How to Spot a Scam
Web Williams (KR4WM)
on
October 6, 2009
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The current scammers who frequent eHam, QRZ, and other websites tend to use "form" messages which are easily recognized. Looking at a number of posts to the SCAM section of eHam's classified ad section, it looks like many are being caught before any damage occurs, but it makes me wonder how many hams ARE being scammed and won't admit it!
Things to look for in a SCAM:
1. The buyer asks information about your "item" for sale. The reason they do this is that they send out dozens of e-mails, and it's easier for them to use a word they're familiar with. Because we sell technical equipment, they really have no idea what it is you're selling, and they really don't care. They're just here to bait and scam you. So they tend to use the word "item" to generically describe what it is you're selling.
2. With no variance, they tell you that their "shipper will be coming to pick up the item". They really don't want what it is you're selling anyhow, they just want you to send them the balance that they supposedly overpaid.
3. They ALWAYS want to send you an over-payment, and want you to send them or their "shipper" the difference via Western Union.
4. They usually want to pay you with a Western Union money order. Beware that a large number of these were STOLEN in Europe and never recovered, so what you receive may indeed look like a genuine Western Union money order because it IS. Plus, anyone that has access to a laser printer and magnetic ink can print their own real-looking checks at will. These scammers depend on your bank taking more than a couple of days to discover that the money order is a fake. By the time you've sent them the money, your bank is just learning that the check is fake! After several days, it's time for your bank to ding your bank account for the amount of the bad check. You'll never hear from the scammer again, and by the way, just in case you haven't realized it by now, there is no "shipper" coming by to pick up what you were selling!
5. If you really think you have a genuine money order that is not one of these fakes, tell your bank teller that you're suspicious, and you want them to confirm exactly how many days it takes for it to totally and completely clear with no recourse to you if it turns out to be bad. Get it in writing.
6. Scammers almost always tell you to put a hold on the "item" and ask you to tell all other interested buyers that whatever it is has been sold. My guess is that this is supposed to make the target feel more comfortable and at ease.
7. A lot of times, they will ask if everything concerning the transaction is "understood". I think they say this just to confuse you and make you think they're a sharp and shrewd business person.
8. They sometimes ask for your "last price".
I'm of the mindset that there is someone training these scammers to do this, or quite possibly, there is some type of "scammers guide book" that they can take pre-written messages from to use in scamming folks.
The best practice to combat these scammers is to REFUSE to sell to anyone outside the continental U.S., Alaska, and Hawaii. The great majority of these scammers seem to be in either Great Britain or Nigeria, but I have seen some scams originating in Canada as well. I can understand them coming from a corrupt country like Nigeria, but I fail to understand why Great Britain doesn't cooperate with the international community and put a halt to these scammers who are based there. If your scammer is in Nigeria, don't hesitate to call him (or her) a MUGU, which is derogatory Nigerian slang for SCAMMER.
If you feel so inclined, it's great fun playing "scam the scammer"! See if you can get them to send you the fake money order so you can frame it and hang it on your wall! It costs them postage and time to get it to you,
and you can feel content in the knowledge that you took a fake or stolen money order off the street! When they pretend to be all mad that you didn't send them the money, let them know that you knew about their little game from the beginning, and have already turned them in to the U.S. Postal Service for mail fraud!
-KR4WM
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How to Spot a Scam
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by NV2A on October 6, 2009
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I find accepting CONUS business only and paying in US Postal Money Orders works good for me. After I get them to accept a Postal Money Order I waste no time in telling them why. "Because it protects both of us. If I send you a forged instrument it is a Federal Crime and, it's a Federal Crime to use the US Mails for Postal Fraud if I don't get my item" The only fly in the soup is "reasonable shipping time". It is not defined in Postal law and reasonable could mean damn near anything unless you both have a prior written understanding that it means X weeks from receipt of payment.
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How to Spot a Scam
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by M5GWH on October 6, 2009
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As a seller and buyer in Great Britain, could you possibly list your reference source of information regarding scammers in this country as, after reading your very good article, I feel we Brits have now all been 'tarred with the same brush' that we too see the Nigerians with, et al.
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How to Spot a Scam
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by G3NWD on October 6, 2009
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Useful article from Web Williams, KR4WM, but he is way off beam on his slanderous outburst asserting that Great Britain doesn't cooperate with the international community. Sheer myth and Fantasy.
Our UK bankers who got sucked into your Enron scandal were extradited and you saw them in your US courts in handcuffs.
The problem we all face in business is that of evidence, and of the cost of pursuing petty theft across state and international borders. Far better, as KR4WM suggests, to avoid the problem in the first place.
The "best practice" advocated by KR4WM is also off beam. No sensible business wants to restrict themselves to only selling things in their own small town or hamlet where they can personally verify each buyer and every delivery, at the cost of failing to exploit millions of potential customers worldwide. Specifying that you would REFUSE to accept buyers from outside your own particular chunk of political territory may help you feel satisfyingly patriotic, but it is not the way for busines to create customers.
You can carry out perfectly sound business all over the world, with verification from international companies and banks and tracked mail services.
Just don't accept Western Union money orders. Especially stolen ones.
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How to Spot a Scam
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by AD5VM on October 6, 2009
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Wow! You just completely described a transaction that almost took place with me a few weeks ago. I was selling a guitar on Craigslist, got an email saying he was interested in my "item" and that I "should take the listing down" because he is going to buy it. And that he would be sending me a "western union money order" and that it was accidentally made out for 300 dollars "more than I was asking" and that I could just "send him the difference" and that his "shipper would be comming to my house to pick up the item" and that he was in the process of moving here from "The UK" he even asked at one point in the exchange if "I understood"
I finally told him "Dude, it's a used guitar for sale, if you want it, get some cash and meet me in the Wal-Mart parking lot, otherwise stop wasting my time"
I never heard from him again.
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RE: How to Spot a Scam
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by KR4WM on October 6, 2009
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I guess some explanation is necessary to the British members of eHam. The scam e-mails are worded in a particular way that suggests these are hard-core scammers, not your ordinary run-of-the-mill British citizen. I don't mean to suggest that all hams in the U.K. are dishonest. I don't think your fellow countrymen are scamming you because it would be easy for your country to prosecute them at home, but it IS a problem with some of them scamming us here in the states. More likely than not, they're not hams, but hard-core scammers who peruse the amateur radio for-sale websites preying on unsuspecting people. Several times a month, I get and e-mail from someone claiming to be in the UK, with an e-mail suffix indicating that the e-mail came from there. Many, many times I get an offer to buy from the U.K. with a proposal to send the difference in funds back. I even got a proposal from the U.K. to rent my beach house, and the "lady" sent me a fake certified check for $5000.00, asking me to send her the balance so she could afford the airfare to come to the U.S.!
The scam source percentages are in the range of 20% U.K., 20% Hong Kong, and 60% Nigerian. Normally, the contents are practically the same scam played by the Nigerians. Possibly, it's Nigerians who migrated from their country and are up to their same tricks after moving. Sometimes I've "won the U.K. lotto". I've never entered it, so there's no possibility that I could have won. Other times, some person who has lost their entire family to some government death squad wants my help to smuggle millions of dollars out of their country. Imagine that! Out of the millions and millions of people in the world, I was the "chosen one"! HAH!
You fellows, on the other hand, may possibly be the recipients of scam e-mails from the U.S., but I don't see any of you British gents complaining about it, so I must assume it's not a problem.
It's always the same three scams.
1. You've won the U.K. lotto.
2. Help me get millions of dollars out of my country before my government does something to my family.
3. I'm sending you a money order, cash it and send me the balance after deducting some amount to pay for what you're selling.
Please don't think I'm painting you all with the same brush, just know that a disproportionate number of your fellow countrymen (not ham ops) are scamming U.S. folks. Hopefully my post will allow some fellow hams to pick out the valid deals and reject the scam offers.
73, -KR4WM
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RE: How to Spot a Scam
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by KR4WM on October 6, 2009
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I almost forgot: M5GWH, if you send me your e-mail address, I'll forward you the scam e-mails I receive from your country as they arrive. Unfortunately, when I delete an e-mail, I have no further access to it, and I have no way of knowing when the next one is going to arrive.
73, -KR4WM
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RE: How to Spot a Scam
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by K0BG on October 6, 2009
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This is the e-mail address of one scammer I am aware of: Joe Robin <joerbn72@googlemail.com>
He had tried to buy an ALS-600 amplifier from me which I posted on e-ham.net. Same modus operandi as outlined in the article. My first clue was he had no call sign, and that he was buying it for someone else. The second clue was the repeated requests for my contact information, even though he obviously had same from the classified ad. In any case, I never received any check, money order, what have you, as he apparently realized I was onto the scam. If I had, I wouldn't care about keeping it, I would have just turned it over to the FBI.
Alan, KØBG
www.k0bg.com
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How to Spot a Scam
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by N0CU on October 6, 2009
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In a related, but different way, I have recently started seeing what appears to be a "pre-scam". It is aimed at getting email addresses for the real scammers. They offer some nice product (new computer, etc) for free as part of a company (DELL, HP, or even an unkown brand)sponsored promotion if the individual sends in some number (typically ten) of his/her friend's email addresses to the originator of the offer. Sometimes, they add onto the gift (better computer, etc) for each additional 10 emails they receive. Shortly thereafter, offers from the real scammers (as described above) start showing up in large numbers to the folks whose email info was revealed. What makes this activity so frustrating is that it is your friends that are sending your email info out to the scammers. Oh yes, the gift never arives.
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How to Spot a Scam
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by N8EMR on October 6, 2009
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I posted about 20 things (non radio related) on craigslist this summer and on 85% of the items I got scammer emails.
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How to Spot a Scam
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by N3LKA on October 6, 2009
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I also had this happen on Craigslist. I find it handy to Google the senders name and or email address. It usually pops up.
I did find by adding the small line of "no scammers please" I haven't received any more scam email replies, not yet so far.
Lastly, I tell everyone if they want the item shipped, they're to use Paypal. I know Paypal has some issues but Paypal is secure. I'll pass along the extra cost for Paypal to the buyer on Craigslist, and they're told ahead of time.
Most of all I use Craigslist for local transactions as well as QTH. I'd rather see and touch my gear before I spend $$$$ on anything.
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U.S. Scam Percentage ?
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by G3SEA on October 6, 2009
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KR4RWM is doing a service by alerting hams to these scams.
However I am curious as to what the U.S. percentage is of these scams ?
KH6/G3SEA
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RE: U.S. Scam Percentage ?
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by G3SEA on October 6, 2009
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Whoops ! Make that KR4WM ;)
KR4WM is doing a service by alerting hams to these scams.
However I am curious as to what the U.S. percentage is of these scams ?
KH6/G3SEA
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RE: U.S. Scam Percentage ?
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by WA8MEA on October 6, 2009
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Still a HILARIOUS satirical look at the world of e-mail scams. (A little old, but still relevant....)
http://j-walk.com/other/conf/index.htm
73, Bill - WA8MEA
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RE: U.S. Scam Percentage ?
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by WD8T on October 6, 2009
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Or if you would like to read some really funny "Scam the scammers" email interactions go to:
www.scamorama.com
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RE: How to Spot a Scam
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by WA8MEA on October 6, 2009
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Speaking of scammers:
WHAT makes old folks so vulnerable and WHY???
My mother-in-law is no dummy. She's 88, spry, a widow but plenty of family around. Two days ago the XYL was over there because "gypsy workers" had told her that "they were doing work across the street and wondered if she wanted her dead tree cut down." (A typical driveway blacktop scam, but this one was about tree cutting....) They wanted CASH....up front. She said, no.
They came back yesterday, again asking for "cash up front." She gave them a check instead.
A few hours later, after cutting down the tree and cutting some of it up, they declared they "underestimated" the work and needed another $100 check.
SHE GAVE IT TO THEM!
I finally called my nephew....a cop in training....and sent him over there.
Her logic was, "Well....the other tree was $1000 so I didn't think it unreasonable." Dam! The other tree was actually two MASSIVE trees growing together and it was insurance work after a storm! (Always a higher estimate.)
I just don't get it. Fear? Wanna be nice?? Rx drugs the doctors give 'em?? What makes seniors do this???
(I need to know cuz I'll be one soon....)
73, Bill - WA8MEA
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RE: How to Spot a Scam
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by NB3O on October 6, 2009
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More info on the Nigerian 419 scam can be found at:
http://www.419eater.com/
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How to Spot a Scam
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by KC2KQB on October 6, 2009
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Ive put my boat up for sale on an association website that was for free. Everytime I list there I get the same scam. They ask you for the price. Then they tell you that its accepted. Then they want a check for the shipper up front that you will be reimbursed for. I tell everyone who is interested in purchasing that they have to see the boat in person or no deal. That squashes the scam.
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RE: How to Spot a Scam
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by VE3TMT on October 6, 2009
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These scams have been around for so many years it isn't even news anymore. So have articles like yours, telling us how to spot a scam, and how to steer clear.
If after all these years, there are still people falling for these scams then they deserve it. If the umpteen warning signs don't clue you in, then nothing will.
And I don't agree with your advice on avoiding dealing with any country just because you got a scam email from someone in that country. If that was the case I would have stopped dealing with US amateurs years ago.
Max
VE3TMT
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How to Spot a Scam
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by K9WJL on October 6, 2009
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Jeez,
I'm certain this article is helpful to some, but why not an article about radios or antennas or something like that? I think anyone who would fall prey to one of these scams is just not "all there".
Please Eham, let the next article be about Amateur Radio.
73,
Bill K9WJL
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RE: How to Spot a Scam
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by AB7E on October 6, 2009
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I have to agree with VE3TMT. Anyone with the least common sense that hasn't been living in a cave for the last ten years should know by now how to look out for this kind of stuff, and any article that tries to effectively protect the stupid and gullible is going to require eHam to buy more disk space.
In any case, blanket advice to totally avoid any seller not in the U.S. is misdirected at best. I know of no statistics that say people living in the U.S. are more honest than people in Canada, the U.K., or any other country. Crime rates in fact tend to indicate otherwise.
And for sure your chances of getting law enforcement action on a scam perpetuated from within the U.S. are no greater than if the scam was from outside it. Want to know the reason? Because there is so much of it! If you don't believe, me, call up your local sheriff or FBI office and ask them what their dollar threshold is before they will pursue any specific online fraud case.
In my opinion, this was a well-intentioned but misguided article.
73,
Dave AB7E
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How to Spot a Scam
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by N7KFD on October 6, 2009
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I've lost count of the millions of dollars I've inherited from people I never knew, won from Microsoft, a European Lottery, contests I've never entered and lately UPS and PayPal want to give me money for some reason. Scams are easy to spot of you use common sense.
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How to Spot a Scam
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by W4WSW on October 6, 2009
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Well I just want to say Beware of "John Phillips" from "Seminol trale Oh", he stole my amplifier and he is not to far rom all of us the good "serious" hams.... Here is his e-mail please he is Indeed a scammer, johne2hotty@yahoo.com please Stay Away from him...
Luis / W4WSW
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RE: How to Spot a Scam
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by 5R8GQ on October 6, 2009
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KR4WM, but the term "MUGU" is Igbo (a Nigerian dialect) slang for "Big Fool" and is how the scammers refer to the scammed, not how the scammers refer to their victims, which are "MAGA's". The scammers operate in well organized gangs in Net Cafe's in West Africa mostly. The low level guys send out the e-mails, catch the responses, and turn the potential "paying victims" over to another gang member who is more savvy and articulate. They all turn over a portion of their prizes to the "OGA" who is the head of the gang, and usually fronts money for the Internet time, phoney checks, phoney documents, etc. The OGA's also bribe local officials and police to see that their operations are not disturbed.
There are dozens of variations of these scams as we all know. Be advised if you were paid with a fake check and the shipping address is to the UK or USA, that the person at that address may have ALREADY BEEN SCAMMED into forwarding stolen merchandise for a "fee". That's another scam.
Also note that the scammers will use a free e-mail account like yahoo or gmail or a dozen others. You can use various utlities on the Internet to find out where they really are by tracing the IP Address in the mail header. That "You've won the UK Lottery Scam" usually comes from China in my experience. Some unfair potshots were taken at the UK in the article.
FYI: There is a huge difference in a check being "CLEARED" and a check being "PAID". A check can clear and the new balance will show on your account as
"funds available" in a day or two. But until the monies are actually PAID by the issuing bank, your bank is doing you a favor. The bank can tell you that the check has cleared, and then still come after you for the funds when the check isn't paid. Read the fine print on your bank documents sometime.
I used to collect these phoney checks for fun but eventually bored of it. It DOES cost the scammer some money to have to print the phoney check, and they are usually shipped to you via overnight express if you tell the buyer that you are in a hurry.
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Scammimg The Scammers!
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by 5R8GQ on October 6, 2009
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One owner of a computer store received a large order
from Lagos,Nigeria for laptops paid for with a fake cashier's check. He agreed to ship the laptops to the guy but really sent him a huge box full of dead power supplies, dead CD'ROMS, etc. One time a toilet and even a stove. All AIR FREIGHT COLLECT of course.
And since there is so much fraud in that part of the world, DHL will only accept CASH to release freight collect shipments. Air Freight charges for a stove from USA to Nigeria....about $5,0000 USD.
Here's the thread. This idiot scammer accepted and paid total freight charges of $60,000 on 9 different shipments before he realized he was being had.
http://thescambaiter.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1132
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RE: How to Spot a Scam
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by K9MHZ on October 6, 2009
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This one happens a lot on eBay. They bid on your item, even though you've listed it as US/Canada only, or whatever. Then, you get this song an dance about how high the (Brazilian, Italian, etc) import duties are in their countries, and could you please declare the value as way, way less than it actually is. Then, mysteriously, they "never receive the item" and want their PayPal payment refunded. You balk, but since you devalued the item at shipment, you cannot get your insurance money. So....you give in and refund their payment, and they get the item free.
Brad
K9MHZ
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How to Spot a Scam
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by ARRLBOOSTER on October 6, 2009
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I sell items and use PayPal exclusively as payment. International is no problem as long as you ship to "modern" countries and calculate shipping charges for the buyer. I have have hundreds of ham and philatelic based transactions and not one problem-here or overseas.
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How to Spot a Scam
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by KE4DRN on October 6, 2009
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Hi,
best bet is to IGNORE the scam emails,
never ever reply to them.
avoid any derogatory language, the net
is a dangerous place, very easy for somebody
to find us by using our callsign.
73 james
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RE: How to Spot a Scam
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by QRZDXR2 on October 6, 2009
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avoid any derogatory language, the net
is a dangerous place, very easy for somebody
to find us by using our callsign.
and now you know why I use a PO. box and a slang call sign... been scam'ed too many times and had disgruntal buyers at the door threating to do all kinds of bad things....
here is how it they do it... one was on ebay... a guy (In our case it was a SK outdated ham call) had a heathkit meter for the SB-220... fair price... so we got the winning bid...
He contacted us by using our call sign ... and said he was 85 years old wanted a money order for the item... so he didn't have to show income to social security..
We did that.. and sent it off... 3 weeks later.. no item. We called (had the caller ID on when he called) and surprise the guy answered. He started off with.. where is my money... We said we sent it as directed...
He went to ebay and wrote a nasty gram. We could only show that we bought the PO money order and sent it by mail to him. He still whined. So we got another money order and this time sent it regestered certified. Again 3 weeks went by and no item. Yet we had the signed return card from the PO. It was signed by someone else (A.. Joe Looter.. and not (the SK)call sign name. He still called us all hours of the night and in a drunken stuper whined about not getting his money and again bad noise about us being a scam'er.
Ok enough. We hopped in a plane and went down.. to the dead guys address... was that a suprise.. when his widow said he had been dead for several years... So we went to the PO where the PO Box was...no help... we got on 2 mtrs and found out they knew of the guy.. house and in the garage was a STORE. When we inquired about the person who signed the card... it was the 85 year old guy (Mr. Looter) and not the ham.
When he found out it was his vic in front of him.. he called the cops and said we stalked and threatened him.
Even though we had the P.O card the cops asked him about it and he said he knew nothing.......and said that I was scam'n him because of his age.
later we found the P.O money order's had been run throught a check cashing auto teller for cash back and no signatures on the POMO ...in a account that was of all things.. in his dog's name...phoney and of course closed shortly after by the bank as others were involved too.
The PO said that it was not worth persueing because of the amount. (nice huh)
Basically the guy got away with a hundred dollars of my money. I had the card from the P.O. and filed a claim of fraud. Nothing ever happened to the guy and I got zip.
Later we saw that he was selling a collins ham station with amp on ebay "for a friend" (he was now using someone elses (local) call sign...or probably someone he rip'ed off already) and noticed that he did the same thing to the the vic... as they were upset about he never sent the thing and were calling the ham (by callsign he had used) all kinds of nasty thing.
We even called the local enforcement and still never got any satisfaction they said they knew of him and because of his age though he suffered from dementsa. They suggested we forget about it and chalk it up to experiance...after finding out how little we had lost. (really that is what they said)
To this day we see him still selling things and rip'n people off as he hits craigs list and ebay under different callsigns and names (how do we know.. when you email or soon to expire cell phone card from circle K.. he gives you the same PO box to send the MO to...asks that you not put his dead/dying friends name on it (for the same SS estate money issue reasion) and asks for your callsign-- as he can't sell radios to non hams.. so you give it to him.. huh now he has your info and he always calls to harass you) But, it doesn't stop their... nope he uses your info for the next scam.
...and when he doesn't deliver.. the vic goes to "ham address and call search" and sends a nasty gram to the ham call this jerk used and listed... and then things get interesting when the vic shows up at the hams door that he got from his callsign address...or he gets harassing phone calls all night long or all his tires flattened/brick through the window.. etc... so want to know why we don't list our call sign... grin.. that jerk did it to us too... we had some guy show up to pick up his New in the box estate sale, Collins 30S1 he paid the guy $600 bucks for... the guy that showed up had the right ham call sign but, we don't own a 30S1... however, try and convence the guy who drove all day to come get it from the address this jerk gave him...
So you don't need to go overseas to be taken... it happens right here in the US down san diego way too... let the buyer be ware...is so true...
but, he will get his eventually when he sells somthing to someone , pulls the same MO, except this time they drive up and burns his house down. Till then however, most of the vics that sent money think they need to take it out on the un-suspecting ham who's callsign this jerk used. talk about identiy theft... this guy has a system down pat and skates away to the bank with your money while you get mad at someone (callsign he used) that is totally unaware. And the're is nothing you can do.
Ya if you have something to buy or sell.. ham swap meet ... face to face...
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RE: How to Spot a Scam
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by K5END on October 7, 2009
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quote,
"...said he was 85 years old wanted a money order for the item... so he didn't have to show income to social security..
We did that.."
That, my good friend, was your first mistake. No offense.
There is an old saying that is something like, "you can't cheat an honest man." I forgot who said that, but it may have been W. C. Fields.
It should not have been your concern that he wanted to defraud the government.
Sow, then reap.
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RE: How to Spot a Scam
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by W8JII on October 7, 2009
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QRZDXR2????
Strange story. Why spend the money for plane fare for a $30.00 meter even if you did get ripped off. I can't imagine this whole scenario going down as you described it.
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RE: How to Spot a Scam
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by KA4JNB on October 7, 2009
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My son, in business for himself, sent a $2400 money order to England to purchase an optical fiber splicer at half the local price. He never saw the splicer or the money again. It can happen to you there as readily as anywhere (My son-in-law is from Hayward Heath, near Brighton!). A local British lawyer tried unsuccesfully to pursue the money. Ira KA4JNB
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RE: How to Spot a Scam
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by QRZDXR2 on October 7, 2009
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yep that is what the buyer said.. showed me the add (new in the box... mighty heavy box one can imagine) and the address to come get it at... which was mine... yet I didn't place the add or have the equipment.
I did everything I could to keep from laughing at him.. as he was not a happy camper after driving over 300 miles to come pick it up. He was really miffed off too. We talked for several hours discussing his rip off... I even called the local cops to see if they could help him out-- but, in the end nothing he could do -- after he calmed down-- saddly he left disgruntled and disillusioned that hams do this to hams. (by the way we are still bud's today and talk on the radio almost weekly on CW)
how true you are when I made the mistake of trying to help out a fellow 85 year old (non) ham... never happen again though. You live and learn as I once heard.
But, you guys who put your call sign out and have it regestered to your house... beware as their is no control over who gets it. I agree one should not live in fear.. but, after having it happen to me... ain't going to happen again..kinda thing. The people who do this kind of stuff are SICK SICK or mentally disturbed as they want bad things to happen to people they don't even know by someone they set up. I call it a hate crime but, then not knowing the other people... using the word "hate" says you have a problem with the person and want to get back at them.
It still amazes me to hear mobile hams talking about being on a month long trip...away from the home QTH... no wonder they get ripped off when they broadcast their stupidity on the air.
Think about it.. how would you protect your home and investment in ham radio items, that the thieves can sell at swap meets for pennies on your dollar investment. all they need is a reciever and you give them the rest on the air or internet freebie call sign look up.. don't believe me look yourself up..does your call sign list your home address? Would that tell 'em where to come to if you told your radio bud's that you left town on vacation? How easy would it be for someone to sell a "ham radio" on ebay or craigs list using your call sign and address? Its all right their for the thief to use...(oh by the way I am moving.. the reasion I am selling the radio...so send the Money order too.. my new temp P.O box) And if nothing more than start some hate and discontent between hams just for the fun of it.
You too will be listing a PO. box for a address and not using your call sign on the web. I call it environmental conditioning. not being the first..but taking the advise of others that also have had bad problems when un-invited "guest" show up.
Identity theft...is one thing. Terrorism and stalking is right up their too. Face it--Its not a nice world out their like it used to be. too many frauds and scam'rs looking for a quick fix/bux or one sick sucker looking to rase hate, hell and discontent between hams and then sit back and watch the fireworks.
And as someone once said.. their are those who have been and those that will be. Let the buyer/user be ware. Caution and vigliance is needed if you sell or buy something today. Trust and honor are like ham radio.. historical art'facts
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RE: How to Spot a Scam
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by QRZDXR2 on October 7, 2009
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W8JII on October 7, 2009
QRZDXR2????
Strange story. Why spend the money for plane fare for a $30.00 meter even if you did get ripped off. I can't imagine this whole scenario going down as you described it.
well it was a 50 bux meter used.. that cost me 100 bux in the end.. and I never got it.
If you have ever looked around for the heath SB 220 meters you would know.. if you can find one its like gold cause they don't make 'em any more. Harbach used to have 'em but he quit because they got too expensive to produce. The only supply is used, salvaged from a recycled similar amp.
No we own a small plane so flying their was not hard.
I really needed the meter to make the amp work again. However after this adventure I scrap'ed the amp and recoverd what I could from the sale of its parts. (at a ham swap meet of course) Too bad because all it needed was the one meter after we put a lot of harbach stuff into it-never got used. I think it became 10 budwiser alu beer cans after recycling it.
Wait until you get your identiy stolen... talk about a night mare...
this is a good article that should be printed in QST. It is about time someone exposed these kinds of people for what they really are. In days of old I am sure they used to say " get a rope" and not put up with the nuts.
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RE: How to Spot a Scam
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by AD4U on October 7, 2009
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If the ebay ad says, "I bought it at an estate sale and I know nothing about HAM radios.........." it is probably a scam.
All that statement means is that, "I plugged it in and it went up in smoke so I am selling it on ebay, hopefully to somebody who lives more than a 1000 miles away".
Dick AD4U
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CONUS business only?????
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by AH6GI on October 7, 2009
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NV2A: "I find accepting CONUS business only and paying in US Postal Money Orders work..."
CONUS, Continental United States? I see "Lower 48" in ebay ads sometimes. What's this about?
Do you think you're going get in your LeSabre and drive to, say, Florida or Arizona and "have it out" with the scammer?
Or is there something about Hawaii, which has been a U.S. State since the 1950's??
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RE: CONUS business only?????
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by G3LBS on October 7, 2009
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'C' in CONUS can mean 'Contiguous' which in turn means 'joined together'
Gil
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RE: How to Spot a Scam
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by K3WACKY on October 7, 2009
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QRZDXR2, I wonder how that scammer would have felt being dragged into small claims court if you have that there. Maybe that would have helped. maybe if he got a judgement against him and they put him in jail a day for not paying, at least that gets on his record instead of the police ignoring him.
The police don't care about scammers unless they are killing or injuring people. The problem is that the police really don't treat indentity theft as a crime. Take the story of a woman whose social security number was being used by illegal immigrant and the local police would not do anything. Some police departments need to treat identity theft as the stealing it is, like holding up a gas station or a mugging, but with tougher penalties.
BTW, you have to keep your ham radio records (address, etc....) up to date for your license, I believe it's in the regulations. Not really a choice there.
But your story has some merit, making me think twice about including my ham call in a ham ad.
73
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RE: CONUS business only?????
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by AH6GI on October 8, 2009
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Thanks... but the question is, what are they thinking?
Does someone in, say, New York, think they're going to drive their Oldsmobile 98 to Arizona or Mississippi to have it out with the scammer? It could be something like that since this thread included a confrontation.
Why do they say, "CONUS" or "Lower 48 only"?
Or do they "think" that they don't have the same legal protections in Hawai'i and Alaska?
I see that restriction in "for sales" all the time.
Maybe when I sell stuff, I should say, "every place is welcome to bid but, oh, Illinois or Iowa".
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RE: CONUS business only?????
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by K5END on October 8, 2009
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Funny, I always thought the acronym "CONUS" meant "continental United States," which of course includes Alaska.
But then again, if "greater Minnesota" (sometimes referred to as "Canada") is included, then term "contiguous" applies nonetheless.
(No offense to our friend Canada. It's just a boorish joke.)
:)
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RE: CONUS business only?????
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by KB9BVN on October 8, 2009
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As a seller, nothing leaves here until it is paid for. In the few times I have violated that rule, it was to a customer that I personally KNEW.
I have shipped parts package all over the world. I use the USPS for all of my shipping, and I have not once lost a package when in their care.
If someone pays with a Money Order, I call the issuing bank and get the MO verified. Then I deposit it, and then I call the issuing bank in a few days to make sure it cleared. I do the same thing with checks. I take Paypal but I don't ship anything until the money has been in my account for a few days.
I have never been a scam victim, and I have uncovered one bad check and one fake money order...and never lost anything but the time it took to check things out.
Just do your diligence, and don't be afraid to sell to DX buyers. The world is your marketplace, take advantage of it.
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I don't believe it!
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by WA8MEA on October 8, 2009
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While this thread is being discussed on eHam, I have a unique situation going on with my business that has NEVER before happened.
A customer ordered an antenna. He used his work shipping address. No problem. Done MANY times. Used USPS Priority Mail/Delivery Confirmation. Item shows it was delivered last Saturday.
Customer says; "No it wasn't."
In my almost 21 years in business, I've never had a Delivery Confirmation NOT be delivered. This Delivery Confirmation has all of the details, from the USPS of origin, to the hub, to the local USPS of the customer and then scanned one last time as it was delivered.
Now, many of you think this might be a case of the USPS mis-delivering....or even leaving it outside the door and the package was swiped. Reasonable assumption....
NOW! Let me mix it up. The kid who ordered this antenna has a website which lists HUNDREDS of books that he HAS READ....with titles such as these:
-101 Spy Gadgets for the Evil Genius
-The Art of Deception: Controlling the Human Element of Security
-The Complete Manual of Pirate Radio
-EASY PICKINGS (A self teaching manual in the technique of lock-picking.)
-Get Even 2: More Dirty Tricks From The Master Of Revenge
-Guide to manipulation
-Hoaxes and Scams: A Compendium of Deceptions, Ruses and Swindles
-Home Workshop Professional Lock Tools
-How to Be a Villain: Evil Laughs, Secret Lairs, Master Plans, and More!!!
-How to Cheat at Everything: A Con Man Reveals the Secrets of the Esoteric Trade of Cheating, Scams, and Hustles
-How to Fit Keys by Impressioning
-How To Open Locks With Improvised Tools: Practical, Non-Destructive Ways Of Getting Back Into Just About Everything
-Make My Day: Hayduke's Best Revenge Techniques for the Punks in Your Life
-Pirate Radio Operations
-The Pocket Guide to Mischief
-Revenge Tactics from the Master
-Scams from the Great Beyond: How to Make Easy Money Off of ESP
-Smuggling Made Easier
OK. He appears to be a nut case.
I'm positive he got the antenna and wants to get it for free. So he'll issue a chargeback through PayPal.
Now my question to you: Would you fight it for $60? If you saw the complete file of what this guy reads, one might think twice about taking on this nut. Even if I won, which I probably would, he would harass me and the family for years to come, I'm sure.
Is there any way to go on OFFENSE with PayPal to alert them to check into this guy's account to see how many "non-deliveries" he's had in the past? Have any of you ever done this?
73, Bill - WA8MEA
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RE: CONUS business only?????
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by KD8Z on October 8, 2009
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Funny, I always thought the acronym "CONUS" meant "continental United States," which of course includes Alaska.
Continental US does "NOT" include Alaska, nor Hi., or Guam, Etc., it refers to the lower 48 States only and always has! The term comes from the period long before Alaska gained statehood, thus excluding Alaska or any other future states that may come along.
73
Dale
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RE: I don't believe it!
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by KD8Z on October 8, 2009
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"Now my question to you: Would you fight it for $60? If you saw the complete file of what this guy reads, one might think twice about taking on this nut. Even if I won, which I probably would, he would harass me and the family for years to come, I'm sure.
Is there any way to go on OFFENSE with PayPal to alert them to check into this guy's account to see how many "non-deliveries" he's had in the past? Have any of you ever done this?
73, Bill - WA8MEA"
Bill, yes I believe I would fight it! Starting with taking a snapshot of his website with all the scam books he has read, second by asking USPS if they have had many nondelivery complaints at his work or home address, you can try UPS as well but you most likely won't get any help there. The Postal Service USPS under the freedom of information act are bound by law to give you this info. Little punk needs his butt kicked and you may as well be the first!
73
Dale
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RE: CONUS business only?????
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by K5END on October 8, 2009
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>
"Continental US does 'NOT' include Alaska..."
Sure it does. And sometimes not. It is an ambiguous term.
Which continent contains Alaska?
The same one on which the lower 48 sit.
Don't take my word for it.
See:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Contiguous_United_States
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How to Spot a Scam
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by AB0RE on October 8, 2009
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I've been scammed by a Canadian. I learned a lot of things by the experience:
1- It's impossible to get justice for scams that took place over international lines, even if that's just the US / Canadian border. The process isn't outlined very well and most international authorities don't give a darn when you contact them about a scam that originated from their country.
2- The US Postal Service Inspectors are a pretty lazy bunch. Unless you get scammed thousands of dollars don't plan on them helping out, even if the transactions took place via US Mail (mail fraud) or were paid for with a USPS Money Order.
3- In Canada, hams can simply apply for another callsign after they completely run their old one into the ground. (Just check out VE7JZ & VE7NVI on QRZ - same guy, forced to apply for a second callsign)
4- Utilize the ham-to-ham references at QTH.com (It's one of the discussions in the Swap Chat board). Sure, there are buyer/seller feedback forums at other websites, but the webmaster at QTH was the ONLY one who checked the facts and refused to remove comments from scam victims when threatened with a lawsuit from the scammer himself. And be sure to post GOOD comments about honest hams and smooth transactions as well.
73,
Dan / ab0re
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RE: CONUS business only?????
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by KD8Z on October 8, 2009
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I guess some revel in the word semantics! Go to any USPS office and use the term "CONUS" and they will tell you it means the lower 48 states. It seems you think "CONUS" relates to a continent when it actually refers to the word continental. Herein lies your error!
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RE: CONUS business only?????
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by KD8Z on October 8, 2009
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Do a Google search on "CONUS" and read the very first example? It expressly excludes Alaska!
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RE: CONUS business only?????
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by AH6GI on October 8, 2009
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whoa, you people miss the point.
It's this. Why do some eBay sellers explicitly refuse to sell and ship to Alaska and Hawai'i?
Some restrict their market to the "Lower 48", others say "CONUS" only, as was stated in this thread.
Why do they do that?
Is it force of habit?
Do they realize that USPS flat rate priority mail packages go everywhere in the US for the same price?
Even if it didn't, the eBay rule is buyer pays shipping.
Are they geezers who believe that Alaska and Hawai'i are foreign countries?
I listen to 75 meter LSB so I do understand that many hams are borderline senile.
Do they think that scammers infest Alaska and Hawai'i?
What is it? We had someone in this thread say they sell only to CONUS. OK, Why?
I'm guessing it is habit. They saw someone use that phrase and like a teenage girl, decided it was "cute" and "clever" and wanted to be "hip" and "with it".
If there's another reason, please speak up. Anyone?
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RE: CONUS business only?????
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by KR4WM on October 8, 2009
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AH6GI, I'll give you 3 reasons:
Reason #1: Because I won't have to deal with all the scammers in Nigeria, UK, Taiwan, Hong Kong, and sometimes Canada.
Reason #2: It's easier than typing "CONUS plus Alaska, Hawaii, and Canada". If someone from these areas responds to one of my ads that says CONUS only, I treat them like they're CONUS .
Reason #3: Call me lazy if you want to, but if I only have to ship to another U.S. state (or Canada), I don't have to fill out all the export paperwork. I HATE paperwork! If selling to U.S. buyers only makes it easier on me to ship, then I do precisely that.
I might lose some business because of my sales practices, but I'm not in the "business" of selling. If I lose a sale because I won't ship overseas, no skin off my nose. Not saying I won't do it, but the deal has to make it worth my expenditure of effort.
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RE: CONUS business only?????
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by WA8MEA on October 8, 2009
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Do they realize that USPS flat rate priority mail packages go everywhere in the US for the same price?
*****************************************************
The U.S. Postal Service® delivers more mail to more addresses in a larger geographical area than any other post in the world. We deliver to more than 149 million residences, businesses and Post Office Boxes™ in every state, city, town and borough in this country, as well as to American Samoa, Federated States of Micronesia, Guam, Palau, Northern Mariana Islands, Puerto Rico, Republic of Marshall Islands and U.S. Virgin Islands.
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RE: CONUS business only?????
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by KR4WM on October 8, 2009
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Almost forgot- one more reason. It takes too long to ship overseas in *some* cases. I sent a box of coffee cups to a fellow ham in Finland a few years ago, and they took a few MONTHS to get to their destination! I'm sure the guy wondered whether or not I was ripping him off! The delay caused by the USPS was not worth my reputation as a seller being questioned. I knew I shipped them. There was no reason they could not have arrived sooner. Eventually, they arrived and he felt better after seeing the shipping date stamped on the box! I was made to feel like a scammer myself! You don't think much about occurrences such as this until you're involved.
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RE: How to Spot a Scam
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by QRZDXR2 on October 8, 2009
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Ok.. here is what I did...
After the guy scam'ed me...
I went to the small claims court. To which the clerk said, can you prove he stole it. Ans: Not really except that I have the return card.
Then she said, Your waisting your time trying to get a judgment on this guy from just cerminstans evidence. All he will do is come to court and say "not me" and will want to counter sue for harrassment which he can prove because you are sueing him. Bottom line: its not worth it and you will lose.
Now I did go to ebay and post a report on the jerk with all the happenings. EBAY sent me a email saying that they had to take it down at the request of the JERK who threatend suit for slander and liable. So no way can you get him either. And if you post something on the web... your the target that he can come after. So not much can be done I found. I am sure Hell is full of these kinds of people.
As to UPS shipping, I always insure my shipments. Most of the time its automatic up to a amount with no extra charge. So if the kid ripped the antenna off.. you can file for it through UPS as the shipper and get your money that way. But, then it puts a mark on your shipping record with them and they watch very carefully from then on.
UPS doesn't ring the bell or have someone sign for it these days... instead they drop and run to save time and money and if the item is stolen from the doorstep its insurance time.
I had a brand new icom 706 that I bought out of TX store coming. Excited back then to get it, I watched the shipment as it progressed towards me. Then suddenly it was logged into a transfer place and never logged back out. When it went missing for 3 days I called the credit card company and cancled the charge. That didn't make the shipper happy as now he was out the radio and my cash. I called him and said that it didn't even make it to my home state. He got upset and said he would never do business with me again. It was not my fault but, he got miffed because I cancled the credit sale and it cost him instead of me. (actually better he than me lose the 900 bux) But, he could recover by the insurance so why did he get mad at me? None the less I guess we were supposed to feel bad for him.. but, we went with another mail order house (AES) and got even a better deal in the end... got it almost the next day. Still have it in the car today too.. great radio. And we have bought a icom PRO from AES and a lot more with the same great service. So the guy in TX lost more than he though by being miffed.
So to the guy who lost his antenna... UPS insurance should make it good. As to the fraud stuff. Hold the item till the check clears and then insure it for its value and ship. If they don't like it.. their loss not yours. As to the JERK that ripped me off.. well I hope bad things happen to bad people. I was just sorry that I got taken twice.. me dummy (smile)
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RE: CONUS business only?????
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by KC8VWM on October 8, 2009
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I use the term "CONUS" in the following context...
# 1 I will sell you the item, if the shipping charges don't exceed the cost of the actual item shipped.
#2 I will sell you the item if there is no additional paperwork, forms, FBI, NSA, Homeland Security clearance, passport application including 3 photographs and fingerprints, additional out of pocket nickel and dime fee's and expenses paid on my part for filing forms, exporting etc and/or any requirement on my part to lie about any declared values etc "so you can get it cheaper" etc. involved.
# 3 I will sell you the item if I don't have any added hassles resulting from such an "unusual" transaction. Such hassles sometimes involve shipping delays, customs delays or other similar added inconveniences etc.
For example... There's nothing more annoying than shipping something to a place like Canada, PR, HI or Alaska and getting emailed to death for 3 or 4 weeks later by the buyer demanding an explanation why the item I shipped didn't arrive 3 hours after I shipped it out my door. Seems buyers in these areas expect they should be getting the very same service as the mail I am sending across the street.
Unfortunately these people fail to recognize that UPS, DHL and FedEX and Pony Express are not actually using STAR TREK transporter technology yet.
So when you read the term "CONUS" in an ad, keep in mind this usually outlines the "intentions" of the seller. It really has little or nothing at all to do with any actual geographical location the item is shipped etc.
My Best,
Charles - KC8VWM
"CONUS" only... lol
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RE: CONUS business only?????
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by KC8VWM on October 8, 2009
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Another "gotcha" example why I prefer to ship "CONUS" instead of getting a "hassle."
Scenerio:
Sold an VHF amplifer to a guy in Canada. He paid my paypal account for the item including my actual shipping costs to send him the item etc.
He gets the item. The gotcha part is that he is charged an additional fee of $5.00 by Canada Post before he could pick up the item.
He screams at me because he claims to have "already" paid ALL the shipping charges already and is wondering why he is being charged this "handling fee."
Turn out that Canada Post charges a $5.00 handling fee to the purchaser when items are imported into Canada.
It's not part of the MY actual shipping costs ON MY END So natually, I didn't charge him anything more than the MY actual "shipping" costs to send him that item. I asked what it would cost to ship, I paid the costs, I left the package with them and went home that day.
I can't help if he's getting charged extra when he actually recieves the item. Tried to explain it has nothing to do with me on my end because I already paid the shipping costs to ship him the item.
He apparently didn't think of it in the same way.
Regards.
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RE: CONUS business only?????
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by K5END on October 8, 2009
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>
"Do a Google search on "CONUS" and read the very first example? It expressly excludes Alaska!"
Ohhhh...well now. It is written in stone if you got it from a google search. It's gotta be true. You believed it? There are just as many web sources that say otherwise. You should have read the 2nd, 3rd, 5th, 7th and 11th search results.
See, the thing is, studies have shown that google search result numerated line items greater than 1 and equal to prime numbers (e.g. 2nd, 3rd, 5th, 7th and 11th) are more likely to be accurate.
Definition:
the internet
noun, an infinite source of incorrect information. (copyright 2009)
***************
Isn't it fun arguing about things that don't matter a hill of beans? Great sport, this.
Have a beer.
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RE: CONUS business only?????
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by K5END on October 8, 2009
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quote,
>"I'm guessing it is habit. They saw someone use that phrase and like a teenage girl, decided it was "cute" and "clever" and wanted to be "hip" and "with it".
My compliments. Good one.
I had to bust out laughing at that one. You just described the mentality of a large part of the human race (sheep.) Teenage girls should feel insulted.
In my ebay sales I just say I will ship to anywhere in the United States. Too plain and straightforward? Sorry. I try to leave the trite acronyms to the verbally-challenged sheep. It's their schtick.
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RE: CONUS business only?????
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by K5END on October 8, 2009
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By the way, inside Alaska, "lower 48" is not as common an expression as you might predict.
Alaskans also use the term "outside" to refer to the rest of the U.S. You may be curious about the semantics behind that expression!
I'm from Alaska. I was even born there. So I don't think much of the prejudicial attitude to exclude Alaska, Hawai'i, Samoa, Guam, Puerto Rico, etc. from business transactions with other Americans just because some foolhardy seller didn't know how to sell something long distance. You can get scammed by some cat on the Bible Belt in Buffalo Gap, Texas, as easily. Don't blame your naive seller skills on someone else just because there is a bit of water between your land masses (or between your ears.)
What about Manhattan Island? What about the Florida Keys? They don't fit the strict definition of "contiguous." Let's not be stupid, folks.
I recently bought a very, very nice TS-830S Gold from a Ham in Puerto Rico. Never met the man and I didn't know a thing about him. The rig arrived in the same "mint" condition the seller claimed. And as I recall it arrived about 4 days after I entered the PayPal transaction.
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RE: CONUS business only?????
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by AH6GI on October 9, 2009
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"Reason #2: It's easier than typing "CONUS plus Alaska, Hawaii, and Canada". If someone from these areas responds to one of my ads that says CONUS only, I treat them like they're CONUS ."
Perhaps you might specify, "US and Canada" and not insult Canadians, KL7s, and KH6s.
CONUS is just too "cute". Frankly it is not good communication, given the comments to the thread.
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RE: CONUS business only?????
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by AH6GI on October 9, 2009
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"It takes too long to ship overseas "
Going 75 meter LSB on me? Your comment does not explain why some sellers specify "Lower 48" or "CONUS", which excludes Alaska and Hawai'i.
An aside - I was working on an ICOM last night and listening to 75 LSB... O-M-G. What a bunch of natterer-geezers! They were yammering about politics as if it mattered, synapses firing on the same old, thinly veiled misogynistic, racist, anti-young, inbred, narrow minded, tribal topics. I expected a fury of harrumphings, "dag-nabbits", and "what-the-ding-dongs!" to erupt and peg the meters on their Henry 2K's.
The paradox is that the 75 meter LSB crowd is the salt of the earth, late at night, they must get liquored up or something.
Best entertainment on the air.
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RE: CONUS business only?????
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by AH6GI on October 9, 2009
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"For example... There's nothing more annoying than shipping something to a place like Canada, PR, HI or Alaska and getting emailed to death for 3 or 4 weeks later by the buyer demanding an explanation why the item I shipped didn't arrive 3 hours after I shipped it out my door. Seems buyers in these areas expect they should be getting the very same service as the mail I am sending across the street."
I've bought from and shipped to Canada and there is a delay and some unusually high costs but, the eBay rule is "Buyer Pays".
I use USPS between Hawai'i and the East Coast. For USPS priority mail, not only is the price the same anywhere in the U.S., but it is sometimes FASTER to ship to Hawai'i than, say, Maryland to South Carolina.
The reason is Star Trek-like transporter technology. Since the package is a long haul, time sensitive item, USPS does not have the option of trucking it. They load it on a 747 or DC10 air freighter. They have to make their 2 or 3 day promise and a truck or rail segment won't cut it.
For a small fee, USPS will let you track the package as it moves through their system. Use it and the buyers won't bother you.
USPS is also competitive on price. Mull it over, fast, cheap, gets there.
This is for packages that normal people can carry, say up to a boxed KWM-2. If you're shipping a KW-1, then yes, I accept the 3 or 4 weeks.
Parcels taking 3 or 4 weeks? Not USPS Priority mail. I would not use a lower grade service. Although I have had 4th class items come in less than a week.
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USPS Needs Help...
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by AB0RE on October 9, 2009
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AH6GI's last post seems like an infomercial for the USPS. Although this is a bit off topic, I felt some things needed to be said:
My observations are a bit different:
- For stuff you pack yourself (say in a 10 x 12 x 15" box), USPS is ALWAYS more expensive than FedEx and USPS for stateside shipments. The flat rate boxes are a novel idea, but really, most of the ham radio gear sold online cannot fit in the flat rate boxes and still be packaged properly. USPS divides the states into different zones and they have goofy surcharges for packages shipped from one particular zone to another. Their online quoting system doesn't account for this. It took 30 minutes for my local post office to locate the information regarding the zone pricing for me (you can get an accurate quote within a couple minutes at ups.com or fedex.com with no surprises when you drop the package off).
- USPS's online tracking system uses circa-1980's technology. Every time I've used it it's served more as a "delivery indicator" and does not get real-time updates like Fed-Ex and USPS's systems.
- And lets not forget that the USPS is currently running a $5,000,000,000.00 year/deficit, the tab picked up by American tax payers. That's what happens when the government thinks it knows how to run a business and government employees are responsible for coming up with bright ideas to keep up with the times, haha..... I think there is a reason why it's illegal for any business to compete with the USPS on first class mail - they know the competition would destroy USPS and make all of USPS's overpaid, under-educated employees look silly. I've seen the Postmaster General on C-SPAN a number of times offering excuse after excuse on why the USPS continues to fail year after year - it's really quite sickening.
If you MUST ship your package USPS more power to ya, but if the package goes missing don't forget who you have to deal with to get straightened out.
73,
Dan / ab0re
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RE: CONUS business only?????
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by KD8Z on October 9, 2009
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I guess you didn't do the search because if you did the first example that came up is your favorite website WIKIPEDIA, that same site you quoted in your semantics answer. It looks like if WIKI says it it must be true! Perhaps you should have made the Google search before you responded, as your wiki site came up first, lol!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Contiguous_United_States
"The term contiguous United States refers to the 48 U.S. states located on the North American continent south of the border with Canada, plus the District of Columbia.[1] The term excludes the states of Alaska and Hawaii and all off-shore U.S. territories and possessions.[2][3][4][5]"
Want to argue the point more?
"by K5END on October 8, 2009 Mail this to a friend!
>
"Do a Google search on "CONUS" and read the very first example? It expressly excludes Alaska!"
Ohhhh...well now. It is written in stone if you got it from a google search. It's gotta be true. You believed it? There are just as many web sources that say otherwise. You should have read the 2nd, 3rd, 5th, 7th and 11th search results."
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RE: I don't believe it!
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by WB6RXG on October 9, 2009
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WA8MEA on October 8, 2009 said
"While this thread is being discussed on eHam, I have a unique situation going on with my business that has NEVER before happened.
A customer ordered an antenna. He used his work shipping address. No problem. Done MANY times. Used USPS Priority Mail/Delivery Confirmation. Item shows it was delivered last Saturday.
Customer says; "No it wasn't."
In my almost 21 years in business, I've never had a Delivery Confirmation NOT be delivered. This Delivery Confirmation has all of the details, from the USPS of origin, to the hub, to the local USPS of the customer and then scanned one last time as it was delivered.
Now, many of you think this might be a case of the USPS mis-delivering....or even leaving it outside the door and the package was swiped. Reasonable assumption...."
I had this happen to me except I was on the receiving end. The post office claimed the package was delivered to my business on a Saturday. Problem is nobody was here. I called the post office on Monday. They claimed the package was delivered. On Wednesday they delivered the missing package to my office. What I believe happened is this - the mail carrier scanned the package on Saturday before getting out of the truck. They couldn't get in the building so they put the package back in the truck. They can't unscan the package so delivery is confirmed.
I avoid shipping USPS because their tracking system is so archaic.
73,
WB6RXG
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RE: CONUS business only?????
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by KD8Z on October 9, 2009
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I appreciate the offer of alcohol but to be honest I rarely drink and never with one who does drink as much as you! You are really embarrassing yourself by not reading your own quoted WIKI definitions found by Google. Perhaps you have learned not to drink while in front of a keyboard! It must be very cold in Alaska as the internet doesn't appear to work well there, Wiki seems to have importance when not found by Google!
"RE: CONUS business only????? Reply
by K5END on October 8, 2009 Mail this to a friend!
>
"Do a Google search on "CONUS" and read the very first example? It expressly excludes Alaska!"
Have a beer."
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RE: CONUS business only?????
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by K5END on October 9, 2009
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quote,
"one who does drink as much as you!"
Actually I almost never drink. By extrapolation I infer that you must drink a negative amount. Nice trick.
quote,
"You are really embarrassing yourself by not reading your own quoted WIKI definitions found by Google."
Uh, I think you missed the subtle, facetious point. Wiki, Google, eham, etc. It is all Internet and subject to scrutiny.
I'll stop commenting here. Have a lovely weekend.
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RE: CONUS business only?????
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by KC8VWM on October 9, 2009
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Perhaps you might specify, "US and Canada" and not insult Canadians, KL7s, and KH6s.
----------
How does specifying or making a particular shipping preference arrangement insult anyone?
It's merely a transaction, not a personal vendetta against anyone or any "targeted" group of individuals.
Also, considering I am from Canada myself and all, I would hate to specify any shipping arrangement that would serve to insult myself.
Seems silly to suggest anyone specifying CONUS in any transaction is actually doing so to insult people.
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RE: I don't believe it!
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by KC8VWM on October 9, 2009
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In my almost 21 years in business, I've never had a Delivery Confirmation NOT be delivered.
-------
I have had it occur to me...
Mailed an INRAD fiter the item via USPS. Person got the item ok, but I never recieved any delivery confirmation service that I requested and paid for.
Occured just a few months ago. In fact, I sold the item to another ham who frequents this website.
73
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RE: CONUS business only?????
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by K7LRB on October 10, 2009
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K5END: "What about Manhattan Island? What about the Florida Keys? They don't fit the strict definition of "contiguous." Let's not be stupid, folks."
C'mon Larry, you usually do much better than this. You must be having an "off" day. Manhattan is part of the state of New York, which DOES fit the strict definition of "contiguous". The Florida Keys are part of the state of Florida, which DOES fit the strict definition of "contiguous". "Let's not be stupid, folks." :)
Here is how I plan to post my next ad: Shipping only to the following states of the USA: Alabama, Alaska, Arizona, Arkansas, California, Colorado, Connecticut, Delaware, Florida, Georgia, Hawaii, Idaho, Illinois, Indiana, Iowa, Kansas, Kentucky, Louisiana, Maine, Maryland, Massachusetts, Michigan, Minnesota, Mississippi, Missouri, Montana, Nebraska, Nevada, New Hampshire, New Jersey, New Mexico, New York, North Carolina, North Dakota, Ohio, Oklahoma, Oregon, Pennsylvania, Rhode Island, South Carolina, South Dakota, Tennessee, Texas, Utah, Vermont, Virginia, Washington, West Virginia, Wisconsin, Wyoming.
Any questions?
Lighten up folks, just kidding! :)
Larry, look for you on CW again soon, always enjoy yakkin' with ya!
73,
de Larry
(with Darryl and my other brother Darryl)
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RE: CONUS business only?????
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by AH6GI on October 10, 2009
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"How does specifying or making a particular shipping preference arrangement insult anyone?"
Your kind need not bid because your kind are untrustworthy. We don't cotton to your type in this town.
Please, don't go 75 meters on me.
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RE: CONUS business only?????
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by K5END on October 10, 2009
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Larry, ya got me to thinking.
Dangerous situation, I know. But you started it. hihi.
In the future, I'll only sell or ship to locations for which I have QSL cards.
And I need Iowa. "Today is a good day to do Iowa."
73
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RE: CONUS business only?????
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by KC8VWM on October 10, 2009
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AH6GI,
Are you familiar with what it means to defame and falsely alledge another person's character as UNTRUSTWORTHY without any facts or evidence to back up that statement?
If not, please consult your lawyer...
There's also some good information here on the subject too:
http://www.expertlaw.com/library/personal_injury/defamation.html#2
Have a great day. :)
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RE: CONUS business only?????
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by AH6GI on October 10, 2009
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"Are you familiar with what it means to defame and falsely alledge another person's character as UNTRUSTWORTHY without any facts or evidence to back up that statement?"
Back to 75 meters for you.
TITLE II OF THE CIVIL RIGHTS ACT (PUBLIC ACCOMMODATIONS)
42 U.S.C. §2000a
(a)All persons shall be entitled to the full and equal enjoyment of the goods, services, facilities, privileges, advantages, and accommodations of any place of public accommodation, as defined in this section, without discrimination on the ground of race, color, religion, or national origin.
I'd call eBay a "place of public accommodation".
All persons have full use and equal enjoyment...
... Except, of course, native Hawai'ians and native Alaskans.
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How to Spot a Scam
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by AC5WO on October 10, 2009
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Suggestion I learned from a car blog. If you want to test if the seller on Craig's List, etc. is really an individual or a small time dealer posing as an individual, be a little vague when asking about something for sale. Say something like I'm interested in the car or the HF Amplifier and if the reply is "Which one?" you're probably talking to someone making multiple ongoing sales and not an individual just selling that item.
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RE: How to Spot a Scam
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by WX1F on October 12, 2009
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Doesn't anyone monitor what gets posted on here?? The thread started out with "How to spot a scam" and ended up with Hams trashing USPS, UPS, Canada and each other!
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RE: How to Spot a Scam
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by AH6GI on October 12, 2009
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"Doesn't anyone monitor what gets posted on here?? The thread started out with "How to spot a scam" and ended up with Hams trashing USPS, UPS, Canada and each other!"
Huh?
uh-oh, another one with reading comprehension, critical thinking issues.
Before you get huffy, I'll splain. One solution suggested to scammers was selling "Lower 48 only" or "CONUS only.
Turns out that us hams are not the sharpest tools in the box, probably because we tend to be older and more geezer-like. Age wears out the dendrites and that leads to synaptic misfiring.
We tend to repeat ourselves. The technical term for this is nattering. This manifests as repeating tired mantras and occasionally going into full diatribe mode. Some, mostly on 75 meter LSB, will harangue until the ten minute timer pops or their 30S-1 goes into thermal shutdown.
The question, which is related to scam prevention, was why do some hams specify "Lower 48 Only" or "CONUS only".
Now then, this thread included some nice contrived justifications of the, er, boo-boo. If you've ever watched cats, they'll blunder, bump into something, and then pretend that they meant to do that all along. An example is they'll look around and start licking their paw. "I meant to do that, really."
So, when called on it, the cat-response is, "Of COURSE, I do discriminate against KH6's and KL7's, give me a few minutes and I'll fabricate a rationale."
"KH6's harass me by email when their item doesn't arrive."
Woo-hoo, callin' a yarn. USPS priority mail to KH6-land is 2 to 3 business days and rides 747 and DC10 air freighters. Sending a Collins KW1 by sea will take a month but KH6's know that.
It's all made up. That's not to say it's not "real in their heads". That's how cognitive dissonance works.
Back to 75 meter LSB for you. Don't worry, we will all end up on 75 meter LSB, it . is . our . destiny.
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How to Spot a Scam by 1yr old Pups.
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by KB5ZXM on October 14, 2009
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I bought a camera, heard the ups truck, come to the door,
<whilst I > being wheel chair mobile, he was gone before I got out side. I could hear his brakes squeak as he stopped, at the main road.
Looked all about no camera? called UPS, they sent the truck back that afternoon. He says I put it right here, on the shelf in the foyer. A week passed and my neighbor, 1/4 mile away thru the woods, shows up with a chewed up box that had contained the camera. Has doggie teeth marks all over it and smells of Barbecue sauce. The driver was ,<must have been> having a sandwich I guess ,while he handled the package? One of the local pups smelled it and made off with it as soon as he put it down......I did then and still do have a lock box for freight, but this driver did not use it> so ups allowed the claim, ah? Life in the Woods.
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RE: How to Spot a Scam
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by 5R8GQ on October 19, 2009
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How To Spot A Scam
"I am selling this for a friend/relative." AND:
"I don't know anything about ham radio but when I plug it in the lights all go on and the noise comes from speaker." AND:
"I was told the owner took very good care of his equipments."
Stay away, unless you can drive to that location with your test equipment. (The seller will have an excuse why you can't test it. "I am too busy, going out of town, etc".
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RE: How to Spot a Scam
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by WA8MEA on October 20, 2009
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Just got this in the e-mail this morning. I'm selling a Sangean 818 on QTH.com and here on Eham.
>>Hello
Am intersted in buying your (Sangean ATS-818ACS (w/ recorder) ) So i want you to explain the condition, and i will need the picture of it, also mail me your last price, and just to let you know that i will be paying with (Money Order) ok. I will be looking forward to hear from you. Thanks and have wonderful day.
Regards,
Joe<<
The first give away, they always have two first names. This guy's name was...."Joe Robin". Or....they will often use the names of famous American celebrities or athletes. I have received scam e-mails from Michael Jackson, Michael Jordan and Jessica Simpson.
The next give-away? He asks for stuff that is already in the ad!
I gave a photo....
I gave the condition of the radio....
and gave the price.
So there is no need to even ask these questions.
73, Bill - WA8MEA
http://HamRadioFun.com
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How to Spot a Scam
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by WA6BFH on October 21, 2009
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How about "Hams" that speak of their active awareness and scientific prowess on 6 Meters, but argue that antenna polarization on this band should be only horizontal. Oh, and also state a simple folded loop antenna as all that is needed.
Oh, and also have a girls name, but is really a guy!
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How to Spot a Scam
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by AD1OS on October 21, 2009
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Here's a fairly simple, common one that I didn't see in the other responses. You buy something and pay with a personal check. (by mail or messenger) The seller claims thay never received payment, and will send a Fedex envelope. You're requested to write another check immediately and return it via Fedex or face prosecution. Good way for them to wind up with 2 cashable checks. I've always done a stop payment, and waited the time stiplulated by the bank before issuing another one.
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RE: How to Spot a Scam
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by WA1UFO on October 22, 2009
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Most of the scam emails I have received over the years have been from the UK or Africa. With all due respect, if the shoe fits, wear it!
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How to Spot a Scam
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by AC7XC on October 30, 2009
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I always use a USPS Money order when selling high priced items on the Internet. When you receive the money order you cash it at the post office and get a new money order for the amount less .75 for the MO fee or cash if they have it on hand. Then you can deposit the money or MO in your bank without worrying about a charge back or bounced check situation with your bank.
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How to Spot a Scam
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by W6IEZKEN on November 1, 2009
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You might want to be careful about "scamming the scammer" Many of these people are members of organized crime syndicates and they have retaliated against people doing this.Reporting it to law enforcement and consumer websites plus alerting your bank is the best way to handle it.
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