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[Articles Home]  [Add Article]  

How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight

from David Black, WO5I on November 30, 2005
View comments about this article!


I've been reading the posts for several years now - NO CODE vs. KNOW CODE; Keep-It-Or-Dump-It; DitDah or Not DitDah. Frankly the argument is tired and played out. It's fairly likely that knowledge of Morse Code will not be a requirement of any U.S amateur radio license in the near future. Personally, I think it's sad, and on many levels a big mistake. But life is full of changes, disappointments, and opportunities to overcome adversity. This is one of them. Time to move on, or at the very least, to take a different tack.

Before I delve too deeply into things, let me first start out by telling you what this post is NOT:

-it is not a reflection on the “Good Ole Days”. Even though I'm over 40, and eligible for QCWA, I still feel like a kid in this hobby. It's one of the delightful things about ham radio. The hobby finds new and wonderful ways to surprise and amuse me virtually every day.

-it is not an attempt to stratify our ranks into the “Elite Speakers-of-Morse” vs. the “Great Unwashed NO-CODERS”. This argument serves no purpose but to divide us and get us looking for new ways to belittle those of differing opinion. I don't believe for one second that NO CODERS have anything less to offer Amateur Radio than those who can copy 40 WPM in their head while simultaneously watching TV, reading a book, and baking cookies.

-it isn't an attempt to convince anyone how easy Morse is to learn. The truth is that, like most things in life, some have an easier time of it than others. I fully recognize that some people don't have the Morse Gene, if there is such a thing. They just don't process broken bits of tone into letters and numbers. Others are simply too busy to learn what amounts to a new language.

What is this post, if not just another trip down that well-worn path, sure to degenerate into a series of sniping WE vs THEY counter-posts?

It's an opportunity for us to all consider Morse for what it is: a second language.

Educators all over the world recognize the need to know more than one language. Some high-performance American schools begin teaching a second language to children in their first year of grade school. In many countries, learning a second language is compulsory starting in elementary school. My preschoolers get a regular dose of basic Spanish just watching “Dora the Explorer”. The world is shrinking, and uniting all 6 continents under one universal language may be a goal for the Utopians to consider one day. Until then, the prevailing attitude in education is that it is very helpful to cross the border equipped to speak the language of your destination.

Morse Code, while not a foreign tongue, is a language. Actually, it's better than a language, because you don't need to learn a whole new vocabulary to use it. Just another Alphabet. There are many engineers who, through their knowledge of mathematics, had to learn the Greek Alphabet. Some of you reading this post right now will pause here and recite Alpha through Omega, just to prove that you still can. I'll give you a moment to get through it. (Too bad there isn't a song that goes with the Greek Alphabet, like the A-B-C song done to the tune of Twinkle Twinkle Little Star. I could hum along. But I digress).

Morse Code doesn't require a voice, a computer, a radio, or even sound to use. Two people equipped with flashlights can communicate while separated by ½ mile, if they know the language. Oh, and it helps if it's dark out, too.

I could be stopped at a stoplight, spot your call sign on your license plate, and with my car horn say,

“M-E-E-T M-E A-T I-H-O-P F-O-R C-O-F-F-E-E ?”

If you know the language, you can reply,

“S-U-R-E, C U T-H-E-R-E”.

If you don't know the language, you feel sorry for me because my car horn seems to have an intermittent short that is attracting a lot of attention.

So, what's the point? The point is this: even if Morse disappears from the FCC curriculum, take the time on your own to learn it as a second language (or third or eighth or whatever). Nobody is telling you that you have to. But maybe you should anyway.

I regret that I grew up in an age where foreign language studies were not required, even in high school. I work for a German company, so it would be very helpful to Sprechen zie Deutch. Sadly, all those years watching “Hogan's Heroes” did little to prepare my language skills for the German Business World of 2005. Living in Texas, it would be very nice to know more Spanish. Right now, I know just enough to know when my lineage or mom's occupation are being questioned. Alas.

At least I've learned ONE language other than English.

Thanks for listening. C-U A-T I-H-O-P.

Member Comments:
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How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by AG4RC on November 30, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
Great article!

I agree,,, CW definitely has its purpose an allot fun both on & off the air.

Being an "Extra-Light" I always participate in CW contests and 1/5 of my rag chew contacts are CW.

Take away all mass media, telecommunications networks, etc... Give me a tuna-tin transmitter and a battery operated shortwave radio (receiver) and I'll commutate all over the world!!

...CW on the road is allot of fun too, I always toot "di-da di-di-dit di-di-dit" when someone cuts me off,,, then wave hello & smile...

73,

Peter
 
How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by W4JVY on November 30, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
What is an extra-light? Could it be an extra flashlight
in your hip pocket?
 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by K0BG on November 30, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
The last time I honked out a Hi Hi on my car horn the guy (in the other car with a KD5 call on the license plate) gave me the high sign, and I'm not talking thumbs up!

Some years back while at a drive in movie, I tooted out a CQ just to see what would happen. I think I got 5 or 6 answers. If you could do that today, I'd bet the manager would come out and ask you to leave. Things sure have changed.

Alan, KØBG
www.k0bg.com
 
How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by K8YS on November 30, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
back in my Scouting days, 1972, while at a "High Adventure" camp, our group had to cross a lake to get back to camp. It was close to dark, and while crossing the lake, a storm came up. The group got scattered in the high winds and rain. The canoe I was in and one other, made it to an island. Using a flashlight, I was able to signal to the camp across the lake and summon help. Moments later, a power boat showed up and searched for the missing scouts/canoes. They were all found to be safe.

I think that this was the defining moment when I decided that I wanted to get my ham license, radio had to be 100 times more efficent than a flashlight.
 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by KE5EXX on November 30, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
What's a drive in movie? ;)

I haven't seen one around here in TX for more than 10 yrs.


-.- . ..... . -..- -..-
 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by AG4RC on November 30, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
"by W4JVY on November 30, 2005
What is an extra-light? Could it be an extra flashlight
in your hip pocket? "

"How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight",,, "extra-light",,, no pun intended...

Peter ag4rc
"extra-lite"
 
How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by N4WQH on November 30, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
I am also an "Extra Lite." I learned 13 WPM to get General, and never used it. Not my "cup-o-tea." I am also tired of the devisiveness of the code vs. no-code debate. This is a hobby. We are supposed to be enjoying ourselves. Experimentation and emergency preparedness should be on our minds. Not flaming the no-coders or the 40 WPM guys. Each of us has our own passions in this hobby and in life in general. Let's get beyond the attacks and find the fun again.

73 All,

Mike
N4WQH
 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by KD5SHW on November 30, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
>>CW on the road is allot of fun too, I always toot "di-da di-di-dit di-di-dit" when someone cuts me off<<

Best quote ever.
 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by AE6IP on November 30, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
So I was wondering, in this "language", how do I ask someone who speaks no English what they had for dinner last Thursday?
 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by N8NOE on November 30, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
OK, Id roll the Window down and say OK!....

I've used CW, but not real proficiant, but if you could do this at a light, YOU need to find another way to get where your going. The light is set too long!..
There going to change the Band and mess with it to the point Nobody will play CW, Last few posts were about RTTY on the CW portion. I'm afraid it's going by the Way-Side.. Just because I Don't care much for the Mode, DON'T mean it should GO.. Actually, MOST the people I talk to use CW or Contest CW..
 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by WR8D on December 1, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
Morse is the universal language. Honestly and simple as that. Lets not turn this into a code/nocode spew fest. I've been so sick of all the crap and crying going on for the past few years i've been terribly inactive. When i check some of my favorite ragchew spots i find them turned into what sounds like a cb free for all. SSB signals extremely wide, amateurs sounding like something you'd hear coming from a trucker on a cb out on an interstate with his mic gain turned all the way to the right and some kind of stupid sounding echo crap on his signal. Its really made me sick to hear what we have degenerated into in some spots. A few months ago i dug my dads old straight key out and started all over again. I honestly had to make myself get on the air and transmit. Now let me make myself perfectly clear. I don't give a flying hoot if you work cw, if you go 40wpm, if you can do 5wpm, or if you waivered the code to get a ticket. The knowledge of cw will not make you a better or worse operator. If you have no character or lack a brain it will be evident on the air, as well as on these threads. I'll say this about the mode though at present time. Every contact i've made has been to a perfect gentleman or in some cases lady. Not once in recent months of me being back on cw have i ran across any example of what we all can see and hear on phone. I'll also have to say the same about any of the so called fuzzy modes from psk31 to the weird sounding stuff like mt63. I must say this though, its been cw by its self alone and not the soundcard modes thats brought the old amateur spirit back to me. If you don't like a mode there's others to try. I'm sure anyone can find a spot to fit in somewhere. Lets all just stop looking down our nose at each other and get on the air. Stop down grading yourselves on the air by saying i'm an extralite and all this other crap we all hear. We'll never start to get along again if you guys and gals continue this. Getting back to cw, i suggest even if you can just do 5wpm get in there and send a cq and make a contact. You'll be rewarded with meeting some of the most wonderful people you'll ever talk with and that goes for anywhere in the world. They'll come back to you at your transmit speed. Well guess i'm off my soap box for now. I hope all this redneck hillbilly spew helps someone. 73 WR8D
 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by KT8K on December 1, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
I totally agree with WR8D on the kind of people you meet on CW AND the great way it feels to do it. On HF I operate 90% CW, with the rest being SSB and about 98% of that in contests.

Every so often I go looking for a QSO on one of the HF phone bands, but what I hear usually sends me back to CW for quite a while. I didn't even order a microphone when I bought my new rig.

It's like fast food burgers (McDonalds in particular) -- I have one every year or two, and it's enough to make me not go back for a long time. Fortunately there is much better food readily available, and for not much more money. The quality is worth it, and I can say the same for CW.

Also, if you can remember the alphabet and punctuation you can converse at 5 WPM, and I hear people operating at the speed frequently in the old novice bands, and sometimes in the general and even extra CW portions. Sometimes I go there just looking for a nice relaxed QSO, too.

CW will Never Die! 73 & best rx de kt8k - Tim
 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by W9OY on December 1, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
Are those Faraday flashlights considered to be QRP?

73 W9OY
 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by W9PMZ on December 1, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
"Morse is the universal language"

Really???

I thought it was a method to convey language.

Does this mean PSK31 is a language???

Does this mean ASCII is a language???

Does this mean packet is a language???

If someone is transmitting German in CW and an English OP who does not speak German happens across the German guy, does that mean that they can communicate? They maybe able to interpert the symbols that make up the language, but as far as communicating I think not.

73,

Carl - W9PMZ
 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by AA4PB on December 1, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
Is Morse code a language? If I send Morse in English to someone who doesn't understand a word of English and doesn't know any Q signals will he be able to understand what I am saying? It seems to me that Morse is a way of encoding the characters of a language just like Baudot and Ascii are ways of encoding the characters. Morse has the advantage that it can be decoded by ear.

I submit that Morse is a code rather than a language.
 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by W8JII on December 1, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
My CW proficiency is marginal but i have noticed that when i call CQ on CW my chances for a contact are almost 100%. When i call CQ on phone it's around 50%. Maybe this just means my fist is so bad people feel sorry for me and my voice is so irritating people avoid me! in any case i find myself on CW more and more which is a 180 degree turn for me. For 50 years i avoided CW entirely!!!!!
 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by K5DVW on December 1, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
I've had plenty of DX with non-English speakers who I am sure couldnt hold a conversation in English. Morse the way we use it with its shortcuts and abbreviations seems to always be understood.
 
How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by NY7Q on December 1, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
As a Radioman in the Navy, I was known to hang around on the signal bridge and copy the lights. At one time, I was assigned to the signal bridge on a destroyer escort (charles e. brannon) as a backup on the signal lights because I was so good at copying and sending them.....
CW will never go away....
those who resist learning are losing out.
those who say it is digital don't know what they are
talking about....
CW TODAY, TOMORROW, AND FOREVER...
GOD BLESS OUR TROOPS IN THE WAR(S)
 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by W9PMZ on December 1, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
But that's not the point. You can have Q codes, etc and still use them on any other mode. The codes and abbreviations are not unique to CW.

What is unique to CW is that it has the potential to have a better SNR which makes it more useable than larger bandwith signals.

73,

Carl - W9PMZ
 
How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by AI2IA on December 1, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
Morse Code is a good thing, because in its structure it is simple, and it is very easy to send, once learned. It has the quality of being able to get through over noise, too! Don't we all know this?

If you like it, use it. If you don't care for it, use something else, that's all.

Let's be honest about it. What all this endless discussion is about is not really Morse Code. It is about regulation and either continuing to impose Morse Code or not imposing Morse Code for ham licenses.

As long as the bands remain open for Morse Code, there is no need to impose it. Don't regret the loss. There is no loss. Hams use it every day. If you don't want to learn it or use it, just don't do it.
 
How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by KC4QH on December 1, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
I have been dilegently studying for my code test. Will I use CW? I don't know. I seemed impossible at first and then easier. We'll see in a couple of weeks. Have to admit - it's kind of intriguing! I have heard the usual pro's and con's of the elimination debate. Probably CW requirement will go away. But if it does not, consider this: All of the learning material suggests copying code off the air. OK - I tuned in to 80 40 10 meters. Copied what I could. Most seemed fast to me, but I found a couple of code-newbies and copied away. Then the learning material suggest that I send code. Hmm. Where can a no-code tech (NCT) send code? Not many CWs on 6 or 2 meters. If the CW requirement stays, how about opening some of the HF bands to NCTs for CW? You want to know why many NCTs are not learning CW. Simple, no place to learn!
 
How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by WA1RNE on December 1, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
Considering the title of this article I couldn't help just scrolling right to the bottom line.


CW is a fun thing to do for some, but so isn't Wouf Houng ceremonies and other rituals.


While living in this great country of ours, I'll continue to order my coffee using good old human voice and the English language - as it should be........


73, Chris


 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by EXWA2SWA on December 1, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
Hey there, EXX!
"What's a drive in movie? ;)

I haven't seen one around here in TX for more than 10 yrs."

Grab yer honey and c'mon up to Oklahoma City some Friday or Saturday evening - the Winchester is still open.

Great sounding call sign, by the way,
73,
Jim ke5Cxx
 
How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by KA4P on December 1, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
I had a schoolbus driver "CQ" me on his horn one day. I couldn't help but smile.
 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by W2SRH on December 1, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
KC4QH writes:
"Where can a no-code tech (NCT) send code? Not many CWs on 6 or 2 meters."

I feel your pain :> You might find other hams nearby with whom you could schedule a contact on 2m, but I've also found that not a lot of people have 2m CW (or even SSB) rigs unless they do a bit of contesting. Doesn't mean you won't find one, just that there's less. Hell, if I had an antenna up for 6m, I'd offer to work you too, but the layout of my apartment makes it difficult to get much more than local repeaters on 2m/440 unless I go play in a local park for the day (getting a bit cold for that now).

Another option is to get a practice oscillator and have a QSO with other hams in the same room - you're still hearing their fist, and still sending code back to them, there's just a more defined way of sending it over to the next person since you have to slide the key acoss the table.
 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by WA9SVD on December 1, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
I agree Chris-
While you might be able to ORDER your coffee using Morse Code, no one has yet devised a method to serve it by Morse Code...

Morse Code is a MODE, not a language. While "Q" codes may allow a "contest" type contact of "U R 599 hr 73 OM" type of contact, there may be some semblence of universality. But there ARE Morse characters for many other languages; including Japanese Kanji, Korean, Arabic, Hebrew, Russian and Greek.ALL have legitimate Morse characters, but if a German operator sent "dit-dit-dah dah," (. . - -) as a single letter, how would it be read by, for example, an Amarican Amateur? It's an "umlauted'U'" auf Deutsch, but unrecognized by anyone using (or knowing) only the "English" Morse code. Universal language? I'm afraid not, unless everyone agrees that English Morse is the Universal language. And U.S. Amateurs may use any of the "alternative" Morse sets to communicate with anyone they wish; the only requirement would be that the U.S. station identify in ENGLISH Morse. The rest of a QSO could be in Klingon, for that matter. (But THAT Morse language set isn't in the ARRL Handbook.)
 
How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by WR8Y on December 1, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
Good article, lots of good comments. But none of it matters.

See, it doesn't matter if CW is a language or an alphabet. It doesn't matter what the license requirements are. It doesn't matter (to me) what other people think.

It doesn't even matter that I have discovered that it is easy-er to work DX on 40, 30 and 17 meter CW than on SSB (using makeshift antennas and 90 watts out.)

What matters: CW is fun. Period.

WR8Y
Mark
 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by W0FM on December 1, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
Thanks for a refreshing slant on an increasing stale topic. It reminds me of when my son was about 8 years old and decided, after listening to his old man on the radio, to memorize the standard phoenetic alphabet.

He got the whole thing down in one afternoon, went to school and blurted it out for the teacher. We discussed it in our parent teacher conference and she commented how much easier it was for children to learn new languages.

Then at age 24, my boy became a cop and had to adjust to the phoenetics used in most law enforcement: Adam, Boy, Charles, David, Edward, Frank, etc. After three years he still struggles with the change.

Nice article.

Terry, WØFM
 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by K8YS on December 1, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
SOME of you guys are missing the point. Morse Code (International Morse Code) may not be a "language" in the truest sense of the word, but there is one indisputable fact of ham radio life, if you know the code, you can communicate with DX stations. OK, so the conversation is short and to the point, you are able to communicate. Without the code, it is just more babble.

With the tired phrase that is being bantered about, "you are ruining ham radio" so widely spread by those in favor of removing the requirement, I would suggest that by the requirement being removed, that would be the end of the international aspectof the hobby as we know it.

As difficult as it may seem to some, English is not a universal language, International Morse Code is as close as we can come.
 
How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by K2JVI on December 1, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
I must share a funny,and shocking story with all of you.
About ten years ago, I was working on my car one fine Saturday afternoon and had the radio on listening to a local talk show. I was listening to KSTP AM1500 here in Minneapolis when the talk show host was discussing toy walkie-talkies that had a morse code key. When he said " My brother and I used to take our walkie-talkies and send 3dit 4dit 2dit dah to each other" I immediately did a triple take and kind of chuckled. Most listeners would have wondered what he was talking about,but not I (or any other ham for that matter). I just wonder how many hams were listening that afternoon in the twin cities!!

73's.
 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by W5HTW on December 1, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
More years ago than I should mention (but I will anyway!) when I was a new Novice, I was one of the kids who has his own car. Well, "car" may be an overstatement, a '47 Chrysler sedan, but it ran. And it had a horn.

It was 1956, in Knoxville, Tennessee. After the meeting some of us would adjourn to one or another ham's house. We would caravan over there, two to maybe four cars, mostly teens, but a couple of young adults.

On the way over, through quiet, winding residential streets, we would hold our horn-talk. Short statements, yes, but they were fun. Today we would be arrested for disturbing the peace, I know. But then, things like "HOW CLOSE?" and "SIX BLKS" could be spelled on a horn, especially one slow enough for us poor 5 wpm Novices.

Today so many hams have no idea what Morse code is, except it resembles Black Plague, a tooted "HI" is, as already noted by several, likely to get an upraised finger, or an unraised .357. Or a rock in the windshield. If you tooted it at a woman with ham plates on her car, she likely will cower down in the seat, wondering what she did wrong, even if she is herself the owner of the ham plates!

Yep, the good old HORN-QSO days are over. They gave us a lot of fun, and though I know we disturbed some neighborhoods, at least we were just passing through, and the 'noise' of MOBILE-MORSE sound abated in one place, while it moved to another.

I recall, though, trying to worm the answers to a chemistry test out of a fellow ham in class. He didn't cooperate, but he did respond with tapped Morse on the desk, telling me he would not help me. Unfortunately the teacher, who did not know Morse, realized something fishy was happening, and made us retake the test after school. At least we got to retake it. She could have failed us.

As in just about every hobby any of us have enjoyed, there are the "good times" to be remembered. Whether it was motorcycles, flying, camping, fishing, or baseball, we all have those good times tales. And we all have things we miss about the good old days, except for those of us who are now living, or entering, what will someday be their good old days.

If that's you, I can tell you, assure you, about ham radio, your "good old days" will never match mine.

Ed
 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by AE6IP on December 1, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
> Morse is the universal language. Honestly and
> simple as that. Lets not turn this into a
> code/nocode spew fest.

I have no intention of turning it into a "code/nocode" spew fest. I just get sick of hams embarrassing the rest of us by spewing utter nonsense about Morse code being a "language". The _only_ people in the world who have a definition of "language" that allows Morse code to qualify are certain hams.

It is not a language. It's a way of encoding an alphabet. It has no grammar. It has no syntax. Of itself, it doesn't even have any words. ("Q" signs are independent of Morse code, and not part of it, as anyone who gets tired of hiring people on voice using them is clearly aware.)

 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by AE6IP on December 1, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
> I've had plenty of DX with non-English speakers who
> I am sure couldnt hold a conversation in English.

DX is a highly artificial exchange.

> Morse the way we use it with its shortcuts and
> abbreviations seems to always be understood.

So how do *you* ask one of these non-English speakers what they had for dinner last Tuesday?

 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by AE6IP on December 1, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
> if you know the code, you can communicate with DX
> stations. OK, so the conversation is short and to
> the point, you are able to communicate. Without the
> code, it is just more babble.

For a DX exchange this is not necessarily true. I've had plenty of phone DX with people who don't speak English, but we've managed to exchange call signs and signal reports, and I've got the QSL cards to show for it.

The exchange is a lot easier in Morse than it is on voice because Morse DX is far more structured, but really, all one needs to know in "English" to DX with an english only speaker is how to pronounce a phonetic alphabet and ten names for numbers.

A lot of non-English DXers have learned that much and have been kind enough to put in appearances on DXnets and QSL the contacts.
 
How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by K3JMG on December 2, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
Thanks, WO5I, for a very well written and entertaining article. I have enjoyed reading some of the responses, too. Though I think it is a mistake to drop code requirements for ticket, it really does not matter that much to me. As you implied in your article, I really like the challenge of learning something new, and I am going to become a more proficient CW op because I want to, I like the mode, and I believe it offers some advantages on the air. The responses also prompted me to begin thinking how to wire a spare horn I have up to a momentary switch for some on the road QSO's! Thanks for your good article.

73,
Mike
 
How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by KK7WN on December 2, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
good article . However, Morse code is not a language. It is a technique for expressing the symbols( letters, numerals) of a true language in an alternate form. Learning code is much easier than learning another true language because all you have to do is learn the pattern of dots and dashes visually or by ear, not a grammer, syntax, etc.Having said this, Code for me has always been a challenge because I tend to be a very visual learner(I mentally turn things into mental images rather than sounds). I can translate a string of visual dots and dashes very well just as I can read a page of Spanish or Norwegian very well. However, tell me to listen and I have much greater difficulty. What is required, as we all well know, is a type of "immersion" in the new sounds to learn them efficiently.
 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by WO5I on December 2, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
Marty (AE6IP),

I promised myself I wouldn't get defensive when someone posted a disagreement to my thesis that Morse "code" is a "language". However, since you seem determined to run a contrarian post to everyone that even remotely agrees with me, I have to take my umbrage public.

According to dictionary.com (and since I don't have my copy of Websters with me at the moment, I'll only cite that as a source) there are 9 primary definitions of language:

lan·guage
n.

1a.Communication of thoughts and feelings through a system of arbitrary signals, such as voice sounds, gestures, or written symbols.
-b. Such a system including its rules for combining its components, such as words.
-c. Such a system as used by a nation, people, or other distinct community; often contrasted with dialect.

2a. A system of signs, symbols, gestures, or rules used in communicating: the language of algebra.
-b. Computer Science. A system of symbols and rules used for communication with or between computers.

3. Body language; kinesics.

4. The special vocabulary and usages of a scientific, professional, or other group: “his total mastery of screen languagecamera placement, editing and his handling of actors” (Jack Kroll).

5. A characteristic style of speech or writing: Shakespearean language.

6. A particular manner of expression: profane language; persuasive language.

7. The manner or means of communication between living creatures other than humans: the language of dolphins.

8. Verbal communication as a subject of study.

9. The wording of a legal document or statute as distinct from the spirit.

As you can see, Morse Code would fully comply with at least three of these definitions (#1,2,&6) and, arguably, one other (7). Maybe I can get a research grant to teach Morse to dolphins...food for thought.

So, your statement,

"The _only_ people in the world who have a definition of "language" that allows Morse code to qualify are certain hams,"

isn't quite accurate, is it? Unless, of course, the editors at dictionary.com are all "certain hams".

I agree that Morse is not a foreign tongue. I conceded that point in my article. Maybe the root of the "embarrassment" you say I caused you is actually due to the fact that you don't seem to own a dictionary.

Send me your address and I'll mail you one.
 
How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by NT4XT on December 2, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
It's all good.
Happy Holidays to all.
73.
And, CW Forever...
dahdit
dah
di di di di dah
dahdididah
dah.
 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by W9PMZ on December 2, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
"1a.Communication of thoughts and feelings through a system of arbitrary signals, such as voice sounds, gestures, or written symbols. "

OK fine. The arbitrary symbols are the dots and dashs, but ultimatly the sum of the arbitrary symbols make up the (for example, RRR RST 599) language.
 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by K7BAL on December 2, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
Good for you Brian! I hear your argument about nowhere to send, but you should know that when I studied for my Novice license in March of 1991 I didn't have a place to send either. Neither did anyone else.

Most guys used a code oscillator and practiced sending off the air. Also, if you can copy 5 wpm you can probably send 15 to 20 wpm. Sending is the easiest part. By the way, there is no test for sending, only for receiving 5 wpm. Get your copy speed up to about 7 wpm and you should have no problem passing the element.

All the Best OM

Brian K7BAL/9
 
How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by KC0TXO on December 2, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
It's easy to get caught up in semantics and minutae, but I believe the point is that whatever you wish to call it, Morse code is skill that for many people is well worth obtaining. Like many other things in life that are worthwile, it takes a lot of hard work, determination, discipline and plain old practice to get proficient at it. Yep, its going to take some folks longer than others. And that's just fine. Those who really want to gain a certain level of expertise will. From a personal point of view, I appreciate the encouragement and inspiration.
 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by AE6IP on December 2, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
> As you can see, Morse Code would fully comply with
> at least three of these definitions (#1,2,&6) and,
> arguably, one other (7).

Nope, don't see that at all.

> I agree that Morse is not a foreign tongue. I
> conceded that point in my article. Maybe the root
> of the "embarrassment" you say I caused you is
> actually due to the fact that you don't seem to own
> a dictionary.

<looks around. notices Oxford English Dictonary. Notices French dictionary. Notices Chinese dictionary. Notices Irish dictionary. Notices copy of _Linguistics_>

Nope, I don't think it's a lack of dictionaries. I think it's your desperation to make Morse code appear to be more than it is.

Let's take a quick look at the definitions you claim, erroneously, that Morse fits:

Definition 1 and 2 are lay versions of the traditional linguistic definitions of language, defintion 1 being the act of using language, definition 2 being the form of language.

Morse code does not, of itself, fit either of these definitions, unless the ASCII character code also does. Morse is _not_ a communication of thoughts and feelings. It _is_ a system of arbitrary symbols. It is distinct from being a *language* in the sense of those definitions in that it requires more than just the symbols of Morse in order to communicate.

Morse has no grammar. It has no meaning. The meaning conveyed using Morse code is only present when it is used to encode a real language. The string 'ni hao' means nothing in English. Encoding it as "-. .. .... .- ---" doesn't suddenly give it any meaning. Yet, it's a perfectly valid sentence. In mandarin. There's a lot more to communicating than just transcribing the roman alphabet into a series of beeps. But that's precisely what Morse is: transcribing the roman alphabet (and a few other characters) into (at least in its aural form) a series of beeps.

If I send you -. .. .... .- --- and you don't know mandarin, you would think I was sending you gibberish.

let me try it another way. Here's a string of two digit numbers: "48 65 6C 6C 6F 20 44 61 76 69 64 2E" Does the fact that I can string those numbers together like that make them a language?

Now suppose I told you that those numbers were the same as ".... . .-.. .-.. --- -.. .- ...- .. -.. .-.-.-". Would you claim, suddenly, that yes indeed, stringing 2 digit numbers together makes a language?

Of course you wouldn't. Because you'd be smart enough to know that a language is _more_ than *just* the symbols that are used to encode it. (And that's why Morse doesn't fit any of definition 1 or 2.)

Yet, when you claim that Morse code is a language, that's exactly what you're claiming: A language is *just* the symbols that are used to encod it.

Why do I find you're attitude embarrasing to the hobby? because you're not that dumb.

 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by WO5I on December 2, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
Sorry, Marty, but we'll just have to agree to disagree on this one.
 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by K0EWS on December 2, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
Good article.
While perhaps Morse doesn't meet the textbook definition of a language; I think that we can all agree that it is a wonderful method of basic communication, and one that requires very little circuitry, little expense, little power, and little bandwidth. The fact that it is still so widely used is a testament to it's merits. I fully enjoyed the post.
 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by WR8D on December 2, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
Hey Marty, universal language as in "international morse code".. Meaning regardless of what language anyone on earth speaks we all can talk on cw. Surely you've heard it called international?? You try to make a mountain out of a mole hill. Its not complicated at all, you are just "trolling". Another question you had i'll also answer, if i want to know what he had for dinner or what color his ole ladies bloomers are i just ask him . He'll tell me in morse code and then maybe send me a pic on slowscan. Understand now?? Hi Hi I know you can't stand that when we do that...Hi Hi cw laughter! Have a nice day anyway, 73 John WR8D >>>>
>
> Hope i got enough of those in there!


 
How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by KC2CBA on December 2, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
Get over this hang up and lets give this dicussion a rest.
 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by AE6IP on December 2, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
Pointing out that Morse Code is not a language is no more trolling than pointing out that a transistor is not a computer.

Claiming that Morse Code is a language is just as incorrect as claiming that French is not.

I fail to understand how hams, who, after all, are in a _communications_ hobby, can't even figure out the difference between a language and a character encoding.

 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by AE6IP on December 2, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
> if i want to know what he had for dinner or what
> color his ole ladies bloomers are i just ask him

Well, here's your chance to prove once and for all that Morse code is a language. Guy at the other end knows *no* English. Help us out here. Be an Elmer. Show in dot/dash form, the Morse code that you use to ask him "What did you have for dinner last Thursday?" and, since he knows *no* English, while you're at it, show the dot/dash form of his answer if, say, he had beijing ba?

You won't, because you can't. You can't, because Morse code isn't a language at all, let alone a "universal" one.

Or, as you like to say: 68 69 68 69. (That's .... .. .... .. to you, since I doubt you speak the international language of ASCII)
 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by KC4UEB on December 3, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
I recall one time sitting in traffic and hearing a couple people tapping out CW with their horns. It took a few characters before I realized what they were doing and I thought it was pretty neat. But it became quickly apparent this was causing confusion among the other drivers and when the light we were sitting at turned green people were reluctant to begin to move because of all the horn blowing. Then other people who didn't know what was going on started blowing their horns either because people weren't moving when the light turned green, or due to what was perceived as random horn blowing. It only took a few moments for this simple incident to turn into a mess.

For those of us who know CW, we understand what we hear and begin translating it, as in the case of the horns above. But to everyone else it was just sheer confusion on the roadway.

If your feel the need to send CW using your horn I would recommend refraining from this if you happen to be in moderate to heavy traffic. This practice can easily confuse other drivers or distract them altogether and ultimately cause an accident because of someone talking to each other using their horn(s). And in some states it's illegal to use the horn on your vehicle except for valid situations such warning other motorists or pedestrians. I doubt sending CW is considered an acceptable reason for using one's horn, and if an accident ocurrs as a result you could be held liable.

CW can be fun for those who prefer to use it but I would urge caution when tapping out CW in traffic because of the negative potential to other motorists.
 
How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by KG6NJW on December 3, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
There is only one true international language, and that is sign language (i.e. - hand signs). The signs spelling out "what did you have for dinner?" are more or less the same in every country.
 
How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by KC2MMI on December 3, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
David, believe it or not there are some 6600 spoken languages catalogued on this small planet.

And Morse isn't even a language, it is more of a "character set", since your Morse in American English will still be gibberish in Mandarin.

But ignoring that, with 6599 other languages to learn, is Morse really the best way to expand your language skills?

It is handy, but so is AmSlan (American Sign Language) and with that, you don't need to disturb the traffic with your car horn.<G>

So many languages, so little time.
 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by WR8D on December 3, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
Let me try it this way then Marty. Everyone in the world is smarter than us Americians. Most of them speak several languages. I don't speak spanish but i can talk on morse with those people because they know international morse code. I'm just like most of the rest of us Americians, we took spanish in highschool and just learned enough to pass the class then after we graduate we forget it. Get this through your hard head! Those damn people are talking to us from all over the world on "international morse code". No dang it, saying its a language is just a damn figure of speech. Its "international morse code" because every damned body in the world can do it no matter what country they're from or language they speak. hi hi. Now i'm going to really get your goat Marty!
MERRY CHRISTMAS you goofy city slicker! God Bless
John WR8D
 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by AE6IP on December 3, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
> saying its a language is just a damn figure of
> speech.

Then behave like saying it's a language is a figure of speech.

And stop using figures of speech that confuse more than they clarify.

.... .. .... ..

 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by W6SN on December 3, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
You said...

Let me try it this way then Marty. Everyone in the world is smarter than us Americians. Most of them speak several languages. I don't speak spanish but i can talk on morse with those people because they know international morse code. I'm just like most of the rest of us Americians, we took spanish in highschool and just learned enough to pass the class then after we graduate we forget it. Get this through your hard head! Those damn people are talking to us from all over the world on "international morse code". No dang it, saying its a language is just a damn figure of speech. Its "international morse code" because every damned body in the world can do it no matter what country they're from or language they speak. hi hi. Now i'm going to really get your goat Marty!
MERRY CHRISTMAS you goofy city slicker! God Bless
John WR8D


BZZT! Still wrong. The reason you can understand each other is NOT because IMC is a language, but rather that you agreed upon a standard encoding of a rather bastardized form of language (English most likely in this case). It's just like us talking here. If i were to start saying things like: Wieso verstehst du uns nicht? Morse ist nicht eine Sprache. Would you readily understand what I said? Just because I, my computer, and eham's servers used ASCII to encode my thoughts into text you could read, and you can make out what the letters were that I sent, does not mean you can comprehend what I said.

On the other hand, most people would understand if I said "Sprechen zie deutsch" (which really should be spelled "Sprechen Sie Deutsch", but I digress...), because it's partially entered the lexicon of the american public.

Back to what you were saying, they were sending a codified language, consisting of Q signals, RRR, RST, 73, U, BTU, K, KN, etc, and you were sending the same back at them. Those are not "International Morse Code", it was merely used as the encoding on both sides so as to facilitate the transmission and reception of data.

Please, don't try and insult those of us who know that IMC isn't an actual language, as I'm sure you'd expect the same on a subject which you were right about.

Jason
 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by WR8D on December 4, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
W6SN gee, you can't read. I said calling it a language was just a figure of speech. You guys are a piece of work. Let me repeat so maybe you'll all catch it this time now follow along..."its not a language its a figure of speech to call it that"...Its not a language its a figure of speech to call it that..Its not language its a figure of speech to call it that....Everyone but us Americians speak several languages. We all converse through the mode of "international morse code" making no differance at all as to what language we speak. Now as much as you guys evidently hate the mode and obviously anyone who uses it. Cw is not going to go away just because the requirement to know it probably will be dropped for a license. Many are getting their old keys out thanks to the attitudes here and getting back into the mode. They are finding out like me that on cw there are perfect gentlemen and ladies full of the old amateur spirit. You don't see this twisted crying crap like on these threads and the ignorant rants you hear on hf. It just is not there. The cw bands each weekend are now getting more and more use thanks to YOU GUYS! You might of won the dropping of the code battle, but you have awaken many to try it again just to see what all the bitching is about. One contact and we're getting hooked on it all over. Santa is bringing me a new keyer because i've gotten so excited about using the mode again. Now at the end of my post let me repeat for those of you with an obvious short attention span. CW IS NOT A LANGUAGE CALLING IT THAT WAS ONLY A FIGURE OF SPEECH. Your own arrl used to advertise it as,"the universal language". Everyone in the world uses it still today to cross language barriers through our whole planet. Its a shame for what ever your reasons are that you can't enjoy the mode. This sentence is directed at whom ever needs it. As we say here if the shoe fits then wear it. I've yet to work an extra on cw and have him tell me he's an extra lite or a general to even mention these kinds of derogatory remarks. The crossing of the language barriers with cw used to be a common saying. Come on back down here to earth a little now guys and take a deep breath of this thicker air and you'll feel much better. No matter how highly educated any of you are nor how much you look down on cw operators and the mode, you're only hurting yourselves and all of us with these attitudes. I work all the modes and all bands. I must speak highly of psk31 here also. Thats another mode where all the world can converse. Remember though the rest of the world is not like us here stateside. Most of them speak several differant languages as well as their own. I sometimes catch two hams in differant countries talking in their native tongue. I just drop my call in and they switch to english and the qso starts from there. The hate for cw is obvious, the anticode group is extremely evident here in many postings. You even attack those of us that stand up for others who enjoy themselves on the mode. Thanks guys for awakening in us the realization that the rest of us have a wonderful mode to enjoy. You might as well realize that you can not make it go away, as we understand your pompous attitudes toward cw and the cw operator will never go away. Merry Christmas for now. Those new folks reading these post please realize the bands are not like what you see here on the internet. Get a license get on the air find you nich and enjoy yourselves. A mode will not make you a ham operator. Belonging to a certain club etc will not make you a ham operator. Its the character we get to see and hear on the air, regardless of what mode you use that will define what others think of you. The same thing applies here, if you don't have a brain others can tell it immediately. Again Merry Christmas, lets all try to get along. 73 WR8D
 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by WR8D on December 4, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
Jason, not picking at you but did you ever stop to think about what the original ham that had your fancy vanity call used to do with it? I'll bet he or she is turning over in their grave at you attitude toward our hobby and other amateurs. The split in our ranks will never heal thanks to attitudes like those present here on eham. None of us are better than any other because of code speed or the lack there of. Think about it! 73 John WR8D
 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by W6SN on December 4, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
Not to pick at you, but did you ever stop to think that perhaps I do indeed respect what kind of legacy he left? I don't regularly post in places like this, so one could hardly accuse me of being vindictive. I merely state things as I see them. Since the majority of posts here are quite "mean" in nature, I guess that's why you associate me posting here with having a bad attitude towards hams. Sadly, you are mistaken. I actually have a very 'brotherhood' attitude towards other hams. Just because I don't hold CW on the high pedestal that you all do, does not make me any less of a ham. I happen to enjoy (when I have time), ATV, pedestrian mobile, mobile, at home, phone hf when the bands are good enough for my short little commute, not that I should really feel the need to justify my being a ham to you.

Further, to say that Mr. Lippman would be rolling over in his grave is short-sighted, at best. Not knowing the full extent of things I do to further the ham spirit (which by the way, is not just pounding brass), you have no place to say anything.

To the other fellow, sure you can say it's a figure of speech, but try not to confuse figures of speech with overloaded misuse of words. Saying something is a language is hardly appropriate, even if intended as a figure of speech. To accurately convey what you want to say, you would need to say that you used an international or universal code. If you wanted to say you used the international or universal language which is commonly used on morse, feel free. That would be completely correct, as "QSL" in any language other than Q signals/prosigns means nothing.

.-- .. . --. . .... - . ... .. .... -. . -. ..--..

.--- . -- --- . -.. . .-. .-- .- ...
. . -. .... .- -- ... - . .-. . -. .--- .
...- .- -.. . .-. .-. ..- .. -.- - -. .- .- .-.
. .-.. -.. . .-. -... . .-. .-. .. . ...

.--- --- ... . .. ...- .. .. -. .- --..--
- . .-. ...- .- - .- .. ... .- ..- -. .-
.- ..- - .- --..-- - .- ..- - .. --- -.
-.- ..- --- .-.. . -- .- -.- ... .. .-.-.-

Did you understand any of that?

If so, then maybe there is some credence to your "International language" figure of speech.

If not, then *shrug* we are at an impasse, since we apparently can not convince each other.

Jason
 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by W6SN on December 4, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
I also missed something in your first post...

Getting on the air is indeed an extremely fun thing. Any new hams should try and get on as frequently as possible, and experiment with as many things as they possibly can. If, as some say the hobby is dying and will go away soon, better to get everything in! If they're wrong, though... you've got a lot of things to experiment with. Just don't let anyone tell you that a single operating mode or avocation within ham radio is the end-all, be-all. There are more facets to ham radio both as a hobby, and as a service, than most hams realize.

I'm sorry to you if I came off as rude, I just don't like it when people start to insult as part of a debate, so I return in kind.

Back I go to my website development.

Jason
 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by NN6EE on December 4, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
It's a real shame that all perspective new entrants into our GREAT HOBBY don't want to learn MORSE, just from the standpoint of achievement it's a HUGE morale booster to say nothing of the satisfaction you get from using it when you become PROFICIENT at using it!!!

But alas it seems that the "NEW-COMERS" hate it and either bristle or fly-off-the-handle at the mere thought of being forced to learn it to get HF privileges!!!

To me it's a very short-sighted attitude!!!

Jim/ee
 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by NN6EE on December 4, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
W6SN,

I don't fault you for being 24yrs old, but I do take a bit of umbrage to the fact that you ignore a fact that in MANY of even your age-group that they still believe in "TRADITION" in Ham Radio, especially from the stand-point of learning "Intl. Morse" and it holds a very SPECIAL place in everybody's heart who uses it often such as myself.

To advocate it's dis-use or even abolition in testing is EXTREMELY SHORT-SIGHTED!!!

I've been a Ham for 43yrs and proficient @ CW(35wpm) for 40yrs. It doid'nt come easy for me EITHER but I disciplined myself!!!

Jim/ee
 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by W6SN on December 4, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
Whoa there Jim...

I never advocated anywhere in anything I said that CW should be removed as a requirement. Nor did I state that it was a worthless endeavour. I merely said that there is so much one can partake of when it comes to amateur radio, that there is no end-all, be-all to the hobby. I personally think I might be interested in learning CW a little better (I've made only one QSO on cw, and that was a pretty rough one, noise took the other guy out half way through on the second go around). Being required to learn it though? I don't know if that's really something I can get behind fully... That being said, I also don't advocate complete removal of said requirement. Read into that however you like, I guess.

Jason
 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by K8MHZ on December 5, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
Count me in with the group that says CW is not a language.

It is a way to convey a language.

The Q codes are closer to being a language than CW.

To qualify as a language CW would have to be understood by all that use it. Someone that only knows the French spoken language and no Q codes or 10 codes (etc) would have to be able to communicate with someone that only knows English and no Q codes, etc, via CW to make it a language.

What I don't understand is why does that bother anyone? I happen to think CW is fun. I like to peep out 73 on the horn of my van while watching a crowd just to see who starts looking around...possibly indicating the presence of a ham radio operator.

We should be more focused on what it takes to get people interested in CW. The Mona Shores School district has well over a 1000 students in several schools and perhaps a hundred or more teachers and staff. The ONLY person in the ENTIRE school district that knows Morse Code is my 12 year old daughter, KØLEY. And she loves it!

We need to stop our petty approach to CW and figure out what it takes to get people interested. My daughter is very proud of her skill (actually skills as she is also an accomplished musician and a very good cartoonist, specializing in her own form of anime) and we send CW on my HF rig, our little practice HTs, the horn on my van, flashlights and by just saying the dits and the dahs.

CW is NOT a language, it's a CODE...and that's why they call it Morse CODE.

Why would that bother anyone? I think that this form of petty self rightousness is a large part of the reason that many want to not only distance themselves from learning CW, but want to eliminate it as a requirment as well.

Come on people, CW is a wonderful thing. It is our tradition. If no other radio service uses CW that makes it even more precious in it's uniqueness. We need to present CW to the world as the wonder it is and always has been.

I like to write things that people will see in CW. One day I found out that one of our club members became SK. I was really bummed out. As an electrician I have to put numbers on the ends of wires we pull into service panel to help keep the smoke in them. As a tribute to our SK, I marked all the wires in CW. Our apprentice saw the dots and dashes and asked two questions. First, he wanted to know how he was supposed to know what the characters meant and second he wanted to know what the electrical inspector, the most strict inspector in the State of Michigan would say.

My boss answered the first question very quickly. It didn't matter what I put on the ends, as long as they matched. Duh? I answered the second question. The inspector wouldn't say anything, he would just laugh as he is an Extra class ham.

On every new panel I install I write --... ...-- de K8MHZ somewhere behind the cover with a Sharpie. I hope for a QSO someday with someone that saw it many years down the road.

A few months ago I was working in a water filtration plant where a ham was employed as an engineer. One of my electrical testers produces a tone when I push a button. I had the thing in my hand one day when I saw Carl walking with two other engineers ahead of me. I started sending CQ on my tester and Carl spun around, saw me and started laughing. The other engineers had some pretty strange looks on their faces as Carl and I stood there laughing at each other, knowing we were baffling his co-workers.

If we present CW in a manner that makes it attractive we will accomplish our goals of preservation and promotion.

If we do not it will die a slow death, left only to a handful of elite afficiondos and looked upon as merely an interesting peculiarity.

73 and have fun! CW ROCKS!

Mark K8MHZ
 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by N5QVF on December 5, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
David, just a thought. The sound QTH (dah dah dit dah, dah, dit dit dit dit) not only means "home" it also means "casa", so in english we would translate QTH (remember it's a sound) to "home" in spanish we would translate the sound QTH (not the english letters, but the sound) to "casa". Yep, it's a language
 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by AA4LR on December 5, 2005 Mail this to a friend!

I think you guys are totally missing the point about this language thing.

So, OK, it's not a full-blown language in the sense that English, French or Mandarin are. But there is more to CW operation than merely taking English words and encoding them with on-off keying using a coding technique by one Mr. Samuel Morse.

Even at speeds of 50 wpm, CW is really slow to send entire words. Operators long ago (even before radio) came up with abbreviations -- a short-hand, if you will -- in order to convey meaning without having to spell everything out.

It's this shorthand that can convey nuances of meaning that go beyond the characters sent. I was trying to convey this idea to my wife, after I operated one evening on the ARRL 160m contest.

Say, you call someone, and he comes back with "?". That one piece of punctuation means a lot. It means, "I thought I heard something, but am not sure - try again." "AGN" in the same situation means, "I heard you, but I didn't copy what you sent." A "?" in a different situation means something else. Say a guy has just finished a contact with someone and sent a "QSL" or "TU". Someone else would send a "?" - meaning, "Who are you?" (Or, more likely, that person has been sitting through two or three contacts that the station made without signing, so it means "What's your stinking call?!")

The little "TU" or "73" at the end of a contact conveys a lot of meaning, even in a contest.

The hard part of the CW "language" is that it takes a certain level of proficiency even to start learning. After 30 years as a ham, I'm just starting to get sufficiently proficient to appreciate it.

Even if CW no longer forms part of the licensing requirements, there are at least three important amateur sub-disciplines that will encourage CW use: a) DXing, b) QRP and c) Contesting. And, it's fun. I had a blast running stations in the 160m contest this weekend. I worked 44 states in about 5 hours of operating.

TU GL ES 73

 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by NN6EE on December 5, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
Really some of you guys are RIGHT in that "Intl. Morse" IS A 2ND LANGUAGE!!!

Like any other mental-process having to do with any other than our own when we learn a foreign language our mind has to be trained to TRANSLATE from it's original form into something that the mind can understand in it's own native-language. The same goes for CODE in that the mind has to put the digital strings into letters or numbers, to make words and various numerical values!!!

Discipline in learning it=eventual proficiency and enjoyment!!!

Non-discipline= an HT and 2m. FM!!!

Jim/ee
 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by NI0C on December 5, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
As much as I enjoy and use (and am proficient at) International Morse for amateur communications, I'll have to agree with AE6IP that it's not a language, but rather a coding scheme that maps an alphabet system into particular sounds. It's a particularly useful coding scheme that allows us to communicate pretty efficiently by using a simple switch to turn a carrier frequency on and off, while occupying very little bandwidth (typically less than a hundred Hertz).

I'm not sure why people want to argue about this (except for sheer stubbornness) -- after all, we call it the Morse "code," don't we? The fact that it is a code is what allows it to be used with many different languages. Although I can understand English coded in Morse at 55 WPM, I can't begin to understand the Brazilian CW stations I hear on 40 meters, even though they may be sending at only 25-30 WPM.

It doesn't detract at all from the charm or the fun or the utility of Morse communications to understand them for what they are.

73,
Chuck NI0C






 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by NN6EE on December 5, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
No sense in squabbling about it BUT the brain still has to interpret "The Code" same as the spoken language!!!

Nuff said!!!
 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by K8MHZ on December 5, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
Is Braille a language too, then?

Do people speak Morse Code? Or Braille for that matter?

The slang that is transmitted via CW for brevity is not Morse Code. Look at the list of Morse Code characters. OM, 73, CUL are nowhere to be seen.

There are, of course, non-spoken languages, such as sigh language. But in sign language a 'word set' large enough allow for comfortable communications is that which qualifies it as a language, not the fact that there are gestures that substitute letters and numbers.

Morse Code is not a language because it can't be used without a language. I use English when I send and receive Morse Code. English is the language not Morse Code. If so I would not need English to communicate with someone, Morse Code would be all that I need. Obviously therein lies the difference.

Here is another test. Some languages are only spoken and have no written words, thus have no alphabet. Could we teach a person that only spoke such a language Morse Code? No, we would first have to teach them a language that had an alphabet in order to teach them Morse Code.

Our language is English. First we learn to speak it, then we learn to spell it and then some of us go on to learn to send it. Morse Code is just another way to convey a language, it is not a language in and of itself. Those that think it is simply do not know the correct meaning of the word 'language'.

73,

Mark K8MHZ

 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by KC8VWM on December 6, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
..--- -.-. .-. . .- -- .- -. -.. ..--- ... ..- --. .- .-. .--. .-.. . .- ... .
 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by K8MHZ on December 6, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
Charles,

Would you like fries with that?

Cheers!

MHZ
 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by WR8D on December 6, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
Like i said, international morse code is "universal", its also "international". Its right there in old qst's being called "cw the universal language". Also referred to as the "bridge of the language barrier". Hey now, you guys taught me this twenty two years ago when i first got a novice license. Now i'm here today reminding you of what "you" taught me. Again for those with a short attention span calling it a language is only a figure of speech. Remember everyone else in the world is highly educated and most speak several languages. For them to converse with us here in the usa via morse code in english is nothing. Also thanks to the anti code movement tons of hams are getting their old keys out and starting all over. This past weekend on forty meters i had to move five times to find a clear freq to call cq on. People were all over the band on cw calling cq. I thought i finally found a clear freq and was about to send my first cq when a strong station beat me to it. He started calling cq so i just went back to him and had a wonderful qso. Like i said earlier up the thread you anticode guys won the battle but it looks like you've lost the war. Thanks to you cw will never die. Thanks to you, folks like me are getting back into cw after years of being inactive. In recent weeks i've had the pleasure of meeting some of the most wonderful people in amateur radio i've ever ran into in my years of being a ham. The sad part of all this is you anticode people just can't imagine what you're missing. I can't understand the bitterness and open hatred i see from you people. Its just a mode, knowing cw or not knowing cw is not what makes you a better or worse amateur operator. Its the character all see and hear regardless of what mode you use that defines you to others. 73, Merry Christmas! John WR8D
 
How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by N5EAT on December 7, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
CW is somewhat of a language. Once, I made contact with a ham in Cuba. He asked me if I spoke Spanish.
I sent NO. I asked him if he spoke English. He sent NO. We continued on using the standard "Q" language
(Qth, QRS, and other common abbreviation such at FB, WX, RIG, etc). We chatted for 20 minutes just using
the actual language of morse code (you could SPEAK these symbols and convey the same information).

My wife's first CW qso was in a hospital. One of her patients was on a respirator. She knew he was a ham, and told him she'd passed her General. He tapped on her wrist "hand is cold". She covered his hand.

I think that CW is so useful that it won't go away.
It's also about as much fun as you can have in the hobby (other than having UPS deliver a new toy to the house).
 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by N8XD on December 7, 2005 Mail this to a friend!

Sign language is very similar to Morse code in many respects. Individual words in a particular language can be spelled out in sign language like individual letters can be represented in Morse code. Whole words or ideas can be expressed that universalize expressions by using signs, in the same way that Q-signals are used in Morse code to do the same. Q-signals have a simple grammar in the same way that sign language does. Ordering Coffee with sign language, just like with Morse code, will often leave the average fast food cashier looking dumbfounded.

Language is simply a way of encoding thoughts and feelings -- that can be done with sign language and Morse code.

If sign language is a language, then Morse code is too.
 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by K8MHZ on December 7, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
“We continued on using the standard "Q" language”

Bingo! The Q codes are closer to being a language than the Morse Code you conveyed them with. Could you have used Q codes without Morse Code to communicate? Sure. Could you have used Morse Code to communicate without Q codes? Likely not.

“I think that CW is so useful that it won't go away.”

Bingo again.

But it’s importance does not grant it status that is does not qualify for. I learned Morse Code in just a few weeks of part time practice. I cannot learn a new language in that sliver of time.

My daughter is teaching her cockatiel Morse Code. He can do CQ most of the time, but usually ends up calling CF or CP for some reason. He listens to Morse on my radio and starts to imitate it. He is up to around 6 letters now, C, Q, K, F, P and X. Are you telling me that when he learns the other 20 he will have learned a language?

I think not.

But, someday if you hear a call for CQ that has excessive ‘chirp’ that can’t be adjusted out, and you manage to have a nice QSO with Milagro the Cockatiel, I will stand humbly corrected.

73,

Mark K8MHZ


 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by NI0C on December 7, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
Mark, good comments in this thread!

I also have a cockatiel (named Wellstone). He seems to like to listen to code, but also causes QRM for me. He's an excellent sunrise/sunset detector, though-- useful for lowband enthusiasts pursuing greyline DX.

I'll have to work with him a little more and see if he can learn to whistle some letters in Morse. He does do well with voice, and talks quite a bit.

73,
Chuck NI0C
 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by K8MHZ on December 7, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
Chuck,

We should probably be careful what we say here, lest someone think that CW really is for the birds.

If you prefer that our 'tiels work SSB, all we need to teach them is "rough copy but you are 5 - 9 here in (insert state name here)".

Just wondering, do you keep your cockatiel in a Faraday cage?

And how do you deal with all the flutter? A real problem here, I guess I will just have to wing it until I figure it out.

73,

Mark K8MHZ



 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by NI0C on December 7, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
I can just imagine the newspaper headlines: "Cockatiels flock to ham radio."

I call my little QRP pet my quarter-pound labrador retriever!

73,
Chuck NI0C
 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by KC8VWM on December 7, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
lol

 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by N5EAT on December 8, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
On the 'bird' sub-thought, my 16 year-old cockatiel buddy (i've had since he was an egg...) passed on to what ever awaits him last week. His father did indeed
attempt to call CQ for several years before he went to bird heaven. He never really mentally found the pattern in CW - he just 'sent' random dits and dahs.

He could, however, whistle the first two lines of Dixie.
 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by K8MHZ on December 8, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
N5EAT

My saddest condolances. These birds are fantastic pets and freinds. Milagro belongs to my daughter KØLEY and they just love each other. Koley has had him since birth as well. Milagro's parents belong to our Nana Gonzalez and Milagro was picked and named by Koley at birth, practically as an egg. He follows her around the house like a puppy. He 'screams' incessantly if she is not around and he thinks he hears her. She cuddles him like a baby and puts him in her front coat pocket. He loves it.

So sorry to hear about your loss. I know the day Milagro passes will be a very sad and somber day in this household.

73 my friend,

Mark K8MHZ
 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by N6AJR on December 9, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
G4FON.NET
 
How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by AB2MD on December 10, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
I became a HAM in 2001 (I was 39 at the time) because of my fascination with QRP operation. I wanted to build a QRP RIG. The one I bought was a Small Wonders Labs SW+40. I beleive I have it set up for two watts. I learned code because I wanted to operate in that mode. I kept going with my license studies because I could not stand the band quality of the novice portion of 40M. I almost quit until I realised there was life off the broadcast portion of 40M. My interest has wained since then, but I am sure that will change again one of these winters.

I know some feel that life is too short for QRP, but every one has different interests. As long as there is interest in QRP, there will be interest in operating CW.

Thanks for reading.

Rich
(AB2MD)
 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by W6SN on December 10, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
>> If sign language is a language, then Morse code is too.

Not true. It depends on whether you are talking about American or International sign language as well. ISL is much like IMC, mostly letters from what I remember (My xyl told me all this information, so I may be reversing the two).

ASL on the other hand uses motions and gestures to convey entire thoughts. Instead of having to encode a phrase "boy" as "b-o-y", or "j-u-n-g-e" in german, one merely needs to make a sign similar to running one's hand along the outside edge of a baseball cap's "beak" on the right side, and regardless of the native language and spelling of the idea of a young male, the thought is conveyed.

I still wonder if anyone has been able to prove us who are saying that IMC isn't a language wrong, by reading what I sent above in ./- form. Seriously, if you can read it, I will withdraw my statements, and join your side (unless of course, if you cheat, and ask someone who speaks the LANGUAGES that I encoded with morse...)

Happy Holidays,
Jason
 
How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by WA2DYA on December 11, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
I don't think the code qualifies as a language. Just a bunch of symbols that's useful for communicating a language. I always found the code to be somewhat cumbersome for communicating. I guess that's one reason why we have Q signals. Looks like we need some new ones:

QMJ -- Meet me for a cup of java
QJB -- I want my coffee black
QJL -- Large java please
QCF -- Caffine free please


Hi Hi

--- CHAS
 
How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by WI5O on December 11, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
WO5I, I agree that Morse Code has been a favorite operating mode of many hams for many years. Up until recently, Morse Code was in one language. When I say recently, perhaps I ought to further define that. American hams live in an international community where even Morse Code can mean different things (Culturally and by multi-country context). Business folks call it globalization. America is a member of the International Radio Union that sets international radio law. What do we do when all the other countries drop Morse Code and replace that with more useful modes? I don't think that means we have to divorce Morse Code. I think we ought to move ham radio forward, and the skills required to operate with more technology - innovating along the way.

Sure we live in a world with many languages now. But Morse Code should mean the same to all hams - there should be a standard convention. I am not sure that will ever be achieved because we might appear to be globalized, but we still live in multi-country cultures. We are a long way from a true global society that can operate under one set of rules.

In my opinion, I think it would be wise to leave Morse Code as is. But... we need to move forward and discover the new way to communicate with ham radio. ICOM is moving forward with DStar and every year, I see improvements in products and processes. Shouldn't hams also keep up? It will be boring to many new hams to use morse code, when they grew up with higher technology-based ham equipment. Different generations come into play now.

WO5I brought up a very philosophical and interesting story.

WI5O
 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by NN6EE on December 12, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
Sorry to say Jason!!!

But there's way too many of your fellow-citizens who want all the PRIVILEGES of Amateur Radio, primarily the "Big-Enchillada" HF operation but don't wanna work for it!!!
Your sympathys may lie with NCTS but it does'nt belie the FACT that presently your "Wanna-Be" brethren don't want to expend ANY extra energy to get what the VAST majority of US worked our ASSES off for!!!

Jim/ee

PS, It seems you're one of the ones who are now invoking an elitist-war, and by your very statements you're wondering WHY we older guys respond as we do???
 
How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by K3ROJ on December 15, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
I also agree. Morse code is an ideal language to master which at the same time can be enjoyed more so than using voice or digial modes.
They now suggest that people getting up in age keep their mind active and learn new things such as a new language, a musical instrument and even word puzzles.
I can't recall the name of a book written many years ago where a family was stranded in a snow storm in the midwest. The youngest son was in the boy scouts and had learned the code as part of him earning a new badge. His Father helped him climb the telephone pole where the scout shorted together the 2 lines (this was way back when) giving the poles serial number and they were soon rescued.
If the FCC drops the requirement of morse code when obtaining a license there will be an influx of uneducated operators who don't have that small section of brain matter that developes from learning code. .... ..
 
RE: How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by K8MHZ on December 20, 2005 Mail this to a friend!
Shorted two lines together and got help?

That is about as fictional as it gets.
 
How to Order Coffee with a Flashlight  
by PE1NPG on March 2, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Lets move on, time's to short.
I use all kind of digital modes, including CW.
With software... works great, great mode!

73 de NOCODE PE1NPG
 
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