eHam.net - Amateur Radio (Ham Radio) Community

Call Search
     

New to Ham Radio?
My Profile

Community
Articles
Forums
News
Reviews
Friends Remembered
Strays
Survey Question

Operating
Contesting
DX Cluster Spots
Propagation

Resources
Calendar
Classifieds
Ham Exams
Ham Links
List Archives
News Articles
Product Reviews
QSL Managers

Site Info
eHam Help (FAQ)
Support the site
The eHam Team
Advertising Info
Vision Statement
About eHam.net



[Articles Home]  [Add Article]  

Those Dreadful CB Operators

Hans van Rijsse (PD0AC) on August 14, 2006
View comments about this article!

When I read ham-related newsgroups, it always surprises me how many hams hate CB and the people who 'live' there. Oh yeah, I agree, some CB operators are rude, they don't care about others, have more interest in the number of Watts they can squeeze out of their linear amplifier than any other aspect of this hobby. Unfortunately, many hams I hear daily show the same behavior. The only difference is the frequency they operate on.

When I got interested in radio (I think I was eight years old at the time), there weren't many options. Either you were happy just listening to all those mystical signals, or you became a pirate. After discovering that my portable radio also generated a carrier, transmissions on the medium wave band were the first step. Years later, CB (still illegal at the time) was the way to go. Lots of equipment was home-built.

When CB finally became legal in Holland, hundreds of thousands of young and old people bought a CB transceiver. Were they interested in radio? Hardly. Most of them only wanted to communicate. They hated things like finding and installing a suitable power supply, coax cable and antenna. They hated the 500 mW maximum output power; they hated the overcrowded 22 FM channels they were allowed to use. CB became a big, big mess. CB was just one big garbage bag full of interference, full of people cursing and yelling at each other, while trying to kill the remaining fun by switching on a 1 kW linear.

Fortunately, the Internet was born. Along with it came messenger software such as ICQ and MSN. No need for an antenna anymore, no interference, just communication. Most CB operators abandoned their radio immediately and switched to the Internet. Is CB dead now? No. Quiet maybe. Things changed. CB matured. Instead of 22 FM channels, anyone may use 4 Watts in any mode (CW/SSB/AM/FM) within 40 channels. The operators who stayed, stayed because they love radio. Newcomers come to CB because they love radio. They experiment with antennas, they behave well, they use (kinda) official call signs, they organize contests.

The VRZA (www.vrza.nl) radio amateur club in Flevoland decided to allow anyone to attend our meetings, including CB operators. One of our official home frequencies is a CB channel. Many CB operators paid us a visit, amazed that we treated them as they were "real" hams. Most of them are regulars now, studying hard for their official license. Within a year, two of them passed their test. Many will follow. How many of us are complaining about the lack of fresh ham-blood? Most of us, I guess. CB operators? Don't repel them, but try to attract them.

73,

Hans / PD0A

Member Comments:
This article has expired. No more comments may be added.
 
Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by NE5C on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Your article brought back a good memory, of how I got my beginnings in Ham radio...3 local Hams with alot of patience, used a Club house and invited a bunch of CB'ers (who all knew each other on CB)to attend classes on learning 5WPM Code and understanding, Ham Radio. Certainly not all kept attending but, quite a few (more than expected) did continue on to become Ham operators starting out as NOVICE CLASS. I bet with a Poll on that subject there are quite a few operators these days, that got their start... the very same way. Hat's off to all those fellows that take the time, to help others.
 
Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by KB0RDL on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Like many hams I was a CB sidebander for years before I finally got my license in 1995. I made the mistake of mentioning this when I first got on area repeaters and I encountered incredible hostility from some of the older hams. I was called a "chicken-bander" among other things.

The CB sideband club I had been active in actually had several members who were also hams. When I told them what had happened they explained that they had seen this many times and never mentioned their CB sideband activities except to a few close friends.

I think it's a wise idea to expand ham ranks to include former CBers. Ham license numbers are declining slowly in real numbers and rapidly in terms of the percentage of the population.
 
Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by KD5FEP on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
My name is Larry and i'm a former CB user. I feel better already.
I lived in a small Arizona ranch community, 30 miles of dirt road to get there, no electric or phone service. CB was how we communicated. Everyone had FCC issued calls and legal gear. When paved roads and phone service arrived CB faded away but my interest in radio did not and I finaly got my novice ticket in 1973. Ham radio is not the same as it was back then and if it survives will not be the same 20 years from now. I agree that we should invite all that will come.
Larry
KD5FEP
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by K8MHZ on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I try to look at the person as an individual.

We have many fine hams that started out playing with CBs. Some of them still do. So what?

I personally hate CB lingo and make fun of it quite a bit but the lingo has little to do with what would make a good ham.

If a person is interested in ham radio for the right reasons (yeah, there are wrong reasons) I say let's help them out.

 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by KB9TMP on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Count me in the crowd of former CBers that have become hams. I was working as the head Service Technician at the local GM dealer. My service manager was a General and the parts manager was a Tech+. I was playing around with 10 meter radios using them as a CBs. The service manager always said I was a 'chicken bander' and needed to stop playing in the 'childrens band'. The parts manager (who used to be a CBer himself) helped me out and told me about not having to have morse code for a ham license. It didn't take me very long to get studying and get my license. Then I kept on studying and passed the code test so I could have HF privileges.

As long as we do what we are SUPPOSED to do and ELMER CBers, they will turn out just fine. It's the ones that go it alone that we need to worry about.

WW - KB9TMP

"I reject your reality and substitute my own."
– Adam Savage
(co-host of the TV Show MythBusters)
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by K8MHZ on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
"When I told them what had happened they explained that they had seen this many times and never mentioned their CB sideband activities except to a few close friends."

That's too bad. People need to be more respectful. I own a few CB radios and even use them from time to time. Not much, but I won't sell them as they are part of my RF arsenal.

If someone wants to give me a hard time about using a CB radio, bring 'em on. I would be happy to offer a dose of reality and put both the spotlight and the microscope on that person's attitude and contributions (or lack thereof) to ham radio.

Some CBers are boneheads, no doubt. Many are not.

Kinda like hams in that respect, no?
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by KX8N on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Apparently I live in a VERY bad area, because the CB activity around here makes 75 meters look really nice. Some of it's downright unintelligible.
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by W5ESE on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
> I think it's a wise idea to expand ham ranks to
> include former CBers. Ham license numbers are
> declining slowly in real numbers and rapidly in
> terms of the percentage of the population.

This is not really true. I have some statistics
about this, for the USA:

Year Population # Hams Hams as % ofUS Population
1913 97225000 2000 0.002%
1914 99111000 5000 0.005%
1916 101961000 6000 0.006%
1921 108538000 10809 0.010%
1922 110049000 14179 0.013%
1930 123202624 19000 0.015%
1940 132164569 56000 0.042%
1950 151325798 87000 0.057%
1960 179323175 230000 0.128%
1970 203211926 263918 0.130%
1980 226545805 393353 0.174%
1990 248709873 502677 0.202%
1997 267783607 678733 0.253%
2000 281421906 682240 0.242%
2005 296410404 662600 0.224%
2006 299291772 657814 0.220%

You can see that during the 1950's, which some
consider the "boom years", amateur radio operators
comprised between 0.057-0.128% of the population.
The hobby was growing very fast, but the absolute
numbers were quite small as a fractional part of
the population, compared to now. We've dipped a
little bit from the peak, which occured in the
late 90's, but the US ham population is quite a
large fractional part of the overall population
compared to historic norms.

In the 1920s-30s when hams were setting all
kinds of distance records, traveled with the
Admiral Peary expeditions, and developed the
single-signal superheterodyne, the number of
US hams was less than 60000, and were ten
times as rare within the overall population
compared to now.

Quality, not quantity.

73
Scott
W5ESE
KNU3709
 
Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by N4ZOU on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Not only do we have problems with some Hams with attitudes about CB operators we have a considerable number of them with the same attitude toward Hams that did not learn Morse code and obtained an amateur radio license. I have found this has caused most activity on the local 2-meter repeaters to become almost totally dead. The repeater ID uses more time on the repeater than Hams! I ride a bicycle for pain relief of arthritis and tried to take along a 2-meter handy-talkie just in case I or other bicyclists on the trail needed help but I found it useless for that. I could not get help via the repeater the day I needed it! A cell phone is almost useless as well due to limited or non-existent coverage in the areas I ride. What to do? Now I take along a CB Handy Talkie and a wire dipole I can throw up in a tree.
So far the emergency response scores are�..
CB 3
Cell phone 1
Ham 0

Need I say more?
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by W3LK on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
If a person shows up at out club facility, we assume thay are interested in Amateur Radio.

That's all that matters.

Lon - W3LK
Baltimore, Maryland
 
Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by K2GW on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
We should welcome anyone who passes the Amateur License exam and wants to be a good ham operator. Whether they operated CB, FRS or whatever before is totally irrelevant. Cureetn behavior is what counts.

One of the underlying problems should be fading with memory. When the CB service was first established in the US around 1957, the 11 meter band was taken away from the Amateur Service to create it.

But that's a long time ago now!

73

Gary, K2GW
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WB2WIK on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
>Those Dreadful CB Operators Reply
by N4ZOU on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Not only do we have problems with some Hams with attitudes about CB operators we have a considerable number of them with the same attitude toward Hams that did not learn Morse code and obtained an amateur radio license. I have found this has caused most activity on the local 2-meter repeaters to become almost totally dead. The repeater ID uses more time on the repeater than Hams! I ride a bicycle for pain relief of arthritis and tried to take along a 2-meter handy-talkie just in case I or other bicyclists on the trail needed help but I found it useless for that. I could not get help via the repeater the day I needed it! A cell phone is almost useless as well due to limited or non-existent coverage in the areas I ride. What to do? Now I take along a CB Handy Talkie and a wire dipole I can throw up in a tree.
So far the emergency response scores are�..
CB 3
Cell phone 1
Ham 0
Need I say more?<

::That's unfortunate. If you could carry a 40 meter rig with you I think you'd find you could make a contact on it 24 hours a day. But in your particular case, where communicating might equate to survival, I'd look into other wireless telephone services, besides the one you're with. Unfortunately, in the U.S. the systems aren't standardized, they're competitive and it's very common that one carrier's service will be perfect in an area where the competing carrier has no service at all. I find this quite often when traveling.

"Can you hear me now?"

WB2WIK/6
 
Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by AB0RE on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Many of us got introduced to the airwaves via CB, myself included. I remember thinking the $35 I spent on my Uniden Pro-510XL CB and antenna combo was a lot of money at the time. There would be no way I'd have spent a couple hundred bucks getting on the ham bands without being bitten by the RF (27MHz) bug first.

I was on a business trip during Field Day this year. I took a coworker out to the local club's field day. He mentioned that sometimes when he was out four wheeling in the mountains (with a CB in his jeep) he'd hear stations hundreds of miles away. Instead of the hams answering his question about why this "skip" happened everybody at field day gave him a hard time about having a CB. Not suprisingly, he has no desire to join the ranks of hams.

73,
Dan / ab0re
 
Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by K0HEA on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I had access to both CB and Ham Radio as a kid in the Boy Scouts. I copied 18-20wpm by the time I went into the USCG. I became a Radioman and proudly worn the 'sparks'. I helped with the Ham Shack on my second ship, an icebreaker out of Seattle. I soon got my Novice ticket and then I got lazy and did not upgrade for quite some time. On the last ship I served on, a communications/radar platform (we towed a 25K cubic foot balloon with a radar unit housed under the belly. I became a MARS station (at least the ship did) and had the pleasure of running phone patches for the USS SARATOGA on her way back from Gulf I...

I am a Tech+ now, and if I ever find a way around the rules of my HOA, and get my wife's plant nursery off of the patio, I may yet set up my equipment and once again converse in that beloved second language known as morse code.

As for now, as an ARES and CERT volunteer, I use both a GMRS radio and a VX-R2 when I am mobilized for an exercise.

I guess each mode of communication(s) has it's own facination and place.

Herb
K0HEA
WQDM933
 
Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by K4UUG on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
The only thing that CAN cause the demise of AMATEUR RADIO is the microphone and the hypersensitive and rude amateur operator.The know it all who assumes the worst in people and rarely give people the benefit of the doubt.The guy who gets on 3898 3975 and uses foul language then comes to the repeater talking about CB'ers or calling other amateurs CB'ers.That kind of behavior WILL cause the demise OF AMATEUR RADIO .
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by K4UUG on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
N4ZOU
No evidence exists that Morse proficiency is an indicator of a desirable,disciplined,motivated, or better qualified operator.In fact In Hollingsworth's view, radio amateurs all too often are hypersensitive and rude,assume the worst in people,rarely give people the benefit of the doubt," Hollingsworth acknowledged that "certain problem operators" remain, but the real troublemakers are rarely the newcomers to Amateur Radio they are General,Advanced,Extras.
"If there's a downfall in Amateur Radio, it won't be caused by no-code Technicians or codeless anything else," he said. "It'll be caused by the microphone--no doubt in my mind." He advised his audience to ignore the troublesome HF operators and not give them the attention they crave by engaging them on the air.
"Now, think about it: If what you're hearing annoys you, or angers you or is stupid, use the 'stupid filter,' which is that big knob--that VFO that will take you somewhere else." "It's the largest knob on the radio." He recommended moving to another frequency or even another band altogether
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by K4UUG on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
USCG_RMC

. I am not opposed to manual Morse code operation. But Morse code is just another mode and should not be afforded any special priority over others. It is available to those who wish to use it. Morse proficiency should not be required for those who do not wish to use the mode.

2. Manual radiotelegraphy communications has been superceded by more modern, reliable, accurate, faster and efficient means of communication.

3. Requiring manual telegraphy proficiency is not compatible with the radio amateur's mandated objective of contributing to the advancement of the radio art.

4. No evidence exists that Morse proficiency is an indicator of a desirable,motivated or better qualified operator.

5. The Morse code requirement serves as an advancement barrier to many otherwise qualified individuals.

6. The value of Morse code communications in the Amateur Service is primarily recreational in nature and manual telegraphy proficiency should no longer be a compulsory licensing requirement for any class of Amateur Radio license.

7. The most challenging problem is our attitude towards newcomers and our focus on the mode of CW as the defining characteristic of Amateur Radio. If you do not operate the mode CW or if you are not proficient with the CW mode, then you are not a real ham radio operator.This is our most challenging problem our attitude towards change. If we can overcome this hurdle, promoting Amateur Radio for the future is the easy part. (ARRL Past President, Rod Stafford, W6ROD, wrote of similar issues - I encourage you to read it.)

8. I do not have good ideas on how to change the mode attitudes. I wish I did because I believe the mode attitude is the Achilles Heel of the Amateur Radio Hobby.Changing our attitude towards change and new comers is a key part of growing Amateur radio in the future.

9. The Majority of Amateurs and VECs support the FCC offer to remove cw as a requirement for any class operator,the new blood will bring more technical knowledge into the hobby.

10 .The FCC will remove CW as a requirement for any class operator very soon!

FCC HOLLINGSWORTH "If there's a downfall in Amateur Radio, it won't be caused by no-code Technicians or codeless anything else," he said. "It'll be caused by the microphone--no doubt in my mind."
In fact In Hollingsworth's view, radio amateurs all too often are hypersensitive and rude,assume the worst in people,rarely give people the benefit of the doubt," Hollingsworth acknowledged that "certain problem operators" remain, but the real troublemakers are rarely the " newcomers " to Amateur Radio.


 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by KC8VWM on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
The only thing that CAN cause the demise of AMATEUR RADIO is the microphone.

-------

.. Apparently, so does the idea of feeding DC backwards into your rig. :(

The main problem is that some people think this is somehow supposed to be a grand competition between hams vs. CB'ers mentality.

This competitiveness in people probably evolved from the idea of playing too much sorority football as a child.

73
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by K4UUG on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
CODELESS HAMS CAN OPERATE HF ON MARS NETS GET YOUR FEET WET NOW How to Join Army MARS

Eligibility

The applicant must -

Be 17 years of age or older. (Signature of parent or legal guardian is required when an applicant is under 18 years of age.)
Be a United States Citizen or resident alien. (Possess a valid amateur radio license issued by the Federal Communications Commission (FCC) or other competent U.S. Authority.)(of any class.)
Possess a station capable of operating on MARS VHF and/or HF frequencies.
Agree to operate a minimum of 12 hours per calendar quarter with 6 hours being on VHF and or HF networks.

http://www.asc.army.mil/mars/join.htm

To request an application for membership either e-mail our administrative staff
netc-opema@netcom.army.mil

or write to -

ATTN NETC-OPE-M (MARS STATION)
US ARMY NETCOM/9TH ASC
BLD 90551 JIM AVENUE
FORT HUACHUCA, AZ 85613-7070

Please send us your mailing address and we'll send you a membership packet.



 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by K3EY on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
There is an elitist attitude alive and well in the ham world. If one doesn't have those vaulted tickets then he is a nobody. And nowadays if you have your Extra Class license and it was under the new rules you are looked down on as well. Human nature, flawed human nature and why we all need saved from ourselves, every last one of us.

I used to be on SSB back in the mid 80's mostly on 75 meters where if you didn't run a KW you were thought of as trailer trash, you were ignored by every ham across the country as they told you they couldn't hear your 5 by 5 signal, where a 40 db signal was expected from real men with balls.

To me CBers and Hams are no different, they both are human beings with the same failings, wants and desires and egos.

Since the late 80's I operate 100 percent CW and when people ask me why I tell them the truth which is: Operating SSB to me anyway, is no different than when I operated a CB back in the very early 70's. Back when people were truly scared to death of the FCC’s strong hand, back when hams were thought of as Gods of radio land.

I have since become an Extra Class and because of my job acquired my commercial FCC along with other government license which I needed for my career. They all were a lot harder to obtain. Now as I look back all those years ago I don't see any real difference between Hams and CBers. Both have morons and less than class A individuals. Getting ones tickets doesn't equate into a better person but sometimes just the opposite, an arrogant A-hole with a government license to inflate his already over blown ego.


Curt
k3ivb ex k3ey
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by W5ESE on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
> 9. The Majority of Amateurs and VECs support the
> FCC offer to remove cw as a requirement for any
> class operator,the new blood will bring more
> technical knowledge into the hobby.

Why, because you say so?

Analysis (by AH0A) of comments filed on NPRM 05-235
indicated that 55% of the commenters support
retention of a telegraph examination element, at
least at the extra class level.

The data is at:

http://www.ah0a.org/FCC/05-235/Nom.html

73
Scott
W5ESE
KNU3709
 
Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by K0HEA on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
K4UUG, KC8VWM,

I agree whole-heartedly, it is the operator that makes the hobby what it is. I guess the best we can do is to 'mentor' those we can, and hope we can minimize the effects of the ones we can't.

Herb/K0HEA
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by AB9LZ on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
K4UUG

>>3. Requiring manual telegraphy proficiency is not >>compatible with the radio amateur's mandated >>objective of contributing to the advancement of the >>radio art.

That is utter B.S.

If you are going to call it an "art", and not a service, hobby, or anything else. Then one can argue that morse code does indeed advance the "art" of radio... perhaps like no other mode can.

Indeed, it would be quite a stretch to make the claim that yakking into a microphone is advancing the ARS in any form whatsoever, in fact, it seems that Riley thinks the microphone is at the root of most of the problems he sees.

73 Mark.
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WB4M on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
"Now, think about it: If what you're hearing annoys you, or angers you or is stupid, use the 'stupid filter,' which is that big knob--that VFO that will take you somewhere else." "It's the largest knob on the radio." He recommended moving to another frequency or even another band altogether

Yup, totally ignore the rule-breakers, etc. Stick your head in the sand, turn the "big knob". Better still, get out of ham radio altogether. That way, you'll never hear the slobbering idiots again.
 
Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WB4M on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Yes, indeed we should recruit those who are notorious for operating on illegal frequencies, running illegal power, and using illegal equipment. Let's just hope they are "elmerable". Good luck.
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by AG4RQ on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
K4UUG:
Referring to your 8-point list:
"5. The Morse code requirement serves as an advancement barrier to many otherwise qualified individuals."

I want to be a Major League Baseball player. There are advancement barriers in MLB to qualified individuals. If you can't hit, they make you a pitcher. If you can't hit and can't throw, they won't let you play. They should change the rules so I can play. They have designated hitters. Why can't they have designated base runners. Let someone that can hit get on base. Then I will run for him. It's not fair to deprive me of a career in Major League Baseball. I deserve a World Series ring as much as those who can hit or pitch.
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by TKRIDEL on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
"Like many hams I was a CB sidebander for years before I finally got my license in 1995. I made the mistake of mentioning this when I first got on area repeaters and I encountered incredible hostility from some of the older hams. I was called a 'chicken-bander' among other things."


The best thing to do when older hams get snobby about CB or anything else is to stand your ground. Their tirades are based on the assumption that you'll lie there and take it because they're supposedly wiser. But if you stand up to them -- such as by saying, "Yeah, I was a CBer. Want to make something of it?" -- the fuddie-duddies just back down and slink away.
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by AB9LZ on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
9. The Majority of Amateurs and VECs support the FCC offer to remove cw as a requirement for any class operator,the new blood will bring more technical knowledge into the hobby.


More utter B.S.

A majority the folks that build their own radios are CW QRP ops.

I don't know about you, but from judging the quality and technical soundness of much of the CB / freebander gear I see, I'm not counting on these guys to advance the "technical knowledge of the hobby". (unless of course you'd like a roger beep, a little echo, and some cool blue lights on yer rig good buddy.)

BTW all the surveys I've seen show most hams supporting the code test, I believe that statement was a fabrication to support a point.

73 Mark.
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by AG4RQ on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
The idea of attracting CBers to become hams has its pros and cons. Stereotyping CBers doesn't work. Some CBers will make excellent hams, while others will make horrible hams. The discerning ham will be able to separate the good from the bad.

This article revealed a lot of truth.

"When CB finally became legal in Holland, hundreds of thousands of young and old people bought a CB transceiver. Were they interested in radio? Hardly. Most of them only wanted to communicate...

Fortunately, the Internet was born. Along with it came messenger software such as ICQ and MSN. No need for an antenna anymore, no interference, just communication. Most CB operators abandoned their radio immediately and switched to the Internet. Is CB dead now? No. Quiet maybe. Things changed. CB matured... The operators who stayed, stayed because they love radio. Newcomers come to CB because they love radio. They experiment with antennas, they behave well, they use (kinda) official call signs, they organize contests."

Here in the States, we have a mixed bag. While many CBers seem to be gutter trash, there are also good people with a love for radio that have good operating habits. Like I said, you have to be able to discern and separate the good from the bad. The ones with a love for radio usually wind up eventually getting their ham tickets.

The author's story about CB in Holland parallels the CB craze of the seventies here in the States, when half to two-thirds of the vehicles on the Interstates (4-wheelers as well as 18-wheelers) were sporting CB whips, and on the roofs of houses and apartment buildings you could see ground planes, "Big Sticks", "Astroplanes", Moonrakers" and such. The vast majority were fad CBers and are long gone. They were the utility communicators that took their communications to cell phones and the Internet. They weren't on CB for love of radio. Most of those who had a love for radio became hams.
 
Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by AI2IA on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
If a person shows up at out club facility, we assume thay are interested in Amateur Radio.

That's all that matters.

Lon - W3LK

I don't think that anybody could express the right approach to CB better than did Lon, W3LK. I have been a VE for years, and I can tell you that the smile on the face of a CB operator who just past his first ham exam is a least a half inch wider than the smiles on the faces of those who were not into CB before their first ham licenses. Ham radio is so big and beautiful that there is room here for everyone of good will with the interest and the determination to do it.
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by W9OY on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Do they still have CB?

73 W9OY
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by W3JJH on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
The principal reason why hams hate CB goes back 48 years. Until September, 1958, 26.96 to 27.23 MHz was an amateur band that we had on a shared basis. Those [expletive deleted] citizens-bandits stole our frequencies before many present day hams were born, and some of us still hold a grudge.
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WB2WIK on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
>RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators Reply
by K4UUG on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
USCG_RMC
2. Manual radiotelegraphy communications has been superceded by more modern, reliable, accurate, faster and efficient means of communication.<

::The automobile has been superceded by more modern, reliable, faster and efficient transportation. But most people still want a drive a car, and there's that pesky licensing requirement that includes demonstrating being able to control the vehicle on the road. Golly, I hope they do away with that soon; it's impeding my dog's ability to get a license from the DMV. (He's already of legal age and has excellent eyesight.) The only more modern, accurate and faster means of communications than code which amateurs are allowed to use are digital modes which require ancilliary equipment to operate; that equipment, with today's technology, isn't so portable and almost nobody backpacking could use it. I can disable your computer with a large electromagnet from an adjacent quarters. But there's no way to lock up a code transmission. Voice transmissions are neither faster, more reliable nor more efficient than code.


>4. No evidence exists that Morse proficiency is an indicator of a desirable,motivated or better qualified operator.<

::You can't prove that. But I can prove that virtually everybody who wins an HF radio contest, including SSB-only contests, knows code and uses it regularly. Look at the list of winners in QST or CQ, and look them up. Those are lists of the best operators in the world.

>5. The Morse code requirement serves as an advancement barrier to many otherwise qualified individuals.<

::Perfectly true. Just like that behind the wheel test is really holding back my dog, who is otherwise a perfectly capable driver. (He's passed the written.)

>8. I do not have good ideas on how to change the mode attitudes. I wish I did because I believe the mode attitude is the Achilles Heel of the Amateur Radio Hobby. Changing our attitude towards change and new comers is a key part of growing Amateur radio in the future.<

::I'd recommend you read the August 2006 issue of CQ Magazine editorial by W2VU. The part where he writes, "A trend I've been noticing at recent hamfests, particularly so at Dayton and Dallas this year, is the presence of more and more young hams. I'm seeing more kids -- pre-teens and teenagers -- with callsign tags...and perhaps of equal importance, more 20- and 30-something hams, often with spouses and little kids in tow." The fact is, code isn't really holding anybody back except those who hold themselves back and probably have failed at lots of stuff. Pity.

>9. The Majority of Amateurs and VECs support the FCC offer to remove cw as a requirement for any class operator,the new blood will bring more technical knowledge into the hobby.<

::How will it do that? No evidence of this exists.

>10 .The FCC will remove CW as a requirement for any class operator very soon!<

::Maybe. FCC isn't commenting on this. In any case, "very soon" could be any time, including ten years from now. By the way, "CW" has never been a requirement for licensing. *Code* has been. They're not the same.

>FCC HOLLINGSWORTH "If there's a downfall in Amateur Radio, it won't be caused by no-code Technicians or codeless anything else," he said. "It'll be caused by the microphone--no doubt in my mind."<

::Riley did say this. And "the microphone" implies amateurs who operate voice modes; because you almost never hear a discouraging word or any of the crap so unfortunately prevalent on the "phone" bands when operating CW. Seems the "barrier" might be a good one, separating the best operators from the lesser so...



 
Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by N7XB on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Many experienced CD SSB ops are frankly more talented and knowledgeable about radio generally than many amateur Technicians who spend their entire ham life operating 2 meter FM on repeater frequencies someone else programmed into their radios.

Language issues? How many of you have heard from a local amateur something like:

"The handle here is Bruce, but I'll have to QRT now because I am destinated at the home QTH. I'll give you a call on the twisted pair after I'm clear on your final."

We have bigger issues, folks . . .

Bruce N7XB
Portland, OR
 
Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WN4DW on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
The article is a good one and totally reasonable.
The comments about it range fron thoughtful to assinine and ridiculous.

I have a mobile rig in my pickup as well as a CB. The mobile rig is a part of my hobby; while the CB is a practicle addition to my transportation needs.
If I need to find out something about a local area, road conditions, traffic or the like; it's the CB. The Ham rig is useless for these things. If I had an emergency the CB would help me. The Ham rig might help, but it is doubtful. Many OTR truck drivers are Hams, but all OTR drivers have a CB in the truck. The CB is a necessity.
Sure there is abuse, but there is no lack of abuse on the Ham bands. I wonder if the abusers on the CB channels are any higher a percentage than those on the Ham bands. My guess is that the percent of abusers would be very close in each group.

Wake up my Ham brothers and expand you tunnel vision attitudes. It's a big world out there, and there's room for CB, CW, phone, rtty, psk31, sat, sstv and whatever.
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by W5ESE on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
>> FCC HOLLINGSWORTH "If there's a downfall in Amateur
>> Radio, it won't be caused by no-code Technicians or
>> codeless anything else," he said. "It'll be caused
>> by the microphone--no doubt in my mind."

Maybe that's why Riley Hollingsworth is a member of
the 'FISTS Club' for Morse operators.

> Hollingsworth holds a Master’s degree from the
> University of South Carolina, and a Law degree
> from Wake Forest University. An Amateur Radio
> licensee since 1960, he is a member of the
> Quarter Century Wireless Association
> and FISTS Club. <<--

Scott
W5ESE
KNU3709
 
Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by K1CJS on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I'm a former CBer too. I have both CB abd ham radios in the rig I drive--the CB is useful at a lot of pick-up/delivery docks that use CBs for door assigning and other reasons.

I don't care who knows I still use CB or what they would/do say about it either. If a person started with listening to radio, shortwave or otherwise, does it really make a difference if they got into CB radio first or went directly to ham radio? The answer is NO IT DOES NOT. When CBers come into the ham ranks, if the time and the trouble to show them the right way to operate is taken, most will welcome the instruction AND appreciate the time taken to actually show them HOW TO COMMUNICATE on the ham bands.

I've found out that there are many good elmers out there that are willing to take the time--just as there are those who just don't care to. If a ham shows the elitist attitude 'I'm better than you--you aren't in my league', who can blame the new ham/ex-CBer if their attitude becomes 'You didn't want to bother with me so I'll do it the way I know how to'.

I had a few hams who took the time to show me the ropes and the correct way when I came into the ham ranks. I also saw a few that had their nose up their attitude, too. It isn't all the ex-CBers fault, a lot of us are at fault as well.

If we want to get the ranks of ham radio cleaned up, we've got to start in our own shacks first. Lets get our own attitude in the right lane before we work on others--it is mostly through example that any of us learn. We won't have to say 'those dreadful CBers' if we give the time and the right attitude to having them see 'how to' the right way.
 
Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WA1RNE on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Per usual, any article having to do with making amateur radio more popular with youth or newcomers ends up as a CW vs. Phone bash session and blame game.


The situation is not going to be improved by blaming newcomers for their lack of CW proficiency or interest.


Amateur radio has been surveyed to death about whether the CW element should be kept as a licensing requirement. The concensus showed there are enough hams who would not mind seeing it dropped alltogether - not surprising considering the Extra Class requirement dropped from 20 to 5 WPM - the same speed I had to attain in order to pass my Novice exam over 33 years ago.



So let's move on.....Let's start spending our energy writing about how we should approach the FCC about an improved testing process that stresses more technical prowess, but without making it so difficult that it requires an undergraduate degree.


I suggested the Demonstrated Skills Element almost 2 years ago on this forum but didn't see a lot of interest.


Imagine an applicant who can wire up his or her station, cut a dipole to length and erect it properly, right out of the chute?


What could be a better learning experience and a means of instilling competency before one gets on the air??



WA1RNE
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by W4LGH on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Personally...in my opinion, I don't thnk hams hate cb'er. I think they hate what CB has become! I played with CB radios back in 1959..yea it was around then, actually had a legal FCC call 5W1196! I got involved with ham radio in 1964 and gave up CB until the next CB craze in 1970, when everyone had one in their cars. That lasted a couple of years and it got bad again.

If the ARRL get their way, they want to give HAM RADIO away. If that happens, you'll find ham radio follow what happened to CB. (again my opinion) I have found that if someone really wants to get in ham radio, they will study and they WILL pass the tests required to get their license. We don't have to give it away to attract "new blood"! We DO have to inter-act with others to get their interest up. Heck , my wife studied and got her license, with my help, and if she can do it anyone who really wants it can do it too!

It is harder to attract new people today, with all the other electronic goodies out there, we really have to work on them, again, not just give it away.

73 to all! de W4LGH - Alan
http://www.w4lgh.com

 
Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by AH6FC on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I never went the CB route but plenty of very competent Hams did. We need to foster relationships wherever we can to improve the ranks of the hobby. No, I don't like CB or CB lingo, operating habits, etc. But the whole code/no code issue is no better. Yes, the licensing process has been dumbed (sp) down, but the lack of cw is not the reason. Without the code I think you're missing a great part of ham radio, but that neither here or there. The CB'er who are "lids" will either change or not be interested in ham radio. It's up to us to help them along.

ah6fc/7
 
Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by N8QBY on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I got my first side-band cb radio back in about 1977. I had many walkie-talkies years before that but this was my first real cb. Having had electronics class in highschool, I was soon delving into building di-pole antennas, and modifying radios. I was working dx stations all over the world. And of course, back then, QSL cards were quite popular, so I still have many from all over the world that I take out now and then for a chuckle. There was a local group of 4 or 5 friends that would go on our own transmitter hunts. Not trying to find other cb radios but actually searching for a home-built transmitter,(by one of the group), with adjustable, intermittent, transmitted tone. We would hide this, "green box" anywhere, ie, in trees, bushes etc. It was fun, period. All of our group went on to getting our licenses. We still hook up now and then on hf, as we are all spread out in different parts of the US. In my area, there weren't many of the assholes that I hear others talk about, until years later. Back then if someone was cutting coax, or just being a jerk, we paid a visit to that person, enough said, :o) Then I decided to get my ham ticket. I don't have any regrets as to the path that took me to the present situation. Life was fun then, and still is. Enjoy... KTC-5700 oops, I mean N8QBY
 
Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by N4MJG on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
i was a cber in late 70's and got off untill back in cb on 1990 untill 2001 got my lic.i love my radios back then,i use to work cb radios untill 2001,atfer i sold all my cb stuffi didn't needed anymore.thanks to george stone wd4cyv that got me into ham radio,i'm glad that i got on ham radio !



73
Jackie
KG4ORX
Website http://webpages.charter.net/kg4orx/

 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WB2WIK on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
>Those Dreadful CB Operators Reply
by WN4DW on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!

Sure there is abuse, but there is no lack of abuse on the Ham bands. I wonder if the abusers on the CB channels are any higher a percentage than those on the Ham bands. My guess is that the percent of abusers would be very close in each group.<

::Bad guess. Can't be, impossible. Reason is, almost everyone who operates CB has operated unlawfully, if you actually read Part 95. Working "skip" is actually unlawful. Operating on any frequency except the allocated 40 channels, with any more power than 4W output, is unlawful. Excessive modulation is unlawful. Modifying type accepted equipment in any way, including adding echoes and other modulation accessories that can change the way the equipment operates and were not part of the equipment certified during reivew, is unlawful. I'd say that probably 90% of *everyone* on CB is operating unlawfully, or has at some point -- often, without necessarily knowing they're doing it!

The percentage of hams who intentionally violate the regulations is quite small, but it only takes one bad apple to make the barrel stink. Probably most of us have accidentally fractured a regulation or two unintentionally, too (DX operators using "wrong VFO" -- oops -- that's out of the band! -- and such are pretty common mistakes). But percentage-wise, I'd guarantee it's much smaller than what occurs with CB.


 
Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by N8QBY on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Additional note: There I was finally licensed, making my first 10 meter phone contact. And then it happend, I was asked, "What is your handle?" Funny if you think about it. 73
 
Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by KA2DDX on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Well, he makes one point that sticks with me. So, I'll pose a question to the readers of this. If you belong to an amateur radion club, does your club NEED new members?

I'd love to read your responses.
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WB2WIK on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
"Those Dreadful CB Operators Reply
by N8QBY on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Additional note: There I was finally licensed, making my first 10 meter phone contact. And then it happend, I was asked, "What is your handle?" Funny if you think about it. 73"

::Not funny at all. "Handle" isn't a CB term. Hams used it for 50 years before there was a CB, and it didn't start with hams, either. It's very old jargon for "name," I've seen the expression used in books from the nineteenth century.

WB2WIK/6
 
Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by AI0F on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I can thank the cb world for me becoming a ham. I was a "big strapper" back in the 70's, but the total lack of anything that could be understood by the common human brain, drove me to get my ham license. I loved the radio, but could not listen any longer to the sing-song truckers, filth, etc. that was all cb-land ended up being.

The only thing that I really can't come to terms with is the same thing I can't come to terms with in the US. I have no problem with cbers becoming hams, but with the license structure where it is now, they might as well just charge the fee and forget the testing. If these people want to be hams, then be one! Why bring all the 11 meter garbage to the ham bands, leave it where it is! Same with the country, if people want to come here and live in America, then be an American!!!! Don't bring your country here and set up shop. Why should I have to "press 1" for English!!!!!!!!!!!

So, enough of that, but anyone that wants to be a ham is welcome...just try and be a ham and follow the rules.

 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by RobertKoernerExAE7G on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Great prose Hans.

Nice to hear something positive about CBers wanting to become a ham. I suspect your culture is at least a little different than ours. Hence your CBers might be different than ours.

When I go into one of our coffee houses, they do not sell anything to smoke. When eating out, we never sit at a table with strangers; our cities do not have sections where one can pay to have sex. Plus, a restaurant with the name of "Five Flies" wouldn't last decades here.

73
Bob
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WB2WIK on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
>Those Dreadful CB Operators Reply
by KF0K on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Why should I have to "press 1" for English!!!!!!!!!!!<

::Heck, you can get it with a "1?" Here, I'm pretty sure it's around a "3" or "4..."


:(

WB2WIK/6
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WA2JJH on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
FWIW...I HAD FELLOW HAMS BE RUDE! I HAVE BEEN A HAM FOR 30 YEARS!
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WB4QNG on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I would think most Ham radio operators from the 70's got into it by the way of CB. I have no idea where hams are coming from today. I personaly think we should open ours arms wide open to CBers. There is no way to measure this but my guess is if you take away the truckers if all the Cbers that are active in the US today you wouldn't replace the 25,000 hams we lost in the last 6 years. I think you are going to see these numbers get larger as the years go buy as more and more of us become SK's.
Terry
WB4QNG
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by K3JVB on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I had a brief interest in 11 meters...as a youngster, somebody gave an He-20c cb rig.

My older brother was a ham, and I was about 9...I guess it was kinda little brother stuff. But he rained on my parade...he took my listening rig, and promtly converted it to 10 meters...

Neat little qrp station ! I still listened a lot...and another few years later...I was on the air.
But the rf bug was caught on all of the bands, yes, including 11 meters

Never liked the "breaker-one -nine thought !
...always thought calling CQ was the better way !
Guess big brother did me a big favor !
73
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by W5HTW on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I would not "recruit" CBers into ham radio or into our club. However, if a CBer comes to the club, I have to assume he did so because he is interested in ham radio, and on that stand, he is welcome. I'll help him learn, help him get licensed. But along the way I stresss that ham radio is not CB, and when he enters our gates, he speaks our language and goes by our rules. If he then goes out to his vehicle and hops on Channel 13 with the rest of the "personals" types, that's his business. But if, on the ham bands, and in the ham clubs, he plays the ham radio game, I have no problem with him. We hams have a long tradition. CB has a tradition. But that does not give CBers the right to erase OUR tradition and substitute theirs. Let them JOIN, not disrupt. Do that, and you're a good ham.

"1 for English?" Maybe in Britain. Maybe not. Perhaps in Oxford. Remember, OUR national language is Spananeseonics. With seventy six secondary languages. English is in there somewhere, I'm sure. Or at least some distorted, uneducated version of it still remains with us.

And that's the problem - people today come to "take a part OF, not a part IN" our nation, and in our ham radio. They come to divide, not to join. And they are very successful at it, both in our nation and our hobby.

Yep, there are a few bad guys on some of the ham bands. Most of them came into ham radio in the 1980s directly from CB, via the early days of the VEC-give-your-buddy-a-license program. They brought CB with them, and now they are our sad Elmers. They got their education on Channel 11. Or 19. Or somewhere in there.

And there are a very few from the old days, before CB, who really started out in ham radio, and did not go to the "CB School Of Useless Garbage." But they are disappearing, and the blended version of the Ham-CBer is what is heard on the HF bands.

Me? I tried CB. I was already a ham, but I decided it might work for me to communicate short distances to my wife. It didn't. Too much garbage on there, and this was in 1963. Kept the radios about three months, much of the time with them in the closet, then gave them away.

Percentages? I'd bet 98 percent of all hams (including the NCTs, slow-code types, and the real old timers) operate legally. Some of them may still use some CB lingo, but that's probably because no one told them not to, in most cases.

On CB? I'd bet the percentage of those who break the rules is very, very high. Can't remember when I last heard of a CBer doing it by the book. I suppose it happens.

Ed
 
Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WO8USA on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
My name is Chris, WO8USA, the former KBHY-1316 and Radio America 1, and very proud of it. I too feel better!

CB got me into the best hobby I can think of--Ham Radio. CB has not really survived like Ham, at least if Dayton area traffic is a sample. It sparked my interest and launched my career--as a 12 year old, I could not imagine talking to someone 8 miles away! As a PhD in EE, I understand the physics and math behind it and am still in awe of how that little signal makes it anywhere.

All should be invited to participate in this great hobby!!! Besides friendship, meeting others and traveling placing you'd likely not do in life, and just having fun, what could it hurt? And, dare I say it----make CW a requirement only for Extra Class---let people get on HF and spread that international goodwill which is supposed to be a Ham Radio purpose.


Chris WO8USA
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by K4VVX on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I have met a "few" Ham Operators since I was first licensed as kn4vvx in 1960. Their demeanor ranged from "slobs" to "gentlemen", just about like any other cross section of the population. What I noticed about the "slobs"(not very many, BTW) is that they lacked self-dicipline and self-control. Think about that,"self-control". That is a quality that causes a person to refrain from conduct that is unacceptable to the "civilized" world on the air OR on the Internet. I firmly believe that if a person has the self-discipline and self-control to learn and use CW, that he will be a better and more considerate operator, on both phone and CW. He will have the ability to "hold his tongue" AND his keyboard fingers when it is "the right thing to do".

I think that what we in the Ham Community need to look at and recruit is "quality and not quantity".

Carl k4vvx
 
Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by N8QBY on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
WB2WIK wrote: Not funny at all. "Handle" isn't a CB term. Hams used it for 50 years before there was a CB, and it didn't start with hams, either. It's very old jargon for "name," I've seen the expression used in books from the nineteenth century. Steve, don't read any more into my comment than was meant. I know the history of ham radio terms. It was only meant for a chuckle. Relax....:o) Pat N8QBY
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by K4VVX on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
....There are other ways to learn self-discipline and self-control, CW is just one way. But,...this IS about Amateur Radio......


Carl
 
Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by N8QBY on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I guess I missed most of the garbage on 11 meters due to operating 99% ssb. And of course, most radios were expandable for more freq's, right or wrong. I never operated on the truckers channel 19, as I didn't care for their lingo. Channel 11 was actually used for the truckers when I first started. We had fun but it more than time to move on. I still don't make ham radio my life, as it is just a hobby like any of the others I enjoy. Live and have fun. Pat N8QBY
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by KC8VWM on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I agree that CW is a disciplined art which requires a disciplined individual which might lead to the idea that we may populate the bands with more quality op's and not just sheer quantity op's.

However, I don't feel that an individual who knows CW necessarily equates to mean that same individual wears clean clothes and shaves either.

Been to a hamfest lately?

So I am left with no chioce but to conclude that certain individual "slobs" mentioned earlier can either be CB'ers or Hams for that matter.

It doesn't seem to matter if they know CW or not. That fact just seems to exist in both worlds.

I tend to agree that if you are looking for "quality" aand not "quantity" then at least it would be more preferable if some people cleaned themselves up a bit before representing themselves in public as ambassadors of our fine service.

Just an experienced observation. :)

73
 
Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by N0XMZ on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Very interesting thread. I hesitated to click on it though... I just knew this topic would cause some flame wars.

After reading about half of the posts and skimming over the rest, I am pleasantly surprised. Yes, the age-old code vs. no-code debate has reared it's ugly head, but there is very little venom being spewed over the actual topic itself.

Many hams are quick to discount the "chicken band" - but many of those SAME HAMS got their start in radio on CB.

Back in the early 90's, a friend introduced me to CB. Later on, I discovered SSB. I was hooked. My activity on 37 & 38 LSB, along with my curiosity about electronics, motivated me to get my ham licence. I was soon studying college-level electronics books and my thirst for knowledge has never been satisfied since.

Out of curiosity, I recently bought the same CB model I had back in '92, a TRC-465 SSB radio. Shhh - don't tell anybody :o) Even here in a major metro area of over 5 mil. people, I am surprised to hear almost NO local activity whatsoever. But there IS stateside activity on channel 37 & 38 LSB. Often times I hear activity there while the ham bands are dead (obviously poor propagation is not to blame). Besides the lack of real callsigns, they often sound alot like hams. They're courteous, they exchange honest (not the generic "59") signal reports, and they BS about the weather and everything else.

So yes, I agree, we should welcome anyone interested in radio. The ones who prefer to use illegal amps, the ones who would rather raise hell, swear, and pick up "lot lizards" will quickly learn that ham radio is not where they want to be and they probably won't come back. It is our responsibility as hams to ELMER the newcomer who is interested in radio, regardless of where he got his start.
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WB2WIK on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
>Those Dreadful CB Operators Reply
by N0XMZ on August 14, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Many hams are quick to discount the "chicken band" - but many of those SAME HAMS got their start in radio on CB.<

::Maybe. But I've never been on CB in my life. Not that I wasn't interested -- I just didn't have the money for any sort of CB rig when the "wireless bug" bit me at about age 12. Ham radio is the only place where you can homebrew all your stuff, so that seemed a better (lower cost) route.

I was there at the beginning of the "CB boom" in the mid-sixties, and knew all about CB. Just never had a rig, and never transmitted a signal there. The rigs back then were all American made (!!) and most of them used tubes.

Wow.

WB2WIK/6
 
Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by N0AH on August 15, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
2 Alpha Tango 934
PDL II Antenna
Super Scanner Omni Vertical
Moon Raker 4 Dual Polarization 8 elementBeam
Rotors
Towers
D-104
DAK Radio
Astron 99
Various Mobile and Base Amplifiers
Superior Mobile Radios with Actual Working NB

The list goes on. The world of CB radio not only has had exceptional technology in equipment, but most of us came from this pond.

The best thing to do with a CB'er (another case of those loving radio), is to get them into our hobby by showing them we have lungs and not gills.

I was mentored by hams in the Mile High DX Association who motivated me to get my Extra within a year of getting my license. I now teach 2-3 ham classes a year. What goes around come around.

(Now for the Bubba's of this world, hating Hams and blowing out his nighbor's speakers, the 11 meter cycle is 11 years and by then, he might be DOA from beer and brautworse-)

But for the average guy loving his radio, support them. If they are on CB radio's these days, and the ham test ae this easy, things will work out-
 
Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WA8VBX on August 15, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Well I am a ham who uses CB while traveling. Yes I carry a 2 meter rig with me, but I am not always within range of a repeater or if I am, getting someone else to talk to is sometimes impossible. At least with the CB if I am stranded in BFE, I can usually get a trucker who can relay a message and a lot of State and local police monitor channel 9. Plus you are not always within range of a cell tower to use your cellphone.

I try to welcome the new ham into our ranks, no matter where they come from, and give friendly advise when it is needed. I have used 10-4 on a local repeater before, but I am also a dispatcher for Police/Fire/Rescue and sometimes it just comes out. I have caught some flack from it but to me it is not any different then using Q-signals on voice, why say I am at my QTH instead of I am at my house.

Being a old code extra(20wpm), I have no problem if the FCC does away with code requirements. There will always be those that want to use it, like myself, but it is no longer required internationally why keep it in the US.

Yes Channel 19 is bad but like others have said, so is some of 75 meters. If you don't want to hear it, change the freq, or turn off the radio.

Kurt
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WA1SCI on August 15, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
CB??? People still do that???
 
Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by KE4ZHN on August 15, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Ive heard bad apples in both groups. Some hams I have heard operate arent any better than the low life trash they seem to paint all cbers as. Remember the chaos on 14.313 that went on for nearly 10 years? There was language used there that would make a truck driver blush. Howabout Glenn Baxter and his deranged taped tirades? Howabout the battles of 14.275? Howabout the liberty net? Howabout the nets on 40 mtrs. that fire up on top of ongoing communications? Remember the 3.894.5 - 3.901 fiasco a few years ago? An unnamed amateur (you know who you are) in NC playing tapes into an 8k Henry amplifier for hours at a time to jam "Porkbutt". (the former WB2OTK) This nonsense was the night time carryover of 14.313. Or, listen on any major contest day and its worse than CB! The rules go out the window and people operate like morons. Just to name a few fine examples of ham radio. The sad thing is most of the offenders I just mentioned are 20 wpm extra`s. So much for the filter theory huh? I give credit to Riley Hollingsworth for cleaning up alot of this trash, but theres still a few that need to be dealt with. Our ranks are far from perfect. Some of these clowns would get drunk or doped up on the air and act like fools and go out of their way to annoy others. Yes, the same thing goes on on the CB band too except maybe on a larger scale. So what? This is what a vfo is for. I dont care if a new ham comes from CB or FRS or whatever. If he/she operates in a legal and civilized manner on the air thats all that matters. Some people cannot and will not be elmered in any way. They only wish to do things their way and they soon realize that nobody will talk to them on the air if they continue to act like "Bubba" on the amateur bands. Before we bitch about how bad CB is, we still need to clean up our own backyard.
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by K3EY on August 15, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
THANK YOU KE4ZHN!


I remember all you mentioned very well. Especially the 75 meter crap as I was active down there at the time. This is exactly what I was saying in my previous post. You made the references which all are very true, morons with licenses. Being Extra Class makes them even worse it seems because they believe they are infallible or some other twisted logic they carry around with themselves.

There is absolutely no difference between CBers and Hams except the elitists attitude of "some" people who call themselves amateurs.


I used to like to listen to some of the characters on the Alligator net on 3895. What about that moron screaming "Rodney" for YEARS on end, what about the moron yawning non stop on the trader nets, what about the "Dog" and other characters that have since faded away, most being extra class operators. Remember these weirdoes the next time you look down your nose at the CB crowd thinking you belong to a better class of people.


Curt
k3ivb

 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by K4JF on August 15, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
"There is absolutely no difference between CBers and Hams except the elitists attitude of "some" people who call themselves amateurs. "

Beg to differ. Yes, there are all the problems you mention on ham radio. Dozens (maybe even hundreds) of hams acting in an uncivilized manner.

But that is a small portion of the 600,000 hams. The Amateur bands are known worldwide for their good habits of "self-policing". That means NOT being "tolerant" of others bad behavior. Tolerance, after all, is a bad thing if what you are tolerating is bad.

The overwhelming majority of hams operate within the rules. The opposite is true of CB. That is the difference.

I welcome with open arms any person who comes to the ham bands and sincerely desires to be a good operator, follow the rules (and not change them to suit his whims), and respect others on the bands. That is all that matters. But he who comes with the attitude that "I was a freebander for years and I know all there is to know about radio." will find himself shunned.
 
Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by W5GNB on August 15, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Well, I have been a ham since 1961. I got my Novice ticket as a young kid and became very good on CW. I still operate CW almost exclusively today.

CB sort of got rolling around the early Sixties and my father briefly got into it but never bacame a ham. I used CB back then to communicate with my father and other friends who were not hams. Many of these old friends bacame hams but many did not.

I still use CB regularily in the car when traveling because you can ALWAYS find someone on CB. This is not so on the ham repeaters. Many times I have called on the ham repeaters and received NO RESPONSE to my calls. I guess the old days of the repeater monitor are gone, there used to be an old fart that seemed to be on the repeater anytime someone called but I suppose all those guys are now gone or have found the internet!!

CB still has its place and if you are travelling, it is something that you should not be without.

I just wish I could get a XXX-RATED filter for some of these dirty-mouthed truckers that you hear from Coast to coast on CB. Too bad these bad apples have appeared on the CB bands but it is probably better here than on the Ham bands!!

73's
Gary - W5GNB
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by K4JF on August 15, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
"Being a old code extra(20wpm), I have no problem if the FCC does away with code requirements. There will always be those that want to use it, like myself, but it is no longer required internationally why keep it in the US. "

Actually, it still IS an international requirement. At last count, only about 20% of hams worldwide have no code test requirement. Let it be said that I haven't heard of any real problem in those countries that have dropped the requirement, but it still IS a requirement for most.
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by RobertKoernerExAE7G on August 15, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Last time I checked, eHam was about Ham Radio.

Debating CB, FRS, SOS, GMRS, two cans on a string, semifore, YAWN.
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by KC8VWM on August 15, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Unfortunately, the main stream public can't tell the difference between the four.

73
 
Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by N2HBX on August 15, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Like many, I also got the radio bug through CB back in the late 70's. I also learned that bigger isn't always better. I used to love annoying the crap out of my ex-father-in-law by talking farther on my stock Robyn radio and a good trunk mount antenna than he could with his "peaked-and-tweaked" RCA Co-Pilot and his whiz-bang, super zillion watt special dee-luxe amp and the equally un-amazing liquid-filled coil antenna on his 18 wheeler.

I have met some interesting trucker types though. One particularly memorable eyeball QSO was with the fellow that drives the car hauler for Mark Martin. Lots of stories from the backside of the NASCAR house.

Haven't had a CB in a while though. Every so often I think about maybe picking one up and adding it to the radio arsenal again. Ya just never know....

I found my old CB license the other day. I think I'll put it up on the wall with the ham ticket, the GMRS license, and the CET.

3's on ya!

73,
Larry, N2HBX/KATG-7172/WQDM-935
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by KC5CQD on August 15, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
***CB??? People still do that??? ***



Most people know and understand "CB radio". For the most part, when you mention "Ham radio", you get a blank look. Just a little fact that I thought I should share with you.

In other words; Don't get too uppity about your hobby. Learn to give credit where at least a little credit is due.

Antenna theory at 27.385Mhz is no different than it is at 7.050Mhz.

I cut my teeth on SSB/CB radio. We were all gentlemen and professional operators. In fact, half of my "crew" were licensed hams. Those were the guys that taught me CW. I get just a little offended whenever those gentlemen are ridiculed by self-righteous idiots that learned a question pool and got a ticket.

Yeah. CB. People still do that.
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WA2JJH on August 15, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
How about 2 semifored DSP cups with low loss string.
True, the general public thinks Ham, CB, GMRS, FRS and freebanding are one enthalpic hobby.

My first transceiver was a Lafayette ch-14 PAIR OF H-T'S. I then wised up to get a superhetrodhyne CB H-T with a 9 foot wire on it.

So what! I was taught at a ham club that lingo like 10-4 and good buddy were not acceptable.

In my day you got a Novice ticket first. Perhaps having CW privs only made the transition less problematic.

Perhaps it is the demise of the Ham club. I can see it be a rougher road for those that might let some CB lingo slip thru on 2M. They did not have a ham club to go to.

 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by KC5CQD on August 15, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
**Last time I checked, eHam was about Ham Radio.

Debating CB, FRS, SOS, GMRS, two cans on a string, semifore, YAWN.**



The article IS about ham radio. The man was just trying to explain how the other radio services can springboard people into the amateur radio service. Seemed pretty obvious to me!

There's nothing worse than fake aristocracy. Please stop thinking that just because we have ham tickets, we're somehow better than non-licensed radio operators. The rudest and nastiest people I've EVER met on the air were on 20, 40 and 80 meters. All of them General and Extra class licensees.

I love radio. ALL OF IT! Although I hold an Extra class ticket, I'm just not all that impressed by titles and pieces of paper. I love the radio hobby. Silly me.

 
Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by N6KYS on August 15, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I may be wrong, but isn't CB really small potatoes today compared to what it once was? We beat up each other over and over, but I think CB's actually whithered on the vine and no matter what you think of it, it's just about gone.
 
Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by KU4UV on August 16, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I got my start in the radio hobby from listening to my dad's C.B. radio in the car when I was a kid back in the late 70's and early 80's. I always thought it was the coolest thing in the world that you could actually talk to other people over the radio, get information,etc. I guess shows and movies like "Smokey and the Bandit", "The Dukes of Hazzard," and some of the trucking shows that were on the air when I was a kid helped with my fascination of C.B. From the C.B. craze, I got into shortwave listening, and later SSB C.B. operating. I had always wanted to get my ham license, and I finally did when I was senior in high school. I think C.B.'s have pretty much served their purpose, and a lot of manufacturers are no longer producing them, save for Uniden, Cobra, and a handful of others. There just isn't a real market for them anymore outside of the trucking industry. I would like to see the 27 MHz spectrum be turned back over to amateur use, but perhaps I have delusions of grandeur when it comes to this. I won't C.B.ers, as I still have one or two C.B.'s around the house. To me, C.B. was the spark that started the fire of my interest in radio in electronics.

73,
KU4UV
 
Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by KU4UV on August 16, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I got my start in the radio hobby from listening to my dad's C.B. radio in the car when I was a kid back in the late 70's and early 80's. I always thought it was the coolest thing in the world that you could actually talk to other people over the radio, get information,etc. I guess shows and movies like "Smokey and the Bandit", "The Dukes of Hazzard," and some of the trucking shows that were on the air when I was a kid helped with my fascination of C.B. From the C.B. craze, I got into shortwave listening, and later SSB C.B. operating. I had always wanted to get my ham license, and I finally did when I was senior in high school. I think C.B.'s have pretty much served their purpose, and a lot of manufacturers are no longer producing them, save for Uniden, Cobra, and a handful of others. There just isn't a real market for them anymore outside of the trucking industry. I would like to see the 27 MHz spectrum be turned back over to amateur use, but perhaps I have delusions of grandeur when it comes to this. I won't knock C.B.ers, as I still have one or two C.B.'s around the house. To me, C.B. was the spark that started the fire of my interest in radio in electronics.

73,
KU4UV
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by KA4KOE on August 16, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
heh heh

http://www.eham.net/articles/9969
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by KC8VWM on August 16, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
lol.. I was thinking about that article just the other day when this thread got started.

:)

 
Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by XE1UFO on August 16, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I also, like many others, got my start on eleven meters, first AM then SSB. In those days of my mid-teen years, I tried time and again to find a ham who would Elmer me. Living in Irving, Texas at the time, I would knock on doors of homes displaying ham antennas. But I would never even get invited through the door. It was very obvious that this religious cult called "Ham Radio" didn't care to have me as a member.

Then I ran into some eleven meter people. This was a whole different crowd. There was always somebody that would come by and pick me up for a "Coffee Break". When I needed help to raise an antenna or fix something, I could always count on a friendly CB'er to help. I am amazed how many QSL cards from around the world that I amassed on 11-meter SSB -- and even more that over 20% of them mention the eleven-meter operator's ham call sign!

One day an unmarked car came to my house. It was an FBI agent who happened to live behind my home. He said he saw my ground-plane antenna, and needed help. Even though I was just 16 years old, I installed his CB in the car for him.

In my quest, I even obtained my First Class Commercial license during this time. Then one day several of us met the great WB5PUN, Jay Smith. he believed we were 'rescue-able', and invested several months in us. Five of us obtained our Novice licenses. (Thanks, Jay!) I slowly worked my way up to Technician, and then jumped to Advanced Class (KA5SUT). (I have not gone on to Extra, lest I be confused with a 5 WPM Extra!)

And of course, after WB5PUN, I ran into dozens of friendly, helpful licensed hams. Maybe the fact that I am no longer a teenager helped. But hey: with a little mentoring, maybe I would have been a ham ten years earlier...

Today our XE1RCQ radio club actively recruits CB'ers. Perhaps 60% of our licensed hams have come from the ranks of 11 meters. And they are very good, courteous legal operators.

Last year I even donated a CB AM/SSB base unit to our club. Why? Because the next time we have a city-, state- or nation-wide emergency, we need to be able to legally connect with these valuable people!

Steve, XE1UFO a.k.a. KA5SUT
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by AE6RO on August 16, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
RE: CW operation
I'm not sure where I stand viz-a-viz the Morse code requirement. But I do know I wouldn't have learned it at all if it hadn't been required (1972).
I really enjoy CW now and don't bother with sideband at present. For one thing it's easier to find things to talk about since the information exchange goes a little more slowly.
For another you can work lots of DX with low power and simple antennas, due to the technical advantage CW has over sideband.
As far as technical advancement goes, sideband is technically obsolete also. What might really kill off ham radio is having digital voice forced on us.
73s, John AE6RO
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by K4JF on August 16, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
"Most people know and understand "CB radio". For the most part, when you mention "Ham radio", you get a blank look. Just a little fact that I thought I should share with you."

May be true where you live. Not the case around here. When people see my tag or notice the antennas and ask and I say "ham radio" the usual next question is "Oh, did you help with Katrina... or 9-11."
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by K1CJS on August 16, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
".....code requirements.....no longer required internationally.....

Actually, it still IS an international requirement."

The International requirements for the knowledge of morse code for operation under 30 mhz has been REMOVED. That means it is no longer a requirement.
The fact that some countries still require code does not make that requirement 'international'. The requirement is now the choice of the individual country, it is not worldwide.
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by K4JF on August 16, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
"The International requirements for the knowledge of morse code for operation under 30 mhz has been REMOVED. That means it is no longer a requirement.
The fact that some countries still require code does not make that requirement 'international'. The requirement is now the choice of the individual country, it is not worldwide."

No, my definition still stands. I didn't say "worldwide", I said "international" - meaning multiple countries, not necessarily all of them. If it were only U.S. and Mexico, for example, it would still be "international".

It is no longer an ITU requirement, it still is a requirement in most countries internationally. (Is that better?)
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WR8D on August 16, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I'm not touching this with a ten foot pole, anyway most of you know exactly how i feel about chickenbanders and what i do for them. 73 WR8D:
 
Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by KB3LSR on August 17, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I got started on CB and still use it today. If you think about it, most CBers still follow the traditions of radio in making and modifying their equipment, even though it is illegal. I bet there are more CBers that build their own equipment than HAMs, of course, this cannot be proven. I also received my license in a HAM-in-a-day class. On these threads, it's amazing how HAMs that want to promote unity in the hobby also talk down upon ex, or current, CBers and those HAM-in-a-day people. I always use the example of K1MAN. He was an extra class and a non-CBer. He wrecked more havoc on the air than most can imagine. Looks like the logic of CBers and HAM-in-a-day people being bad operators falls thin.
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by KE4SKY on August 17, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I started with a CB back like alot of people and then got a 2 meter rig and a tech license when a few of my friends did. I was very lucky that Art Feller, W4ART, then with the FCC and Butch Baker, N8LE a former freebander converted to Extra, were willing to Elmer me and teach me good operating practices. Both men set fine examples as mentors and teachers which I try to follow today.

We would all to well to follow their example.
 
Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WA9PIE on August 17, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Well, I haven't met a CBer recently who wasn't at least as old as most of us. That said - WE are not the future of ham radio. Recruiting more of US isn't going to be of much benefit in the long term.

What we really need is some way to convince kids that ham radio is more fun than getting their thumbs stuck on a cell phone sending text messages.

Mike, WA9PIE
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WB2WIK on August 17, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
>Those Dreadful CB Operators Reply
by KB3LSR on August 17, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I got started on CB and still use it today. If you think about it, most CBers still follow the traditions of radio in making and modifying their equipment, even though it is illegal.<

::This isn't an incidental problem...it's a major one. Hams aren't all perfect and we've all done things illegally by accident (equivalent to speeding or rolling through a stop sign), but this particular issue is major and I know of almost no hams in my 41 years as a very active ham who have intentionally and repeatedly violated the regulations -- which would include running excessive power, for example. Almost no hams to this, at least not in the U.S. where we have a very high legal limit to begin with.

>I bet there are more CBers that build their own equipment than HAMs, of course, this cannot be proven.<

::I'd bet NOT. However, if any are building their own equipment, that's illegal right there and technically should forbid them from ever becoming licensed amateur radio operators.

>I also received my license in a HAM-in-a-day class.<

::Congratulations!

>On these threads, it's amazing how HAMs that want to promote unity in the hobby also talk down upon ex, or current, CBers and those HAM-in-a-day people. I always use the example of K1MAN. He was an extra class and a non-CBer. He wrecked more havoc on the air than most can imagine.<

::It's intereting you should choose Baxter as an example. That's probably because you cannot think of other examples. He definitely became a rotten apple, no question -- but he wasn't always that way. I think he lost his mind over the past 10-20 years. He used to be a well respected ham who was known for restoring old Collins gear and such, and doing a very good job at it. And he is one, of over 600,000 licensed hams in America. There aren't more than a couple of dozen total who have created such a stir.

>Looks like the logic of CBers and HAM-in-a-day people being bad operators falls thin.<

::I don't think so. In tuning the amateur bands, I hear a few "K1MAN" types out of thousands of stations. The percentage is miniscule and easily ignored. But then, tuning the low end (and just below the low end) of ten meters, at any given moment I hear numerous "freebanders" operating, all illegally -- this quantity greatly exceeds the total number of "K1MANs" in the world, and this is only what I can hear from my location -- obviously, a small portion of the overall problem. The other issue is one of operating skill, on the air. I operate CW half the time, and must say about 99.9% of all CW ops are fine, even if they can't send worth a darn -- they're decent people, who are trying and not doing anything unlawful. But converted CBers are *mostly* not on CW, they're using "phone." Whether that be on HF or VHF, I can pick them out almost immediately, unless they are exceptional operators who blend in very well. But usually, by someone's on-air demeanor, I can tell. I just ask, "So, what was your CB handle?" and they tell me! It's obvious by such things as poor operating procedure, overmodulation and excessive mike gain, using "different" protocol which is largely inappropriate for the ham bands, and so forth. It is also obvious from the comments and questions. Questions are a good thing, as it's a quest for knowledge. When a knowledgeable ham provides a technically valid answer and then the party who asked the question challenges it because it conflicts with his CB wisdom, then it becomes a problem -- and I hear this all the time.

WB2WIK/6
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by W9WHE-II on August 17, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
There is nothing wrong with being from CB, SO LONG AS the CB related habits are not brought to ham radio.

No power microphones, reverbs, roger beeps, or rachet-jawing lingo, good budy. If they want the free-wheeling style of CB, then stay there. If they want to be like a decent ham, then we should welcome them. Its that simple.

W9WHE
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators K9SQG  
by K4UUG on August 17, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
K9SQG SAID

"Regardless of what the skill and knowlege requirements are, they serve as DESIRABLE BARRIERS to keep undesirable individuals out of ham radio."



DEAR K9SQG No evidence exists that Morse proficiency is an indicator of a desirable,motivated or better qualified operator in fact most fines by the FCC for misbehavior on amateur radio ARE NOT NO CODE TECHS or new comers the majority are the General Advanced Extra Class operators who know morse code.The most challenging problem is our attitude towards newcomers and our focus on the mode of CW as the defining characteristic of Amateur Radio.We should center on technical theory not on a mode of operation.The Morse code requirement serves as an advancement barrier to many otherwise qualified individuals.The value of Morse code communications in the Amateur Service is primarily recreational in nature and manual telegraphy proficiency should no longer be a compulsory licensing requirement for any class of Amateur Radio license.The FCC will soon drop Morse code as a requirement.Any codless tech can now get on HF if they join ARMY MARS the only requirement is that they have a valid amateur licence of any class and they pass the short Army Mars basic course.MARS handles real world traffic phone patches and operates under the umbrella of homeland security in fact morse code is not allowed on MARS freqs.To require a person to pass a morse code test for an amateur radio license is a kin to requiring a person to hook up a horse and buggy to get a drivers license.


K9SQG SAID
"First, I salute your service to Country. More Americans might due likewise. For some reason it seems like it is more politically correct to compensate the civilian victims of 9-11 with million dollar awards while our killed in combat veterans don't receive enough to cover burial and close-out expenses. Not sure I comprehend this but then I'm politically incorrect."


K9SQG No need for any salute my service to my country was my duty.I joined of my own free will as did my ansestors before me all the way back to the american revolution my people served in every conflict and war since.

Now think about that for a min.If you served in the Infantry is your service some how better than the guy who was a cook? no all their service is the same the infantry might have endured more hardship than the cook but just the same the cook served too whos service to our country then is more desirable the infantryman who does most of the the killing or the cook who serves hot food to the troops?or for example I was wounded in action and I was awarded the Purple Heart what about the guys fighting next to me who were not wounded.Am I so how better or more desirable that the guys who were not wounded?Then how about the people who never served? Am I more american or more desirable?
No because we all are AMERICANS ! ALL GAVE SOME AND SOME GAVE ALL AND SOME STILL DO!

NO MORE DEBATE MORSE CODE NEEDS TO GO as a reqirement for any class amateur license!
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators K9SQG  
by WR8D on August 17, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Ref K4UUG...you honestly don't have a clue. I'm only getting into this spew fest to say you should live here. A few years ago when 5wpm came uppon us we were over ran by the freeband types. Pure outlaw with no respect for themselves muchless anyone else. They're extra class now and the attitude got much worse with the license. Maybe you can't believe all this talk because you've just not experianced these people where you live. There's many of us that have had the misfortune of having to live around them as they came into our hobby. Sure, we've always had outlaws...code helped just a little. Listen to some of the nets on 40 meters...many are run by cb types...Rogeeeooooo...understand now?? Good luck, we're all gonna need it. If you have any doubts listen to 3990 some weekends. 73 John WR8D
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators K9SQG  
by K2FIX on August 17, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Is this post a troll, or what ?

A few nights ago, I had to go to a late night business meeting, and then to the airport to pick up friends. I had my wife's car, so my trusty 706 mk2G was not available. I had in the car my ancient Uniden PC-122, an AM/SSB rig. While I rarely get off CB 19, I had some time and figured I'd give it a fair chance. The radio has never been opened, and works into a mag mount Wilson antenna on the roof.

Driving from Nassau County, New York, across Queens and Brooklyn, and ending up at Newark, I managed to have cordial conversations with a few guys on AM 17, and hit a net on 37 LSB, with about eight ops on the lower part of Long Island. Again, all conversations were cordial, some funny or interesting, and none were marked by jamming or profanity. I have heard FAR worse from my morse code knowing "betters" on 80 M.

In Dutchess County, NY there's a net on channel 27, AM in the evenings. Again, cordial and civilized.

Really, if all you notice is the bizarre babble on channel 6, it does make no sense, but if you use the other 39 channels, it really is no worse than any other service.
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators K9SQG  
by WA2JJH on August 17, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
The WORST behavior I have seen has been on GMRS/FRS.
Death threats, QRM with those $%^%*%((%^ signal generators and illegal power.

The QSO's are filled with every curse word invented.
It makes the shows "DEADWOOD" and The Saprono's seem tame.

Yes, ham radio has a few rotten apples. K1MAN and that infamous computer hacker(The dude did a few years in the slammer, and is now trying to get his General ticket back).

The Worst of the CBers, are the dudes that do experiment and/or use Ham rigs on CB. Granted some CB sideband groups are emulating hams(still illegal because they operate close to 10M). They brag of their
nice Kenwood audio.

There are also wanna-be outlaw gangs that brag of their butcher experiments of using two alternators and truck batts. for their filthomatic unfiltered HF amps.

I can always tell if someone is using a power mic. to get ALC compression. The splatter pattern is a dead give away.

However, I do know of many CBers that become decent hams. I elmered a few. Those with an attitude, I will not elmer with an 11 meter pole!

CB can be very handy for those that use it in a legal
manor. Many Police municipalities monitor CB for emergent traffic.

From 6-14 years old I had many CB H-T's. I built FM wireless broadcast stuff too.
My DAD refused to buy me an SSB-CB. I got an National NC-173 for my birthday instead. In retrospect, he did me a big favor.

Some dude I talked to on CB, simply gave me a broken EICO-753 when I got my Novice ticket. Not all CB types are dreadful.

It are the ones that adapt a psuedo outlaw attitude on CB that are more likely to be LIDDY Hams.
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by K8MHZ on August 17, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Let he who is without splatter cast the first stone.

--Bandwidthians 3:12

 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators K9SQG  
by WB2WIK on August 17, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
>RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators K9SQG Reply
by KC2IJI on August 17, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I have heard FAR worse from my morse code knowing "betters" on 80 M.<

::Well, I seriously doubt that. Here's why:

1. 80m is a CW-digital band only. You're not licensed to operate there so I suspect you're not spending much time doing that.

2. The "phone" section of this band is 75m, not 80m. 80m operators will be insulted to be grouped in with 75m operators -- there's a lot of difference.

3. Since 80m is mostly a CW band, and I expect you probably don't use it at all, how would you know what your Morse code knowing betters are saying when they're operating there?

WB2WIK/6

 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators K9SQG  
by WB2WIK on August 17, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
>RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators K9SQG Reply
by WA2JJH on August 17, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
The WORST behavior I have seen has been on GMRS/FRS.
Death threats, QRM with those $%^%*%((%^ signal generators and illegal power.<

::Yeah, that's true. But a lot of that also goes on on the 27 MHz band, plus or minus MHz, since they seem to want to operate anywhere they choose.


>Yes, ham radio has a few rotten apples. K1MAN and that infamous computer hacker(The dude did a few years in the slammer, and is now trying to get his General ticket back).<

::BTW, the hacker did get his license back, and he's a local here in the San Fernando Valley (CA). He's actually a nice guy (Kevin Mitnik) and has never done anything wrong on ham radio, 'far as I know. The fact that he's an accomplished hacker is another story...and he didn't really do much wrong there, either. He's been released, and his license is indeed reinstated.

>CB can be very handy for those that use it in a legal
manor. Many Police municipalities monitor CB for emergent traffic.<

::Some likely do. However, in civilized areas, the police actually monitor the ham bands. Here in southern CA, the L.A. County Sherriff's Dept. maintains a network of VHF-UHF repeaters which are very high profile and available 24/7. They all use the same callsign, and are all "open" to any licensed amateur, and they're better than "911." If you have an emergency, just give a call on any one of their high-profile repeaters (colocated on a 6600' hilltop overlooking L.A.) and you're patched directly into the Sherriff's Dept. for help. Any time of day or night.

WB2WIK/6

 
RE: Of course this article is a troll  
by WA2JJH on August 17, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Gee, you might have terminated the thread!

Perhaps it is the will of LANDREW!

Original Star TREK circa 1968.
Season 2 Episode 06
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by KC5CQD on August 17, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
***"Most people know and understand "CB radio". For the most part, when you mention "Ham radio", you get a blank look. Just a little fact that I thought I should share with you."

May be true where you live. Not the case around here. When people see my tag or notice the antennas and ask and I say "ham radio" the usual next question is "Oh, did you help with Katrina... or 9-11."***

____________

Yeah, it must be where you live because out here in CA, I don't meet too many people that know anything about amateur radio. In fact, they always ask, "Oh! Kinda like CB radio, right?"

Interesting story....

When I tested for my Extra ticket, there was also seventy others there to test for their tech licenses. I was the ONLY person there to test for anything other than a Tech. The reason for the seventy Tech testees was because of the "Big Sur Marathon". Basically just a bicycle race here on the central coast of CA. For some reason the board of the marathon had decided that people involved needed ham licenses.

While awaiting my test results, I sat next to three VERY good-looking ladies. In time we all began to talk. They began to snicker and ask me questions like, "Do you drive one of those cars with fifty antennas on top?", "Do you have a hat with your call letters on it?", "Do you wear one of those fluorescent vests?"

This is the attitude that a lot of people have towards our hobby! Is it always true? Of course not! They were generalizing and honestly I was beginning to take offense to their line of questioning.

I feel that where Citizens Band Radio is concerned, we also shouldn't generalize. Not all CBers are ignorant. I've met many a good operator on the 11 meter band. There are those that are quite content to stay right where they are. For whatever reason.

 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WA2JJH on August 17, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
talk. They began to snicker and ask me questions like, "Do you drive one of those cars with fifty antennas on top?", "Do you have a hat with your call letters on it?", "Do you wear one of those fluorescent vests?" >>>>>>>>>>

VERY INTERESTING INDEED!!!

I WOULD HAVE SAID..... Oh those dudes with the hats and antenna's are just eccentric millionairs"
Ohhh..Are you ladies getting you tech ticket to save on you ultra high cell phone bills!!!!

Ladies..The rest of us are DR's, Broadcast producers and enginners or just hard working Joes's!

Nice dress...I did not know McDonalds had a
cloths line!!!!
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by K4JF on August 18, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
"I don't meet too many people that know anything about amateur radio. In fact, they always ask, "Oh! Kinda like CB radio, right?" "

Yep, occasionally, not often, get that question. I always answer, "Oh, not in the slightest. I had a CB many, many years ago and the only resemblance is that they are both boxes with microphones." That usually leads to more questions where I can explain the range, clarity, versatility, licensing and other differences.
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators K9SQG  
by K4UUG on August 18, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
WR8D NO YOU ARE THE ONE WITH NO CLUE!
THE FIRST 4 LETTER F WORD I ever did hear WAS ON hf amateur radio! I was watching my father operate in a qso with some other ham and another ham broke in and used the most foul language 4 letter f words ect.My father shut off the radio and I asked him what did f*** you mean?My father told me it was filthy language,that my friend was aprox 45 yrs ago as I am now aproaching 50!so much for CW as the desirable filter!
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by W4JBR on August 18, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
The REAL problem with all these demographics is the number of "Active" hams has fallen off drastically. I know here (Atlanta) you can drive around town and monitor all the UHF repeater frequencies and hear very little in the way of activity....I can do a search of my zip code and find dozens of licensed operators within a few miles of my QTH and never hear a single signal.
Sooo, what is the solution? It seems that clubs are so clannish that they don't welcome new members very well, QSO's on 40 and 80 meters seemed to be closed to new folks....We have to stop being so "Closed" to new comers.
Stop by 7.158 any weekday/weekend morning and say hello, our group always welcomes new people.....

Jack
W4JBR
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators K9SQG  
by K4UUG on August 18, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
KAZC3579 the troll that smell you discribed is your breath!
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators K9SQG  
by K4UUG on August 18, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
WB2WIK FCC HOLLINGSWORTH said "If there's a downfall in Amateur Radio, it won't be caused by no-code Technicians or codeless anything else," he said. "It'll be caused by the microphone--no doubt in my mind." WB2WIK In fact In Hollingsworth's view, radio amateurs all too often are hypersensitive and rude,assume the worst in people,rarely give people the benefit of the doubt," Hollingsworth acknowledged that "certain problem operators" remain, but the real troublemakers are rarely the " newcomers " to Amateur Radio.WB2WIK I THINK HE WAS TALKING ABOUT AMATEURS LIKE YOU!
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators K9SQG  
by WB2WIK on August 18, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
>RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators K9SQG Reply
by K4UUG on August 18, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
WB2WIK I THINK HE WAS TALKING ABOUT AMATEURS LIKE YOU!<

::Undoubtedly. It's great to be famous.
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators K9SQG  
by KC9GUZ on August 18, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I was a CBer for several years before i became a ham. I finally decided to go for the lisense a couple of years ago and now i hold a General. I got away from CB because it was dying here were I live. Now almost no one gets on the 40 channels anymore besides a few die hard locals and truckers. I enjoy HF and VHF MUCH MUCH more than i ever did CB radio.. Ill never go back.
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by NL7W on August 18, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
WA9PIE said: "Well, I haven't met a CBer recently who wasn't at least as old as most of us. That said - WE are not the future of ham radio. Recruiting more of US isn't going to be of much benefit in the long term.

What we really need is some way to convince kids that ham radio is more fun than getting their thumbs stuck on a cell phone sending text messages."

NL7W says: Does it really matter how old the licensees are? I am 40 and have been a ham from the age of 15; that is very unusual. I would've never become a ham if I had succumbed to peer pressure of any degree.

Getting kids or young adults involved would be great, but I believe there's far too many other competing interests. Ham radio appeals to a fraction of a percentage as compared to youngsters just 25 years ago (when I became a ham as a teenager).

Face it, ham radio appeals to those with time on their hands -- retired and some middle-aged folks. Marketing types should concentrate their recruitment efforts on those who are near or at the end of their careers and entering retirement -- those with the life experience, money, and time to pursue envolved, technical endeavors.

73.





 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by NL7W on August 18, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
WB2WIK:

Ham-in-a-day types will eventually forever change and destroy ham radio through what we've collectively let happen:

Just a few recent examples:

- Teaching the test using Q&A manuals
- License question pool reductions (less to memorize)
- Removal of all pictorials which included schematics, block diagrams, and symbols from the Tech and General tests (see latest Tech test revision July/August 2006)
- Removal of the Morse requirement

The instant gratification types won't stop here and now -- neither will those who will profit from the "it's easy enough for me to try (and buy) it now" types.

Unfortunately, the bureaucratic and legal types at the FCC today do not understand or care what has happened, and are bowing to business pressures wanting to keep ham radio's numbers growing and equipment, accessories, and book sales up and profitable.

What a sad state of affairs...

 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WB2WIK on August 18, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
NL7W: Well, you might be right.

The harm, I think, is that the "ham in a day" courses result in a license without any actual knowledge.

Which in turn results in 3000 questions a year posted here about "How do I connect up a dipole?" and "Why doesn't my rig transmit any power on SSB?" ad nauseum.

Those kinds of questions were absolutely unheard of when I became a ham through the traditional Novice license system in the sixties. Nobody would ask, because everyone would know. If I had to ask anybody how to adjust a dipole, or install or connect one, I'd have been laughed out of the hobby. Now, it's a routine question.

I equate this to becoming a certified mechanic in a day, and then looking on the internet to find out how to change a spark plug.

WB2WIK/6
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by NL7W on August 18, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Steve, WB2WIK: You're so right. It's obvious we've been around long enough to see what's happened.

73 de Steve, NL7W
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by NOMDEPLUME on August 18, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
The problem we have here in the Modesto, CA area are a couple of rouge HAM operators hanging out on CB and actually terrorizing the locals.

These guys hold Technician class licenses but will tell the average CB operator that they can work all bands and with as much power as they want. One here, Opie, KG6WIV, actually brags about being in the "war zone" on 40 meters. He doesn't even have HF privledges.

Every other word out of their mouth is vulger and they actually splatter on 10 meters 6 miles away from their QTH. They sell 10 meter Export CB radios and modifiy them for the locals and truck drivers. From the sound of their radios, I believe they are HACKS!

These couple of disgraceful hams are giving the rest of us a bad name in the area. No one wants to be a ham here if this is all they can compare it with.

Opie's neighbors have sent recordings of him to Riley Hollingsworth and NOTHING has happened!

As far as I can see Riley Hollingsworth is only sending out about 12 letters a month. A fifth grader could do that in a day.

I say we get a real attorney working for the FCC.


Riley, get off your ass!

 
Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by KB3LSR on August 18, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
While I did attend the HAM-in-a-day class, I did read the entire ARRL "Now You're Talking" book over the course of a week. Also, when I was at the HAM-in-a-day class, I had college finals the next week. I now realize why HAM and CB different. When a CBer gets a CB, they are treated like all other CBers. When a HAM gets a license, it becomes a barrage of downgrading questions about how you tested, whether you know CW or not, and other technicalities that do not actually deal with HAM radio itself, but merely the administrative aspect of our hobby.

Will a CBer answer a possibly illegal CQ (remember, CB is limited to 150 miles, it's illegal to talk further than that)?
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WB2WIK on August 18, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
>Those Dreadful CB Operators Reply
by KB3LSR on August 18, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
While I did attend the HAM-in-a-day class, I did read the entire ARRL "Now You're Talking" book over the course of a week. Also, when I was at the HAM-in-a-day class, I had college finals the next week. I now realize why HAM and CB different. When a CBer gets a CB, they are treated like all other CBers. When a HAM gets a license, it becomes a barrage of downgrading questions about how you tested, whether you know CW or not, and other technicalities that do not actually deal with HAM radio itself, but merely the administrative aspect of our hobby.<

::Interesting observation. But unfortunately, you precisely represent the actual problem, which is you became licensed without knowing anything about amateur radio. The "Now You're Talking" book is a P.R. piece designed to entice people to become interested in the hobby; it doesn't teach anything.

Here's why I write what I just did:

-Every legitimate amateur radio operator everywhere knows that "ham" radio is not an acronym for anything, and thus isn't capitalized -- ever. It's not HAM radio, it's ham radio. Only people who never spent any time at all researching the hobby's rich history don't know this.

-If you've been barraged by people asking downgrading questions, you must have brought that upon yourself, because it's certainly never happened to me. When I first became licensed many years ago (as a 13 year-old), the only negative comment I ever heard was that I had a squeaky voice, because my voice was changing and I sounded like a typical young teen. I heard that comment several times, so I decided to just operate CW for a year or so, until this phase passed. It did pass, and I returned to "phone" operation, never heard the comment again, and got on with life. But never once did anyone ask if I knew code or how long I had my license, because I did know code and sounded like I had my license quite a while -- the result of actual study, and *listening* to good operators using the bands for several months (as an SWL) prior to grabbing a microphone and sounding like a newbie. Most everyone did this "back in the day," and in that respect, "the day" was better.

-Only someone who doesn't know much about ham radio would state, "...whether you know CW..." because there's nothing to know about CW. The question is, do you know Morse code? CW is a mode. It happens to use the code, but a mode can't be learned.

I see you're a law student, and probably pretty busy focusing on that. As a young ham, I was a HS student, then an engineering student, and worked full time as well -- so I know what it's like to be busy. As the father of four and employer of many, I still know what it's like to be busy. But I wouldn't use that as a justification for a lousy attitude.

WB2WIK/6

 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators K9SQG  
by WR8D on August 18, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
K4UUG, again you just don't get it do you. I own a repeater system and had to bring Riley in to ban them from my machines. It's been wonderful here for the past few years not having to put up with idiots. Pitiful foul mouthed types are out there, seems 95 percent of them live here in this part of the country. I don't allow filth on my machines so i made an example of a few and it worked. Now we just need to do the same in some spots on hf. They are honestly out there in "droves" and dropping the code to 5wpm just opened the gate to hell a little. Wait till its gone completely those that were to stupid to learn even 5wpm will get on the band wagon then. Plussssss their good buddies are now on the ve team...all of the assholes will be extra class in a few months. I know this for a fact because i've already seen it start happening here. Believe me!! 73 John WR8D
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators K9SQG  
by WR8D on August 18, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
My name is John Blackburn WR8D and i approved the above message! hi hi I will call in the fcc on any chickenbander type trying to turn my machines into their next 11 meter haven. I have also been known to kick ass and put knots on their damn heads when needed. Sometimes a registered letter from the fcc just isn't enough. Everyone have a nice weekend, John
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators K9SQG  
by WA2JJH on August 18, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Not all that experiment with CB as kids...turn into LIDS!

I do think being a Novice with code privs only, made me a better ham.
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators K9SQG  
by WB2WIK on August 18, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
>RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators K9SQG Reply
by WA2JJH on August 18, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Not all that experiment with CB as kids...turn into LIDS!

I do think being a Novice with code privs only, made me a better ham.<

::I'll bet it did, as it did for almost everyone.
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators K9SQG  
by WB2WIK on August 18, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
>RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators K9SQG Reply
by WR8D on August 18, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
K4UUG, again you just don't get it do you. I own a repeater system and had to bring Riley in to ban them from my machines. It's been wonderful here for the past few years not having to put up with idiots. Pitiful foul mouthed types are out there, seems 95 percent of them live here in this part of the country. I don't allow filth on my machines so i made an example of a few and it worked. Now we just need to do the same in some spots on hf. They are honestly out there in "droves" and dropping the code to 5wpm just opened the gate to hell a little. Wait till its gone completely those that were to stupid to learn even 5wpm will get on the band wagon then. Plussssss their good buddies are now on the ve team...all of the assholes will be extra class in a few months. I know this for a fact because i've already seen it start happening here. Believe me!! 73 John WR8D<

::I hope you voiced similar comments in reply to the RM notice about dropping the code requirement. I know I certainly did, as did thousands of others. They're probably still reviewing all that...
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators K9SQG  
by K4UUG on August 18, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
WR8D "K4UUG, again you just don't get it do you. I own a repeater system !"

NO WR8D YOU JUST DON'T GET IT!

so big deal you own a repeater wow I bet its not used much!
WR8D THERE IS A WORD FOR PEOPLE LIKE YOU
" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man.

FCC Hollingsworth's view, radio amateurs all too often are hypersensitive and rude,assume the worst in people,rarely give people the benefit of the doubt," Hollingsworth acknowledged that "certain problem operators" remain, but the real troublemakers are rarely the( " newcomers " ) to Amateur Radio.

 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators K9SQG  
by K4UUG on August 18, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
"I hope you voiced similar comments in reply to the RM notice about dropping the code requirement. I know I certainly did, as did thousands of others. They're probably still reviewing all that... "


HUM
Narcissistic Personality Disorder

A pervasive pattern of grandiosity (in fantasy or behavior), need for admiration, and lack of empathy, beginning by early adulthood and present in a variety of contexts, as indicated by five (or more) of the following:

1.has a grandiose sense of self-importance (e.g., exaggerates achievements and talents, expects to be recognized as superior without commensurate achievements)

2.is preoccupied with fantasies of unlimited success, power, brilliance, beauty, or ideal love

3.believes that he or she is "special" and unique and can only be understood by, or should associate with, other special or high-status people (or institutions)

4.requires excessive admiration

5.has a sense of entitlement, i.e., unreasonable expectations of especially favorable treatment or automatic compliance with his or her expectations

6.is interpersonally exploitative, i.e., takes advantage of others to achieve his or her own ends

7.lacks empathy: is unwilling to recognize or identify with the feelings and needs of others

8.is often envious of others or believes that others are envious of him or her

9.shows arrogant, haughty behaviors or attitudes

WB2WIK GET SOME HELP!
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by K4JF on August 18, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
"Will a CBer answer a possibly illegal CQ (remember, CB is limited to 150 miles, it's illegal to talk further than that)? "

What "possibly"? ALL CQs are illegal on CB.
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators K9SQG  
by NL7W on August 18, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
K4UUG Said:

"HUM
Narcissistic Personality Disorder

A pervasive pattern of grandiosity (in fantasy or behavior), need for admiration, and lack of empathy, beginning by early adulthood and present in a variety of contexts, as indicated by five (or more) of the following:

1.has a grandiose sense of self-importance (e.g., exaggerates achievements and talents, expects to be recognized as superior without commensurate achievements)

2.is preoccupied with fantasies of unlimited success, power, brilliance, beauty, or ideal love

3.believes that he or she is "special" and unique and can only be understood by, or should associate with, other special or high-status people (or institutions)

4.requires excessive admiration

5.has a sense of entitlement, i.e., unreasonable expectations of especially favorable treatment or automatic compliance with his or her expectations

6.is interpersonally exploitative, i.e., takes advantage of others to achieve his or her own ends

7.lacks empathy: is unwilling to recognize or identify with the feelings and needs of others

8.is often envious of others or believes that others are envious of him or her

9.shows arrogant, haughty behaviors or attitudes

WB2WIK GET SOME HELP! "

NL7W says:

Granted Steve and I have disagreed on occasion, but this time Steve (WB2WIK) is being honest, candid, and forthright. Then you spew this comment? His good, long-standing, and well-known amateur and professional reputation has stood for as long as I remember. But then again, I've only been a ham for 25 years.

Go troll somewhere else... you aren't even worthy to comment here.
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by KC5CQD on August 18, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
WA2JJH said....


{{{talk. They began to snicker and ask me questions like, "Do you drive one of those cars with fifty antennas on top?", "Do you have a hat with your call letters on it?", "Do you wear one of those fluorescent vests?" >>>>>>>>>>

VERY INTERESTING INDEED!!!

I WOULD HAVE SAID..... Oh those dudes with the hats and antenna's are just eccentric millionairs"
Ohhh..Are you ladies getting you tech ticket to save on you ultra high cell phone bills!!!!

Ladies..The rest of us are DR's, Broadcast producers and enginners or just hard working Joes's!

Nice dress...I did not know McDonalds had a
cloths line!!!!}}}

******************

That's very funny but whenever you're NOT A HAM DORK and sitting and chatting with three very pretty ladies, it's quite difficult to be condescending or insulting with your comments. Most of you guys out there will understand that.

I'm so not a ham dork that most hams are shocked to find out that I have a license. These were ladies that I ordinarily would have been "working" for phone numbers. Get my drift???

But....I was loyal enough to my hobby and brethren to set aside my hormones enough to become offended by the generalization of my fellow operators. They pissed me off!!!!!

My point is....or was....that we too get painted with a broad brush. Maybe we shouldn't be the same whenever it comes to CBer's.

Radio is radio. As long as they stay within the law, what the hell do any of us care about the CB spectrum? Except maybe to feel just a little superior.
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators K9SQG  
by NL7W on August 18, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
>RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators K9SQG Reply
by WA2JJH on August 18, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Not all that experiment with CB as kids...turn into LIDS!

I do think being a Novice with code privs only, made me a better ham.<

WB@WIK said:
::I'll bet it did, as it did for almost everyone.

NL7W says:
Mega-Dittos!
 
RE: WB2WIK  
by KB3LSR on August 18, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
If we are being critical (and when aren't we on forms such as this)....

you mentioned I made a grave mistake in capitalizing the word "HAM" when it is not an acronym, I stand corrected. I do not understand though why you signed your message "WB2WIK/6" if that too is not an acronym, then why should that be capitalized?

Sounds like you may just take the hobby a little too serious. Also, I'm sorry if you do not approve of my education method for becomming a HAM, but I did receive my license nonetheless, and since it is what I needed to do to get my license, it worked. I promote use of this book ("Now Your're Learning") to teach the basics (again, I am not an extra, so some of the theory is still to be learned).
 
Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by KE6I on August 19, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I don't have transmit on CB, but I listen now and then, and here in Northern California, if 10M isn't open for DX, CB just sounds dead. Maybe I'll hear one set of people talking on channel 19, but more often I'll tune all across hearing absolutely nothing.

When the band is open, often I'll hear about 75% Spanish speaking stations on CB and maybe another 25% English speaking. Maybe these guys are coming in from MExico, I'm not sure.

I just wonder where are the 'dreadful CBers' -- maybe they sold their radios and switched to the internet, I think.
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WA2JJH on August 19, 2006 Mail this to a friend!

AWW-GEE 58, Somebody broke out a DSM-IV and is pyscopatholing WIK. Not nice!
 
RE: WB2WIK  
by WB2WIK on August 19, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
"RE: WB2WIK Reply
by KB3LSR on August 18, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
If we are being critical (and when aren't we on forms such as this)....

you mentioned I made a grave mistake in capitalizing the word "HAM" when it is not an acronym, I stand corrected. I do not understand though why you signed your message "WB2WIK/6" if that too is not an acronym, then why should that be capitalized?"

::Here's why. An amateur callsign is capitalized as issued by the FCC. Look at your license. Same goes for automobile license plates and many other government-issued identifications. That's why I capitalize it. If the FCC issued it as wb2wik, then I wouldn't bother, and it would be faster to type.

WB2WIK/6
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators K9SQG  
by W5ESE on August 19, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
> Not all that experiment with CB as kids...turn
> into LIDS!

I hope not! If you grew up in the South in the 70's,
many (if not most) of your friends from school had
CB's, and that's where you could chat with them.

> I do think being a Novice with code privs only,
> made me a better ham.

I agree that there was alot that was "right" with
the old Novice license.

There is an excellent article on the ARRL web site,
"The Novice License Helped Shape the '50s Ham
Generation".

I became a ham some 20 years later, but I found
alot in that article that resonated with my
experience as a young ham in the mid 70's.

The article is available at:

http://www.arrl.org/news/features/2006/07/28/1/

I do think we had a much richer experience than
the "Ham in a Day" and "Shack on a Belt" that
seems to be the normal introductory experience
today.

73
Scott
W5ESE
KNU3709
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators K9SQG  
by WA2JJH on August 19, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
DOUBLE DITTO ON THAT!
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators K9SQG  
by NL7W on August 19, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
A large majority of my fond and memorable experiences revolve around my Novice time in '81 & '82 -- before my parents drove me 185 miles to Chicago FCC office for the General.

I could go on for awhile about my experience, but the synthesized version is I met some of the most friendly and helpful hams on-the-air as a teenage Novice -- it egged me on that much more. As a Novice, I build a homebrew 2-ele quad for 15 meters and put up a 40 ft stick of Rohn tower -- I worked DX worldwide. It was pure enjoyment and helped me decide on a career as a teen.

The "One-Day Wonder" Hams and the shack-on-the-belt types will never experience that.
 
RE: WB2WIK  
by K4JF on August 19, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
"I do not understand though why you signed your message "WB2WIK/6" if that too is not an acronym, then why should that be capitalized? "

Because it is an FCC issued radio callsign. Always capitalized, just like WCKY or WNBC.
 
RE: K4UUG  
by WR8D on August 19, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Rick i looked up your profile on qrz and you have my total respect for your service to our country. That although does'nt give you the damn right to call me names. That's where i draw the line pal. If you can't have an intelligent conversation with someone that does'nt agree with you on every subject then you have no business on these threads or amateur radio. Its not my way or highway pal, i was only stating what measures i had to take here to keep my repeaters "amateur" instead of letting them become cb machines. I'm sorry you have the attitude that you do, everyone that has served this great nation does'nt have a chip on their shoulder it seems like you do pal. Many of us also don't take up space on qrz patting ourselves on the back about it either and some of us have given as much as you if not more. Now getting back to amateur radio. If we keep giving it all away then there is nothing left to "work" for. It has no value, then it becomes worthless like cb. If we let those people come into our hobby unchecked with their foul mouths and cb freeband ego's then we seem to become just like them. As dumb as a rock is it would understand this. We all have opinions, some agree and some disagree. We don't act like children though and we're supposed to be men. I can't believe someone that has seen what you've seen in this old world could resort to name calling because someone else does'nt have the same opinion as you. This is life pal, depending on what part of the country you live in you may or may not be having to put up with these types of newcomers to the hobby. We don't live in utopia anymore, everywhere you look there's some dumbass with his or her hand out wanting a free ride. It's only natural the same apply to amateur radio. As amateurs we have to keep our standards up or we "devolve" as we're doing now simple as that. This is life man, people invest time and money and there are way to many responsibilities to look after so it's part 97 and good amateur practice or Riley sends a registered letter to the offender. Another thing too, i've had several phone conversations as well as many emails to and from Riley. I don't need you to "spew" comments he's made to others, to me. If i have a question needing an answer i just call him up and ask for his professional opinion as it applies to my situation. I hope this ends this spew fest you're certainly on a roll. WR8D
 
RE: K4UUG  
by WA2JJH on August 19, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Used to be getting your EXTRA was as good as Earning your First Phone Commercial.

However newbies should be judged on a person by person basis. We had that in my day at ham clubs.

Yes, CB seems abondoned. What is left are Outlaws and Narco-trafficers.

When I work a "minute rice" extra on 20M, I am always warm and cordial. The golden rule is a darn good one!

Repeater abuse is horrible. I can understand where W8RD is coming from.
 
RE: K4UUG  
by THERAGE on August 19, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Looks like a few of you need to get off the pitty pott and get on the air. What a waste of intelligence, or lack there of. :( It doesn't matter if you're a vet, a seasoned ham, or a "ham-in-a-day". What matters is that you'll only get what you put into it. Nothing more and nothing less. Just make sure Ol' Riley doesn't catch you on the air using the same garbage that's used in here.

Keep the beer cold and the tubes glowing.
73
 
Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by KC7QDO on August 19, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I got my start in CB about 12 years ago and now I am a General class.

I rememeber reading about hams helping hams out. I have only witnessed that a few times to be honest. I still dink with CB from time to time and you mention antenna raising you have around 5 people or more and we all would bbq. Someone needs a radio people would come out of the wood work with their backup radio to help out. Ham radio good luck getting one to help if you are the new kid on the block.

Then if you actually talk to the people in CB that like to play radio but don't become hams cause of cost. You make Min wage to about 8 dollars an hour and see the price of your gear in those eyes you can't afford it.

I still know hams that don't have any gear cause of shear price of it all trying to raise a family trying to make ends meet. And the only radio gear that they have is their CB cause that is all that they can afford.

And for emergency communcations I have given up on ham radio cause I to like the other gentleman I have needed help and on the local Aries reapeater in mid after noon could not get help and as soon as I signed clear someone called their buddy and had a nice rag chew. At least on channel 9 on CB you can get help cause around here law enforcment montior 9 mostly in their patoral cars.

Allot of the curtisies that I use today I learned from CB sideband and helping fellow hams no matter how new they are come from the AM operators.

10-4 Good Buddy and 10-9 on the problem with CB'ers being or becoming hams?

Bruce D Horish
(kc7qdo)
Aka WT-1369 and or Mustang
 
Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by KC7QDO on August 19, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
No offense people with this bickering going on it is allot like CB that some of you are dogging on. Hmm makes you think huh....
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by NOMDEPLUME on August 19, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
What do you mean a CBer can't afford to become a ham?

10 meter radio $300.00
modify for 27mhz and peak $50.00
stupid ass noise makers $50.00 each or 3 for $100.00
CB base antenna $100.00
make roger beep louder $50.00
Install new cool blue lights in meter $50.00
Leanyar $500.00
Echo mic $125.00


Shall I go on?

That is not the right way to get sympathy for a CBer.

Give me a couple hundred bucks and I can be on HF phone in less than 2 hours.
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WR8D on August 20, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Ref KC7QDO: My feelings exactly. Are we to just let lawlessness run wild? There have been rule breakers and outlaws since amateur radio came into being. Around here though in recent years the outlaw type coming into our hobby greatly outnumbers us. Freeband cb to extra class amateur license in under six months. Keep the freeband outlaw disrespect and disregard for rules and regs and turn them loose on the rest of the world. Thats exactly what we're doing. Some here and there take a stand against them as i have been forced to do and the rest bitch about it because for what ever the reasons are some of us just will not turn our heads or the vfo and allow them to continue unchecked. I love this hobby and i'll continue to see to it our requirements as amateurs are maintained and respected, "in my part of the woods" as long as i can take a breath. If that pisses so many off they'll just have to be pissed. Its just our society though, looks whats going on in Americia. A small handfull of radicials going to court taking away the rights of the rest of us while we all sit around and work to make the ends meet and shake our heads while it's going on. Well amateur radio is one place where we all need not let that happen. It's just so simple to correct it. We all have the same rules and regs to abide by and they're just about the same world wide. The brotherhood of amateur radio is honestly just about shot. The few of us left that care worldwide need to stick together and like i said if it pisses so many off they'll just have to live with it. Over twenty years ago i decide to get into this wonderful hobby. I feel anyone and everyone is welcome to enjoy it and become a ham. This is the root of the problem though. So many want the amateur license and then change our hobby into "their version of glorified cb". It's as we say here in the mountains "ain't gonna happen", around me. There's many that feel the way i do but won't get on these threads and voice their opinions due to the trolls. I hated to get involved in this spew fest but somethings just needed to be said, we must take a stand! ..73 John WR8D
 
Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by KC7QDO on August 20, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
NOMDEPLUME

I was refering to the few that I know that are still using there 40 dollar cb stock or what they found cheap at a second hand store or was given to them.

The people with the amps are the ones that make it bad for everyone else. Keep in mind that more people than not now adays started out in CB.

When I first started out as a ham I got chewed out from using proper radio procdure that was taught in the Tech book and tested on it. So it is actually a grey area cause around here if you go by the book people get all offended. This is on the local vhf repeaters in the area.

Then again using proper radio procedure on HF is better accepted than on 2 meter fm.
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by KC7QDO on August 20, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
WR8D

I hear where you are coming from there are some jammers and what not up here as well on 2 meters.

The ones that complain about it have nothing better to do. That is not fair to you cause with new rulings they can fine you for that kind of activity if it is continued to be allowed.

And to the ones out there with issues turn on your osolating frequency finder(off swith or knob). And when I last checked every class of license now allows you to have a VFO; so thus therfore use the darn thing.
 
RE:WR8D  
by K4UUG on August 20, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
WR8D like I said before there is a word for men like YOU!
" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man
 
RE:WR8D  
by KC9GUZ on August 20, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I agree with your postings.
I was once a "Chicken Bander" and I got away from it because I simply wanted to get away from the types of people that were involved in the hobby. I just didnt fit in with the typical CB types, you know the welfare, double digit IQ, high school drop outs, live off of the system, types that permeate the service. And besides around here CB for the local scene is dead. Heck, everyone of the good guys that i used to talk to gave up or went ham, and the ones that went ham never upgraded and have abandoned radio altogether. Sad but true. They found out 2 meters wasnt what they thought it was.
I got my general here recently and i love HF. At least on HF you can actually put out your call and someome WILL come back to you (IF they can hear youthat is!HI) and WORK you. I pushed myself to get my code and theory because I just didnt like 2 meters(you know, put out your call and no one talks to you.) that well and 6 meters is too unpredictable for reliable long distance communications.
As fas as letting CBers into the hobby i feel its ok but the troublemakers can just stay out of the hobby as far as i am concerned.
 
Those Dreadful HAM Operators  
by K4UUG on August 20, 2006 Mail this to a friend!

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NOCODEREQUIRED/


join the group go to the files download audio file and listen to title General Class or above CBer's
PROOF REMOVING CW WILL NOT TURN THE AMATEUR BANDS INTO CB radio!


 
Those dreadful Trolls:  
by WR8D on August 20, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
They're everywhere and freak out when confronted by truth. "lol". --... ...-- have a great week everyone! John WR8D
 
RE:WR8D  
by WR8D on August 20, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Ref KC9GUZ, one last post for me before getting ready for the upcoming week. This isn't about code or nocode. It seems lately no matter what the subject is it will devolve into a code or nocode debate. It should be clear to any reader of these threads where most of the problems are, notice how i've been harassed by a nocode. It does not matter what your back ground is or where you came from to get into this great hobby. Just do what ever it takes at the time to make the ticket. Get on the air and enjoy radio. I know many that have come out of the cb bands and are excellent amateurs. On the other hand i'm also aware of more recently coming into the hobby that are honestly trash. You make it what you want it to be. We judge by what we see and hear on the air. This is what defines you as a person, as a fellow amateur and like i said it matters not where you're from. It matters how you act and conduct yourself on the air after you get here. Have a great week "GUZ", 73 John WR8D
 
Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by KC2IYN on August 20, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I have had my tech license for quite a number of years now, and I find the hobby a disappointment. I recently invested heavily in some nice VHF/UHF equipment, because I was tired of the trash on CB. What I heard on 2m wasn't much better. I heard a net controller barking instructions at some bicycle event, I heard another guy call someone a faggot. And I got smacked down several times for using the incorrect terminology. On HF, I have listened in on several contests, and it's like listening to aircraft controller talking. The salesmen at my nearest Ham store are rude and hate answering any type of questions, so I have been buying my equipment mail order to avoid interacting with them. When I go to ARRL.org, and check out the FCC enforcement page, I see too many hams ratting out farmers for electric fence noise. Amateurs are very knowledgeable, and have nice rigs, but they lack people skills.

On the positive side, I loved the echo link repeaters on 440 MHz., WOW! For the most part, everybody was nice, but the conversation is terribly dull and inane at times. So what to do? Invest more money and upgrade to my General? I am force to say , no.
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by NL7W on August 20, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
KC2IYN said:
"I have had my tech license for quite a number of years now, and I find the hobby a disappointment. I recently invested heavily in some nice VHF/UHF equipment, because I was tired of the trash on CB. What I heard on 2m wasn't much better. I heard a net controller barking instructions at some bicycle event, I heard another guy call someone a faggot. And I got smacked down several times for using the incorrect terminology. On HF, I have listened in on several contests, and it's like listening to aircraft controller talking. The salesmen at my nearest Ham store are rude and hate answering any type of questions, so I have been buying my equipment mail order to avoid interacting with them. When I go to ARRL.org, and check out the FCC enforcement page, I see too many hams ratting out farmers for electric fence noise. Amateurs are very knowledgeable, and have nice rigs, but they lack people skills.

On the positive side, I loved the echo link repeaters on 440 MHz, WOW! For the most part, everybody was nice, but the conversation is terribly dull and inane at times. So what to do? Invest more money and upgrade to my General? I am force to say , no."

NL7W says:
I am sorry to hear you say these things. Obviously, if you had a General or Extra Class, your on-the-air choices and opportunities would expand considerably. As you have seen, a Technician Class license is rather limiting -- operationally speaking. Even though, have you considered weak-signal work and station building on VHF and above? With this activity, come learning, accomplishment, goals, and (most probably) some of the interesting people you crave. Weak-signal activity is challenging; stations and operators' abilities can always be improved. For the most part, the same holds true for the HF bands also.

If you cannot build and erect larger antenna arrays, consider roving or portable operations at selected high elevation spots, or join a weak-signal group within your area. There are alternatives to FM and the crowds hanging there...

73.
 
RE:WR8D  
by NL7W on August 20, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
K4UUG repeatedly said:
" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man" CURMUDGEON " a crusty ill-tempered old man"

NL7W says:
What kind of person keeps repeating this? God only knows...

As I stated in an earlier post, K4UUG is not worthy of posting here, for he cannot express himself in a respectful manner. He's just a troll...

73.
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by KC9GUZ on August 20, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Get your Code down and get your General lisence. It will give you a much better vision of what ham radio is REALLY about!!! HF is so much more fun and better than 2 meters. Build a dipole for a band that you like, tune it, get it up in the air as high as you can and talk away! Theres nothing like talking to Spain one minute, and working Nevada the next. The operators on HF tend to be, of the most part, friendlier than what you will find on 2 meters. Usually if you throw out a CQ and someone can hear you they will work you!
I encorage you to study and get your General. I quote a line from "Oh Brother Were Art Thou" from Delmar, "C'mon in fellers th' water is fine!"
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WB2WIK on August 20, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
>Those Dreadful CB Operators Reply
by KC2IYN on August 20, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I have had my tech license for quite a number of years now, and I find the hobby a disappointment...
On the positive side, I loved the echo link repeaters on 440 MHz., WOW! For the most part, everybody was nice, but the conversation is terribly dull and inane at times. So what to do? Invest more money and upgrade to my General? I am force to say , no.<

::Good bye.

This is exactly the problem with the current licensing system. Bring back the Novice and make it 1 year, non-renewable, CW mode only...as it was for many years...and watch this kind of attitude disappear forever.

 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WA4DOU on August 20, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I wouldn't worry too much about K4UUG. He's been a Tech. class licensee for less than 2 years who knows nothing about amateur radio and is a parrot for NCI. He displays little or no self control as you might expect from an ex soldier and I'd suggest that his opinion on any subject about amateur radio is likely to be ill informed. The difference between him and those of us who have been licensed for a few decades is that we knew that we knew very little as newcomers and kept our mouths shut.
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by KC7QDO on August 21, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Well first off I think it is a bit extreme to back to Novice being a one year and cw only class license. From my elmers I also learned that you had to retest every 5 years and that inculdes the CW.

I know technicians that are very professional that have been working in radio for a life time and now retired or close to it are tech and tech with hf.

I know some of you all think with current changes that it is dumbing down ham radio and you are correct to a point. But with the aviablity of digital phones that can act as a ht to surfing the web we need to do something.

There are allot of things one can do technology wise that that is cheaper than ham radio and also in allot of cases not authorized.

We live in a world of text messaging, IM's, and now doing the mp3 thing downloading to your portable phone and don't forget the sattallite phones that are hand held now.

We are in a age were people like me working toward a eltronics technition are not needed to know the engineering math cause of technology we can hit a button and get the answer. In a industrial setting they want it done now not a hour from now.

So put yourselves in the younger ones shoes. You be on the recieving end of being accused of being stupid no matter what field might be in. Not everyone is a eltronics tech and knows or cares to know the math on how and why it works.

What about the computer programers that designed the software you are using are not all hams. Are they stupid or what about the web designers that are in the hobby are they stupid to?

Now I do agree that people need to learn the protocol, procedures, and making the tests harder to upgrade if they do away with the code.

If anything between the whinners about the 5 wpm code, people complaining about hams not being hams cause of the 5wpm code now and being dogged on being stupid for keying up the radio and sharing that you are a new ham with out the decades of experiance needs to stop.

So unless you are a ex-cber like myself a new comer that has no radio experiance tend to not renew. So next time you pass judgment look at your actions and you two will see you are acting like the hashers and trashers on cb that you say you are better then.

Bruce D Horish
The 5wpm general and according many stupid cause I did not have to design a radio for the advanced test like you nor pass a 13wpm cw test.
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WA4DOU on August 21, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Bruce, you'd do more for your cause if you didn't come across as illiterate.
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WA4DOU on August 21, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
KC2IYN, goodby!
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by W5ESE on August 21, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
> I have had my tech license for quite a number of
> years now, and I find the hobby a disappointment.
> I recently invested heavily in some nice VHF/UHF
> equipment, because I was tired of the trash on CB.

> What I heard on 2m wasn't much better. I heard
> a net controller barking instructions at some
> bicycle event, I heard another guy call someone
> a faggot.

That's pretty sad. Around here, the public service
oriented hams on VHF are pretty friendly. You may
need to look around your area to find a group that
you like better.

I agree with NL7W's suggestion to consider trying
VHF/UHF weak signal modes (SSB/CW).

Though another thing to try, that wouldn't involve
any additional investment, is to experiment with
working VHF/UHF FM simplex with the equipment you
already have.

Try doing some hilltopping/mountaintopping, and
see how far you can communicate from higher
elevations.

Experiment with antennas. Build a 2 or 3 element
Yagi to use with your handie-talkie and take on
your excursions.

> Invest more money and upgrade to my General? I
> am force to say , no."

The General license doesn't require investing much
money, mainly effort.

I operate CW about 95% of the time, and the activity
I encounter is almost universally friendly. Learning
CW for my license was the best investment I made
in the hobby.

73
Scott
W5ESE
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by K8MHZ on August 21, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
There is just no way to make Internet Hams happy.

If our 600,000 plus licensee number drops a 1/2 percent it is lamented that ham radio is dying.

Those that refer to the days in which ham radio was king also refer to the days where our numbers were more around the 100,000 licensee mark.

We can't have it both ways. We can't die to the point of becoming king again, now can we?

The cry I continually hear is for the quest to get more people into the hobby. Getting our numbers up seems to be the order of the recent era.

What about some quality instead? Where are those that push for refining our current population? They sure don't exist in number sufficient enough to establish an effective concerted effort, that is for sure.

We put forth 10 times the effort to create Ham in a Day classes than we do to educate and refine existing licensees. Our area pushes very hard to get new Techs (I teach Tech class, actually) but does not have even one Extra Class training session. My friends and I are going to form a study group so we can upgrade, the Extras here have 'topped out' and really aren't interested in helping others it seems.

We have no one to blame for our problems but ourselves. Not the FCC, the ARRL or the multitudes of CB operators. Not cellphones, FRS or GMRS.

LISTEN!!!

What are the complaints about ham radio? It is not about the actions of any of the above, it is the actions and treatment received from LICENSED HAMS.

No one has a right to bitch if they are not making an active effort to improve the quality of our operators. Those that do probably bitch about everything in their lives and do nothing else. How many of us make a concerted effort to help others grow into respected operators?

Making light of their practices on the air does not count. Holding classes, writing articles, chairing events like fox hunts, showing someone how to solder or build a piece of equipment, sitting down with a new NCT and showing off a nice HF station, helping erect a better antenna, locating a noise in a station, explaining the jargon of the bands and why they vary...the list goes on of what should be done instead of whining about how awful our hobby has become.

Getting my license was one of the best things I have ever done. Ham radio is the greatest, no matter what the Internet Hams have to say about it. I was a NCT for over a decade and loved it! I am now a General and love it! I will be an Extra in a few months and will love it! I teach Tech class and love it! I plan on starting a General class and a CW class for those that have a hard time with it, and I will love it!

I would rather have 100,000 hams that are proud of their ticket and take pride in passing on the trade to others than 1,000,000 unhappy crabs.
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WB2WIK on August 21, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
>RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators Reply
by K8MHZ on August 21, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
There is just no way to make Internet Hams happy.<

::Too true.

I use the internet a lot, and participate in these forums and reflectors because they can be fun and educational...I learn something new every day. But I'm also very active on the bands, generally filling up a logbook every couple of months.

Limited operating time on weekends because we're busy with family activities, but I took an hour on Saturday evening to work a little bit of NAQP and made 106 contacts, so there's four more log pages. NAQP is cool because it's like a social gathering, "this is Joe in Georgia" is a neat exchange. Next time you hear the guy, you know his name.

The reason I so highly promote going back to the old ways, using the Novice as an entry-level license (1 year, non-renewable, code only) is that it worked so well. NOBODY complained about how other hams operated, or really about anything, because they were too busy having fun and figuring out how to make their stations worked. Because there was no internet, the only way to figure that out was to either do it by trial and error; or by asking more knowledgeable local hams who you actually knew and could meet; or by going to libraries and doing research. All three of these ways worked great, and most of us used all three.

The "way" today stinks, by comparison.

The reason for ham radio isn't to chit chat using wireless, and use it as an alternative to a telephone. If that's the reason anyone became licensed, of course they'll be disappointed and should lose interest quickly.

The reason is the technical challenge of doing stuff that most people don't or can't do. Figuring out new ways to meet the challenges. Experimenting, building stuff. Trying to work DX when nobody's working any. Trying to win a contest, just to show you're a slick operator and have learned how to do it. Lots of reasons for ham radio, but chit chatting was never really one of them, and when we try to force it to be something it isn't, it's a huge disappointment.

I agree, 100,000 hams who are actually doing something to contribute to the state of the art and the longetivity of the hobby are far more valuable than 600,000 "internet hams."

WB2WIK/6
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WA2JJH on August 21, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I USED MY APPLEII to get my text printed. money for printers was scarce. Printer cost were high.


There was lots of shock and awe, when I would get the expensive printer going at my little brothers school.

A hacker was simply a dude like me that experimented.
Not like Mitnick with his credit card scams, and destroying intellectual property/and GVT databases.

I think a better classification would be.....
F.C.C. testing, and N.F.C.C.T(NO FCC TESTING)

HOWEVER...LETS NOT BE AWARE, that their are many hams
that are good with V.E. testing too.

It is never good to STEREOTYPE.
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WA2JJH on August 21, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
i used internet back in 1978. Does that make me an ''INTERNET HAM'' NO WAY!

A.I. after internet. and B.I. before internet is just too much of a broad stroke for me.
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WA2JJH on August 21, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
,,,,,,Bruce D Horish
The 5wpm general and according many stupid cause I did not have to design a radio for the advanced test like you nor pass a 13wpm cw test.,,,,,,,,,

It is an attitude like that....WE DO NOT WANT OR NEED!!!!!!

THAT IS WHY AMERICA IS LOSSING OR TECHNOLOGICAL EDGE!!!!!

 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WB2WIK on August 21, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
>RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators Reply
by WA2JJH on August 21, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
i used internet back in 1978. Does that make me an ''INTERNET HAM'' NO WAY!<

::Golly, it must have been just you and Al Gore! :)

I think "Internet Ham" is a term for hams who use the internet for their QSOs and really aren't on the air. To me, that's a good waste of the VE fee paid to get the license.



 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by K8MHZ on August 21, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Coincedence???

The first two people to respond to my 'Internet Ham' remark were heard by me ON THE AIR this weekend on HF.

Steve, I heard you work a station on the North American QSO Party on Saturday. I really wanted to break protocal and give you a yell. NICE sounding station. Were you a DJ at one time??

Mike JJH was on the SPG Net on Sunday. I had a decent copy on him but due to local QRM/N he could not make out my call, but I actually did speak with him.

You both have been officially 'Un-Internetted'

73

Mark K8MHZ

 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by K8MHZ on August 21, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Steve,

Speaking of 'This is Joe' did you work Joe Rudi NK7U this weekend? I did and it was my fourth time.

Some of my baseball fan ham friends have trying to get a card from him for years.

The card is cool. There is a pic of him in his Oakland A's uniform on the front.

Now if I could only get Joe Walsh, WB6ACU.....
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WA2JJH on August 21, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I heard Steve(WIK/6) 5/9 A few days ago too. I did give him a call, but I think he QSYed before he heard me. Audio was nice. Was it the TS850 OR the TR-7?
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WA2JJH on August 21, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Back in 1978, it was not called THE INTERNET as we know it. It was a rag-tag group of Universities and Wall street types.

I thought it was DAN QUAIL that said he created the internet. OH WELL..all those politico's all sound the same to me!!!

I was on TELNET at 300 baud back then. I used to get higher marks on my lab reports, because I had dot matrix printed papers.

The originals were a group of Universities and D.A.R.P.A. The only alphabet agency that does not have all the "cloak-dagger" types.
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WB2WIK on August 21, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
>RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators Reply
by K8MHZ on August 21, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Coincedence???

The first two people to respond to my 'Internet Ham' remark were heard by me ON THE AIR this weekend on HF.

Steve, I heard you work a station on the North American QSO Party on Saturday. I really wanted to break protocal and give you a yell. NICE sounding station. Were you a DJ at one time??<

::Cool. Wish you would have yelled, "down 2" or something, I'd probably have heard it and gone to find you. Thanks for the nice "audio" report. You should see my elaborate audio system: $9.95 Radio Shack PTT (hand) mike from 1980, plugged into the TR-7. It always sounded okay, so never thought about changing it...

73

Steve WB2WIK/6
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WB2WIK on August 21, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
>RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators Reply
by WA2JJH on August 21, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I heard Steve(WIK/6) 5/9 A few days ago too. I did give him a call, but I think he QSYed before he heard me. Audio was nice. Was it the TS850 OR the TR-7?<

::TR-7. I use it mostly on SSB, and use the Kenwood mostly on CW, with an occasional jog over to AM. The TR-7's noise blanker is about as good as it gets, so the Drake gets the nod for phone work most of the time. Give another call, we'll work.

73

Steve WB2WIK/6
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WB2WIK on August 21, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
>RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators Reply
by K8MHZ on August 21, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Steve,

Speaking of 'This is Joe' did you work Joe Rudi NK7U this weekend? I did and it was my fourth time.<

::I've worked Joe before. Nice card, as you said.

>Now if I could only get Joe Walsh, WB6ACU.....<

::Joe's been away on tour a LOT lately. Don't hear him much anymore. Damn band is too successful. But if they're back during the winter months coming up, here's a tip: Joe is really active in the 75m AM nets. The Collins AM net is the first Wednesday of each month on 3880 (sometimes 3885), look around 0400 UTC; other Wednesdays at the same time is the AMI net on 3870. Joe checks into these pretty regularly and has a GREAT signal on AM. He's close enough to me (few miles) that I catch a ground wave signal from him, and even that's strong.

73

Steve WB2WIK/6
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by K8MHZ on August 21, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Thanks for the tip Steve!
 
Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by KC2IYN on August 21, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I already passed the code to get my novice licence. So a 50 question test is not a barrier for me. There is however, a significant cost in equipment. In my situation, $2,000 for a good station, that is radio, PS, antenna, cabling, and a meter or two. I have built a number a homebrew antenna's for 2 & 10m, as well as a dipole or two, so I feel I have good basic knowledge of radio.

The response I received to my post exemplifies the problem with Amateur Radio. Many amateurs are hostile, and they do not hide it. Why spend the money just to talk to a bunch of miserable old men?

I would like to send my greetings to Hans van Rijsse, PD0AC, in Holland. My parents emmigrated from Holland, a small city called Deventer, I still have family thier.

Best 0f 73's
Rob
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WA2JJH on August 21, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
<<<<< Why spend the money just to talk to a bunch of miserable old men? >>>>>

Simply unenlightened.

AN INTERNET CHAT ROOM IS NOT ANYTHING LIKE HF OPS ON HAM RADIO, PERIOD.

EHAM IS JUST A SPECIAL INTEREST GROUP.

I guess your not on the air, so you would not know.

With all due respect...MIKE/JJH

 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WA2JJH on August 21, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
,,,,,There is however, a significant cost in equipment. In my situation, $2,000 for a good station, that is radio, PS, antenna, cabling, and a meter or two. I have built a number a homebrew antenna's for 2 & 10m, as well as a dipole or two, so I feel I have good basic knowledge of radio..............

TS-520 OR FT-101 $250-$300 Built in PS
Best antenna's are free. OK 5 bux of wire.

73 MIKE

 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by KC2IYN on August 21, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I bought a Kenwood TS2000, Heil GM5, and a cushcraft 5 ele. dual band yagi (vhf/uhf) march of this year. Previously I had a TS480SAT, TM-G707, yaesu ft7800r. I don't have an elmer to help me, so I have struggled alittle. I bought a G5RV off of ebay that was junk. So I have put my money were my mouth is. Perhaps I sould give it a second chance, radio's are fun. :)

73
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WB2WIK on August 21, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
KC2IYN, if you already have the TS-2000, why do you need a new rig for HF? That already covers HF, and does fine.

Your only investment at this point would be antennas.

$2000 isn't a lot for antennas...in fact, it's not much for even a small tower. But everybody starts someplace, and a small 20m beam on your roof will work lots of stuff, whet your appetitite.

Skill and timing are what makes it happen, and those don't cost anything...
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WA2JJH on August 21, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
The TS-2000 does have an ATU. A beam is best, however
you could experiment around with dipoles and inverted V's. The cost is next to nothing.

W8MHZ made some antenna's out of coax sections.

Check out the elmer section for more advice.

Ham radio is what you make of it. These dread threads are not the best place to get advice.

If this was not a CB vs Ham thread, it would be whats your favorite flavor of ice cream. People would still bicker.
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by KC7QDO on August 21, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
WA2JJH

You are right that there will be disagreements on different threads no matter what the subject.

I feel that it is better to be bickering here than on the air.

I am just glad that to be american and cause of that we can have our own opinions and we don't have to worry about being thrown in prison for them.

But for me anyways it is interesting the wide range of thoughts and feelings on the the topic.
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WA2JJH on August 21, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
QDO, very true. I am glad my passport has USA on it.
I have traveled all over the world. I have seen what
people can get in trouble for.

In the early 1900's the FCC designed ham radio to provide a pool of skilled technical people to advance the art of radio and electronics.

My opinion is with that tradition. I have mixed feelings about newbies. Those that want to help keep Americas diminishing technical edge are cool by me.

Those that just want a multiband 1.8-30mhz CB, I just have very little toleration.

It is America. The FCC will do what ever they want to do. We certainly have a right to our own individual opinions.

I just see lowering standards are a root cause of many problems in general.

I guess everything is relative. There are those that complain about 5 WPM. Took me 4 times to pass 13WPM.
I complained that I had to relearn 4 years worth of physics and calculas to get my Masters a year back.
However now that I have my Masters, I want my Phd.

 
Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by N8QBY on August 21, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Most hams would bitch if they were hung with a new rope. Never seen so many whiners in my life. Maybe the ham bands should be given to the cb'ers. :o)
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by KC8VWM on August 21, 2006 Mail this to a friend!

Your only investment at this point would be antennas.

-----------------

I just outright refuse to buy any antenna's. :)

Now maybe I am not normal or something (ask my wife:)but for some reason I get all weird and excited about the prospect of assembling a simple telescopic 15' painters pole, a cheap camera tripod (yard sale special), a 50 cent retractable camping clothesline reel filled with bare copper wire and a few tent pegs.

Is this morally wrong? Is there a cure for this condition I have?

Total investment - $20 bucks

Commercial "portable" equivalent - $447.00

Oddly enough it's not even close in actual performance. So "NO!".. you don't ALWAYS get what you pay for!

Amount of fun DIY? - Yup, Priceless!

Do you actually learn anything from the experience?

...More than you realize.

Will I build it "lighter, better, stronger..." (insert 6 million dollar man theme) the next time I decide to play and build another antenna project?

...You bet.

Just my 20 bucks on the subject.

73
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WA2JJH on August 21, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
<<<<<<Most hams would bitch if they were hung with a new rope. Never seen so many whiners in my life. Maybe the ham bands should be given to the cb'ers. :o)>>>>>>

I would round house and cresent kick anybody that tried to hang me or "garott" me.

Fot the 10th time a Ham styled chat room is NOT HAM RADIO!

WE VENT HERE....so their is not a body count! HI-HI
PEOPLE JUST DO NOT SEE THE LARGER PICTURE!

What would un--elemered do with HF....produce a cess pole of lids. the DXers would not talk to you.

Considerig that HF rigs can cover TX/RX 1.6-30mhz would produce huge problems, if a multiband CB service was pressed into service.

 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WA2JJH on August 21, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Besides, if your that much into sociopathic operstion. You can purchase a $200 cobra that covers 10-12M. ONE MODEL HAS 150w of class C SSb. So cbers have HF now.

It is their loss. My EXTRA-20WPM ticket opened many doors for me in broadcast TV. Can a HF CBER do the same? N.F.W!!!!!!

WHAT IS WRONG WITH LEARNING ELECTRONICS? IT IS A BIG PLUS.

F.W.I.W. many hams used to land BDCST jobs.
10-4 good buddy will land you nothing.

We worked hard for out tickets. That is something you cannot just take away from us that took the hard road!

You can whine all you want! MY COMPLAINTS MANAGERS NAME IS HELLEN WAIT. YOU GOTTSA PROBLEM GO TO HELEN
WAITE. HI HI.

WE ARE WILLING TO HELP THOSE THAT ''DONT COPA-TUDE"
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WA4DOU on August 22, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Class C is very non linear and cannot be used for ssb, only cw and fm.
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WA2JJH on August 22, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I KNOW THAT CLASS C IS NOT FOR SSB, IT AS A JOKE!!!!
The cheap 10-12M are not very linear. Like Dahhhh!!!!!
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WA2JJH on August 22, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
B.T.W....What is your favorite flavor of ice cream?
Mine is baseball....gotta problem with it!{;
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by KC8VWM on August 22, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
As they say in Joisey, ya gotta problem wit' dat?

It sure beats the taste of a cookie on-a-stick hockey puck ice cream.
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by KC9GUZ on August 22, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Eham and QRzed are just a place for hams to vent off some steam. HF is NOTHING like the forums IMHO. People need to get off the computer and get ON THE AIR. I think the biggest problem is some people get on the forums and see all the negative posts and they THINK the whole ham world is like what they see on the forums. Heres a good example of why ham radio is NOT like what some see on the forums; last night 10 meters was wide open as a barn door, and I heard some ops. in the southern states talking and they were having a blast! Telling jokes and ribbing each other so yes, hams DO have fun on the air to some extent. Not all hams are arrogantly defensive, bitter, old shrews.

Get off the computer and get on the air and work someone.. :-)
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WA2JJH on August 22, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I am on 20M all the time. So drink steak and eat beer!
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by K8MHZ on August 22, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
KC2IYN,

You have a great radio in the TS-2000.

I do not own an HF antenna that I have not built. The antenna that JJH was referring to (K8MHZ, not W8MHZ, that is Selwyn.) was made from discarded coax and it rocks! 39 countries in 12 months at the bottom of the cycle on 20 meters.

You can make many configurations of dipoles with wire and feed them either with coax or balanced feedline. I have found that with my 80, 40 and 20 meter dipoles I get coverage on all bands but 160 using a tuner.

Making antennas is a blast! Especially when they work. It took me several tries to get the coax antenna (search 'double bazooka' on Google) to work but once I got it resonant it was great. Tip: Better long than wrong.

As for Elmers they are there. You may just need to do some networking.

What is the local 2 meter repeater like? Is there a QCWA chapter near you? How about an electronics shop? What are the closest radio clubs or ARES/RACES groups? Who were the hams that tested you? Their calls should be on your CSCE. It may be prudent to contact them and ask to be put in touch with an Elmer.

I am always available by e-mail to answer questions if I can.

Stay curious and have fun,

Mark K8MHZ

 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by K8MHZ on August 22, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
"I am on 20M all the time. So drink steak and eat beer!"

When? I know if we get a cleaner freq we can probably work on 20 around 01:00 Zulu or later.

Sked?
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WB2WIK on August 22, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I'll probably be on around 0030-0130 UTC this afternoon, myself...

20 SSB. If condx stink, then 20 CW. If that stinks, then 30 CW. But I'll be on someplace.

WB2WIK/6
 
Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by W6PMR on August 23, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Yes, I too must admitt that I started out in radio on 27mhz,...and I had a LOT of fun with it.
I got my first "rig" in 1959 or 60, it was made by RCA, looked like an icebox, had a regen rx, and used a speaker mic with a pull up antenna on the top of the cabinet.
I met many friends that I still have on CB, spent many a school night talking into that little glowing box to my pals.
Over the years I learned a lot about electronics and radios playing with CB, It never occured to me to go for a Ham ticket until many years later when a Ham moved in down the block and then let me borrow a Hammerlund receiver.
I strung out a long wire and listened, Wow !
I left CB just as the craze went nuts in the mid 70's, just could'nt take the lingo.
Got my ham ticket in the early 80's and so did most of my CB friends.
Today I have a collection of about 60 or 70 older tube CB sets, the ones I could never afford as a kid and the ones I dreamed of and drooled over in all those catalogs.
My Ham shack has these radios all around the room on shelves, Tram Titans, a complete set of General's a Buddy Base, Golden Eagles, Lafayette's galore, Sonars, Karrs, Pacer's, Olsons, most of the older Johnsons, Most all Hallicrafters and many, many more.
I have been collecting these radios for years and have picked up some of the rarest ones at Ham fests for a song.
The point is I love my Hamming but I never forgot what gave me the interest in the first place and I don't feel ashamed to tell anyone how I got into Ham radio. I look at my collection as I wait for six to open and monitor my net on 80 and it makes me smile.
Paul.
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by KC0YEF on August 23, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
30 years ago I was 12, the 74 gas crisis just over and recently moved to a big city after my Mom and Dad Split I had seen all the CB movies that year
1974 Dirty Mary, Crazy Larry
1976 The Gumball Rally
1976 Cannonball
The Songs "convoy" a fun song "The White Knight" by Cledus Maggard came out near my birthday, and "Teddy Bear" singer Red Sovine's song about a wheelchair bound boy were number 1 hits
Parker Brothers Game, 10-4 Good Buddy CB Radio Board Game had come out and my Dad had a CB radio he was a pirate but he traveled a lot and sometimes needed help locating his next intended sale.

I got my license in 76 but didn't get a radio until Christmas that year Man 0" Man was that cool the channels were expanded to 40 I didnt had uppers and lowers but SSB was unknown to me then, I have over 20 CBs still today including my original Fanon 880DF
I was right next to a highway with an indoor antenna a "humming bird" basically a truckers whip in a PVC pipe with a sliding Gamma match with company information and it was gold.

I assumed a Handle "Lone Eagle" and with my license I was on the air.
The QSO's were brief from that indoor antenna but I felt like I was on the road with the truckers and I myself never became a trucker but I have traveled to every state you can drive to with my trusty CB at my side.

30 years Later I am a HAM and can't wait to see what technology comes up next
73
James
 
RE:NL7W our youth sees it ! The Truth Hurts !  
by K4UUG on August 23, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Most of our youth view of Amateur Radio as a bunch of crusty ill-tempered old men who have poor personal hygine and are the biggest Cheap Charlies.They are right !Hum been to a ham fest ?? Some are sub-human a guy becomes a sk and the sub-humans call the widow about the guys equipment before he is even cold.
 
RE:NL7W our youth sees it ! The Truth Hurts !  
by WA2JJH on August 23, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
K8MHZ.... I am on around 0100utc and 14:00UTC I park my VFO at 14.178

A sked would be cool
 
RE:QSO PSE  
by WA2JJH on August 23, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I WILL BE ON 14.178@16:00-17:00h UTC
 
RE:NL7W our youth sees it ! The Truth Hurts !  
by WA4DOU on August 23, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
K4UUG needs erasing and reprogramming!
 
14.178?  
by WB2WIK on August 23, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
>Re:NL7W our youth sees it ! The Truth Hurts ! Reply
by WA2JJH on August 23, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
K8MHZ.... I am on around 0100utc and 14:00UTC I park my VFO at 14.178

A sked would be cool<

14.178? You sure you want to be there? That's the long-established "hi-fi" eSSB frequency, dominated by guys fooling around with "wi-fi" modulation and mostly running high power. It's QRM Central, most of the time.

I'd pick another spot.

WB2WIK/6
 
RE:NL7W our youth sees it ! The Truth Hurts !  
by WB2WIK on August 23, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
>Re:NL7W our youth sees it ! The Truth Hurts ! Reply
by WA4DOU on August 23, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
K4UUG needs erasing and reprogramming!<

::Or at least a lesson in grammar.
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by KC2IYN on August 23, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Thanks for your kind post. I really stirred up a hornets nest when I said Hams are crusty farts. I just spent some more money at the HRO in New Castle, DE. today $129 for 100 ft of 9913 coax, ouch!, and $49 for a duplexer. I told my XYL that it's still cheaper than a Harley or a boat. In that respect, I'm right. I am ging to fade into the dark now, because I might be talking to y'all in the future.

3's & 8's
Don't forget your roller skates
 
Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by KE7AKS on August 23, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Well I too came from CB to ham radio, but I live in Oregon, and enjoy going into the woods on occasion.
I am a General Class and have 2M rigs in my vehicles and the CB is in them as well. In the woods in Oregon the loggers use CB to communicate when they are comming out with a loaded truck. Usually the intersections in the woods have a plaque with a number on it by each road that forks off....guess what that means. In the woods right-of -way is determined by being up hill, and by the ton. If you meet a rig on a skinny logging road where you can't pass, or turn arround, the CB can save you from being run over, or having to back down to the nearest wide spot.
On most highways probably 95 percent of all those 18 wheelers have co-phased antennas on their mirrors..
That means they likely have CB to let each other know if there is a tire comming apart (making a GATOR, or if they have tail lights out, etc. They also use the CB conversation to keep each other awake during long boring night trips. As a radio user I find it is not too hard to loosen the ham radio bow tie, and chat with truckers, especially if it keeps me awake, and lets me know about (brake tests) accidents ahead. I still hear some local CB side banders on CH37, 38, 39, and sometimes 40 that use better protocol than I hear on 80M and 20M. I have to admit there is a cestpool of noise on some of the channels of CB when you get in the area of most larger cities like Portland OR, and Seattle, but out of the towns most of it fades away. There are other times when CB is useful but you would have to know how to use it. If for instance you get suck in the woods, don't think 2M would likely get help as easily as CB and the loggers. I think we need to remember that 11M is still radio, and it too can be used properly. Children's Band is usually the nick name for FRS. Chicken Band is CB. Just because you use a CB you don't have to act like a Dumb Chicken. In Oregon City, Oregon there is still a REACT REPEATER operating on GMRS CH 19 and I think they use FRS CH1 as a emergency channel as wwell. It is all as good as we make it.
I hear a lot of truckers and CB ers on 2M that now have their ham tickets, and still use it all, even the 800 MHZ Nextel radio at times.

73's Harv KE7AKS
 
RE: 14.178?  
by WA2JJH on August 23, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
REILLY REALLY RILED the HI-FI dudes up in my area.
How about 14.173.
 
RE: 14.178?  
by K8MHZ on August 23, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
"REILLY REALLY RILED the HI-FI dudes up in my area.
How about 14.173."

Steve has to stay above 14.175 and I have to stay above 14.225

Also 40 has been cooperating from time to time. Right now it is great!
 
RE: 14.178?  
by WA2JJH on August 23, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
40m..whats the frequency...Kennith?
 
RE: 14.178?  
by WA2JJH on August 23, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
On 40M@03:10UTC....its hot! I am on 7.195
 
One dreadful Mcdonalds manager in 1973  
by WA2JJH on August 23, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
My friend found an old Lafayette tubed CB. We went to the local radio shack to test the tubes.
We then went to a McD's. Left without the tubes.
Came back 10 minutes later. The manager said he saw the brown paper bag, and threw it out!

We cried bloody murder! He then threatened to give us a beat down if we did not leave.

He had some explaining to do threatening 2 13 year old boys with extreme attitude! The Police were not pleased with the managers public relations skills(or lack there of)
 
RE: One dreadful Mcdonalds manager in 1973  
by W9WHE-II on August 24, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
arrl sees a HUGE potential for cash from converting CBers to hams. membership, publications, fees, etc. Is it any wonder arrl wants to make them hams?

Follow the money. Allways follow the money.
 
RE:NL7W our youth sees it ! The Truth Hurts !  
by W9WHE-II on August 24, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
KC2IYN wrote:

"Thanks for your kind post. I really stirred up a hornets nest when I said Hams are crusty farts".

Do not let the "Politically-correct" speech nazzis censor you!

 
RE: One dreadful Mcdonalds manager in 1973  
by KE6I on August 24, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
>Follow the money. Allways follow the money.

You're in the wrong hobby then. Maybe take up polo or yachting.

CB just seems kind of dead around here. (SF Bay area)
 
Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by FORMER_K0PD on August 25, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I too am a refugee from CB but it took a few year's to decide to be a Ham. My first meeting with Ham RAdio was in the mid 50's and tho it excited me i as a poor kid living in the wrong part of the City felt that i could never afford the Equipment and had no idea you could build your own. Then in the late 60's i again came in contact with Ham's and being of a more mature age the Ham's i met it seemed were snob's and looked down there noses at us common folk's. Then came the CB boom and i jumped aboard and was very happy shooting skip and the CB get together's(Jamboree's). Then some time in the 80's it seemed like the low life's of communication's took over the CB band and i tolerated it untill the early 90's and once again got to meeting Ham's and found them to be a open group and exciting and fun to know and now i'm one and only sorry i had not explored it more deeply year's earlier as i now realize the bad one's i met was just bad luck on my part and tho there still that type around they are a very insignificant part of HAM RADIO...
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by K4JF on August 25, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
" ...the bad one's i met was just bad luck on my part and tho there still that type around they are a very insignificant part of HAM RADIO... "

Excellent insight. You are correct. GL
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by KC9GUZ on August 25, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I too came from CB. In fact Idid the CB thing for a long time before i went ham. 10 or 15 years ago Iwouldnt have even THOUGHT of going ham.. My impression of hams back in 1993 was a bunch of bitter, mean, spiteful,old geezers that never bathed and never knew what it was to smile or have fun.. I though this way about hams for a very long time. A few years ago some friends urged me to get my NCT lisense and get on 2 meters with them. So I did and I soon made freinds with some of the "mean old hams" and soon found out they were not as bad as I thought. But I soon got sick of operating on just 2 meters and decided to save my $$ and I soon got a nice, used, Icom 746. I soon discovered the magic band, which is 6 meters SSB. I operated/operate on 6 meters, and had a blast making contacts and getting QSL cards. Here recently, I upgraded to General and am discovering how much fun the HF bands are. I just installed a GAP titan DX in the back yard and a 80 meter doublet for the lower bands and I have been having a super time. Im not on 2 or 6 as much as I have been since getting my General, but I still check into the 2 meter nets from time to time. Ham radio is what one makes it to be.

I am only 32 years old and enjoying ham radio!!

73 Eric KC9GUZ
 
Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by KB2FBI on August 25, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
CQ CQ de KB2FBI

Might I offer a different take? The proposition might be better stated, "It is not where a man comes from, but where he is going." I say if a man wants to be an Amateur Radio Operator, good for us. Welcome to the ranks. So then, why disparage his path when he shows up at our door? Are you saying, "All Amateurs are equal but some are more equal than others."
Why all the vitriol? The guy shows up and wants in. Good enough for me. He wants to use the PUBLIC airwaves the same as we do. Just what is the complaint? He's "not good enough!" because, why?
Just listen to yourselves! The words like, "those people" or "they're all" are really passé.
Do we now have a uniform to wear or have a secret handshake to be able to identify ourselves from, "those other people?"
I do see a camouflaged complaint from the "CW forever" holdouts. To those I say, "Elvis has left the building!" That issue is Res Judica. What is it with CW? Is it, "When they pry the paddles from my cold, dead fingers!" If you still are unhappy and insist on CW, then at least be consistent. Use only, a radio that "Glows in the dark!" Tubes only. Plug in coils, got to have them and nothing else. Then, drive nothing in the way of a vehicle that has air conditioning. "In my day, we sweated!" And, no more automatic transmissions! To get a drivers license, you should be competent with a manual transmission. No more microwave ovens. Microwaves don't exist in your Amish version of Amateur Radio.
It is not where a man comes from. That's in the past. He wants to be headed along the path with us. Despair him not. Welcome him into the world of Amateur Radio. It is a hobby, not religion. If the state of the hobby is not like it was back when you built your first spark gap generator, well we can Thank the Almighty for His allowing us to "see" the World over a piece of copper wire.

de KB2FBI -.-

QSL via Pony Express
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WR8D on August 26, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I might add to this, its not where a man comes from..i agree its his or her past. Its how they act after they get the amateur license. I've said this dozens of times...how you conduct yourself, what you allow us to hear on the bands, this is the factor that defines what others will think of you. Many of the weird acting you see here act exactly this same way on the bands. Amateur radio is world wide, why anyone would want to make a fool of themselves infront of the world escapes me. I'll also agree it matters not what the subject is the code or nocode debate will always be brought up. Code did not filter out all the weirdo's...it did help just a little. Not till after it was dropped to 5wpm did i see the trash in my area arrive on the scene. The most abundant of it is the freeband filth mouthed cb type with honestly no respect for any rules much less themselves or others. If we don't maintain our past traditions and at least keep the requirements for a license above the six year old level we'll devolve as anyone active can already see happening. Its not about code...or quantity "tnx to arrl"...it's about "quality of the character". We already have a cb band, lets not allow the riff raff from there, to turn our amateur radio into "their" version of glorified cb. Why is this so hard to understand for so many??? Just sit back and give it a thought...dial around on your favorite band and anyone will see what i'm talking about. I'll agree we've had weirdo's since amateur radio came into being. Riley has told me personally the most complaints he has are against older advance and extra op's...but it's getting worse like here in my part of the country...and its not the older op's this time. It's like a nice gentleman emailed and stated.."cb on steroids". Where's the amateur spirit, the good will toward one another??? It left when they started using their cb handles instead of their hamcalls and doing this just to piss off another amateur operator on frequency. It left when they arrived wanting fancy amateur gear to put the mars mod in and run an icom pro3 with an 8877 amp on the cb band just so they can brag to their other cb buddies who are waiting to be practically given a hf license. Pretty soon this won't be a mistery to so many. Everyone will get a taste of these types then you'll understand why so many of us speak up on these threads about it and put up with the flamers. Come to amateur radio and enjoy the hobby, don't try to turn it into your version of cb radio. There's still plenty of us around that love this hobby and i promise you it won't be allowed to be turned into your version of cb. If this shoe fits then wear it. If it does'nt apply to you then just get over it. Some of us care enough about "your" amateur radio to be doing something about it. 73 John WR8D
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by AE6RO on August 26, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Hey! why have cars at all? Let's go back to oatburning horse and buggies!
You make a lot of compelling points and I think you're getting the hang of it.
And you're right. Tubes ARE better and competence with an manual transmission ought to be part of the driving test (only half in jest.) CW does have technical advantages over any other form of radio communication. Narrower bandwith, and it cuts through interefernce. Didn't you see "Independence Day" CW saved the world!
73s, John AE6RO
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by W5ESE on August 26, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
WR8D

> I might add to this, its not where a man comes from
> ..i agree its his or her past. Its how they act
> after they get the amateur license. I've said this
> dozens of times...how you conduct yourself, what
> you allow us to hear on the bands, this is the
> factor that defines what others will think of you.

Well stated.

73
Scott
W5ESE
KNU3709
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by K4JF on August 26, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
"If you still are unhappy and insist on CW, then at least be consistent. Use only, a radio that "Glows in the dark!" Tubes only. Plug in coils, got to have them and nothing else. "

Silly comparison. Tubes and CW have nothing to do with each other.
 
Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by KB2FBI on August 26, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
CQ CQ CQ de KB2FBI CALLING CQ

I knew it. I just knew it. Read over the postings. The arguments have little to do with anything rational. The "hidden" don't take my CW away! Fear is ever present. Let us, for the moment table the CB person coming into Amateur Radio. What then of FRS/GMRS users? They're a bunch and I find some operating with, shall we say, "Excess amount of RF energy beyond the bounds of their license class." Might they become Amateurs? It really is a Red Herring to pick on the 11-meter band users. That is just a pretense to keep out those who are, "not like you."
If, it is as I suggest, a remnant of misguided souls who insist upon the licensing requires expertise in an obsolete technology, then suggest or propose an FCC rulemaking requiring every Amateur to retake an pass a CW exam yearly in order to maintain a license. Let us collectively insist on 1930's technology. Take this simple test: listen to Amateur Operators talk via 20 meter phone or 80 meters and especially on the local 2 meter machine, and you will hear, I kid you not, grown men talking in CW. Admit it. You often hear people talk each other and say, "Fine business Old Man (FBOM)” and "73" and "QRT, QSL (for ‘yes’ - agreement) and the all time favorite, "Hi Hi". Hi Hi? Can't we just laugh? Or say, "That's funny!" It is voice communication. But, those CB people with their "jargon." We will have to retrain them, QSL? Hi Hi!
Staying on point, it is NOT their background. "CB or not CB that is the question!"
Oh, and one more lampoon. The yesteryear crowd: No more VEC's - travel to an FCC office should also be insisted on. And also, surrender all those vanity call signs you sucked up. A 1x2 call was a badge of honor. You must be consistent or you reveal that your argument is simply nothing more than - watching the calendar turn and hating everything that changes. Including the tiny world of Amateur Radio Operators.

de KB2FBI/5 kn

 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by KPQ0983 on August 27, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
You all have interesting veiws of the past,and yes,alot of the hams were and some still are CB operators,mostly on the CB sidebands or operators on the free~band's called freebanders. I began in the Mid~60's on the CB band as a teenager,i built my first CB Heath~kit,you all know the old heath kit,with one socket on the front of the CB,you buy each Crystal for transmit,with aTuneable receiver,and we boughteach crystal separately,and thelittle crystal mike with no pushto talk on it,the CB heath~kithad a flip~paddle for on and offoperation on the front of the Heath~kit,in fact,the local Hamoperators helped me put the CBHeath~Kit togeather,I attendedthe Ham club in the Light~houseon the edge oF Lake~Erie in Dunkirk New York,upstate New YorkState,I learned alot from the Hams Later I got my own CB licence,includeing my-XM-Canadian Licenseto operate in canada while visiting on Vacation in canada. Yep,and during these old days, the Battle oF S~9 magizine withthe CQ Ham magazine was going on,LOL those were the old days. I later became a member oF theCitizens React,Helping out Dutiesfor the Benifit oF emergenciesin our community,and the otherCB'ers that needed Emergency Helpon the Road and in our local communities. Then I became part of the CivilAir Patrol helping out in the rescue operations. Yep,I'm one oF those Old CB operators,but the Differance is,I talk about subjects,and not people,thats the secret oF talkingresponsible,and i educate theyounger operators so they willbecome good responsible cleansounding Radio operators. Today,we all still use Ham andCB Radio for communications whenthe Hurricanes hit Hard SouthFlorida,because the Cell phonesdie,the micrwave towers go down,theres no other means oF communications,the regular Phonelines are down,the Electric isDown,we use car batteries forpower and mobil units for the onlymeans oF Communications. We guide the Relief Truck~driverson channel 19 on the right roadsto get our community suppliedwith food and water during thehurricane season,we tell the truckers which roads are open,andguide them in and on the backRoads to get the Emergency Bottledwater and Gas and food deleiveredto our local stores. So Yes,CB and Ham operators pulltogeather in times oF need. I spend time with the old Hamoperators too,they have the manytricks of the Radio Trade,and whenthey Die,there many years oF knowing the Short cuts and theTricks of the radio's die withthem. and yes,some oF them arestill carrying there old generations resentment about theCB Band taken away from the Hamsmany years ago,most of the realOld timers are passed`on,but it'sour responsibility as the BabyBomer generation to train thenew comers,because the new~comerswill someday become the Hams oFTommarro. The Real reason why CBers don'tbecome Ham operators,is becausethe FCC tends to get Thierrevenue from fineing some of the ham operators,and CBers don'twant the fines and be punishedfor working to get a Ham license,and some of the real Old Hamoperators that don't encouragethe CB operators with good positive attitudes so that CBerscan want to become good Hamoperators. Some the Test requierments to become a ham operator is what turn~off alotoF CBers,including out~Dateduseage materials,such as the morse-code,and related requirements most CBers Deem asjust plain unneeded or not usedout of date requirements,and theHigh cost of Ham radio Equipment. but in all honesty,if you allwant the real truth,this is whyCBers tend to shy~away from becomeing Ham Operators. Its good that we learn theory,and proper radio operation ofthe radio and antenna operations,but this id why ham is declineingand the ham manufacturers feelthat money pinch,While Cb is onits way back in large numbers too. Check the sales of the manufactures,that alone will tellyou the truth,CB is on its wayBack in,and if Ham is to survive,there has to be certain Changesto get those CBers into good Hamoperators. Venice,Florida,HurricaneAlley South Florida "BILL"
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WR8D on August 27, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Ref KB2FBI: Hi Hi, time honored ham laughter. Qrt, Fb all that other stuff comes straight off the cw bands. These are just shortcuts so the cw operator doesn't have to spell it all out. We do simply laugh as you ask but if the other operator says something funny how else let him know you're enjoying it other than the time honored Hi Hi...kind of dumb to sit there and look at the keying device and laugh and not let the other operator know you're having a good time. How did all these shortcuts find their way over into the phone portions of the bands? Who knows, there's no need to use them on any phone band but most of us use them so much they just slip out when we're on ssb, and they wear off on others that you talk to or listen around and hear them. It's no big deal. WR8D
 
Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by KC2IYN on August 27, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
If I take my general written test, do I still get credit for the 5 wpm I took years ago when I got my novice ticket? Previous to the recent license restructuring, I was a tech+.
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WR8D on August 27, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Ref 0983: around here you'll get the pants cussed off you trying to elmer one of those guys. Most of them just want the ham license so they can call up AES and buy a fancy ham rig and big ole 8877. They put the mars mod in the rig and stay on cb. Makes a real fancy freeband radio. Imagine how envious your other cb buddies will be of your station, and my oh my what it does for that ego. Here the ratio is one in ten. Honestly only 1 in 10 in recent years has any intention of bettering themselves and becoming respectable amateurs. Many of them are in the process of trying to turn some little portion of the hambands into "their" version of glorified cb. Thumbing up any band and they are easy to find. They kind of stick out like a sore thumb. Again it's not where you're from, its how you act after you get to the amateur ranks. It's not the mode either or the lack there of that defines you, its the picture you paint after you get the amateur license. WR8D:
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by W5ESE on August 27, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
> If I take my general written test, do I still get
> credit for the 5 wpm I took years ago when I got
> my novice ticket?

I believe the answer is yes; if you held a Novice
Class license or a license actually labelled 'Tech
Plus'. The CSCE's (Certificates of Successful
Completion) are only good for one year for upgrade
credit, but a license that required the 5 wpm
element will give you credit for that element
indefinitely. It will help if you have one of
your old licenses you can bring with you to the
exam session.

This is my understanding of how it works, anyway.

You can find the answer more definitively at:

http://www.arrl.org/arrlvec/grandfather.html

73
Scott
W5ESE
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by W5ESE on August 27, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
> KB2FBI
> If, it is as I suggest, a remnant of misguided
> souls who insist upon the licensing requires
> expertise in an obsolete technology, then suggest
> or propose an FCC rulemaking requiring every
> Amateur to retake an pass a CW exam yearly in
> order to maintain a license.

No sweat.

And in order to maintain one's status as a High
School graduate, maybe we should require everyone
to pass annual exams on MacBeth, Hamlet, and
Pygmalion?

Makes about as much sense.

73
Scott
W5ESE
 
Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by KB2FBI on August 27, 2006 Mail this to a friend!

Alas for naught.

We started this QSO with the question of recruiting Amateur Radio Operators (I dislike the term, "Hams.")
It was posed that a possible pool of candidates might be found in the 11-meter gang. Then, as I pointed out originally, it decayed into anecdotal (and apocryphal) stories of a "CBer who did such-and-such." It then went further astray into the old mantra of, "CW made me the man I am today." And the usual barrage of how "they" must learn this and that and come up to our "standards" which of course, required that they listen to CW tapes, and decode the long and short, pass the tests and never use it again.
In the usual photographs Amateur Radio Operators post in QST, here at eHam, on their own websites and so forth, what do you see? A desktop and often greater, stacked with grayish communications gear, the odd computer, a D104 for posterity's sake, and often "wallpaper". Are there no humans in this hobby? Oh yes, there's one. A guy, sitting in FRONT of the desk stacked with radios! Hooray! I can sometimes see a bug somewhere on the right (most of us being right handed) and almost never a straight key. (There's a joke in here somewhere but I demur).
Too bad because one of the activities I enjoy is straight key night. I sometimes get the odd and funny message of, "try using your other left foot!" replies.
This thread started as a way to recruit more participants and quickly devolved into "us and them." The stories about 11-meter operators are mostly stuff of legends. The debasing activities of Amateur Radio Operators are documented in the FCC enforcement logs: (What a hoot! The 6 land repeater wars, the K1MAN saga, the false club trustees and the hoarding of call signs, I look forward to reading it in QST.)
Almost always, the CW forever crowd and their allies the “do it the way it was before the War" crowd, always jump in to the discussion. You are eagerly sought, especially by me. The great, "wrecking ball of logic" smashes into you again and again. The simple logic is that no one wants to take away your CW but you must also release your now silly hollering that it somehow is the gatekeeper of not only Amateur Radio but also persons of a better quality of character.
Just to put the icing on this, or should I say, "tie the ribbon" you may try the archive.org site (great repository!) and view several films on radio communications. One is "Your Career" 1940 educational film for H S students, that there is a bright future in Radio Communications. One of which is the radio operator job with their FCC First Class licenses. It shows them pounding the brass to communicate with ships at sea. Small segment. It concentrates on how phone is more often used because, "after all, this is 1940!" In those years, they even mentioned television as a future career. So, in 1940, before Pearl Harbor and the Sinking of the Reuben James, etc., phone was the future of radio. 66 years hence, most people would guess that CW is "country western"; no ships at sea use it. The Navy and Coast Guard have long since stopped monitoring "on 500" for distress calls. Nonetheless, the fear-gripped few wish it were 1940 again. It is okay to be nostalgic, it is illogical to insist on admiration and recognition because we mastered a skill that no one finds noteworthy other than a few other hobbyist who think it's nice.
My son at Fort Bragg can pick up his 1/2 watt 800 MHz full duplex digital radio, and talk with me and add his sister in Monterrey Mexico to the QSO and when needed, he can send "packets" of voice, data and images as well. I can sit him down, show him the brass key or the paddles, and try to impress him with some DX QSO amid the QRM/QRN and tell him he too can step back in time and be "allowed" to do so if he is the right sort of guy - being defined as someone who can "hear" and translate those ons/offs into something meaningful. All this without a phone! How exciting! And, sending the data mixture mentioned previously that he sends via the "net" anywhere in the World at the speed of light, he is not "allowed" to use low power RF over a backyard piece of wire, because he doesn't "know" 1940's and earlier technology. He is in combat with low-light and night vision optics, with laser designators while he is connected real-time to a secure digital voice network that allows him to integrate with his mil-spec laptop and also enables him supposedly, to talk (there's that word again) to anyone else all the way up to the President. Too bad. George W missed the sked because he was working forty meter Morse with P M Tony Blair during a band opening.
Make sure you have your 7 element tri-banders aimed awkward so you can tap out a few characters to those people in SPACE.
Me? I recommend that we require not only CW as a requirement but also semaphore flags (boy scout you know) and the Aldus lamp as well. Joking? Not really. If you still want to REQUIRE a 20 WPM certification, then you HAVE to agree to the others as well. Caution: don't let your blanket catch fire on your next sked.

de KB2FBI/5 kn

 
Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by ACBER on August 27, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I have been a SSB freebander for 20 years. I got my novice ticket way back in the olden days. I made a genuine effort to pound my fist on the novice bands, but I went back to freebanding because I had voice priviledges there. I have worked almost the entire world on 11 meters, Russia, Isreal, Poland, all of Europe, Austrailia, Japan, to name a few. If I had more liberal voice priviledges back then, I wouldn't have gone back to pirate radio. Back then, I had a HR-2510, but now I have a Icom 746 pro2 (mine works fine, no IC151 problems), and I have a 3 element maco beam on the flat side. I am happy to hear the second reverse sun spot has appeared, and I am looking forward to working the world on 26-27 Mhz. The real question is, do I need ham radio?
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WB2WIK on August 27, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
>Those Dreadful CB Operators Reply
by ACBER on August 27, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I have been a SSB freebander for 20 years. I got my novice ticket way back in the olden days. I made a genuine effort to pound my fist on the novice bands, but I went back to freebanding because I had voice priviledges there. I have worked almost the entire world on 11 meters, Russia, Isreal, Poland, all of Europe, Austrailia, Japan, to name a few. If I had more liberal voice priviledges back then, I wouldn't have gone back to pirate radio. Back then, I had a HR-2510, but now I have a Icom 746 pro2 (mine works fine, no IC151 problems), and I have a 3 element maco beam on the flat side. I am happy to hear the second reverse sun spot has appeared, and I am looking forward to working the world on 26-27 Mhz. The real question is, do I need ham radio?<

::Evidently not. And for certain, ham radio doesn't need you.

 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by ACBER on August 27, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
(The real question is, do I need ham radio?<

::Evidently not. And for certain, ham radio doesn't need you.)

I am willing to bet that many hams break the speed limit, run yellow lights, have unpaid parking tickets. If you talk on a GMRS walkie talkie without a license, you're an HF pirate. So get off your high horse. Ham radio needs people like me, I have the knowledge and the will, and I have the proper appliances, HI HI.
CQ CQ CQ DX
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by AE6RO on August 27, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
"Oh brave new world, that has such people in it!"
1). Which play is this from?
2). Which character uttered this immortal line?
3). who wrote the play?

If you can't answer you will have to attend your high school reunion.
It's a hobby, it is supposed to be FUN!
CW forever! AE6RO
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WA2JJH on August 27, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
,,,,,,,, If you talk on a GMRS walkie talkie without a license, you're an HF pirate. ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

yo, like dude......GMRS ARE 14 CHANNELS IN UHF!!!
HF IS 1.8-29.7MHZ. You have you freqs really freaked, by many octives.

I will not be mean. However you have proved how much
you have to be enlightened!
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by AE6RO on August 27, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
That <archive.org> site looked interesting but I couldn't find the movie you referred to, "Your Career."
I was wondering if you could please say which subheading it was under, such as "filmocracy?"
Thanks. 73, AE6RO.
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WA2JJH on August 27, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
MR A-CBER, you are the quintencial example of a CBer, that cannot even answer the first question on many entry level exams.

The FCC CREATED HAM RADIO TO PROVED A POOL OF TRAINED
(OR WILLING TO LEARN) PEOPLE TO ADVANCE THE STATE OF THE ART OF RADIO AND ELECTRONICS.

That question can be found on many old NOVICE OR NCT TEST'S.

SO why dont you add a 200W linear to your HR-2610, AND just freeband, and be caught!!!

You may also find an excellent job as being a snot radio op for NARCO-TRAFFICERS.
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by KC0YEF on August 27, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Wow,
the full gambit of comments.

bottom line
when there is an emergency you can count on a lot of hams cbers and citizens in general...
UNtil then we'll argue and disagree
73
and GN
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WA2JJH on August 27, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Many CBers become good hams. As for getting off a high horse....the only martial art that has been proven for that is AIKIEDO.

Also those highly published freeband ''keydowns'' are infiltrated by the alphabet agencies and some hams.
There are list's. the last time I eluded to publish said list's, the EHAM staff asked me not to.

The alphabet agencies do not need illegal traffic from us loyal Americans.

Do you ever think that your illegal activities indirectly support terrorism?

I hope to see your 746 PRO-2 at a GVT confiscation sale.
I am sure I will have to pay more money for it than the Crack head that stole it for you!!!!!!
 
Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by KB2FBI on August 27, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Ta Da!

It happened. When all else fails, including rational thinking and scientific method, then comes "When all else fails, CW gets through!" I know it was hard to sit on that for this long, so I applaud your self-control.

Now, let me get this straight. Somewhere, someplace, nobody knows for sure, (In a Galaxy far, far away...) radio contact could be made, but SSB was a no-go. RTTY, was a no-go. AMTOR also a no-go. But then, out of the desperate crowd there rose a mighty sound! It was a "Ham" and he had with him, a straight key! "We're saved!" the women cried. The men applauded as he tossed a copper wire over a branch. With some seat-of-the-pants tuning, and a prayer on his lips, he started tapping out, CQ CQ. Slowly at first then quickly speeding up to over 20 WPM. The crowd knew he was a HAM! They tossed their cell phones away. The GPS and satellite phones, were condemned to the ash heap of history. Because it was clear to all that when the chips are down, "CW will always get through!"

And they all lived happily ever after.

Tongue in cheek all the way. So no offense meant. But that is the story we pass down regardless of clear and simple truths to the opposite.

Science, logic, reason. So, maybe on the Titanic that story MAY have some believability but .... a scientific study with a control group?

And, don't but butter on a burn! Regardless what your Grandma said.
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WA2JJH on August 28, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
KB2FBI....NICE PRO'S!!!! Good to see "G' men and 'company men' in ham radio. Simply outstanding!

TA-DAH, one just never knows the quality people ham radio attracts.

Better a ham, than a CB wanna-be outlaw RF mutt/perp.
Nothing wrong with being a lawfull CBer.

Those 11M outlaw gangsta wanna be's do not even got their physics straight!

They claim they all "KEY DOWN'' with a phased ERP value of Mega-watts. However they are all out of phase, so their intentional EMI is mostly concelled out!

See that MR CB Skell, you just might get caught!
I have always got great deals at GVT confiscation auctions. The 756 pro-II on 11M, what a waste!

73 KB2FBI....keep up the good work and be safe!
DE MIKE WA2JJH
 
Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WS4Y on August 28, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
As someone mentioned the CB freqs used to be an amateur
band. I am wondering if we can legally operate cw at
the 5 watt level on these 11 meter freqs? As QRP is
at or below 5 watts the QRP cw ops might have another band just for the taking. I would like to know what
rule prevents us from using our amateur call and
operating in this manner on 11 meter cw? Maybe even
get the ARRL to issue a special WAS certificate.
Think of the possiblilties!
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by K4JF on August 28, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
"As someone mentioned the CB freqs used to be an amateur
band. I am wondering if we can legally operate cw at
the 5 watt level on these 11 meter freqs? As QRP is
at or below 5 watts the QRP cw ops might have another band just for the taking. I would like to know what
rule prevents us from using our amateur call and
operating in this manner on 11 meter cw? Maybe even
get the ARRL to issue a special WAS certificate.
Think of the possiblilties!"

Neither CW, or Amateur calls, are authorized on 11 meter band.

Only AM and SSB are authorized emissions on CB, and 11 m is no longer in the list of frequencies authorized to ham operators.
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WA2JJH on August 28, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I do remember when some of those cheap CB walkie talkies had a CW key. However they were 100mw toys.

I see the new FRS radio's have all sorts of stupid signal do-dads..

I guess with toy H-T's one code practice CW across the street with a friend.

I have seen CW transmitters that transmit on the AM radio band. In certain parts of the LF spectrum unlicensed seem to get the nod. A 555 timer/osc and a 2n2222 is the TX. Range is ultra limited.

I guess if your transmission is limited to less than hundreds of feet,(OR MICROVOLTS/METER) one could practice CW. I am rusty, I think those are considered part 15 devices. Please correct me if I am wrong.

However with full power GMRS and 5W CB, CW IS ILLEGAL.

We used to use audio code pratice oscillators to practice CW TX. For RX, IT WAS W1AW'S GREAT CODE PRACTICE AT 5,7,10,13,15,20WPM.
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by AE6RO on August 28, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
DA da Da da! Da da da da DA! The story your are about to read is true!
The radio operators on the TITANIC used SPARK Morse to summon aid since CW had not been invented yet. And 753 people were saved when the Carpathia's op heard the call and sailed to help.
In "Independence Day" movie, the aliens had jammed every other mode of communication. When the Good Guys found out how to destroy the alien ships, they used CW to tell whoever was left in other countries how to do it. In fact, the hero who gave his life to destroy one ship was a CB operator.
The simple truth is that we are so dependent on communications satellites and the Internet for everything from bank transactions to buying overpriced gas that if someone toasted them, we'd have alot more to worry about than getting help with CW. Like buying groceries, or ammo to keep our hungry neighbors at bay.
It's just a hobby. I know from experience what CW can do but hardly expect to save the world with it. We have to depend on those professionals who are paid to use overcomplicated, unservicable gear that doesn't work.
73s, John AE6RO
 
Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by N8QBY on August 28, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Food for thought....Many 2 meter repeaters us a courtesy tone at the end of the transmission. Some CB'ers use a "Roger Beep", at the end of their transmission. Ham operators like using their radios to talk long distances. Alas, some CB'ers like using their CB's to talk long distances. See, hams are just a fancy licensed CBer. Everybody celebrate, and join in for one big group hug. Have you hugged a CBer today?? :o)
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by W9WHE-II on August 28, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
The ONLY thing seperating us from CB is the standards. Take away the standards and we WILL be CB.

 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WB4M on August 28, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
"I am wondering if we can legally operate cw at
the 5 watt level on these 11 meter freqs? As QRP is
at or below 5 watts the QRP cw ops might have another band just for the taking."

I had almost forgotten, but a few years ago, I was tuning around 11 meters and heard a digital signal. Using my PK-232MBX, I plainly copied 2 guys engaged in a Pactor QSO! They both were using ham callsigns, and I must assume they were the lawful owners of those calls. What a pair of total idiots!
But let CB'er keep 11 meters, giving it back to hams would be inviting even more wars, hi..
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WR8D on August 28, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Ref ACBER: you're just trolling and trying to stir it which is a typicial example of what went on here when some of your pals upgraded to ham. They always had that little chip on their shoulder and try as we did we failed to elmer them in any way. If you have the knowledge as you say, you'd already be here. No high horse involved. Just lots of BS from your end. Someone up the thread said amateur radio doesn't need you...i must agree. You'd only continue to freeband and brag to your other cb buddies that now you have an amateur call. Just a waste of your time and ours. WR8D:
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WB2WIK on August 28, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
>RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators Reply
by ACBER on August 27, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
(The real question is, do I need ham radio?<

::Evidently not. And for certain, ham radio doesn't need you.)

I am willing to bet that many hams break the speed limit, run yellow lights, have unpaid parking tickets. If you talk on a GMRS walkie talkie without a license, you're an HF pirate. So get off your high horse. Ham radio needs people like me, I have the knowledge and the will, and I have the proper appliances, HI HI.
CQ CQ CQ DX<

::No, you haven't the knowledge. Motor vehicle operator infractions resulting in tickets are misdemeanors, and most people don't enact them purposefully. Wireless infractions are Federal and can carry far more severe penalties. I have no need for GMRS radios, and have never used any. My horse is much higher than yours because he deserves to be.

Now pack up your marbles and slither away.

WB2WIK/6
 
Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by N8QBY on August 29, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Ham radio "is" cb, only spelled different. :o)
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WA2JJH on August 29, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
ACBER, if your happy with 11M, enjoy it andf stay with it!

If you come around here and troll, you accomplish nothing. No Ham is going to help you. Has nothing to be with being on a 'High horse'. Your the one that is acting like your hooked on horse.

Your not hurting us at all. What you are doing is showing why many never used CB or left CB to become hams.

If you were a decent person, hams would help you get your ticket. Instead you got a stolen 746 ProII and are using it in an illegal manor. Then bragging about it.

So enjoy your CB. Hams just cannot be bothered by the likes of you.
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by K4JF on August 29, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
"Ham radio "is" cb, only spelled different. :o)"

Now THERE'S some total bravo sierra!!!
 
Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by VK2FLOW on August 30, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
you couldn't be more to the point.CB in Australia is very low quality and same goes with most of the opperators.The problem here is that any person can purchase a UHF CB and all the other required bits and pieces and before you know it,another radio ratbag has been created.I started on CB nyself when i was 14 then gave it away for some time.Until 3 years ago i discovered UHF CB.I fell into the trap of owning linear amplifier's and trying to be the number 1 signal into a local repeator.In the end all it did was make plenty of other operators dis-like me and radio was not fun anymore.....
Now,i am a amateur operator,enjoying all aspects of radio.It's a pitty we can't convince all the ratbags that drowne our local repeators to follow in my steps and enjoy radio for what it was intended for.I think most people forget why they got on radio to begin with.
Cheers,from Chris ( VK2FLOW ) 73's from downunder...
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by K4JF on August 30, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
"The problem here is that any person can purchase a UHF CB and all the other required bits and pieces and before you know it,another radio ratbag has been created.I started on CB nyself ..."

Really? CB is UHF down under? That's where it should have been when they set it up here, rather than the HF it is. But then equipment for UHF wasn't readily available in 1958 - the hams hadn't really worked to develop that area yet.
 
Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by KI4OGD on August 31, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Evil only wins when good people stand by and do nothing.

I am a no-code tech, but am learning code for my general. In my area, I've hardly ever come across a single radio person, ham or otherwise, that even cared what my license grade was, and those that did were only curious. I've never been ridiculed for my grade of license.

I had a token intrest in CB for awhile, but it never really piqued my interest. The bug caught me when a friend of mine dragged me to a meeting of my high school club.

I do come across the occasional former CB operator on the local VHF repeater, and if I do, I treat them with the same respect I would anyone else. If anyone starts being offensive, I clear the repeater. I've only had to do this once in my area, and it was not for a former CBer, but rather an active member of the local repeater club and long time ham.

73 KI4OGD
 
Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by KI4OGD on August 31, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Evil only wins when good people stand by and do nothing.

I am a no-code tech, but am learning code for my general. In my area, I've hardly ever come across a single radio person, ham or otherwise, that even cared what my license grade was, and those that did were only curious. I've never been ridiculed for my grade of license.

I had a token intrest in CB for awhile, but it never really piqued my interest. The bug caught me when a friend of mine dragged me to a meeting of my high school club.

I do come across the occasional former CB operator on the local VHF repeater, and if I do, I treat them with the same respect I would anyone else. If anyone starts being offensive, I clear the repeater. I've only had to do this once in my area, and it was not for a former CBer, but rather an active member of the local repeater club and long time ham.

73 KI4OGD
 
Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by KE7AKS on August 31, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
This thread seems to have a certain CB type ring to it. It goes something like this " I am a better radio user than you are", "I have a better rig than you do." "I have more power than you do." "I can talk over the top of you."
Then comes "MOM he hit ME back FIRST."

We need to be GLAD for CB for the following:

1) In Portland Oregon most of the radio ABUSERS hang out on CH17 and 20 AM, kinda like a CESTPOOL you don't want to live there, but a place for that stuff.

2) About 95 percent of the 18 wheelers on the roads have co-phased CB antennas on their mirrors. That means they can KEEP EACH OTHER AWAKE on long or boring trips, so they have less times where 80,000 pounds of 18 wheeler and load runs over some EXTRA CLASS trying to share the freeway. The same thing goes for LETTING A DRIVER KNOW if he has lights out on the trailer, or a tire turning into a ROAD GATOR.
The same self righteous extra class maybe would roll his car trying to miss the gator. They can warn other drivers that the extra class has hit that gator and rolled over in the road, thus avoiding a real pile up. They can let other drivers know about bad road conditions, and leave the extra class to brave the elements on his own. The log truck comming down the mountain road (barely wide enough for the truck) can let everyone listening know to wait for him to get past the poor extra class that is backing a few miles down the hill to the next wide spot.

All is not lost though, the extra class can fire up 40M and tell his Australian friend how rude log truck drivers are, and about his last operation he had from rolling his SUV after hitting a cap off of the tire from some 18 wheeler. Then he may have time to say dit dit dit dit - dit dit to his CQ buddy on 80M
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by K4JF on August 31, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
The above just shows the extreme jealousy that some people have of others who buckled down and EARNED their Extra class. Don't be jealous - get off yer butt and take the exam. If not, don't put someone down just because they worked a little harder than you.
 
Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by KE7AKS on August 31, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Well K4JF, I am working on my EXTRA CLASS, and who knows, soon I may be able to use the EXCLUSIVE segment of the bands, send you some CW !
Sorry if you took it all PERSONAL...

You sound just a bit like my DOCTOR.
He takes GLORY for his MIRACLES, and BURIES his MISTAKES.

I just realize that SSB CB CH37-38-39 seems to have groups (mostly also HAMS) that use quite good protocol, and usually talk only locally
Quite like my friends on 10M 28.4000 seems to do.

Personnaly I perfer 2M SIDE BAND most of the time.

I don't like SELF RIGHTEOUS people no mater what their QUALIFICATION, or STATUS.

I always travle with CB (SSB) in the car especially on long trips, and in the woods. I agree that sometimes the truck drivers have POTTY MOUTHS. so you have to avoid that even though there is a potential for good conversation, and info on their channels (17 and (19) usually. Here in Oregon the STATE PATROL monitor (17) out on the highways.

Most truck drivers that I talk to use CB - 800 MHZ (cell phone) and many use 2M FM on repeaters as they pass through.

73s Harv
 
Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by KE7AKS on August 31, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
When I first got into radio, I was in the military.
USMC, as a tech you had to send /receive 8 WPM RANDOM CHARACTERS, (you could not fill in the blanks)it was much harder than 5 WPM QSO...

When I first got into personal radio it was CB LICENSED (KBU 0508) with family call sign. There was OO's and BUSINESS CLASS CB. For those that lived out in the TOOLIES there was CLASS A licenses that allowed some power....

Strange the changes through the years.
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by K4JF on August 31, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
"You sound just a bit like my DOCTOR.
He takes GLORY for his MIRACLES, and BURIES his MISTAKES."

Nope. I don't do miracles (my God does those), and I'm retired, so I don't worry about burying my mistakes (and, fortunately, even though mistakes on my job could have caused someone a funeral, it didn't happen).

I'm just another ham, who hit the books, took what I learned from better hams than me over the years, and slowed my CW down to 20, and passed the Extra exam. That doesn't make me better than anyone else, but, contrary to some on here, does NOT make me worse either.

Not self rightous, because there's nothing to be self-rightous about. I just don't like seeing people put down because they worked a bit. Happens all over the place, not just ham radio, and it's rather disgusting.
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WA2JJH on September 1, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Those that have been around for a while, simply know the hard way was the best way.

The FCC USED to supply a large commercial like lic. for those that did it the hard way. I have mine displayed next to my commercial tickets and a my multiple university diploma's.

We simply feel that we worked harder for the same privs.

The ""minute rice extra's'' are not un welcomed at all. You dont't call us "crusty old farts'' and we we will be glad to help. JUST THAT SIMPLE!
 
Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by N1HLE on September 1, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
i to started out as a CB'er. my parents bought a house from a man who was a ham and left all his old equipment. my dad knew about some of it and we started learning about how to use this.i got my CB license in 1973 and still remember my callsign to this day. it took me a few years to get into ham radio and have been a ham an cb user ever since.
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by W9WHE-II on September 1, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Nothing wrong with being from CB, so long as CB ways and philosophy are left behind. But if arrl has its way and the floodgates are opened, the difference between the CB and Amateur services will be meaningless.

THE ONLY THING SEPERATING US FROM CB IS THE STANDARDS. TAKE AWAY THE STANDARDS AND WE WILL BE CB.
 
Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by KE7AKS on September 1, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
Well James (K4JF)
I really bet that you are an excellent HAM and no doubt I could learn a lot from you. I really was only making a point that 11M or CB does actually serv us a purpose, though it is behind the scenes, and no mater what radio privileges one has earned, there is a time when only CB will work. You can't talk to the crew up on a logging road with 14.200 MHZ. I will be going into the woods (Trask River near the Oregon Coast) tomorrow, the roads have little signs with the CB channel to use on that road, so I will definately check before I run up the road. I don't want to be a general class, backing down to the nearest wide spot.

You did a nice job describing your shack on QRZ, I use a Kenwood TS 700A for 2M SSB, it is OLD like me, but I really enjoy it.

I really was only trying to be silly, not wanting to offend folks for being EXTRA CLASS, and I am working
HARD to become one myself.

I will be 70 years old on 9/11/06 so CRYSTY OLD seems to fit for me as well.

Back to the subject, CB was a hands on learning experience for me. I learned to build good cubical quad antennas, and back in the old (DAZE) when CB was licensed they had to use good radio practices. I find that many of the friends that I make on HAM RADIO got their start on CB (USUALLY SSB) and after they get their license the CB gets used very little.

73's
Harv KE7AKS
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WA2JJH on September 1, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I think W9WHE-II, sums the matter up very well.
So perhaps we are beating the proverbial dead horse(Pegasus).

We never got a 'question pool' from the FCC.
We were tested by the FCC. We never whined on ad-nausium about having code privs' only, before we had
Voice privs on HF.

In general we welcome new blood. Blood as we know has many types.

We have O-neg...The unversal doner. We can donate to any that do not have bad antigens However O-neg cannot accept a B+ doner. Those "new bloods" that will
bring in their CB WAYS, will case clotting.

The A.R.R.L. seems to be HEME-8(a synthetic blood).
A poor replacement for "type specific" or O-neg.

The type specific is in the early 1900's FCC mandate visa-vi ham radio.

......To provide a pool of skilled people to advance the art of radio and electronics.........

I am paraphrasing what was on my Novice test around 1975.
 
RE: Those Dreadful CB Operators  
by WA2JJH on September 1, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
When I was 14, my friend got a siliconix "slider" for his RS-SSB CB. I had to see the schematic, and decide where to solder in the slider.

I listened to my friend on his now illegal CB. Sure it sounded better than what was on the 23 channels of the time. It just did not interest me.

I knew I wanted to be a Ham. I started to learn the code. I found I enjoyed my 40M CW QSO's far better than anything I heard on what was called HF Operating on 11M SSB.

I am sure CB has it's uses with truckers. The only problem are the 10/11M HI-pwr combo radio's sold openly on E-bay and truckstops
 
Email Subscription
You are not subscribed to discussions on this article.

Subscribe!
My Subscriptions
Subscriptions Help

Other Opinion Articles
Prices for Old Equipment and Hams Building Gear