Goodbye to Yaesu
Leif (KF7AMY)
on
July 18, 2009
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Goodbye to Yaesu
I have only had my license a few months. The first radio I got was a HT, a Icom W32A, an awesome HT, and I really enjoy it, and its capacity. Dual band, dual monitoring and cross repeater.
The second was a Motorola converted to HAM 2m and it is a great radio, with great sound.
Then I got on a shopping spree...
I got a Yaesu 8800R, a great radio, but somewhat annoying, it requires its proprietary software for computer programming, and off course, proprietary programming cable.
For that reason, I bought a second 8800…
In between there I went out and bought a Yaesu FTM-10R, the biker radio.
Great radio…Have a few design flaws that I easily could overcome, I have posted a review about these issues in another thread.
To the FTM-10R I need a headset, and I do NOT want Bluetooth. I do have a pilot style headset, so I figured, find a plug and retrofit it to the radio…
Right…
The plug is proprietary; I have searched multiple websites, stopped by several electronics stores, but no luck. This made me interested in Yaesu's product philosophy, and I started researching.
To me it seems like that very little from Yaesu is cross compatible with other Yaesu products, It seem to me that Kenwood and Icom is much better on cross compatibility.
By making their products so specific they get in the position of forcing their customers to buy from their product catalog. Then you get a guy like me; I flat out refuse to pay $24 + shipping for a cable with connector that should have a price on about $5. -- (CT-M11 External headset connection cable).
My conclusion is that Yaesu do not want my future business, and have directed me to other manufacturers of radios.
If Yaesu need help with their product strategy, I will be more than willing to assist.
I do appreciate comments.
73
Leif
KF7AMY
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Goodbye to Yaesu
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by HAMMYGUY on July 18, 2009
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This outta be good.
There is some compatibility between manufacturers. The standard 12VDC cable of years past, the 6 pin din that Yaesu uses on their 817, 857, 897 and several others.
They don't make much money on their radios, they make money on the accessories.
So they lure in us tightwad hams with cheap rigs and stick us with the high priced add-ons!
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by KG4RUL on July 18, 2009
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AND, if there was an International Organization to standardize radio connectors, AND, they started debating what that standard would be TODAY, they would still be debating 20 years from now.
If radios were as ubiquitous as 120VAC wall receptacles, there would be standards. As it is, there are too few manufacturers with limited markets for their goods. They have to do something to differentiate their products and make a profit along the way.
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Goodbye to Yaesu
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by XW1B on July 18, 2009
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Before things get totally out of hand here's my 2 cents worth. I agree with the comments made but this is not new information. This practice has been going on for decades. If you don't believe it buy anything SONY.
Eons ago I ran the old Galaxy V xcvr - the Collins S-Line was the only other beast on the market using the same diameter microphone plug. Standardization is too easy, too simple, and it doesn't make any money. Sad but true.
I, for one, run a pair of Yaesu FT-2000's and wont part with them.....even if I have to go to Tokyo for a plug.
GL - 73, have fun!
Bruce, XW1B
Near Vietiane, Laos
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Goodbye to Yaesu
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by KA2DDX on July 18, 2009
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I'm sorry but your arguments appear to have little merit. We'll agree to disagree.
The use of proprietary products is not necessarily a bad thing. Most manufacturers of products in any industry engage in this practice to some extent for various reasons.
Some manufacturers do so just to pump up the price of their products above the market levels of the competition.
However, some also use this methodology to introduce their own copyrighted way of doing things.
Back to Yaesu, their prices are relatively competitive with the other manufacturers. Their use of proprietary products is primarily to introduce their features and designs.
I know it's a pain in the neck to buy a cable from just one place, I own a VX6R, case in point. So what? It's just a cable.
As far as software goes, Yaesu doesn't write software. It is written by third parties. And yes, it is proprietary (read licensed) as that is how the developers can best try to make money. That is their right to do so.
Other developers give us software for free or for a nominal donation. That doesn't mean all developers should do that. You have to look beyond this and examine the functionality of the product.
In conclusion, I'd say if you paid a high price and got junk then your points would be valid. But, given that their products are relatively price competitive and of standard quality (compared to others) and backed by warranties, then I believe your argument pales.
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Goodbye to decent articles
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by W3VR on July 18, 2009
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They were getting interesting again with one on receiver design. A step forward with that one, and three back with this one.
Oh well, need to be patient.
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by CROWBAR on July 18, 2009
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As they say, to each his own. I like and own a lot of Yaesu gear. The proprietary connectors have never been a real issue for me. Actually, most of them are common place now. Someone blamed the wierdness of the some of them on RT Systems which seems odd to me.
Regardless... Enjoy your Kwood, Icom and other brands
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by KI9A on July 18, 2009
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Leif, I'm sure they are awaiting your offer to help market their radios! ;-P
Seriously, this is a problem with not just ham equipment, but, many other things in general.
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by K1MMI on July 18, 2009
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When I look at my Yaesu FT-990
AC cord, Headphone Jack, Key Jack, Mike Connector, RCA Plugs, Din Plugs(4, 5, 6, 7, and 8 pins)they are all standard plugs, jacks and connectors. All of these items are relatively easy to locate and purchase but these days where places like Radio Shack no longer carry a lot of parts, and local electronic stores are out of business, it is a problem mail ordering for a $2.50 connector when you add in another $7 shipping.
Recently I ordered a lot of spare parts for my 990 and it is unbelievable how cheap these parts are from Yaesu. If the same parts were available from Radio Shack or a local electronic store it would have cost double, triple or even quadruple for the same parts.
Yaesu, Kenwood, Icom and other manufacturers do charge top dollar for accessories but that is part of the equation to stay in business. Ham Radio is a low volume business and it's not easy to make enough sales to be a profitable business. When I think of all of the manufacturers and dealers who have gone out of business it's a reality check.
I buy replacement parts to keep my Lawnmower and Exercise Equipment running and it is unbelievable the markup these manufacturers charge for replacement parts. In many cases they are one of a kind part and they can't be purchased at a store like Home Depot but when the part can be purchased at Home Depot for 25 cents it is a price shock to see the manufacturers charging $1.50 or $2 for the same part.
When I compare the costs of Yaesu Ham Equipment to the other manufacturers the end result is always "Dollar for Dollar" Yaesu gives the best value.
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Goodbye to Yaesu
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by AA8GK on July 18, 2009
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You just noticed? Welcome to reality.
If this experience is going to make you say 'goodbye' to Yaesu, you might as well get out of the hobby now and take up knitting. While you're at it, get rid of your car.
Ford parts, for example, aren't all compatible with every model and year of car and truck they make. A headlight for a 1992 Ford F-150 won't work with a 2009 Focus. And, why can't you take the engine out of an Expedition and put it in a Mustang? Is this an evil conspiracy, too? No. Different vehicles do different things and have unique specifications and performance.
Your Motorola HT is indeed a fantastic radio! I'd love to have one. It's a time-tested battle wagon. However, Motorola has such a broad spectrum of products that it would be impossible for them to make all accessories inter-compatible with their radios. The speaker mics for a Saber won't work with the Tetra, the MX-350, nor the MTX-2000, just to name a few. Come to think about it, there's very little compatible between my Icom 756 Pro, 706MIIG, and Delta 100H.
Amateur radio is an equipment-intensive hobby, no question about it. Sometimes, we just gotta suck it up and write the check.
Peace,
Pete AA8GK
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by HFRF on July 18, 2009
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If anybody thinks some cables for radios are too expensive, buy a boat. I live for my boat but the prices for anything designed for a water craft is unbelievable. Stuff that might cost $1.00 for a common item will cost maybe 100 times that for the boat version.
Just as bad is professional photography stuff. A small plastic adapter that should cost $.50 might be $200.
Ham stuff is really cheap. Look at old catalogs from the 1950's and you will see transmitters that cost $600+ in 50's money. Can you imagine what that costs in 2009 dollars?
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Goodbye to Yaesu
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by WB9UYK on July 18, 2009
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I own a FT-950. I can say that this is the finest transceiver I have owned. Great value, wonderful features and a really great receiver. I recently purchased an Ameritron 811H amp to use with my 950. I came to realize that the 10 pin mini din plug (for the interface)is about impossible to purchase. So you either purchase the Yaesu cable with 10 conductors (even though you only need 2 for the Al811H) or you find a 3rd party (like on Ebay) who will supply a 2 conductor line with this "special" 10 pin din. Interestingly enough, the FT-2000, the big brother to the FT-950 has normal RCA plugs rather than the rare 10 pin mini-din. I'm surely not saying I would never buy another Yaesu radio because of this issue. However, it does seem kind of crazy to have to pay $36.99, plus tax, plus shipping for a Yaesu connector. I know that both Kenwood and Icom provide the required plug for an amp interface as part of their package with the radio. Personally, I would have rather paid $25.00 more for the Yaesu product and had all the necessary connectors. I say this knowing that some of the connectors would probably never be used by me. Oh well - just venting...
Tnx es 73,
David - WB9UYK
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Goodbye to Yaesu
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by KA2WYG on July 18, 2009
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Sorry you are having such a bad expierence with Yaesu radios. I personaly own 2 of them, The FT-450 and the FT-60r HT. I love them both. I too am also new to Ham radio (at least to the General ticket). My friends all own Kenwoods and I thought I would also go that route but after getting my first Yaesu I was hooked. I guess you could find good and bad features on any brand of radio. I doubt if there is the perfect rig out there?
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Goodbye to Yaesu
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by WA1RNE on July 18, 2009
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"By making their products so specific they get in the position of forcing their customers to buy from their product catalog. Then you get a guy like me; I flat out refuse to pay $24 + shipping for a cable with connector that should have a price on about $5. -- (CT-M11 External headset connection cable)."
>>> First, this "article" is a Speakout piece. You're not sharing something that most hams haven't known about and have been dealing with for the last 40 years.
Second, the $24 + shipping isn't really a bad deal. The connector looks like something Neutrik would make but I'm not sure not having one to look at - but it looks like a well made cable that would probably take the average ham a few hours of labor scouting up the parts and assembling/soldering the cable properly.
Your paying for yaesu to stock the parts, the finished assembly and labor to assemble and maybe to test it.
Life's too short, just get it over with.
....WA1RNE
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by K8KAS on July 18, 2009
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Please grow up, this is life. The cables and add on's are how the Mfgr's make money. You want to see how things really are done just look at the Auto Mfgr's ( US and offshore) and their price/markup on parts. Nothing is standard in the automotive markets, the dealer/mfgr controls everything.
Nothing is Standard in the USA, look at the gas pumps, different, the check out's at the food markets, different,everyone wants a piece of the pie
and likes to waste your time. In the mean time "have fun" its only Ham Radio.
73 Denny
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Goodbye to Yaesu
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by N5YPJ on July 18, 2009
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Welcome to the world!! Get over it quickly and get on with enjoying life.
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by K1DA on July 18, 2009
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Actually Drake used the same plug Collins used.
By all means, stop buying Yaesu, BTW--- less demand means better prices for the rest of us.
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Goodbye to Yaesu
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by VE3TMT on July 18, 2009
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Leif,
Welcome to amateur radio. I doubt Yaesu is going to have to file for Chapter 13 by losing your business. My advice is to read up and test drive if possible any equipment you plan to purchase. It will save you a lot of grief.
Max
VE3TMT
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by AC7CW on July 18, 2009
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I lost some tiny screws that held a faceplate on a Yaesu mobile rig... they cost a thousandth of a cent in bulk but Yaesu wanted $14 for a couple of them... I got sales to send me some but what was weird was the immediate and ongoing hostility from the parts department! It was offputting and I'll never buy another Yaesu thing ever. Apparently they are tired of hams complaining about little stuff like that... Americans make much better radios nowadays anyhow, how anybody could buy one of those boxes when you can have a laptop and a little external hardware and resulting better performance with a much bigger screen is beyond me...
I got horrible treatment from a Toyota dealership once, I wrote to the Japanese guy in charge of sales in my state and they investigated and shut the place down. They had a whole team of really polite people that came in and took the place over, it was cool...
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Goodbye to Yaesu
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by KC2PLJ on July 18, 2009
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I, as others on here also own a handful of Yaesu products that have been great performers. Yaesu is the backbone of my station mobile base and portable (FT-950, FT-857D, FT-817ND) The price and value scale here outweigh any connector issue or compatibility issue for that matter with any other manufacturer. You also have to understand that the software is developed by third party so your argument holds very little water. You also must ask yourself this question: Does the equipment perform it's job up to the specifications set by the manufacturer and expectations of the purchaser. I have had many different rigs and have been burned by a couple of them (won't go into details). I have not given up on any of them as it's all part of the hobby that brings me to my next point, all my cables accessories and connections are HOME BREWED. Have fun Mike KC2PLJ
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by N3OX on July 18, 2009
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"I lost some tiny screws that held a faceplate on a Yaesu mobile rig... they cost a thousandth of a cent in bulk but Yaesu wanted $14 for a couple of them... I got sales to send me some but what was weird was the immediate and ongoing hostility from the parts department!"
Probably the parts department doesn't want to be in the small metric hardware business.
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Goodbye to Yaesu
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by SWL2002 on July 18, 2009
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Good gosh man! Put it into perspective: $24 is like the price of a pizza with something to drink - and you are going to poop that out in a short while! Consider what your short time on this earth is worth to you. You have probably let this aggravation over a cable remove a day or two from your life span. Isn't a day or two of your life worth more to you than $24?
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by KE6WNH on July 18, 2009
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There must be something to it, if Yaesu and the others are still around. You can't stay in business with lousy products---I can name one manufacturer which learned this lesson in a hurry when they came out with a mobile rig about 15 years ago which was very tricky to program.
BTW if there's some piece of equipment which won't do what I want it to do, well... that's why hams have to be inventive. If you don't like your lemon, build something better.
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by W4VR on July 18, 2009
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I had Yaesu HF gear for many years, and was quite pleased with overall quality and performance. Lately, however, they've been manufacturing radios that are fraught with problems, aside from the compatibility issues you describe. When a company gets taken over a number of times by a larger company things tend to go down the drain pretty fast. At this moment Icom is the only Japanese manufacturer that seems to have their ducks lined in a row.
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by K9FON on July 18, 2009
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Sheesh hams will complain if they have to spend a little money. 24.00 is nothing in todays world. I have owned several Yaesu items and IMHO they were great! I had a Yaesu 8800 that i wish i still had. It was a GREAT little rig.
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Goodbye to Yaesu
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by KA4ETV on July 18, 2009
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Yaesu customer service is just flat out terrible too.That was the final straw for me.
So I quit Yaesu some time ago. Got tired of buying new two thousand dollar radios and then getting excuses from the customer DisService Dept.
As with anything in life the more simple and straight forward the better. Staying
Behind the curve on tech means cheaper prices.
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by N2RRA on July 18, 2009
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LOL!
I'm not going to mention the list of Yaesu equipment I've had in the past, but I assure you I've had enough to refrain from purchasing any of their products going on 9 years now. The only products that has worked out well for me is the G-1000SDX rotor I still own.
As for some of their radio products, they SUCK! Why would anyone justify BETA testing for them? Their using the public to figure their problems for free. Sure! there are people who like to exersize their Electronic Engineering background and say I figured it out for them for the credit, but what about the guys who are not, or could care less?
Lets start with the FT-9000 (any model) $10,000 Garbage! They all had recalls and this year Yaesu said they would pay for the hardware repair. Why so long?
Next! The FT-2000 or "D" model. They both have Hardware issue's and firmware issue's. Not to mention their not user friendly. When you upgrade firmware the menus change and you need to start all over figuring what does what. For every firmware upgrade it's a hit or miss weather it's going to work. Sometimes it's a sacrifice for one for the other. Example! their CW (Morse Code) section always has problems. Some say "All I need the radio for is to rag chew or digital", but that doesn't make it right. To you it looks great and works fine for your purpose, but what about the next guy you sell the radio too. That person is expecting an all around working radio. That's not what he's getting and now buying your "Broken" radio.
If you purchased a rig that for 4+ years has had nothing but problems you've purchased a "New Broken" radio.
The FT-950! Actually has a better roofing filter section than the FT-2000. That's a proven fact that makes it a better receiver than it's more expensive FT-2000 and there's lots of documentation out there to confirm it. Some say "Well it doesn't have the second receiver" mostly so that they can work split. You can still work split and hear that other station on the FT-950. I might add that the Transmit audio on the FT-950 is better and have heard less problems all around with the FT-950.
I think their better products are the smaller units like the FT-817, 857 and 897. Back in 1993 I purchased my first Yaesu unit which was the 757 GX II. My old FT-1000D was a nice unit before it starting giving me problems and so was the FT-1000 MP before it gave me problems. After those two units I gave up on them.
Well! You have the logical and illogical. You have the practical and non-practical. Question is which bracket do you fall into.
73's!
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Goodbye to Yaesu
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by K1CJS on July 18, 2009
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Some people don't complain for a specific reason, they just complain. Leif, if you don't want to spend the money for the parts for your Yaesus, sell them and get Icoms or Kenwoods. Problem solved.
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by N3OX on July 18, 2009
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"The plug is proprietary; I have searched multiple websites, stopped by several electronics stores, but no luck."
Actually, I bet it's not strictly proprietary. I think it's one of those Bendix/Amphenol Aerospace multi-pin jobs.
Very nice.
Pretty expensive.
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by AC5UP on July 18, 2009
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For those of you who scoff at this article, let me tell you a little story..................
In 1973 I bought a brand new Chevrolet Vega.
Worst.
Car.
Ever.
Traded it in five years later and swore that I would never buy another new GM car.
Look at where they are today.
Sure, it took 31 years for me to punish the largest US corporation for the error of their ways, but I, alone, made it happen.
Imagine what I could have done if there was an Internet back then... ;)
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by HFRF on July 18, 2009
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You actually think you, you alone, drove GM into bankruptcy? You are are very big dreamer about how important you are!
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by KF4HR on July 18, 2009
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Do I understand this post correctly? You are disappointed over having to buy a $24 specialized programming cable, and that your pilot headset isn't compatible with your FTM-10R? Seems like weak reasons to kick a radio manufacturer aside. I think it is safe to say the Yaesu engineer's developed all their radio gear for the amateur masses in general, and maybe not for your specific requirements.
Is it Yaesu's fault for developing a $24 specialized programming cable, or your fault for not researching the various manufacturer's first, before making your purchase?
Drawing conclusions about which amateur radio manufacture to toss aside after only having your ham license a few months, is like a kid making similar decisions about a particular automobile manufacture, as they walk out of the DMV Office with their newly printed drivers license.
If you're drawing conclusions this early in the game and concerned about $24 programming cables, you may be in for a lot of disappointments in the future. Best of luck.
KF4HR
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by KF4HR on July 18, 2009
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In 1973 I bought a brand new Chevrolet Vega.
Worst.
Car.
Ever.
Traded it in five years later and swore that I would never buy another new GM car.
==============================
Wait a minute here... Your Vega was that terrible and it took you FIVE YEARS to trade it in? What's wrong with this picture?
Calm you mind Mr. Powerhouse. Your particular Vega just might not be the only reason for GM's issues.
By the way, I never had a problem with my '73 Vega. Mine served me well.
KF4HR
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by KF4LVC on July 18, 2009
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Hello. I believe that others have made similar comments above. I have worked in the fields of electronics and RF for over 20 years and I have had many ham rigs over the years, as well. The reality is that Yaesu is NOT the only manufacturer that makes proprietary gear or accessories. Actually, all of the manufacturers have made various models of gear with some feature/cable/plug/etc that is not compatible with any other model they made prior or after. Sometimes this is done so that the company can charge more for the product or add-on, sometimes it is done so that competitors will have a harder time trying to "copy" the product features, and sometimes it is done because maker is "hoping" the new thing may become a "standard". Take the case of USB connectors on computers. Apple went exclusively to USB long before the market for peripherals even saw USB...9-pin serial was dominant. In this case, Apple's push (or gamble) paid off and USB is the standard for computer connections. We can see this in ham gear, too. Look at Icom and their microphone connectors. Most of their radios today use an RJ45 connector instead of an 8-pin din. Though I am not trying to defend Yaesu, per se, I just wanted to let you know that they have not done anything "underhanded" or different from any other manufacturer of ham gear. If you look, you will find that this practice is quite the "norm" in any technology. Sometimes something new and different "catches-on" with the product line, sometimes not...for a hundred possible reasons. Don't bash one manufacturer over one or two "proprietary" models in their product line of thousands of models. I own a great Icom AH-4 auto tuner that is not compatible with any other maker...without building or buying a 3rd party interface. Still, I consider this tuner to be the best I have ever used.
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Goodbye to Yaesu
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by W0CBF on July 18, 2009
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Goodbye to Yaesu - No way! After struggling with old outdated equipment in the past,ownership of a modern piece of equipment like the Yaesu as well as Kenwood and Icom products, is a joy. I'll stick with the new stuff, propriety connectors and or add on's, I will take them anyday. Enjoy your hobby and equipment and don't be so nit pickey. Like someone said earlier the money is made on add on's not on the equipment itself. This is true in any field especially the electronics field.
Smile,
73's
WØCBF
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by N0YXB on July 18, 2009
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Leif, you might have a bit of an over-inflated ego if you think anyone cares what you buy. And your offer to assist in product development made me laugh out loud.
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Goodbye to Yaesu
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by KL2TC on July 18, 2009
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I love my Yaesu radios!! I love, love dem...love dem. When I think of all the tinkering I used to have to do as a kid with my homebrew stuff to reach across Denver, these plug and play guys are fantastic! The world really changed in the years I was gone from the hobby. A cable? A mike mod? HO BABY! I'm pulling in New Zeland on my dipole!
LOVE DEM!
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by HR2510 on July 18, 2009
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In 1973 I bought a brand new Chevrolet Vega.
Worst.
Car.
Ever.
Traded it in five years later and swore that I would never buy another new GM car.
*****************************************************
Excellent! I love a good thread drift.
1974 Vega..I had to have the engine REBUILT at 40,000 miles due to oil consumption. Then the tranny went out 3000 miles later.
The very next time it conked out, I left it on the side of the road.
Buck up and pay the money for the Yaesu cable. You might be able to replicate it for $5, but what's your time worth?
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by W4KVW on July 18, 2009
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Here is another Yaesu example for parts.Try & find a replacement plug for EITHER end of a Yaesu rotor cable & see what you find.I LOVE my Yaesu G-8000SDX rotor but NOBODY but Yaesu has an end connector for one should you have a need for one nor can you buy just a replacement control box should yours stop working.NOBODY works on Yaesu rotors except Yaesu so if one becomes damaged you may as well just buy a new one at the cost of Yaesu repair service pricing it is just about the same in the end.I'm glad the rotors are MUCH MORE dependable than their radios or I would buy another brand FAST.You will also need to carry the owners manual with you to operate MOST of the Yaesu rigs today(MENUS FROM HELL).It's NOT fun being the MOST MISPELLED brand of ham radio gear EVER.Check the for sale & want ads(eham,QTH.com,QRZ.com,ect)on the web & search YEASU & see what I'm saying is TRUE!hahaha }:>)
Clayton
W4KVW
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by HAMMYGUY on July 18, 2009
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"By making their products so specific they get in the position of forcing their customers to buy from their product catalog. Then you get a guy like me; I flat out refuse to pay $24 + shipping for a cable with connector that should have a price on about $5. -- (CT-M11 External headset connection cable)."
Leif,
I guess you don't get to interface the radio and the other device since your being to cheap. And for this you dump on Yaesu products?
When you have company over to visit do your kids have to yell DING DONG when they hear somebody at the front door since the connector to the doorbell was proprietary?
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by AB7E on July 18, 2009
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What a misguided excuse for an "article". Why can't people post temper tantrums like this one to the Speakout section where rants are presumably welcome? Or more appropriately bash the manufacturer in a product review? In my opinion, posting such garbage as an article makes KF7AMY just as much a LID as if he had intentionally QRM'ed a frequency or fired up a KW RTTY signal on 14071.
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Goodbye to Yaesu
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by W1ITT on July 18, 2009
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What this country needs is a Compatibility Czar, to assure that everything could be successfully connected to everything else. I'm sure the current administration in Washington would jump on this, but to be truly universal in scope, the United Nations would need ultimate authority. Further, to atone for past sins, manufacturers should be punished by requiring them to retrofit everything from the Grebe on up. Perhaps, instead of providing different features, manufacturers should limited to providing only standard features so that we would only have to learn one operation manual. This would make contesting fair, as nobody could take advantage of using "better" technology to win. And let's all wear uniform gray jumpsuits while we operate as well. Homebrewing and equipment modification should result in a trip to the re-education camp.
The Compatibility Czar will make everything better.
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Goodbye to Yaesu
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by ARRLBOOSTER on July 18, 2009
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Leif, What next? Are you going to buy one of the cutting edge, new, Kenwood HF rigs? LOL. I hear they are going to blow us all away next year, with their innovative "gray case" limited edition 480 rig. Woo Hoo, pass me a beer, honey, I have just got to celebrate.
I think Yaesu,Icom,Elecraft,Ten Tec should all be supported by our business, not boycotted over trivial matters....
Ric
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by W6VPS on July 18, 2009
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Gotta agree with other postings about this "article"
It is more a rant than anything else. And proprietary programming software? Don't think so OM...there's a chap in Great Britain who makes tremendous programming software. Proprietary perhaps in the sense that HE is the one who busted his programming chops to create it...but proprietary in the true sens...naw...I don't think so.
Seems to me this is all akin to the old Chevy vs. Ford arguments which sill rage today. I have both Icom and Yaesu gear...I like both.
Big to do over nada.
Paul/W67VPS
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by KG6WLS on July 18, 2009
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Leif, I think you are dead on about Yaesu in regards their proprietary software issues and programming. I, for one, have a battle of a time just manually programming them with their little leaflet instructions. However, I don’t think that your “Goodbye to Yaesu” post has any merit based on only TWO “FM only” radios that you’ve owned and operated. You mentioned that you’ve only had your license for just a few months and posting a review like this won’t go over too well with this bunch.
The money that you spent on THREE “FM only” radios could have bought you ONE newer or slightly used HF/VHF/UHF multi-mode Yaesu or Icom.
Lief, I wouldn’t knock Yaesu until you’ve test driven and bought one of their desktop models. I, for one, like Icom. ;-)
73
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by W3VR on July 18, 2009
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"Goodbye to Yaesu Reply
by ARRLBOOSTER on July 18, 2009 Mail this to a friend!
Leif, What next? Are you going to buy one of the cutting edge, new, Kenwood HF rigs? LOL. I hear they are going to blow us all away next year, with their innovative "gray case" limited edition 480 rig. Woo Hoo, pass me a beer, honey, I have just got to celebrate.
I think Yaesu,Icom,Elecraft,Ten Tec should all be supported by our business, not boycotted over trivial matters....
Ric"
Well Ric, you can't expect what isn't there. So many coming into ham radio without the benefit of any formal electronics training and experience. Many can't set up their own station, much less build or repair even the most basic equipment configurations, nor do they have enough pride in themselves to even make an attempt to find out what they need to do so on thier own.
But of course they can always complain with no reasonable solution except "gimme, gimme, waahhhh mommie it's broke and I don't know how to fix it".
A pathetic lot indeed.
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by K5END on July 18, 2009
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Don't flame the author.
He has a good point, but it is the way it is.
"That's where they getcha."
In response to the GM example someone brought up, somewhere I read that auto manufacturers make more profit off of replacement parts than they do on selling the vehicle in the first place.
Wouldn't that mean it is far more profitable for them to make longer lasting cars?
In my view, that is where GM missed out.
Hondas are said to last a long time. Have you checked the cost of Honda replacement parts? They are exorbitant.
Therefore, if Yaesu or anyone else makes a product that lasts a long time, it benefits the manufacturer more than it does the consumer.
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by N4MJG on July 18, 2009
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I never have any problem any radio from yeasu ! i had 8800R with low audio problem ,but it was the repeater problem with grouding. but that all fixed !
73
Jackie
KG4ORX
VICE PRESIDENT OF MTARS CLUB
WWW.KG4ORX.COM
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Goodbye to Yaesu
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by N2EY on July 18, 2009
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I sort-of agree with the article. It's a pain when something as simple as a mike connector is proprietary so that you're forced to spend $$$ just to get an adapter, and there's no second source.
That said, I think it's kind of extreme to boycott an entire company over the use of incompatible connectors.
How about this: Before buying anyother rig, do some research into the details, such as connectors, power supplies, optional filters, etc. Think about the final configuration you want, as a package, rather than the cost of each item.
For example, a particular rig might cost $A. But the configuration you really want includes a couple of extra filters that cost $B, the ATU that costs $C, the matching power supply and speaker that costs $D, and the multifunction mike which costs $E. So the package cost is $A+B+C+D+E, which may turn out be more money than a competing unit which costs more for the rig itself but comes with those things built-in, or at lower cost.
---
Unfortunately, the ham gear market is small enough that a lot of consumer-electronics trends haven't really reached it yet. Desktop PCs are the ultimate example; cross-brand compatibility and extreme standardization is taken for granted with them. Most PC components have enormous lifetimes if you don't require state-of-the-art performance from the old stuff.
I've built "new" PCs from the pieces of discarded ones, taking the best parts of each machine and putting them together. Wouldn't it be great if we could do the same with ham rigs?
73 de Jim, N2EY
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by N7ZM on July 18, 2009
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Boy your in the wrong hobby to be worrying about a few bucks. You must be a beginning appliance operator because only the experienced ham operator will tell you that Yaesu is is one of two Amateur Radio Companies that have kept up with the lastest technology, the third company has been asleep at the wheel lately.
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Goodbye to Yaesu
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by K1CJS on July 18, 2009
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This article is just another six month ham radio 'expert' who is speaking up. This article should have been dropped out of the post list from the day it was uploaded.
This is even worse than the reviews where a person says "I have had the unit for two weeks and want to rate it."
Clinton, you can do better than this!
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Goodbye to Yaesu
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by WA1UFO on July 18, 2009
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Hey Leif!! Piss and moan!! The code-piss and moan. Theory tests-piss and moan! Oh-woe is me-piss and MOAN! WA1UFO
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Goodbye to Yaesu
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by WA1UFO on July 18, 2009
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Hey Leif!! Piss and moan!! The code-piss and moan. Theory tests-piss and moan! Oh-woe is me-piss and MOAN! WA1UFO
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Hello to Yaesu, Icom, Kenwood, Alinco, etc.
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by AI2IA on July 18, 2009
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Operators will always have their favorite brands, and/or favorite models. I wonder, is there really much difference in their manufacturing, marketing, reliability, or price? The designs vary, useally slightly, but the components are mostly the same and from the same component manufacturers, too! Yes, you read through the lab performance testing, but when it is in the average ham's hands, how much difference is there, really, in practical day to day use?
They all ding you on the accessories, so that's nothing new. If we use the word "style" very loosely and broadly to include favorite design features, then it is all a matter of style and slight difference in cost. I have a mix of brands and wouldn't put any one brand on a pedestal or give any one the booby prize.
I wouldn't fault a newcomer for making a rating, or even someone who owns a product for a few days. Sometimes it is the initial impression that alerts you to an issue, when frequent use may tend to make you minimize one apect because you found so many others to like. First impressions are not by that fact alone always bad ones. Keep the path of inquiry always open for discussion.
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Goodbye to Yaesu
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by KI4FAU on July 18, 2009
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>>>AND THEN LEIF SAID<<<
The second was a Motorola converted to HAM 2m and it is a great radio, with great sound.
Then I got on a shopping spree...
I got a Yaesu 8800R, a great radio, but somewhat annoying, it requires its proprietary software for computer programming, and off course, proprietary programming cable.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>>>AND THE RESPONSE FROM SCOTT WAS<<<
I can't believe that nobody has caught this one yet and connected the dots...
Motorola, yeah, built like a tank and awesome radio. Trump card against most any amateur equipment if Moto makes a product that can be stretched into our bands.
HOWEVER, I am wondering what the chances are that Leif (or the seller he bought his Moto HT from) is running a legit (aka LEGAL) version of RSS? And that RIB--real Batwing or some offseas crap meant to bypass licensing and development costs?
Show me a "universal" Moto programming setup that is properly licensed and otherwise legit and I will show you someone who would have (I am guessing) several thousand dollars invested.
Not taking Moto's side on this or saying I've never used a friend with a dirty copy of RSS to do some programming from me.
I am just amazed that anyone could be so naive as to bellyache about the cost of software & cables (or hardware) to get the most out of a radio that they just dropped several hundred dollars on without researching first.
Shame on Leif for wanting something for "nothing".
Shame on all of us (including me) who have jumped on this flame-fest but I can see how it happened---this is just SOOOOO far out in left field from reality that it screams to be responded to.
My best suggestion for Leif if he wants "universal programming" would be to go buy some rock-bound equipment and not worry about cables or software.
Oh wait....there ARE different cans/sockets for some crystals....let this thread continue to digress....
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by N6AJR on July 18, 2009
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or program it by hand. I have probablly 15 ht's and 10 or 12 mobiles and probably a dozen hf rigs, I keep the manual and program them by hand, cheaper and you never have to buy a cheap cable off of ebay. and yes my motorola junk uses different connectors too.
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by WB2WIK on July 18, 2009
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My Ten Tec came with every cable and connector it uses, so you don't have to buy "anything" to add accessories. It even came with a spare mike plug, spare fuses, etc.
All the major and most used interfaces are RCA phono jacks. The serial port for programming is a standard DB-9. I don't see anything proprietary there, anywhere...
WB2WIK/6
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by WB2WIK on July 18, 2009
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Actually, on this subject: There's no reason for any manufacturer to use anything other than RCA phono jacks, for every accessory I-O. Even a "serial port" really only uses a twisted pair for data. Only a parallel port -- now pretty obsolete -- requires more than two pins.
External audio in, audio out, data in, data out, TX keying, amplifier keying, ALC: Everything requires only two pins and one can be grounded.
That any of the manufacturers have chosen to use anything else is ridiculous.
WB2WIK/6
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Goodbye to Yaesu
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by K1ZF on July 18, 2009
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Remember when Hams knew stuff? Gezzz…..
That’s why I operate exclusively on CW. I’m sorry.
G;-‘/K1ZF
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by K5END on July 18, 2009
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>"Everything requires only two pins and one can be grounded. That any of the manufacturers have chosen to use anything else is ridiculous."
No argument here (except perhaps on the possibility things can get plugged to the wrong jacks.)
But other than avoid manufacturers, what can be done about it?
Like the old Mississippi gambler--when told privately that the riverboat game he was playing was rigged in favor of the house--said, "I know, but it's the only game in town."
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by K5END on July 18, 2009
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on Motorola...
Motorola ain't perfect, not by a longshot.
Two years ago I bought a Moto-Q cell phone.
Very disappointing.
Aesthetic, yes.
A performer, no.
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Goodbye to Yaesu
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by WB9QVR on July 18, 2009
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Leif, I don't think I'd be so quick to abandon a manufacturer just because of a proprietary connector issue. If you are happy with the performance of the particular model rigs that you have that would seem to be a much more important measure of satisfaction than whether or not a connector can be easily found.
The truth is that every manufacturer uses different connectors or interfaces. A prime example - Icom uses their CI-V protocol for computer control. To provide an RS-232 interface they sell the CT-17 which retails for about $140. For a long time if a person wanted to interface an Icom HF rig to their PC they had no choice but to shell out the money for the CT-17. Luckily cheap after market converters have become available.
My point in the above is simply this - if you dismiss one manufacturer for using proprietary connectors or technology then you'll have to dismiss them all because they all do it to one degree or another. These differences aren't necessarily a bad thing - a manufacturer may have perfectly valid reasons for choosing the technology or connector that they did.
One last bit of advice: Every manufacturer has its share of good and bad designs. I strongly recommend that a person evaluate a particular model for its strengths and weaknesses rather than simply looking at the name on the faceplate. I own (or have owned) equipment from each one of the major manufacturers (except Ten Tec which I do plan to purchase at some point) and chose each model rig for its performance, features and reliability without respect to its manufacturer. By the same token don't bypass a certain model simply because it comes from the same manufacturer that produced an inferior model. The two radios are likely to be radically different designs.
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by KF4HR on July 18, 2009
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Remember when Hams knew stuff? Gezzz…..
PRICELESS!
(long live CW)
KF4HR
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by W4KVW on July 18, 2009
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Leif.YAESU = YET ANOTHER EXCUSE SO USELESS.Just buy what you want to spend your money on & BE HAPPY.
Clayton
W4KVW
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by N5ACK on July 18, 2009
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<snip> Ford parts, for example, aren't all compatible with every model and year of car and truck they make. A headlight for a 1992 Ford F-150 won't work with a 2009 Focus. And, why can't you take the engine out of an Expedition and put it in a Mustang? Is this an evil conspiracy, too? No. Different vehicles do different things and have unique specifications and performance.
<snip>
This is the perfect analogy and proof that there is no standard with manufacturers, in any field. Just about the only standard is the SO-239 connector on the rig. What's wrong with making cables? The info is out there on the web. If you're talking about programming cables, they're fairly simple to make.
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by K9MHZ on July 18, 2009
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Being a diehard Icom customer, this might sound strange, but I think you're way off base. Especially Yaesu and Icom have developed some remarkable products, and even though some rigs will make you choke when you see their sticker prices, in a larger sense, these manufacturers develop these radios and sell them very inexpensively.
Someone mentioned that accessories have always been proprietary and pricey....very true. Ever compare an Icom microphone setup with just about any other manufacturer? They all do it.
Don't crap in your own messkit, and boycott a good manufacturer over something small like connectors. If these manufacturers don't get a return on their developmental costs, they'll join the ranks of being mere memories, and then we're all screwed.
Yaesu makes some great stuff, and I'm one "Icom guy" who'd hate to see them go away.
Best,
Brad,
K9MHZ
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Goodbye to Yaesu
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by KB9GIG on July 18, 2009
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Oh boo hoo i have two of these 8800 i purchased from ebay and i did,nt need any computer to program either
suck it up stop being so lazy.
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by W5GNB on July 18, 2009
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"Remember when Hams knew stuff? Gezzz…..
That’s why I operate exclusively on CW. I’m sorry."
-------------------------------------
SO, just because someone knows "CW" how does that qualify for some ham knowing ANYTHNG other than "CW" ????????????
I have met pleanty of LIDS and APPLIANCE operators on CW too...... however, not as many as on Phone....
YES, the good old VEGA. I had one back about 1972 or so and what a piece of JUNK!! I would say that GM certainly had the propietory rights to that one, there was certainly none other that was as bad. If I remember correctly, they had hardened Aluminum cylinder sleeves and they just didn't hold up after about 30-40K miles...... No wonder they went BROKE!!
As for the Yaesu Bluetooth, that is also one-of-a-kind and will not communicate with standard Bluetooth gear, only thier own headset.... Makes it sort of usless for our motorcycle helmet Bluetooth intercomm systems interfacing.....
73's
Gary - W5GNB
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by K6CRC on July 18, 2009
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They probably make $16 on $20 cables. There isn't much margin in a $1000 radio, they are lucky if there is $80 in margin after dealer markup, shipping, advertising, etc.
Want to hook your iPod up to your car stereo? Either buy the audio upgrade package at $1000 with the car, or pay $200 for the special cable. I you know what you are doing, you can hack it for $20 in parts. But, most people don't so Ford makes a big margin on the ability to listen to your playlist in your car. And, people pay it. Yaesu is no different than Ford, Honda, Sony, etc.
Product pricing is a very sophisticated business, and the product marketing groups have it down to a science. They know what they can charge, what we will pay, and where to raise prices and where to cut prices. Yaesu knows they can get $20 for a cable that costs them $4, so that is the price. If they could get away with charging $50, they would do it. In the industrial or scientific world, the cable WOULD be $50. Stop whining. Pay the price or hack your own cable.
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Goodbye to Yaesu
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by G3UXB on July 18, 2009
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You have only had your license a few months, then why trash Yaesu, their suppoprt as shown for the latest series of radios has been brilliant, and the FT1000MP as far as I am concerned is the best HF radio performance per dollar available, to each our own !!!!
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by N3OX on July 18, 2009
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"hack your own cable. "
I wanted a CAT cable for my Kenwood TS-440S.
It uses a 6 pin DIN, four wires used, and I didn't feel like ordering one.
So I pulled four pins out of a 5 pin DIN in the connectors drawer and soldered a wire to each one, cut a little piece of thick plastic bag and laid it over the connector, plugged each pin through the plastic into its place and back-filled the DIN ground shell around the pins using hot glue, and was done.
A connector = some metal bits embedded in some dielectric bits.
73
Dan
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by WB2WIK on July 18, 2009
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>RE: Goodbye to Yaesu Reply
by K5END on July 18, 2009 Mail this to a friend!
>"Everything requires only two pins and one can be grounded. That any of the manufacturers have chosen to use anything else is ridiculous."
No argument here (except perhaps on the possibility things can get plugged to the wrong jacks.)
But other than avoid manufacturers, what can be done about it?<
::Talk with your wallet and don't buy their stuff??
I've been very happy with Ten Tec, and not only do they use RCA phono jacks for everything, but they also provide all the cables and connectors with the rigs, so no matter where you are, you can connect the gear to the rest of the station without having to go search for new stuff. Very smart.
WB2WIK/6
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by K9KJM on July 18, 2009
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Indeed, Just WHY is this an Article and not in the forums under "Company Reviews"???????? Who at Eham permitted this to go through as an article?
And a very poor "review" it is too. The author, KF7AMY clearly has close to no experience with some of the other ham radio manufacturers.
Try buying some of the special Icom cables if you think Yaesu is expensive!!!!!!!!
The bottom line is that ALL manufacturers have produced "lemons" (And that goes for lots of other things besides just ham radios)
Yaesu has some of the very best deals on VHF/UHF mobil and hand held radios available today.
(A spot Icom once held years ago.)
(Icom still does produce some very good quality HF radios anyhow.)
I do not care at all for lots of Kenwood radios, But the Kenwood TS 2000 "Do it all" radio is a real keeper!
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by AJ4MJ on July 18, 2009
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"I got a Yaesu 8800R, a great radio, but somewhat annoying, it requires its proprietary software for computer programming, and off course, proprietary programming cable. "
So does Icom. What manufacturer doesn't use proprietary software for programming the rig? I'm not aware of any industry standard radio programming protocol.
And regarding the connector issues - all connectors suck (especially RCA phono jacks which fall out if you look at them cross-eyed). Real men use screw terminals! :-)
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Goodbye to Yaesu
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by W3DCB on July 18, 2009
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My 2 cents: I think that your attitude is silly. Ham radio is a very low volume business. Hams tend to hold on to their very well built radios a long long time. So, turn over of product is quite slow when compaired to other industries. Further, constructing a cable is usually not worth my time and effort. By the time I shop for the what-ever-number-pin-dyn commector, etc., and do the soldering, it just is not worth it. My time, effort, aggravation, and gasoline is worth a lot to me. Also, every radio that I have purchased from Yaesu, Icom, or Kenwood has come with an accessory pack that had everything I needed to make any cable that I ever required. Also, there are after market small manufacturers on the internet that produce cables for just about anything. Also, this is not specific to Yaesu. I have just recently (within the past 3 years) purchased from Yaesu an FT-897, an FT-857, an FT-2000, HTs, and an FTdx9000D. Support has been great for a great product which has given me no difficulty what-so-ever. Go to Radio Shack or your local electronics store (Here in Baltimore, there is Baynsville Electronics). If they even have what you are looking for, and if you don't end up spending the day on the road going from store to store looking for the parts that you need, check out the inflated prices! I usually shop the internet unless I "need" or want the connectors/patch cord immediately. Usually the internet is cheaper. In the end...again, it is worth it for me to pay the $24 or more. I just ordered a patch cord and jumper set from Westmountain for one of my Rigblaster Pros. The cost was $46! Well worth the money. Take care...hope my thought are not too unorganized. w3dcb (formerly wb2mjb) Daniel C. Baral
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by WB6DGN on July 18, 2009
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<<"And that RIB--real Batwing or some offseas crap meant to bypass licensing and development costs?
Show me a "universal" Moto programming setup that is properly licensed and otherwise legit and I will show you someone who would have (I am guessing) several thousand dollars invested">>
LICENSING??? SEVERAL THOUSAND DOLLARS INVESTED??? For a level converter that shifts RS-232 levels from the computer to the TTL levels needed by the radio??? The same thing that a MAX232 does better AND cheaper??? There's NO processor, NO firmware AND NO software in a REAL Motorola RIB -- it's not needed! AND the RS-232 levels in a REAL Motorola RIB are pretty shoddy at that. They're close, they'll do the job MOST of the time but not always. Some computers don't like them and it's NOT the computer's fault. Bottom line -- NO LICENSE NEEDED for public domain circuitry and not a very good implementation of it at that.
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by WB6DGN on July 18, 2009
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In fairness to Motorola, the RIB was intended to be a "compromise" primarily to make it more portable for field use and keep it as small and compact as possible. The main issue of less than optimum RS-232 voltages stems from the use of a 9-volt battery (or, optionally, a 9 - volt wall-wart) as it's power source. Small and compact, yes; but unable to provide the exact RS-232 voltages needed without the use of a DC - DC converter which, in that day and age, would add excessive size and complexity to the RIB. The design Motorola chose worked with a sufficiently large number of computers that the additional size and complexity was not considered necessary or desirable. The poster is correct about the cost of the programming software, however. For the cost of a SINGLE user license to program ONE model of radio, one could buy more than 10 of the programming cables in question. That's why I still pay someone else to program my Motorola radios.
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by W7ETA on July 19, 2009
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Congrats on your up grade to General, two down, one to go.
73
Bob
PS: I stopped buyin Yahoo rigs after my new 767 had the same failure twice in 18 months; fortunately my TS930 kept workin and workin and working and workin.....
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by WX1F on July 19, 2009
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Some reasons to avoid Yaesu that no one has mentioned yet....Try to get service bulletins from Yaesu. Impossible... unless you have a certified Yaesu repair center in your back pocket, they tell you to ship your rig to them and they will gladly rape your wallet. Icom, Kenwood...no problem. They're available on the internet to the average joe. Plus....who screens the instructions in the Yaesu manuals? They are laughable!
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Goodbye to Yaesu
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by NN4RH on July 19, 2009
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Goodbye to Toyota.
The luggage rack crossb-bars of the Toyota Hylander are not compatible with the Hyundai Sante Fe.
What they hell where they thinking. They must not want my business.
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by CROWBAR on July 19, 2009
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Ya know.. Every day folks on here claim to be engineers and scientist. That being the case, you would think these engineers would find interfacing a little ham radio to the outside world to be childs play.
Is that what happens when you have 2 cereal box top extras?
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Goodbye to Yaesu
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by W6CAW on July 19, 2009
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You should learn how to use an internet search engine like GOOGLE. I have no problem finding after market products for my Yaesu radios. Maybe you just like spending 20% more for a radio with Kenwood written on the front?
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by K9MHZ on July 19, 2009
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>>>>by NN4RH on July 19, 2009 Goodbye to Toyota.
The luggage rack crossb-bars of the Toyota Hylander are not compatible with the Hyundai Sante Fe.
What they hell where they thinking. They must not want my business.<<<<
<LOL> That's excellent! My new Tacoma is incompatible with my garage and all of the crap in it....too big.
Brad
K9MHZ
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by VE1IDX on July 19, 2009
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KF7AMY, by your own admission you have only had your ticket a couple months. Well I am sorry to say that if you feel this way already then you may as well tear up that ticket and take up knitting. The complaint you have against Yaesu is not unique to them nor is it new. Try and find an after market or other brand accessory to fit a Kenwood HT.Even the speaker/mic jacks are wired differant than any other I have seen.Good thing I did not swear off of Kenwood gear after getting "burned" with a TH-G71A about ten years ago. I never would have picked up an entire TS-820S station in mint condx for an unbelievably low price. :)
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by WA1RNE on July 19, 2009
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"Actually, on this subject: There's no reason for any manufacturer to use anything other than RCA phono jacks, for every accessory I-O. Even a "serial port" really only uses a twisted pair for data. Only a parallel port -- now pretty obsolete -- requires more than two pins."
"External audio in, audio out, data in, data out, TX keying, amplifier keying, ALC: Everything requires only two pins and one can be grounded."
"That any of the manufacturers have chosen to use anything else is ridiculous."
WB2WIK/6
>>> Actually there's a very good reason: chassis size and available panel space.
In this instance, the FTM-10R has a total of 7.2 sq inches of chassis size, minus cover overlap, the SO-239 and 1/8" jacks and you're left with about 5 sq" of panel - not taking into account obstructions from heatsinks and components that might interfere behind the rear panel.
If the $24 price tag for a ready-to-roll high quality cable is unattractive, Yaesu provides a MEK-M10 mic adapter option for $13. Then you can purchase a shielded cable, some 1/8 jacks for the headphone audio and wire up your own configuration and use VOX - and in the process spend more time and effort for a solution that isn't nearly as clean and convenient.
I have to say, I'm a little amazed reading about these "beefs". For a $290 radio (on sale from $350 until 8/31) Yaesu has, IMO gone above and beyond. They even offer Bluetooth capability, AM/FM broadcast receive, an 8W power amp for a PA and an excellent manual.
At the risk of sounding like an old fart but with a modern twiz, this radio would have been considered "the bomb" when I was first licensed. We would have taken full advantage of its features, especially Bluetooth, probably spending several hours immersed in thought over how to interface with other equipment or drumming up other new tricks.
Sometimes that innovative mindset appears diminished these days which is one of the best things amateur radio had going for it.
...WA1RNE
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by HAMMYGUY on July 19, 2009
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After this feeding frenzy of Leif to his article, I'm sure he has probably decided to sell off all of his ham gear and purchase a Kraco 23 channel CB. Folks are probably just a little friendlier on channel 19.
Lief this is why people don't write articles much for eHam. The unmoderated attacks bring more clicks to the site.
I'll bet your opinion of ham radio has changed to say the least.
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Goodbye to Yaesu
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by KD6HUC on July 19, 2009
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This is lame! I'll bet the person who created this article wouldn't know a soldering iron from a curling iron! Go back to your computer chat room and leave ham radio alone! We already have too many of your type in our ranks already...
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Goodbye to Yaesu
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by N3QT on July 19, 2009
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I feel your pain.
I see this as a problem with every company. This basically boils down to economics.
Supply/demand applied... If you owned the perfect radio that lasted forever, you would never buy another.
Interface issues were mentioned.
Other companies develop a radio, let thousands buy it, and create a revised version 3 months later.
Others design radios with known short comings that "will break" in a determined amount of time.
The perfect radio (or generic product) that lasted forever would not be affordable.
Pick what meets your needs. Have fun.
John
N3QT
73
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by K9MHZ on July 19, 2009
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>>>>The perfect radio (or generic product) that lasted forever would not be affordable.
Pick what meets your needs. Have fun.
John
N3QT
73<<<<
Very well put, John.
Brad
K9MHZ
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by AF3Y on July 19, 2009
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"I'll bet the person who created this article wouldn't know a soldering iron from a curling iron! Go back to your computer chat room and leave ham radio alone! We already have too many of your type in our ranks already..."
And - That's the way it is, July 19th, 2009!
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by N3MMH on July 19, 2009
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Well, what can I say. Most of us have been there, done that. It just goes to show how if you do a little homework prior to buying a rig, you may not be waisting your money on a "Yazoo", as it's commonly referred to in this area.
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by NJ2E on July 19, 2009
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"Then I got on a shopping spree...", a "Unrestrained or excessive indulgence in an activity" A good consumer researches before he buys, not after. The comments about the FT 8800, RTS Systems and G4HFQ both offer reasonable priced software to program the radio. My experience with their products for other radios has been good. As for the FTM 10R, looking over the Yaesu brochure for the radio a couple of things jump at me. Like "Waterproof/Dustproof" and "Vibration". This implies a demanding environment that would require special connectors, like you would find on mil spec or aviation equipment. In your comments on the product review page you mention that you bought it from an off shore dealer. Did you ever touch the radio before you bought it? Had you visited a brick and mortar store or a hamfest, you could of asked questions and save yourself grief. Well you "saved a $100". Your bad not Yaseu's.
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Goodbye to Yaesu
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by KE5VUI on July 19, 2009
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I wish 24 bucks was all I had to pay for the power cable on a Garmin GPS that I have on an open boat. Salt water and eletronic connectors are not friends so I just bite the bullet and buy a new cable every few years when the old one corodes or falls apart from the uv exposure. Buy the cable and get on with life or build your own (I do build my own for indoor use)and get on with life
Mike (now AE5MW)
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by PULLRAFTT on July 19, 2009
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still sounds like appliance users to me. i construct my own cables and interfaces..along with a few tranceivers. Not like the commercial radios thats for sure, but home made and they work well. more satisfaction knowing i built it from scratch.
stop buying and start building (like it was in the beginning).
-zw
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by WB2WIK on July 19, 2009
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I don't blame people for griping about this. It has nothing to do with soldering or technical ability. It has to do with parts availability, and in many cases, that the manufacturer has used jacks and plugs that have a lot more pins than needed for the tasks.
If every radio came complete with the mating plugs for accessories, I have no objection to soldering them on. But they don't, and in some cases you can't find those mating plugs anywhere except to buy them from the manufacturer in the form of prefabricated cables.
BTW the SIX RCA phono jacks on the rear of my Ten Tec occupy exactly 0.75 square inches of rear panel space. There's just enough room between them to seat all the plugs. They're all clearly labeled both on the panel and in the manual, and they're all protected against shorts or wrong connections. That's smart engineering.
WB2WIK/6
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by CURIOUSHAM on July 19, 2009
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Don't worry about the criticism, Lief. It generally comes from idiots. Even MMH, the CB'er with a ham call, has posted. He doesn't know a 'Yazoo' from his own 'wazoo'.
73
Chip
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Goodbye to Yaesu
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by W4NJF on July 19, 2009
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To WB2WIK,Hey Steve,when did you suddenly see the light?
Last time I was in QSO with you on 17M,you razzed my TT Jupiter and and said it could not hold a candle to your TS-850 SAT.So where did spasm of enlightenment come from? LOL! 73 de Bill W4NJF(ex WA2UUV).
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by WA1RNE on July 19, 2009
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...
eHam finally pulled this speak out piece and winged it right where it belongs.
Funny how it seems to move on out just as common sense starts to right its course.....
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Goodbye to Yaesu
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by KJ4KKI on July 20, 2009
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I read the various posts on this and here's my 2 cents worth. I am new to ham and my FT-60 is my first radio. I love it...except getting used to what everything does. I bought the ADMS software. Several people online complained about it being crap. After having used it, I have nothing but praise for it. Likewise, my HT is amazing. I've talked 35 miles to a repeater on 1 watt (with Diamond antenna), and listened to Nashville airport traffic (70+ miles away). I agree that companies make money with accessories. To keep a radio at an attractive price...especially in today's economy...they need to keep it affordable. Buying the additional goodies makes them money. After having bought a radio, digital SLR and zoom lenses in the past year, if you think Yaesu is the only company that charges more than you think they should, check out the others. I got a camera with a 4/3rds format sensor, and there weren't even any flashes available for it, except Olympus brand. Likewise, other lenses were limited. But, it's a heck of a camera. Likewise, Yaesu is a heck of a radio. I did not mind buying the software from Yaesu. What I do mind is that it supposedly only fits that model. So, when I get a higher powered mobile/base, I'll need that model software. Fortunately, there are 3rd party options available. HRO recommended the Yaesu cord mic over the competitors. But, I've seen 3rd party batteries for almost half what Yaesu charges. Options are available. Getting back to the main issue: I will get the serial/USB connector one day. It's about $20 plus shipping = $29. The local Radio Shack wanted $40 for a converter they wouldn't even guarantee that it would work. Anyway, that's my thoughts. Steve
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by KI9A on July 20, 2009
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AC5UP: "Sure, it took 31 years for me to punish the largest US corporation for the error of their ways, but I, alone, made it happen. "
Laugh my A$$ off! You really think because you didn't buy another GM for 31 years, you, ALONE made them bankrupt? HAHAHAHAHA...Funny stuff...
Was wondering. How many new cars, of any other make, have you bought since then?
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by KI9A on July 20, 2009
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CURIOUSHAM: "Even MMH, the CB'er with a ham call,"
At least he has the sack to use his call, and not hide behind a CB "handle", like, umm, CURIOUSHAM!
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Goodbye to Yaesu
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by WB4DX on July 20, 2009
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Newsflash!! Ham radio is a very expensive hobby. Leif, did you ever think about contacting Yaesu for a plug? And are you referring to that crappy rj connector for the mic? I just hate those things. But then again, my Yaesu AND Icom have them also.....
I know the feeling about getting screwed after the sale, I purchased the Yaesu VX8R at the Orl hamfest, had it only a week and it went to ebay.
Purchased a Kenwood THF6a in its place as I have had 2 of these radios in the past, much easier to operate AND 5 watts on 220! Yaesu missed the boat there.
With the vx8r you needed two hands just to change the volume that was the main decision factor for me.
Those accessory prices were ridiculous.
Still, I believe that feature for dollar, Yaesu offers the best value in a rig.
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by K6YE on July 20, 2009
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Leif,
As others have pointed out, a lot of companies make stuff for their product line only. I do not buy cell phones often but notice with each revised model, a new power plug is implemented.
I have found that with ham radio there is always someone willing to make and sell accessories that are less expensive than the manufacturer. You just have to ferret them out.
I own a Yaesu FT-1000D, two Icoms (IC-775DSP and IC-756), Alpha 91B, and Kenwood TL-922A . Each line has its own set of pecadillos but I like them for different reasons.
Enjoy the hobby while you can.
Semper Fi,
Tommy - K6YE
DX IS
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by N3OX on July 20, 2009
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"Laugh my A$$ off! You really think because you didn't buy another GM for 31 years, you, ALONE made them bankrupt? HAHAHAHAHA...Funny stuff..."
What is it about eHam that makes everyone lose their sense of humor?
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Goodbye to Yaesu
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by DJ0MBC on July 20, 2009
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The EU has now issued regulations that all cell phones must use the same interface for chargers and data. The mini-USB will be standard throughout Europe.
As for the cost of small parts, it's not the material cost, it's the cost of buying them, putting them into inventory in case some one loses one this year or in 10 years. If no one ever needs one of this still costs money (they are on the books) and of course maintaining the inventory and associated data bases is not free.
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by W3DDF on July 20, 2009
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This shouldn't be an article but should have been posted in the Reviews section. I am sure Yaesu won't go bankrupt without your future purchases.
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by SV9OFO on July 20, 2009
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"They don't make much money on their equipment, they make money on the accessories. "
this sentence, is probably best fitted to companies that produce "consumer" goods, like inkjet printers, netbooks, or kitchen blenders.
You don't rely on selling "accessories" to a group which sports the word "homemade" clearly visible on their definition - it's the recipe of the financial disaster!
An enormous amount of reconsideration should be applied to the ways of profit making by those greedy bloodsuckers. Especially if they are to survive in a world that has "wongdong and fudong and bluedong" chinese products of equal quality, life time and capabilities in less than half the price.
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by WA1RNE on July 20, 2009
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"BTW the SIX RCA phono jacks on the rear of my Ten Tec occupy exactly 0.75 square inches of rear panel space. There's just enough room between them to seat all the plugs. They're all clearly labeled both on the panel and in the manual, and they're all protected against shorts or wrong connections. That's smart engineering."
WB2WIK/6
>>> Interesting.....Either the RCA receptacles on your Tentec are some sort of miniature version that I'm not aware of of your measurements are way off.
The barrel of non-hex RCA phono jack is just about 0.375 diameter, making it physically impossible to fit 6 in an area 0.866" x 0.866" or 0.75 sq". Only 4 will fit and that's pushing it, allowing just 0.125 between connectors -- barely enough room for the smallest of fingers to insert plugs.
On an HF rig where there's plenty of rear panel space, RCA jacks make sense - plus there are signals running to different devices, i.e. amplifier ALC, antenna changeover, antenna tuner, foot switch, computer audio, etc., etc.
But we're talking about a dedicated connector for just a headset or microphone for a small VHF/UHF dualbander, so using RCA jacks doesn't make physical sense - and that's why you rarely see anything but 1/8" jacks on the rear panels of most small rigs.
The connector Yaesu is using looks similar to some Amphenol products, and sure, they could have used a Switchcraft connector instead, but geez we're talking $24 with the cable attached and ready to go. Buy the headset, hook it up and move on.
...WA1RNE
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by W5DQ on July 20, 2009
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Try buying accessories and parts for your Harley Davidson bike. HD doesn't stand for 'Harley Davidson' ... it means 'Hundred Dollars'
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by K9FON on July 20, 2009
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Ya know, i dont think the author of this article has been back to see the replies. Hmm. Troll post maybe to stir up trouble?
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by W5DQ on July 20, 2009
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<N5ACK> What's wrong with making cables? The info is out there on the web. If you're talking about programming cables, they're fairly simple to make.
I know alot of new hams do not have any experience in doing any sort of cable fabrication or electronic assembly and a lot of them have no desire to learn anyhting beyond memorizing test answers. With your statement, you're assuming the newbie knows which end of a soldering iron is hot. May he does, maybe not, but I agree wholeheartedly. I make about 95% of my cables and look long and hard before I spend my bucks on a pre-fab cable that I can make.
In reference to the reply about a $2 part and $7 shipping. I try to alleviate this by making periodic bulk purchases and combining required items to bring the shipping under control. Also if it is a common plug, jack or part and doesn't required a 2nd mortgage to buy, I usually buy an extra or two because as I know from experience, I'll most likely need it sooner than later.
As Steve WB2WIK/6 stated, most everything could be done with RCA connectors. I use these almost exclusively in any adapter or outboard interface box I design for my shack. Makes cabling a snap.
Gene W5DQ
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by N5LRZ on July 20, 2009
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If anyone feels the need to bitch about a petty $25 bucks then that person needs to look at weither they need to be in the hobby in the first place.
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Goodbye to Yaesu
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by KC0GLA on July 20, 2009
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I hate to say this, every radio from all manufactures have some sort of special cable. My D700 has a special cable for the packet connection. A Icom receiver has a special cable to allow the audio and video to be displayed. Every company has some sort of special cable to sell you.
After a while other company come out with ends and cables to use with these radios. I own a Yaesu handheld and bought a 4 contact 1/8" plug from mouser for a few dollars. It just depends on the model of the radio on what connectors they use. Try hooking up packet to a Motorola GP300.
I do have to say one thing that the new models that Yaesu brought out this summer sound great. Apparently the merger was not such a bad thing. A local ham bought a FT-7900 and it now has that Motorola audio that is so loved.
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Goodbye to Yaesu
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by W7AWH on July 20, 2009
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“You take the blue pill, the story ends, you wake up in your bed and believe whatever you want to believe. You take the red pill, you stay in wonderland, and I show you how deep the rabbit hole goes.”
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by NA7CS on July 20, 2009
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I can't believe this was actually posted. You complain about proprietary stuff with Yaesu in the same story as your Motorola HT.
I have Motorola and Midland commercial radios for FM work and they can not be beat. BUT.... Let us talk proprietary. To program most commercial radios (read YOUR Motorola HT) you need a proprietary Radio Interface Box (RIB). They are not cheep, even the home brew box's cost plenty. Then you need the proprietary programming cable and/or plug-in box for certain HT's. Now the best part..
Most of the old commercial radios one can get for cheep require software which only runs on old DOS based 286, 386 and if your lucky, 486 computers. I forgot the software to program the commercial radios. Call a Motorola service center and ask what it would cost for the RSS to program your HT. (I know you, or your friend who programmed it it not using a pirated copy from Russia... Right?) I bet you would not whine about a measly little Yaesu part again.
Life is way to short to sweat the small stuff.
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by K9MHZ on July 20, 2009
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>>>>by SW9OFO on July 20, 2009
"They don't make much money on their equipment, they make money on the accessories. "
this sentence, is probably best fitted to companies that produce "consumer" goods, like inkjet printers, netbooks, or kitchen blenders.
You don't rely on selling "accessories" to a group which sports the word "homemade" clearly visible on their definition - it's the recipe of the financial disaster!
An enormous amount of reconsideration should be applied to the ways of profit making by those greedy bloodsuckers. Especially if they are to survive in a world that has "wongdong and fudong and bluedong" chinese products of equal quality, life time and capabilities in less than half the price.<<<<
Maybe it's different in your world, but I see very little "homemade" of anything going on anymore.
Also, their "ways of profit" are driven by market forces, and I'm completely baffled how you can assert the title of "greedy bloodsuckers" to companies who produce the finest communications gear, for a fraction of what things costed years ago. Geez....a full power 2 meter FM rig for $129? I built a rock-bound 2 meter Heathkit in the early 70's for $189, in early 1970's dollars.
Some may point to the price of an Icom 7800 as proof enough that things are too expensive, but I'd be very surprised if the price point for the vast numbers of new HF radios sold today was more than the cost of a Pro or Pro III or Yeaesu 450. Just look at the station photos here on eham.....manufacturers aren't "bloodsuckers," they're what's keeping our hobby strong with innovative, new products.
I'd suggest rethinking who you choose to hate, because you may just get what you want if they disappear. And all this because of a few cables or connectors? Yikes.
Brad
K9MHZ
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by WB2WIK on July 20, 2009
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>Goodbye to Yaesu Reply
by W4NJF on July 19, 2009 Mail this to a friend!
To WB2WIK,Hey Steve,when did you suddenly see the light?
Last time I was in QSO with you on 17M,you razzed my TT Jupiter and and said it could not hold a candle to your TS-850 SAT.So where did spasm of enlightenment come from? LOL! 73 de Bill W4NJF(ex WA2UUV).<
::Hi Bill. I don't remember that, but I do have a TS-850S/AT and other stuff, and have owned a Jupiter for two years now. It's a very fun rig, and although it's true it actually cannot compete with the TS-850S on many fronts (mostly because it lacks cascaded hardware crystal filters in two IFs like the Kenwood has), there are things it does just beautifully. I especially appreciate "user friendliness," like the use of all the RCA phono jacks -- and the fact that the rig actually comes with usable interface cables, spare connectors, etc. I think they all should.
My Jupiter has the internal automatic tuner, by LDG. It's clicky-clacky and can take some time to find a tune point, but it's very effective and never fails. The Kenwood's is quieter and motor driven (not relays), a bit more impressive to use, but isn't any better at matching stuff.
Good to hear from you!
73
Steve WB2WIK/6
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by WB2WIK on July 20, 2009
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>RE: Goodbye to Yaesu Reply
by WA1RNE on July 20, 2009 Mail this to a friend!
"BTW the SIX RCA phono jacks on the rear of my Ten Tec occupy exactly 0.75 square inches of rear panel space. There's just enough room between them to seat all the plugs. They're all clearly labeled both on the panel and in the manual, and they're all protected against shorts or wrong connections. That's smart engineering."
WB2WIK/6
>>> Interesting.....Either the RCA receptacles on your Tentec are some sort of miniature version that I'm not aware of of your measurements are way off.<
::No, they're not. The RCA jacks used have no "shoulders," they're board mounted and just protrude through a molded rear panel piece. They're aligned in rows and columns measuring .756" wide (two connectors wide, each being .328" O.D.) x 1.184" tall (three connectors high, each being .328" O.D. in.). .756" x 1.184" = 0.895 square inches, just a bit more than 3/4th square inch. In any case, certainly less than 1 square inch and a whole bunch less than 4-5 square inches!
I contend that "saving space" is a crazy reason not to use them, unless you're talking subminiature equipment like a cigarette-pack sized handheld. There isn't any "home station" HF or VHF transceiver I've ever seen that couldn't easily fit six RCA phono jacks in the available space. Even my little FT-857D's rear panel has adequate space for that, if they hadn't used multi-pin DIN jacks instead.
WB2WIK/6
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by SV9OFO on July 20, 2009
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Dear Brad,
Thanks for the opportunity to discuss my ways of doing it.
I always find or buy defective equipment (had never had a new plug&play TRX) which I repair and use.
Therefore I am quite familiar with the inner parts and I know that intercompatibility between accessories and rigs can be enormously easily achieved, even with small interfaces (maybe even PIC's could be added in them) to connect ANY radio to ANY accessory out there. I cannot swallow their ways of "proprietary" connectors which require access to micro-lathe equipment to replicate, just because the connector is not out at large but needs to be bought along with the actual accessory.
For a pro Electronics Engineer's point of view, one of the type that could design their own SDR's,
I tell you that it is rather offensive of them to tell me to "suck it up and sign the check", as was previously mentioned by another fellow ham.
I would rather
>design my own equipment,
>possibly recycle parts from broadcasting equipment (smells like cheap KWatts in here, you know, hi hi...)
always ensuring FCC or local requirements,
>sign the "declaration of comformity" required here in EU myself,(and would be as good as mr. Yaesu himself signed it),
and enjoy a rig that would outperform any "gizmo" rig that could stand near it,
than pay those 25 bucks or quids or euros for the part that costs less than one, even if I had to pay twice or three times the price of the actual black box just to build my own.
because I would have deep knowledje in theroy of operation in my rig, I would have modified existing functional accessories from "passed away" rigs that sported "proprietary" connectors, which should be thrown away along with the rig otherwise, And for the best part I would be able to fix it myself.
About yaesu speaking, once upon a time the so-called, "Technical supplement" for my FT-480, was included in the user manual. Should the rig fail to any reason, having the TS was a matter of minutes for you or your elmer to spot the fault and return the rig to fully operational state. Have you seen a "technical supplement" included in the user manual lately?
Even if you buy the book, you will find that most of the parts inside are proprietary.
As THE example let me present the FT1000 MK V dedicated PSU,
Yaesu FP-29,
and it's PWM controller,
MB2013A
Please google them and meet the horror....
Find it for a price less than 100$ and make me happy. You can get it only from YAESU. (and ICOM, but that's another OEM story - PS-125 also uses it - both PSU's are made from the same OEM manufacturer, but they have different circuits and output voltages). No spares anywhere but the factories themselves.
And let's say for now that they have it in stock. Stocks are not meant to last forever. In 5 years time there will be no spares stock for your FT-1000 mk V. You will either have to modify or sell to a fraction of the price of the complete functional set.
And all this for 15 SMD parts that wouldn't even fail if they weren't subjected to enormous temperature stresses due to their packing into epoxy resin in a first place....
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Goodbye to Yaesu
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by NF8V on July 20, 2009
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And here I give you the up and coming NEW class of RADIO AMATEURS ("I have only had my license a few months"), No Code, No decent exam. Need I go on?
Its amazing the old timers have lasted this long without him.
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by K9FON on July 20, 2009
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NF8V You know, we can always rally the ARRL and the FCC to stop issuing new lisenses and just let ham radio in the USA die away. Or we could just rally the ARRL and the FCC to just kill off ham radio altogether.
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by SV9OFO on July 20, 2009
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Dear Rich, I surely wouldn't want to put all my efforts to oppose a point of view,
to a totally ethical declaration our fellow ham did.
By any means I would avoid focusing on other Hams operating experience.
Instead I try to be objective,
judging their opinions,
rather than judging "Them".
I would enjoy our chat more if you did that too. Thanks in advance.
in the most friendly of matters,
John Makris
ex-codeless "Tech"-equal SW9OFO
now the equivalent of "Extra" (with code) SV9OFO
ham for less than year
electronics enginner for more than 20.
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by WA1RNE on July 20, 2009
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The RCA jacks used have no "shoulders," they're board mounted and just protrude through a molded rear panel piece. They're aligned in rows and columns measuring .756" wide (two connectors wide, each being .328" O.D.) x 1.184" tall (three connectors high, each being .328" O.D. in.). .756" x 1.184" = 0.895 square inches, just a bit more than 3/4th square inch. In any case, certainly less than 1 square inch and a whole bunch less than 4-5 square inches!
>>> Standard RCA phono plugs with a shoulder run 9mm or .366", as opposed to your .328" pc mounted connectors - giving you a whopping 1/32" of extra mounting space - same deal.
Regardless of the amount of rows of RCA's in your TenTec Jupiter, the difference in rear panel real estate -especially internally - is night and day between that radio and a small VHF/UHF Dualbander.
Apparently every commercial manufacturer seems to agree since no modern VHF/UHF mobiles use RCA's.
...and why on earth would you route mic, left and right audio out, control and in many cases power for an electret mic on 6 separate cables and RCA connectors - or even 1 multiconductor cable and separate connectors?
For the FTM-10R that's what it would take to provide the same functionality as the 7 pin connector Yaesu provides. That's fine for an HF base station that's set up and rarely disconnected but this "cluster" of RCA plugs would be a joke in a mobile environment.
If you are interested in adding cost and decreasing convenience and reliability in a mobile environment, RCA's are certainly the way to go.
...WA1RNE
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Goodbye to Yaesu
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by K4LMS on July 20, 2009
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You are so right !! Ever since ICOM and KENWOOD entered the market in the early 1970's Yaesu has never caught up to either one!!! Their gear is third rate and inferior to ICOM and KENWOOD, and nothing in the future for Yaesu in my opinion!! Yaesu never got out of the CB Business in all these years!!
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by DJ0MBC on July 21, 2009
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Yaesu CB Radios?? Kenwood hasn't made a new HF rig in how long? There is speculation they never will again.
I find ICOM and Yaesu to be tops if we compare apples and apples. I own an FT-900 and FT-2000, Elecraft K2 and K3.
He obviously doesn't know about the Yaesu FT-9000, FT-2000, etc.
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by KI9A on July 21, 2009
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Reply
by N5LRZ on July 20, 2009 Mail this to a friend!
If anyone feels the need to bitch about a petty $25 bucks then that person needs to look at weither they need to be in the hobby in the first place
AMEN BROTHER!!!!
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Goodbye to Yaesu
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by AE1Z on July 21, 2009
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Is this some sort of joke???
First, why on earth this thing is posted as an article? It belongs to the product review section!
Secondly, dude - you need some serious reality check!
"By making their products so specific they get in the position of forcing their customers to buy from their product catalog. Then you get a guy like me; I flat out refuse to pay $24 + shipping for a cable with connector that should have a price on about $5. -- (CT-M11 External headset connection cabl"
How about the Motorola cell phones (forget the specialized ham radios - we are talking plain vanilla consumer product) - I have in junk box 4 motorola cell phones - ALL OF THEM are using diffrent chargers with diffrent jacks!
This is part of the business - accessories! You can't judge the cost of a cable just by the cost of the materials in it! Did it ever occur to you that Yeasu might be recovering the cost for develoment of the interface as part of the price for the cable??
"making their products so specific "? What you are talking about? Radios with RS-232 or USB port? Oh yes - Icom has one with USB and it costs 3K!
If you cant spend 25$ (the price of 4 McDonalds meals) for a one time purchase of a specialized cable for your radio, you have serious income issue and it should look elsewhere for a hobby - like CB for instance. Ham radio, especially if you are "applience operator" is an expensive hobby! I would offer you my Motorola Talkabout FRS but the headset jack might not be compatible with yours!
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by SV9OFO on July 21, 2009
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speaking of cell phones - cell phone manufacturers have already agreed than starting from 2010, all new models will use COMMON charger design, standard voltages and common mini-usb plug, due to environmental issues (the vast amount of chargers thrown away due to cellphones failing or becoming obsolete).
As you can see, that example is not a good example on commercial proprietary techniques any more.
will the manufacturers of ham radio gear follow the neat example?
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by SV9OFO on July 21, 2009
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Ah yes. IC7200 has also a USB jack with embedded sound card and costs just 800$...
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by NK2U on July 21, 2009
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"I flat out refuse to pay $24 + shipping for a cable with connector that should have a price on about $5. -- (CT-M11 External headset connection cable)."
Well, if that is what you believe, then there's a business opportunity for you here! Here's what you do:
Buy one cable and contact a factory in China. Have them make 200 (that's all you'll sell if you're lucky) and have them ship them back to you.
If they are as cheap to make as you claim, then you could mark 'em up 100% right?
de NK2U
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Goodbye to Yaesu
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by N5LRZ on July 21, 2009
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You DO NOT need software to program that radio--I KNOW because I own one. I know because I program my own without software OR computer links. JUST READ the owners manual. It clearly states how to program your radio without any connection wires OR software. It just takes a little longer to go thru the menu selections and press a few buttons.
As to the charge of a MERE 25 bucks aka Chump Change IF that causes you financial concerns then you seriously NEED to get out of the hobby entirely until you can get a job with more discretionary income.
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by KC8RWR on July 21, 2009
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What's all this talk about selling proprietary connectors at inflated prices so they can keep the cost of the radio down? It reminds me of Microsoft selling the XBox at a loss so that it can make a profit on the games.
First off, ham equipment is expensive. Including the radio! I know this and choose to spend my money and be a ham anyway. But if I'm to believe that any new radios out there are being sold at anything less than a nice fat profit margin I really wonder why they are so expensive to build? Are they hand soldering these things with all military grade components? Are they crafting and painting the chassis by hand? I don't think so! Surely they are mass produced just like everything else.
Second, how many people really buy all the proprietary connectors for all our radios. Most of them I think just get mounted in our cars, hooked to an antenna and power. If companies were relying on those connector sales I don't think they would still be in business.
Leif, I certainly feel your pain. I tried to use a connector from a mouse extension cable as a programming cable for my FT8900. It really looked like it would work. Once I got done filing away half the plastic because they have the connector recessed so far I discovered that it still doesn't work. I wasted my cable. Maybe the pins are farther back? Now I know selling more cables had to be the purpose!
Eventually I will break down and buy the cable b/c it's a whole lot cheaper than buying another radio and much more convenient to fill all the memory channels that way. Not to mention, the only way I have found to read the frequency on a memory channel once you give the channel a name (ie callsign) is to use a frequency counter or to dump the channels to a computer and read it there.
Having recently paid for a wedding, a honeymoon ,purchased a house and with a kid on the way it's just not a good time for me to do so at the moment. I certainly could spend $24 but only so many times per paycheck and there are other projects that come first!
For now I am annoyed but not enough to say I will never buy another Yaseu. I like my waterproof VX-7R, The 8R is very tempting with it's builtin APRS and higher output power on 220. Much better (to me) than ICOM's D-STAR when there are no DStar repeaters in my area or Kenwood's HF SSB support which interests me but would be receive only anyway.
I also enjoy the 4 bands on my 8900, not a common feature for a radio that goes all the way up to 440. So far I've found much more activity on 10 meter than on 6, even without sunspots! I do wish it had 220 though.
KC8RWR
Also a Leif!
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by W4NJF on July 21, 2009
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Hi Steve,I hope this a PM to to you as I did not want to hijack the thread.I've had my Jupiter for about 8 yrs and its only had one trip to Dollyland.Got it from Bill Krug KQ4WO (now SK) who was a good golfing partner.Said it was too much radio to use,so I bought off him.Seems it had issues (its a red dot Jupe) with the TX keying,so I sent up to TT and there were "factory installed" cold solder joints;since I was not the original owner,I had to pay for this.This was in 2002,and its worked great since.I run it with a AL811 and have had no problems.
Now my observations on this rig:
1.Vertically polarized antennas close by will cause the readout to go bananas,if you have the 302 remote pod plugged in.Gary Greene at TT gave me a resistor substuition kit to install,but I haven't done it yet-SMT makes me nervious!
2.Don't know if you have done the CW personality mod or not,but IMHO it may not be worth it if you want to work DX.Works fine on strong local sigs but if QSB sets in you are going to see a lot of garble and noise "hits".
3.The CW personality mode does NOT work in Pegasus emulation mode;I run N4PY software in Peg mode to do PSK 31 and the first try doing this in CW personality totally corrupted Carl's program-had to reload it.
Hope this helps.
BTW,Got up on 6 last Sunday,and by George the band was open!Worked a few stations in NNJ and EPA using the 1208 XCVTR into a discone @8watts out.Worked WA2FGK,and I think our old pal Herb was at the mike.Guess their contest station is now in EPA as their GS is FN21.
VY best 73 and keep in touch de Bill W4NJF
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by WB2WIK on July 21, 2009
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Hi Bill,
Mine was made in 2007 and has all the latest upgrades.
Never had a problem with it, but my antennas are far from the shack (shortest feedline here is 165', the others are longer). I have heard about RF getting into stuff with the Jupe, but I suspect those are mostly cases of antennas being closer.
I use it on CW all the time, but never in the Pegasus Emulation mode, as I like the front panel and it does the job for me.
Ironically, in a pinch if the going gets really tough, I often go back to my 1978-vintage Drake TR-7 or my much older 75A4! Those receivers are both amazing and pretty bulletproof.
Sometimes on 80 or 160 I use the 75A4 with a low wire antenna and the Jupe with a kilowatt amp and an inverted L for transmitting. That way I don't even need to "switch" antennas at all, I can leave everything connected. I'm old fashioned. ;-)
I've worked Herb K2LNS at WA2FGK on 6m many times, including recently.
Six was open at some point almost every day for the past 7-8 weeks but that's definitely coming to a close! I caught some great opening back in late May, worked dozens of JAs on triple-hop, and a lot of guys on the east coast on double-hop, but never once heard Europe, which some guys out here were evidently working. Not me. Murphy's Law dictated that any time that might happen, I wasn't here!
73
Steve WB2WIK/6
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Goodbye to Yaesu
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by KJ4DGE on July 22, 2009
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I own an ICOM V85 HT, a Alinco DJ-V5 HT,and 220Mhz HT a RS HTX-200 and 3 Yaesu's. The ICOM R-5 HT SW radio I sold on E-bay the programming for it is as conviluted as is the V-85, I just feel more comfortable with the Alinco and Yaesu rigs. Each Ham op has their own learning curve when it comes to radio's and mine leans to Yaesu. IMHO.
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lifetime loyalty to yaesu
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by W8JN on July 22, 2009
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hi guys, this is real simple. i have a ftdx9000d and a ftdx9000mp. both were shipped back to yaesu for massive rebuilt with the "pep" program. the rebuild was free and the shipping both ways was free. no other manufacturer in the history of ham radio has ever done anything like this. i sent my icom 7800 back to icom for the factory upgrade for the third roofing filter. icom charged me $1000. my best uneducated guess is the 9000 upgrade would have been close to $3000-$4000 including shipping. i will now stand in front of a fast moving train to prove my loyalty to yaesu...
best 73 paul w8jn
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RE: lifetime loyalty to yaesu
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by AA5JG on July 22, 2009
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Paul,
At least Icom would upgrade the 7800! If you wanted an upgrade on the 706 or 756PRO you had a buy a completely new radio and sell the previous one at a loss! I agree with you on the Yaesu FTDX9000-incredible customer service on that one. For the FT2000 and FT950 the upgrade can be done at the firmware level off of your own how computer. Name one Icom rig you can upgrade the firmware on.
73s John AA5JG
Yaesu FT450 owner and loving it!
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RE: lifetime loyalty to yaesu
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by W3VR on July 22, 2009
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"RE: lifetime loyalty to yaesu Reply
by AA5JG on July 22, 2009 Mail this to a friend!
Paul,
Name one Icom rig you can upgrade the firmware on.
73s John AA5JG
Yaesu FT450 owner and loving it!"
The 7800, the 7700, and the 7600 at least. I have those xcvrs, and have updated the 7700 FW 3 times since I've had them.
And I like the Yaesu products very much, and still have some.
All mfrs have had their share of bad runs. That's just the way it is. There is no perfect "one". If there is, its only in our minds.
I also have the Orion II, another radio with upgradeable firmware.
It's no suprise that there have been so many "beat down" responses to the article author. The poor guy probably hasn't had much equipment, and hasn't ever worked in commercial electronics service repairing any of this stuff, so how could he know?
I'm sure he'll learn like we all do.
I'm suprised that they put this in as an article. Maybe they slipped up, maybe not. Who knows.
Al lot of us that work in the industry take what we know for granted more times than not. Not everyone getting in the hobby has the benefit sometimes of any hands on technical experience at all.
W3VR
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Goodbye to Yaesu
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by PD1JMB on July 22, 2009
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KF7AMY, this is an absolute joke of an article.
First of all, these programming cables are not proprietary at all. The socket on the back of the FT-8800 is a 5 pin DIN one as used with keyboard ports on a PC. You can buy DIN connectors at any proper electronic parts store.
You cannot connect the CAT port directly to a PC, you need a MAX232 or similar TTL to Serial level converter. Since you are a ham radio operator you should be able to construct this with a little bit of soldering.
Lastly, there are multiple sources of software to manage the memory of this rig. Yes, you may have to pay for it. But sometimes people have to be compensated for their effort.
The interfaces on Yaesu radio's could be more practical, but they are _not_ proprietary. The connectors are available, and the CAT interfacing is documented, otherwise there wouldn't be any ham operators selling software using CAT.
By the way, if something is not free or plain and simple does not automatically mean it is proprietary. Try to lookup this word "proprietary" sometime.
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by K9MHZ on July 22, 2009
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>>>>by SW9OFO on July 20, 2009
Dear Brad,
Thanks for the opportunity to discuss my ways of doing it.
I always find or buy defective equipment (had never had a new plug&play TRX) which I repair and use.
Therefore I am quite familiar with the inner parts and I know that intercompatibility between accessories and rigs can be enormously easily achieved, even with small interfaces (maybe even PIC's could be added in them) to connect ANY radio to ANY accessory out there. I cannot swallow their ways of "proprietary" connectors which require access to micro-lathe equipment to replicate, just because the connector is not out at large but needs to be bought along with the actual accessory.
For a pro Electronics Engineer's point of view, one of the type that could design their own SDR's,
I tell you that it is rather offensive of them to tell me to "suck it up and sign the check", as was previously mentioned by another fellow ham.<<<<
John,
I don't know if I'd do the manhood measuring routine ("20 years electronics engineer", etc) on here....there are some enormously talented people who drop in here from time-to-time.
Hey....if you want to build...by all means, build! Yes, that's what so much of this is all about.
Still.....you aren't entitled to anything, so get "offended" all you like if you have to buy a $25 cable, but it's wasted angst. Nobody owes you anything....they're private, for-profit businesses who can develop anything they want. Your right is to get a quality product if you buy something, or to simply not buy what they're offering. Period. Vote with your pocketbook. But getting "offended"? How strange.
Free enterprise.....I hope we can keep it alive. Today though...oh well, better not go there.
Brad
K9MHZ
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by W8JN on July 22, 2009
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john,
brad is 100% correct. vote with your $$$$ dont like a manufacturer? buy elsewhere. yaesu took care of me... for a measley $700 plus shipping, icom lost me as a customer. i am not a nickle dime buyer. shame on icom... no whining from me.. i just spend my $$$ elsewhere.
73 paul w8jn
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FAIL: Goodbye to Yaesu - You ask for it Pal
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by W4UDX on July 22, 2009
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Leif:
"When being slapped, you'll take it and you'll like it"!
(Quote from The Maltese Falcon)
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Goodbye to Yaesu
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by W1LWT on July 22, 2009
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well after reading many feed backs .I agree but dis agree. too start .Nope the list is long for all things in life.
MY boat
My guns
MY camping equipment
MY fishing reels
MY computors
And yes my Ham radio stuff,
Well the fact is I complain too about it. and if I cant make the part I need .Well Ill decide then well it is a part of my Hobby and well I beleive Ill invest into it for me to enjoy it.!!! Mic /cable or connector and or Antenna ...
LEE
www.w1lwt.com
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RE: Not Proprietary
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by KC8RWR on July 23, 2009
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PD1JMB wrote: "First of all, these programming cables are not proprietary at all. The socket on the back of the FT-8800 is a 5 pin DIN one as used with keyboard ports on a PC. You can buy DIN connectors at any proper electronic parts store.
You cannot connect the CAT port directly to a PC, you need a MAX232 or similar TTL to Serial level converter. Since you are a ham radio operator you should be able to construct this with a little bit of soldering. "
Really? Do you know this or are you assuming because it looks the same? Now, I have the 8900 which I think uses the same connector. It certainly looks the same. The FT8900 which seems to be the same radio +2 bands.
With my 8900 I tried a standard 5-pin DIN which I got off of a PS/2 Keyboard/Mouse extension cable.
First, the way they recess it behind the tiny hole rules out most DIN connectors because they usually have a thick plastic body that gets in the way. Once I found one that only took a little filing to make it fit it still didn't work.
No, I didn't try to connect it directly to a serial port. The same connector has the lines for hooking up a TNC. I tried to key the radio with the TNC PTT line. Nothing happened. I assumed that they did something with the pins, put the sockets they mate too deeper into the connector or something so that you would have to buy their connector with longer than normal pins.
Had that worked I would have then hooked it to the level converter so I could connect it to a serial port. Since it didn't I stopped. Was I missing something? If so I'd love to hear what it was so I can finish that project!
KC8RWR
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by K9NYO on July 23, 2009
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PD1JMB: a very good, well thought-out reply. Thank you.
I have owned many Yaesu rigs, and I have done my share of trial and error patch cable construction....one in particular that I recall was some telephone wire w/ RJ11's I used as a "separation kit" for the control head of my FT7100M. Just find the wiring schemes, locate the connectors and solder. Granted, soldering some of the tiny DIN connectors found on some of the rigs can be challenging, but that's really what we're supposed to be all about isn't it? And if you don't want to do that, then you have to pay for someone else to do it...and $24 isn't bad compared to an afternoon of soldering mini-DINs.
BTW...I would think beginner hams would be proud of a project like soldering on a connector for your rig for a old Astatic or Shure desktop (or other cool) mic you found at a hamfest...whether it's for an Icom, Kenwood, Yaesu or whatever is available these days. The next step is creating interface cables or even homebrewing a soundcard interface. Or just buy it--buy then you have to pay and not complain.
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Goodbye to Yaesu
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by WA2ADS on July 23, 2009
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This proprietery stuff is old news. SEARS did it for years, anyone who ever purchased a SEARS lawn mower can remember having to go to the SEARS parts store to get even the simplest of parts. (BTW, for those of us old enough to remember, what ever happened to Roebuck? And, who besides me remembers, I think back in the late 70s, early 80s, when SEARS sold ham gear made by Yaesu?) Your feelings mirror mine about Icom. I do agree with the writer though, the high mark up for accesories is annoying. Maybe all one can do is wait for MFJ to come out with a knock off. In closing, doesn't Motorola own a chunk of Yaesu now, or vice versa?
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Goodbye to Yaesu
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by NB3K on July 23, 2009
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Sorry, but you sound exactly what you are: a newbie. I was an Icom biggot for the longest time. I just bought an Yaesu VX-170 2meter ht and I love the thing for a 120 bucks you get more than you would think and it's a damn good radio for the money. I also have an Yaesu FT-900 and I love it too. No frills hf mobile that does wht it is meant to do. HF. I also have an Icom 756 ProIII that I use most often on Hf but I love using that Yaesu for a second sub receiver and at times I am amazed on its perfomance. I may be some what of a newbie to some degree too. I first got my ticket in 10/05. I have owned a ton of rigs in the past five years.
Icom's Ic-756, IC-756Pro, IC-756ProIII, IC-7000, IC-V8000.
Kenwood's TS-2000.
Yaesu's FT-11R, VX-170, FT-900
My personal opinion, I liked Kenwood's TS-2000 over all the rigs I have owned, even my ProIII. But I traded the TS-2000 and my IC-7000 for a near legal limit amp Ameritron's AL-800 and the Yaesu FT-900. I am thinking about trading the ProIII for the Kenwood TS-2000 for I miss that rig. GREAT SOUNDING AUDIO!!!!
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Goodbye to Yaesu
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by VK2GWK on July 24, 2009
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"I have only had my license for a few months".....
I think it would be prudent to reserve ones opinions and the bashing of a ham friendly brand until you got just a little more experience.......
Yaesu - on the rigs that I have or had - like the FT200, FT980, FT1000mp and now the FT2000, uses only standard plugs and sockets. Nothing proprietary....
You got to know what you are doing when you connect perifirals to your radio.... I think that is where the problem is........
Amateur radio is about learning and experimenting....
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by K1BQT on July 24, 2009
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>The Compatibility Czar will make everything better.<
Oh Norm, this coming from a Planning Board Czar who decides what people can and can't do on their own property?
I agree, though, that if it's too much bother (or too confusing) to swap wires on a DIN plug, perhaps the author chose the wrong hobby and not the wrong radio.
Four legs good, two legs bad!
-- RANGER
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Goodbye to Yaesu
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by KA8PTT on July 24, 2009
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With the annual sales figures of Yaesu, does anyone feel that one persons' upset feelings is going to make a difference? I don't think so.
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by WD9FUM on July 25, 2009
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I remember Sears selling Yaesu gear in their catalog. Monkey Wards also sold ham gear out of their catalog in the 50's and 60's.
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Goodbye to Yaesu
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by N9AMI on July 25, 2009
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I would tend to agree with the author. But that does not stop me from buying whatever product because I have no problem making my own cables and if need be change whats needed to make things work.
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by N4GMG on July 26, 2009
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Stop Complaining
My father bought some ham radio gear in 1957:
xmitter $900
rcvr 600
amp 900
total $2400
At 4%, the cost today is approximately $20,000. What a deal. Stop complaing.
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by KI4SDY on July 26, 2009
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I will be making my third call to Yeasu this week regarding the repair of the outside case of my VX170 HT. On the second call, they wanted to automatically charge me a $35.00 bench fee on my credit card, but the lady on the phone could not tell me how much the part was going to be. She said that the bench fee charge would be removed after the repair and the final charge applied. Huh? That did not make any sense, so I asked to talk to the technician and he told me the part would be $15.00. I find that reasonable and at least I have some idea that the repair will be $50.00 or less, plus shipping.
I will probably be able to force the true final cost of the repair out of the nice lady on the third call, maybe. Then I can make an informed decision of whether or not I repair it or buy a new one. Why all the mystery and wasted time? All that does is frustrate customers! Besides, smart people are cautious about giving out their card numbers for an unknown amount. That does not instill confidence.
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by K4ZMV on July 26, 2009
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My recent experience with Yaesu only strenghthens my respect for the company. I have an FT-2000D and my operating activities are 99% CW. I found a problem with the Yaesu Quadra amp and the FT-2000D. After documenting the problem, CW character truncation, I contacted Yaesu tech support. I wound up working with Yaesu engineers through Mikio, WA6F and the problem was resolved. I was furnished a test fix for the Main software without cost. The fix is now contained in the Main software version 1.49. In my mind, that is superlative customer service. If you choose to avoid Yaesu over the non-problem you whine about, you need to find another hobby.
73, Jim, K4ZMV
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Goodbye to Yaesu
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by WA6TFP on July 26, 2009
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I have been a dealer for 20 years and find Yaesu-Vertex to be the most difficult company to deal with of any in the market place. They trust no one including their dealers and hope they end up chapter 11.
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Goodbye to Yaesu
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by N3LKA on July 27, 2009
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Well, like the others said it happens to a lot of other products. I would buy one connector and then make an adapter with a standard connector.
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Goodbye to Yaesu
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by KL7AI on July 27, 2009
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You might try TEN TEC as at least they are made is the USA and they will take the time to work with you on the phome and to resolve problems. I have never tried a K3 but maybe you could look to them also.
I just like Ten Tec and will suppoert them till the end of time. I cannot warm up to the Yaesu or Icom products at this time. 73's and good luck. Remember "BUY AMERICAN"!
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by K7DZW on July 28, 2009
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The problem with Yaesu is that when they make a piece of crap your stuck with it because there are no options.Case in point the VX-6,7,8 external speaker/mic connection is a piece of crap " not intended to be used " according to the yaesu rep. Yaesu's are like Porsche's. You better get 2 because one will be in the shop all the time.
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Goodbye to Yaesu
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by K4MTN on July 28, 2009
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Welcome to the hobby! Hope you are enjoying it.
As you may have noticed we can be an opinionated group.
73, Andy
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by W3HR on July 28, 2009
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AC5UP sed: >>Sure, it took 31 years for me to punish the largest US corporation for the error of their ways, but I, alone, made it happen.<<
Oh, so you're the one! I was wondering how that happened.
Someone hiding behind "HFRF" sed: >>You actually think you, you alone, drove GM into bankruptcy? You are are very big dreamer about how important you are!<<
Geez, is THIS what happens to us when we get old?
Re: Yaesu... I side with the writer. My Yaesu experiences have all been less than stellar. I had a brand new FT-411E, used it for a while, then put it back in the box and plastic wrap up in the closet for ten years. Become active again, get it out of the box, put a new battery on and... dead as hell. Well, almost. The squelch and volume knobs were dirty all the way around.. not just in one spot where it'd been sitting all this time (how'd THAT happen when it was sealed off in its original box?). Didn't work right, and battery life was for crap. I could understand caps drying out, but pots are not caps. Well, anyway, I attributed it to non-use and oxidation, until doing a little searching and finding that I was not alone in the Yaesu trouble dept.
And I don't even want to get into all the headaches I had with my FT-101E!! Never liked Yaesu's audio, either. Too "thin".
So, no thanks. I'll just stick to the good ol' AMERICAN radios... like ICOM!
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by W3HR on July 28, 2009
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KL7AI: >>You might try TEN TEC<<
Nah. Those guys are too chintzy to even provide swag at the hamfest held across the street from their factory... much less at a big event like Dayton.
Every other radio mfg. exhibits some kind of promotional goodwill at hamfests except Ten-Tec. They are too stuffy to even donate prizes. Oh, they'll SELL you a hat... If I'm gonna parade around in advertising for someone, it's at least gotta be FREE! C'mon.
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by KC6ZSY on July 29, 2009
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Remember to write to Yaesu with your comments as well. They do read letter from HAM Radio individuals.
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Hello to Yaesu
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by G8KHS on July 30, 2009
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On a constructive note Leif, why are you crippling your mobile station with just one mode - FM? If you pxed your FM only box in for an FT857D or an IC706GII you could at least be on SSB and having a great time without messing around with programming leads.
73 es gd dx de G8KHS - John
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by KA9HJZ on July 30, 2009
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this is not new.most anything in electronics is expensive. see how much it cost to buy a new batterypack for a portable phone or a bttry operated drill. i repair my own now. i also make my own dc P.S. plugs.it saves about 40 percent of the cost.i personally can't see how these ham radio outfits make enough money to stay in business. in my 30 years of radio i only bought one new rig.the rest are all used.if you look in QST in the silent ham section more are dying than becomming hams.
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by HFRF on July 31, 2009
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This has got to be the dumbest "article" yet. "goodbye to Yaesu" sounds like something a 14 year old drama queen would say, and over a 20 dollar cable the writer is bitching about. What a joke!
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Goodbye to Yaesu
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by KC5CQD on July 31, 2009
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LOL! If you think "$24.00 plus S&H" is expensive, then you're in the wrong hobby, my friend. Ham radio is friggin' EXPENSIVE!!! Get used to it. George Carlin (R.I.P.) once said, "I have interests. Hobbies cost money but interests are free."
As for Yaesu: They are a Gold Standard in the ham radio industry. I'm not saying that they're the best...just an icon in the amateur radio community.
Let me give you an example....
I've never owned a new Ten Tec radio. Know why? Because all three times I've called them and tried to buy a new rig I was told that, "We're not on that production run right now. We'll send you the radio in three months." So I bought from the big three instead. Ten Tec's production is lousy!! But....they make damned nice radios.
All of the companies have their glitches, I suppose.
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by K2WH on August 2, 2009
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"The second was a Motorola converted to HAM 2m and it is a great radio, with great sound."
The Motorola requires proprietary software also. You have no idea what you are talking about.
K2WH
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by K6WLT on August 2, 2009
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Hey Leif...haven't talked to you in a while...how's Katie?
I understand your frustration with Yaesu. I just bought a battery charger for my 897's batteries for more than what a cable should be legally allowed to cost.
73
Scott
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by K4RYR on August 2, 2009
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Being that I am in the electronics resale business I can attest that parts cost a lot more than you might think, when you factor in the connector cost, cable and labor...sometimes $20 doesn't look so bad. Especially when your like me and too shaky to do that fine close in soldering any longer. We should be thankful that Yaesu is still around supporting ham radio and especially with radio's like the FT-950 & FT-2000 that they provide "no charge" software updates to make the radio better and better!!!! Sure beats going out and buying a new radio every time someone comes out with something a little better!!! Especially since Kenwood looks more and more like they are not going to be in the ham radio business that much longer.
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by VE3ES on August 2, 2009
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WHINE, WHINE, WHINE, WHINE, WHINE, WHINE, WHINE and when you're finished, whine some more.
I supposed you won't buy another vehicle from whatever auto company because they sell something that's proprietary. Same with a camera, a TV set, your stereo, DVD player, whatever.
This "Goodbye to Yaesu" is the most stupid posting I've ever read on e-Ham and it should be deleted!
Judging by the call you've been licensed for a few weeks now and you might even one day get on a HF frequency to enjoy what ham radio is truly about.
In the meantime, keep whining because you can't do something useless with your 2m FM set. At this point, you're one step ahead of CB. I suppose you won't buy a new Cobra because something is proprietary.
WHINE, WHINE, WHINE, WHINE, WHINE, WHINE, WHINE, WHINE...
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by N6CIC on August 3, 2009
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Sorry Leif but I feel I must disagree with your thesis. I own several Yaesu rigs, plus three Icom rigs and a classic Kenwood rig. Firstly, all three make very fine rigs, and Yaesu is certainly a technology leader in ham equipment. I have not had a problem with cable and connector incompatibility and there are also many third parties out there, including those on eBay, who sell the necessary cross-connectors. So is that a reason to reject all Yaesu equipment-I think not.
73s, Scott, N6CIC
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Goodbye to Yaesu
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by N0MUD on August 3, 2009
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I am sorry to have to tell you that you are wrong about having to use extra wires, plugs, propriatery equipment to program your Yaesu. I have three FT-8800r's and I manually program them without the use of any additional wires, equipment or any other garbage. I also have two FT-7800r's and I also manually program those radios without the use of anything extra. All you have to do is READ the book, OWNERS MANUAL. It will walk you right thru the programming of those radios. I also have a VX7r and I manually program that HT without the use of anything else. Again if you just open the book for the FT-8800r's and read it you will see it is very easy to use. If it wasn't for safety I could even program the radio will driving but NAH, that's just as bad as texting while driving and everyone who does that is just asking for trouble. I also have a FT-897D and two FT-857D's and all three of those radios operate the exact same and program the same. You just have to know where the buttons are on the FT-857D's because they are in a different place than on the FT-897D. The only Yaesu that I didn't like was the VX-5r, HT, and I sold it just as fast as I bought it. I just didn't like it nor did I like the modes and bands that it covered. No the VX-7r is not the same it is different. I even had a FT-60 HT and it also was very easy to program, it's just that radio took a krap on me so I put it on the shelf for now. In the owners manual for the FT-8800r you start at page 21 and stop at page 34. Gee whiz that was easy. That's have of the 68 pages.
73s and have a good day and if you don't like the FT-8800r's I will take them off your hands.
Mike, NØmud
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by AF4KK on August 4, 2009
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I suppose that if Yaesu didn't make such excellent products, it would be a reason to stop buying the band. Otherwise.......
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by KA2FIR on August 4, 2009
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Hi,
I have a +2 week-old FT-950 and have discovered that it has drifting spurs on 15 and 17 meters with only AMP1 on. I've posted for help on Yaesu's website last Friday. Still waiting for a response.
Mike
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Goodbye to Yaesu
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by N7ZM on August 4, 2009
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Your comment doesn't make any sense. Been in radio since the 70's and it has always been that way. Gee my 1998 Chevy can't change parts with my 2008 Jeep. Maybe i'll stop buying Chevy products now. Wake up and smell the roses, we have more to worry about than just this.
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu . . . Damn Right !
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by YEPSURE on August 4, 2009
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All these people who try to use swapping car parts to make their point need to grow up and get a life.
It isn't even close to the same thing. You know it and we know it. But people sometimes defend things just because they think product "x" is the greatest there ever was . . .
Ignorance is bliss I guess.
Yaesu does what they are accused of doing in order to make more money. That in itself isn't a bad thing. However, there could EASILY be a standard for these things. I'm sure some of the manufacturers would be for it while others would be against.
Yaesu must first get hold of and do something about their extremely poor service record. Just take a look at Yaesu's customer service ratings here on eHam vs. Kenwood, Icom, Alinco, Ten-Tec, and most of the other companies large enough to have a footprint in the world and you will clearly see where Yaesu falls flat on its face.
Just because YOU had a good experience sending your radio in for repair in no way means everyone else has too. Yaesu's very poor service record speaks for itself.
I wouldn't buy another Yaesu again either. But not because they shaft the buying public with their proprietary parts. They simply need to get their sh!t together before the rest of the buying public can take them seriously.
If your happy with Yaesu, good for you. But not everyone likes them. Some folks plain hate'm because they demonstrate year after year they just don't care about repairing your radio correctly, or about even sending you the same radio you sent in to be fixed.
Yes indeed. Yaesu did it again.
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu . . . Damn Right !
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by K6JPA on August 4, 2009
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I, on the other hand, have had nothing but excellent service from Yaesu... and this is from a die-hard Icom fan. For example, their PEP program has been a wonderful experience. They upgraded my 9000D without any issues, and even did extra work for me while it was there at Yaesu at no additional cost to me. Their communications throughout the process was wonderful. It was obvious to me they were dedicated to "making things right" for their amateur customers. I will certainly be a repeat Yaesu purchaser as a result. Jim/K6JPA
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by KI4SDY on August 5, 2009
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Here is an update on my Yeasu VX-170 cracked top of case repair. After four phone calls, I finally got their customer service representatives and technician to spill the whole beans on the repair cost. They will repeatedly ask for your credit card number before they will explain how it works. They charge a $35.00 bench fee to find the problem. Then, after the repair is authorized, they supposedly cancel the bench fee and charge you $70 per hour (just like AES) plus parts. To them, five minutes to install the new case equals $70.00 plus $15.00 for the part and $10 to ship it back. I might as well buy a new HT, under warranty!
To make a long story short. I refused to give them my card number (who would?) and demanded the entire charge for the repair. After I dragged that out of them, I told them to send the radio back on their dime. I will order the case part after the radio is received and put it on myself. In short, if your radio is not under warranty, try to fix it yourself or have it repaired locally by a reasonable shop.
I like their products, but not their lousy customer service!
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by KA2FIR on August 5, 2009
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KI4SDY,
That is horrible.
Wonder why Yaesu did a recall of the 9000 but not the 2000?
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by N4GMG on August 5, 2009
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To: KI4SDY
So, I gather from what you said that the price for the part and the shipping is OK. Your just unhappy with the labor cost since you think the repair requires 5 minutes.
If it was so simple, requiring only 5 minutes, why didn't you just order the part in the first place and fix it yourself? Further, somehow I think when you add up all the time required to deal with your radio and you, the total time will be much more; probably close to 1 hour; diagnosis,talking to you, fixing the radio, packing & shipping, etc. Their charges are realistic.
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by IK0VSV on August 6, 2009
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hej friends!
during more than 20 years i bought all yaesu radio....but...i had some problems whit ft100 failure.
display board off.
the maintenance service ( good and professional) told me that yaesu dont support the ft100!!!! only after 5 years!?
i wrote to headquarter in japan....no answer. the ft100 repaired after 8 months!!
i will not more yaesu radio in the future.
kenwood for example support the TS50 whit all spare parts after all years....
best 73
de ik0vsv
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by KD6NIG on August 6, 2009
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Its hilarious how people will complain about this kind of stuff, yet they will get a new cell phone every 2 years and get a new case, car charger (because the plugs are never the same) etc for it and its no problem.
You want to talk about a business that makes money off accessories! And I can't believe what people spend to make their phone ring with something funny as well.
But a cable for an 8800 is a pain? Come on :) At least you don't have to trade it every 2 years for a better one.
Unless you like the latest and greatest, of course.
Oh, and computers are another great source of this kind of thing as well :)
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by KG4YMC on August 8, 2009
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I had to laugh, it reminds me of old (new) days with photography equipment. Each electronic flash company had there owne syn cord plugs , none where compatiable. Nikon cameras may still have the same bayonet mount. I know I am comparing cameras to radio , but the idea is the same . The manufactors want you to have to buy there stuff exclusivly. Same thing with film cleaner or anything with the great yellow kodak on it , was always highter. When Pentex tried to make the screw mouunt lens the standard,it din't work . Independent camera lens companys would come up with there owne lens minus the mounts so you would have to buy the adaptors. The connector companies for radios could do the same thing, then you have to pay for the adaptors , back to square one. Argument manufactors of cameras used and radio also is there don't want inferor after market stuff on there equpment . Valid arugment or not ? same story with icom mics for 210 0h I have, it wouldcost as much as the radio to fix my mobile mike so hang it on 2, I"Jll save money for hf rig. 73 kg4ymc gosh, I can almost type on home computer, retirement has advantages, still have to miss spelling sometimes or flamers will have nothing to do .. 73kg4ymc
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by WA2JJH on August 10, 2009
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Agreed. I could care less about Yeasu.
Yeasue is also indirectly responsible for the cocain cowboys of the early 80's.
I worked at one of the scarce ham radio stores, back when I was 17 year old extra/wiseass.
The rule was a ham radio lic must be presented to purchase a ft-101EE/e/ex. However they got greedy.
As a young lad I wondered why these very well manored latino dudes could buy 20 ft-101's at a time.
I was told DO NOT ASK ANY OF THESE NICE FOLK FOR THEIR CALL!!! TREAT THEM LIKE GOLD. IF THEY GIVE YOU A ENVLOPE 200-300 BUX.....JUST SAY THANK YOUR SIR. THAT MONEY IS YOUR TIP BECAUSE HE LIKED YOUR DEMENOR!!!!!!
I must have made $7000 in a few months.
WTF DID I KNOW. I was 17. I did not touch ethnol,cigs,pot, or any drug.
The 100Wah JAH-a-su(the nice dressed drug barron pronounced it that way) is perfecto for me to talk from colombia to Rego park/corona(Major coke hub).
It good radio. Oh, you are a smart boy, you will be rich like me when you grow up, he said.
I did not have a clue back then of what this dude was about. Today,....Fahgetabbout!!!!
The FT-101 was a smash hit with the original FREEBANDER BONEHEADS.
So, I spit on yeasu beause I purchased a POS FT-100D and the all too easy 11M mod.
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by KM6X on August 10, 2009
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I can't believe you need the programming software for the FT-8800. The 8800 is so simple I have one in my go kit because programming is so intuitive that I can leave the user's guide home and get along just fine. Now the FTM-10R is a radio that is just screaming for programming software. I have one installed on my Harley, using the proprietary mic cable to a 5-pin DIN mounted above the gas tank. From there I plug in a older Harley CB radio headset. I get excellent audio reports and just finished a two day public service event and received many compliments on my signal and audio. It's a quirky radio, but totally awesome for use that is subject to rain, and has no competition from the other makers. Get the CT-M11 or put the rig on ebay, nothing else you can do.
-James
KM6X
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by N5TXN on August 11, 2009
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I'll take your two used FT-8800s. That would make me having five, plus two FT-60Rs, and an FT-897. I for one buy nothing but Yaesu ... I like their hats.
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Goodbye to Yaesu
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by MCDO320 on August 13, 2009
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I am new to ham Radio as well, I got my first 2 meter Yaesu FT-2800M. I am delighted with it's features and build quality. An with a price tag of a mere $120. Plus shipping brand new, I did a lot of looking and pricing. Yaesu was handsdown the best price and features for the buck! As other's have stated, It a price to play! I hope you continue to buy Yaesu product's, I also bought a Galaxy 10 meter rig. It cost me near $399.00 and sad to say it does not even come close to the Yaesu at price nor features. The point, Don't let price change your decision on a Good Brand, but let breaks, none working, no transmitting or just got a month's worth of use out of it before it broke change your mind on a brand!
God Speed and 73's,
Albert
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Goodbye to Yaesu
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by KF2VA on August 14, 2009
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I too have, long ago, decided to no longer purchase Yeasu products. But my reasons are more for quality of product than anything else.
I was first licensed in the early 90's and my first mobile purchase was the Yeasu FT2500M. Nice radio, but a bit short on features, even for the particular time. But, I like to keep things relatively simple, especially for mobile operation.
But, within a matter of months the FT2500M proved to be tricky when changing channels. One or two clicks might well stay on the previous channel or leap you several channels. Although the radio has proven to be solid as a rock, it takes my eyes off the road to check the channel. Oh, well...sort of a minor flaw.
My next Yeasu purchase was the compact FT90. Nice little radio. Get's hotter than a griddle though and shuts down. Looking at the many comments/reviews on this site, I suppose I got one of the good ones though. Mike cord has shredded... obviously Yeasu decided to go cheap on the cover materials.
My final purchase was a rather expensive FT50RD dual-band HT. I purchased it with the Vertex drop-in charger and two extra batteries. But what a POS this radio proved to be, despite it's Mil Spec rating.
Advertised as wide-band receive, it isn't... or at least it doesn't hear without extreme distortion. In-band, it doesn't hear much of anything. At 500 yards it doesn't hear anything less than a 5-watt signal, line-of-site. Fifteen miles from the airport weather channel, I have to go through all kinds of motions to find a sweet spot. By contrast my old Radio Shack HT will pick up the signal from anywhere in the house, including the basement.
Worse problem was that within a year and a half, the batteries were worthless. The AA-pack doesn't allow for rechargeable NiCads. Even when new, the radio would drain the battery within two days, unused! At less than two years, the on-off button failed completely.
My problem is that Yeasu knew of these problems and failed to do a recall or provide free service to fix it's own design flaws. The radio looks brand-new, except as it's seen very light duty. It's been sitting in it's original carton for several years now... as a reminder to stay away from that brand!
By contrast, I've owned several Icom products. None of of them have had a single failure or disappointment. While I'm sure arguments can be made for or against any brand, my own experience shapes what I value and what I stay away from.
What a POS this radio was.
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by RFSOAKED on August 14, 2009
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Wow.. This thread got long but i got through it all.
Some comments..
The few that mentioned the Yaesu Rotors. If you need a connector for the box or the rotor itself go to R&L Electronics. That's where i got a couple from. They even sell cable assemblies with the connectors pre-installed on a length of cable, how could it get any easier than that?? I have two G-800 rotors, one is the older model and on is the newer model, an SA and a S model. The one needed a new connector for the rotor end when i got it off eBay. No problem, placed a phone order to R&L and had it in a few days. Wow that was hard, NOT.
Other parts in the past, i have bought stuff from Yaesu's parts department. If you can get a part number from a service manual that helps speed things up a lot, the person on the other end is usually just a guy/gal that gets paid to answer the phone and take orders, they are not always techs or hams and are not always totally knowledgeable in the model your asking about. But give them a part number and you can find out in a couple minutes if they have the part available or not. Works for me when i call them.
As for what i own thats Yaesu...
2 x FT-7800R
1 x FT-60R
2 x G-800 Series Rotors
1 x FT-847
1 x FT-2800M
1 x FT-8800R
I have also owned...
VX-7R
VX-150
FT-8900R
FT-2500M
FT-2400H
Probably few others but i forget. I have been Yaesu since i got my license all those years ago, my first new radio was a FT-2400H.
As for the other brands, its the same with them too. And all companies have their flops and problems. The thing is if you actually cooperate and deal with the problems your helping to make a better product in the end. I have had a few minor problems with my FT-2800M, one time the receive audio quit on it. Sent it in and it came back with a note that they replaced the audio amp IC, the speaker jack for good measure, and they also did some CPU/Firmware update to it that fixed a transmit problem some others were experiencing. So it seems to me they listen if you take the time to calmly explain what your problems are. It's that feedback from the ham community that helps with the next generation.
For example the FT-7900R just came out to replace the FT-7800R, other than some outward style changes they did update the guts a bit too after seeing minor issues with its predecessor. That's the way it goes with electronics, constantly improving.
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icom free 92ad.....
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by W8JN on August 16, 2009
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i just spent $850 on an icom 92ad and accessories! the darn thing has a proprietary plug on top for the mic and computer interface.... dammmmmmmm that really upsets me. i am going to give this stuff away and never purchase icom again... first person at the door gets a free $850 92ad and accessories boo hoo hoo !!!
73 paul w8jn
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RE: icom free 92ad.....
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by W8JN on August 16, 2009
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ooooppppssssssssssssss all gone... looks like lots of people are willing to overlook the proprietary plug.. boy are they stupid. they are going to have to buy only from icom when they need stuff for their free 92ad..,. are they fools or what????? har har har fools everywhere! boy did i trick them. a rig with accessories from icom only nyuk nyuk nyuk....
73 paul w8jn
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RE: Goodbye to Yaesu
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by 5R8GQ on August 17, 2009
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These newcomers who bitch about the prive of an exhorbitant accessorie just speak a diffferent language! Shhhhhhh!, check it out:
What they Said
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Why do I gotsta buy dis here $39 stupid cable just to yack with other guys yakking on the exact radio?
WHat they don't know
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The Function of said cable has nothing much to do with voice ops at all, if anything. Had he read the owners manual, buyers guide, or onlinr revire, he would have founf that $39 + TAX & Shipping contraption
holds extra alkaline "D" cells in a pair of handy yet porty bandoliers! A look that every outdoorsman i cultivating tis year!
"
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