eHam.net - Amateur Radio (Ham Radio) Community

Call Search
     

New to Ham Radio?
My Profile

Community
Articles
Forums
News
Reviews
Friends Remembered
Strays
Survey Question

Operating
Contesting
DX Cluster Spots
Propagation

Resources
Calendar
Classifieds
Ham Exams
Ham Links
List Archives
News Articles
Product Reviews
QSL Managers

Site Info
eHam Help (FAQ)
Support the site
The eHam Team
Advertising Info
Vision Statement
About eHam.net



[Articles Home]  [Add Article]  

Hide Your HF Vertical in Plain Sight

Do not contact (N4ZOU) on July 22, 2005
View comments about this article!


Hide your HF vertical in plain sight

So you moved into a HOA controlled property or worse, your wife won't allow an "ugly" antenna! You need to hide it but just how are you going to do that without dropping it out of sight during the daylight hours? Well my friend, you need to do a little foam and fiberglass work and produce a flag or light pole that contains your vertical antenna. Working with the blue insulation foam board available at most building supply stores is easy. You may saw it or use a hot wire cutter you can easily make yourself. Working with fiberglass cloth and resin is a little harder but it's well within the neophyte's capability to learn how to do it. If you don't want to do it all you can find help in your local area very easily. Any good boat or automotive body shop will have people with years of experience working with fiberglass and would be more than happy to take your money to produce your custom flag or light pole.

Lets start with the design requirements. Will your HOA allow a flagpole? Most people that sit on HOA boards are liberal types that like to control every aspect of your life and waving a flag (especially here in the USA) reminds them we live in a free country which limits there power and so the last thing most of them want is a reminder of that and consequently they ban blatant patriotism, flag waving, and worst of all a (horror of horrors) flag pole that could be used for the display of a flag! In these cases you will want to produce a light pole, which most HOA's will allow. In either case the production of the pole will be the same except for the "decoration" used at the top of the pole. A flagpole will have a rope and pulley system and the light pole will have a light housing and bulb.

Lets start working on the pole. You will need to make the interior of the pole hollow so your vertical antenna may be placed inside. Square tapered poles are common and for our use and this design makes construction easy. Measure your HF vertical and figure out the space requirements. Now you need some way to hold the foam in position as you construct the pole. Use the cheapest OSB or plywood obtainable or even multiple layers of cardboard will work fine to produce the required form. Below is a drawing of a form that would work just fine for producing our square tapered cavity. There will be no resin used in form so it should pull easily from the completed pole. If you're worried that some resin could infiltrate the cavity simply use wax paper around the foam supports to prevent the resin from gluing the foam supports to the foam.

0x01 graphic

If you need a round pole this is not a problem. Simply add more foam to the sides and form the foam into a round or any other shape you require. No dimensions are given as this depends on your choice of antenna. The taller your antenna the more foam supports you will need. Also the support rod is very important! After you finish the pole the support rod and foam supports must be pulled out of the cavity. If you want a monoband HF antenna you do not need to worry about making a cavity for your antenna element. Simply use some copper wire as the antenna element between foam sheets, no form required! Don't forget the required decoration for the top of the pole. Your HOA requires pre-approval of every part of your existence on your (or there?) property. Be ready to supply this information in the form of a product brochure and the placement of the pole on your property. This requires that you copy a design for your pole. Here is a very good example of a generic pole design that you could submit to the HOA or your wife.

If you get the ok for a flagpole then your pole construction effort will be easy. Here is a link to a site that has flagpole hardware and decoration.

If a flagpole and flag is not allowed then you need a light pole like the one pictured below.

0x01 graphic

Notice the square form of the lamp box. That's going to be easy to make with foam and fiberglass. I know, what about the wires and the light? There's an easy and cheap way around that problem! Don't put wires and a light in the pole! Simply get a cheap mirror and put that in the light box where the lens would normally be and place a light fixture and narrow beam floodlight pointed up at the mirror from the ground. This is a modern design and use the bulbs pictured below.

0x01 graphic

Halogen and low voltage PAR-46 bulbs.

Lets get back to the construction of the pole. I won't get into just how to work with fiberglass and foam, as there are plenty of sites on the Internet that go into great detail on this subject. Most of them deal with boat construction. Here is a link that details the construction of a mast for a sailboat.

0x01 graphic

That's a strong pole made of foam covered with fiberglass. Would you stand on your aluminum vertical HF antenna? If it were located inside that hollow pole you could!

Here is a site that shows some details on forming the shape of the foam and laying the fiberglass on it.

Just remember that your pole will be hollow inside if you make it to contain an antenna like a Butternut HF6V or HF9V or a Husler BT5V.

0x01 graphic

0x01 graphic

0x01 graphic

The above pictures show the development of the foam core. In this case a solid construction. Making it hollow will be just as easy except you will need the form shown earlier to hold the foam in place as you work on your pole and later add the fiberglass cloth and resin. Make sure you taper the interior cavity so when you pull the mold out it will release easily and become lose with only a small amount of travel. As for mounting the pole I would reference the flagpole supplier and use mounting hardware like that used for a factory made pole. This could be incorporated with the mount used for your vertical HF antenna.

Fiberglass products are available from many sources. Here is a link to one of the better suppliers.

Not only do they supply the fiberglass products you will need they also have information on how to use their products. It's almost a "Dummies guild to fiberglass composites" online book!

When you install your vertical in the fiberglass pole just remember the resonate frequency's will drop slightly due to the velocity factor. The performance of the antenna will be the same. It's sort of like comparing the difference between insulated and bare antenna wire. As for as the RF is concerned there is no difference.

Member Comments:
This article has expired. No more comments may be added.
 
Hide Your HF Vertical in Plain Sight  
by K5UJ on July 22, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
Articles such as this one demonstrate some creativity and interesting construction ideas. Thanks to the author for taking the time and trouble to write and submit the article and photos. I'm sure there are hams who will be glad to get the information in this piece and use it.

Hopefully without this turning into a big argument (i.e. another eHam flame war), I'd like to respectfully submit that wherever possible, these solutions be regarded as temporary. The best solution is to get out of a HOA situation and into one where you no longer have to hide your antennas.
 
Hide Your HF Vertical in Plain Sight  
by N6AJR on July 22, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
are you saying in your article that we should try to Fool the fine folks in charge of the HOA's and put up a trojan horse, what image of a ham does that project ... tsk tsk ...


Great article, I hate hoa's, and restrictions in general. and sending everyone in your local neighborhood a big tin of popcorn as a "good neighbor" every christmas don't hurt either ( $5 a tin at wally world)
 
RE: Hide Your HF Vertical in Plain Sight  
by IMBACKHF on July 22, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
One of the best ideas I have seen is a quad band antenna disquised as a giant bird house on a tall pole -- cause liberals and HOAs all love birds and bird houses...


.
 
Hide Your HF Vertical in Plain Sight  
by W2NSF on July 23, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
Scott, It would have been a good article, except for your comments about liberals.

Why couldn't you just have held it at helping out your fellow hams with quality technical information, instead of deepening our political division? This hobby should be a uniter, not a divider; but, by your loose words, you've alienated half your intended readership.

Sure, go ahead and express your political views - it's a free country - but do it in an appropriate forum, not in a technical article about antennas.

Thank you for listening.
73
Jim
 
RE: Hide Your HF Vertical in Plain Sight  
by KB2CPW on July 23, 2005 Mail this to a friend!


He was inferring that Liberals suck and will be the downfall of our great country..

Oops, I shouldnt put words in his mouth.. I think liberals suck.. I hope this makes you happy, oh and thanks for a wonderful article... Richy N2ZD
 
RE: Hide Your HF Vertical in Plain Sight  
by K0BG on July 23, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
Two comments. I have seen similar articles on line that used foam pipe insulation to form the basis of the pole. Being round to start, and hollow on the inside, it makes construction somewhat more straight forward.

I don't know what it cost you to build your pole, but a 40 foot fiberglass flag pole with a fold-over base assembly (an important attribute) is just shy of $400. I can only speak for myself, but that is what I would use. And speaking of what I would use....

When I lived in Littleton, Colorado, I used a 50 foot aluminum flag pole as an antenna. It was fed using a gamma match on 20 meters and worked like a champ. Later on, I used an SGC auto-coupler to match it on the rest of the bands. Because it was grounded at the base, it had an advantage over most designs for very obvious reasons.

Alan, KØBG
www.k0bg.com
 
Hide Your HF Vertical in Plain Sight  
by WA5PSA on July 23, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
Yeah, well, I'd probably be considered a "liberal." But, funny thing, most of the upper class folks that live in my HOA all seem to be good staunch "conservatives." Seems like they're the ones most interested in protecting their property values.

But the labels we use (and that I just used) are simply attempts to put people into boxes just because it makes it easier for our little brains to think about things. And it ain't fair, from either side of the political spectrum.

Other than that, I'm gonna save this article because I can use this idea.

73
 
RE: Hide Your HF Vertical in Plain Sight  
by WD0M on July 23, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
It's an interesting commentary that the following tripe has to be interjected in what otherwise is a beneficial article:

"Most people that sit on HOA boards are liberal types that like to control every aspect of your life and waving a flag (especially here in the USA) reminds them we live in a free country which limits there (sic) power and so the last thing most of them want is a reminder of that and consequently they ban blatant patriotism, flag waving, and worst of all a (horror of horrors) flag pole that could be used for the display of a flag"

To the contrary, I've found most HOA committees comprised of conservative members. Having learned to think for myself, rather than follow any particular political dogma, I have no issue with either side of the partisan spectrum. When I bought my home I worked with the HOA environmental committee to illustrate how my antenna would be hidden in the trees. I provided each of them a 10 page brochure I had put together with photographs of towers belonging to hams who lived in the area. I included a Paint Shop Pro rendition of a tower placed in the trees in an actual photo of my property so they could envision what it would look like. I provided a history of ham radio, emphasizing the public service nature of the hobby. I received approval and the tower is up.

My experience may not be the norm, but I find that if you approach the HOA committee without a pre-determined idea that they are a bunch of "flaming liberals" or "right wing conservatives", you may have a bit more success.

Joe
WDØM
 
RE: Hide Your HF Vertical in Plain Sight  
by KA4KOE on July 23, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
Couldn't one go ahead and get a bona fide aluminum pole and shunt feed it like a tower? The light fixture would act as a capacity hat.

Just curious. Being an engineer, you can get poles in round, tapered, whatever, and just about any color you want....

Not cheap, however, thats the drawback.

PHILIP
 
Light Pollution  
by KA4KOE on July 23, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
Also, I wouldn't use the in-ground light/mirror solution. Since many of us hams are also into astronomy, the light going straight up is light polution, plain and simple. We advocate cutoff fixtures that have nil horizontal light in its pattern.

Check out the International Dark Sky Association. They have a website somewhere.

PHILIP
KA4KOE
 
RE: Hide Your HF Vertical in Plain Sight  
by WB4TJH on July 23, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
It was an interesting article, but why go to all that expense and trouble of fabricating a flag pole antenna? Just get a Hustler 4BTV vertical, remove the capacitance hat rods, and buy a large enough piece of PVC for it to slide into. You can also just buy a commercially made flagpole antenna for a lot less than all that custom fiberglass fabricating. I have a friend who has a commercially made one, and feeds his with an Icom tuner. He put it up recently in a new gated community he moved into, and immediately, the neighborhood old fart/self proclaimed covenant enforcer demanded that he take it down. My friend reminded him that there was NOTHING in the covenants that forbade a flag pole in the front yard. He then politely told the old jackass to get lost and has been secretly using his flagpole vertical ever since. Don't ever tell a ham he can't get on the air. Where there is a will, there is a way. He recently told me that since he has put up his, several non ham neighbors ave also put up flagpoles. So his is lost in the forest. Don't you just love it?
 
RE: Light Pollution  
by SWLNVSN on July 23, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
Philip - bless you!
I was trying to figue out how I would interject that bit - and you did it very well. I'm glad I'm not alone!

Folks - "light polution" is a HUGE deal.
Take look at any sat image of earth at nite - you'll get the idea.

Do a search on it. I won't harp.
 
RE: Hide Your HF Vertical in Plain Sight  
by WB4TJH on July 23, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
It was an interesting article, but why go to all that expense and trouble of fabricating a flag pole antenna? Just get a Hustler 4BTV vertical, remove the capacitance hat rods, and buy a large enough piece of PVC for it to slide into. You can also just buy a commercially made flagpole antenna for a lot less than all that custom fiberglass fabricating. I have a friend who has a commercially made one, and feeds his with an Icom tuner. He put it up recently in a new gated community he moved into, and immediately, the neighborhood old fart/self proclaimed covenant enforcer demanded that he take it down. My friend reminded him that there was NOTHING in the covenants that forbade a flag pole in the front yard. He then politely told the old jackass to get lost and has been secretly using his flagpole vertical ever since. Don't ever tell a ham he can't get on the air. Where there is a will, there is a way. He recently told me that since he has put up his, several non ham neighbors ave also put up flagpoles. So his is lost in the forest. Don't you just love it?
 
RE: Light Pollution  
by K4JSR on July 23, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
Philip, may I strongly recommend the use of a Romanian
as a less expensive substitute for a Pole?

Tom, AJR, why didn't you suggest Fan Flag Poles?

Of course no none mentioned the fact that vertical antennas, stealthy or not, would turn us all into
RADIAL HAMS. Somebody had to say it!

This is also a good article. I strongly favor any ideas that will get more of our fellow hams who had an
aphasia when buying their houses back onto the ham bands.

By the way, liberals do suck. Bill Clinton left them no other alternative to inhaling! :-)
 
RE: Light Pollution  
by WA6BFH on July 23, 2005 Mail this to a friend!

I have taken a similar approach, although since I typically operate at shorter wavelengths, I have taken a different tack to disguising my antennas. I have three different wavelength band antennas for “EME” work that resemble a pair of Birkenstocks, and an empty Tofu container. I did once receive a complaint for littering but after a discussion on the matter, which included a sale at “Shoes for Less”, and a wonderful Tofu emporium downtown, the matter went away.

During this discussion I did mention the idea that I would like to put up a flag pole. Gotta cover those longer wavelengths too don’t’cha know! I was told that this would be Ok, as long as the only pennant or flag displayed was in a form depicting a rainbow, although the “Hammer and Sickle” was under consideration. It was also proffered that “wind-spinners are fun”!

As far as light pollution goes, hey we are getting a handle on that! I can now see all 9 stars in the night sky! I also believe I may have actually seen Venus but, I know this is mere speculation on my part, and I am not attempting to make the actual claim!
 
Hide Your HF Vertical in Plain Sight  
by KC9OD on July 23, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
Lot of hard work and creativity but you're still in violation of the covenants AND probably violating building codes as well.
Some HOA simply specify no transmitting devices!!!!

Maybe a First Admendment lawsuit is the way to go ?

Seems to me the easier flagpole solution would be any of the telescoping (or not) ready-made units and be sure to put down a network of those copper wires in the yard for mole control.(Well, that is one explanation for why you are digging in the grass!)
 
RE: Hide Your HF Vertical in Plain Sight  
by NN8Y on July 23, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
John, I think I enjoyed that piece of writing better than anything you've done so far.

On light pollution - he said put a mirror in it and shine the light up (onto the mirror) as an alternative to putting an actual light in the fixture. Whatever doesn't get reflected, well, ok, I guess that's pollution, but it's a small price to pay to get on the air.

On politics - if you talk to people you find that most have ONE main issue that makes them vote one way or the other. That basically puts them on the communication lines of their party, which means they listen to the lies from one side only. Well, except, of course, that our side doesn't lie and the other side is a bunch of subhuman scum. Seriously, I often remind myself that all politicians are criminals. But if you talk to someone from the other side, unless they're one of the rabid few, you'll be surprised how much you agree on.

And on flagpoles, there's always Force 12, $159 plus the price of a tuner if you don't have one. My antenna is against the C&R's so I may have to go stealth at some time in the future.

http://force12inc.com/F12-flagpole-ants-003.htm
 
Hide Your HF Vertical in Plain Sight  
by N0AH on July 23, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
I like the term "Trojan Horse" to replace "Stealth Antennas" thus leaving the word antenna out of the name.

I finally found something to take from an Eham forum besides liberal propaganda pushing MFJ benefits.

Amazing in that it only took the second posting and we have splatters on the thread.

VC factors show that this guy actually did what he is talking about. Nice change and without question magazine worthy material. You should submit it. Politics and all.

I was in a restricted neighborhood 11 years ago in Denver. I just put up an AP8A in my backyard in the corner. I took it up and down depending on use. After a year, I put up my 40 foot tower.

How? Because in Colorado, if you break a neighborhood code and no one says anything about it after one year, you are grandfathered in. ie: taht code does not apply to your property!!!! One neighbor complained. I showed him the law, made it sound like it applied to any antenna I wanted, and I never had a problem again.

Be it a Trogan Horse or a case of studying the law, there are ways around restrictions. Just ask for help- Sort of like what this forum SHOULD be about.
 
RE: Hide Your SHF Antenna in Planar Sight  
by WA6BFH on July 23, 2005 Mail this to a friend!

Oh, and on that idea of pointing a low voltage spot lamp up at a mirror. Shoot, point a GunnPlexer at a 12 inch diameter parabolic reflector -- such that it reflects the signal to another node. This is for your high speed Ham radio wireless Internet connection on our 3 centimeter band!
 
RE: Hide Your SHF Antenna in Planar Sight  
by K3UD on July 23, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
Cool way to fabricate a mast!

Unfortunately, there are some, if not the majority of CC&R restricted neighborhoods that do not allow flagpoles either attached to a window mount or ground mounted. As far as the birds are concerned some resctict things like Purple Martin houses that typically go up in 15 - 25 foot poles. (this would also be a great disguise if you can get away with it)

However, one thing that most CC&R restricted neighborhoods seem to allow is a basketball goal, many mounted on 2 or 4 inch pipe. Might be a possibility here.

Interesting article and good pictures.

73
George
K3UD
 
Hide Your HF Vertical in Plain Sight  
by KA5KXW on July 23, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
To the author of a mostly intelliegent article: As a former member of our armed forces, a proud past member of the Signal Corps Association and not a knee jerk conservative such as yourself, I was going to suggest a really good dark place where you could put your vertical. I will refrain because its a cheap shot and I *try* to stay above such things and stick to intelligent discourse. I'll simply say that I spent 9 years of my life defending our right to fly a flag and your right to flap your lips. Grow up.

73,
A liberal ham
 
RE: Hide Your HF Vertical in Plain Sight  
by W6TH on July 23, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
.

At the present time I am in a CC&R flying a 30 foot mast with a American flag on top and below the American flag I have the (POW) Prisoner of War. I am flying these flags with pride, because I enjoy my life in "These United States", which of course could be improved.

I was told to take it down, but came back and said: You must be Un-American to demand such. Three months gone by and nothing heard.

Un-American to explain:

Considered contrary to the institutions or principles of the United States.

73, W6TH
.:
 
RE: Hide Your HF Vertical in Plain Sight  
by K0MU on July 23, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
Only a conservative ham would be shortsighted enough to move into a dwelling with a HOA that resticts antennas.
 
RE: Hide Your HF Vertical in Plain Sight  
by W6TH on July 23, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
.

I will stand for and behind my rights, contract or no contract and watch and see what punishment The signing of the "Contract" will cause. I will take all the punishment "they" can dish out and will stand by to protect my rights.

Force me to sell my home, remove my countries flag, fine and jail me? let it happen and I will still stand behind our Constitution and our Bill of Rights.

Why the reason?

Our flag is representative of our independence and our unity as a nation.....one nation, indivisible. Our flag has a proud and glorious history. It was at the lead of every battle fought by Americans. Many people have died protecting it. It even stands proudly on the surface of the moon.

I again will sacrifice my life for my freedom.

Live free or die is my motto, I will be excessively proud of my accomplishments for you and me and "These United States" of America.

In God We Trust.

73, W6TH
.:
 
What a pathetic article  
by KD5VHK on July 23, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
I agree completely with KA5KXW.

So often great information is ruined with pointless attacks such as this. But, that's the avarage conservative American for you.

Leave it to a conservative to find a way to spew their garbage in the disguise of an attemp to sound intelligent.

Besides, I thought it was the conservatives that tried to run everyone's life -- abortion, attacks on personal rights such as invasion of privacy (commonly known as the patiot act), even how a person wishes to die(Teri Schivo). Or how about putting everyine down who doesn't feel the same way they do. (like neighbors that don't want the front lawns poluted with flag poles..) Remember, it was these very same Einstiens that bought the house, or sighed the neighborhood agreement in the first place. And now are trying to sneak around or break the agreement they signed.

Makes you proud doesn't it.

Give it a rest....... I'm really supprised you didn't mention Bill or Hilary.

I'd better shut up now before someone tells me "if I don't like it, leave". Oh, wait, we have something called freedom of speech. And I have just as much right to exercise it as they do. Whew,,, I was worried there for a second.

Just keep painting that picture for the rest of the world to see.
 
RE: What a pathetic article  
by W6TH on July 24, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
.

Conservative or Liberal, you young generation know little about. You believe in democracy and yet do not understand how it works.

Here is proof that our forefathers did not believe in democracy or government.

"A democracy is nothing more than mob rule, where fifty-one percent of the people may take away the rights of the other forty-nine."
-Thomas Jefferson

"A democracy never lasts long. It soon wastes, exhausts, and murders itself. There never was a democracy that did not commit suicide."
-John Adams

Try spending more time to go back and study history that you were probably not taught in the past. The internet can make the true Americans come back to reality.

In God We Trust.

73, W6TH
.:
 
RE: What a pathetic article  
by KB2CPW on July 24, 2005 Mail this to a friend!

To all of the hopeless Liberals.

Remember that Mr. Clinton gave "The Base" 8 Years to regroup and reformulate. I know because I was there at West St. cleaning it up that Tuesday morning and the following months after.. There hasnt been a President since Truman that had "spheres" enough to do what has to be done (btw,the only democrat with a pair). But Reagan comes in a close second.. At least he made some "accidents" happen..

While our Allies, Saudi Arabia finance the operations along with some other Arab scum, we sit back and claim that we dont know who our enemies are. Remember that your sleepy little town is next when the phone call comes.

Call me what you want, but this will never cease until we yield to their demands or turn the sand to glass.. IMHO Lets keep this thread about antennas and not politics.. But since you brought it up.. N2ZD

BTW, nice antenna article! Feel free in your next HOA related post to call these people what they are..
 
RE: What a patriotic article  
by KC8VWM on July 24, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
Live free or die.

 
RE: What a patriotic article  
by K4JSR on July 25, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
Charles, I am retired. Just how can I live free when everything costs out the pazzoots? Senile minds want to know.
73, Cal K4JSR Senility is great--you never hear an old joke. The mind is the second thing to go. I can not remember the first thing.
 
RE: Hide Your HF Vertical in Plain Sight  
by KI4GYT on July 25, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
KA5KXW,
Who are YOU to be invoking the United States armed forces? As if that gave you any right to be more "American" than someone else. There are plenty of hams who have plenty of active service under their belts, and the author has as much right to flap his gums as you do.

And for all the libs who want to scream about liberties taken away... Which party supplied the first President to unleash tanks on US citizens? Hmmm....
 
Hide Your HF Vertical in Plain Sight  
by N5UV on July 25, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
I find that it doesn't matter if they are conservative or liberal, power corrupts...and absolute power corrupts absolutely. What a shame that a good article has to be defaced by partisian politics.

As the other hams said before, I'd just put up a Hustler 6BTV and just take it down during the day...or, keep a smaller MA5V up for 10-20, then put up the 6BTV at night, when no one will care about it being up. If you mark the ant. at the point where you loosen a clamp to hold a section in place (such as at the top of the first 6 foot section, just before you get to the 10m trap), it'll be very easy to put it back when you want to get on the air again. Doing this will cut down any chance of accidentally bending the ant...you'll be surprised how much easier it is to bend 24ft. instead of 18ft. I've considered putting PVC over the ant. as a flag-pole option, but I would be a little concerned with how that would affect the performance.

Also, "bribing" your neighbors will help as well. That's why I don't raise a stink when someone parks their semi in the drive way, "he who is without sin..."

Now, back to the radio...DL
 
RE: Hide Your HF Vertical in Plain Sight  
by N5UV on July 25, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
To KI4GYT...

Are you referring to Herbert Hoover (from the party of Lincoln) when he allowed Gen. Douglas MacArthur to unleash the army on miliary vets during the Bonus Army Riot of 1932?

Or are you referring to something more recent? I'd like to know, as a historian.
 
RE: Hide Your HF Vertical in Plain Sight  
by WB2WIK on July 25, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
Nice construction article, but I'd commend it more if it focused on the more important aspect of using a vertical antenna, which is the radial installation. I didn't even see radials mentioned -- or if they were, this must have been glossed over.

A $1 piece of wire stapled to a tree trunk but fed in conjunction with a good radial system will dramatically outperform a $400 commercial vertical disguised to look like a flagpole, a lamp pole or anything else with an inadquate radial system.

I won't go into why people buy homes having restrictive covenants...

WB2WIK/6
 
RE: Hide Your HF Vertical in Plain Sight  
by KA5KXW on July 25, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
"Who are YOU to be invoking the United States armed forces? As if that gave you any right to be more "American" than someone else. There are plenty of hams who have plenty of active service under their belts, and the author has as much right to flap his gums as you do."

Thank you. Exactly my point. And I, like millions of others, liberal, conservative and other, put my future where my mouth was and joined up. THAT's why I invoked my participation in the armed forces. It doesn't make me any more American to be an old soldier. It does mean that I participated in our democracy to the fullest, as does every veteran: we defended it.

To tell the truth, I shouldn't have taken the bait and answered the author's liberal bashing to begin with. I'm just sick of vituperative personal attacks. I'm sick of attack politics and I'm sick of the far left and the far right acting like a bunch of school children. The sad thing is that it is popular to be ignorant and overly opinionated. Conservatives used to be intellectual powerhouses like William F. Buckley. Now they have Bill O'Reilly spewing half-truths. As for the liberals, they have Nancy Pelosi and Al Franken for spokespeople. Criminy.

So, this will be my last post on this or any subject on eham.net. I'm going back to the bands where decent, polite conversation dominates... well except for 75 meters. <grin>

73 to all
 
RE: Hide Your HF Vertical in Plain Sight  
by KI4GYT on July 25, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
N5UV, you know, I had forgotten about the Bonus Army riot and Hoover. I need to brush up on my history :) Too much studying of other countries' histories. Did Hoover use tanks? I thought it was infantry and horse cavalry.

The incident I was referring to was the use of M-60 based Combat Engineer Vehicles (CEVs) on the Branch Davidians a few years back. While they were without a doubt breaking the law and definately had some strange views on life, I've got my doubts as to whether armored vehicles [Both the Bradley AFV(25mm electric cannon + ATGMS) and the M-728 (165mm cannon)] needed to be used on American citizens. IIRC, I saw helicopter gunships flying around the perimeter as well.

I mean, c'mon, that's over the top. Tanks?
 
Hide Your HF Vertical where the sun don't shine  
by KC7EKK on July 25, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
This was a very entertaining and informative article. It was opinionated but funny. I would have gotten offended but I was too busy laughing my butt off. Scott you have a silk tongue.

Only a fool takes offense when no offense is given. That’s what wrong with our society. If you are offended, sue somebody.
Quit being a fool. Love your neighbor, forgive those that trespass against you, laugh often and enjoy life. Lets lower the nations blood pressure.

I lived in a CC&R neighborhood. Yes ham radio is a high priority but raising a family in a good neighborhood with good schools and close to my job was more important to me. In my town, the HOA was the only option. Call my crazy but my family comes before my HOBBY ham radio. If the HOA didn’t allow children or people who needed corrective lenses then I wouldn’t live there.

KC7EKK
 
RE: Hide Your HF Vertical in Plain Sight  
by KB2CWA on July 25, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
How did an antenna article turn into a political mudslinging event? From the postings here, I can see that there are morons on both sides of the aisle! Stick to Ham radio and stop making yourselves into a bunch of sissy-ass overly sensitive cry babies.
 
RE: What a patriotic article  
by KC8VWM on July 25, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
"Charles, I am retired. Just how can I live free when everything costs out the pazzoots? Senile minds want to know." 73, Cal K4JSR

---------

Well , the good thing about your particular situation Cal, is that eventually you will forget what everything originally cost in the first place.

Thus, you will no longer think anything is expensive anymore!

Say Cal, Do you remember when gas was just a nickel a gallon?

Ok then..., clearly I just demonstrated my point in question.

This perplexing phenomenon is apparent in the state of Georgia, and especially on eBay.

On another note, I really enjoyed reading the antenna article in it's entirety. It just goes to show where there is an un American, flag burning HOA gulag concentration camp..., there is a way.

Ok folks, I have to go now because I need to bring in my trash can and close my garage door...

73 Charles - KC8VWM
 
RE: Hide Your HF Vertical in Plain Sight  
by KI4GYT on July 26, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
>>How did an antenna article turn into a political mudslinging event? From the postings here, I can see that there are morons on both sides of the aisle! Stick to Ham radio and stop making yourselves into a bunch of sissy-ass overly sensitive cry babies.


Boy, they sure sound dumb, don't they? The only way they'd sound dumber is if they stooped to using words like moron and sissy-ass :) (/sarc off)

Isn't there a little sillyness in stooping to a lower level to try to criticize people for stooping to a lower level?
 
RE: What a patriotic article  
by WA6BFH on July 26, 2005 Mail this to a friend!

The good thing about the cost of things in the “state” that the author suggests is, all will receive according to their need, from those according to their abilities!
 
RE: Hide Your HF Vertical in Plain Sight  
by N5UV on July 26, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
To KI4GYT,

You may be right, I'm not 100% on tanks being used...but the decision to use that level of force was made by Gen. Douglas MacArthur at the time, it was his call on the ground to make...Hoover basically left it up to him to decide. I think they brought the tanks in, but then decided it wouldn't be necessary or politically very smart at the time. Either way, the incident just added more fuel to the FDR bandwagon in the 1932 elections.

Interestingly enough, I'm pretty certain George S. Patton was involved with this event in some way, as an officer in the cavalry or mechanized corp...if he'd been in charge, you KNOW he would have used tanks without blinking. You can a lot of things about Patton, but you can't say he wasn't aggressive or unpredictable. My favorite quote of his is this: "A good plan executed now is better than a perfect plan executed later." I can only imagine what he had to say about the Bonus Army, but this isn't the proper form for such language.

I guess my point on this is that sometimes the President is informed about what decisions are being made, but they may not know that such a level of force is going to be used. In hindsight, would Hoover have thought twice about letting MacArthur unleash the Army the way he did? Did Clinton know that tanks were going to be used that way at Mt. Carmel? Sure, I don't remember him apologizing for that after the fact...but when was the last time any politician admitted to ever making a mistake?

Anyways, back to the radio...DL

 
RE: Hide Your HF Vertical in Plain Sight  
by KB2CWA on July 26, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
Hello KI4GYT,
That's right, I took the liberty to use some nonsensical terms in order to draw attention to and make light of the useless postings being made here and in other forums. I only recently started getting back into the hobby and thought I might do some catching up by reviewing a few of the articles posted here. What I found though is that quite a bit of disk space is being wasted by "sissy-ass morons" who stoke their egos by flaming people. Instead of contributing something useful, people make a sport out of denigrating others. There are just too many socially inept nerds and trailer trash kings who hide behind the anonimity of the internet when making these posts. So if I choose to use colorful words to express my opinions here, too damn bad. I have a good life and really don't give a rats ass about the opinions of some guy living in his mom's basement.

73's
Aaron
 
RE: Hide Your HF Vertical in Plain Sight  
by W1BAK on July 27, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
Great Article! Great ideas! An Antron 99 (10/12/15/17/20m All can be worked with an efficient tuner) fits inside a hollow fiberglass flagpole nicely, too. As for my antenna farm...I'm very fortunate. Even though I live on a postage stamp sized lot, I can hang whatever I want in the ether. But then again, I checked before I bought the place. Something to think about?
 
Hide Your HF Vertical in Plain Sight  
by KLEMM on July 27, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
THANKS SCOTT THAT WAS A GOOD ARTICLE. I THINK YOU MIXED A LITTLE HUMOUR IN WITH YOUR ARTICLE AND THATS GOOD IT SHOULD MAKE US ALL LAUGH.THOSE THAT HAD TO MENTION PRO ABORTION AND THE PATRIOT ACT TO MAKE YOU LOOK BAD SHOULD GET A LIFE.SCOTT THANKS FOR YOUR IMFORMATION.
KE7EGZ VINNY
 
RE: Hide Your HF Vertical in Plain Sight  
by KD5VHK on July 27, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
Boy, you guys are funny!

The only reason the political issue was even pursued was because it was so blatently thrown out for all to play with. And it was fun. Like fish in a barrel.
P.T. Barnum was a very smart man.

There is still no denying the subject of this post is how to get away with beaking agreements you made with your neighbors/neighborhoods. And, how to break these rules under the guise of flying a flag/patriotism.
You know, good old American sneakyness.

As I said earlier.
It makes you proud.


 
Hide Your HF Vertical in Plain Sight  
by KE4ZHN on July 28, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
Interesting article. I still feel that it would be much easier to hide a piece of wire in a tree, or even tack it under the house eves and it would be all but invisible. But, if this is an only option, I guess it beats being off the air completely. I know a ham who used to run a coax and 13.8v out to his car parked in the driveway and use his screwdriver antenna to do HF from home. The only problem there is, dont drive off with the coax and power lead still connected! I ran across another website once of a ham who used his rain gutters and downspout as an antenna and buried wires for a counterpoise. This article didnt seem to mention any radials but without them this thing will not work very well. I also talked to a fellow on 80 mtrs. who lived in one of these restricted areas who simply layed a full size wire dipole on top of an azalea bush 8 ft off the ground and it played surprisingly well. Unless you walked right up to it, you would never see it. I imagine when he trimmed the bush he had to be careful not to cut his wire...but what the heck it beat nothing. Creativity is the key.
 
RE: Hide Your HF Vertical in Plain Sight  
by WA6BFH on July 28, 2005 Mail this to a friend!

KB2CWA, I think that you will find that if you take a circumspect viewpoint, and factor in a bit of humor, you will find a very good bunch of thoughtful and well meaning Ham’s. Check it out!
 
RE: Hide Your HF Vertical in Plain Sight  
by KC4KYZ on July 29, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
All good ideas about the antennas. But whatever happened to the ARRL's efforts to get the FCC to extend PRB-1 to include HOA and CC&R's?
 
RE: Hide Your HF Vertical in Plain Sight  
by W6QW on August 3, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
I didn't read through all them threads but California has a law (enacted about five years ago as I recall) that allows all flag poles regardless of any local laws OR CC&R's. California hams can look up the legislation by doing a search of the California Sate web site.
 
RE: Hide Your HF Vertical in Plain Sight  
by K8MHZ on November 20, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
What am I?

I want to conserve the environment.

I want to conserve lives.

I want to conserve peace.

I want to conserve the standard of living the US working class has strived so hard to attain.

I want to conserve the quality of life for senior citizens.

I want to conserve our freedom and rights.

I wanted to conserve our nation's finances, but it's 6 years too late for that.

What am I,

Of course, I am a liberal!!
 
Email Subscription
You are not subscribed to discussions on this article.

Subscribe!
My Subscriptions
Subscriptions Help

Related News & Articles
How I Saved On My Tower
The 'Wadetenna' for HF Pedestrian Mobile


Other Antennas Articles
Using Yagis Backwards
The 'Wadetenna' for HF Pedestrian Mobile