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[Articles Home]  [Add Article]  

Fighting CC&R's: 20M 4-Square Array

from W4AN on November 28, 2010
View comments about this article!

"Editor's Note: Due to the popularity of some of eHam's older articles, many of which you may not have read, the eHam.net team has decided to rerun some of the best articles that we have received since eHam's inception. These articles will be reprinted to add to the quality of eHam's content and in a show of appreciation to the authors of these articles." This article was originally published on: 03/01/2001

On a more personal note, eHam.net has just hit a milestone in the number of articles submitted since its inception in 1999. As editor, I chose to make this contribution by Bill Fisher, W4AN (SK) article number 25,000, and it is the 10,082 article that I have had the pleasure of uploading. Thank you Bill, for all that you did, and for believing and trusting in me to be your editor so many years ago. You are sorely missed. -- Clinton Herbert, AB7RG -- Editor, eHam.net.



Fighting CC&R's: 20M 4-Square Array

CC&R Happens

When our son got to be around 3 years old, my wife got the itch to get us in to a neighborhood with other children. She also wanted a new house and not something that was built 20 years ago. Seems pretty reasonable unless you are a ham. My XYL won, and we are now living in a neighborhood with restrictive covenants. The wording of the covenant in my case is something like: "No outside antennas visible from the street and any antennas must be approved by a planning board". Boiled down to mean, NO HAMS ALLOWED.

Not Without a Fight

Well, I'm not one to give up without a fight. I've put up various stealth antennas at this QTH with varying degrees of success. Luckily, I talked my XYL in to buying a place that backs up to some farm land. Just behind our house are wetlands which are rarely traversed by anything but ducks and frogs. Near the wetlands is where I would find a home for my new antenna.

Ground is Everything

If I have learned one thing in ham radio, it is that verticals work better when there is a good RF ground. My good friend Tom Rauch, W8JI, would define a minimum good ground for a vertical as 64 1/4 wave ground mounted radials. In my case, installing 64 radials X 4 was an unreasonable near term expectation, but I was still determined to minimize ground losses. Jens, DL2AKC, recommended that I put down chicken wire under my verticals. Of course! We are in the chicken capital of the world here in north Georgia, and chicken wire was had inexpensively and easily. Laying a several sheets down on the ground would be much less work than installing so many individual radials.

I cleared an area that was about 25 feet square. The elements needed to be in a square with 17' 7" separation between verticals. 25 feet was chosen only due to physical limitations (streams on two sides). The chicken wire was laid down to fill most of this 25' area, but ultimately ended up being about 22' square. Approximately 1 foot of overlap average was used between sheets in an effort to improve electrical bonding between layers. After the area was filled, another two sheets of chicken wire were laid perpendicular to the existing layers in an effort to further improve bonding between layers. The chicken wire was held down with long nails and wire. Two nails were joined together at the head with a 4 to 6 inch piece of wire. The nails were inserted in to the ground so that the wire was taught. There were many nail pairs used to hold down the numerous sheets. Another tactic is to use heavy wire or cut up hangers. Later when pinning down radials, I found that 8 inches of electric fence wire worked better for holding things to my soil.

When putting radials down, Dick, K4XU, suggested using a ground rod with a small hole drilled in one end. Lay the ground rod on the ground flat, tie the ground wire through the hole, and slide the ground rod along the ground under the thicket. This worked VERY well for me and it allowed me to put radials where I had previous not considered.

Construction

The verticals were salvaged HyGain 204BA driven elements that I had in storage. The Hygain elements make nice verticals because they are split in two half's. They are also nice because an old Hygain 204BA can be had for very little money or nothing. To maintain a stealthy appearance, each vertical was painted black, green, and brown.

The elements were mounted to a 1 foot piece of Garolite rod. Garolite is a very strong insulating material. I bought my from McMaster Carr off the web. I mounted some galvanized pipe to the other side of the Garolite with 1" spacing between the element and the galvanized pipe. In both the element and pipe I installed a mounting screw for radials and coax.

Initial Installation

When the verticals are fed as an array, the array will move up in frequency slightly. Therefore when I installed the first vertical I cut it for minimum SWR around 13.950 Mhz, hoping the array would be resonant around 14.050 MHz when installed.  I installed one vertical and connected it to only the chicken wire ground screen using several long pieces of wire woven through the chicken wire from the vertical to the opposite sides of the ground screen.  The vertical was only a few feet from the edge of the ground screen in one corner.

Evaluating an Antenna

When I read articles about antennas, I normally first skip to the end of the article where authors almost always give their impressions of how the antenna works. If the author quotes his logbook providing a list of DX worked or quotes from stations worked, I will read the article with a high degree of skepticism.

Examples of poor evaluation techniques used in evaluating antenna performance
"I worked the following DX with this antenna" Blah, blah, blah. A first rate operator will work DX with a lousy station. Quotes like this are as likely to be a testament of the operator than of the antenna.
"Several mentioned I was the loudest station on the band" Blah, blah, blah. Another example of an author providing unreferenced reports of antenna performance. Too many unknowns to be taken seriously.
"Won the XYZ contest with this antenna" Blah, blah, blah. 100-to-1 says this same guy was operating from a propagationally advantaged QTH.

I knew that I wouldn't be able to evaluate this antenna without a reference. My reference would be a dipole antenna mounted at the very top of my roof in the attic. The dipole is fairly high in relation to its surroundings.  About 40 feet above the ground and as much as 80 feet higher than where the vertical is mounted.  It is oriented with the ends pointing NW and SE.  A 40M attic dipole is mounted near it as well as heating ducts, so there is no telling if it is radiating like a normal dipole or not. All I wanted was a consistent reference, which the dipole provided.

First, I decided to get an idea how just one vertical would work when compared with the reference antenna. With 12 greater than 1/4 wave radials installed in addition to the chicken wire ground screen, the input impedance of the first vertical at resonance was measured as 44 ohms. The impedance was measured through a 1/2 wave length piece of coax using a MFJ 259B SWR analyzer. A 1/2 wave length piece of coax was chosen because it will have the same impedance at the analyzer end as it does at the feedpoint. This allowed me to measure the antenna's characteristics without needing to be physically at the feedpoint. Although this wasn't a huge problem with this antenna, measuring the feedpoint impedance for a yagi antenna could prove to be impossible. In this case, it just meant that I wouldn't have to disconnect the coax from the feedpoint to get a measurement.

Vertical Vs Dipole

A few signal reports were recorded in December 2000 and early January 2001:

Signal report comparisons between a attic dipole at 40' and a single ground mounted mono band vertical.  Entries are at various times from mid-December 2000 to early January 2001 sorted from early to late. 

Station

QTH

Report

K4AO

Kentucky

2 S-units stronger on the dipole.

W1CW

Florida

Vertical stronger by 1 s-unit.

W9GW

Indiana

Vertical slightly stronger.

SM4CPW

Sweden

Dipole slightly better, less than 1 S-unit.

K4XU/7

Oregon

Dipole 5db better

V51DR

Namibia

No difference

ZS6AL

South Africa

No difference

K1UU/4

Florida

No difference

VA3LK

Ontario

No difference

K4XU/7

Oregon

6db Better on Vertical

W7GB

Washington

1 s-unit better on vertical

W0CGR

Colorado

First said dipole slightly better, then vertical was as much as 3 s-units better.

W2DX New York At first dipole was 5 s-units better. By end of QSO, they were the same.
K9WA Illinois Vertical 10db better
K7NV Nevada No difference
F5VEX France Dipole was 5 s-units better
K9DX Illinois No difference
N3BB/5 Texas Very close, maybe dipole by 1/2 s-unit.

4-Square Installation

After I was satisfied that the vertical was working, and that I had enough reference signal reports, I installed the other verticals of the array.

I used a Comtek phase box to achieve the correct phasing between elements and to switch directions. The Comtek box greatly simplified my installation. The only thing I had to do was make four 1/4 wave transmission lines between the Comtek box and the verticals. This transmission line must be the foam dielectric type with a velocity factor of .8. If you use .66 dielectric cable, the cable will not reach the verticals. I cut the coax to length using an MFJ-259B SWR analyzer. I cut one cable about a foot longer than expected, and then trimmed the cable to resonance. My method of achieving the correct frequency is by tuning the 259B to the 2nd harmonic frequency (in my case 27.8Mhz) and shorting the opposite end of the cable being trimmed. A minimum impedance will occur at the 2nd harmonic. I do this because the frequency of resonance is more easily determined using the 2nd harmonic.  Once the cables were cut, I installed a PL259 on one end that would connect to the Comtek box and trimmed the other side to connect to the verticals.  I covered the ends with 3M tape and 3M ScotchKote in 3 layers.  This will prevent the coax from being ruined by water. 

One note on tuning individual elements: Due to mutual coupling, you should always disconnect the coax from the other 3 verticals when tuning the 4th vertical. If you do not, your resonant frequency will be changed by presence of the other 3 verticals. In my case, it was easier to take apart the other 3 verticals, effectively detuning them on 14Mhz.

4-Square Signal Reports

Signal report comparisons between an attic dipole at 40' and the 4-square

Station

QTH

Report

N3RS
PA
4-square 1 s-unit louder
EA8CN
Canary
4-square 1 s-unit louder
YV1NX
Venezuela
4-square 2 s-units louder
W0QE
Colorado
4-square 1.5 to 2 s-unit louder
W8VSK Michigan 4-square same to .5 S-units louder (on RX, 4-square was always much better)
YV1NX Venezuela 4-square was 3.5 S-units louder.
W9ZN Illinois 4-square was 1 s-unit louder
W5SKD Oklahoma 4-square 1/2 s-unit louder
W4PM Virginia 4-square better by 10db
DL6TQ Germany Dipole 1/2 S-unit louder
K5DQ Texas No difference

General Impressions

This is where I'm supposed to list all of the DX worked on this antenna or give quotes from stations worked proclaiming my signal to be "the loudest on the band". Sorry to disappoint you, but I will offer no such irrelevant information in this article. I will leave you with my list of advantages and disadvantages for each antenna.

Antenna Advantages Disadvantages
Dipole
  • Easy to install
  • Easier to hide
  • Inexpensive
  • Very good performance if installed 1 wave length off ground.
  • Can be installed in an attic hidden from neighbors
  • Requires supports
  • Works much better when flat top, not inverted-V which requires 2 supports.
  • Basically omni directional, which makes it a less effective receive antenna and provides little gain in a desired direction.
4-square
  • Instant directivity
  • Superior receive ability (very good pattern).
  • May be lower angle than a dipole depending on height of dipole above ground and terrain of dipole location.
  • Requires no supports
  • Very broad banded.
  • If located near salt water, could out perform yagi type antennas.
  • Requires excellent ground system to perform well.
  • Requires complicated phasing system or expensive box to achieve correct phasing.
  • Should be installed on flat ground.
  • Good choice for 20 meters and lower. Ground losses on 10 and 15 meters in most installations would make it a poor choice for these bands, unless over salt water.
  • Harder to conceal, especially in absence of trees.

Other Impressions

The 4-square is especially beneficial on receive. One of the problems I have had with my current QTH is line noise that generally occurs on cool, dry days. Due to the superior pattern of the 4-square, I can make the noise go from 10db over S9 in the worst direction to completely eliminating it in the opposite direction. Lucky for me the noise disappears with the 4-square aimed north, where I am typically interested in working.

Like most antenna projects I undertake, I learned a lot from this one. In general I would say that a dipole located at least 1 wave length above the ground will out perform a 4-square of verticals over less than optimum (salt water) ground. A dipole will also perform better when installed over sloping foreground, effectively lowering the angle of radiation of the antenna. The verticals will work better if installed over an excellent ground and will provide superior receiving capability.

I currently use a 4-square for 80 meters at my mountain contest station. Although the antenna performs very well, I am confident a 2 element yagi would out perform it most of the time. My 80M 4-square uses elevated radials, and is located at the top of a very steep hill which slopes downward in all directions. I'm sure these attributes make it less than optimum. I'm currently in the process of moving a lot of antennas to make room for the a 2 element 80m yagi that I hope to have installed within the next 2 years.

73

Bill Fisher, W4AN

Member Comments:
This article has expired. No more comments may be added.
 
Fighting CC&R's: 20M 4-Square Array  
by KB2DHG on November 28, 2010 Mail this to a friend!
A very nice article and great useful information. It seems these days that antennas are a dirty word when it comes to HOA's CC&R's and most any residence abode. I went from a private house in the country with an antenna farm to rival none to a HOA restricted condo. Yea I know WHY? that is a whole other story... Sad to say I was forced off the air for quite some time... Then as I looked all over the Condo, I see all these TV dishes and it occored to me that the bi-laws stritly state NO ANTENNAS! Well to me these dishes constitute an antenna... So I made my case to the HOA and they shot me down. SO off to the town hall to do some research. I found that our municipality has a zoning law concerning dishes...
" no dishes can be mounted in plain sight on the front of the building"
So I took this little bit of information to the HOA and asked one more time to errect a simple wire antenna. Again they said NO! So I asked them to comply to the local zoning law and remove the over 16 TV dishes mounted on the front of the building... I now have a wonderful G5RV up on the roof of the building and yes the TV dishes are still mounted on the front of the building!
Bottom line, no matter what conditions we are forced to live in, there is always a way to get a signal out. Yes it may not always be what we would desire like a tower and beam or dedicated dipoles or verticles BUT it is amazing how crafty you can get when it comes to antennas...

NEVER NEVER GIVE UP!
 
RE: Fighting CC&R's: 20M 4-Square Array  
by WY3X on November 28, 2010 Mail this to a friend!
KB2DHG, you worked a very, very good "bluff"! If someone with one of those dishes knew anything about the FCC's OTARD law, they could have carried a copy to the powers-that-be and shown them that HOAs and zoning ordinances may not regulate dishes or TV antennas that protrude up to 12 feet above the roof line. (Provided certain proof is met.)

1. A TV antenna (or dish) must be used to receive channels not available on the existing cable system.
2. Dish (or antenna) has no other path to the signal source and must be mounted where the installer says.
3. Dish may not be mounted in "common" area. If you have exclusive access to the area, then your installer may mount your dish (or antenna) there.

The rules were not necessarily written so as to allow you to be your own installer. The way the OTARD law is written, it is presumed by the FCC that you and your HOA are technically ignorant. You may have to get a buddy to act as a technically competent installer for legal defense purposes.

They also may NOT require a permit before installation can occur because the FCC says that constitutes an "unreasonable delay".

I continue to wonder why hams don't come up with an antenna design that will receive OTA television that just happens to tune the higher ham bands with a good match. It could easily be installed to meet the requirements of OTARD and give the user a nice log periodic with a fairly potent signal on the air. Even an upright could probably be tuned for use as a 2M, 220MHz, or 440MHz vertical for repeater use. The larger elements could tune 6M. Guy wires are required for safety and could be made long enough and broken up with insulators so as to tune the HF bands. There is nothing an HOA can do to have it removed if they can't provide a desired channel which is not supplied by the in-house cable system within 30 days of installation. If they do provide the channel you want within the 30 days then the HOA must pay to have your antenna removed (by law).

Just because you use an antenna which meets all the OTARD validation rules to transmit with occasionally doesn't mean it isn't being used for television reception. (wink-wink)

Read the OTARD rules. If you're creative enough, you can come up with something to get on the air with.

-WY3X
 
RE: Fighting CC&R's: 20M 4-Square Array  
by KG4RUL on November 28, 2010 Mail this to a friend!
"1. A TV antenna (or dish) must be used to receive channels not available on the existing cable system. "

There is no language in the OTARD rules that specify this restriction. I think what you may be referring to are a few associations that have a community antenna system and are able to prohibit outside antennas based on that accommodation.

In fact, the following antennas or dishes are covered by these rules:

- A “dish” antenna one meter (39.37 inches) or less in diameter (or any size in Alaska) designed to receive direct broadcast satellite service or to receive and transmit fixed wireless signals via satellite.

- An antenna one meter in diameter or less designed to receive wireless cable or to receive or transmit fixed wireless signals other than by satellite.

- Commercially-available analog and digital television antennas. (Note: the "analog" reference is moot now that we have had a conversion to digital - the exception being a few analog TV repeater stations that still exist)
 
RE: Fighting CC&R's: 20M 4-Square Array  
by KH6DC on November 28, 2010 Mail this to a friend!
Thanks Bill for the great article. I'll soon be in the same boat as you moving to a 25 year old community with other kids as my 4 year old and no antennas allowed. 73 Delwyn KH6DC
 
Fighting CC&R's: 20M 4-Square Array  
by K9YNF on November 28, 2010 Mail this to a friend!
Thank you for re-running this great article!

I have living proof that what the author says is true.

My wife and I wanted to downsize and build our retirement house. We searched for almost a year for the perfect lot with great DXing potential.

We found it in a tiny farm community that had a small subdivision with 2/3 acre lots, city utilities and high-speed Internet service.

Having had to give up my 60-foot crankup and 6-element tribander in the process, I knew that I just had to have a great low-angle DX antenna to continue on into retirement.

Enter the 20 meter 4-square.

My research indicated that this array would be a powerhouse and yet offer a minimal profile in this CC&R neighborhood.

I made an offer on a 965-foot-high lot with the contingency that I be given written permission to erect a wide-spaced 20/17 meter four square array with flat-black-painted ZeroFive elements. I attached a photo of a similar array to my offer.

I am very grateful to say that I was given written permission by the local developer to erect the array that all may now see on my QRZ.com page.

I just worked ZL8X on 17 meters (yes, I'm in the online log!) for my #328 DXCC entity and have also worked several more super-rare ones like Cocos-Keeling and Palestine, all with this killer array. I am also on the IOTA Honour Roll using this great antenna and would heartily recommend it to anyone in a similar situation to mine.

73,

Wayne, K9YNF

 
RE: Fighting CC&R's: 20M 4-Square Array  
by WY3X on November 28, 2010 Mail this to a friend!
KG4RUL> I think what you may be referring to are a few associations that have a community antenna system and are able to prohibit outside antennas based on that accommodation.

You say tomayto, I say tomahto. Different verbage to describe the same thing. If a channel is available on a community cable system, then you may not use that channel in determining whether or not you are allowed to install a dish and/or outdoor antenna unless the signal quality of the provided channel renders it unwatchable. As I said, you must prove that you can receive a channel that is not provided by the existing cable system in order to meet the intent of OTARD. I install 'em for a living, you'd think I'd know the law... I've had to go to bat for my customers several times after installing dishes or antennas for them. In every case, the HOA backed down after I provided them a copy of the OTARD laws and pointed out why they may not restrict my customers access. In almost all cases, my customers desired foreign language programming from S.E. Asia. No cable system in my area provides Asian language services, nor do they plan to, and that reason allowed every dish I installed to stay put. As far as antennas go, there are so many sub-channels that no cable system op in their right mind would include every one of them... so it's not hard to prove a customer is receiving a channel with a TV antenna that is not provided by either the cable system or other source provided by an HOA. HOAs are permitted, however, to provide access to what you want within 30 days and then require you to allow them to pay and have your antenna and/or dish removed. If they try, however, you just pick a different source of programming to keep 'em wiggling and dancing at the end of your fishing line.

-WY3X
 
RE: Fighting CC&R's: 20M 4-Square Array  
by KB2DHG on November 28, 2010 Mail this to a friend!
OUR ZONING LAWS call for a master dish or dishes mounted on the roofs, not on the front of the buildings...It does not prohibit these dishes/antennas just ask that they be out of sight, it is NOT enforced but if provioked it could be.
 
RE: Fighting CC&R's: 20M 4-Square Array  
by WY3X on November 29, 2010 Mail this to a friend!
If your HOA supplies a community dish that provides your requested programming, then you are required by law to connect to that dish instead of installing your own. But back to the subject of the article- a mast-mounted TV antenna could be installed and the guy wires fed as dipoles. This would not work in a condo situation, however, because you'd almost certainly have to install such an antenna in a common area. But in an HOA area where you own your yard, it most certainly would work, and I doubt the HOA would be able to do much about it. And they could be fed by a box similar to a 4-square controller making it directional. Something like this would most likely wind up being on 10M due to the length of the guy wires probably being fairly short. 10M is better than nothing at all! A three-wire 4-square...??? (It should work similar to an old CB super-scanner antenna.) -WY3X
 
RE: Fighting CC&R's: 20M 4-Square Array  
by AD7C on November 29, 2010 Mail this to a friend!
So let me get this straight. You fought (beat) the CC&R restrictions by locating the antennas off your property and on the wetlands behind your house.

Sorry. I just don't see how this applies to most CC&R cases. I've looked behind my house and the wetlands have yet to appear.

73,

Rich
KE7SAK
 
RE: Fighting CC&R's: 20M 4-Square Array  
by KG4RUL on November 29, 2010 Mail this to a friend!
"If your HOA supplies a community dish that provides your requested programming, then you are required by law to connect to that dish instead of installing your own."

I agree that this is applicable for over-the-air channels. However, they cannot prevent you from utilizing a DBS service, as an alternative to wired cable service, by banning the required dish.
 
Fighting CC&R's: 20M 4-Square Array  
by K8QV on November 29, 2010 Mail this to a friend!
An observation:

Most hams are rather anal about following all the silly rules of radio (one MUST identify every 10 minutes, always run legal power, etc.) but when it comes to the rules of the community in which they chose to live they stay up nights thinking of ways to cheat the system.

It's just ironic.
 
RE: Fighting CC&R's: 20M 4-Square Array  
by WY3X on November 29, 2010 Mail this to a friend!
KG4RUL> However, they cannot prevent you from utilizing a DBS service, as an alternative to wired cable service, by banning the required dish.

I think you're confused about the OTARD law. They can prevent you from installing your own dish or antenna unless you can prove you're receiving some channel or service you desire that they're failing to provide you with, or the quality of the signal they're providing on the community dish or antenna is unacceptable. You may not install a dish or antenna to receive the same channels they're already providing you on a community-supplied cable or dish system. You must connect to their system if it's there and provides an equal quality signal source. If you're getting away with something, more power to you.

Here is a reference for you, straight from the FCC's mouth: http://www.fcc.gov/mb/facts/otard.html

Q: If my association, building management, landlord, or property owner provides a central antenna, may I install an individual antenna?

A: Generally, the availability of a central antenna may allow the association, landlord, property owner, or other management entity to restrict the installation by individuals of antennas otherwise protected by the rule. ***Restrictions based on the availability of a central antenna will generally be permissible provided that: (1) the person receives the particular video programming or fixed wireless service that the person desires and could receive with an individual antenna covered under the rule (e.g., the person would be entitled to receive service from a specific provider, not simply a provider selected by the association); (2) the signal quality of transmission to and from the person's home using the central antenna is as good as, or better than, the quality the person could receive or transmit with an individual antenna covered by the rule; (3) the costs associated with the use of the central antenna are not greater than the costs of installation, maintenance and use of an individual antenna covered under the rule; and (4) the requirement to use the central antenna instead of an individual antenna does not unreasonably delay the viewer's ability to receive video programming or fixed wireless services. ***

Q: May the association, landlord, building management or property owner restrict the installation of an individual antenna because a central antenna will be available in the future?

A: It is not the intent of the Commission to deter or unreasonably delay the installation of individual antennas because a central antenna may become available. However, *** persons could be required to remove individual antennas once a central antenna is available if the cost of removal is paid by the landlord or association and the user is reimbursed for the value of the antenna. Further, an individual who wants video programming or fixed wireless services other than what is available through the central antenna should not be unreasonably delayed in obtaining the desired programming or services either through modifications to the central antenna, installation of an additional central antenna, or by using an individual antenna. ***

Respectfully submitted, WY3X
 
RE: Fighting CC&R's: 20M 4-Square Array  
by WA2WMR on November 30, 2010 Mail this to a friend!
Antennas by Eimac!
 
RE: Fighting CC&R's: 20M 4-Square Array  
by KG4RUL on November 30, 2010 Mail this to a friend!
"KG4RUL> However, they cannot prevent you from utilizing a DBS service, as an alternative to wired cable service, by banning the required dish.

I think you're confused about the OTARD law. They can prevent you from installing your own dish or antenna unless you can prove you're receiving some channel or service you desire that they're failing to provide you with, or the quality of the signal they're providing on the community dish or antenna is unacceptable. You may not install a dish or antenna to receive the same channels they're already providing you on a community-supplied cable or dish system. You must connect to their system if it's there and provides an equal quality signal source. If you're getting away with something, more power to you.

Here is a reference for you, straight from the FCC's mouth: http://www.fcc.gov/mb/facts/otard.html

Q: If my association, building management, landlord, or property owner provides a central antenna, may I install an individual antenna?

A: Generally, the availability of a central antenna may allow the association, landlord, property owner, or other management entity to restrict the installation by individuals of antennas otherwise protected by the rule. ***Restrictions based on the availability of a central antenna will generally be permissible provided that: (1) the person receives the particular video programming or fixed wireless service that the person desires and could receive with an individual antenna covered under the rule (e.g., the person would be entitled to receive service from a specific provider, not simply a provider selected by the association); (2) the signal quality of transmission to and from the person's home using the central antenna is as good as, or better than, the quality the person could receive or transmit with an individual antenna covered by the rule; (3) the costs associated with the use of the central antenna are not greater than the costs of installation, maintenance and use of an individual antenna covered under the rule; and (4) the requirement to use the central antenna instead of an individual antenna does not unreasonably delay the viewer's ability to receive video programming or fixed wireless services. ***

Q: May the association, landlord, building management or property owner restrict the installation of an individual antenna because a central antenna will be available in the future?

A: It is not the intent of the Commission to deter or unreasonably delay the installation of individual antennas because a central antenna may become available. However, *** persons could be required to remove individual antennas once a central antenna is available if the cost of removal is paid by the landlord or association and the user is reimbursed for the value of the antenna. Further, an individual who wants video programming or fixed wireless services other than what is available through the central antenna should not be unreasonably delayed in obtaining the desired programming or services either through modifications to the central antenna, installation of an additional central antenna, or by using an individual antenna. ***

Respectfully submitted, WY3X"

Exactly as I said, the items you quoted concern an antenna for over-the-air reception. This does NOT apply to DBS!
 
Fighting CC&R's: 20M 4-Square Array  
by AC7DX on November 30, 2010 Mail this to a friend!
I just run remote and my HOA can kiss my ass
 
RE: Fighting CC&R's: 20M 4-Square Array  
by WY3X on November 30, 2010 Mail this to a friend!
KG4RUL: Exactly as I said, the items you quoted concern an antenna for over-the-air reception. This does NOT apply to DBS!

The part you don't understand is that the FCC interchangeably uses the terms "antenna" and "dish" where it applies to the OTARD law. They consider a dish to be an antenna. Don't take my word for it. Drop a nickle and phone the FCC. They'll straighten you out.

-WY3X
 
RE: Fighting CC&R's: 20M 4-Square Array  
by AD6KA on December 10, 2010 Mail this to a friend!
KE7SAK Posted:
>So let me get this straight. You fought (beat) the >CC&R restrictions by locating the antennas off your >property and on the wetlands behind your house.

>Sorry. I just don't see how this applies to most >CC&R cases. I've looked behind my house and the >wetlands have yet to appear.

I agree, you didn't "Fight" OR Win anything.
You you just did an "end around".

Im happy for you and all, just don't
paint yorself as a CC&R dragon slayer....
73, Ken AD6KA


 
RE: Fighting CC&R's: 20M 4-Square Array  
by AD6KA on December 10, 2010 Mail this to a friend!
And fix the COMTEK link in the article.
Not only is it to the wrong company
(the link is to Comtek instead of Comtek Systems),
DX Engineering has been the sole distributor of Comtek Systems gear for over two years.......
 
Fighting CC&R's: 20M 4-Square Array  
by KD8Z on January 7, 2011 Mail this to a friend!
Congrats Bill, enjoy your radio rights. Not long ago I posted a similar message in the antenna restrictions area of the forums and received so much poison mail both in the forums and by email from other hams that I was flabbergasted. I was amazed that you seem to have avoided the poison messages. It must of been something I ate. I talked the farmer directly adjacent to my property to allow me to run underground cabling over to his property where we placed the towers and antennas. This was a fine symbiotic relationship as I would mow the area and watch his remote equipment shed that was to distant from his home. He still farms this area as we placed the towers in an area that he could not farm because of boundary lines and rocks. It worked fine. I wish you luck and just ignore the poison if it comes, there is no benefit in replying to these messages as I did, but I learned.
Good luck.
73
KD8Z Dale
 
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