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[Articles Home]  [Add Article]  

KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'

Kenneth J Perry (AL7GA) on April 4, 2006
View comments about this article!


It happened again, in last weekend's WPX. “AL7GA 5/9 134. And are you really in Alaska? You guys move around a lot!” I am wondering if I need to start signing KL7/AL7GA just to relieve the confusion. All of you in Alaska, Hawaii, US Virgin Islands etc know exactly the frustration I speak of. DXCC prefixes being used “Willy-Nilly” all over the US.

I recently did a search of the January FCC database, and over 25% of the ?(K)L(7)? calls are owned by persons living outside of Alaska. That includes club calls and repeaters! And that is just the honest people, there are likely another 15% or more who have fake addresses here or have moved and not notified the FCC. So - for you who are not fortunate enough to live in a DXCC entity like ours, why is this such an issue?

For two reasons: First, we agreed with ITU many years ago on call letter assignments, and the standard agreement has always been that Amateur calls in separate DXCC locations would have distinct calls. What has happened? Laziness or just ignorance on FCC's part. Second, it is good amateur practice to have a call sign reflect the geographic location, especially for emergency communication purposes. While this may not seem to matter to the FCC, it should matter to those persons who are abusing this standard of identification. If you have a call from a different DXCC entity, it is the proper thing to identify yourself correctly : W5/AL7GA. If you move out of a DXCC entity, you should relinquish your call.

Finally, imagine the frustration of a REAL Alaskan who wants a vanity call: *L7JW. It is impossible, since all four Primary letters for this call are owned by non-Alaskans. I probably will not change calls, since I have a long history with mine, but you get the idea of the frustration level that we feel up here. And I have heard comments from other US owned DXCC entities as well. Such a shame!

Member Comments:
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KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by K0AMZ on April 4, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
It goes back to 1978 when the FCC decided that we do not have to have our call sign change when we moved around in the United States. I was military and lived with my N5AMZ until I finally retired and then realized that I've lived here in Colorado long enough I "bought" a vanity call of K0AMZ. What it really means is people are "lazy" or sentimental with their calls, but if they really like them get a vanity call at least close to your "loved one".

73
 
KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by K0RFD on April 4, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I agree that it's a big pain in the neck.

However, I don't see what, if anything, this has to do with the International Telecommunications Union. The ITU has nothing to do with DXCC. DXCC is an award given by the ARRL (and a registered trademark owned by the ARRL), not an international treaty or anything close to it. "DXCC Entities" are not even real countries. They're just little subdivisions that conform to a set of rules the ARRL can change anytime it wants to.
 
KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by WD0M on April 4, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I agree. Having lived in Alaska for many years, and held the calls KL7IBM, KL7NJ, NL7Z, and lastly, WL7M, I have given up my Alaska call sign every time I moved "Outside" - Alaskans will know what that means. I've also been licensed in Hawaii as AH6JY - and left the call behind when I moved to the "Mainland".

Too bad the FCC relaxed the rules.....actually, I guess they didn't "relax" them, they eliminated them. You supposedly have to LIVE in Alaska (or Hawaii) to get the call - but a post office box or cooperative friend will let you get the call without actually living there.

Too bad we can't roll back the rules so a distinctive call means something.

73, Joe WDØM
(ex-WL7M, NL7Z, KL7NJ, KL7IBM, and AH6JY)
 
KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by N8KOM on April 4, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I thought all those ops were just on vacation in the "mainland". Maybe not.
 
KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by VE7ZWA on April 4, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I belive you are quite correct with this complaint. I find it a real irritant. Fundamentally a call sign should reflect the geographical area!

I find there is way too much confusion when I wrk American operators. One never knows what region they are in. Why is someone with a K1 call, or a WA2 call who lives on the west coast not signing K1**/6 or WA2**/6 ???

As a Canadian Living on the Alaska Highway in B.C. I do not use my original call which is VE5ZW. If I did I would use it as VE5ZW/VE7. Once I move back to Saskatchewan in a couple of years I will again use it. Until then I am happy to operate useing my present call letters.
 
KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by NE0P on April 4, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
The WPX contest requires KL7/KP/KH stations to sign portable with a "mainland" US prefix if they are located in the mainland US. In other words, the prefix you use for the contest must reflect your DXCC country. So it was pointless for those stations to ask if you were really in Alaska because you would have signed differently if you weren't.

73s John NE0P
 
RE: KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by NE0P on April 4, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
This is something that I have been thinking about lately-changing my call to reflect my current QTH. I have had this call since 1984 when I lived in Iowa. I have been in Oklahoma now for 4 1/2 years and have no intention of leaving. So should I get a 5 call? Getting a new call after 22 years is almost like getting a new identity (witness protection program, maybe?). In addition to the $21.90 every 10 years for the vanity fees, I would need to get a new callsign hat, a new callsign badge, eventually would want new award certificates with my new call on it. You can see how the money adds up here. I guess I could just put in for the next FCC call that comes up, but the AD5W* series doesn't do anything for me. Plus, everyone knows me by this call on the air. I would have to start reintroducing myself.

How do others feel about changing their call after a number of years?

73s John NE0P
 
KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by WA1RNE on April 4, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Agreed......


I believe the amateur call sign system is totally abused.


The FCC has allowed Vanity call sign assignment to become all the rage and has allowed it to go out of control.


What's more important: Calls signs that serve DXCC purposes or geographical location? The original intent was geographic location, not for contesting purposes.


It used to be that when you worked a "1" station, i.e W1KNX, there was a good chance they were located in New England. Not any more.....


If I'm running my station out of New York, I was taught to run as "portable" and would sign WA1RNE/2 or "portable 2".


It also used to be that when you worked a 1x2 call, there was a good chance you were engaged in a QSO with a ham that has been around for a while. That's not necessarily the case either. Obviously, this is a different issue althogether, but what the heck......


WA1RNE
 
RE: KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by KPAX1 on April 4, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Seems to me you should be thrilled to death to speak with someone who's call sign travels about. Just because you are trapped in your own personal shack in Jackass Flats, Iowa...doesn't mean you have to insist the operater stays in his/her's home shack. Lighten up!
That is why God invented Mobile's.

73 Jib Jab
 
KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by WA0RSX on April 4, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
It is just another change (for the better?) the government did, to be able to make more money. The call system was well thought out originally for a REASON, thats what we use to do in this country. It worked well in many ways , people were in the area their call indicated via regulation, benefiting all aspects of amateur radio. Now it's a mess and means nothing. Just another thing that should have never happened.
Unfortunately it would cost millions to set it straight and anger many. 73
 
KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by EXWA2SWA on April 4, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Good thoughts here. Imagine my thrill to work a KL7 in Montana and a KH6 in South Texas (actually, Baja Oklahoma). Both QSO's were fun, both operators a pleasure to work, but the callsigns ... well, you know. The KL7/Montana op (one I'd be happy to work again) even apologized for not being in Alaska.

My login here (exWA2SWA) is my original post-Novice call and indicates my location at the time. When I got back on the air in 2004 I could have asked for that as a vanity call. But, I live in 5-land, have no intention of leaving and so will retain a 5-call until I do, even if I go the vanity route.

One of my disappointments in getting back into the hobby was discovering our apparent freedom to pick a number, any number, regardless of where we live and operate. Another has to do with an opeating mode, but I'll let that one alone for now.

73 all,
Jim KE5CXX


 
RE: KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by WI7B on April 4, 2006 Mail this to a friend!

I did like the first call letter and numeric prefix partially identifying your region. A "K" west of the Mississippi and a "W" east of the Mississippi, as with commercial stations. There was K7 and K6, but W1 and W2. However, this is past and won't return.

Outside of the WTB, there is no district preferences. For example, in recent OET assignments one can easily receive a WC9 prefix for an experimental station in California.

We can try to aver the difficulty of not assigning district designations, but the FCC as a whole is eschewing them; not just the Amateur Service.

73,

--* Ken
 
KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by N3AIU on April 4, 2006 Mail this to a friend!

I was first licensed 31+ years ago in Pennsylvania (WN3YJZ, WA3YJZ, N3AIU) and I lived in Maryland for a while as well. When I moved to Arizona, I already had my present call (N3AIU) for more than 20 years. Yes yes, I know that callsigns are for stations not individuals, but corny as it sounds I feel that it has become part of my personal identity. I just didn't have the heart to trade it in, even for a 1x2 or 2x1 (I could have asked for an extra call back in Pennsylvania). I've since moved from Arizona to Colorado and I'm pretty sure that I'm going to move again, so I'm not inclined to change my call any time soon.

Glass half empty: A station in Los Angeles works a KL7 on 6 meters and finds out that he's in San Diego. This can be somewhat annoying. It has happened to me.

Glass half full: You're a 3 living in 7-land? Where did you get you license? This can be the start of a nice QSO. It has happened to me.

IMHO, the only hams that should be annoyed about "deceptive" calls are 1) DX hunters who don't like to waste time ragchewing after pouncing on a supposed DX station, or 2) contesters who automatically type CA in logging software when they hear a 6 call to save a few nanoseconds. I'm willing to let them deal with it (grin).

73, Nick N3AIU(/0)

PS: Incidentally, I like being refered to as a 10, not a 0 ...
 
RE: KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by WB2WIK on April 4, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I'm in the state of "confusion" most of the time...

I think there's a valid reason to *retain* a callsign when moving, even to a different call district. But I can't think of any valid reason to just pick one from a list of available callsigns, and pick it outside the area. I'm not in favor of the latter idea; however the former seems natural to me.

I never changed my callsign when moving around the country because it's been with me most of my life. I've had this call since eighth grade as a new teenager and although shorter, easier calls are available, I never thought about changing mine. One reason is I know a lot of people all over the world, who know me by this callsign. I'd have to re-introduce myself to thousands of hams if I changed it. On phone, old friends might recognize my voice; but on CW, the explanation is a time-waster.

If an AK or HI (or PR or VI, etc) station wants to retain his call after relocating, I think he should be able to, if for no other reason than by getting a new callsign, you're relinquishing the one you had before. If you then move "back" to your original area, that call may not be available again.

WB2WIK/6

 
RE: KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by K6AER on April 4, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
To me this is much to do about nothing. This is what active data bases are for. The FCC has a hard enough time keeping up with a hobby that basically does not pay for its self. We want enforcement but engineers and lawyers cost the FCC money. We want international enforcement but international good with negotiations are expensive. Only because of the legacy aspect of ham radio do we have access to the frequencies we now have. The technical need of the finite spectrum will take president to the free ride we have had for so long. The day will come when we have to pay for our overhead like everyone else who uses the radio spectrum and hams moving around the country will seem pretty minor. Ham radio is the only user that gets the spectrum for free. Every other hertz of spectrum has a user to pay for its usage.

I’ll bet when you explain the involvement of the FCC in our hobby and what little we pay for FCC services the average layman will want to know why we have had a free ride.

You drive a car, you pay taxes. You fly, you pay taxes. You use a phone and you pay taxes. The list goes on. I would not complain to loudly for it is just a matter of time before the rest of the country see what a sweet heart deal we have in this hobby.

I know this will fundamentally change the direction of this post but it is something to think about.
 
RE: KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by KR1ST on April 4, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
This "article" has nothing to do with any complaint about the use of CONUS callsigns outside the call area in the CONUS, but rather with the loss of that "special status" that some hams feel they have with a callsign from outside the CONUS. It's called the DXSDS, or DX Status Deprivation Syndrom. You can pay someone to talk about that. :-) Folks who have it really bad list a whole bunch of prior callsigns in their signature.

If you had a callsign for a while I can see that it becomes like your name, just like John, NE0P indicated. Everyone knows you by that call. And if you need to know where the person is, you could ask. Gives you something to talk about. Or if you don't dare to strike up a conversation and think that someone's CQ call should reveal all information, check QRZ.com or some other callbook. That way you don't have to talk to the person to get to know something about him or her.

NE0P, John, don't change your call. I recognize your call from so many email lists, contest log reports and score lists, that if you'd change it I'd think you've become a SK if it didn't show up anywhere anymore.

73,
--Alex KR1ST
http://www.kr1st.com
 
KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by WA0RSX on April 4, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
You don't need to change your call. You just need to use / or mobile or portable notation, with your call. Then move any where you want. 73
 
KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by K6VCI on April 4, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Although I have been licensed a good many years (always in California with the same K6VCI call), I had never used a VHF/UHF rig until about five years ago.

At that time I purchased a HT. When I first turned on the HT, I could not believe how many stations from Guam I was hearing on 2M ... all those KG6 calls!

I too miss the days when a K1/W1 was in New England, a K2/W2 was in NY or NJ, a KW6 was on Wake Island, a KG6 was on Guam, etc. If you had a beam, you at least knew where to aim it for the station you were working.

Mike, K6VCI (in California)
 
KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by KPAX1 on April 4, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Define Communism: When someone needs to change his/her's call sign identity because they have moved to a new location just to satisfy a chosen few who are irritated by the inconvenience. Understand that we are a nation of freedom. To change after many years of a personalized call sign just because you have relocated is unethical. Plus...until FCC rules apply...perfectly legal.

73 Jib Jab
 
KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by G0GQK on April 4, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I entirely agree with your comments and the ARRL should do something about it.

In the UK a person is issued with a callsign eg G0AAA
if that person operates in Wales the call becomes GW0AAA, if he lives in Scotland it becomes GM0AAA and this rule applies to all the various parts of the UK, northern Ireland, Guernsey, Jersey, Isle of Man etc.

With a smattering of brain power, what about KH7AAA/FL or /WI or /CO.? Not too difficult is it ? If there is a vast army of OOO's, hams who listen to other hams should they operate out of band and end up "in the pink", it shouldn't be too difficult to stop.

Its very irritating when you hear what you believe is a rare station and find out the "rare" Hawaiian station is operating out of b.... Brooklyn !

Mel G0GQK
 
KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by WA0TTN on April 4, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
What would be ideal is if we could hold more than a single callsign. I feel very attached to my original callsign for, as stated previously, sentimental reasons and will never give it up. But I've talked with hams in other countries who were allowed to hold more than one callsign. I'd be happy to use a second callsign that is native to my current QTH, and even pay the extra fee as if it were a vanity call.

73, Dave
 
RE: KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by N4OI on April 4, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I have been a ham for just over three years now. My "issued" call was KG4VJR -- it took me a few days to figure out why so many contacts were asking if my QTH was in Guantanomo! (I sensed their disappointment to find out I was in Charlotte...) Oh well -- it was not long before I picked up a better CW call -- 73 de Ken -- N4OI
 
KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by KI6LO on April 4, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I totally agree on the disappointment of thinking your call just got answered by a non-conus station when the actual QTH is just down the road from you. I have had that happen a couple of times for states that I need to finish out WAS.

If the station with the KL/KH/KP/etc. prefix identifies that they are indeed NOT in the designated call area for that prefix when they are on the air, I don't see any real problem. It does alleviate some of the overhead in FCC processing (or at least they say it does). But if the op doesn't id as such, it really can be irritating to hear the needed prefix and find after finally getting a QSO, that the KL7 station has 'retired' to FL. No wonder the signal was weak. He was off the back of the beam, hihi.

I remember 30+ years ago when I was a little shaver (Novice) that an station's location could be closely 'guessimated' by the callsign and the accent of the operator. Not anymore, not that it matters.

I had a '5' area call for years until I moved to CA and now have a '6' call. If and when I ever move back east (or north), I'll probably get another call for tha area I go to.

Gene KI6LO
 
KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by KG6WLV on April 4, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Until I read this thread, I had no idea the San Francisco Bay Area was in GUAM! LOL I guess we all have to just get used to the idea that callsigns -- other than national prefixes -- don't tell us as much as they used to. The old system made more sense to me; changing a number within a call is not as big a deal as changing the entire suffix. When I got my call, I decided I liked it and would keep it, forever. I don't like pronouncing the "W", but phonetically my call sounds good.
 
KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by K0JQZ on April 4, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I have pondered changing my callsign after I retired to Colorado however, after getting back on the air and hearing different stations in states other than what their callsign indicated I decided not to.

What it really means is people are "lazy" or sentimental with their calls, but if they really like them get a vanity call at least close to your "loved one".

Lazy? What specifically is it about not wanting to change a callsign makes one lazy?

I should pay the FCC to get a vanity call close to the one I already have? Why?

Fundamentally a call sign should reflect the geographical area! It does, KA is a geographical area.

When I lived in the Philippines, Florida, Maryland, West virginia, North Dakota and Colorado (the first time) I always used DU2/, /4, /3, /8, or /0 to indicated my location since it was other than NC. Since I knew I would not be living in these areas forever, or for long periods of time, I felt that I was portable.

BTW: KA4JQZ/0 is a lot of cw.

I stopped doing that for the most part since I am not portable or mobile.

Callsigns do not reflect what they once did. We have a lot more to worry about than something as mickey mouse as this.

If the FCC required me to change my call I would but, since it is not a requirement and I can keep my "Novice" call I am going to keep it.

I feel my callsign is "not" the best for cw and it is not a high speed low drag 1 by 2 call but it is mine and has been mine for 26 years.

I choose not to change!

73, Frank ex G4VDN 7J7AAL DU2/KA4JQZ KA4JQZ/0 /3 /4 /8

 
KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by W5EEX on April 4, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I live in Arizona but I have the callsign W5EEX.I have it because it was my Dad's callsign from the 1930's until he died in 2002. He was my "Elmer" and got me into this hobby, so I figured if I couldn't keep him alive, I could at least keep his callsign alive and on the airwaves....it's a great CW call...I love it.
73
 
KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by NL7W on April 4, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Ken, AL7GA:

As a fellow Alaskan that has moved "outside" before, I agree with you 100%. When I moved to Wisconsin in 2000, I changed my KL7DC call to KZ9G. Luckily, another active Eagle River, Alaska ham picked up "DC" after I left the state for 3 years. I am proud to be back in the greatest state of the union again, holding NL7W.

It's disgusting to see lower-48 hams holding U.S. related DX entity callsigns. A perfectly silly and cute example of this abuse is the callsign: AL0HA. This happens to be an ALASKAN CALLSIGN issued to the COCONUT ISLAND DX ASSOCIATION, 2058 AINAOLA DR, HILO, HI 96720-3638 USA. Enough said...

Does someone want to tell me how this cute Alaskan call ended up belonging to these guys?

73 de Steve, NL7W
 
RE: KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by NL7W on April 4, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
OK, Hawaii isn't lower-48 (as related to in my previous post), but this example does illustrate the foolishness that's been going on for years.

73.
 
KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by N0AH on April 4, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Look, no one is going to give up their call all because they move. However, I do think it is only common sense that the call be tagged with a zone number or prefix when on the radio where located. ie:

N0AH/KH7
N0AH/7
N0AH/F

It's the world we live in-
 
RE: KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by K0BG on April 4, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
We're not the only country in the world that doesn't have specific calls for specific locations. Since most of my operation is mobile, to me it is a moot argument.

To take a different slant on it, it just means it takes a little longer to complete the contact. Lord knows, far too many are "59 good luck in the contest" contacts.

Alan, KØBG
www.k0bg.com
 
KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by N3AIU on April 4, 2006 Mail this to a friend!

I've worked AL0HA and they sent me a card. It's cute, but it definitely seems to an abuse to me.

I don't know the details on how they managed to get this call for Hawaii. I suspect that they used a PO Box or the address of a friendly ham in Alaska to get the initial grant, then changed the address to Hawaii.

73, Nick N3AIU
 
KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by K4EQ on April 4, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Long before we were not required to sign portable or have a call sign from the U.S. district we lived in, I thought it was a silly rule. You never could necessarily tell where someone lived from their call sign. A W7 could be way in the northwest in Seattle or down in the southwest in Arizona. The only continental state you could be sure of was California. What's the big deal? Fifteen seconds into a QSO everyone gives their QTH. When the correct state is necessary in a contest, it's required in the exchange. One thing I've discovered in many years of hamming is that hams just have to have something to complain about. Why not just get on the air and have some fun? --Dale, K4EQ (in Iowa now)
 
KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by NM7H on April 4, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
KL7, KH6, and KP2. None of these are particularly tough DXCC entities. Whats the big deal? I get these entities pretty regularly on 100w and a vertical antenna. There are only a couple of US entities that are truly rare.

What state am I in? I currently live in Nebraska and my call since 1985 is NM7H. I was the first person in Casper, Wyoming to take and pass the new at the time VE based tests for my Extra Class ticket. Prior to that I tested for General and Advanced at the FCC office in Denver. (By the way, the USAF and I both consider me to be a resident of Wyoming).

I joined the USAF in 1987 and have been all over ever since. Why should I change my call every time I move? According to the regs I don't have to. I also do not sign NM7H/? not even when mobile because it is not required by the regs. If you talk to me for more than a minute you would quickly find out where I was and if I was mobile.

I recently spent a year in the middle east. Was I suposed to change my call to reflect an APO that I was not allowed to use my USA call from? That would not make any sense.

I believe that if you obey the regulations, then it is perfectly OK to keep your old call whenever you moved.

Kelly - NM7H, G0MKT, YI9WF, and A7/G0MKT
 
KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by KC0TQX on April 4, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Let's use a different analogy here. Now I know that your Social Security number is not supposed to be a universal ID, but it will work for this example. The first few digits of your SSN are based on your ZIP code at the time you apply for it. But when you move somewhere else, the government doesn't make you get a new SSN, do they?

If you want to know where someone else is from, what's wrong with just ASKING?

73, Mike
 
RE: KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by KL7IPV on April 4, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I am keeping my call because I am atttached to it and it is LEGAL for me to do so. It is the 4th call I have had and I got tired of having to change as I moved. Since I don't work contests I guess it isn't hurting anyone. I retired in Alaska and left Alaska but not because I really wanted to. I even dream of returning. But whether I do or not, the KL7 call makes me feel like part of me remains there. If that isn't good enough, too bad. I plan on keeping it as long as I legally can. I make sure that anyone I talk to KNOWS where I am and doesn't have to ask. It may be the last vestige of Alaska that I can hold on to. Oh, I have looked up similar callsigns thinking of changing but every time I get close to that I can't. Sorry, KL7IPV will remain on the bands as long as I can maintain that. I live in Las Vegas for now. I may move and the call will too. Don't talk to me if that offends you.
73,
Frank
KL7IPV
 
KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by N3AIU on April 4, 2006 Mail this to a friend!

KL7IPV:

I don't think that anyone except the most extreme callsign cop will fault you for keeping your call. Personally, I think that any confusion because of your call and present QTH is short and painless. On the other hand, I believe that someone who gets an Alaska call just for the sake of having one (AL0HA) without having lived there may have to be introduced to the Wouff Hong, even if it is technically "legal".

73, Nick N3AIU
 
RE: KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by W3LK on April 4, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
This subject gets dragged out of the closet three or four times a year and the discussion is always the same.

Give it a break, fella. With online databases it takes 10-15 seconds to find out where the station is, and if you are using a computerised logging program, the program almost always looks the call up for you.

What another waste of bandwidth. eHam should stop publishing these junk "articles."

73,

Lon - W3LK
Baltimore, Maryland
 
RE: KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by KG6QKJ on April 4, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
>N0AH stated:
>Look, no one is going to give up their call all >because they move. However, I do think it is only >common sense that the call be tagged with a zone >number or prefix when on the radio where located. >ie:
>
>N0AH/KH7
>N0AH/7
>N0AH/F


This is exactly what everyone should be forced to do with an out of area call or a vanity call.

Like I said, they should be forced to do this!
 
RE: KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by K7VO on April 4, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I agree with Steve, WB2WIK. I also am not going to be forced to sign K7VO/9 becuase I moved out of the seventh call area. This callsign is bought and paid for its a good CW call, something I never had before. You don't like it? Petition the FCC to change the rules. Somehow I don't think they will.

73,
K7VO
in Wisconsin
 
KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by KF5KWO on April 4, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I have changed callsigns 3 times as a result of moving and have no objection to doing so, even though I don't legally have to. Originally licensed as KF4KWO in 1996, I obtained vanity call KF3KWO when I moved to MD, and KF5KWO when I moved down here to TX. For some reason, I really like the letters. It's a courtesy I like to extend to others so that they have a general idea of where I am. When I'm cruising the bands or looking for particular states or counties, it's nice to hear a call and have an idea of where that ham is - I don't have the rig co-located with my computer.

73 de Jeff, KF5KWO
Helotes, TX
 
RE: KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by W8DPC on April 4, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
"On the other hand, I believe that someone who gets an Alaska call just for the sake of having one (AL0HA) without having lived there may have to be introduced to the Wouff Hong, even if it is technically "legal". "

It's not just "technically legal", it's 100% legal. What ham in the United States would NOT think that "AL0HA" is coming from Hawaii? I mean come on, it's the only state in the union that uses that word.

I know a guy who has a 1X2 call that includes his initials, yet it's not in 8 land as it geographically "should" be. Big deal? No. Myself, I look up a call on the computer before I even key up, so I know who I'm talking to and where they are at. What if I'm mobile? Ask them. If you think you're hitting Alaska, and the guy happens to be in Maine, what's the big deal? If you're working on an award, then work the next Alaska call you hear.

Come on, this is more of a pet peeve than an actual problem.
 
KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by AC7DX on April 4, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Whinners
 
RE: KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by KA2LIM on April 4, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
It's disgusting to see lower-48 hams holding U.S. related DX entity callsigns. A perfectly silly and cute example of this abuse is the callsign: AL0HA. This happens to be an ALASKAN CALLSIGN issued to the COCONUT ISLAND DX ASSOCIATION, 2058 AINAOLA DR, HILO, HI 96720-3638 USA. Enough said...

Does someone want to tell me how this cute Alaskan call ended up belonging to these guys?

THEY PAID FOR IT. (vanity = pay $ and get the call you want)

Ken
 
Agree with WA1RNE  
by WB4M on April 4, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Yes, used to be you could know which call area a ham was in by his callsign. Now a w3 could be in any state, not just in 3-land.

WA1RNE is correct in saying the vanity system is abused. Another thing, why did the the FCC switch to KA4 callsigns after WD4ZZZ was issued? Why did the callsigns not continue in logical order with WE4AAA?
 
RE: Agree with WA1RNE  
by AB9H on April 4, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Funny coincidence! Its just about midnight local time here in Chicago, and I am listening the 80 mtr upper dx band (3799), and an interesting comment did occur! Namely, OE6BMG, Mike from Austria, just worked K9RX,from Arizona, and after exchange Mike have asked : "Please, are you from portable 7 (/7)?"
Then K9RX replied: "Yes, but I am not saying that any more!"
???
73, Joe AB9H
 
RE: KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by NL7W on April 4, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
KX8N:

To LEGALLY receive a KL7, KH6, or KP2 callsign, you are supposed to have a valid address in these locales. Some have CHEATED by using friends addresses and/or a PO Box -- while never living or making plans to permanently live in Alaska or the others. This, in my view, is CHEATING the system. If you have never lived in these locales for a reasonable period of time, a callsign from these should NOT be available to you.

This rule has been twisted by many, for whatever reason.

Now, do I care if my brother-in-law get a 2-land callsign when he's lived in Iowa his whole life -- no. But, when this situation includes a American DX callsign -- I object forcefully.

73.


 
RE: KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by NS6Y_ on April 4, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I myself was very glad to get rid of my KH6, that place needs the Professor Pianka Prescription. I do believe in having my call reflect my location, althought the sentimental hanging onto of calls has its good points too, here in California it often lets us know who to tell to go back to Iowa hihi!
 
RE: KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by NS6Y_ on April 4, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
PS I feel sorry for whomever ends up with my old KH6 call, they're going to get a certain number of grumpy ol' XX's QSL cards - at least I did back when everyone used the Callbook and before he had his call put in bold.
 
RE: KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by RobertKoernerExAE7G on April 4, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
First, we agreed with ITU many years ago on call letter assignments, and the standard agreement has always been that Amateur calls in separate DXCC locations would have distinct calls


Second, it is good amateur practice to have a call sign reflect the geographic location

Good rant article.

After you work a hundred or so KL7s and KP4s, who cares if every KL7 is in Alaska.

AE7G, Arizona

Bob
 
RE: KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by K8RBW on April 4, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I have had my call (K8RBW) since the late 1950's. I feel it has been a significant part of my identity in amateur radio and never had any desire for a 1X2 vanity call. In contradistinction, I have never harbored any resentment toward those with less senority who have adopted a 1X2, unless I caught them abusing some poor soul who was newly licensed and trying to learn the ropes, so to speak. I was thrilled when the FCC allowed me to keep my call when I moved from Michigan to Illinois. I've always been in favor of keeping things that are original, be they body parts or amateur radio call signs. In the same vein, I still have a proclivity for sticking to CW. When I operated on vacation in Puerto Rico, the US Virgin Islands or in the "mainland" I always signed as portable because, although not legally required to do so, it seemed the proper thing to do. I have always found it kind of fun, when listening to a signal, to guess where they were located based on their signal strength. If someone wants my QTH they can look it up on QRZ; it isn't like an unlisted telephone number. I do share some of the uneasiness of the author with stations on the "mainland" signing *P2,*P4,*L7 or *H6, but I have never lost any sleep over it. I guess it would be more a matter of concern to me if I lived in one of those places. The so-called "mainland" is one DX entity and I don't see much of a problem. Everybody is entitled to their own opinion.

73 to all,

de Dick, K8RBW
 
KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by VE7TL on April 4, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I find this lack of geographical relationship of call signs to be very frustrating and chaotic. It also is a potential hazzard in times of emergency. Hopefully someone in a position of authority will take responsibility and straigthen out this mess.
 
RE: KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by NS6Y_ on April 5, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
#1 reason to get rid of that KH6: It would have caused MUCHO confusion.


What's next, taking your old telephone number complete with area code, with you from Michigan to Florida? The technology exists, you know.
 
KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by SMHAM on April 5, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
There is one important difference between countries with a large ham population and smaller countries with only a couple of thousand hams.

In smaller countries, the two or three letter suffix is often unique. If you move to another call area you just have to change the number in your callsign. This is the most simple and by far the best solution to the problem that your call doesn't reflect the call area that you are transmitting from.

In USA, Japan, Germany and other countries with a huge ham population this is simply not possible. There are too few unique suffixes.

As someone said in an earlier comment, there has been a "gentlemens agreement" that separate DXCC entities have had their own prefix series. OJ for Market Reef, which is in the Finnish prefix series, etc. If separate DXCC entities within a country are not too many this is a manageable situation. However, it has absolutely nothing to do with ITU. ITU is a UN organization. They allocate prefix series to nations recognized by the UN only.

Denmark abondoned their call areas a long time ago and other countries have followed. The vanity program is in full swing in Europe. Special calls which were rare and only issued for special events are now heard on a daily basis from Sweden. There is no longer any explicit written rules that prohibit the use of which number I want in my callsign, regardless of which call area I am transmitting from. I can even use the non-existent 8 and 9 call area numbers if I want to. There is no rule against it, although I have not yet heard anyone doing it.

The point is that the importance of call areas and unique prefixes will soon be abandoned, not only in the US but everywhere.
 
RE: KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by KG4RUL on April 5, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
The simplest solution, when there could be some doubt of your QTH, is to state the Grid Square where you are transmitting from. If you provide the six character grid square, you can almost point someone to your front door.

For some awards or contests, the IOTA number, County, State, etc. may be more significant.

But, in all of the above cases, call prefixes not withstanding, there would be no doubt where in the world you actually are.

Dennis KG4RUL
 
KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by MY_OPINION on April 5, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Form over substance again. "You're 59... what was the callsign? ...AGAIN? ...AGAIN?" Oh yes, that was a contact of which to be proud.

If you want to know where a station is located, ask. Or, use a callsign lookup. The content of the QSO is far more meaningful than contest points or paper on the wall. Make your own fancy certificates at home and hang them on the wall. Ooh! Aah! Then talk (GASP!) to the person on the other end.

73,
MY_Opinion
WAP - Worked all pizza
5B WAC - Worked all cocktails (I can't remember)
WAL - Worked all lids (in progress, finding more each day)
 
KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by KC4GS on April 5, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I got a KC4** call years ago, had a lot of the ego types had to call me, thinking I was something special but I was where I should have been according to the FCC. The only ones that whine and cry are the weekend wanna b hams, holler 59, what was your call again, rude crude socially unaccceptable types that talk over anybody because they have tons of power and feel like anyone not in their contest is nothing. I have no respect for that type of person, I won't even call them a ham. I long for the days of 50 or so years ago, when most on the band were TRUE LADIES AND/OR GENTLEMEN.
 
KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by KG4WHL on April 5, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
stop crying
 
KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by WIRELESS on April 5, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Quit whining like a 2 year old. I am not in this world to make all the morons life easier by having a call that is to their onvenience. Buzz off.
 
KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by K1LWI on April 5, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
think the FCC is just nuts. prefixes go back to the old way than you can id the station qth kl7 is alaska k1 etc new england. what you are kh6 you live in new mexico this is crazy what state are you in
k1lwi wendell
73
 
RE: KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by WA9SVD on April 5, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
You don't NEED to; you don't HAVE to. That is, Use the "/wherever" modifier. It MAY be a courtesy, but there is no legal requirement.

And for people that must move often (whether by choice or circumstance) it's often impossible to obtain a new callsign for the designated area before another move becomes necessary. And THAT would be a waste of the FCC's resources.
 
RE: KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by WA9SVD on April 5, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
by NE0P on April 4, 2006 Mail this to a friend! This is something that I have been thinking about lately-changing my call to reflect my current QTH. I have had this call since 1984 when I lived in Iowa. I have been in Oklahoma now for 4 1/2 years and have no intention of leaving. So should I get a 5 call? Getting a new call after 22 years is almost like getting a new identity (witness protection program, maybe?). In addition to the $21.90 every 10 years for the vanity fees, I would need to get a new callsign hat, a new callsign badge, eventually would want new award certificates with my new call on it. You can see how the money adds up here. I guess I could just put in for the next FCC call that comes up, but the AD5W* series doesn't do anything for me. Plus, everyone knows me by this call on the air. I would have to start reintroducing myself.

=====================

One of the "newbies" complaining about changing call signs! {{{BIG GRIN!!!}}}
(Same call here since 1966; original sequential assignment from FCC)

I agree with much of what you say. But it's FAR, FAR too late to go back to the old sytem, before the current vanity call system was introduced. So it's best to just IGNORE the call area, and just ask a station where they are located. If it really matters, (such asa when a DX station is going by "the numbers," then add the /wherever. But legally, you do not have to do so.
 
RE: KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by KI6LO on April 5, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
W3LK said ".... With online databases it takes 10-15 seconds to find out where the station is, and if you are using a computerised logging program, the program almost always looks the call up for you...."

Correct and usually but not always the info contained therein is accurate. When someone does not bother to update their QTH info or if they happen to be portable/mobile then the information may or may not be valid.

Signing with the appropriate /portable area or /mobile is not only good operating procedure but it is also a nice courtesy to your fellow operator, even if the FCC rules do not require it anymore.

Gene KI6LO
ex-WB5UZU, WN5UZU
 
KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by AH6FC on April 5, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Yes, it's confusing. With our current mobility it's not realistic to constantly change call signs. I've held my current call longer than any other, I'm not going to change, too much headache. It would be nice to be able to hold two calls; in fact I think this used to be an alternative. Though while I'm currently living, most of the time, in Arizona, I'll simply continue to sign AH6FC/7. I'd prefer to simply use AH6FC but want to minimize the confusion. When I don't it really gets confusing, particularly on 6 meters.

All said, it's just not a big issue.

Sorry for the rambling...
73's & Aloha,
Bill
AH6FC/7
 
RE: KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by WN3VAW on April 5, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
This reminds me of all the times a few years ago a certain 2x1 living (at the time) out in the Pacific would rail on a regular basis about how most of the "choice" 2x1 calls were held by individuals who didn't live on his territory or a nearby one (or who were at least visitors from time to time), but individuals who'd faked an address to get the call assignment. Said person was pretty adamant that it wasn't right that these calls were all snapped up so that the locals couldn't get one if they wanted to.

Funny thing, once the 2x1 moved to a mainland US call district, his call was never changed... and I haven't heard of him griping about mislocated calls since.

 
RE: KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by WA2JJH on April 5, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I concure. I REALLY do miss W,WA,WB for EAST COAST.
k,ka,kb, FOR THE WEST.

I could have had a nice spiffy W2XX back in 1981.

Now with this psuedo DX pre-fixes....geeeesh!
 
RE: KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by K7CU on April 5, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I think a person should "turn in" his callsign when moving to another district and obtain a new callsign. I was originally KN1TMK in Maine, then K1TMK. But when I moved to Utah I obtained a new call (W7KHY) and in 1976 my current call (K7CU). When I was transferred to Georgia in 1977 I did not obtain a new call because I knew I would be moving back West. However, had we actually moved to the South, I would have obtained a '4' call.
 
KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by N4KZ on April 5, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Alaskan callsigns are no longer restricted to having just the number 7 in them as they did in the "old days." Now, an Alaskan call can have any number from 0 through 9.

So when the original poster said his friend wanted a vanity call of "L7JW" but couldn't because the A, K, N and W prefixed versions of that call were all assigned (all to non-Alaskan stations), I understand his frustration. But there are many ALxJW, KLxJW, NLxJW and WLxJW calls available in the FCC database. I checked.

So why not get one of those calls?

OK,I understand that an AL7, KL7, NL7 or WL7 call might be more highly prized by some just like many prefer W or K 1x2 calls over N prefix 1x2 calls. Of the remaining unassigned 1x2 calls in the various U.S. districts, most are N calls. Or that many hams worldwide don't yet realize that Alaskan calls can now have any number.

But it's a changing world. Rules and situations change. I'm sure there was much angst and frustration over the FCC rule change decades ago that changed Hawaiian calls from K6 to KH6, Alaska from K7 to KL7 and Puerto Rico from K4 to KP4 to free up those prefixes for assignment on the mainland. Or more recently assigned KG6 2x3 calls to California instead of Guam or KC4 2x3 calls to the 4th call area instead of the South Pole! And so on and on and on.

The only thing in life that doesn't change is change itself. Some of us seem to struggle with that daily, don't we?

73, N4KZ (An N call and proud of it!)

 
RE: KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by W6TH on April 5, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
.

I have moved from California to New Hampshire and you will hear me signing my call sign as it was 68 years ago.

Listen for W6TH/1 as soon I get my new ham set up going and in operation. CW only. No phone.

All one has to do is sign with the portable slash /1-0 which I believe is required in the FCC rules and regulations. Seems it is no longer being used and I believe is required.

Check it out. Being on eHAM, I will remain to use W6TH.

.:
 
KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by SMHAM on April 5, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Remember that a lot of hams have no Internet connection at all in their shacks. It isn´t all that easy to look upp every single piece of information about your QSO partner while you are in the shack. Also remeber that there is a much sought after award among your fellow hams elsewhere in the world, called Worked All States. We want to know where you are so that we can give US OMs and YLs a call if they perhaps are in a state that we need. Signing with /call area is an excellent way of telling us where you are.
 
RE: KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by KL7IPV on April 5, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Actually, the rules no longer call for adding "portable", "slash" or "mobile" to your call if you are doing that or out of the call area the callsign is from. In fact, when I first moved to Colorado, I added "portable zero" when I answered a call or made a CQ call. I was promptly told twice that I no longer needed to do that and should discontinue doing it. I do it now if I hear someone calling for a specific call area I am in but as a normal thing, I no longer add it. I am legal and will continue to do as I have. When the FCC says once again that we need to have a callsign that reflects our home QTH, I will change. I don't see that happening, but if it does....
73
Frank
KL7IPV
 
RE: KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by KC8VWM on April 5, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I never ran into any of these communication problems from my QTH up here in the Artic Ocean.

KC8VWM

 
RE: KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by N8UZE on April 5, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Sarcasm mode on:

Of course the whiners are up-to-date on call sign availability.

Sarcasm mode off:

Factual data mode on:

If one were forced to change upon moving, all Generals and Techs would either have to settle for 2x3s using the sequential call signs or have to go the vanity route to get a 1x3. The Advanced class could still get sequential 2x2s but the Extra class would have to either settle for a 2x2 sequential or try for the very few 2x1s or 1x2s via the vanity system.

Do the math folks. There aren't enough available call signs to reserve one for each call district for each ham unless you restrict them to 2x3 calls.
 
What State Are You In? Just ask the question!  
by AI2IA on April 5, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
If you intention is to really communicate with another operator, just ask the question, "What state are you in?"

If you want to be a model for others, when you call CQ always give your call sign, the band you are on, and your QTH. When other operators hear your CQ they will know with certainty whether they want to answer your CQ.

I have always done this and never had a problem.

This way all those folks who want to keep their originally issued call sign and all those folks who got themselves vanity call signs, as well as all those folks who have changed their call signs can be as happy as frogs on lily pads.

If you are a dedicated contester, you might try slowing down and learning to appreciate the ham on the other end as well as collecting the log entry. Awards are nice, but people are nice, too! You can switch from one pursuit to the other and back, just don't get hung up on these little matters. Be greater than you seem.
 
RE: What State Are You In? Just ask the question!  
by K4JF on April 5, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
"How do others feel about changing their call after a number of years?"

I kept my original call for over 20 years (even while progressing to Extra). Only when my initials came available did I consider changing. But I would have NEVER gone for a non-4 callsign.

It is a simple courtesy to the other stations to sign with a "slant whatever" when you are operating outside of the area indicated by your callsign. The ham who was told he should no longer do that because it is not required was told WRONG. Just because you are not required, doesn't mean you should drop the courtesy.

If you're not in the location indicated by your call, use the /# to indicate where you really are. It is a simple, easy to do, courtesy to other hams. To do otherwise is just rude. (I was in Mississippi a few years ago on temporary assignment. I ALWAYS signed "/5" while there.)
 
KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by BHARDIMON on April 5, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Old men are neat !
 
RE: KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by NE0P on April 6, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Wouldn't it be more useful to sign /state? 7, 4, and 0 land cover a pretty large territory. Some states (like mine) would have to use a 3 or 4 letter abbreviation, though, to prevent confusion with a DX prefix.

73s John NE0P/OK
Now in 5 land, not the Czech Rep.
 
RE: KL7, KH6, KP2, KH0 -- "Car 54 where R U&q  
by T32AI on April 6, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
WB0BNR since '70 - - whew, what a long call cw-wise (especially in a pile up). Used to just throw in "North Dakota" when in G.Forx years ago 'cuz it was easier. Earned "real extra" in '80 but all the good calls were already gone so kept long callsign but finally got "vain" in '02 @ VOA/Tinian but (again) all the Filipinos had all the good callsigns gobbled up for the Marianas. I often ID slant 9 now but will probably go back to my old call 'cuz the contest folks won't let me use the WH0 prefix anyway.
KG6, KC4, KM6 and so many other prefixes over the years have been phased out or changed and we don't get excited about it.
 
KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by K3WI on April 6, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I worked an NL7* in Virginia the other day.It was an 80m cw contact. He was 30db over nine. He was calling CQ..
There was no pileup.

Did I call him because of his prefix? You bet.
Was I hoping he was in Alaska? Of course.
Did I think he really was? Nope.

Enjoyed the contact. Look forward to working him again.

If someone's got a readable signal and they're calling CQ, I'm gonna call him.

For what its worth a quick search of the callsign database shows 2 dozen plus stations in Fairbanks, Alaska that have CONUS callsigns.

Look, there's K9YYG calling CQ. Gonna call him...nah..he's probably in Illinois.

Make the call. Have a QSO. Enjoy the hobby!

73,

Bill
K3WI
 
RE: KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by AC3P on April 6, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Social Security Numbers were never based on zip codes.
The SSNs were issued starting in 1935. Zips Codes were invented in the 1960's.

 
KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by K4EQ on April 6, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Some have written similar to this: "It is a simple courtesy to the other stations to sign with a 'slant whatever' when you are operating outside of the area indicated by your callsign."

Oh, please, this has nothing to do with simple courtesy. Would you prefer we sign K4EQ/0/IA/DALE? If you'll wait for my first transmission (simple courtesy?), I'll give you all that information and even through in a signal report. If it's a contest where that information is necessary, it will be in the contest exchange.

This is really a silly issue for anyone to get so bent out of shape over. How about a healthy, non-emotional debate over how to assure the long-term existence of the amateur service? Let's not make non-essentials like "slant whatever" a matter of courtesy or integrity.

Dale, K4EQ
 
RE: KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by AC3P on April 6, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
"My "issued" call was KG4VJR -- it took me a few days to figure out why so many contacts were asking if my QTH was in Guantanomo! (I sensed their disappointment to find out I was in Charlotte...)"

There were lots of disappointed DXers in 1978 when I went on the air with my new Extra call AC3P.

AC3PT was listed in the 1977 DX Callbook as the Prince of Sikkim. For some reason the ITU allocated the AA-AL block to the USA in 1978. A lot of people were dissapointed to find out I was in Maryland and not the Himilayas.

I was accused of being a bootlegger for many years. Even now some old old timers think it's a bogus call.

73

Frank AC3P
 
RE: KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by NE0P on April 6, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
AC3 should have never been issued to Sikkim, as AA to AL is the US prefix block. Why was Sikkim using a US block? We also had the same problem with Tibet when they existed.

73s John NE0P
 
RE: KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by N3UMH on April 6, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I am disappointed in those that fake addresses in AK, HI, or wherever to get non-mainland calls.

That said, anyone who came by one honestly and doesn't want to change should keep it.

I'm primarily a DXer. I do a lot of 5NN stuff. But as I've played the DX game, I've learned that the 59+25 on-my-low-dipole KL7*** on 160m is NOT IN ALASKA.

If you are halfway around the world from N. America, I'm sure the situation is somewhat different, but knowing *propagation* can tell you a lot about whether or not a "DX" station is.

So I fall into the "if you want to know, ask" crowd on this one. It's not rude if I decide not to sign N3OX/7 if I move to, say, Seattle. I'll probably do it when there's an advantage to doing so (calling with the 7's and not having the DX think I'm a jerk), and not do it when I'm just ragchewing and am going to mention my QTH anyway.

It is still the situation that most 3's are in PA, DE, MD. Some aren't. Anyone who is passing out counties, states, etc. is going to mention where they are. If you're hunting for specific stuff and don't want to talk to anyone else, well... I guess you're just going to have to deal with it.

If you're staying to chat a bit, things will be made clear. If you're 5NNing it, you're going to have to WFWL (work first worry later).

73,
Dan
N3OX
www.n3ox.net
 
KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by N5PFZ on April 6, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I have lived in "5" land my entire Ham career. I wanted to change my i x 3 call to a 1 x 2 as I was a new extra class. I went to the Vanity Call websites and watched until the call I wanted came up for grabs. I then noticed a Ham who was a resident of a US Island territory in the Carribean, who had a "2" land call had been awarded the call I applied for. What makes me angry is 1. this guy was not a native 5 land operator and had no business (in my opinion) applying for this call. 2. Less than two weeks later he had changed his call to another 5 land call and locked up the call I wanted for at least two years. People who do this are difficult to understand.
 
RE: KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by N3OYA on April 6, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
When I was first licensed (not so long ago as some of you guys), I was under the apprehension that tagging with the number of the call area from which you were operating was required. When I was stationed in NC, I therefore signed every ID with KB3AIM/4. Same when I upgraded and got the call I now have.

I understand that it is no longer required, but I do consider it a courtesy. Courtesy is, after all, about making everyone involved in a social contact comfortable. :D It takes literally no time at all to say (or send) "/2" if I travel across the Delaware into NJ from my home in PA (though I completely forgot to do so when I was on my way home from JFK airport last night).

Dale, K4EQ wrote:

"Oh, please, this has nothing to do with simple courtesy. Would you prefer we sign K4EQ/0/IA/DALE? If you'll wait for my first transmission (simple courtesy?), I'll give you all that information and even throw in a signal report."

I'm glad, and when I upgrade and meet you on an Extra-class frequency, I'll give you a signal report as well. But I think you're overstating the situation. What does it really cost to send K4EQ/0? Five presses of the paddle? Two keystrokes? Ten pumps on a hand key? Half a lung? Does it take half a lung to say three syllables? Sorry if that's too much trouble for you. :D

I'll agree that sending "/STATE" is rather a bother. But it's nice to know that the amateur you're working is within a certain call area without firing up QRZ.com, or even a "QTH is XXX, XX - so bob hw? bk"

As for the possible confusion about DX entities, I was always under the impression that the operator placed the host country's prefix before the op's call. Like "G3/N3OYA", or "P4/N3OYA" or something. I could be mistaken.

All in all, this *does* seem much ado about nothing. But it should be borne in mind that one man's "nothing" is another man's "everything". :D
 
RE: KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by AH6RR on April 6, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Most of the posters in this thread are missing the point. The main point is a lot of of you non KL7,KH6 and KP2 with those prefixes confuse and disapoint the DX stations who need KL7 KH6 and KP2 if you dont also include the /5 or whatever. It does get tiresome answering DX stations questions "Are you Really in Hawaii?" I could care less if you have a 5 call in California or a 1 call in 4 land. Thats just a Mainland call (A,K,N,W) but a KL7,KH6 or KP2 is a differnt country according to DXCC. It might be easy for the mainland to work us but it is not that easy for say EU,AF and the Middle East ect to work Hawaii or Alaska remember we are halfway around the world from most of these places.When
everyone comes here to work HF always sign's KH6/K1XXX why cant you holders of DX prefixes sign /W2,W3,K6 or whatever? Not everyone has a computer hooked up to the internet to look up calls.

Just my $.02 worth
Roland AH6RR/KH6
 
KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by KC2MMI on April 6, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I don't disagree with you, but I think you are ignoring the changing times and technology. Or rather, that the operating habits and licensing have fallen behind on it.

Used to be your ham license was also your station license and reflected a large heavy permanent installation for most people. And, that people didn't move around very often.

Now? Almost every rig is portable (ignoring antenna farms) and the average US citizen relocates every 5 years. If you change call signs every five years...it starts getting hard to keep track of who is who. But, the call sign for the operator and the geographic station are still bundled into one sign for all practical purposes.

I used to have a phone number. If I moved, I had to get a new number. Now? Ask any kind in college, because they are the future, and they will tell you, when they go away to college--their phone goes with them. Same number, same area code, either VOIP or cell phone, and they may be two thousand miles away from where it was issued. And no one knows or cares, they just lean that area codes no longer have geographic meaning.

Changing times. It is a waste of effort to get upset about it, the changes "are". Maybe you can get the FCC and ITU to agree on a better system, where an operator and a station both have to be uniquely and separately identified, but then you're also going to make calls longer and contacts slower. Or, you'll destroy the legacy (identity) of calls as people are forced to give them up every time they move.

I suggest there is no simple or practical answer for you, beyond accepting the changing times. And sooner or later, when HF becomes totally obsolete and perhaps some equivalent of DSC gets added into the mix...the contact may bring geolocation in automatically as well. That's the only thing you can be sure of: Change will continue.
 
RE: KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by W4MEC on April 6, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I would think that contest folks have the biggest problem with this, and this can be cured by the contest rules requiring the proper call area being part of the exchange. Another cure is to revamp the call sign allocation by simply dropping the the entire 0 to 9 locator, and number each state sequentially. Other countries use 2 numbers in a call, so maybe NC will become W14/K14, but a state like California will still be a problem. To those who look up whose CQ they are about to answer on a computer, thats a bit like the Whitman Sampler box. You can look at the index to see what you're getting, but it's more fun to just dive in. Gee, if you get all the info before you even establish contact, why bother. Send the guy an email saying you heard is CQ.

Charlie in NC
 
KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by F8AFC on April 7, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Hi all,
This is even more confusing from a foreign station such as Europeans.
I would just stress out that the KG4 prefix is also sometimes abused (Not guantanamo, but florida, or somewhere else on the main land)
 
KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by W4YA on April 7, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Maybe I'm confused. AL7GA says: "I probably will not change calls, since I have a long history with mine,.."

But he wants others to change theirs? How about their histories? I don't understand his point.
 
RE: KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by WA9SVD on April 7, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
"Vanity of vainties; all things are vanity..." (Ecclesiastes 1::2)

SHEESH! When the FCC (dropped the ball and screwed up, IMHO) and decided not to change call signs and institute the vanity system, we reached THE point of no return. So call signs now ARE little more than Social Security numbers; they do NOT (necessarily) give any information about "time in service," years licensed, or location.
But after ALL this time, we have to GET OVER IT!
IS it confusing: YES, many times.
IS it discourteoue: only if an operator tries to deceive others about their location.
IS it against FCC rules: NO NO NO! We need to get over it! And more importantly, ACCEPT it as reality, whether we like it or not!
The same is true of the Amateur testing. Anyone entering the Amateur Service NOW, has to meet the requirements of the FCC NOW, and they do NOT have a choice to try to comply with the requirements of last year, last decade, or last century. THAY DO NOT have a choice. Whether General or Extra, or even Tech, they have to comply with the rules in effect NOW.
If you have a real problem with that, you should voice your objection to the FCC. (But too little, too late.)

Whether we like it or not, the FCC sets the standards that are in force TODAY, and it's not even fair to require new operators to know the nit-picked details of what the rules and regulations were 5, 10, even 25 years ago. THAT is counterproductive, and leads to alienation and hostility between the older Amateurs and the newer operators. We should be elmering and trying to cooperate, not lamenting and condemning people for not adhering to rules the FCC abolished long ago. A polite suggestion about more specific ID, may at times be appropriate, but a disdain or hostile response will only result in hostility in return.
Sometimes I myself wonder what happened to the "Amateur Radio Fraternity." It's NOT just the new operators that do not cooperate.
 
KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by KD0EE on April 7, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Another irritation is the DXpedition that is working the pileups by call districts. It is not uncommon for coastal stations to have up to a 20db propagation advantage over the deep central US, especially on the low bands. Many times I have been clobbered in the pileups only to find that the W0's the dx is working are in MA and CT. Gimme a break!
 
KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by KL7CDG on April 7, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I have to agree with AL7GA. During the last WPX contest, I was asked about 98% of the time if “I was really in Alaska”, with the QRM,it took valuable time to explain that I was truly in Alaska thus cutting into my total count and time. Watching the DX Spots, there were numerous notices that ‘XLXX IS NOT IN ALASKA’. Stations that did not have the DX Spots wasted time hoping to get the XLXX multiplier, imagine their surprise when the XLXX did not count as a multiplier.

A blatant abuse of the vanity call system can be seen by visiting the FCC site http://www.vanityhq.com/2002/suffa.html and scanning through the various vanity call applications paying attention to the address and then the number of vanity calls on the 605. It can be seen that several individuals have applied for numerous ‘preference vanity calls’ that are not in their call area. Plus there are several applications by the same individual for vanity calls for the same address thus using up the call database and depriving someone of a relative’s or a special call. If this trend continues, the call area prefixes will soon become useless, then we can make up our own ‘handles’ like they use on that ‘other band’.

I’ve been licensed since 1950 and have had to change calls and or modify several times. If one is active, it doesn’t take long for other hams to recognize the new call, especially with various software logging programs that around today.

I can understand the reluctance of giving up one’s call which was had for many years, what I can’t understand is applying for a vanity call outside of the call area in which one lives just because it is “legal”.

 
RE: KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by WA9SVD on April 7, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
by KL7CDG on April 7, 2006

A blatant abuse of the vanity call system

-----------

I will agree with you there. I can't think of a legitimate reason for someone not in Alaska Or Hawai'i requesting a KL7, KH6, (or more recently designation of formerly restricted) callsigns, unless they are the callsign of a deceased relative, or perhaps a close, really close, friend. SOME do it to get an edge in contests, but to me that would seem to be "cheating," similar to fudging on power level, or even running more than the legal limit. The contests are SUPPOSED to compare results fairly, but if someone has a "unique" call from a rare area, and has obtained the call for no other reason, would IMHO have obtained an unfair advantage over other operators in his/her geographical area. But the greater problem is that some operators think that is OK; it's anything for the contest points.

If I am in a contest (just to give out points; not for competition) I will use a modifier (/6) if it seems necessary, and I will use it if a station is calling "by the numbers." And YES it does take longer to send a call and modifier via voice or via code. SO WHAT? But it is up to theskill of OTHER station to discern calls, whether or not they are short, witty, or long and drawn out. It's what (or whom) the OTHER station wants to hear, and to which it wants to respond.
 
RE: KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by WR8D on April 7, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Come on guys, they did away with the call areas many years ago. Now if you find a fancy "vanity" call you like and you live in 4 land, but the call is a 6 the good ole fcc will let you have it. I don't think any of us like this at all but there's not a thing we can do about it, especially now. Its been going on for way to many years. What really pukes me now is these people who are nothing more than glorified cbers that we all hear on the bands. They try to hide behind a fancy vanity call of some amateur that has passed away. What a disgrace to this persons call to hear it being used by some of these types. They still stick out like a flashing neon light. While the original owner of the call is turning over in their grave at the abuse. Really sad what we're "devolving" into. John WR8D
 
KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by KL7HF on April 7, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I'm surprised at how few understand the prefix
assignement issue.

The U.S. is signature to agreements with other countries
that allows the ITU to assign radio prefixes.
In the view of ITU, Alaska, Hawaii, Puerto Rico
and the Virgin Islands as well as most of the U.S.
protectorate islands of the Pacific, to be countries,
not states.

When the FCC allows non resident Alaskans to hold
callsigns with the KL7 prefix, they are thumbing their
noses at the agreements. A good example of the
problem was issuing K7C for operation on Kure Island.
The justification was there are no postoffices on
Kure so a legitimate license was not possible.
In reality, it was another instance of the FCC not
abiding by our long standing agreements.

 
RE: KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by NE0P on April 8, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
"In the view of ITU, Alaska, Hawaii, Puerto Rico
and the Virgin Islands as well as most of the U.S.
protectorate islands of the Pacific, to be countries,
not states."

No, they are countries in the eyes of the ARRL's DXCC list, and other national organizations who offer DX certificates who put them on a list. In the eyes of the ITU, they are part of the USA, hence the reason for no special prefix block from the ITU. The KP, KL, KH prefixes were created special for these areas by the FCC, not the ITU. That is why Wake Is., which used to be KW6, was changed to KH9-it was an FCC decision, not an ITU decision.

K7C was probably used for Kure because no KH7K license will be issued from the FCC, and it was a shorter callsign than WB5VFO/KH7K to use for a DXpedition, which is the other alternative those stations had. K7C was authorized for use by the ARRL, not the FCC. Go to the ARRL's webpage and read about 1 x 1 callsigns. THe FCC has nothing to do with their issuing-I should know, I have used 2 of them before (N0M, W5O).

73s John NE0P
 
KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by KB0GU on April 8, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
This is a peeve of mine too. I think we should have geographic representative call signs. If you move you have a period of time to get it changed just like the license on your car or in your wallet.
 
KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by K4SHF on April 8, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Nothing worse than a new ham, anxious for some contacts from the east coast, and having a QSO with a KH6 (S9+) to find out he lives three blocks over.

I think we need to go back to the way it used to be. Your call is based on where you live.

My $.02 worth
 
KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by K4SHF on April 8, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Nothing worse than a new ham, anxious for some contacts from the east coast, and having a QSO with a KH6 (S9+) to find out he lives three blocks over.

I think we need to go back to the way it used to be. Your call is based on where you live.

My $.02 worth
 
RE: KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by AL7GA on April 8, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I am enjoying the input, and stand by my comments. I realize that those who are offended by my complaint may not have had the pleasure of living in a DXCC entity, or may not work a lot of DX, and so I understand their surprise that we find the issue so offensive.

That said, a quick respnse to W4YA's question - I meant changing my Alaskan call, not moving out of state. I would seriously consider the calls I mentioned (especailly Gales' old KL7JW) IF the opportunity was not being stolen away from us. And if I SHOULD move out of Alaska, I would hope that I would have the courtesy and respect for my fellow hams that WD0M & NL7W displayed when they did.

I take no offense at those who do not, and if I hear KL7IPV/W7 on the air, I will be pleased to chat with him. However, the issue stands and the fact that some do not understand our traditions is sad.

Ken
AL7GA
 
KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by K5RIX on April 8, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I appreciate the potential for confusion. My WI6I call was granted me randomly in 1985 and I like it. Being associated with the Navy means I move around a lot, and it's great to not need a new call every time I move. When operating, I make certain to identify my call region; i.e.: WI6I/9. Not being a shark in the contest waters though, maybe I don't know what it's like to lose a portion of a second by sending the /x postscript to ones call.

For commical effect, the Navy has me now in Yokosuka, Japan. I was able to obtain a Japanese license with minimal fuss and the equivalent of about $70.00. At least for now, JE1GWN is relatively beyond confusion!
 
KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by KC2WI on April 9, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
1. If a ham moves to a new permanent location then he/she should be allowed to change call signs to get the correct prefix/district at no charge. A "vanity" call sign fee should not be charged.

2. A vanity call sign that misrerpresents the location of the licensee should not be allowed (i.e. no "KL7's in New York.)

3. Some people take this ham radio stuff way too seriously, especially the insiginifcant stuff like having a vanity callsign. I can see getting one if your assigned call is a real toungue twister, or maybe the former call of your elmer or grandfather to honor them or something like that, but one to mislead people so you can make more contacts? Nonsense, and contrary to the true spirit of ham radio.
 
KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by WZ7U on April 9, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Try driving a semi truck for a living and having to explain almost daily why a 7 land call was being heard on a New England (or wherever) repeater. Some guys would get pissed off and ignore me once they figured out I wasnt some eerie tropospheric skip phenomenon. Even got cussed out a couple times over it. I guess thats why I quit doing VHF so much from the truck and stick to HF mainly. However, to be fair, having an out of area numerical indicator did strike up a number of fantastic QSO's from time to time out on the road. I will keep my 2x2 call forever, since I dont plan on moving from the seventh call area. The call shows a sequential issuance for an advanced call and thats good enough for me, even if I am an extra now. Like others have said, if the other guys location is SO important to you, ASK the other operator, stop assuming and quit whining about it!
 
KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by KL7FZ on April 9, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I thought the move by the FCC of allowing Alaska stations to have numerals other than "7" was one of the dumbest things they have done. Totally unneeded and uncalled for. They were plenty of "L7" callsigns to fill the need. Alaska is the in 7th callsign area. It IS confusing on the air at times when you hear AL1 or KL6, etc. A real bonehead move by a bunch of lawyers at the FCC who have no operational radio communications experience.
Normally changes are implemented when there is a need. This was NOT needed. Just a bunch of government dummies with too much time on their hands.
Way back when, Alaska was just "K7", and the rest of the 7 area was "W7". This changed in the late 30s or early 40s and Alaska became KL7. But this change did keep the 7 as representative of the 7 area as it should.

KL7FZ
 
RE: KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by AL2I on April 9, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I had a WL7GQS, then NL7GB, and lastly AL2I. I have to admit getting assigned a non-Alaskan, non-7 call was dissappointing, but I decided not to worry about it, because no matter where I move or what I do, I will keep the stupid AL2I. It is too familiar now.
 
RE: KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by AL7KC on April 9, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
SOAPBOX, skip if allergic:

I agree with you, Ken/AL7GA, (you nailed it, thanks for bringing this up again) Del/KL7HF, Steve (what's your call this year??/NL7W), Steve/KL7FZ and AH6RR. I get irritated from people always asking me if I'm in Alaska, from both lower 48, and DX stations. Unfortunately, it happens nearly every time I operate. There's so many "spoofers" operating, using their old prefix to draw them more contacts. (After all, the DX station will find out too late, and the contact will already be in the log.) Guess it hurts to leave the Great Land, and I do feel for you, but YOU DON'T LIVE HERE ANY MORE. PLEASE STOP MESSING THINGS UP FOR THOSE OF US THAT STILL DO. If you have no intention of living in Alaska (or HI, or Guam, or PR,) give up the call and get one appropriate for where you now live. You lived thru your change of address, so I think you can survive a callsign change.

I get cranked over this too regularly (thanks, Ed) but am now trying to see if I can work all states with "out of place" calls. I get enough frustration from work, don't need it in my hobby, too.

It's a shame there's no structure anymore, and anyone can do whatever they please, with no ramifications. Well, we're the only thing that's going to change anything, by peer pressure - so, if you're a lower 48 spoofer, and you call me, expect that I'll say something about it. I'll try not to be a jerk or impolite, as we're all fellow hams, deserving of courtesy, but I disagree with you keeping a call that belongs here. I've already done it to a couple, and we did not part enemies.

Thanks, FCC for deregulation -- for really helping to create a mess and continuing confusion. The way it's going, within a decade anyone will probably be able to buy a license, without any testing. Things seem to be going the way of CB. Bash, no-code, no real knowledge necessary. They'll be saying "why do I have to take a test?" next, (it's not fair, I have trouble memorizing questions!) and someone at the ARRL will carry that torch, too....it's all about numbers and $.

My admiration goes to the people who do the honorable thing and relinquish their call when they move outside (way to go, Joe, and Steve!) giving a chance to have normal AK calls available for Alaskans. (In my opinion, a call like KL6 is pretty messed up. I have Europeans frequently asking about that, too...seems it causes much confusion.)

It's really nice to be able to listen around, and actually know where people are without having to wait for the next qso where the info is exchanged again.

My $ worth. I like Swiss, Cheddar, and good mild cheeses.

73, Mike AL7KC
 
RE: KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by N3OYA on April 10, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
WA9SVD wrote:

"IS it discourteous: only if an operator tries to deceive others about their location."

You're a ways off the mark here. Intentional deception is plain bloody rude.

Look at it like this. Forgetting to open the door for a lady because you're in a hurry is discourteous. Dashing in front of the lady because that means you get to use the door first - then slamming the door in her face - is plain bloody rude.
 
RE: KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by AL7II on April 10, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Yes I'm one of the bad boys. I've had the AL7 call for about 24 years now, left the state 10 years ago, and have signed /5, /0 and now /9. (for WPX I signed /W9) Shoudl I change my call? Probably. Will I change my call? Probably not, I've grown rather attached and fond of it. Brings back wonderful memories, of both Alaska and operating from that great state. Oh I've thought about a nice 2x1 9 land vanity call, something good for WPX, but since I operate for fun and relaxation, I've chosen to keep my AL7 call. But I am very careful to never make another station think that I'm anywhere but /9 land, I dont' try to "cheat" when in a pileup. I wait for the DX to call for 9's then I call, not when he asks for 7's. I always sign /9, and such as in WPX /W9. What I have found is that other U.S. DX stations, KP4, KP2, etc, when they finally realize that I'm /W9 (which when I began calling them in the pilup, I used my full call with the /W9) could care less about completing the QSO, I've had several stations return my call without the /W9 I recall them with my proper portable call, and they imeaditly go QRZ, no longer do they want or wish to work me. DX stations however I have found to be very courtous, more than happy for the point, rather than the multiplier, and having a bit of a humorous comment regarding my being /W9, but never rude, nor ignoring me.
I agree with the comments that an operator should not fudge his location/ address in order to get a U.S. AL, KH, etc call, but please don't disparage those of use who choose to retain our calls, we worked just as hard as you did, studied the theory and code, passed the tests and recieved the license.
AS I read the comments in other aarticles, I wonder when did Ham Radio cease to be a hobby and become a vocation? When did it cease to be a source of pleasure, relaxation, etc, and become a 9-5 job? It's supposed to be fun people!! Granted there is a serouis side to Ham Radio, that has been proven time adn time again with various diasters throughout the world, but it's a Hobby, Fun, Pleasure, Relaxation, Promotion of International Goodwill!!! Along with the technicial and operating activities that accompany the fun.
Lets stop sniping at each otherabout callsigns, or this or that, and go back to having fun on the air. Chasing DX, long ragchews about nothing. Marveling at the thrill of the miracle of radio, we all know the theory, but jsut think we tape a key, or speak into a mike, or even type on a keyboard, and a slender wire sends our signals out, and another wire on the other side of the world picks up such a minute resdiual part of what we sent out, and someone hears or sees us. And we communicate, meet, and share with someone we will never meet, in a land we will probably never see, but for those moments of the QSO we are in each others shacks, just as if we were standing there.
Lets go have some fun you all!! I know I am!!
73's
 
RE: KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by NE0P on April 10, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
The FCC doesn't require you to change your call when you move out of district. Either petition the FCC to change this, or get over it!

73s John NE0P
 
RE: KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by KL7FH on April 10, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I agree..and have had the same topic on this website in the past. My problem is the folks who use a po box in Alaska to get a call from out of state! Better yet, I had a Russian use my address and I complained and now he has a po box in Fairbanks! look up KL7WA! he now has an address in NY! Also AL0HA nice call eh? check out the name...geez...vanity calls in Alaska? good luck.
73
Frank
 
RE: KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by K8MHZ on April 12, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
We live in Michigan. My daughter Nicole's nickname is Koley. Her call sign is K0LEY. For those of you that don't like 'cute' call signs, this is a cute call for a cute, let me make that beautiful, bright, etc, 12 year old ham that decided she wanted to get her Morse Code certification BEFORE they dropped it. She knows that her call is out of district and is kind enough on the air to always give her location.

So far, there has been no confusion. Her call, like mine sometimes, is a great conversation starter. It is also something she can use as ID that doesn't make her look so nerdy.

I think the vanity program is great. Anyone that has a problem with it needs to realize there are bigger things to worry about.

Address inacuracy was a problem long before vanity calls were allowed.

If you really have to know where your contact is, how about asking him or her? Perhaps some of this issue would resolve if we got out of the habit of just throwing 5s and 9s at each other and moving on.

JMHO.

73,

Mark K8MHZ
 
Enough Of This Foolishness  
by WPE9JRL on April 13, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I'm not changing my call, no siree, bub.

I'm gonna stay in my basement, lit by a 60-watt Edison Mazda.

I'm gonna sit tight, right here...and wind coils.

Wind coils on toilet tissue cardboard tubes.

Wind them with number 20 enameled copper wire.

I'm gonna grind quartz crystals using a glass plate.

And Ajax scouring powder.

I'm not changing.

Not changing my call.

Nothing.
 
RE: KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by AC7DX on April 13, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
ROFFLMAO
 
RE: KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by WA9SVD on April 13, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
They can have my call and assign a new one when they pry the key (or mike, whichever) from my cold, dead hands.

Besides, after 40 years, how many of us would (or could) remember a new call? {{{GRIN}}} (The FCC makes the rules, whether we like them or not.)
 
KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by N3AIU on April 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
AL7II:

You lived in Alaska for a while, so I don't think that most hams would question your choice of keeping your call when you moved. It may be confusing for the first minute of a QSO, but I can deal with it :)

73, Nick N3AIU (/0)
 
RE: KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by KL7IPV on April 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
AL7II,
That works for me!
73,
Frank
KL7IPV
 
RE: KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by WA9SVD on April 16, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
No offense meant, OM, but you apparently have a vanity call; there's nothing wrong with that, under current rules. But after all this time, if you WERE to relocate, would you really want a new, sequentially issued callsign?
Some of us have our original assigned calls, issued back in the 60's or even before. At one time, it often denoted "time in service." But since the vanity call system went into effect, chaos has resulted.
If the playing field were level, and there were no vanity system, I might tend to agree with you. But even your vanity call doesn't denote "time in service" any longer. So although the call area can be confusing for Amateurs that relocate, so can "time in service" be confusing with the vanity system. And it's too late to change the system now, unless the FCC were to issue new calls to EVERY Amateur, based on SOME criterion of their own making. I doubt they'd even think of that nightmare, and I doubt there's enough hams to count on one toe that would like that situation.
 
RE: KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by K5SET on April 16, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Maybe it is because that I am a new amateur, never considered call area number as being a factor as to who "whom" I had a QSO with.

I'm not a contester so call area number has never been a real consideration to me.

I have always lived in the 5th call area BUT would not like to change my call simply due to moving to a different call area.
 
KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by NG1G on April 17, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I had a KE4 callsign before I moved to Alaska and took a sequentially administered WL7 call sign, and then got a vanity 2x1 WL7 call sign some years later. When I left Alaska in 2003 and went to one-land, guess what I did? I'm now NG1G.

Before I got my new one-land call I always signed /1, which during contests, became a pain in the behind. So I did what I considered to be the right (and easy, contest-wise) thing and changed my call.

BTW, for the gentleman who thinks there were enough Alaskan call signs before the FCC authorized all numbers there, you're incorrect. If memory serves, there were no available Extra or Advanced class call signs before the vanity system went into effect. I know, I tried to get one when I upgraded. Their decision to allow all numbers was a wise one, IMHO, because it allows Alaskans the opportunity to get a call sign reflecting their license class.

In MY perfect world, all hams would either change their call when they move to a new district, or sign portable. I consider it a courtesy.

73,
Pat, NG1G
ex KE4LJN, WL7CMK, WL7Z
 
KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by K4EQ on April 17, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Don't you think we've hashed this out enough now? It looks like it's a 50-50 draw with nobody right and nobody wrong. It's a difference of opinion that reasonable people ought to be able to live with. It's pretty insignificant compared to major issues we face in amateur radio (e.g. BPL, keeping our frequencies, our future existence). --Dale, K4EQ
 
KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by K9MI on April 18, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I couldn't agree with you more. I "bought" my last callsign as I finally had a fair station, and my new interest was in dx'ing. I had a 5 call, and I live in 9 land now, and I found too many stations were confused about a 5 with a qth in 9 land. So that took care of that problem. I can only imagine the confusion of say, "KH6ABC" in AZ. With that said, I have no problem with "K7/KH6ABC". Now, if the ham wants to drop the "K7/" on 2m and uhf with his buddies, I don't see the harm in that. However on HF, using "KL7ABC" and living in Miami, FL is just too confusing, especially in a contest. "W4/KL7ABC" is what I prefer seeing used on HF.

73, Mike K9MI

 
RE: KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by K8MHZ on April 19, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Question:

How do I know if I am supposed to use (for instance) K4/K8MHZ or W4/K8MHZ?

Can anyone point me to a quick link for an explanation? I am going no were out of 8 land soon so it's not worth spending a bunch of time researching it, but I wouldn't mind a quick read if available.

73,

Mark K8MHZ
 
KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by KC2TA on April 20, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Just think, our friends at the FCC did this for us a number of years ago by relieving the requirement that we change calls when we changed areas. It's not something new, but I'll agree has reared its ugly head, especially in contests - especially when you need the multiplier!

In 1981 I moved back to NJ from NC. Really liked my old call (KB4AP), but being from the 'old school', I REQUESTED a change of call so that ANYONE would know the general area I was located in. In any one day any of us can work the KH6 in Idaho, KL7 in Florida, or a W2 in ZERO land!

Unfortunately, I don't think that the FCC will change the requirement anytime soon. I believe that this was originally done to make it easier for us hams to move about the country (make less work for our government employees).

Basically, it boils down to identifying properly. How many of us can truly attest to that fact?

Anyone remember where KZ5 and KG6 were located?

73,

Hank, KC2TA

 
RE: KL7, KH6, KP2 -- 'What State Are You In?'  
by NE0P on April 20, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
KZ5 was the Canal Zone.
KG6 was Guam, except for KG6R, S, and T, which were for the Mariana Islands.

There also was:
KB6 for Baker, Howland, (now KH1) and American Phoenix (now T31).
KC6 for Caroline Islands (now V6 and T8)
KJ6 for Johnston Is. (Now KH3)
KM6 for Midway Is. (Now KH4)
KP6 for Palmyra Is, Jarvis is (now KH5) and Kingman Reef (Now KH5K)
KR6 for the Ryuku is. Now JA6
KS6 for American Samoa (Now KH8)
KW6 for Wake is. (now KH9)
KX6 for Marshall is. (now V7)

And
KV4 for Virgin Is.
KS4 for the Swan islands
KC4 for Navassa is.

73s John NE0P
Now in 5 land.
 
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