Morse Code The Universal Language
jeff (N3JBH)
on
March 10, 2005
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Morse code the universal language. Well I decided to research this interesting idea.
Well, I discovered that Morse code as we amateur radio operators know it is based on the English language, using the 26 letters, the ten simple numbers, and some punctuation marks.
And wow it is accepted as the universal language for this use. It hardly is that at all. There are more than 90 different alphabets in use in the world some with less than 9 letters others with over 40. And that's just letters alone.
So it seems to me that many of our foreign friends must learn the English language first to use Morse code. So is it universal I ask?
We talk of having the FCC drop the code requirement. Maybe we should consider the alternative and require all amateurs be proficient in all languages. That way we would be fair to rest of the known world and be able to spread our goodwill and joyous news in the native tongue. After all, if we are going to be fair and argue the merits of the code/no code argument. Then I believe telling the whole truth and merits of the origin and basics of what the code was based upon and that was our own language not one of the many other known languages.
So what do you say folks? Has the time come to drop the code and learn their language and share their tongue? Or should we retain the code and in such depend on others to learn the English language to communicate with us?
Thank you all, n3jbh
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Morse Code The Universal Language
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by N3HKN on March 10, 2005
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I did not know that Morse Code was an English language only code set?? No wonder the DX is so difficult to snag!
N3HKN
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Morse Code The Universal Language
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by LA6UIA on March 10, 2005
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The Norwegian characters æ, ø and å are represented with morse codes:
æ = .-.-
ø = ---.
å = .--.-
So Norwegians happily use their native language in CW. I guess the same can be said about any language.
The author of the article would benefit from a little more research on this matter.
de LA6UIA, Anders
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RE: Morse Code The Universal Language
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by NI0C on March 10, 2005
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"Research" ?
Here is yet another utterance published by eHam that demonstrates the site has no standards whatsoever for publication and will display virtually anything under the "articles" category. Until this improves, I won't re-subscribe, and I won't submit any more articles.
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Morse Code The Universal Language
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by NE1RD on March 10, 2005
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The highly structured nature of a CW QSO benefits the non-English speaker. A free-form voice transmission, by comparison, is much more difficult due to the complicatoin of accents, regional dialects, the nearly pervasive use of idioms, and generally drawing from a richer vocabulary than one would typically use in a CW QSO.
LU1DX de NE1RD -bk- UR RST 599 -bk-
QTH Acton, MA Acton, MA -bk-
NAME HR IS Scott Scott -bk-
BK TO U -bk- ...
This correspondence is highly-structured, nearly fixed format, and provides "restarting makers" (through the breaks) that allow a listener who had lost track of things to resynchronize with the sender and begin picking up information again. This is much more difficult in free-form voice communication.
As a new ham, the effectiveness of this system was something of a surprise to me, though, upon reflection, I can see that decades of use probably served to iron out the kinks.
Just my 2-cents. Refunds upon request.
-- Scott
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RE: Morse Code The Universal Language
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by AA4PB on March 10, 2005
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I submit that it is not the Morse code that is universal. It is the standard format, appreviations, and Q-signals often used on CW that are more or less universal.
For this same reason there is often some benefit to the use of standard signal on voice. However, some hams today look down on anyone who doesn't talk like he was speaking with the next door neighbor. I suspect this results from the use of repeaters.
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RE: Morse Code The Universal Language
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by K5DVW on March 10, 2005
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It always confuses me when someone who seems to dislike CW uses a lot of "Hi Hi" in their written profile and some even say "hi hi" when they talk on the radio? Why is that? Perhaps you should "research" it and get back to us.
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hoo boy ... not again!
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by KZ1X on March 10, 2005
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Jeff, if you spent as much time learning Morse as you did making posts about it, you'd have been a General long ago. Also, Anders has corrected you about Morse; the English Morse alphabet isn't the only one!
For a homebound guy with time on his hands, and who has done many fascinating things in life including having multiple careers, I really don't understand why you drag this out. If you can recognize a favorite song on the radio when the DJ starts playing it, you can learn Morse at the recognition speed that is the whole test today.
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Morse Code The Universal Language
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by K1CJS on March 10, 2005
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As side research, I would like to find out if callsigns worldwide are issued using only the english language alphabet, or if the callsigns are issued in the issuing countrys native alphabet. For example, are Russian callsigns issued using the cyrillic alphabet? Are Israeli callsigns issued using the Hebrew alphabet? How about German callsigns, or even callsigns in the Middle Eastern countries? Somehow, I don't think so, but I don't know for sure.
I think it's the way the author stated. It seems that those people are forced to learn the english alphabet and to a lesser extent a limited part of the english language in order to use morse code. I also agree with the other posters that the standardized format and abbreviations that make morse code a "universal language" recognized worldwide among ham operators.
I realize that a good part of the world uses the english language with regional variations, but if we stopped and realized that english is not everybodys language instead of demanding to have everything our way, just maybe people in other parts of the world would have a better opinion of us.
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Morse Code The Universal Language
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by N0IU on March 10, 2005
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Wow, an "article" from a No Code Technician who wants to do away with CW. Gee, there's a shock! I haven't seen one of these in at least 2 or 3 weeks!
I used to be one of you way back when. After I got my Tech Plus license, I wasted a lot of time thinking of excuses as to why the code should be eliminated. Please pay attention to two very carefully chosen words in the last sentence: WASTED and EXCUSES. While I thought I was SPENDING time thinking of REASONS to eliminate the code, my friends who had already learned the code, whether they were using it or not, were having a blast on the air making contacts! What a concept!
Who are you trying to convince that the code is a waste of time? The wheels are already in motion for the FCC to receive comments on another round of restructuring.
You have two choices:
1) Continue wasting your time concocting excuses not to learn CW at the painfully slow speed of 5 words per minute.
2) Take a few weeks out of your busy schedule and learn it. Part 97 does not say you have to use CW or even like it. All you have to do is copy 5 words, 25 characters, in the span of one minute.
NØIU
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Morse Code The Universal Language
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by KG6AMW on March 10, 2005
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French was once the language of diplomats. English is the international language of aviation, engineering and science. Learning a second language like Chinese besides Engish would be helpful, since it more likely spoken than cw. Morse code is a mode and not a "universal language". Your point is not well taken.
KG6AMW
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Morse Code The Universal Language
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by W0UHF on March 10, 2005
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My 1991 ARRL handbook shows several languages and their morse code equivalents. I don't have it here with me right now, but from memory I think it gave characters in Russian, Arabic, Japanese and several other languages. Obviously the author did no research at all.
Many DX stations only send your call, 5NN, and TU if many are calling them, so there is not much English needed to learn there. Others that have the time, but don't know English will exchange RST, name, and QTH. The characters for RST and QTH are universally understood by amateurs world wide, so that leaves the one English word, name, and maybe add rig too.
But of course there are a very large number, for whom English isn't their first language, that know English very well and there are many who know serveral languages very well.
For those who wish do learn different languages in addition to their native, Amateur Radio provides a unique way in which one may might be able to practice (either with morse, or voice.) In college, I had a friend who was studying Russian and got on 20 meters to practice his Russian with Russian hams who were more than happy to converse with him, both in Russian and English.
Obviously the original poster here, just wishes the fan the flames of the code or no code debate again. While I am all for trying to attract more potential hams by removing a barrier (as some see it) to becoming one,
ALL hams, once licensed (wether there continues to be a code requirement or not for HF and unless disabled), would do themselves a favor to learn the morse code. Not only is it still a very useful mode in manys ways, it is also a whole lot of FUN. If you never tryit , you are really missing out.
I've been away for too long now; I think I'm going to go look for my straight key and tune down to the low end...
Very 73 to all,
Dan
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RE: Morse Code The Universal Language
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by W5HTW on March 10, 2005
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Not only a waste of the author's time, but the rest of us who read that as well. So full of lack of knowledge about international communications (not just ham radio) it may as well have come from Porky Pig.
Ed
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Morse Code The Universal Language
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by WD0M on March 10, 2005
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If you can't take the time to learn morse code, how in the world do you think you can take the time to learn another language? What a specious argument.
WDØM
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RE: Morse Code The Universal Language
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by W0UHF on March 10, 2005
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I the first line in my privious post, I meant alphabets, obviously, there isn't room in the handbook to teach languages.
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RE: Morse Code The Universal Language
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by W0FM on March 10, 2005
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So do we all invest in 90 different computer keyboards in order to operate PSK and RTTY in a manner that all our brother hams can understand?
73,
Terry, WØFM
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RE: Morse Code The Universal Language
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by W1BAK on March 10, 2005
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I swear if it were not for the cw issue, that you people would have nothing to bitch about at all. If the FCC drops it as a requirement, it will be moot. If they don't drop it, it will still be moot. Get a life...accept change or whatever...but just shut up about something you have absolutely no control over. That includes everyone...for and against.
Let's see some posts on a positive note for a change.
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RE: Morse Code The Universal Language
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by K0BG on March 10, 2005
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A while back I was conversing with another amateur on 20 CW, and he told me he could speak any language except Greek. I sent him a phrase in Swahili, and he send back, "...huh, Greek to me." So I guess Morse code isn't universal.
Alan, KØBG
www.k0bg.com
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RE: Morse Code The Universal Language
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by N1EA on March 10, 2005
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The morse code is universal.
I was a radio officer on a ship. If I sent a message to a foreign station to an operator who did not know English (and likewise I sometimes received messages written in foreign language), they could be put on the international telegraph network for delivery to their destination.
Thus a ship near Hong Kong could call the local station there, send their message, have it relayed by Cable and Wireless by undersea cable to any destination in the world.
I have also received and sent messages in Greek, Japanese and Russian - in International Rules - messages passing international bounderies must be reduced to the 26 roman letters, 10 numerals, and certain punctuation.
But even without some extended characters - such as exist in Turkish, Danish, Swedish, Norwegian, French, Spanish, Russian - most information can be conveyed by "Roman characters" - Japan has such a translitteration.
However there are many national "morse codes" which consist not only of the 26 Roman letters and 10 arabic numerals, but have the entire morse code for every character in the language.
The writer of this original post should have done his homework prior to submitting this.
73
David J. Ring, Jr.
Radio Electronics Officer
U.S. Merchant Marine
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Morse Code The Universal Language
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by K8DIT on March 10, 2005
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I understand that Jeff is NOT in favor of losing the mosrse code, but that we should all be required to learn ALL foreign languages as an adjunct to being allowed to communicate on the ham bands. After all, if one nation of people could require all their people to speak all tongues to qualify for a radio liscense, then that would put a crimp on the number of liscensees.
Or, that nation's hams would be the smartest in the universe and they would naturally do away with the morse code, since learning all the languages is way harder to do. You see, then all the multi-multi linguists could look down their noses at the advocates of the morse code and feel superior. This is Jeff's way of showing us who we really are by way of mirroring our attitudes in satire.
Jeff will learn the code. But not until he has rebelled in a reasonable way to show that he is unhappy about it. But growing up is hard to do. Learning the ways of the world and being a contributing part of it is hard to do. Learning the morse code is a good way to show respect and take a positive step in that direction.
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Morse Code The Universal Language
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by NY7Q on March 10, 2005
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I disagree with KG6AMW. CW IS A LANGUAGE AND VERY UNIVERSAL. YOUR CALL SIGN SEZ IT ALL....
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RE: Morse Code The Universal Language
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by K3ESE on March 10, 2005
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CW is incredibly fun and relaxing...and exciting, all at the same time. People use it because they like it, not because they have to. I've always been a 100% CW op, and I don't care, one way or the other, whether the requirement is dropped...the level of usage won't be affected, IMHO...it lives on because it's naturally attractive...to some.
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RE: Morse Code The Universal Language
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by W6TH on March 10, 2005
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Morse Code The Universal Language?
Yes, Now and Forever.
QRU, QSX, QRT.
73 DE W6TH.
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RE: Morse Code The Universal Language
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by WB2WIK on March 10, 2005
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Code is a universal language as much as English is the universal language of commerce. Bankers in all countries speak English, as the U.S. Dollar is accepted everywhere. From Bangalore to Bangkok, to Manila to Oslo, I've never had anybody turn away my payment for merchandise when I offered U.S. dollars. Never been to Timbuktu, but I'll bet they work there, also.
WB2WIK/6
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RE: Morse Code The Universal Language
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by W4EWJ on March 10, 2005
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W1BAK
Pal you aint man enough to tell me to shut up (and be
able to back it up) about any GD subject I choose to
comment on anywhere. Its the weaklings like you that
crawl in your hole and let silence be your guide regardless of how it affects others pro or con.
That the cretin that lacks the mental ability to do
effective research on this so called article is worthy
of anytype of comment is obvious since not knowing
what the hell he is talking about is obvious as well.
So...you want to debat the relative pros and
cons of CW...lets have at it, I know a little bit about the subject.
W4EWJ USMM ret.
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RE: Morse Code The Universal Language
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by NOLICENSEASOFYET on March 10, 2005
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Hey guys/gals if any.. My elmer is now in the process of teaching me code to take my amatuer extra test. I have already passed the written several times and look forward to QSO in code soon.
Its all about the elmer and the student as far as I can see.
I have raised 11 children, still have a young daughter at home and after years of searching for a local elmer, found one by scanning 40 meter on a receiver.
The wealth of knowledge he has, I will learn and pass on to someone else.
No matter if code gets dropped by the FCC in testing, it will live on through elmering and encouragement by experienced operators with the proper approach and tactful persistence.
73
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RE: Morse Code The Universal Language
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by N3JBH on March 10, 2005
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((I understand that Jeff is NOT in favor of losing the mosrse code,))
((This is Jeff's way of showing us who we really are by way of mirroring our attitudes in satire. ))
THANK YOU K8DIT.
The purpose of my article was never to suggest dropping the code requirement at all.
Am I a no code tech? Yes according to my license class . But please don’t tell that to the fellow in Paraguay I tried working last night on cw on the 6-meter band,
I wasn’t trying to start a flame war here but rather. Discuss the universal language everyone tells me about. I enjoy vhf/uhf bands a lot and seldom use FM as a mode at all.
So my article here on eham was never meant to suggest I was anti code. But merely a question on is Morse code so universal?
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RE: Morse Code The Universal Language
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by KB3KAQ on March 10, 2005
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first - cw is not a language, it is a mode. Morse Code is not a language - it is a coding of letters used to represent a specific langauge - in our case English. some would argue that language is exactly that, but that is without merit. Morse Code represents a host language.
it is rather arrogant to expect all the hams of the world to converse in English just because you do. i often hear German, Spanish, French, and Russian languages on the air. should i break into their conversations and demand they speak in English so i can listen in?
i have learned Morse Code and occassionally operate using it on the HF and VHF bands. i had to learn it to upgrade. that's just the way it is until it is not.
-steve
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Morse Code The Universal Language
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by W3DCG on March 10, 2005
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I think, Morse Cose can be as "universal" as English.
The idea of learning Chinese? Sure seems like a good idea to me, were it no so intricate and difficult- I would. Oh never mind, no excuses- I should. I think it will prove handy in time. I sure wish my children could take Mandarin somewhere. I think it makes economic, if not social, sense. For the immediate NOW, seems like we all would be able to use Espanol more than any other, Other language.
But, CW is a language I say. It has style, and at speed- it is a language as much as Sign "language" is a language.
SSB, AM, FM, are modes. A continuous wave carrier going on and off need not be Morse, we could send gibberish non-sense, and it would still be CW, just like that irritating Latino gets on 40m almost every night and just obliterates 4Kc of spectrum by going, "Aye-Ayeh-AHHHHHHHHHHHhhhhhhhhh-yh, OhhhhhhHHHHHh-OOOO-aaaayeeeeeeeeooooooooh," over and over and over again. Saying absolutely nothing but it's SSB.
CW in any language is- a language, via A1A emission.
I have heard CW in French, could copy but not understand, I have heard CW in Spanish.
Talking is so widely performed in our daily routines, that everyone is using that "mode" but no-one else calls it a mode.
Anyway- I'm gonna bail from here and not come back- everyone Pro and Con knows how I feel about current requirements and proposed amendments.
We truly do not need another flame war on this, everyone has opinions and are entitled to them, and they are all valid for whomever wishes to have them.
I like phone too. I'd like digital, too. I just seem to confine my digital time to this sort of communication instead. I prefer to spend my air time doing what I enjoy, like everyone does- and since I can type anywhere, speak anywhere, there is only one place I can do CW- so that's what I do with most of my limited air time. I think Voice is a real kick too, though. SSB is still my second favorite mode.
It is HAM RADIO- IT'S ALL GOOD.
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RE: Morse Code The Universal Language
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by W1BAK on March 10, 2005
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I've waded in shallow water..but chose to do my 20 in a man's navy. With all do respect...screw you chief.
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Morse Code The Universal Language
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by KK7WN on March 10, 2005
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In spite of a number of rude and just plain ignorant comments, this article does bring up a number of interesting issues. Of course CW is primarily a digital mode of communication that could be adapted to any language and thus require translation between people of different tongues. The use of standardized symbol words such as QRZ, etc. would seem to allow the creation of a type of "pidgin language" or trading language similar to "chinook". Thus one might also argue that it might resemble a language, although that might be pushing the point a bit. I'm sure that some Hams must be trained as linguists and it would be nice to hear their opinion on this matter.
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MORE good reasons NOT to write articles for eham!
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by GOODBUDDY on March 10, 2005
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"Jeff, if you spent as much time learning Morse as you did making posts about it, you'd have been a General long ago. Also, Anders has corrected you about Morse; the English Morse alphabet isn't the only one! "
"For a homebound guy with time on his hands, and who has done many fascinating things in life including having multiple careers, I really don't understand why you drag this out. If you can recognize a favorite song on the radio when the DJ starts playing it, you can learn Morse at the recognition speed that is the whole test today."
"Wow, an "article" from a No Code Technician who wants to do away with CW. Gee, there's a shock! I haven't seen one of these in at least 2 or 3 weeks!"
"Not only a waste of the author's time, but the rest of us who read that as well. So full of lack of knowledge about international communications (not just ham radio) it may as well have come from Porky Pig. "
"If you can't take the time to learn morse code, how in the world do you think you can take the time to learn another language? What a specious argument."
"Pal you aint man enough to tell me to shut up (and be
able to back it up) about any GD subject I choose to
comment on anywhere. Its the weaklings like you that
crawl in your hole and let silence be your guide regardless of how it affects others pro or con.
That the cretin that lacks the mental ability to do
effective research on this so called article is worthy
of anytype of comment is obvious since not knowing
what the hell he is talking about is obvious as well."
Why anybody would want to write any article for eham is beyond me. These idiots just wait in the woodwork waiting to pounce so we can hear their "wisdom".
"Better to keep your mouth closed and be thought a fool than to open it and remove all doubt"?
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Morse Code The Universal Language
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by M0CUQ on March 10, 2005
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True Morse code is not a 'code' but a cypher, replacing each letter with a short digital signature. It is a cypher to which the key is well known.
To be a 'code' one must replace whole words with symbols and this is exactly what we do when we communicate a typical rubber stamp QSO in cw. However, this does not make it a language, merely a very useful way of communicating. Granted, many of the abbreviations derive from English, but it doesn't have to be an 'english' code.
To successfully bridge the language barrier all you need is an agreed set of 'code words', for Morse we have things like Q-codes and Interco (International code of signals). Both of these codes can be used on phone and it seems that phone operators love to use them even when they speak the same language, QSL?...
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RE: Morse Code The Universal Language
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by W4EWJ on March 10, 2005
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W1BAK
Any dumb son of a bitch can sail a ship in
deep water....ass hole (or is it chief ass hole?)
ewj
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Morse Code The Universal Language
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by WA9SVD on March 10, 2005
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Certainly, there is some commonality in CW contacts: The use of common "Q" codes allow this. And that is fine for simple exchanges, IF all you want to exchange are the proverbial "HI, UR 599, 73" elements such as used for contests. But CW is NOT a universal "language," merely a mode. If another station only "speaks" (or wishes to converse in) German, French, Spanish, Tagalog, Klingon, etc., they can do so quite well in CW, but that doesn't make it any more understandable to someone who doesn't speak the same language.
And while some languages have special "Morse" characters, unless a person is fluent in Morse of that particular language, dialect, or flavor, they will be meaningless at best, and probably VERY confusing to most.
This has nothing to do with the merits (or if you wish, lack thereof) of CW being kept as a licensing requirement, 0r even retaining CW only frequeny allocations. CW (as we know it) is a mode of transmission, not an international "language." It may allow some rudimentary communication because of commonly used concepts such as "Q" codes, but that is only rudimentary communication.
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Morse Code The Universal Language
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by N0IU on March 10, 2005
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Jeff, I am glad to see that you are at least trying to use CW. Did your attempted QSO to Paraguay fail because of poor propagation or did he not understand English??? HIHI
Since you are showing an interest in CW, why not go take the code test and become a Tech Plus? The closest VE testing session I could find is about 50 miles away from you in Pittsburgh. Here is the listing from the ARRL website:
12-Mar-2005
Sponsor: BREEZE SHOOTERS/NORTH HILLS ARC
Time: 12 NOON (Walk-ins allowed)
Contact: ROBERT W BENNA
(412)366-0488
VEC: ARRL/VEC
Location: NORTHLAND PUBLIC LIBRARY-ROOM 148
300 CUMBERLAND RD (LOWERLEVEL)
CALL AHEAD FOR ACCOMMODATIONS!
PITTSBURGH, PA 15237
It says walk-ins are allowed so why not give it a shot? If that one doesn't work for you, just go to http://www.arrl.org/arrlvec/examsearch.phtml and find another one.
I think if you continue using CW and find that you enjoy it, these nagging little questions about the future of CW will become less and less important to you. I have had a few thousand CW QSOs and I don't think the topic of conversation has even been the viability of CW!
NØIU
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RE: Morse Code The Universal Language
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by WA9SVD on March 10, 2005
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N0IU makes a hidden point. Not only do you NOT have to use the code once you pass the Code Element, you NEVER have to even look at it again!
Back in the "old days" (when T. Rex was young, I believe) when your license came up for renewal after FIVE (not ten!) years, along with the renewal fee, you also had to SIGN the renewal form that stated you were STILL proficient at code at the speed required for your class of license. (I wonder how many operators, Extra, Advanced, General, and even Tech [Novice was non-renewable, and only for one year, so it didn't matter] actually kept up their code speed... when they renewed?)
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RE: Morse Code The Universal Language
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by W4EWJ on March 10, 2005
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W1BAK
How quaint...you said "screw you chief" guess that
leaves little doubt about your sexual orientation
There are those that stand up to piss and those that
sit down...I'll send you a roll of toilet paper
You want a pissing contest? I'll sure as hell give
you one.
ewj
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RE: Morse Code The Universal Language
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by N3JBH on March 10, 2005
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NO1U HELLO
well i will assume that the propagation god's didnt like my signal. but hey at least it was fun trying.
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RE: Morse Code The Universal Language
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by EXWA2SWA on March 10, 2005
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"I'm sure that some Hams must be trained as linguists and it would be nice to hear their opinion on this matter."
Oddly enough, the Marine Corps first made sure I was somewhat competent in Morse (with more than 26 letters and 10 numbers) before sending me off to Language School (Finnish).
So, an opinion: I think that, in order to be classified as a language, a system of communication must include a system of thought as well as words. By that I mean that, if you must constantly translate from the heard language to another, you may "speak" the tongue, but not truly "understand it". Example, if I hear the English word "Thanks" and must translate it to the Finnish "Kiitos", I'm an English-speaker with some knowledge of the Finnish language. If, however, I hear the word in conversation and have no need to translate, I'm "thinking" in that language and much more liable to have a grasp of it than the 'translator' does. Every language has words that do not translate perfectly into all others, and that not only compounds the 'problem', it makes it imperative to "think" in that language. (Look up "pimu" in your Finnish-English dictionary).
When operating CW (my preferred, 100% mode) and I hear "RST" I know that it means I'm about to hear a report on my Readability, Signal Strength and Purity of Tone. I don't have to think about that. When I hear numbers 3 6 8x, though, I do need to translate them into a quality-of-signal report that is not yet automatic.
When I hear the sound "didah" (or, to coin a phrase, dididadahdidit, or even ditty-dum-dum-ditty) that registers automatically to a symbol to be put on paper or combined with others to express a thought.
So yes, Morse is both a language and an 'alphabet', a way of communicating and a 'culture'. Universal? Only to a point. Last night, I heard a station in Boston (Helzer, KB1LCK) in a Morse QSO with a Brazilian station, ragchewing in what I presume was Portuguese. I've had extended CW QSO's with both a German and a Swede, in perfect English. Which side of the argument do these support?
Morse, and CW operating, are what you make of them. For me, they comprise a language, a system of thought as well as communication. For others, they're just an anachronism with little useful purpose. For others, Morse is just another subject to put an "X" in the box toward a higher level of licensing. For some, it's just a meaningless string of sounds that make no sense. I pity the last group.
Regards,
Jim
KE5CXX
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RE: Morse Code The Universal Language
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by X-WB1AUW on March 10, 2005
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Morse code as a language?! Silly.
Some believe that mathematics is THE universal language.
73
Bob
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Morse Code The Universal Language
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by AB9FH on March 10, 2005
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This does demonstrate that the author does not understand how cw is used. You aren't sending words, which are in general limited to one language, but rather letters which are useful across multiple languages.
The choice of the English alphabet might be problematic for some, but cw is really the best compromise because:
1) you really only have to learn the alphabet and not the language because of abbreviations, prosigns, Q signals, etc. BK looks like "break" to me, but CQ doesn't look anything like "calling any operator". I know what both mean and so does any cw operator world wide. I don't have to understand English to know what is being said. If you really want to talk freely, you have to learn the language no matter what mode you use. It's too bad Morse wasn't Hawaiian, we'd have almost half as many letters to learn as well!
2) most people want to learn English anyway (in fact it is part of the stereotype of the American to know just one language, much of the world is already polyglot).
3) cw lets you practice without the impediment of accent or pronunciation, which is a nightmare in the case of English. Tough, cough, through. I'm glad I don't have to learn English!
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RE: Morse Code The Universal Language
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by KB3KAQ on March 10, 2005
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KE5CXX -
RST and such are concepts - they transcend language because they are agreed upon universals - and happened to be in the English language - you understand them as R, S, and T. in Russian, these wold be different and if given the string in phonetic Russian, you would be lost.
Morse Code is not a cypher per se - it is an agreed upon means of representing a character via sound or light. there is no "coding" beyond the face value of the representation.
for Morse Code to be a universal language, it would be understand by anyone regardless of the native language. Morse in French is not Morse in English.
the fun comes in with languages that use phonetics so English speakers can play along, like Russian.
-steve
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RE: Morse Code The Universal Language
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by G3SEA on March 10, 2005
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NE1RD has it in a nutshell. CW often get's through both bad condx and foreign language barriers ( albeit in a very abbreviated way )when other modes cannot.
One has only to monitor the CW contests to see that this mode is still very popular worldwide.
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RE: Morse Code The Universal Language
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by NOLICENSEASOFYET on March 10, 2005
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It is so much fun reading these post......
I can actually imagine some of the posters.....
Remember the muppet show........the two old grumpy ass guys in the balconey.....
I can see it now......them arguing beating the crap out of each other arguing about code, no code.
Really, after the years of reading these post, I find myself seeing the posters name and saying "Ut O, here goes Ghostrider, or here goes one of the other regular flamers......... I have acually laughed out loud at the predictability of who will flame first and how long it will take before someone pees on a tree.
Go get'em guys ....... the entertainment value is high.
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Morse Code The Universal Language
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by WA7NDD on March 10, 2005
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I was not going to post, but I could not resist!
I have never talked to another ham in any other country in the last 50 years
that could not give me a report in english, even when Russia was the USSR!
So what does this topic have to do with the price of rice in China?
English is the language used in all international bussiness transactions!
Jim, WA7NDD
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Morse Code The Universal Language
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by NS6Y_ on March 10, 2005
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Yep! English is the universal language, and yes, the structure of CW contacts overcomes a lot of hassles with accents, etc.
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Morse Code The Universal Language
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by WN3VAW on March 10, 2005
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Jeff,
Congratulations for working on your code. There are quite a few V/UHF amateurs who seem satisfied with the status quo -- and if that's all that they need, that's fine, but for those who want more like you, keep up the good work!
I see from QRZ.COM that you're located in Latrobe. If you ever need information on a VEC test session coming up in the near future, drop me an email and I'll let you know what I know. The Foothills ARC in Greensburg, the Tri-County CWARC in the Mon Valley, the Somerset ARC, and the Skyview RS in New Kensington are all relatively close to you and hold periodic test sessions. Also, the North Hills ARC & the Breezeshooters hold a VE session monthly up in the Wexford area North of Pittsburgh, the WPA Hilltoppers have one bi-monthly over by the University of Pittsburgh campus in Oakland, the Steel City ARC has one quarterly out near Pittsburgh International Airport, my club (Wireless Association of South Hills) has one quarterly in Peters Township (Washington County just over the Allegheny County line) quarterly, next one in April... and that's just what comes to mind offhand, and we haven't even gotten into Fayette, Beaver, Butler, Washington, or Greene Counties yet! Trust me, when you're ready to take a test, we'll find a session you can get to!
And while I realize your mobility is very limited, do check out some of the area clubs. You'll find many V/UHF'ers involved in the Greater Pgh VHF Society, Steel City ARC, North Hills ARC, Skyview RS, and WASH, just to name a few. If you can make an occasional meeting at one or more of these groups, you'll meet up with a lot of people who can give you some good advice and lend a hand if you need it. Also, don't forget to check out some of the upcoming major WPA Hamfests -- Foothills ARC Hamfest in May, Breezeshooters Hamfest in June, North Hills ARC Hamfest in July, Uniontown ARC & Butler Co ARC in September, WACOM Hamfest in October.
GL & Gud DX!
73, ron wn3vaw
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Morse Code The Universal Language
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by G0GQK on March 10, 2005
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The English language is a universal language. There are no countries in the world where you will not find anyone who does not speak English.
Last week the British Chancellor of the Exchequer, Gordon Brown, visited China, a country which is expanding at an amazing speed. During the visit he met students at a university, perhaps it was Beijing. He asked them whether they were learning any European languages, such as French, German, Spanish etc. The only language they wished to speak was English, as English was the international language and therefore the most important one for them in which to converse.
Incidentally, the Chinese have used a Chinese Morse code for many years, as have the Japanese. Would you propose that enthrusiastic Morse code users start learning oriental morse ? Perhaps for true blue Americans a club which only uses the American Morse code !
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RE: Morse Code The Universal Language
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by K4JSR on March 10, 2005
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BAK and EWJ, Go ahead and have your contest.
The rest of of us will just quietly stand up wind from
both of you while we watch! :-D
At least your bickering is not about partisan politics!
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RE: Morse Code The Universal Language
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by W4EWJ on March 10, 2005
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hey Jeff....long as you're in the leeward you shud
be ok
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RE: Morse Code The Universal Language
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by K7VO on March 10, 2005
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First off, English uses the Latin alphabet. The alphabet is hardly exclusive to English nor did it originate with English. Indeed, it predates English.
Israeli callsigns are in the Latin alphabet. I believe that is an ITU standard.
English is not universal in the least. Many people in many, many countries do not speak it at all. Nor is it the most spoken language in the world. That would be Chinese. However, since the dominant military and economic power in the world today is an English speaking country, yes, many people the world over choose to learn English. The majority of the well educated and elites in the world do speak English.
I used to trave a lot on business. In business meetings in Madrid I could speak English. After work if I went out in the city most people did NOT speak English and my very poor, broken Spanish is what got me by.
If you visit Paris and insist that the Parisians speak English to you well... it's resented. Americans think Parisians are rude. Parisians think Americans who insist that people in France must understand their English are incredibly arrogant and rude. Who is right? I speak French and I am treated very well in Paris, thankyouverymuch. Oh, the people there know I'm American. My accent gives that away the moment I open my mouth. The fact that I make the effort to speak their language makes all the difference in the world.
Many Americans resent when foreigners come here and don't speak English. Why can't the rest of the world feel the same way in their own country?
The point: English is anything but universal. Morse code is anything but universal. It is a historical artifact, a hobbyist mode steeped in the traditions of the past, a relic from a time that has passed most everywhere except in amateur radio. The idea that it should be required to be licensed communicate by modes other than CW is a ludicrous anachronism. Oh, and I hold an Extra class license and could pass the *old* 20WPM CW test at this moment, something many Extra class hams who argue to retain the CW licensing requirement could not do. Heck, if CW testing is so important how about we retest all existing licensees to make sure they are still proficient? What percentage of General class and higher hams today, including oldtimers, would pass?
The idea that the only people who want to see CW exams abolished are no code techs who are too lazy to learn is even more ludicrous. Why should they learn something they may never, ever use again and which is totally irrelevant to their interests in the hobby and to 99.9% of modern communications? CW exams are little more than a hazing ritual to enter the ham fraternity.
It troubles me greatly that so much of ham radio seems to be on the trailing edge technologically and that so many hams live in the past in so very many ways. You either embrace the future or die with the past.
The author makes an excellent point even if he didn't get his facts completely straight.
73,
Caity
K7VO/8
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RE: Morse Code The Universal Language
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by W4EWJ on March 10, 2005
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K7VO
Tend to agree with most of your post...except with
one possible exception...your statement (my partial
extract) "most everywhere except amateur radio"
According to a graph I made recently there has been
an 11% increase in cw use of the various services
that still use CW...I cant tell if more stations...
within the past 6 mos...I cant tell if more stations
because so much is either numbers stas or 5 ltr
coded grps and the stations dont identify. BUT one
station that bcsts every week night on either 8009khz
or 8134/8135khz has been doing so for a long time and
frequently he comes up on 10126khz and less frequently
on 3523khz where he shares with another clandestine
station (numbers) most are random time/freq but many
fixed service stations...4XZ on 8102khz...UDK2 on
13050khz...and many others, FSG on 4940khz, RMP on
4078khz...all the stations mentioned are on other
freqs as well and I have logged about 155 cw stations
both manual and automated on more or less random times
and freqs. The Koreans have 2 large cw coast stations
for their huge world wide fishing fleet as dothe
Russians and others.
I realize that theres far less cw than 10 years ago...
my only point is that at least for the last 6 mos
there has been an apparant increase on the freqs I
scan automatically with COR to a recorder using
a WJ 8718A/MFP. I dont hear it all but simple tfc
analysis of the available ckts shows the mentioned
increase.
ewj
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RE: Morse Code The Universal Language
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by K7VO on March 10, 2005
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I can't explain why there would be more CW than 6 months ago. Your statement used the qualifier "those services that still use CW". There are very few such services left. Digital communications has replaced 95% or more of what was once done on CW.
The more I play with PSK31 and other, even newer digital modes the more that I believe that ham radio is heading in the same direction.
CW will survive so long as hams enjoy it and share their love of CW with others. Heck, I think the CW advocates will have a much easier time of it once they stop trying to ram CW down people's throats by forcing them to learn it whether they see a reason to or not. Let's put it this way: in 2000 I had done little CW in the previous 15 years and what I had done was mainly to make some otherwise impossible VHF weak signal contacts possible. In 2001 my interest in CW was peaked by some really cute little Mizuho CW rigs and a desire to actually use them on the air. I did more CW in the next three years than in my previous 16 as a ham.
I am not anti-CW. I am also not for "dumbing down" ham radio, whatever that means. I am for relevant testing.
I feel where we need to improve our exams is in the areas of operating practices and etiquette, RF safety, digital communications, and there definitely should be more rules and regs questions. Our current testing system does a woeful job at preparing new hams to get on the air. It needs to change but I see no movement or motivation in the amateur community to change it in that way. Those who want more hams at any cost for their own profits just want to reduce testing requirements. The "CW forever" crowd is so myopic about CW that they can't consider any real alternatives.
73,
Caity
K7VO/8
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RE: Morse Code The Universal Language
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by W5HTW on March 10, 2005
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Part of the problem here is we have a lot of relatively new hams who know nothing of the history of radio communications, (and certainly nothing of ham radio's history) and they have no desire to know. All too often these come across as sounding as though they believe ham radio was not invented until they got their license.
Morse code was used by non-hams, including government agencies (such as our own State Department) and a myriad of other services. In an attempt to standardize the way it was used, some international effort was made, but it is true that different languages have different CW characters (though not "Morse" as that is a specific 'brand" of the code.)
In the early days of aviation, code was the primary method of communication, as it was in the marine world. Throughout the Big War - World War II - CW was the mainstay of communications. The attempts to standardize resulted in recognition of certain international "signals" such as the Q-signals. These were published in a document called Allied Communications Procedures (ACP131B, I believe.)
Whether or not Morse is a language will remain debatable, but in at least one aspect, it qualifies. That is, it allows people of different primary languages to exchange some limited information. Perhaps it could better be called an "interface."
Switching topics: English has been the international language in not only the business world but the government world, as well as the aeronautical and maritime communities, for years. Certainly, for example, Norwegian ships communicating among themselves would use their own language. But in communicating with ships of other nations, there had to be a mutually-agreed-upon language, and that was English. (That I think it will soon be Spanish is beside the point of this threat.) Almost every world leader speaks some English, and many of them speak it quite well. If they don't, or aren't certain of themsevles, they will have an interpreter on hand, but most can get the basics.
Even in non-radio, the international semaphore flags carried the same meaning, regardless of the language spoken on the ship. They were (and remain today) a recognized method of communicating certain phrases from vessel to vessel, and native language does not enter into it. A certain progression of flags may, for example, mean "hurricane approaching" and it means that in any language on our planet. That is what CW accomplished, with limited signals, prosigns, and phrases.
But back to English! It isn't just because America is "the sole super power" so we force it upon them. That's total bull. In fact, it is bull that we are the sole superpower, but that, too, is for another thread. (China would have a strong argument against that!) The British, the Australians, the South Africans and others, would not be pleased to learn that the world speaks English because the US says they are required to do so. That, too, reflects a total lack of knowledge of world history, international politics, and civics. I suspect none of those subjects are taught in schools anymore.
For many people, not just here on the ham radio forums, they think the world started when they became an adult. (Or whatever age they are now.) They do not choose to know what took place 50 or 75 years ago on the international scene. Maybe their main need is to be able to download another MP3, I don't know.
Back on ham radio, there is a very growing move to dispense with the history as well as the traditions of the hobby, and to recreate it as though it was invented in 1992. (Actually I think it WAS re-invented then, to the joy of many, the dismay of many others.) I think that will actually happen, that all of what went before, as it other aspects of life, will be destroyed or lost.
That really isn't about the code. It's about those who pioneered this hobby, and gosh, even a few of them did so before 1992.
It is true that none of the major countries of the world now use CW in their routine communications, neither their political entities nor their military ones. From time to time one will hear some maritime CW from third world countries, but it's pretty rare. And I would guess CW will disappear from the ham bands within ten years, except, perhaps, for a few die-hards to try to keep it going, maybe limited to six meters.
Today many of us choose to define CW as a digital mode. That's because, I guess, the language we speak is "digital." That is, we live by digital design, and every electronics device we own or operate, from our TV and our coffee pot to our cars and our computers, are digital. But it was a "communications" mode long before the word "digital" became as common as bacon and eggs in our lives. It may be that simply lumping it with digital modes removes from our senses that it was more than a mode; it was/is a skill. That, too, will fade away, and sooner rather than later.
CW, though, was not the language; it was the utility by which the language was conveyed. Often the language was limited to international (not ham) Q and Z signals. Often to just a few short phrases, and usually in English. It was, therefore, the interface, the interpreter. In that capacity, it still works very well. I have had CW QSOs with those who speak virtually no English. But the basics get across.
As we reinvent the hobby, I guess destruction of the roots is inevitable.
Ed
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RE: Morse Code The Universal Language
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by W4EWJ on March 10, 2005
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Yes...the qualifier was that I could not identify
an increase in the number of stations only in the
volumn of tfc on freqs known to be used for cw,
either manual or auto keyed.
It could also be said that the "anti cw" crowd is
also myopic in their "down with cw" rants. Likewise
I dont like anyone trying to slam anything down my
throat...it just causes me to stiffen even more.
PSK31 I understand is just as effective as cw under
weak signal condx...would like to give it a try.
Agree that testing should reflect the real world...
how many hams use a smith chart? Home brewing is
by and large a thing of the past...doesnt matter if
we like it or not...its the nature of things.
ewj
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RE: Morse Code The Universal Language
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by K7VO on March 10, 2005
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W5HTW: Ed, there were some gentle snipes at me. It might shock you to know that I was licensed well before 1992 and that I have a fairly extensive knowledge of history.
One could argue that the horse and buggy were a traditional mode of transportation and one could argue successfully that the Conestoga wagon had an essential role in the settling of the American west and in American history as a whole. However few would argue that we should learn horsemanship to get our driver's license. I also think few would argue that our past has been destroyed even though the buggy whip business isn't what it used to be. The horse and carriage survive in a limited way, as a romantic anachronism, but it survives despite being largely displaced by the motorcar.
The idea that this is new hams vs. old isn't accurate. I know plenty of hams who were licensed much earlier than I was who feel as I do. However, I find it odd that some consider me, after 20 years as a licensed ham, to be a relative newcomer.
There are few relatively young hams yet young people use two way radio much more than you or I did as kids. They call those radios "cell phones" without realizing that they even are radios. Ham radio can and should be as appealing and as fascinating to them as it was to you or me when we were younger but we, the older generations of hams, don't even know how to communicate with those young people or to present ham radio in a way that makes it seem like something they want to be part of. Of course, G-d forbid they listen to some of what passes for ham radio on 75 meters and I wouldn't blame them for wanting to steer clear. I hope what I am referring to on 75 meters, which has been around for all 20 years I've been a ham, isn't what you want to preserve.
It is one thing to insist we honor our traditions and history and learn from them. It is quite another to insist we continue to test for horsemanship to drive or for CW to communicate via radio. Nobody is disputing the past importance of CW.
It might shock you to know that I have done business all over the world and have not lived in the States my entire life. Most of my family is not in the U.S. I would argue forcefully that the reason English is as much of an international language as it is has everything to do with the United States position in the world after two world wars, no disrespect to the British or Australians or anyone else intended. However, I think that would be straying too far from the point of the article or this thread. I'd be happy to have that debate and discuss the historical parallels I draw via e-mail.
CW is a digital mode by any definition of what digital means. The concept of digital (as opposed to analog) encoding of information dates from the 18th century. What makes it different from other digital modes, whether they be older ones like RTTY or newer ones is that it can be easily decoded by ear and easily manually transmitted. That does not make it any less of a digital mode. That also does not make it any less of an anachronism.
For me the magic of ham radio is the ability to communicate, to meet people, to interact with people in a way that other modes of communication simply do not offer. That was true before I was born and is still true today. What ham radio has to offer is timeless. The technology may change but the beauty of human communication between people who would otherwise not communicate remains the same.
I suspect similar heated discussion were going on 50 years ago in the great AM vs. SSB debate.
73,
Caity
K7VO/8
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RE: Morse Code The Universal Language
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by K7VO on March 10, 2005
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EWJ: Very interesting point about the Smith Chart and homebrewing. I would argue that those are advanced skills and are appropriate for the Extra Class license exam. Most hams who don't want to learn the necessary skills can be content with a General Class license which does give access to at least part of every possible ham band.
Similarly, I would not argue against retaining a CW exam for Extra only although I really fail to see the point of doing so. I think the ARRL offered it as a compromise. Like most compromises it satisfied absolutely nobody.
Oh, and yes, people on both sides of any argument are capable of becoming myopic :)
Good discussion. I'll be quite a while and let others voice their opinions. I'm amazing I haven't been roundly flamed yet.
73,
Caity
K7VO/8
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Morse Code The Universal Language
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by KN8AW on March 10, 2005
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Everybody is basing their responses on the premise that the English and non-English hams communicate exclusively with each other. Now what if a Finnish and a Thai station wish to communicate with each other? Which language do you suppose they will use on CW or phone? More than likely it will be English unless each of them knows another widely spoken language, such as Spanish or French.
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RE: Morse Code The Universal Language
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by K0VJ on March 10, 2005
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"CW is incredibly fun and relaxing...and exciting, all at the same time. People use it because they like it, not because they have to."
Spot-on.
I use PSK-31 from time to time and have in the past tinkered with SSTV, but the vast majority of my HF operating is CW. Why? Because it is fun and satisfying.
The FCC may well eliminate CW as a license requirement, but the mode will live on. That includes new ops, too. A shooting analogy - how long has it been since smokeless powder and brass cartridges have been on the market? Longer than the lifetimes of virtually anyone alive today, yet black powder shooters and archers abound in 2005. They enjoy the challenge, tradition, and fun of "vintage" shooting sports.
So it is with CW, and will always be.
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RE: Morse Code The Universal Language
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by AE6IP on March 10, 2005
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> I'm sure that some Hams must be trained as linguists
> and it would be nice to hear their opinion on this
> matter.
Morse code is a way of encoding an alphabet. No more, no less. In that, it is no more of a language than the ASCII character set is.
The Q-codes are a set of shorthand for a handfull of common statements and questions, the answers to which, for the most part are language neutral.
Morse code lacks almost all of the characteristics that a linguist associates with a language, even if you throw in the Q codes.
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RE: Morse Code The Universal Language
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by AE6IP on March 10, 2005
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> English is the language used in all international
> bussiness transactions!
I'm not sure where this myth got started, but it's not true. It is not at all unusual for regional but still international business to be accomplished in a local prefered language. In much of asia it is Mandarin, in parts of the middle east, Arabic, and so forth.
By the way, not in the near future, but within the life time of young people, expect Mandarin to replace English as the language of business for much the same reasons as English replaced German and French.
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RE: Morse Code The Universal Language
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by AE6IP on March 10, 2005
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> English is the language used in all international
> bussiness transactions!
I'm not sure where this myth got started, but it's not true. It is not at all unusual for regional but still international business to be accomplished in a local prefered language. In much of asia it is Mandarin, in parts of the middle east, Arabic, and so forth.
By the way, not in the near future, but within the life time of young people, expect Mandarin to replace English as the language of business for much the same reasons as English replaced German and French.
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Morse Code The Universal Language
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by N9AVY on March 10, 2005
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Somewhere I heard that either the Chinese or Japanese version of Morse Code has over 400 characters. Now that would REALLY give the no-coders something to whine about !
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Morse Code The Universal Language
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by NS6Y_ on March 11, 2005
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Hahaha today a neighbor was saying back in his Navy days, he worked at some base where they were teaching people morse code, and the students used to come to him to get stuff, or something, maybe he worked in supply, and they'd talk, verbally, dit-dah-dit etc to each other, which used to drive my neighbor up the wall!
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RE: Morse Code The Universal Language
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by N0IU on March 11, 2005
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Mail this to a friend!
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Well now that we have finally once and for all answered all of the questions regarding the value and future of CW as it relates to amateur radio, what shall we tackle next, abortion or gun control??
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RE: Morse Code The Universal Language
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by W5ESE on March 11, 2005
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Mail this to a friend!
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I think retention of CW testing is important.
Acquiring that skill to a great extent enables
Radio Amateurs to get started building their
own gear. The simple transceiver projects are
all CW based. Who'd want to build a K2 as their
first RF construction project? One of the
purposes of the Amateur Radio service is to
expand the reservoir of trained electronics
experts, and knowledge of CW helps to make
that happen in a tangible way.
CW also provides unique capability to outdoor
entusiasts. If you examine the specifications of
all the QRP transceivers on the market, you'll
find that, by and large, the QRP transceivers
with SSB capability have significantly higher
current consumption than the CW only units.
The receive mode current is a particularly
important spec, since even during a QSO, you
spend more time receiving than transmitting.
Although the FT817 and Icom IC 703 are often
promoted as dream rigs for backpackers, they
draw far too much current while receiving
to be useful for anything much longer than
an overnight trip. They draw 300-400 mA.
Compare that to the Wilderness Radio Norcal
40A, Wilderness Radio SST, and Small Wonder
Labs SW+, with receive mode currents of
15-16 mA.
It's not a mystery to me why all of the
Adventure Radio Society operating events are
all 100% CW, and their events seem to me to be
increasing in popularity.
CW lives!
73
Scott
W5ESE
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RE: Morse Code The Universal Language
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by W5ESE on March 11, 2005
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Mail this to a friend!
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K7VO
----
> EWJ: Very interesting point about the Smith Chart
> and homebrewing. I would argue that those are
> advanced skills and are appropriate for the Extra
> Class license exam.
My first transmitter, I built as a Novice licensee,
was homebrew, from an old ARRL Handbook design. I
knew of several other Novices at the same time
(~1975-76) who also homebrewed their first
transmitters. As Novices.
That seems to where amateur radio has gone. What
used to be considered "entry-level", has today
become considered "advanced skills for the Extra
Class license".
Anyone who is curious, I recommend getting a copy
of the ARRL book 'Understanding Amateur Radio'.
Second-hand copies can be found at Powells.com
or Amazon. As you look through it, keep in mind
the target audience for this book: the newly
minted *NOVICE* c | |
