The ARRL Needs More Members!

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The ARRL Needs More Members!

John Rippey (W3ULS) on July 11, 2003
View comments about this article!

The 2002 Annual Report of the American Radio Relay League (ARRL) contains the dispiriting news that membership fell by 2.5% in 2002. According to the Annual Report, this was due largely to a dues increase in 2001. Am I mistaken, or wasn't the increase about $3.00?

At a time when representation of the amateur radio service in Washington is crucial, did 4,000 members drop out for that lame reason? These actions weaken the League when it needs to be seen as strong. -- Not only on Capitol Hill, but in the Federal agencies that have a hand in telecommunications regulation, and in state and local governments as well.

Whatever a ham's individual issues are with the League, this is no time to be petty. The ARRL is the only game in town. If it needs improving, there's always the ballot box as well as the opportunity to meet one-on-one with the leadership, such as the upcoming Annual Meeting in Texas.

From long experience in Washington, I can assure my fellow radio amateurs that without a strong, focused voice in the Nation's Capital, our hobby will be buffeted about and suffer damage there from. There is ample evidence that such buffeting already is underway. President Haynie & Co. are on the right track, but they need more muscle.

To provide that muscle, the League should have at least twice as many members as it has today. Those readers, who are not members, sign up!

Member Comments:

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The ARRL Needs More Members!

by ROOT_ADMIN on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

AGREED! but before that can happen, the ARRL must give up the image of being the Newington Boys Club. That goes hand in hand with the anti-ARRL crowd too. They must wise up and realize that the ARRL is the only game in town, and that while THEY are anti-League, the League is looking out for them too.

I am a Life Member of the ARRL.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by KB9YKY on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

I am a member but doubt that I will renew. The ARRL did nothing at WARC about keeping the International Morse Code testing of some sort in the treaties...showing that they want to turn amateur radio into CB radio with the belief that they will rake in more money for the purpose of increasing their already overpaid salaries. Also, did anyone else see the ad in at least one issue of QST that was promoting the mental illness known as homosexual queerness? (Just what America needs, more liberalism/filth). I will look that up with the issue and page number and post it tomorrow.

The ARRL Needs More Members!

Anonymous post on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

To w3uls:

Please list all the accomplishments by the ARRL in the last 50 years to justify the tens if not hundreds of millions of $ this organization collected and spent. Don't list petty nonsense, list major issues won by the the league.

Good luck thinking of any.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by KG4RUL on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

I think not lobbying for keeping the Morse Code requirement was the SMARTEST thing that the ARRL could have done. More people will become Hams, ARRL membership will go up, we will have more political clout.

IMHO the alternatives to the ARRL that I have seen seem to be bunches of rabble rousers and complainers who have no idea how politics work. Writing in pulp newsletters and senseless rants on the Net are not going to get the attention of those in power. The ARRL seems to be the only ones who are effective AT ALL!

Dennis

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by AG1N on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

I just cancelled my membership and asked for a refund because of the ARRL's shameful rip-off of eqsl.cc's idea(s) for electronic QSLing. First they deny any credit to eqsl.cc records, then create the nearly identical thing and say it will now be the best way to QSL. Shame on you, ARRL.

They are also stuck in the past and don't seem to want to find new ways to deal with issues. The QST rag is now mostly a catalogue, more ads than content. There is no way to NOT receive the QST magazine, so I pay for the useless rag whether I want/need it or not. I suggested that they offer an online-only membership where the QST isn't sent out and they suggested to me that I should have the QST sent to someone else if I didn't want to receive! Not only do I not want to receive it, I also don't want to PAY FOR IT! They could easily knock off $15/year in dues by not sending the magazine - but then, they would lose advertising $$, which is the most important consideration in all things ARRL!

73
Dennis

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by KB5TBB on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

I put my petty ARRL gripes behind me five years ago and became a life member. I probably give them more money now as a life than regular member, though I never need to send them another dime to get QST. It's a good investment, especially for young hams like myself. I've invested the past 12 years of my life in this hobby, and I plan on living at least another 60 years and would like to enjoy it from here on out. Maybe I am blind to the "eliteness" of the ARRL since I live in New England now, but I never had a problem with it when I was a young Texas ham. Heck, look at the home QTH of our el presidente...

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by WA9BXE on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

I understand the complaints of many hams about the ARRL. But keep in mind, as someone said in an earlier post, they are the only game in town when it comes to lobbying Congress and the FCC about amateur issues.

I work for an elected official and I do not like the fact that it appears the average citizen’s voice does not carry the same weight as a lobbyist (face it, that’s what the League does, lobbies on our behalf). But until the system changes (not likely) we had best play the game or we’ll be left out.

I have not been a fan of the League but I rejoined after ignoring them for 35 years. I just swallow the bad along with the good. I just want more of the good.

If more hams in the League, gives them more money (this is about money), then hopefully the better a job they can do in at least keeping some of the RF spectrum there for today’s and future hams.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by G3RZP on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

I don't suppose any of you guys have ever been to an ITU meeting. I have, and I've seen the way in which people like Paul Rinaldo (W4RI) of ARRL quietly use their position on the US delegation at these meetings to help influence other countries positions and get protection for amateur radio. It's happened on Spurious Emissions at Task Group 1/3, Out of Band Emissions at Task Group1/5 (both of which could have led to much tighter requirements on amateur transmitters) and it's happening now at Task Group 1/8 on UWB. A lot of the quiet political influencing can't be publicised, but I've seen it happen. The ARRL has influence at ITU, through being part of the US delegation. And it's used to good effect in defending amateur radio.

Of course, there's the work that they do at CITEL, too.

And as far as removing morse code testing is concerned, I firmly believe that ARRL would not have been able to stop the removal of it at international level. What happens in the US is another matter.

For ham radio to flourish, we need strong national societies, even if you don't approve of what they're doing. By the way, I'm an ARRL member as well as an RSGB one...I have caused some upset by suggesting that I get better representation WHERE IT MATTERS from ARRL than RSGB.

73

Peter G3RZP

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by W5USB on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Serves them right. Sit up and listen to the membership, or go the way of the dinosaur. This is like saying the IRS needs more taxpayers.

Hasta la vista, baby!

Art Granda W5USB

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by KP4HLR on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Shame on the ARRL!!!!! More members?? No way!!!! CW WILL STAND FOR EVER!!!!

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by KC8CON on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

The ARRL has done several things that are driving away membership. I for one am a member and probably will remain a member just due to the fact that my dues (I HOPE) goes towards helping protect our hobby and my rights to operate. But, my biggest complaint with the League is the removal of the ARRL Section News from QST, the raising of dues but then removing things from the magazine to save cost or to add more technical columns to the magazine.

If the League is loosing members, then they need to look at what they have done in the past few years. I have an old copy (December 1960) of QST. A much better magazine back then. A lot of technical stuff and articles about your ordinary amateur operators. Section News was really good to read, you read stories about local hams doing things in their state. The Section News was like reading hometown newspapers from all over the US.

I do believe that the League is necessary to be in Washington, to observe and protect the frequencies we have been allocated to operate on. There are so many companies with digital devices that are in this new digital age we live in looking for frequencies to buy from the government so they can make a buck. Everything we do is voluntary, and we (Amateurs) don't have the resources, time or money to be in Washington to lobby for our hobby. The ARRL did help us get allocation on the 60 Meter band, even if it is only 5 channels. We would of gotten more if it had not been for the terroist attacks on 9/11. With the development of homeland security I feel it will be harder and harder for anyone to get frequencies.

I have heard people say that if the League disappeared today that there would be another organization come forward, but I don't think so. If that were true they would be here now. This other organization would be as popular as the ARRL.

I do not agree with the things the ARRL has done, I don't agree with their requirement that an EC (Emergency Coordinator) must be a League member. I would agree that the DEC (District Emergency Coordinator) needs to be a League member. I have seen here in my state, several counties without EC's and one reason was that the person who was interested in being an EC doesn't want to be a member of ARRL. Therefore, that county is still without an EC.

Sorry for the rambling. This is just my personal feelings. Like I said I am member and probably will remain a member just to protect this great hobby we have.

73
Juddie, KC8CON

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by W5USB on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

The Hegelian dialectic. Problem, reaction, solution.

Problem: The Government won't stop taking frequencies until each one has been allocated to commercial use.

Reaction: Oh my God, This is the worst thing to happen since Watergate.

Solution: We need more members since we are the exclusive organisation "protecting" the hobby. "If you CARE about amateur radio, then you should join the ARRL".

LMAO

Art Granda W5USB

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by WB3FUM on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

I only support the league because of the support at International meetings. I can honestly do without QST. The league has screwed up ECOM here in Virginia. We now have two groups doing ECOM and competing for participants. Also what is up with charging for ECOM training. I would think that this could be done by the league FREE OF CHARGE with some of the post 9/11 grants from the government. This is the main reason I support ARES VA Inc. instead of the ARRL. The instructors are Hands-On and training is always free of charge and top notch. Thanks Ed and Tony.

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by WV8T on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

I agree with Juddie, if they want to continue to get my money, they need to stop taking stuff away that we enjoy, and stop buying some of that expensive furniture for their buildings, and lower some of their salaries. The only reason I am still with the ARRL is for the QSL Service.

73
WV8T

More Members! And Less Hatred, Please.

by KB1JPB on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

I think that at least part of the reason for the recent drop in membership is the economic downturn since 2000. Many hams, particularly the large subset of hams that work in high-tech, have lost their jobs and not been able to find comparable work. With unemployment running out for many, it's no big surprise that a certain number would decide not to spend scare bucks to renew their ARRL membership.

On a side note, I believe that KB9YKY has way overstepped the bounds of polite (or even impolite) debate on eHam with his assault on QST's support for "the mental illness known as homosexual queerness" as a reason for the decline in ARRL membership. [I assume this diatribe was aimed at QST classifieds for the Lambda Amateur Radio Association and the Rainbow Amateur Radio Association.]

This is supposed to be a hobby rooted in science. It's been a quarter century since the American Psychiatric Association--joining other such bodies around the globe--announced that homosexuality was not, in fact, a mental illness. They based this assertion on years of scientific study and exhaustive research. More reserach over the years has only strengthened this position.

Even if that were not the case, the Amateur's Code, the defining visionary document of this hobby since it was written by W9EEA (SK) in 1928, states that "The Radio Amateur is: Considerate, Loyal, Progressive, Friendly, Balanced, and Patriotic."

I would suggest that attacking gay hams, and I'm sure there are many, violates the spirit of the Code, and of the good fellowship that is supposed to be at the very heart of ham radio. I think, therefore, that KB9YKY should apologize for his harsh words--or risk driving even more people away from the hobby at a time when ham radio can ill afford to lose any more people.

I would also like to state for the record that I am going to make it my personal mission to help recruit more women hams; black, latino, native american and asian hams; younger hams, and, yes, gay and lesbian hams into ham radio. This hobby, and the ARRL (whatever one thinks of it, and I have not been around long enough to form a solid opinion of it yet though I am a member), will only expand by attracting populations of people that it has not yet made significant inroads with. I've met lots of great people on the air and in person through this hobby, and I think there are lots of other great people out there that have not yet been properly introduced to ham radio. I think it would behoove us all to expand our horizons, outreach to everyone in sight, and, to paraphrase some modern slang, "spread the love."

In this way the hobby, and ARRL, will survive and thrive far into the future.

My $.65.

73,

Jason, KB1JPB

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by AI4DA on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

I am a new Ham (late start in life) and a ARRL Life Member.

Looking at ARRL today without the benefit of historical knowledge, I see a self defeating cycle generated by ARRL. They work very hard to get new Hams trained and certified but then very little is done to keep the new Hams. Looking at expired call numbers I see large blocks of concurrent numbers being released daily by the FCC.

It appears to me that more effort to keep what we have gained would help with the membership numbers more then trying to regain them with new Hams.

A positive effort to develop mentors (elmers), simple ongoing training such as basic electronics ( meter reading), construction (soldering), troubleshooting, calibration and alignment procedures (exposure to RF Volt Meters, Oscilloscopes, Alignment tools etc). These could be worked with Clubs as 30 minute sessions after meetings.

This continuing training for the general population would be a simple way to keep the original spark glowing that got the new Hams into Amateur Radio in the first place. Periodic informal outings that put this training and knowlege to practice would help cement the Ham to the hobby.

I see things I like about ARRL and I see things I do not like but it does not appear that one of their strong points is keeping a pulse of the current Ham community.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by N8AUC on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

To the KB9 guy who wants to drop out of ARRL because of those ads for gay and lesbian ham clubs in the back of QST.....don't blame the league. You just don't know the history, because you weren't around back then.

The ARRL fought that fight 20 years ago when they originally denied those groups advertising space. The groups sued, the ARRL went to court to fight and lost, and was forced to grant that advertising space by the court.

I heard a group of hams confront a division director at a convention over that same issue shortly after the ads first appeared and the story of the court decision was the reply. Why didn't we hear about it earlier than that? Simple - you don't discuss the details of a case while the litigation is in process. Any lawyer worth his salt will tell you that. So I heard it first hand, and knowing that particular division director personally, I have no doubt as to his integrity.

But don't blame the league for that one when you don't know the history behind it.

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by KC0ODY on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

My .2 cents...

I am an ARRL member. If the ARRL can influence Congress to protect the amateur radio spectrum from predatory commercial interests, then I'll continue to support them.

As far as I'm concerned, the ARRL doesn't set the standards for our hobby, but they do "bring it all together" through promotion and education. No one else out there is doing this.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by K0BG on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

I don't always agree with the ARRL and its policies anymore than I agree with the present Washington administration. But I support both and for very obvious reasons.

Alan, KØBG

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by K8AG on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

I believe that we are at a critical time for amateur radio. For several years I let my participation in ham radio, and my membership in ARRL lapse. I see now how important amateur radio is to the technical base of this country.

If you ever considered becoming a member, do so. Even if you are not a ham (or not yet a ham), join. If you have let it lapse, renew. QST alone is worth the membership fees. I like the changes they made removing the lists of contest participants. They do seem to have replaced these with great material that I find much more appropriate.

My $0.02

John Pawlicki, K8AG

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by W2LO on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

What has the ARRL accomplished? Ladies and gentlemen, without ARRL's presence and representation in Washington and in international forums, we would have been history a long time ago. We simply are not that important a constituency to governmental entities both here and abroad.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by KB9YKY on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Re: my above post...Example: March 2003 issue of QST. page 142. Same liberal bs may be found in many other issues.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by ROOT_ADMIN on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

N8AUC:

And do not forget that not only did the gay/lesbian group win in court, the won a money award too -- OUR DUES. What did they do with our dues? Do you think that possibly returned that money to the "evil homophobes"? I doubt it.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by K3UD on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Even though the ARRL lost 2.5% of their membership, they will still collect more money as a result of the dues increase. As a general rule of marketing, potential loss of customers are always figured into any price increase equation. With customer loss, overhead also goed down.Not as many issues of QST will be printed and mailed and membership services will most likely have lowered demand, both of which will save botttom line dollars. If you gain more than you lose, it is considered a success.

I think that he real situation with the ARRL is that they seem to be acting like a state government that is chronically short on funds. (most state governments these days) When times were good, there was a lot of money to spend, now, when the pinch comes, guess what?

It seems that the ARRL is taking some kind of shotgun approach in the areas of its focus, and in efforts to raise money. We have the Diamond Club, the Big Project, the Spectrum Defense fund, and now, discussions at the director level how much of the ARRL's resources should go towards convincing the FCC to keep the code requirement for amateur licensing. There are probably many other projects I did not mention. All of these are, in my opinion, very worthy projects, just as most state government provided services are beneficial to the people in the state (Some my argue this)

Perhaps the ARRL has become too top heavy and bureaucratic for its own, and the memberships good. maybe a complete evaluation of its purpose and mission
is in order.

The two questions I have are:

What is driving the membership away?

Possible answer - Cost of dues - the code question - the general feeling that the ARRL bureaucracy caters to only a small section of the licensed ham community, and the increasing perception that the money is not being used in the most productive way possible.

What are the percentages of membership base?

If the technician, novice, and tech+ license classes are 52% of the ARS, are 52% of ARRL members in these classes? This information is not on the ARRL website, at least I could not find it.

Like many members, I have some differences with the ARRL and its policies. At one time I dropped my membership for almost 8 years over the Incentive licensing situation in the late 60s, later re-joining when I realized how childish it was to do that. The ARRL is only as good and responsive as the people who make who run it day to day and the elected people who craft its policy. The majority of its membership do not take the time to vote in the divisional elections, which, like voting at the state, local, and federal levels, concentrate the power to change things into a relatively small amount of membership.

73
George
K3UD

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by N1RJA on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

It still amazes me how many hams continue to miss the boat in this post. Tunnel vision must be contagious. What's with the "CW will stand forever", "expensive furniture for their buildings", "lower some of their salaries", only a member because of the QSL service", "shameful ripoff of e-qsl.cc's idea", "QST rag is only a catalog now", "the ARRL did nothing at WARC about keeping the International Morse Code testing", blah blah blah. Yep, let's keep on whining about these "big" issues and continue to trash the ARRL and hope that the membership just dries up completely. Who needs another "IRS" as W5USB puts it. WA9BXE and a few others have it RIGHT. I, too, have my petty gripes about the ARRL, but as the Eagles once sang, "get over it." When it comes to preserving our bands, they ARE THE ONLY game in town. WA8KJP is still looking for the "major accomplishments" of the ARRL in the last 50 years. He will turn on his radio(s) today and work a few QSO's and still wonder what "major" victories the ARRL is fighting and winning for him and all other hams. Just the fact that he can still turn on a radio and use the precious freqs that are still there doesn't qualify as a "biggie" I guess. If we don't support the organization that will fight for and protect our bands, than we will go the "way of the dinosaur" in due time. There's a LOT of money and power out there that want what we have. Then we can all tap a little CW with our hand on the side of our leg while cruisin' down the road in our vehicles, because that'll be the only place left to do it. If by chance your young son (grandson), or daughter (granddaughter) happens to be riding with you and inquires about that tapping thing on your leg, you can just tell 'em the 'ol story about how you used to do this literally over the airwaves as real amateur radio operators!

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by K0FL on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

The ARRL has a much different vision of ham radio than I do. They measure the health of the service in dollars and membership numbers. In my opinon they have been on the wrong side of so many issues through the years I would never consider becoming a member again without a complete house cleaning at HQ. The idea that you should join because they are the only game in town is BS. Trust me...the ONLY thing they understand is membership numbers and income. The only way to make them sit up and take a good look at what they are doing is to make their income drop and thus threaten their future. The good old boy club is what is killing ham radio...they never saw a lower standard they didn't like..the ARRL has taken so much value away from being a ham it is almost a joke to become one.

More is not better

I rather see ham radio die a dignified death than turn into channel 19

de KØFL

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by KG6AMW on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Some of you guys are so self centered its a wonder how you survive. Look past the hot head remarks and consider G3RZP's comments. Also, if you really want to know what the ARRL has done for you, go to the FCC website and see the ARRL's 121 page submission documenting their dissension against proposed BPL (Broadband Power Line) technology implementation. Get your head out your ass and start supporting the ARRL.

KG6AMW

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by KB9YKY on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Young Jason, KB1JPB, wrote "This is supposed to be a hobby rooted in science. It's been a quarter century since the American Psychiatic Association--joing other such bodies around the world--announced that homosexuality was not, in fact, a mental illness. They based this assertion on years of scientific study and research...blah blah blah.....". Young Jason is a perfect example of how the liberal-socialists have suceeded in dumbing down America with their liberalized socialist education system. This is NOT a hobby "rooted in science". Amateur Radio is a service "rooted" in with a interest in RADIO, not a hobby for those who think that they are scientists. A quarter century ago they knew what such insanity was...But then came along the libs with their junk science and their political agenda to further expand socialism by dumbing down America and taking it apart piece by piece by piece. Junk science, the same "science" that today tells society the way to deal with behavior problems with children is to dope them up...then when the kids grow up to be bums, dopers, career criminals...these "scientists" and social engineers place the blame for it on being that America hasn't enough of their socialism in it. These liberal socialists, in their efforts to expand the socialist state are working to destroy every decent, moral fiber in America... one being what is now the Amateur Radio Service is just one of the things that they are out to "fix". Alas, young Jason, and so many others have been conditioned well by their masters and the trend continues.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by W9WHE on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Most hams ARE NOT MEMBERS.

A ham for 26 years, I've been a member for only 3. I'm one of the LARGE MAJORITY of hams that WILL NOT join. But why??????

1) The ARRL has been an entity OF, FOR, AND BY EXTRAS. If you aren't an extra, you just do not count.

2) ARROGANCE. Ever encounter one of the Newington boys? Heaven forbid that you do not see things the ARRL way. There is the ARRL perspective and ALL OTHERS BE DAMNED!

3) A REALLY BAD case of N.I.H. (Not Invented Here). If the ARRL did not think of, or at least be consulted on it, they will oppose it.

4) The MAJORITY of hams will NEVER join the ARRL unless it changes. MARKETING 101: People will not pay to join an organization that detests them!

Don't get me wrong. The ARRL is not all bad. But the undeniable fact is that the MAJORITY of hams find the negatives SO OUTWEIGH the positives that they simply will not pay money to people that detest them.

HELLO!

RE: More Members! And Less Hatred, Please.

by DOO-DAH on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

KB1JPB:
Thanks so very much for your thoughtful comment. The ARRL believes that all people need to be included and all groups need representation. BTW might you be a member of Lambda or Rainbow by chance?

RE: More Members! And Less Hatred, Please.

by DOO-DAH on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

KB1JPB:
Thanks so very much for your thoughtful comment. The ARRL believes that all people need to be included and all groups need representation. BTW might you be a member of Lambda or Rainbow by chance?

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by KB9YKY on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

If the ARRL continues to seek more profit, and bigger paychecks for themselves, by making the amateur bands nothing more than additional "CB" channels there really will be no need for spectrum protection. If, and when, this happens the "broadband power line" thing will not really matter at all. In fact, it could well turn out to be a blessing rather than an interference problem.

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by WA7NCL on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Hey guys, did it ever occur to you that maybe the 2% that dropped out just plain died.

Look around yourselves, ham radio is getting pretty long in the tooth.

A bunch of guys who spend kbucks on radios --complaining about the cost of ARRL dues?
Ya gotta be kiddin.

We don't even have to pay anything for our Ham tickets anymore!

Get real and get over it!

The cost of ARRL dues is peanuts per month. You get a magazine and a website, fun contests(Field Day etc).

You think QST is bad, take a look at Wayne Green's 73 mag?

I rest my case.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

Anonymous post on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

To n1rja:

Your comments are typical of useless human beings that always take credit for everything that sounds positive and never take credit for anything negative. If the ARRL is responsible for what you say, PROVE IT! I don't think the ARRL is responsible for much of anything except doing nothing except selling books and mags to raise money.

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by N1RJA on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

"Trashin' and a bashin'...

Keep it up fellow hams. If the BPL issue fails and this gets implemented, or God forbid, a precious slice of your favorite band mysteriously disappears sometime in the near future, I know who will be crying the loudest - you non-members. If that isn't bad enough, you then will surely blame the ARRL for it. Can you say "deaf ears all around you?" Sympathy will be a hard thing to find among the membership who dutifully supported those who fought dilligently in Washington, D.C. to preserve what we have.

RE: More Members! And Less Hatred, Please.

by K1CJS on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

There is not a single organization out there that has all their members 100 percent behind them. That includes any radio organization, and there are more than just the ARRL, although none who are supposed to represent a greater number of hams.

No matter what an organization does, 1/3 of the membership of that organization will be against it. Get over it! The ARRL has pulled some real lulus, but all in all they have tried to represent amateur radio and its aims fairly.

Even though I wasn't a ham back in the sixties, I remember the incentive licensing debacle and the fallout that resulted. Ham radio has had its bad moments, some caused and some stopped by the ARRL.

As far as the ARRL being extra class oriented and controlled, maybe. But most of us hams in time want an extra class license, don't we?

As someone said, ARRL is the only game in town. As long as they stand for the retention and advancement of ham radio, they'll get my money.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by ROOT_ADMIN on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

W9WHE, as usual, you have hit the nail on the head.

Lets see, what has the ARRL done to me recently? I cannot think of anything.. What has the ARRL done to me in the past? well, look at the 220MHz deal. The ARRL never embraced FM Repeaters - 73 did, but not the ARRL, Incentive Licensing - nothing need be added to that one. On the plus side, we did get the WARC bands, and we are going to regain 40 meters IN SIX YEARS.

Things have changed, the old farts are dying off... The old mindset is changing, but there needs to be more effort to meet the needs of the members.

QST is the club newsletter and a wise operation would have the newsletter financed 100% by the advertisers.

If I were king, I would suggest a price reduction, run a special deal, make it a real deal! Build the numbers.
Someone said many years ago, if the ARRL was serious about dealing with WashingtonDC, they would open an office next door to the NRA.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by MICHELEBAMA on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

KB9YKY , Joe:

I wonder if two women wanted to have a threesome with you, you'd have the same disgust you have for the 'gay' people. I would bet that if I offered myself and a female friend of mine, you wouldn't turn it down. Like that would ever happen!!

Typical hypocritical Republican you are.

Michele

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by W5HTW on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

I doubt that job layoffs contributed substantially to the loss of membership, though it probably had some effect. My guess is the membership decline comes from perhaps three prime areas. (1) People who got into ham radio with starry eyes, and then found themselves limited, by way of license, to the VHF CB, and they lost interest. (2) Old timers who chose not to renew in belief the decline of ham radio is attributable largely to ARRL action or inaction, (a form of protest,) and (3) those who find the membership doesn't offer them what they want; neither in QST nor in real accomplishments.

A lot of what has been said here is true. QST, for example, is mostly advertising. In an effort to cut its cost more, the Section News, which is the ham radio "community news" was cut and put on line. Changes in content will always dissatisfy some people, of course. But QST has lost its appeal to many hams who once read it feverently. One solution would be to put it on line, but that would instantly reduce advertising revenue, which would probably offset, perhaps more than offset, any gains produced by not publishing in print.

One thing that has bothered me is the constant "up the body count at all costs" approach. As in many areas of life we have seen quantity substituted for quality, and certainly this constant "let's get more hams" is in line with that. It is not "let's get better hams" or "let's help the hams we have know more." Just "get 'em to the exams, pass 'em, and get the next group." "And get 'em to join ARRL."

I am an ARRL member. I find myself wondering if the reason I continue as a member is so I can be well informed concerning the decay of ham radio. I can't find that story in my local newspaper or on TV, so the ARRL becomes my deathbed analyst, as they sit over the patient and keep telling him "you're gonna be OK," while he's gasping for breath. So perhaps I renew out of, to use a cliche, morbid curiosity. And perhaps to know when to sell my radio equipment to the new multi-band CBer and to return to photography.

The ARRL's promotion of the internet as ham radio has certainly caused consternation among many of those who see ham radio as "radio," not as computers. The mere mention of the "Hinternet" is enough to make me growl at the nearest copy of QST. Their apparent approach in trying to make certain anyone who knows how to turn up a volume control should be an Extra (read: expert) Class ham is also a serious gripe of many. It is through the "up the body count" approach that we have so-called experts (Extras) who can't read an ohmmeter or figure out a resistor color code.

There is, though, a paradox. If the ARRL gets more members, it does have the opportunity to make itself known a bit better in Washington, as the name of that game is and always has been, money. But more members means more support for ARRL policies, and that is a problem. More members also means making it easier for wannabe hams to get into the hobby, and then they can send in their dues to 'thank' the ARRL for helping make that possible. That's OK, too, except this mass recruitment includes the cell phone bunch who really don't care about ham radio at all, but just want a free and easy way to talk to hubby/wifey/baby.

But I'll likely renew again! I can keep informed on the lastest in Hinternet and computers and the radioless ham radio, by visiting the Members Only website and reading how the body count has changed.

Ed

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by W7CO on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Well there certainly a lot of opinions about this subject. I am a relatively new member (25 yrs) of the ARRL. Even in the years when I was not very active I continued to send in my dues. My whole reason for doing so was the idea that someone needed to speak for amateur radio at the federal level. If no one stood up for the little operator my hobby would go the way the the stagecoach.

On the subject of CW. I do it because I think I ought to not be because I like it. In fact I HATE CW ops. However in the time of emergency CW will work when all the fancy stuff is crapped out. That said I suppose we should bring back "spark" transmitters also.

So, to all the experts who are leaving the ship like rats. If not the ARRL then who will speak for me in Washington. If someone has a better idea I'll listen. If not just please leave quietly but don't sour the soup on your way out the door.

73's Mike

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by K0RGR on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

How can you improve an organization by leaving it?

Furthermore, how can you be a ham without reading QST?
(It is available on some newstands, by the way - so membership is not required.)

Yes, I'm a liberal. I only voted for Reagan twice, but I didn't worship him.

But I've been an ARRL member since the 60's.

Yes, I refer to them as "A-Double-Cross-L" too sometimes.

Years ago, the Pacific Division Director, Doc, W6ZRJ
(a member of the AIP - George Wallace's party) started an intersting tradition. Each year, all the affiliated ARRL clubs in the division were invited to elect and send a representative to a meeting hosted by him. I know Doc paid for part of this himself, but I believe ARRL reimbursed some of the bigger expenses.

At this meeting, each representative had a vote, and the opportunity to raise any issue or proposals put forth by the clubs they represented.

I was fortunate enough to be that rep one year - what an experience! Our conference lasted an entire day, from early morning until dark. We had a 4 or 5 page agenda of items to discuss and vote on. Those items that were approved were faithfully forwarded by Doc to the ARRL Director's meetings.

Now, if I got my wishes, I'd ask the ARRL to institute this process in all their Divisons. Each affiliated club would spend a club meeting selecting a representative and preparing their issues for discussion, if any. After the meeting, the representative would report back to the club.

Meanwhile, I continue to write, and complain, to my Division Director and others whenever ARRL does something I don't like.

As for the code debate, ARRL opposed no-code licenses for decades until it became inevitable. No-code was one of the issues at the Directors conference I attended ages ago, and it got voted down there too!
Once the handwriting was on the wall, ARRL took a leadership position to try to get a limited no-code license. FCC decided to go with what we have today,instead.

No-code hams now outnumber us brass pounders about 2 to 1. I think ARRL's membership is still about 2 to 1 the other way. Most of those crying about ARRL are no-coders who think ARRL is anti no-code, so it's pretty strange to see the brass pounders dropping their membership in the only organization that has ever taken their side in the argument!

Meanwhile, as no-coders become a larger part of the ARRL membership, they also become a more important voting block. If you're unwilling to be part of an organization that represents all hams, then leaving is probably a great idea.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by W9WHE on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

What I find interesting is how many members are also dis-satasfied. If the ARRL had marketing savvy, they would model the ARRL after the most successful of all PACS, the NRA. Talk about successful, respected and most of all, VERY EFFECTIVE!

But what are the chances? SLIM.

Those running the ARRL are all seeing, all knowing and infalable (they think). Therefore, they are unlikely to admit they have problems, let alone fix them. Unfortunately (because with attitude change they could be Sooooo much better) I place the odds of meaningful change at 5-10%. About the same I give for liberals ever regaining the majority.

Anyone think its strange that the only national ham radio entity can't even count a third of hams as its members? That statistic alone speaks volumes. Perhaps what the ARRL needs is a "big project" to repair its relations with hams. However, they don't seem to care about existing hams, just getting new hams!

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by AB5XZ on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

I was out of ham radio (and ARRL) for a number of years (1970-1993), and was very pleased to find on my return that ARRL had done a pretty reasonable job of looking after the interests of ham radio operators. There had been some gains and some losses, but the hobby was still pretty robust.

I consider the annual cost of ARRL membership (which is about the cost of a magazine subscription) to be the best deal in town for hams.

In the latest and most important flap, ARRL had its top Headquarters people involved in creating the 121-page Comment to the FCC's Broadband Power Line NOI. That Comment is bigger than any other that I've seen in the FCC's comment data base (for the specific NOI). It is well crafted, obviously by people who care a lot.

To those who dislike the ARRL for one or more reasons: Get in the organization and change it, then! Sitting back and whining won't change a thing, in ARRL or any other organization. Remember that the ARRL is made up of *people*, some good and some great.

73TomAB5XZ

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by KG4YJR on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

I've never found or been a member of an organization that I agreed with 100%. I did hear from a guest speaker at our club meeting last night that if you want any type of ARRL sponsorship or endorsement for any events that your club may be organizing that they demand a very hefty percentage of any profits (probably gross) that you make. Sure some financial compensation is necessary but he said their demands are unreasonably high. I'll still continue to be a member and so will my wife but it would be nice if they helped others as much as they ask for it. I got a letter last week from them asking for money.

73
Dave

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by AB5XZ on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

In regard to ARRL charging big fees for hamfest sponsorship or endorsement:

Looking at ARRL's application form for hamfest/convention sanction, I don't see any mention of such fees.

Please back your statement with some facts.

My club has held ARRL-sanctioned hamfests for some years now with no demand for funds (percentage or otherwise) from ARRL.

73TomAB5XZ

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by W0JOG on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

What a great thread! I hope someone is seeing to the ARRL headquarters getting copies of these messages. While some are far from helpful or relevant, there is a thread here that is consistent and could be helpful to any service organization that has its mission statement in sight rather than its P & L.

Of course, I was saying the same thing back in the early 60s to others who were saying the same things you-all are writing here. I am amazed the organization has survived this long without revolt or responsiveness.

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by N7XB on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

To all those who oppose the ARRL and want no part of it, then practice what you preach, beginning in your own shack. All you need is a shredder, so let's begin.

1. Possess any QST magazine's? SHRED 'EM ALL

2. Earn DXCC, WAS, or other ARRL Award? SHRED 'EM ALL

3. Possess any QSL cards obtained through the ARRL Bureau? SHRED 'EM ALL

3. Did you obtain your FCC License at a test session run by ARRL VEC volunteer examiners? SHRED IT!

Now that your qth is disinfected from all things touched by the ARRL (magazines, awards, qsl cards, license), you can start enjoying the hobby all over.

73 de Bruce N7XB
Portland, Oregon

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by N6TGK on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

KB9YKY said, "The ARRL did nothing at WARC about keeping the International Morse Code testing of some sort in the treaties...showing that they want to turn amateur radio into CB radio with the belief that they will rake in more money for the purpose of increasing their already overpaid salaries."

I don't know if they said anything or not, but even if they did I doubt it would've made much difference since the other countries were in favor of it. The rule change letting each individual country decide makes perfect sense to me. KB9YKY makes it sound like the FCC has done away with the CW requirement already. I suggest if he wants to keep CW a requirement that he continue to be a member and VOICE HIS OPINION. I want to see the CW requirement stay so I'll do all I can to ensure that it does. 5 WPM is NOT difficult. It just takes time... something that the "want it now" crowd or those that refuse to upgrade just because they don't want to learn CW aren't willing to do.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by K8JME on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

To KB9YKY and the others who have been expressing views on sexuality:

Please take it somewhere else. It doesn't have anything to do with ham radio, so it doesn't belong here. I suggest USENET; there are plenty of people there who would be happy to debate this topic.

Thank you for your anticipated cooperation and courtesy toward your fellow hams.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by KG4YJR on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

AB5XZ, Read my whole post will you. I'm only repeatting what was told to me and my club. I didn't make it up out of my head as you're trying to imply. If the information is incorrect then thanks for addressing it. As for them sending me junk mail asking for more money (not for renewal) I can forward it to you if you'd like to pay it.

73
Dave

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by W0FG on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Let me get this straight. I shouldn't join the ARRL because they are a bunch of old-fogie CW-loving Extras that won't have anything to do with anyone else. I shouldn't joint the ARRL because they want to do away with the CW requirement and turn the ham bands into CB. I shouldn't joint the ARRL because they don't promote the newest technologies like FM, but I also shouldn't join because they promote computers and the internet. I shouldn't joint the ARRL because they support incentive licensing, and I shouldn't join because they want to cheapen the licenses. I shouldn't join because they haven't done ANYTHING for amateur radio and I shouldn't join because the magazine, the code practice, the QSL service, the contests, the training materials, and the club support are not perfect. I shouldn't join the ARRL because the officers have furniture in their offices and I shouldn't join because they spend money to attend WARC and ITU meetings. Well,in spite of all that, I became a Life Member years ago simply because they are the first, best and only credible U.S. organization who will defend the very existance of amateur radio at the highest levels where those policy decisions are made. If gunowners acted like most of the crybabies here, we'd be disarmed and defenseless like WWII Jews in the Warsaw ghetto.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by N6TGK on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

K8JME, you're absolutely right and I meant to say something about it in my post. By KB9YKY's own post stating that "Amateur Radio is a service 'rooted' in with a(n) interest in RADIO, not a hobby for those who think that they are scientists" has nothing to do with sexual preference so why is he bringing it up?

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by KC8CON on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

One other thing that I forgot to mention. If you want to promote an organization, promote a hobby and get people interested in it, you don't take your magazine off the news stands. For years QST could be found on the news stands, but not now. The ARRL pulled QST from news stands, so now the only way people can found out about QST, ARRL or the hobby is via word of mouth or the internet. Of course buying a QST magazine at the news stand meant that I could read it whenever I wanted, take it with me anywhere. Read an article now and finish it an hour or two later, not set at the computer for a hour or two, but also remember a lot of good information is in QST that doesn't even appear on the website and if it did you would have to be a member to access it.

Just think about it a kid or adult is at a news stand, they are looking at all the magazines. They come across this magazine call QST! There is a picture of someone operating a radio. They pick it up and glance through it. HUMMMM, they purchase the magazine and take it home. They begin to read it and begin wondering what is this ham radio.

It might not be immediate, it might be years down the road, but that magazine had an influence on them and the became a ham radio operator. Then they join the League.

What was the ARRL thinking when they pulled their magazine from the news stand?

I have read and reread some of the other postings and of course there are people out there who just want to pick a fight. But a lot of the postings are good ones. The thing over the code, well if the International group wants to remove code and the League is the only one against it what do you think is going to happen? The code requirement is going to disappear from the International requirements. If those who are fussing about the code would look at what was written in the League article, they would see that each country has the right to keep it as keep it as a licensing requirement. It doesn't look like to me that it is going to disappear. Only those who are to lazy to learn it will be pushing for it to be removed here in the US. I learned the 5 and 13 wpm code and was working on my 20 wpm code when the code requirement was reduced to 5 wpm. I do not look down on those new Generals or Extras who only had to pass the 5 wpm code. I think if they took the time to learn the code then they really wanted their ticket.

Well, I don't want to make this a code debate, I just think that this particluar forum is about the ARRL not the code.

73
Juddie, KC8CON

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by K0RGR on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

FYI all, I received a nice note from ARRL President Jim Haynie. He is reading the posts here, and will address those items that he can. He's having a registration problem with eHam right now, and he can't post anything himself, or he would have, already.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by W5USB on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Uh, Michele and kb9yky, what does sex have to do with amateur radio? That is absurd.

And the FCC, what the heck are you doing granting a club call NU5DE, for a bunch of "naturalists" who wanna sit around nekkid and talk on the radio? I mean, nothing wrong with that I suppose, but why must we know every intimate detail. Can't you just be the "Naturalist Radio Club"? This doesn't dredge up the obvious questions from youngsters that NUDE does. Now we must explain to our children (yes, kids are hams too) why there are those who insist upon getting undressed before talking on their radios. Isn't it enough to enjoy the hobby like the rest of us, without forcing your yet-to-be-mainstream views upon all of us? Have a little respect, will ya?

Oh yeah, and Michele. I'm neither Republican or Democrat and I would turn you and your lady friend down in a heartbeat. I'm primarily a Christian, and we aren't supposed to dabble in such self-destructive behaviour, regardless of how good it may feel. Apparently, it's not enough that you are now allowed to do whatever you want in private, but we must also get it thrown in our faces on a daily basis. So basically, keep it to your damn self! Thank You.

Art Granda W5USB

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by WV8T on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

This Crap is funny, I dont need the ARRL or QST, I have all the quality reading I need right here.

WV8T

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by K8UPA on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

I am not a member of the ARRL and don't condone or condemn them but to blame them for what happens in the WARC conferences really doesn't seem fair. From what I understand the ARRL has no vote and can only work the halls so to speak. Correct me if I am wrong.

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by KR1ST on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Hi there,

W3ULS writes:

"
The 2002 Annual Report of the American Radio Relay League (ARRL) contains the dispiriting news that membership fell by 2.5% in 2002.
"

Indeed the annual report is a good place to start to get some information about an organization. The real fun starts when you look at the numbers most folks don't even look at. For instance the schedule of expenditures:

Salaries, compensation and benefits:

2002: 6,245,221 $
2001: 5,643,583 $

That's an increase of 11% for 2002. That is a quite a bit if you'd ask me. (Only 5.5% increase from 2000 to 2001.)

Most folks would just look at the bottom line and see only an increase of roughly 400 grand, and think that that was to be expected (everything gets more expensive, right), but you really need to look at the line items to get some indication what happened, where money comes from, etc.

Employer contribution in pension plans have more than doubled (there's no employee contribution) also. It had decreased the year before. Membership dues has increased by 230K compared to 2001.

I haven't read everything myself yet, but there certainly are some interesting numbers. It's just too bad a financial statement doesn't tell you everything, so I just hope that these numbers mean that the ARRL has more folks on their payroll now and they are able to achieve financial stability in these economically challenging times.

73,
--Alex KR1ST

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by K8UPA on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

By the way, if it does get to the point that the FCC gives up morse code conditions, blame congress. It is a treaty and does need to be ratified by them.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by W5USB on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

THE AMERICAN RADIO RELAY LEAGUE, INCORPORATED
SCHEDULE OF EXPENDITURES
For the Years Ended December 31, 2002

Salaries, compensation and benefits $6,245,221
Publication costs and forwarding expenses $3,713,929
Communication and postage $609,372
Office supplies and expenditures $580,006
Administrative expenses $402,103
Occupancy costs $366,449
Legal and professional fees $383,262
Depreciation $332,218
Travel $269,145
Rentals and equipment maintenance $168,994
Other $321,511
TOTAL $13,392,210

Hmmm, $6.2mil for Salaries,compensation and benefits...up over $600,000 from the year before. Publication costs have decreased $300,000 since they year before. So we have a nearly $900,000 difference since last year. Yep, they need more members to cover this whopping sum.

from http://www.remote.arrl.org/announce/annualreport/02ar.pdf

Art Granda W5USB

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by KZ0ZZ on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Michele, I would like to have a three way with you:) I am one of the few Hams left that does not need viagra! On a more serious note, I think the ARRL lost touch with their membership years ago. People are quitely losing interest in ham radio and letting their membership lapse. I am still a member, but am not sure how much longer that will last. The ARRL is more interested in boosting membership than the level of ham radio (Quantity over Quality). The trouble is they are catering to the new hams, who are not joining, and loosing the old loyal members. Ham radio is quickly loosing appeal, Michele may have a better hobby in mind.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by KB0JQO on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Amateur Radio is still here... That's what they've done in the last 50 years.

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by NK7J on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Now this has been a very intersting thread to say the least. Everything from the devil is the ARRL to sexual deviants. WOW.

I am now a member of the ARRL and have been for about 3 of my 13 years of being a ham. Do I agree with all they do? No not really. BUT I want all the ANTIs to come up with one, just ONE, other group that has any political pull or will step up to the plate to lobby for our hobby. There just is not one there.

Some of the comments here are totally bizzare to me about hating the ARRL and it being a bunch of extra class nazis etc. Where do you come up with this stuff? I read through QST and do not see any prejuduce agaisnt lower class licencees? I enjoy QST, read everyone I get, maybe twice sometimes. If I had one suggestion for them it is to do more personal focus columns, I love to read on what others are doing with thier stations, layouts etc.

I am also a member of the NRA, I dont always agree with what they do BUT again no other org is going to stand up for my rights the way they do (by the way they are damn good at it too).

You ANTIs get off you high horse and get real, we need a PAC and right now you have only one choice, so support it.

God Bless
Jack NK7J

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by WA1RKA on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

The league lost me as a member many years ago when they shoved the incentive licensing program down everyones throat.Until that little debacle the amateur service was growing at about 10 percent a year.

In early 2002 I was about ready to join them again,but didnt. This was after one of their VEC's refused to let me or several others take the extra because we didnt belong to the league.

I also know that any VEC has to give the test to anyone whether they belong to the league or not!!

This left a bad taste in my mouth that I doubt will go away anytime soon.

John

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by KB9YKY on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

I NEVER brought up anything about "sex", "sexual preference", or "sexuality"! I merely stated some of the reasons that I probably will not be renewing my ARRL membership...and made some comments in response to a young, liberals foolish ideas taught to him by the liberal socialists. When the ARRL promotes, condones, or associates such things as queerness with amateur radio...it is harming the sevice! When such harm is being done, whether for profit or any other agenda, it effects everything to do with amateur radio. Such liberal nonsense only harms the service. Using the lib's logic, the QRT magazine should also be associating amateur radio with things like legalizing child molestation since there are child molesters who have "preferences" to molest, kill, and/or queer little children (there are indeed convicted, and not convicted, child molesters that hold amateur radio licenses). Why not also promote and condone being dopers and career criminals? Such "people" also exist in the amateur radio ranks. NO, NO, NO, my friends, this is NOT the image that amateur radio needs to put forth! IF, in fact, as one poster wrote (which I believe to most likely be the truth of the matter) that the ARRL was forced by the liberal courts to accept such filth from advertisers...then the ARRL should have just done away with the magazine altogether OR they could have just quit having advertisements altogether and published the mag with a small fraction of the $6 million+ that they pay to their over-paid staff. NOW a little word about the young tramp that posted her foolishness: Hopefully, her parents will discover the kind of stuff she is doing on the internet and get her some mental help/AIDS/etc counseling. If not, the odds are that she will not live long enough, to mature, to outgrow her youthful, foolish, and dangerous liberal ideas.

RE: The ARRL Needs More MONEY!

by W9WHE on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

IF its true that salaries, compensation and benefits have increased by 11% while income declines, that shows me evidence of the "Newington Boys Club" that many reference. Inflation was around 2% last year. The average raise (for mere mortals) was around 4%.

In your AVERAGE ham's household, when income goes down, so do the benifits! But if the post is accurate, at the ARRL....when income goes down, they all get raises that are in MULTIPLES of the inflation rate. Such a deal!

If you are a member.....and have to pay for the 11% increase....and this does NOT bother you....I have to ask whether you are also a member of the NBC? (Newington Boys Club)

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by K2WH on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

I find it absolutely amazing the comments from the idiots on this thread stating they are not going to re-join the ARRL because of some perceived slight to them. Imagine, dropping off the roles of ARRL because of a $ 3.00 increase in fees. That's only .0082 cents per day. How much did you spend on that deluxe radio? Give me a break!

ARRL is the only organization that is in the forefront of the fray, known as the FCC. ARRL is the only organization that represents hams in the Washington D.C. area. ARRL is the only credible organization period.

When will the "I'm not going to renew because the ARRL did or didn't do what I wanted them to do" jerks going to get off their duffs and support the ARRL good or bad. Sure, don't renew, and weaken the ARRL some more. I personnally am putting a $ 100.00 check in the mail today for them because of the stupidity of the comments on this thread. They need our support.

ARRL - the only organization that puts up a fight. Lose them and lose ham radio.

K2WH

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by K2WH on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

And on another note. Many hams join for (1) year at a time, and when the request to re-up arrives from ARRL, it gets lost or you just don't get around to doing the paper work and mailing in your payment.

If you don't already know, current members can opt to re-up automatically. That's the way my membership is. Quick and painless. They just charge the CC card. No big deal.

So any members reading this, go to the website, and click on auto re-up. You will be glad you did.

K2WH

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by KB9YKY on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

For the foolish little fella who used the false/fake callsign KZ0ZZ...Even using that fake callsign, YOU could very easily get yourself into some very, very serious trouble by posting to that child that you would like to have sex with her. If you are any older than being legally a child yourself...even if you are just "kidding"...YOU are putting yourself into a very serious position. Also, if you are still just a child yourself, you might very well cause serious problems for any adult members of the household.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by KB9YKY on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

QUESTION: Did any of those figures on the ARRL's expenses give an actual breakdown of which employee's, staff members, and officers received in salary and additionally benefits? Sounds like they might have a better racket going than being on the public dole ("working" for the government)!

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by W3ULS on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Some points of clarification in this ongoing discussion:

1. My plea for more members is based on the (unstated) assumption that the amateur radio service comes to Washington as a public interest lobby. As such, it does not, and need not, have the funds to compete with commercial interests--with political action committees and their lobbyists. We do not have to be the National Association of Broadcasters or the National Rifle Association. What we offer is an important public benefit--assistance to fellow citizens in times of emergency being the most obvious. This role seems to be well recognized by federal officials and members of Congress, expecially since 9/11. President Haynie and Co. have done an excellent job of making sure the value of the amateur radio service is recognized and appreciated in Washington. This recognition of amateur radio as being in the public interest is worth far more than any amount of good will political contributions can conjure up. A job well done by the ARRL.

2. When President Haynie testifies before Congress, he brings to the table the invaluable recognition and acceptance discussed under #1. What he needs, in addition, is to be able to speak for large numbers of radio amateurs. It may surprise some commenters that Congress and federal officials have no interest in ARRL's intramural squabbles. They do not care that radio amateur "A" doesn't like ARRL's policy "B" and therefore radio amateur "A" has no use for anything President Haynie may be saying now or in the future on any topic. My advice: pay your dues, work through the system and, if you lose an argument, get over it. There's strength in numbers for a public-interest lobby; your membership is important.

President Haynie & Co. have done very well in positioning the ARRL favorably in the Washington milieu. It is up to radio amateurs in the U.S. to provide the ARRL with the back-up needed to make the message heard. Join up!

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by KD7QPY on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Frankly I believe it is healthy to see such dissent amongst Hams. All dissenters should join ARRL! The last thing I believe the Amateur Radio service needs is complacency.

I'm a General (read: non-Extra) and I do not believe the ARRL ignores me.

The ARRL appears to have a much different vision of Ham Radio than I do--and I am glad of that!

I also believe ARRL did more than nothing at WARC--they did show up and from what I read they were ready to go to the bargaining table. The issues with 40 meters seems to be vastly improved by 2009 and we have a new band now (60 meters). I expect the ARRL will also be instrumental in helping us on the BPL issue.

What other US Amateur Radio organization has the resources to be MORE EFFECTIVE than ARRL? Please let me know... I'll join them instead.

I can also come up with one or two minor excuses to denigrate ARRL. So? I don't know of an organization that doesn't have its flaws.

The ARRL does not need to give up their image. It is the "whiners" and "peanut gallery" who should reexamine their image.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by KG6NXL on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

My friend KB9YKY, your comments about "homosexual queerness" are out of context and inappropriate. I am used to homophobes who rave about queers, but the intensity of their raving, and in your case the total lack of context, reveal more about their own internal feelings than about the "sickness" of homosexuals.

Homosexuality was taken off of the American Psychiatric Association's list of recognized mental illnesses in 1973. Any practicing health care professional will tell you that homophobia is indeed a mental condition, but homosexuality is not.

So, in the words of Shakespeare, "Methinks she doth protest too much."

KG6NXL, Queer radio to the max!

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by KR1ST on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

One does not have to become a member of the ARRL at all to support the ARRL in legislative issues. One can choose targeted donations.

Unlike the DXCC Award, where folks need to be a member of the ARRL if they reside in the US or its possessions but not when they reside outside the US (speaking of advocating patriotism....last page annual report), there's no membership requirement for targeted giving.

73,
--Alex KR1ST

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by KG6NXL on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

ROOT_ADMIN do you think it is fair to deny anyone the right to place advertising as long as they pay for it and it is appropriate? What could possibly be inappropriate about a gay group like Lambda or Rainbow wanting to advertise as long as the subject matter is Ham Radio?

The lawsuit was won by the gay groups because we have a system of justice in the USA that protects minorities and strives to guarantee fairness and equality of all under law. It's just a shame that some of us bitch about losing a lawsuit that should never have been required in the first place.

That they won was just, and if it cost ARRL members their precious dues, then dues paid to an unjust organization deserve to be lost until that organization becomes fair and just to ALL of us.

KG6NXL - Queer radio is as good as any radio.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by K5DVW on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

I can't tell if all this off topic commentary is sad or hilarious. Maybe I'm just confused as to whether my radio is queer or not.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by W4MDL on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

WV8T hit it right on the head. It's to bad it is over priced also (QSL service). Most other similer org's all over the world (esp. europe) get the service with membership. Just something to keep those salaries so high!

W4MDL

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by W5USB on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

K5DVW: Hey, that's funny!!!!! ;)

Who cares if some hams are gay or not, it doesn't belong here, period.

Keep your sexuality to yourselves, for God's sake.

Note to FISTS members. I detect a political force gathering to steal your monicre.

Art Granda W5USB

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by K0RGR on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

I have nothing to back this up, but it seems to me that there are more reasons for an increase in an organization's salary expense than just pay raises. I believe ARRL continues to expand their organization - they have several new big projects going, for which they have announced the hiring of new staff members. If you take that into account, it quickly wipes out that 11% raise you calculated.

In the past, I've seen many ads for openings at ARRL HQ, and I have to say that the salaries discussed have prevented me from applying - I could not stand the pay cut! If they have good benefits, more power to them!

We seem to live in an era where contributing money for the common good is considered foolish, wasteful, or a 'liberal' plot.

I was on 20 CW and 6 meter SSB last night. Worked 2 guys in the Rocky Mountain region. We discussed a lot of things, but sexuality, race, politics and religion were not among them. Let's keep it that way, please! One of Ham Radio's greatest strengths is the relative anonymity of its members.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by W5USB on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

God, did I say that? Alright, I'm done with this topic too.

Art

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by K0XXX on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Geeze, would you just listen to all this stuff. I won't join because they're getting rid of CW. I won't join because they want me to learn CW. I won't join because it costs too much (usually said while operating a megabuck rig and sitting in an RV). I won't join because it's all for the Extras. I won't join because it's all for those who won't upgrade. I won’t join because they’re using computers to talk on a radio (what do you think is inside that nice, new, fancy, do-everything rig?). Etc., etc., etc., and all the while the threats to our frequencies keep coming.

So I guess those that don't join, for whatever reason, are all writing their representatives and, posting public comments on the FCC site, Elmering and, otherwise doing their part to help preserve the hobby on their own…

Let’s get off our duffs. If we WANT to keep the spectrum, we need to start acting like it and get proactive. Just ragchewing in 75 meters, chasing DX on 10 meters, or bouncing UHF signal of meteors is not going to keep the hobby alive. In the real world (unfortunately) it takes lobbying and political savvy. Right now, I don’t see any other organization capable of doing that.

The ARRL is an organization of MEMBERS. If it is not doing what you think it should be doing, and you are a member, then speak up. Contact your League officials and make your opinion known. If you are not a member, well… I have seen mention of other ham organizations. At the very least, join one of them. It might not have the clout of the League but even small voices, if there are enough of them, will be heard.

The main thing is, member or not, direct your energies toward a constructive outcome for the hobby and not in dividing it.

This is just my two cents worth. All flames cheerfully returned to sender. ; ? )

Mark, KØXXX
ARRL Life Member

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by KC0ODY on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

WHo gives a rat's rear about "queer" radio or threesomes? I fail to see how one's sexual orientation or sexual proclivities have anything to do with our opinions of the ARRL. I don't care what you do in the privacy of your bedrooms as long as you're consenting adults. Why don't we just ignore such obvious trolling attempts, and stick to the subject if we want to have a productive dialogue?

We are looking at the possible loss of our bands when we collectively dismiss the ARRL. That's really the only reason I joined them. I don't really care one way or the other about QST Magazine, and I send most of my QSL cards direct using SASEs with mint postage, so I don't really care about that service either. I give them my dues money mainly so that they can represent me, and other hams, when it comes time to protect our frequencies against those who would want to absorb them. That's worth $40.00 a year.

For those who don't like the ARRL, then you are completely free not to join-- but then don't whine when the "Spectrum-Stealing Spectre" of commercial interests comes knocking on our collective doors sooner rather than later.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by I1MMR on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

I am italian,I joined ARRL in 1965 when I was 17 years old.The 1963 Radio Amateurs Handbook was my Bible and QST my preferred reading.Now I am 55 ,proudly ARRL Life Member,and I believe that the best defender of amateur radio is ARRL,not only in USA ,but,because USA leads the free world,also here in Europe.
Now ARRL is fighting against BPL. If BPL is approved in USA,in Europe and Japan it will come too.We follow USA,in all aspects of the life, with some delay .With BPL interference (2 to 80 Mhz) HF activity is impossible.And this would be the end of amateur radio.

To all the radio amateurs of the world I recommend : join your national league to defend amateur radio!Also if you do not agree on something !

Not only ARRL,but all the radio amateurs organizations in the world are losing members.May be Internet and the new way of life are killing us....
About the ARRL Books,I simply believe that they are the best.This year I buy the Antenna Book and I found it very good,a fundamental.I compare it with the 1964 edition (2 US$).....and I can say :Thanks you ARRL to keep me up to date.
Best 73's to you all de I1MMR Mauro !!!

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by W5USB on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Nope, not done yet.

Who gives the ARRL permission to invest the membership's dues? I noticed a $1.6 mil net loss on investments last year. Funny, that 1.6 mil could have been used to offset increasing costs of operations. Damn, these people act like the feds.

Can't they keep expenses at the level of intake, or below? Like all of us must do on our household budgets?
Heck no, because they don't "earn" the membership dues...they beg for them.

Art

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by KG6NXL on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

OK KB9YKY, here it is. My response to your outrageous bigotry. You know what "bigotry" is don't you?

The "Random House Dictionary of the English Language" defines bigotry:

(1) stubborn and complete intolerance of any creed, belief, or opinion that differs from one's own. (2) actions, beliefs, prejudices, of a bigot. (3) to be so emotionally or subjectively attached to one's own beliefs as to be unthinkably hostile to all others who disagree.
A bigot is a person who is utterly intolerant of any creed, belief, or opinion that differs from his own. In practical terms, bigotry is about how you relate to someone who disagrees with you.

So, I declare that you are exhibiting extreme bigotry and intolerance, to the point that there is probably no purpose in communicating with you. Enjoy your narrow little life, and I hope that some day your mind may open to the "rainbow" of life experience out there. But more than that, I hope that nobody suffers as a result of your extreme intolerance.

KG6NXL - Fae Nelly of the Radical Faeries

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by KC0ODY on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

W5USB... ROTFL!!! Now THAT was funny.

Back to the topic now... ahh, forget it; it's Friday, I'm clearing outta this pop stand. Have fun trying to stay on topic.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by G3SEA on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

In terms of general visbility I believe the ARRL made a big mistake by removing QST from newstands.

At the very least they could have displayed it at the thousands of Radio Shack Stores and other technical outlets.

Remember that without any Organization there is Chaos.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by N9CYS on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

NU5DE? ROTFL

That's TOO funny!!!

Does the club operate SSTV?

Thank goodness some gov't administrator still has a sense of humor.

Jim

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by W5USB on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

BPL? Boy it that the new cry lately.

Here in Austin Texas, it seems that each time lightning strikes, the power goes down. Who the heck is going to pay for that kind of connectivity? It's a fad and it will come and go without much effort from the ARRL.

Art

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by AA4PB on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Yup, when incentive licensing came in there was one bunch that complained about their loss of frequencies and dropped their ARRL memberships in protest. Then there were others who put in a little effort, upgraded their licenses and got the frequencies back. When they got back on the frequencies, they discovered there was a lot less QRM because most were up higher in the band bellyaching and protesting. Now I wonder who made out better on incentive licensing?

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by K9IKE on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

After reading numerous complaints on the ARRL I have to wonder if those in oppostion of the league's policies truly understand the role and function of the organization. As a member you have the right, if not the obligation, to support those elected representatives who share your beliefs. You also have the right to advise those reps with whom you disagree of your position. You can discuss these differences with your rep, you can try to persuade him to your side of the argument or, ( worse case scenario ) you can support the opposition in the next election. You can even get off your duff and run for office yourself! By the way, how many of us even know our division directors or how to contact them?
Anyhow, I don't agree with my wife on every issue either and I'm not gettin rid of her anytime soon.
All hams should be League members.

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by AA6E on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

So I wonder if the problem is the -2.5% League membership decline or if it is the ~75% non-membership among hams?

Maybe it's the civilized quarter of hams that _have_ already joined the League, and the rest are cavemen. But I'm not that pessimistic, despite what you can read for yourself above.

I've been licensed since '57, and, yes, I took the 20wpm exam -- when you had to do it at the FCC. Guess that makes me an OF and a CW elitist. (Wait, ARRL is for no-coders!)

I grew up reading QST and always thought of Newington as the center of things for ham radio. But it's obvious lots of people don't. I'd agree that the League has not shown enough imagination about how to make a "bigger tent", I think. The story of W6ZRJ and his efforts at grassroots democracy show what might work if we (and it's "we", not "they") worked harder at this.

The latest QST says 5 Divisions are coming up for Director & Vice Director elections. If you want the League to change directions, get in there and get the right candidates elected.

73 - mse

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by NK5A on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Somewhere in all this I saw the word "Simple" as in
"No Brainer".

So here is "Simple" in my opinion.

No ARRL, No ham radio frequencies, No ham radio.

No NRA, No gun ownership for private citizens.

Etc., Etc., Etc. That's the way it works. Simple.

So join or renew the ARRL membership.

As for dues increasing; what doesn't?
There ain't no "free lunch" and there never has been.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by NB3O on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

One of the main reasons for the ARRL's current membership decline stems in part from the poor relationships between the League high ranking officials and ops like you and me. As mentioned in the previous posts, there is a large divide between philosophies of a few in charge of the League and the general membership. The real solution is not to quit the ARRL (if you are already a member), but to use your vote to get sincere and competent people to replace those few in leadership who would sacrifice the ARRL and the future of amateur radio for their own personal agendas.
I really miss the ARRL heydays when Vic Clark W4KFC was involved with helping obtain the WARC bands. Vic was not only an incredible radio operator, but a real gentleman and a great leader as well. It was in these days that the ARRL represented the heart of its membership. We need more folks like Vic at the helm to restore the integrity of the League and preserve the future of amateur radio. It's time to send the current leadership packing.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by N1GNV on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Disclaimer:

I was the ARRL's Advertising Manager from 1999 - 2002. My comments and opinions are my own. I'm still an ARRL member and plan to remain one. I'm also in the Amateur Radio business, manufacturing and distributing antennas and other accessories.

This may be a rather long post, please bear with me.

As has been pointed out, the particular case of the Lambda Club's advertising was taken to court (long before I got there) and the ARRL lost. The League generally takes no position on any matters not directly affecting Amateur Radio. It does not endorse causes, candidates, or political agendas other than those of immediate concern to Amateur Radio. KB9YKP, there are several other more appropriate venues to vent your narrow-minded, bigoted, poisonous spleen -- er, I mean, to share your unique point of view. Take it there, please.

The League is, to a large extent, a democracy. Directors are elected by members in their divisions. Directors are, by definition, politicians. They listen to those who vote -- either for them or against them. And of course they have very little incentive to listen to those who can do neither.

You don't like the way the League operates? Join up, and let your Director and Jim Haynie know how you feel. Encourage everyone you can to do likewise. Believe me, I know from very (VERY!) personal experience that when a Director (or Jim Haynie) says "jump", there's a whole lotta jumpin' goin' on in Newington. And in many cases, nothing gets a Director to say "jump" faster than a member's interest or complaint. It's your organization, if you're a member. Make your voice heard. Or you can sit there and bitching and whining, but don't expect a lot of sympathy or interest from Newington.

The increase in salary expenses? I don't have any more information than you do. But I'd hazard a guess that a big part of that is increased medical insurance premiums, and possibly increased contributions to the pension plan necessitated by reduced investment income.

The Overpaid Boys in Newington? Actually, a significant percentage of the staff -- and middle and senior management -- is female. Probably a much greater percentage than League membership. I think that speaks well of the League. I'd hardly describe the League pay scale as overly generous, particularly so in the management ranks. I'm fairly certain that most of the League's managers (the competent ones) could earn considerably more in the private sector.

Most Hams don't belong to the ARRL? Depends on how you look at it. Yes, there are 685,000 licensees in the FCC database. Formal and informal studies going back many years consistently indicate that 65-75% of active hams are League members. How is "active" defined? A loose concept, to be sure, but two studies that I personally conducted were 1) Write down 100 random US call signs heard on the air on a variety of bands, modes, etc. and 2) Write down 100 random call signs of people posting on e-ham and similar internet Ham Radio forums. I did each one twice at 6 month intervals. In all four cases the results were as indicated. Others have done similar surveys with similar results. From this I conclude that most active hams do belong to the ARRL, and that there are something like 250,000 active hams.

Ham Radio is decaying/dying? Not true. Again, I personally did the research. The number of FCC licensed hams as a percentage of the US population has been steadily increasing for as long as I could find statistics for -- back to the 1920s. In fact, that percentage is now about 3 times as high as it was in the "Good Old Days" of the 1960s. ARRL membership as a percentage of licensed hams has been fairly steady over the same period.

QST is mostly advertising? Not true. A typical 160 page issue probably has about 65 pages of advertising. Independent readership surveys indicate that most members pay attention to the ads and find them valuable. If you feel differently, refer to my "contact your Director" comments above. Advertising revenue is a major source of ARRL revenue. Without it, either dues would be significantly higher, the nominal fees charged for some programs would be significantly higher, or some programs would just not exist -- for example, the $1,000,000 (One Million Dollars) a year that the League spends on defense of frequency issues.

You only belong for the QSL Bureau? Someone else only belongs for the contests. Another only for DXCC and other awards. Many, I suspect, see it as nothing more than a subscription to QST. All of these parts, plus many more, form the whole that allows the League to be our only effective national organization, for better or worse.

Is the League perfect? Far from it. I can think of quite a few improvements that could be made. But leaving, or refusing to join, does nothing to improve it. Neither does complaining here or anywhere else except to your Director or other members of the Board. My Director knows how I feel. Does yours?

Thanks and 73,
John Bee N1GNV
Quicksilver Radio Products
www.qsradio.com

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by KG4YJR on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

I received a very friendly and professional email from Jim Haynie in response to an earlier post I made that seemed a little negative and may have been misinformation given to me from another individual. Therefore in fairness I'd like to give some of my positive opinions about my experience so far with ARRL. I personally feel the membership dues are very reasonable. The price I paid for both my mine and my wife's membership with the included subscription to QST magazine, which arrives on time every month (couldn't say the same for CQ Magazine) is cheaper than what I pay a month for cable television and cheaper than my annual AAA membership too. So please folks, ARRL is paying attention to the postings and clarifying any misinformation. Instead of just slamming the organization and the individuals personally give them some constructive feedback, good or bad and it seems like they'll consider it. After all, according to the majority of the posts here, they do want to keep and recruit more members.

73
Dave

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by KC2IXE on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Michele wrote:
Typical hypocritical Republican you are.

Michele

Not all Republican's are hypocritical, OR anti-gay. One of my first elmers (before I became a ham) was gay - big deal. Didn't bother me (In fact I didn't realize it for over a year)

Some of us are even pro choice. Now find me a pro gun democrat

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by W4EF on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

>>QUESTION: Did any of those figures on the ARRL's expenses give an actual breakdown of which employee's, staff members, and officers received in salary and additionally benefits? Sounds like they might have a better racket going than being on the public dole ("working" for the government)! >>

No the annual report does not mention salary levels. The league website does mention that the league maintains a staff of 120 people. No sure how many are full-time, however. If we assume that it averages to 100 hundred full-time employees with an overhead of 50% for benefits. Then the $6meg expenditure would average about $60K gross salary and benefits, and about $40K gross salary. This would be consistent with the job ads posted in the back of QST from time to time. The advertised salary ranges are generally not impressive. When you consider that the median salary for electrical engineers is at around $101K right now, I can't imagine that they guys who work in the ARRL lab or the technical editors are earning very competitive salaries. It would be interesting to see what Haynie and Sumner make, but compared to other comparable executives, I bet its a pittance. In any case, you have to consider that an organization or company has to pay reasonably competitive salaries in order to attract good talent. The idea that ARRL employees are overpaid in my estimation is fantasy.

73 de Mike, W4EF..............................

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by K1CJS on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

KG4YJR:

I believe your guest speaker was slightly off the track as far as sponsorship of an event goes.

I have just gone through the paces of getting an event ARRL recognized and sponsored for our club, and not only didn't it cost anything, the ARRL supplied slightly over one thousand mailing labels for us and also supplied three ARRL published books for door prizes at no charge!

Maybe some larger clubs are asked to make a donation, but we weren't.

So, I can only assume your speaker was ill informed or had another reason to say what he did--possibly he spoke concerning another type ARRL sponsored function.

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by N3NL on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Hello, The ARRL should be much more assertive in
representing us. A good example of this is the
very effective job done by the Aircraft Owners and
Pilots Association (AOPA). AOPA has shown that you
can be effective, expert, and assertive in representing
the membership. ARRL has the knowledge but they need
to be more assertive for amateur radio. Perhaps they
need a separate taxable political organization to
supplement the main tax-exempt organization (which
cannot be too political).
73, Nickolaus E. Leggett, N3NL

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by AM5ATEUR on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

THE AMATEUR'S CODE AS IT WAS BACK THEN.

The Radio Amateur is:

CONSIDERATE...never knowingly operates is such a way
as to lessen the pleasure of others.

LOYAL...offers loyalty, encouragement and support to
other amateurs,local clubs, and the American Radio
Relay League, through which Amateur Radio in the United
States is represented nationally and internationally.

PROGRESSIVE...with knowledge abreast of science, a
well-built and efficient station and operation above
reproach.

FRIENDLY...slow and patient operating when requested;
friendly advice and counsel to the beginner; kindly
assistance, cooperation and consideration for the
interests of others. These are the hallmarks of the
amateur spirit.

BALANCED...radio is an avocation, never interfering
with duties owed to family, job, school or community.

PATRIOTIC...station and skill always ready for service
to country and community.

The original Amateur's Code was written by Paul M Seagal,
W9EEA, in 1928.

--->

THE CURRENT AMATEUR'S CODE, WHAT PEOPLE HAVE
NOW TURNED IT INTO IN 2003

The Radio Amateur is:

IN-CONSIDERATE...knowingly operates in such a way as to
lessen the pleasure of others. Has citizen's band radio
operator mentality, always willing to argue flame and
fight on the air. Uses big amplifiers, equalizers,
power mics with distorted lousy audio just to talk to
his ham buddy across the street, and always asking
for a signal or audio check. Uses profanity,
obscenities, foul words and meaning, 11 meter jargon,
promotes C.B. radio, is as rude, vulgar, and red neck
as can be. Hey, don't take my word, listen to some
of the biggest LID's on 7255.kHz, 7258.kHz, 3.857MHz,
3.840MHz.

UN-LOYAL...offers disloyalty, discouragement and does
not support other amateurs. Hates local clubs, other
amateurs and even himself. Mocks the American Radio
Relay League, the only Super Duper club through which
Amateur Radio in the United States is represented
nationally and internationally even though they are
always running themselves like a business contrary to
the amateur radio service rules, always begging for
some sort of money donation or another. The blind
leading the blind, hand in hand with the W5YI group,
the greenhorns and 3 wpm FRS/technicians, right ORV!

UN-PROGRESSIVE...with no knowledge abreast of science
and a shoddy built and inefficient station, he asks
some of the stupidest, most asinine questions on some
of the ham web sites, questions that raise a substantial
and material question of whether he possesses the
requisite character qualifications to even be or
remain a Commission licensee. He has an on the air
operation or deportment equal to a moron in a class
known as "appliance operator" or "LID". Claims to
work but is always asleep on the job.

UN-FRIENDLY...mentally challenged, but really retarded
with impatient or improper operating practices, has no
integrity, poor ethics, scruples or morals. Willing
to give unfriendly moronic advice and counsel. And ready
to flame or burn anyone at an instant. Doesn't give
any consideration to any because they are either
cantankerous old timers, greenhorns, or
johnny-come-lately's - JCL's. Who currently only pass
their exams by guessing at an exam session, then only
to obtain and hide behind a vanity call sign of a real
old timer. These are the hallmarks of the current radio
amateur spirit.

UN-BALANCED...To the hot head ham, amateur radio is not
an avocation. To them it is like professional radio in
their own distorted and perverted way of thinking. They
cheat in radio contests, pad their logs with the calls
from the local club member roster, and even work DX with
their friends call to get them a contact, they boast and
pontificate that they are the best or claim to know it
all, but are hypocrites and dummies by their own words
and actions. They're willing to lessen the pleasure of
others by mocking or attacking one verbally if you
don't agree with them. While all the time hiding behind
their HT's, microphones or e-mail because they're to
chicken to face you in person.

UN-PATRIOTIC...with a LID station and sub-skills and
a poor education they are always ready to stick their
noses or be intrusive in other peoples business. Always
wanting to know what one is doing, if you are married,
working, or who you're dating etc., ready to mock or
skip the country and community when the going gets
rough, only to say screw you, hey it's not my job.

RESTRUCTURING AND VANITY PROGRAM...thanks for
restructuring and the vanity program, because now we've
got a lot of young and old jealous selfish hams, an
abundance of LID's on the bands. And some have only
had their tickets for a total of two minutes, already
sport a vanity, FRS/tech, or 3 wpm extra call sign,
and then they're trying to preach to everybody about
what's right or what's wrong when they themselves don't
know jack squat about the hobby or its traditions.
Rather than yacking, flaming, and trying to boss
everyone around they should try a nice warm cup of
"shut the fock up". They talk too much, don't know
when or how to shut up and never listen, therefore
they don't learn anything.

Probably because they've got their heads shoved so far
up their rear ends they'll never see the light of day
to know what's really going on.

73, Mike, and I am not the old man on the hill, just
stating the facts man.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by N6AYJ on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

KG6NXL, your definition of "bigotry" doesn't apply to those of us who disapprove of homosexuality because being gay is not a "creed, belief or opinion", but is instead a sick, disgusting form of behavior. Those of us who know what kind of behavior is normal, and what is not, have the right to disapprove of homosexual acts. Don't try to put us in the same category as racial bigots. Race is not behavior; it's a status. Homosexuals CHOOSE to engage in their sick, disgusting behavior. We have a perfect right to condemn their sick, disgusting choices.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by K1CJS on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

KC8CON

I don't believe your post about QST being pulled from the newsstands. Its more likely that it was pulled from the newsstand you went to.

The last time I went to the newsstand I frequent it was there on the rack. Further, I just called that newsstand and they told me the newest issue is there.

Please just look a little further, I bet you'll find it. Better, if you enjoy it that much, become a member of ARRL. Instead of paying $60.00 every year for the magazine, you'll save over $20.00 on the cost.

A winner in any case, even if you don't ever use the ARRL membership!
_____________________

KG6NXL

Just ignore the bigotry and he'll go away eventually. If you want more laffs, look at his comments under the article "K. I. S. S.". Keep in mind he is a technician class licensee.
_____________________

As far as the off topic posts and remarks, even though they don't belong here--I also think some are funny. But some are obviously the result of "mouth in gear before brain running smoothly" ;-)

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by K1CJS on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

As usual, most of those who are yelling and screaming the loudest don't have their real callsigns posted and aren't HAM enough to even identify themselves in their profiles.

There really isn't any need for some of the posts here on e-ham no matter what the original article is about. Whether someone lives an alternate lifestyle really doesn't belong here at all, period.

No matter what the posts involve, can't we just have a discussion--spirited or not--without it turning disgusting? No, I suppose not. That would be asking too much..........

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by WO5I on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

John (N1GNV),

Thanks for taking the time to provide the "ARRL Insider's" view of things. It always is a refreshing breath of oxygen to see someone who actually knows the facts in regard to what he's opining.

I have been a ham for 25 years, but only active for 7 or 8 of those. The other 17-18 years I held a valid license, but didn't operate or participate due to various personal reasons. In those years I was inactive, I was also NOT a member of the ARRL. So your reasoning behing your assertions that active hams are more likely to be ARRL members is sound, as far as I'm concerned anyway.

I had the occasion to be in the Hartford, CT, area last March and found myself with an afternoon to kill, so I got directions to the ARRL HQ and stopped by to see what it was all about. For the most part, nothing about the HQ facilities struck me as luxurious. I work in the insurance industry, so I have seem some pretty palacial digs. The one area that did impress me was the Maxim Memorial Station. W1AW is first-class! If my dues are going to support the efforts of operating that station, then I have no problem with paying dues for that alone. However, the rest of the ARRL facility, or at least what I saw of it, was quite unremarkable. No leather chairs in offices, no mahogony paneling, just a very Spartan and functional office.

My involvement with the inner workings of the league has been fairly limited. I voted in the last SM election, and have held appointed posts in the past (OO, Asst. SEC, others too trivial to recall), and agree that the "bureaucracy" that some seem to think exists at the League is minimal. People involved at the elected, appointed, or salaried levels all seem to have important jobs. Sure, some take their jobs more seriously than others, but not disproportionate to any other working arena I've ever seen.

I appreciate how you made it a bit more obvious that people join an organization for very personal, sometimes selfish reasons. But those reasons are theirs and nobody should question them. It's my money, so if I want to join just to use the bureau or to read QST, so be it.

By the same token, people who elect NOT to join for personal reasons, whether they're rational or not, shouldn't really be blamed either. It's their money, and if they'd rather spend $40/year on TV Guide than QST, then so be it.

As for the guy who needs the lobotomy (you know who I mean), don't worry about him. I think it's a very good sign that so many people have posted without even commenting on his 4th grade mentality. Why sink to his level anyway? If you're not with him, then you're against him. And if you're against him, you must be gay. I remember a lot of arguments from my gradeschool days that went like that. Seems so reasonable to one with the mind of a 9-year-old, eh? Hi Hi.

Again, thanks for your insight. While I also don't agree with everything the league does, I make a point of telling my director or SM exactly what my opinions are.

73 and best wishes on an improved League and Amateur Radio Service.

David, WO5I

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by AC5E on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

227 years ago Ben Franklin told his compatriots "We must all hang together or we shall all hang separately." Amateur Radio Operators are in much the same situtation today.

Those of us who read the professional electronics magazines know there are literally dozens of "new or proposed" services whose sponsors and promoters want our spectrum. If we don't hang together to preserve our spectrum from those commercial interests - ham radio will be dead and buried.

No, I don't like some of the ARRL's positions. But I understand that trying to satisfy everyone is impossible, the League must try to satisfy as many hams as possible.

I would like the League to be more assertive, but since only a minority of Amateurs belong I understand that diplomacy works better in this situation than bluster.

I did not like dropping the section reports and contest results from QST, but I understand the directors had to make the same business decisions I make every day. When revenues are down and costs are up sacrifices must be made.

And I do understand that some hams are still incensed and blame the ARRL for things "Bud" Budlong did back in the 1930's. But if you don't like League policy join the ARRL and talk to your section manager and district director - you may well find they agree with you. Or run for office and find out from the inside what is actually behind many of the League's actions.

But whatever you do, join the League and help us preserve ham radio. Because if you don't there will be no ham radio to perserve.

73 Pete Allen AC5E

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by N1GNV on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

W5USB --

>>Who gives the ARRL permission to invest the membership's dues?

Uhhh, what would you have them do? Stuff it in a mattress? Open a free checking account and get a toaster? Were you complaining just as loudly when the market was skyrocketing and the ARRL earned substantial income on the investments?

On newsstand sales -- I doubt very much that the League "pulled" QST from anywhere that was willing to sell it. More likely that it did not sell in enough quantity to justify the space. Wal-Mart probably pulled it when they heard there might be "queer radios" on the cover... sorry, couldn't resist.

Thanks and 73,
John Bee N1GNV
Quicksilver Radio Products
www.qsradio.com

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by KD7KOY on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Is it me or has these threads reached a new low? Sex, fights, name calling...
(I feel like I'm reading some of the interviews for perspective guests for the 'The Jerry Springer Show..' : P)

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by N6AJR on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

What in then Hell does ARRL needs more members have to do with CW, code or no code, gay and lesbian hams or half of the crap that has been posted here.

Get a life, the arrl is an organization, if you don't like it , then run for office with your friends, and change it from the inside. It is a funtion of the charter and the membership and the elected officials. KEY WORD , Elected officials. DO you vote?

Don't like the way THEY run things, RUN FOR OFFICE, and change things. SEE How Well you do. If you don't vote you, don't have a say, be it ARRL, or the U.S. president. If you don't vote, don't complain. Naner naner.

tom N6AJR

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by W5USB on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

N1GNV:

Yes! In fact I do keep some of my savings in a lockbox in my closet. I am no gambler...and in fact I despise gambling. I also know computers very well and have been using/programming them since 1980. I also know that this hightech/internet fiasco has all but ruined our economy on odds that Vegas wouldn't take. It's just a damn box, not the next "saviour".

That said, I have just read my email from Mr. Jim Haynie. In my reply to him, I stated the exact same thing. I simply do not agree with people investing other peoples money, unless you are a broker or something.

I live in Austin, Texas. It's here that many folks are still feeling a severe sting of the downturn. 3 years ago, it was hog heaven. Man, we could do no wrong...money was everywhere.

Apparently nobody understands the cyclical nature of the markets. When they are pumping, it time for a downturn. Three years ago everyone I knew were tying their 401K's to the stock market. I warned them all and was called stupid for it. Guess what, I still have every penny.

Easy come, easy go. Simple.

Well, enough of that.

Thanks for the email Mr. Haynie, I hope you understand my position.

Art Granda W5USB

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by K1CJS on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

After a little digging and a dose of common sense which I lacked on my previous post concerning pulling QST from newsstands:

The newsstands will pull magazines that aren't selling in favor of others that will. I was told that in the case of QST, sales are very low as compared to other electronics type magazines. (What others I don't know.) Many small newsstands just cannot afford to use the space for QST--it just doesn't sell that many copies.

The larger newsstands and some of the large bookstores should and do have copies of QST, CQ and other radio oriented (ham radio, shortwave listener, etc.) magazines as well as copies of the more widely asked for ARRL books--The Handbook, Repeater directory, and so on.

If your small local newsstand doesn't carry QST anymore, try a larger bookstore or newsstand--you'll find what you're looking for.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by K5UJ on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

A couple of quick comments, first re the ARRL's financial figures given earlier:

I've seen a lot of balance sheets over the years and I can tell you that in most not-for-profit organizations it is not unusual for 50% of expenses to go to salaries and benefits. In fact, if they are kept to 50% of budget they're not doing too badly. I did not do the arithmetic to be sure, but in the ARRL's data it seemed that they are roughly at that 50% mark for S and B. Before you tell me about the relief organization that gives away 98% of its income, let me say that "not-for-profit" is a term taking in a wide range of groups with all manner of operating expenses. ARRL has to compete in the market place for hiring technically qualified people. They operate W1AW, publish, and maintain a Washington office. In order to be represented at meetings all over the world, they have to pay travel expenses. That 50% starts to not look too shabby.

The ARRL has had a quiet reputation for decades for not being a particularly generous employer. The people who work there are not trying to get rich. They are there because they love this hobby and love making their hobby their work. If you don't believe me take a look at the Hq. job ads and see what the starting salaries are. Then, go investigate the cost of living in Connecticut and prepare to say Hello to baked beans and Velveeta.

If you don't like the high dues you can do what I did: Become a life member--then you'll never have to complain about dues again! : )

Rob Atkinson
K5UJ

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by KD5HIY on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

The only reason i haven't joined yet is because of the money issue. I don't have a lot of money and at this very second i cant afford to join, just because i don't have enough money to join. I think it is important to have a "Union" in a way to help protect us from the uncaring people in washington. like i said i support the ARRL but just cant afford to have a membership at this current time.

Chris
KD5HIY

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by W5USB on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Ahhhh, I have forgotten.

Mr. Haynie reminded me that those investment {losses} were unrealised. After thinking a bit, that makes sense. The losses aren't realised until the investments are sold. Fair enough.

But can the money spent on the investment be used before the sale, NO! So, for 2002 alone, that particular chunk of money is tied to "paper" that cannot be spent for more employees, or better lawyers, or travel expenses...etc. In my opinion, this is the same as a realised loss, since the ARRL now finds itself in a position where it needs more liquid cash, before the investments can be converted into such. The burden for this investment decision now falls on the hard-working ARRL general membership. Would it not be better to spend exactly what one takes in and no longer worry about it, rather than to gamble for the "easy money".

Art Granda W5USB

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by W4CNG on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Took more than 20 minutes to get to the bottom of this trail of stuff. Was a member in the mid 60's and grew up in the old school, saw Incentive Licensing arrive, left and moved to VHF/UHF and later returned after it died in 1999, I was right then and now. The ARRL blew off FM Repeaters (found about them 10 years late 1978+), most recently ESSB, and they basically have to acknowledge what is going on in the world today after it happens (less CW). I am a yearly member because of my ARES Responsibilities in Metro-Atlanta. They are the only Group reperesenting us on a national level. My cost was 37 years not working HF Radio and enjoying the contacts. That is all behind me now (55 years old) and re-living your youth can be costly ($20,000), and you cannot pass thru this life twice. Support the ARRL first, when they are WRONG let them know, it's lot's faster now with the Internet and DSL. Vote, comment, speak out, but DO NOT COMPLAIN if you are not a MEMBER. You have no right...

Steve W4CNG

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by X-WB1AUW on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Initially, I bought QST because I was interested in radio. Before becoming ham, I had a subscription to QST. Once I became a ham, I still subscribed to QST. After a few years, I decided that there really weren't that many articles in QST that interested me.

Someone pointed out that ham radio was like an umbrella term, there were many facets to ham radio, and QST tried to cover them all.

I thought about it, and concluded that QST was like a free benefit of membership, that my membership supported the ONLY organization looking out for the benefits of all hams involved in the many facets of ham radio. And, NO ONE ELSE had the history of service to ham radio, let alone the organization to fight for ham radio’s interest.

So, I became a Life Member. As a result, I can claim that I support Ham Radio.

I doesn't surprise me at all, that an organization, who has all of ham radio's interest at heart, doesn't do what some individuals think is best for ham radio, all of the time.

When I see posts, complaining about the ARRL ask myself, who seems to have the BIG picture and experience dealing with our government and the governments of other countries? I NEVER decide it is the individual complaining on the internet.

It is my understanding that Anyone who doesn't like ham radio can send "petitions" of change to the FCC.

It is my understanding that Anyone who is a League member can send suggestions to the League—dam, members might be even able to VOTE!

SO. If you don't like amateur radio, or the League, show us what you have done to change things, and what the results have been.

Bob

PS: Keep those RANTS coming; its great fun to read the “way over the top” ones, and the ones with the main theme The League did something I didn’t like in 1960something, so for the last 40 years, I’ve never financially supported their efforts to protect and promote ham radio!

Other "good ens" follow the pattern of "The League doesn't administer their awards program the way I want them to!"

And, “Why do I have to be a member to get member benefits?!!!””

Someone should really start a contest bashing thread.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by W5USB on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

"Vote, comment, speak out, but DO NOT COMPLAIN if you are not a MEMBER. You have no right..."

I am an American and that gives me the right, (1st amendment). It is however improper to do so, so I will attempt to temper my outbursts from now on. Thanks for reminding me ;-)

Art

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by W4CNG on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

W5USB (Upper Sideband No Email address)
If you are not a member of the ARRL you have NO right to complain about what is going on either side, much less post. Want to run with the big dogs, get on the Porch with an email address. No cheap shots allowed here.....
Steve W4CNG (On the Porch and Dues Paid Member)

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by W5USB on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Hey now, don't make me place into print (here on eham) the first amendment. Even if one pays no taxes, he has the right to complain about them. Perhaps you should re-read your Constitution. Placing me on "ignore" is YOUR right, but you can NEVER deny my right to speak.

Art

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by W5USB on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

And another thing. I almost never check my email (every two weeks on average). It's not something I enjoy doing. It just so happens that I read another ham's posting that mentioned an email from Mr. Haynie. This particular ham also posted "figures" from the ARRL. I thought I'd check it just in case. So don't bother sending me any email unless you wish to wait a few weeks for a reply.

Art Granda W5USB

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by N1GNV on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Art, you have every right to speak. Just don't expect that anyone in Newington will pay much attention until you're a member.

Thanks and 73,
John Bee N1GNV
Quicksilver Radio Products
www.qsradio.com

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by KC8CON on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

TO: K1CJS

Hello,

Just thought that I would clear up any misunderstanding. I am a member of ARRL. Have been a member for 7 years now. I am also an ARES District Emergency Coordinator. I was just posting my thoughts about ARRL and things they have done that possibly has caused some of the decline in membership. Also, this is my third reply to this forum and my very first reply I thought indicated that I was a member of the League. I have had friends who are members who have either let their membership expire or will let it expire due to the way things have been done by the League.

I am a member and since I am a member I feel I have the right to complain about things that the League does. I also email my Section Manager and Division Director anytime that I don't agree with what the League is doing. It is like I was always told as a child, if you don't register to vote and exercise your right to vote then you do not deserve to complain when things don't go as you think they should. As some have posted here those who are doing the biggest complaining, but state that they are not members or they are going to let their membership expire, have no right to complain. If they don't like what is going on then stay a member vote in the Section Manager elections, put someone in the League who will listen, then email your SM, Division Director or even the League direct with your complaints.

As for the magazine issue, the last time I renewed my membership, which was in February of this year, I asked the woman at the League who took my renewal about the League not selling magazines at news stands. She informed me that they (the League) had stop sending to news stands. I have checked at my local Krogers, Wal-Mart, Waldens Book Store and another book store and they do not have QST on their stands. The only magazine I have found was CQ Magazine and that was at Walden Book Stores.

If your still seeing them at a news stands I am very glad and pleased, but it makes me wonder why they are not here in Fayette and Raleigh Counties, WV.

Please don't take this posting the wrong way K1CJS, I just wanted to let you know that I am a member.

73
Juddie KC8CON
ARRL Member since 1996

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by W5USB on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Please don't take offense to what I said in my first post, in reply to you. If it came across as "sharp" that was not my intention. I have no beef with anyone. I do feel that I have at least a small sliver of a valid point. I'm sorry if you disagree.

Art

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by K1CJS on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Seems to me the right to complain IS a basic right granted to all Americans including those who may or may not be members of the ARRL. The right to complain to anyone about anybody.

Not paying dues or renewals and telling the ARRL why you're not is a form of complaining. Those who say if your not a member don't complain, seem to have a limited view of most things. How are we to try to reform things--or organizations--without telling them what we find unacceptable with those things or organizations. How are things supposed to be remedied? How are things supposed to be changed to a way that other people would then join?

You who say "If your not a member you have no right to complain", you are the worst kind of idealist--one who has no regard for the opinion of others.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by WA1RKA on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

I guess miracles still happen, in response to my post earlier I did hear from the President of the ARRL and he is going to let all of their teams know that a refusal to let someone test is againt the rules!

Guess that kind of destroys the theory that they only listen to members.

First time anyone from the ARRL has responded to me on this matter so maybe there is hope that they are changing.

To clarify something I said in my previous post about incentive licensing. When it was passed I was in the Air Force and couldnt upgrade till my enlistment was up.I have pretty well forgiven the league for that debacle.

When it comes to keeping our bands,I guess the best thing said is "The more things change,the more they stay the same." As the arguments now are almost word for word from 40 years ago.

If the ARRL wants more members they really need to listen to the non-members concerns as well.

I would be more than willing to send them a check right now,IF they would give me the option of not getting QST. I have read the magazine a few times and just dont particularly care for it.Why send something that is only going to be thrown in the round file to begin with.

John
wa1rka

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by KE4MOB on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

This thread is EXACTLY what is wrong with ham radio. No one can stay on the subject...we are too busy beating each other over the head with politics.

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by KI4AFO on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Gents, bear with me. I am a new ham so I probably bring a slightly different perspective than many of you old timers.

I will probably join the ARRL, not because I think they are the best thing going but because they are the only thing going. But competition is a good thing and even if they don't have another competitor they have to compete with members vs. non-members (people who leave or don't join). As I look at the ARRl I see a few things that seem blatanlty obvious.

First off they are the principal negotiator with the FCC. In that vein they are immensely involved with the band plan and the testing standards. For starters, in this day and age, I fail to understand the immense bandwidth dedicated to computer driven communications. The internet is here and that is where the computer is best suited. RTTY and such means of communication are slow and very duty cycle intensive. What is the purpose. Yes digital communication can be accomplished but in todays day and age, do we really need an organization dedicating itself to the promotion of these means of cummunication. SSB and CW should have the lions share of the spectrum but in my analysis it seems that they are viewed as almost secondary. Please note 30M. One would think that with a dwindling frequency spectrum moe effort would be placed on like I said, CW and SSB.

As to the testing. I was very discouraged when studying for the tests. There does not seem to be an emphasis on learning things that really count. Okay, i need to know that as a general I have certain limitations and I do need to know what they are. But does any one really think that I will keep them memorized after the test. No, in fact I can't remember them now so I keep a chart near at hand to keep me legal. As it stands right now if I am in doubt I look at the chart. I am sure that as time wears on I will memorize them from use but to worry about them on a test seems pointless when there is so much more to learn and be competent at. I would love to see more information on antenna theory and the solid working knowledge of the rules and where to find information.

I know this may all seem petty but it is one new persons view on what ails the league. I have yet to join, and I will in the next few weeks but that does not mean that I am happy about the way things are run or what direction it seems to be headed in.

Just my thoughts

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by WB4QNG on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

They are the only game in town. You have to have a voice in congress or ham radio will die. They are it like it or not. I am a member and will stay a member. The ARRL is a lot better than nothing. As for as the decrease in membership. They died. It takes one to three years for your memership to expire once you die. It takes up to ten years for your license to expire. Look around gang we are a bunch of old men. Like the WWII vets we are going to start dying in an increasing large numbers very soon. Another fact of life.
Terry

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by K1CJS on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

KC8CON--Hello!

Glad to meet a fellow ham. I checked just one newsstand tonight but I have seen them around. The person at the ARRL HQ could have been mistaken, on the other hand, I've noticed a lack of the other ARRL publications at that newsstand, perhaps it is those that have stopped being shipped to newsstands.

I also am an ARRL member and am a local ARES Emergency co-ordinator besides being radio communications director for the local EMA.

Yes, I remember being told if you don't join in you don't deserve to complain--but you still have the right to do so. I'm sorry to have to put it this way, but it is a first amendment right, known as free speech. That is one of the reasons we are able to post on this and other forums. The flip side to that coin is the people you are complaining to don't have to listen to you!

And I agree with your other statement as well, I also let my section and division managers know my feelings on the various matters confronting ham radio, and I especially try to keep up with technical issues since I also hold an ARRL appointment as a technical specialist. Whenever I am asked to provide assistance or get an answer to a question, I have to know the answer or know where to find it quickly.

You probably did post that you are a member of the ARRL, and I apologise for missing that, but sometimes we all miss things no matter how hard we try not to.

I'll try to find out about the conflicting reports concerning QST, but a thought occurs, if QST has stopped shipments to newsstands, how is the league going to make up the money taken in from newsstand sales? Even if those sales are low in volume, at $5 a pop, the income from limited sales would still be quite high.

Just a thought from the south side.

73, Chris J. Smith, K1CJS

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by N2BR on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Well the ECOM is a bunch of crap and another way for the arrl to rip you off,Who want to pay and is dumm enoulf to pay $45.00 for so called ECOMM training not me.And what happen to the grant money the arrl got from the goverement for the 9/11 this was to go for the so called Ecomm.Looks like that money ended up in someone back pocket like all that money does.Now the arrl is mailing out to all members to please send money to help fight for the bands.Hell where all the money gone to and why is the arrl wanting Mo-Money.Well soon as i can get my money back i plan to never sign up to join the arrl ever again.

I work in emergency public service for almost 25 years,And they do not want hams in there way untill they ask for help.Most all local police fire ambulance ema have there own backup radios repeaters etc and will tell you fast get out of there way if they need you they will call.

Beside that what we pay the policeman fireman and dispatcher is to do there job.

Just my 10 cents now someone else turn
Bob/N2BR

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by WB5HZE on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

I wonder why I'm even bothering to post- most folks will probably give up before they walk this far through the mud. But still, just in case . . .

Here's the question- do you appreciate your privileges as an Amateur Radio Operator? Do you want to keep them? A simple YES or NO will do, please.

If everyone who has written a reply here has one thing in common, it is that you have strong personal feelings about amateur radio. Otherwise, you would not have taken the time to express your opinion.

If we fail to rally behind the ARRL in support of their effort against BPL, everything that has gone before or will come later will be irrelevant. You'll probably be off the air- or stuck in the World Above 50 MHz permanently. No bull$%!^.

I suspect that the BPL issue will be addressed according to politics <Mr. Powell> rather than technical issues. If so, we are in a fix- because the comments submitted thus far reflect only a small percentage of the number of licensed hams in the US. Industrial opposition (numbers, $$$, & political influence) is virtually nonexistant- because industry uses HF very little these days & frankly does not give a $%!^. So despite the rightnousness of the cause, the opposition voices don't have the weight that they need to win a political battle.

Fine, let's be self-centered- do something to protect your own special interests, because EVERYONE's differing interests are all rolled up into the big package that the ARRL is fighting to protect. Get some cash to the ARRL so that they don't run out of funds before the war is won, & build up the membership numbers to get the FCC's attention. Join the ARRL if you like- even if it's only for the duration of the BPL issue. Or don't join the ARRL - but send some bucks on the side to fund the opposition to BPL, & file your own comments in support of the ARRL comments.

Love them, hate them or simply tolerate them- the ARRL is the only politically visible voice speaking on your behalf against BPL. If the ARRL fails, you lose. Bottom line.

Ron WB5HZE

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by K7VO on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

KB9YKY makes me proud to call myself a liberal. No, I don't believe conservatism equates to the type of hateful bigotry he has posted here. However, he does equate tolerance with liberalism, and that is something I want to be: tolerant. If he doesn't want to be an ARRL member because the ARRL can't discriminate in QST, well... don't let the door hit you on the way out Mr. Dinosaur.

America today, thankfully, is a diverse society representing many different viewpoints, religions, races, creeds, cultural heritaqes, and lifestyles. Anyone who is a ham and doesn' t do harm to others should be welcome. People like KB9YKY drive good hams away, and that is a true shame.

What has the ARRL accomplished? We're still here, aen' we? All the commercial interests clamoring for our bands have made very little headway. Yes, I remember 220-222MHz and 1215-1240MHz very well. Still, our allocations have grown more than they have been whittled away by commercial interests. We now have 60 meters, and in the last 20 years added 12, 17, and 30 meters as well as the 33 centimeter band. None of those were open to us when I entered the hobby. Today I learned that the broadcasters will have to move from 7.1-7.2MHz, making another 100kHz of 40m ham exclusive. The league lobbied long and hard for that.

CW? Folks, I operate CW. My new call was one I wanted because it's so very nice in CW. CW will never die so long as hams enjoy it. The ARRL has a stated position that the CW bands will remain CW bands. That DOES NOT mean that CW has to be a license requirement. You do not have to operate or know CW to be a good ham. Where does ham radio sound most like CB? 75 meters, right? It's been that way as long as I can remember, and that means that folks had to pass a 13WPM code test to create the nonsense heard on 75 phone for many years. CW is no filter, nor does it insure the quality of the bands.

To those who say CW will live forever I say, yes, it will, so long as you share your enthusiasm for CW with newcomers. By all means, encourage them. However, let's be realistic and understand that time and technology marches on. CW has historical importance, and it is a wonderful hobbyist mode. It is no longer an essential as it once was. I personally think the ARRL has it right if they are no longer fighting to retain CW as a license requirement.

Disagree about my view on CW? Fine. Disagree with the ARRL on other issues? Fine. Still be a member. That's the only way your voice can be heard and you can influence policy. Talk to your section manager and division director and vice director. Let them know how you feel about the issues that are important to you. Do not pull the plug on the ARRL and your membership. They are still the only ones fighting to preserve our bands in a meaningful way.

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by NE1RD on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

I am a new ham. I got my ticket less than a year ago.
During these last 12 months I did not sit around
wondering what the ARRL was going to do for me; I
considered instead what I should be doing to contribute
to the hobby.

I am an Extra class operator. No I did not pass the
20 WPM test that some have passed. And, my code skills
are not (yet) sufficient to pass such a test today.
But, I am taking those skills I do possess and have
made an effort to give back to the hobby.

I have successfully obtained the credentials to be a
Volunteer Examineer (VE) under the ARRL VEC program.
Once a month, I join several others who volunteer their
time to give exams to new and upgrading hams. All told,
I've probably contributed 30 hours or more to this in
my first year. I wish I could have done more.

I've helped a friend who had strayed from the hobby
some years ago to become interested again. He studied,
worked hard, and upgraded from his Novice (with code)
license to General. He's a bright fellow who just
needed a little encouragement. We spent Field Day
together and had a wonderful time operating QRP.

I've helped another friend who is a bright and
curious type "graduate" from playing with scanners
and Family Radio Service (he loves to tinker and
build things!) to get his Technician's license.
He's also got a strong sense of community and
service. I suspect he'll be volunteering to help
with the Boston Marathon and local community
organizations when they need communications help.

Finally, I should say that I got this sense of
pleasurable obligation from MY Elmer, Dave. He
was patient with all of my crazy questions, he
gave me the encouragement to pursue this in the
first place, and has provided me with a positive
role model for what a good ham should be.

The ARRL doesn't live in Newington. The ARRL,
like any "community" organization, lives in its
community. That is, it is up to _you_ to make the
ARRL work; not the other way around.

The ARRL leadership can work, usually quietly
and behind the scenes, in international meetings
(as pointed out by some above) but the job of
keeping hams interested in the hobby is up to
you, acting the role of Elmer. If you're sitting
on your backside expecting ARRL to do everything
for you or for the hobby, I think you've missed
the point.

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by W0SCB on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

As usual I see this 'Hot' topic has recieved a tremendous number of posts in an extremely short period of time. I look at it like this, we are a relatively small group with only one organized voice protecting our freedoms. That is the ARRL. While I do not necessarily agree with everything they've said and done, what organiztion would every ham support? None. As long as we are a fairly large and diverse group of individuals, there will be disagreements over an almost unlimited number of matters. Nevertheless, if you enjoy this hobby and would like to protect our bands, maybe even expand our privledges, to my knowledge there's only one organization. I respect everyones right to argue and/or disagree in a constructive manner, but is complaining on a forum the effective way? Maybe if the dis-gruntled ex-arrl members, and/or holdout members joined and made organized requests to the ARRL or got more involved things would change. In my short life, experience has shown me that the squeaky wheels get the grease and paying ones get it more often. The non-payers are basically sabre rattling to an underfunded and overworked deaf ear. I'm newly licensed(just over a year) and have been around hams since I was a child (several decades). Some were/are members, others aren't. I really don't care to listen to those who aren't as I watch my money go to protect their freedoms. Complain sure, if you are a paying member. Then you've earned (bought) the right. But if you haven't while others may listen, they really aren't obliged to now are they? No one should deny your right to speak, but unless you're part of it, I don't have to listen or act either. If you pay me conversely, I am obliged, and if it is a majority opinion (ah democracy) then action should (or actually would) be taken. It's all in the 'put your money where your mouth is', if you truly expect to be heard. This is my first and probably only post on such a contrversial topic such as this one, but it seems to me the spirit in which this was started has been overlooked by most of the nay sayers. Our strength is increased by increasing numbers and weakened with it's decline, do we want our precious hobby to decline? Do we want our bands to shrink? I hope that more and more will put aside their gripes about the magazine, the offices, the salaries, and everything else to step back and look at the big picture. It is an organization that we can guide and direct, IF we're a part of it. Iask you all this...If there were no ARRL for the past say 20 years, would the hobby be better or worse off. I know my answer and I voted with my lifetime membership dues. I urge you all to do the same.
73

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by NB3O on July 12, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

OK, this might be slightly off-topic, but for those interested in the ARRL's balance sheet, you can find the League tax returns from 1993 to 2000 at http://www.kr4uq.org/ARRL_Tax_Returns/arrl_tax_returns.html
You might have to be a CPA to understand how the Form 990 is put together and how expenses are hidden, but it's all here for your scrutiny.

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by K9WQ on July 12, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

I am stunned by the meanness and ignorance of some of the posts in this thread.

Votes in our democracy count equally. But in the marketplace of ideas, the value of an opinion varies greatly.

The value of a willfully ignorant, emotion-driven, hateful opinion, such as the opinions of the homophobic KB9YKY, are worthless, no matter how many right-wing commentators may make the same kind of noise.

Whereas well-informed, well-reasoned opinions, such the opinions of N1GNV, who formerly worked inside the ARRL and who brings actual facts to bear on the question at hand, carry great weight.

If I can afford it, I'm going to buy a life membership in ARRL, because it's quite clear from this long thread whose opinions are worthless and whose opinions are well-informed and well-reasoned.

More than ever, I am grateful for the work done by the ARRL.

And if some of the comments in this thread are representative of average Americans in 2003, then I am terrified for the future of our democracy.

David
K9WQ

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by KC0ODY on July 12, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

It's nice to see some sanity and rationality on this board (i.e., the last three posts). Whatever your politics or feelings are about any number of topics that've been brought up on this (and other) threads, it behooves us who have this one thing in common- an appreciation and concern for amateur radio- to make our voices heard through support of the one organization that can make a difference for us in this hobby.

Of course, you're certainly free to do what you would like to promote and support amateur radio on your own, too... but try and get an audience in DC... I'll leave that up to the ARRL.

Communicate your concerns- this is very important, if you want your reps to know what you feel is important to AR. Send e-mails, letters, or call them on the phone; whatever. Just DON'T be silent when it comes to your concerns about AR... use the tools we have and don't just assume someone ELSE is going to do it for you.

And above all, RF is FUN! So enjoy. Life's too short to bicker about trivialities.

Jackie

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by K0RGR on July 12, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

W5USB - I believe that part of the idea behind offering 'lifetime memberships' is that the organization hopes to earn enough money over time by investing the lifetime membership fees to more than cover the cost of the membership. In the economy that prevailed from Eisenhower until 9/11/2001 , that was considered a prudent investment.

With the current state of the economy, a Life Membership looks like a terrific bargain, unless you are 86 and ill.

Maybe they should have invested in a nice energy company instead of high tech. Maybe Enron?

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by K1OU on July 12, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Wow! I forgot all about this topic as a way to cause drama.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by KD7WWR on July 12, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

About the gay/lesbian issue:

Perhaps this isn't the best forum to address this subject, since the only real thing that will be accomplished is the swarming of tempers.

KB9YKY: I agree with you completely. All true Christians are aware of this problem facing the world. Just remember that all of this was foretold. Remember what happens to these Sodomites (and probably most liberal-thinking people) in the end. We'll be celebrating, and they'll be burning eternally.

This is the last time I will make a political/religious statement on this forum. I fully admit that I'm a newbie and hardly know CRAP about Ham Radio, but lets use this forum to debate Ham radio issues, not personal ones.

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by W9JCM on July 12, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Whatever a my issues are makes it a big deal with me. I was with them for almost 6 years from before I got a lisc. But just dumped them. I dont like there politics and they do what they want anyhow. The OO program is a joke and waste of time. They are trying to put the screws to EQSL. So goodbye forever arrl I dont need you. I didnt become a ham to be in a "club". I enjoy the hobby in a singular fashion and thats the way I like it. I will spend my hard earned cash on something more fun mm like a nice italian dinner. :-)

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by W5USB on July 12, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

K0RGR: Hello
I understand your viewpoint and somewhat agree.

I do not invest money in anything. I'm of the old fashioned variety that earns money, and that's all I have...nothing more nothing less. This really makes "accounting" quite easy. I have no credit cards, and hold only a small truck loan for my business. I guess it's completely possible that I sound like a financial baffoon, in fact quite probable. But that's how I do it...and it works for me quite well.

My thinking on this subject, which certainly carries little weight, is that people (you and me) invest if we wish, and then the profits earned can then be applied to the ARRL if one so chooses. This puts the complete financial risk on the earner, and not the "borrower:ARRL". Wouldn't it be nice if Mr. Haynie didn't have to send out pleas for cash, just because some unrelated field takes a nosedive...dragging thousands of good folks and organisations down with the ship?

Like I said earlier, I do not gamble. No matter what the risk or reward. I will not risk 1 dollar for a chance at a 200 million dollar powerball win. I remember my statistics education well.

It's not that I don't understand the gamble which is investment, I simply don't believe that the likely gain is worth what can be expected if things "go south", that's all.

I do not include things such as house buying in my list of "won't do" gambles, as things like this can be "affected" by the hard work I put into improving the potential value, reducing the risk substantially. Throwing money at some "just-outta-college" person with some newfangled "business plan" tied almost exclusively to computers is not my idea of a safe risk.

My health insurance bill just came due, it rose 30% since last year. I have not been to a doctor in nearly 20 years. Feel great, never better. Why does my insurance rise so much is my question? I take good care of myself. I am healthy and fit for my age. Why should I be burdened more than I was last year, or the year before? Why can't the "hypochondriacs" be burdened more than I? Makes sense to me, and is fair to boot.

I would send the ARRL a check for a term membership, as a trial, if they would guarantee me, in writing, that my portion of the dues will not be invested, and conversely I wouldn't be hit up for added monies when the economy hits the league right between the eyes. You see, my financial picture leaves me little leeway for "surprises" like that. I simply will not throw money into another "risk pool". My health insurance is bad enough.

Enough babbling, I'm tired.

Nite all
Art

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by 10-4GOODBUDDY on July 12, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Geez you HAM operators are really on another planet. Come on now, get with the program; Your 2 Meter CB operator here joined the ARRL as soon as his license was manufactured a few weeks ago.

I simply love reading QST and dreaming about building the electronics I see in it. It just happens to be a fact that i cant solder for shit and have the worst luck at getting anything I build to work. Yet, QST makes me believe in a world where we can be heros in our own minds

What else is there to the amature radio service besides rag chewing on the 2 meter repeaters, checking into 2 meter nets just to hear your callsign mentioned at the end of the net, and looking at the members only acrobat files on the www.arrl.com website.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by AB7RG on July 12, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

"...you have every right to speak. Just don't expect that anyone in Newington will pay much attention until you're a member."

I know for a fact that statement is not true... When I first upgraded to Extra Class in 1996 I wanted to become a V.E. and I wanted to be able to help out with the next testing session. I called the ARRL and told them when it was (only about a week or so away) and they put a rush out to get the "test" to me for becoming a V.E. and another rush on getting my credentials to me. (Me, a non-member at that time.) Shortly after that experience I sent in my membership dues and have been a member of the ARRL ever since. And every time that I have had a question or concern the ARRL has always been there, just a phone call or e-mail away.

As for the question of, "What has the ARRL done for Amateur Radio?" We have more Amateur Radio bands and spectrum available for Amateur Radio operation than ANY other country in the world. I could have answered this simply by stating that we HAVE Amateur Radio bands to operate on and the freedom to do so. Ever read "200 Meters & Down"? Another really recent thing that the ARRL has and is doing for Amateur Radio and its future is fighting the BPL issue, FCC Docket 03-104 -- ever hear of it? Did you post your comments opposing it? The ARRL did, over 120 pages of real insightful information.

If you don't like what you see going on with the ARRL then become a member and vote for what you would like to see! Changes are made from the inside, not by Monday morning quarterbacking on the sidelines... "Changes do not occur through complaining, they only occur through action."

The ARRL is Amateur Radio's ONLY voice in Washington. (Members AND non-members alike.) They are representing YOUR interests in Amateur Radio operation there. They are fighting for OUR bands and justifying the need for OUR spectrum to those who would simply sell it off to the (many) commercial interests that would love to have our frequencies if it were not for the efforts of the ARRL. If you don't care for the ARRL as Amateur Radio's only voice in Washington, then you simply don't care for Amateur Radio.

The real question is -- what have YOU done for Amateur Radio?

73 Clinton AB7RG -- ARRL Member & Proud of it!

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by K1OU on July 12, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

KD7WWR,

Please remove yourself from the cross. We need the wood.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by N1OFZ on July 12, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

AG1N - Ripping off eQSL.cc?

Can you tell me what kind of computer you are using right now? Please, please don't tell me it runs anything Microsoft. If so, shame on you for supporting a company that rips off other companies ideas. You had best throw out the computer or at least get an operating system that is more in line with your values.

I'm posting this message using Debian and Lynx. Unless you run Linux (and from the CLI) you are nothing! Oh, I'm starting to sound like one of those CW/Extra elitist...

Sorry

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by K8VF on July 12, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

If you dont belong, you are part of the problem.

You are not voting, not sending letters, and not telling Newington your views.

Just like the 70(or more) million gun owners who ride on the coat tails of the 4 million NRA members.

Pay the dues, get involved.

Protect your hobby, and your future.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by KC5SZU on July 12, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

When I first got my ticket, you could call the ARRL # to check on your call-sign you were issued, while they were checking on my new call, the guys in the back ground on the phone said, got another idiot wanting his call sign. I may not be the smartest guy in the world but I will never give a red cent to an organization that feels that way about new hams or people in general. In my seldom expressed opinion, all they want is your money and I dont like to make a stir on matters. 73s

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by N1RWC on July 12, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

I found it cute that the President of the ARRL "is having trouble logging in and can't post" as stated earlier in this thread. I am a former ARRL Member and will never re-join the ARRL because of several factors that maybe the League should look at.

1) Dues increase was a major factor because in a slow economy, most people are on a budget. That means that they can only spend what the have available and no more. When Dues cost more than what is budgeted, the typical Ham will re-appropriate the money to other things.

2) Don't claim to represent "All Amateur Radio Operators" when you don't. Representing the interest of the hobby is a better claim. When was the last time a league representitive regularly came to a club event or function, or was heard on the local net or repeater and mentioned they were "ARRL Section whatever"?

3) The last time I looked at QST, I only saw articles of any technical use for the hobby. I have to agree with earlier posts that QST has become a catalog of ads for different manufacturers and suppliers. I can read a QST in about 3 minutes to absorb all the technical stuff, about 3 weeks if all I wanted to read was Ads. Funny part is that I immediately flip to page 4, read the article index, then to the technical correspondance, then if any technical articles show up, then throw the issue in the recyclable pile.

4) When was the last time you made contact with W1AW on the air? I commend W1AW for sending bulletins and code practice in the evenings, but that's it lately. During Field Day, I didn't hear W1AW except for the bulletins and ARRL FD Message. Not one QSO, just broadcasting. I think that the Flagship of the hobby should be more active on the air in communicating, not just broadcasting.

5) The day the Repeater Directory dropped the Digital Listings was the end of the Directory. I have had several given to me and gave them away or thrown out because the information inside is nowhere accurate. Several dozen repeaters listed require CTCSS, not listed in the book but on the Coordinator Websites, and some aren't on the air, and haven't for several years. The Directory say's they're accurate and on the air, but talk to the guys whose callsign is on the repeater and you get a different story.

I was talking with a ol'timer W#*** and he made the comment, which is true, the hobby is turning a lot of CB'ers into KB'ers.

Maybe the ARRL will listen and look back into where it started from and why it started, then look at where they want to go, then hopefully figure out that they need to correct themselves if they want to get back to where they want to be.

And to the guys complaining about the CW requirement, that's on the K.I.S.S. Article thread, not this one.

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by K0XM on July 12, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Well, since I got licensed in 1979, I have had my disagreements with the ARRL decisions. The 220 fiasco in the 80's was the biggest one. There wasn't ANY support (or least highly visable support), to keep our band the way it was. Also, there was a major riff in the Kansas/Missouri (KC Metro area) rptr co-ordination back then that some of us feel the ARRL chose sides, and it was a mess. Having said that, am I a member?? YES!!!
All the bad feelings aside, overall they do a good job for the MAJORITY of the hams. Getting the WARC bands at WARC 79 was a good move. I have my feelings on certain issues, but I will continue to be a member. Also, I am one who feels that CW should stay a part of licensing, and I also feel that we should get back to a more technical licensing questions pool. Everything takes time folks, and nothing will change overnite. The 40 mtr change HAS to take place over time. Commercial interests can't just drop the freqs and switch in 24 hrs. We are but a small group affected by this. Will I continue to be a member? Yes. Am I a "CW forever" guy? Not really, as I work both SSB and CW. But then there are other modes available. Also, for the naysayers who say because I have a 2x1 call, I am not looking for out the V/Uhf guys, WRONG!!! I am active on 160 thru 440, (6 is in the future), and a trustee of a rptr, so that flushes that arguement. But crying about all the disagreements here won't do much. GET OUT AND MAKE SOME CHANGES!!! Become active, and if not, support your representative, and talk to them about what you would like to see.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by W5USB on July 12, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

"If you dont belong, you are part of the problem."

Is the problem actually that the ARRL has less than 100% membership? I thought is was more complicated than that.

"You are not voting, not sending letters, and not telling Newington your views."

Certainly I am, Mr. Haynie emailed me yesterday...and I replied to him immediately upon my reading of his. In the email I stated my viewpoint as clearly as I could, and I have to admit, I was very surprised (and impressed) that I heard from him...being a non-member and all.

"Just like the 70(or more) million gun owners who ride on the coat tails of the 4 million NRA members."

Yeah, I own guns...but no "gun clubs" for me. My rights are permanently emblazoned on our Constitution.
Even if that document should fall someday, my original right of self-defense (given to me by my Creator) can NEVER be denied. I loved Charleton Heston's movies and his patriotic attitude...but sending his organisation my dollars to relieve me of the organisationally generated guilt placed on Americans (by the NRA) isn't my cup-o-tea. "Send us your money, or lose your guns" sounds more like a threat, to me.

Art

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by W5USB on July 12, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

"4) When was the last time you made contact with W1AW on the air? I commend W1AW for sending bulletins and code practice in the evenings, but that's it lately. During Field Day, I didn't hear W1AW except for the bulletins and ARRL FD Message. Not one QSO, just broadcasting. I think that the Flagship of the hobby should be more active on the air in communicating, not just broadcasting."

Actually, they are contesting on 14,154 KHz right this minute (8:39am CT, Sat. July 12). They appear to be "portable" from Pennsylvania, this weekend only.

Art

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by K3UD on July 12, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Ok, I just have to ask....... What is a KBer?

73
George
K3UD

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by AB8IG on July 12, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Any enterprise, profit or non-profit, must provide value for their price if they expect to succeed. If the cost of ARRL membership exceeds the perceived benefits derived therefrom, the organization will lose 'customers'.

If the ARRL wants to expand its subscriber base it must offer a service worth the price of membership. If it does not, it will be relegated to the dustbin of history.

Jim

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by WB5UAG on July 12, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

OK, I finally waded through all the flames and stuff.
Early in this thread I wanted to just shout, "Ham Radio is for EVERYBODY!" Later in the posting someone basically said that. The ARRL with all its good points and bad is still the only voice we have. I say "we". Those of us who enjoy ragchewing, or SSTV, or RTTY, or EME or those who are so busy with life that ham radio is a very small part of it.

I was exposed to ham radio in high school. I did not get my first ticket until 10 years later. I have been a ham now for 28 years. I have operated many of the modes we have today. I still like to ragchew and chase a little DX. I'm not in to contesting exept for field day, which I love but I always try to remember ham radio is for everybody. Field day may not be your thing or SSTV or ragchewing but there is something here for everyone.

I used to read Wayne Green when he would league bash. I read him when he said many, many silly things. Sometimes I miss his silliness. He encouraged hams to quit bitching about rig prices and get a second job using the skills of electronics we have learned and make enough money for a new rig. I did that. I worked two jobs to get out of debt and get on with my life and with ham radio. The one thing that I noticed, Wayne is a life member. I renewed my ARRL membership. I kept reneewing it and finally decided it was time to be a life member. It is money I have never regretted spending.

I met Jim Haynie in April. I walked up to a group of hams at an electronics convention. I wondered who would I meet. In the group was Jim Haynie. I listened, you learn to listen with ham radio, I applied it to conversation too. Jim likes to hunt, he likes to tinker, he likes to help his neighbor. I learned all this while listening to a conversation about living and working in the electronics industry. Jim listens too.
Let him know what you expect.

Don't just sit back and whine that you are loosing your frequencies. If you sit back and whine long enough you will loose your frequencies.

Decide whether you are going to be a whiner with no one to listen to you or that you are going to be a part of an organization that has leadership and you can be an influence on that leadership. Remember the part about listening. Listen to what you are saying. We are only a few ears that hear, but we are just a group of hams who are willing to talk and listen to what other hams are saying.

To those who need to get a grip on where we are going today, read QST. If you don't like the direction, email, pick up the phone, let someone from your section manager on up know what it is and communicate.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by K1CJS on July 12, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

I just read through some of the comments posted here and have the following answers to a couple of them:

Bob, N2BR, as far as the ECOM grants, steps have been taken to insure completion of the course. The ARRL doesn't want to send out the course materials then have the registrants just walk away. So, in their wisdom (not being sarcastic at all) they ask you to pay the fees, and when you complete the course the fee is refunded to you. This insures the grant money is used for the course instead of for giving books and materials away. I THINK SOMEONE REALLY THOUGHT THIS ONE THROUGH AND THE ARRL IS TO BE COMMENDED FOR RUNNING THE ECOM COURSES THIS WAY--TO TRY TO SAVE MONEY AND THE COURSES FOR THOSE THAT ARE SERIOUS ABOUT TAKING THEM. Oh, not all the ECOM courses are set up this way, but the ones that are clearly state "The fee will be refunded upon completion of the course."
______________________

KC5SZU, Are you willing to tar the entire organization with the same brush for the unthinking, uncaring words of one individual? I know the remark really got you mad, It would get me mad too! But just because you overheard one person say something like that doesn't mean the whole organization is like that one person. I'll bet that if you called back and related your experience to someone else (management) you'd probably be surprized at the apology you'd get. Believe it or not, there are some really nice, helpful people in Newington.
______________________

N1RWC, The repeater directory put out by the ARRL has information that goes through many different individual steps to get into the directory. Alright, the digital listings going to a website dissapointed a lot of people, but the reasoning behind the decision is and was valid. Those listings changed so often that by the time the directory was printed many of the listings had changed in one way or another. It was thought that by using a website the listings could be kept much more current AND VALID. The second aim, to make the directory lighter and handier (read as 'pocket size') just didn't turn out too well.

The information in the other part has to first be submitted by the trustee (or other responcible party) of the repeater. In turn the information submitted is what goes into the directory. If the trustee doesn't include certain information such as the pl tone setting, it just doesn't get published.

From there the info goes to the area co-ordinators where it is assembled and grouped according to states or other areas as needed by the publishers. These people can't check every bit of info or every listing to be sure it's right--is isn't humanly possible.

After the area co-ordinators, the info goes to the ARRL who assembles it and then sends it to the publishers. So, if some information is missing or just plain wrong, the person to blame is the trustee of the machine who originally submitted the information. (Who, BTW may not have submitted it for that year). Don't blame the ARRL for that--as I said it's just not possible for them to check every listing.
______________________

And so, there was my next installment of two cents!

73, Chris K1CJS

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by NB3O on July 12, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

N1GNV has it correct in his reply stating "when a Director (or Jim Haynie) says "jump", there's a whole lotta jumpin' goin' on in Newington".
Unfortunately for the Commonwealth of Virginia, President Haynie and the Executive Committee "jumped" to dismantle one of the finest ECOM organizations in our state without full knowledge of the facts. Now we are stuck with two fragmented groups, apathy and a sizable drop in ECOM participation for both organizations, no cooperation between them, and a lot of hate mail back and forth. This certainly has not helped the cause to boost ARRL membership or improve League credibility. Yes, everyone makes mistakes and as members, we do not always agree with the ARRL (QCWA, NRA, etc, etc). However, despite the roar of protest that came from Virginia Section members after this decision, nothing has been done to date by Headquarters to improve the situation. It has only festered into a major eyesore for our served agencies to gape at (read: another black eye for amateur radio). Past ARRL leaders like Vic Clark W4KFC or John Kanode N4MM would have been more diligent researching the problem before "jumping". While they might have made some of the same mistakes or unpopular decisions, it is my strong belief that Mr. Haynie's predecessors were more in tune with the membership at large and less likely to "jump" to the tune of a vocal minority of malcontents. This situation is not isolated to our Virginia Section either. Several other ECOM groups in other states have parted ways from the League to form their own organizations in an effort to set higher standards and FREE ECOM training. One has only to do a few web searches to find the vast amount of amateur radio ECOM training material, most designed to fit the specific needs of our served agencies, and not a 40 dollar "feel-good" class.
Let's face it, the League is the only game in town. But this does not mean we have to put up with milk-toast division directors who "jump" recklessly when spooked. As a life member, I'll be sure to excersise my vote to change the current leadership, starting at the grass-roots level. The real title of this thread should be "The ARRL Needs New Leadership". Keep your membership current and make your vote count this fall to restore League integrity. The future of amateur radio depends on it.

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by W4VR on July 12, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

True...QST magazine is loaded with old news. I get the latest news from their very excellent and informative web site. Therefore, I don't read my QST, except for the table of contents..and if nothing looks interesting I usually toss it. But, I don't mind contributing money to ARRL in the form of subscription dues to do my share in supporting the league in its efforts to protect amateur radio spectrum at the local and international levels....no one else will do this for us.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by W7DAH on July 12, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Good grief. Do these rants and flame wars actually accomplish anything other than reducing the readship here? Let's see now, the most prolific expressions seem to originate from the folks who have a whine about the IRS (which Militia chapter you belong to again?), or a need to express their off-topic homophobia; some wanna project their personal fear that CW has somehow been stamped out (hey, ya wanna do sumptin' positive for the CW mode, go pound some brass). Sheez, makes ya wonder if they have ever once spent the equivalent time and energy expressing those concerns directly to the league or to their elected representation, their priest/rabbi or their shrink maybe (reads: go tell someone who gives a darn) coz most of it sounds like your personal problems, and has nuttin' to do with the exchange of ideas on being organized to support the hobby in whatever way is most effective.

73 & 88,
Don - W7DAH
P.S. Save those Dixie Cups, ya never know when yer South will rise again! ;-)

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by RobertKoernerExAE7G on July 12, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

So, all of you who don’t financially support The League’s efforts to fight commercial interests taking our spectrum, tell us about the organization(s) protecting and promoting ham radio you do financially support, especially the organization(s) that NEVER did ANYTHING you didn’t like.

Tell us about what these organizations have done about BPL similar to this:

“ARRL is unwilling to have the Amateur Service gored with the double-edged sword of an incompatible service that will at once (1) cause widespread interference, and (2) preclude any future changes in the amateur HF allocations," the ARRL said. The League said that based on "diligent and exhaustive research," it's concluded that BPL must avoid any and all amateur MF, HF and VHF allocations without exception.”

Tell us what they did at the recent international meeting to get BC stations out of 7Mcs?

Have they been around long enough to have helped obtain the "New Bands" (WARC)? What did they do to help get the "New Bands"?

I’m interested in finding out what other organization(s) there are which have PACs for ham radio.

Bob

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by KA0MR on July 12, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Reading all of the negative post towards the only viable voice hams will ever have reminds me of the workers in a right-to-work enviorment such as Kansas and The Boeing Company constantly refusing to contribute with Union Dues because the Union does absolutely nothing for "them".

But when the company decides an employee need terminated for what-ever-reason at hand there they are asking a Union Steward for all his energy to protect them under the Collective Bargaining Act and after the Union has demonstrated that the termination is unwarranted and unfair under the labor contract the workers job is protected and his family avoids the financial problems the employer attempted to unfairly create for them that same employee show his gratitude by bad-mouthing organized labor just like the posters we are talking about here. Instead of being grateful for having and organization that is willing to cover as many bases as they can to preserve our interest we refuse to financially support it. This kind of representation cannot be accomplished without financial support. Why do we have no problem sending our money to Phillip-Morris,Coors Brewery. How many losing Lottery tickets have we thrown away in the last 5 years fellas and your worried about $50.00 a year membership. Give us a break.I have contributed to ARRL since 1970 and don't regret a single dollar of it.
Bob KAØMR

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by W5USB on July 12, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

"So, all of you who don’t financially support The League’s efforts to fight commercial interests taking our spectrum, tell us about the organization(s) protecting and promoting ham radio you do financially support, especially the organization(s) that NEVER did ANYTHING you didn’t like."

I'm not sure if this is anyone's business but my own.
_______________________________________________________

"Tell us about what these organizations have done about BPL similar to this:

“ARRL is unwilling to have the Amateur Service gored with the double-edged sword of an incompatible service that will at once (1) cause widespread interference, and (2) preclude any future changes in the amateur HF allocations," the ARRL said. The League said that based on "diligent and exhaustive research," it's concluded that BPL must avoid any and all amateur MF, HF and VHF allocations without exception.”"

I think BPL is merely a fad that will pass. The whole concept of bargain internet linkage through powerlines is just a bandaid and will fade away soon after it appears. Don't forget that nearly 60% of the fibre optic lines installed during the "boom" are yet to be utilized. Someone, somewhere will put this to good use, freeing the aging power grid to do what it aimed to do best, provide power.
_______________________________________________________

"Tell us what they did at the recent international meeting to get BC stations out of 7Mcs?"

I don't have a problem with BC's on 40m. If they are there broadcasting at a particular time, I move elsewhere. It is a shared band, remember? Why should WE have more clout than THEY? They are the pros, and we are the amateurs, be thankful we get shared access.
_______________________________________________________

"Have they been around long enough to have helped obtain the "New Bands" (WARC)? What did they do to help get the "New Bands"?"

Never used the "New Bands", heck I don't even use the old ones. I am of the belief that we, as a group, should work to protect what wehave, rather than always trying to "get more". More space means more hams which means more money...and this, ladies and gentlemen, is what this discussion seems to be centering upon. IMO
_______________________________________________________

"I’m interested in finding out what other organization(s) there are which have PACs for ham radio."

Lobbies for Hobbies? I just have to keep telling myself, this is only a hobby...this is only a hobby. Our Government seems financially burdened enough currently and having more PAC's demanding more of the FCC's attention (umm, from a Hobby Lobby) seems a little selfish. You know...gimme gimme gimme. Protect what we have..and try to actually "self-police" these bands we have been entrusted with. This means reducing the sometimes petty arguments that must come before the agency, day after day after day, from those who promised to "handle" it themselves.
_______________________________________________________

The sky isn't falling yet. No reason to don the armour, relax, get a good perspective on the situation. Join or don't join...it's everyones individual choice. A choice that shouldn't be "coerced" or be the product of "bandspace losing" scare tactics...similar to those employed by the NRA.

Have fun in radio, peoples. After all this is supposed to be fun, remember? The EM spectrum isn't a result of legislation, or litigation. It's God's gift to those who know how to use it. Essentially the FCC has little rights in this area, we only "play along" because we choose to.

C'mon, if the FCC said tomorrow that all amateur communcations are now banned permanently, what would really happen? Nothing, thats what. Well maybe chaos would happen, but the radio waves will still be "flyin'".

Art

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by KB1GYQ on July 12, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Look guys and gals, ANYONE can file a comment with the FCC. Stop sitting on your collective asses and speak out; don't rely on the ARRL to do your job!

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by WB5HZE on July 12, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Well, everyone has an opinion and the right to express it.

You, the reader, have the unpleasant task of determining which of those opinions are valid and which are not. That's not always easy, especially if you are not familiar with the subject matter.

Your only defense is to educate yourself on the topic at hand and then form your own opinions. I suggest that it would be best to obtain material towards that education outside of forums such as this- take what you see here with a BIG pinch of salt.

I still find myself astounded by the ability of the human mind to adopt & propagate nonsense as if it were essential truth . . . except in the case of politicians, of course, where such behavior is considered normal and therefore is expected . . .

Ron WB5HZE

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by N6AJR on July 12, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Yes Virginia, there is a santa Clause. All you folks have opinions, just like we all have an anal orifice. Dosent make one better than the other. Its an opinion.

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by KS1F on July 12, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

I have been a member of the ARRL for most of the 38 years I've been an Ham, and a life member since 1981. I have not always agreed with League on every topic, but I can honestly say that anytime I have contacted anyone at HQ or the field organization with a question or concern I have ALWAYS been responded to in a polite and professional manner even though I may not have agreed with them.

I have gotten to know some HQ staffers over the years and my feelings usually are they weren't doing the job for the big bucks (or lack of...) but because they loved the hobby and what the ARRL represents.

My interest in Ham Radio has come and gone several times over the years as I worked on my career, but being a life member and always receiving QST has kept me in touch with the hobby and the technical changes that have evolved. The negative attitude bunch and the naysayers would never have kept my interest and enthusiasm like the ARRL has.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by N2WSO on July 12, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

To the Ham that issued the challenge to list 10 accomplishments the ARRL did in the last 50 years.

We still have our frequencies, don't we?

If it wasn't for the ARRL, I predict those frequencies would have been chopped up and given to commercial interests years ago. Yes, we lost a few, but without the ARRL, I doubt we would have anything left by now.

No matter what you think of the ARRL, no one else is signing up for the job of keeping Ham Radio alive.

73, Bob
N2WSO

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by K1MKF on July 12, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Interesting point made by the author. If you don't agree with a dues increase or if you have another "petty" difference with the ARRL don't respond by not renewing. Well, that's the only way I know of that catches someones attention.

I get the exact opposite reaction from the statistics. It shows me that at this time, either because of the economy, the health of Amateur Radio or maybe even the attitude of the ARRL, the the membership does not want a dues increase. The ARRL should react to that by cutting expenses or even membership benefits to balance the books instead of raising dues.

My wallet is not a bottomless pit.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by K1MKF on July 12, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Also, How much spectrum do we need? I doubt we would loose HF without the ARRL. We would most likely keep all or most of 6m, 2m and 70 cm, too. Now those few on the other UHF and microwave bands might be out of luck. But, how can we justify keeping all those frequencies for a hand full of Hams on a couple weekends a year?

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by K9DS on July 12, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

I strongly disagree that we should keep morse code as a licensing requirement.

I find it amusing that one one hand someone says the ARRL is living back 40 years in the past, and the other complain they didn't lobby for code requirements on licensing.

Don't get me wrong, I am an avid CW fan, just give us the allocations of frequency so we can practice and play with the modes we all enjoy, be they different than code requirements.

Morse code is no longer even tied to any late technology industry.

We all need to change with the times.

Why not make TNC/Digital Radio contact/technical demonstration as part of the licensing requirements.

How about getting a CCNA from Cisco ?

I would guess that hams think they are "technical" and only a very small percentage would be able to pass a modern certification in todays digital age.

i.e. CCNA, CCIE, MSCSE

Additionaly, if we are to keep our frequency allocations, we need a lobbyst in Washgington.

Are any of you voluntering for that assignment?

I doubt it, Ham Radio today is more about complaining that being constructive. With the exception of those involved in education & search/rescue operations.

Next time your about to complain on the air or on one of these boards, ask your self what you have done to contribute a positive image of this hobby in the last 5 years....?

73 de K9DS

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by N9WQ on July 12, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

what really yanks my crank is that as tax payers and lets see what that consists of... income tax,sales tax, service tax,fuel tax,property tax.... well you get the picture..dont you think as the people of this great land .. and make no mistake contrarey to what others may have posted we as amateurs on an international level STILL need to exsist as can be seen by the massive post's about ARES/RACES personal that is consumed from the amateur community to help with the daily events in our world today such as tornados, floods,earthquakes,and yes terrorists.now with that being said its a wonder that we should have to have a ARRL to watch our spectrum.I thought that back in 1934 some president signed into eternal law that we as amateur's and our spectrum would always exsist .Well how come now after all this time we find ourselves trying to keep something that the fcc doesnt even have the legal right to give away... I guess I just dont understand?? I have been a member of the ARRL for the past 8 years and now find myself not renewing my membership because I can get an AES catalog for free! well mabie someone out there is doing the math on this membership fee thing and can see the massaive amounts of money that are being crammed into the ARRL not even taking into account the income manufactured by the ad's and the so called NEW RADIO RESEARCH where they tell you how great a "new" product is and then you turn the page and theres the ad the company paid a great sum to have in the magazine... I mean c'mon have you ever seen a bad write up about a "new" radio thats advertised in the same issue????.. well all I can say is that its pretty crapy that we should have to worry about someone like the (FCC) taking away the tennie wennie little bit of spectrum that the amateur radio service consumes is beyond ones rational way of thinking and then take into consideration that we are paying the bastards to do it! Mabie if we as amateurs would get up off are duffs (me included) and get ahold of our congressmen and his people and there people and so on we wouldnt need the arrl at all :-) WOW THAT FELT GOOD!!!! N9WQ Dave :-)

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by K1CJS on July 12, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

My friend, the only eternal things in this world are death and taxes. There is no "eternal law" that the amateur bands would always exist--laws are being overturned everyday--even laws that were meant to last forever.

As long as the league fights for amateur radio in Washington and is the voive of amateur radio, they deserve the support of the ham community.

So, if you won't pay dues to be a member, support them by not bashing them here--or anywhere else for that matter. There is nothing or nobody who is perfect by any standards. Even though the league does things that some don't like, in the long run they ARE trying to preserve amateur radio and the spectrum.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by KD7KOY on July 12, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

I don't mean to sound 'disenchanted'..but I see a whole lot of fighting in ham radio.
I listen to 40 and 75 meters and hear rants, insults..
Go to the boards and hear rants..
Most of us are spending a whole lot of money to hear this.
Conversations are either about fights or someone calling CQ just to get a 5-9 and tell me what kind of radio they are on and then they are off..
The same people, on the same freqencies, talking about the same drivel every night, guarding 'their' frequecnies like it were gold.
Don't get me wrong, I like radio. But I'm thinking with the investment as opposed to what I'm hearing I'm beginning to wonder what are we fighting for?

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

Anonymous post on July 12, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

To above poster:

What you describe IS ham radio, at least for the last 35 years I have heard it.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by N2MWE on July 12, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

To the amateur that posted about the ARRL running an ad for gays...the ARRL was sued a number of years ago for discriminatory practices against a gay/lesbian amateur group called LAMBDA.
I'm not liberal, and I'm not gay, but the fact that your thinking that homosexuality is a mental illness does not belong here on this board.

73 de Kieran

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by K3GI on July 12, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Amen!

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by K4JRB on July 12, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

I agree and the ARRL has added two people to help in this task. Mary Hobart is the Chief Development Officer and K7BV is the Sales and Marketing Manager. Mary coordinates the funds for the projects the ARRL runs and K7BV brings real sales background to overcome the order taking the ARRL has been known for in the past. President W5JBP is a dynamic leader who gets out to represent the ARRL to the FCC, Congress, and groups such as the NAB (Broadcasters).

The ARRL is the only voice that counts with the FCC and now Congress in the United States. The ARRL has pushed legislation to save the ham bands from grabs that happened to 220Mhz and they get in front of the FCC on issues such as the BPL (they filed a 120 page response). Recently the ARRL and their ARES emergency organization has been named by both the Red Cross and Homeland Security as the primary amateur radio support group.

The ARRL is the anchor for the IARU, the world wide group of national amateur Radio Clubs. The ARRL and IARU worked long and hard to get a world wide band on 40 meters at the recent WRC. Through the leadership of the ARRL, the IARU has become a factor in world radio matters.

So if you care about Amateur Radio you should be a League member (better yet a Life member). Once inside the ARRL you can vote for elected officials (SM, Director, Vice Director). The HQ gang listen closely to the Directors and the President...its not the old
gang of years ago. The ARRL has grown up. Join and support our hobby and speak out if you don't like what is happening!!
73 Dave K4JRB

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by N7IOH on July 12, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

I let my menbership expire about 18 months ago. I really like the QST magazine and believe in the ARRL. I have been having a tuff time these last few years financially. I have cut just about all the expenses I can trying to stay afloat. My real gripe is that with all and I do mean all the advertisements in QST they should be able to give you the QST magazine for free. I receive Consumer Reports and there is no advertisements in this magazine and I pay $26 for a year, that's about $2.17 a month. If you were to remove all the advertisement from QST it would be about the same size as Consumer Reports. Even when I was not in a financial bind, it would always rub me the wrong way knowing that the ARRL is making a huge profit off it's members. I think that the ARRL should use the money it gets from the advertisers to cover their expenses. I don't mind paying for membership, just the amount of membership seems to have gotten out of hand. Ham radio is expensive enough without the over priced membership dues. Like I said, I like the ARRL and enjoy QST but just can't afford it any longer. I know I will take some flack for this, but maybe, just maybe, the ARRL will get the price of membership down to a more reasonable amount.

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by AE6IP on July 13, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

This hobby is stuck in the past. If it stays there, no League is going to keep it alive.

I'm an ARRL member, and I'm kinda embarrased by how behind-the-times the ARRL publications and web site are. But I'm even more embarrased by the mythos that simply won't die.

If we want to keep the bands, then *we*, all of us, have to be active in public hearings, at every level. But more than that, it's time to reinvent the hobby and find a plausible use for those bands, or at least be honest with ourselves and everyone else that we're just hobbiests.

The trick is to realize that the old 'innovation' paths are closed because they're too expensive now or simply not needed any more. It's time to find areas where we *can* innovate and that means moving on from trying to be hardware designers and third tier emergency communicators and find some new ground.

Does this mean the old modes should go away? Of course not. Those who find a mode fun should be able to continue to use it.

Does this mean that we should give up all tinkering? Of course not. But it does mean we should realize that we're tinkering for our own pleasure and not to advance the state of the telecommunications art.

Does this mean that those who are involved in EMCOM should give it up? Of course not. But it does mean that they should understand that they're role is providing third tier support to professionals who keep systems up 24x7x365. Maybe they should even realize that they'd be more helpful if they took CERT or Red Cross training and actually got involved in the meat of disaster services.

Does this mean that the hobby can't be fun anymore? Absolutely not. If it's not fun, it'll die no matter what you try to do to it.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by ROOT_ADMIN on July 13, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

If this is a sample of members and non-members, I am going to have to say that the ARRL does not need more members.

What a bunch of whiners, crybabies, social degenerates, trolls, and excuse makers we have here.

Those that are proud members, keep the faith, those that are not, well just keep the excuses for not joining coming, they may keep you all warm and fuzzy.

If holding a ham ticket is important enough to have studied and taken a test, then there is no reason why you should not be a member, if the reason you have a ham ticket is because it cost money to have a GMRS license and a ham license is free, well by all means, the ARRL is not very important.

Flame away

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by N3DRK on July 13, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

John Pawlicki says:
If you ever considered becoming a member, do so. Even if you are not a ham (or not yet a ham), join. If you have let it lapse, renew. QST alone is worth the membership fees. I like the changes they made removing the lists of contest participants. They do seem to have replaced these with great material that I find much more appropriate.

My $0.02

John Pawlicki, K8AG

////////////////////////////////////////////////////

Great Materials? Where in QST? I have searched every issue since then and just cannot seem to find it.

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by KT4VW on July 13, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

There’s a reason that the ARRL membership is going down and will continue to decline. People are angry. Maybe they should find out why??? 10-4 good buddy??

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by AJ9C on July 13, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Interesting......lets all try and be tolerant of each other. That said on to the ARRL. Im not sure what the final accepted salries may be but the listed ranges when a job is advertise do not suggest to me that there are too many employees getting rich in Newington. I know of a couple of people who have taken positions recently and they are doing it for the love of the hobby not the money or stock options they might receive.

I would have to disagree that the ARRL is "extra" oriented. Over the time I've been licensed and a member I have seen the content of QST evolve. It seems that vhf/uhf is accentuated more now along with basic information for operating.

ARRL membership is worthwhile for no other reason that they do lobby in Washington and have assisted locally in antenna disputes. You may disagree over the effectiveness of their efforts but I don't see any other groups stepping into the role of lobbyist or advocate. Throw in the awards administration/magazine and the outgoing qsl bureau and membership seems like a good value to me.

Ive not always agreed with what the ARRL has changed (such as the contest coverage chnges) but the changes usually are for the better if you give them a chance. Embrace the future instead of fearing it.

enough said have fun and see you on the bands.

Mike/aj9c

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by KE0SM on July 13, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

To compare a very vertical market niche publication such as QST to one put out by an organization with huge membership and very broad appeal such as Consumers Union is not really fair.

Consumer Reports has a very good reason for not carrying advertising. Their very existence is largely based on the perception that they have no obligations to the manufacturers of the products they review. Their publication is 100% reviews of products.

The equipment reviews in QST are a valuable but fairly insignificant part of the magazine content. QST reviews are also conducted in such a professional manner that I doubt any reasonable ham believes they are affected by advertising or lack thereof by the manufacturer.

Over a year ago Consumers Union began charging a hefty fee for access to their web site. Even subscribers to the paper version received only about a $5 discount off the substantial cost, effectively making subscribers to the magazine pay twice for the same information if they wanted to be able to do an electronic search. I believe in protest. I cancelled my subscription to CR when Consumers Union did not reply to my repeated letters objecting to their price structure, which I felt was particularly inappropriate for an organization which purported to represent consumers.

The very valuable ARRL web site is free to members. Most ARRL services are. I think it takes a bit of nerve for some to complain that the web site is members-only.

I am a life member of ARRL and I enjoy the ads in QST. I am glad that ARRL makes money off of them. I think ARRL membership is a great value.

The cheapskates can kid themselves all they want, but very few hams could not tuck away a dollar a week to pay for ARRL membership. There will even be money left over to buy some lottery tickets.

The ARRL Needs More Members!

Anonymous post on July 13, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

What I really like about this site are the people who preach that anyone who disagrees with them should shut up. I love it. This site's content mirrors a trend in society to chastise anyone who disagrees with the political correctness of a supposed majority. The design of the ARRL's structure is very much like the government. A representitive based organization always tells complainers to jump on board and support the current regime because criticism is destructive. But if one follows the little dictators that always use the "should" word, one could never complain. The government uses the tactic that if you don't like something, you should support the government now but vote as desired later. But all anyone hears later are the same old lies to get politicians elected and when elected they do whatever they want just like before and the cycle continues.

The ARRL is a joke. The FCC is a joke. The ARRL takes all the credit for everything good as if it made it all happen, and it blames someone else when things don't go well, just like all politicians. And it works.

There is no doubt in my mind that good things happen in spite of the ARRL not because of their useless and ineffective nonesense.

I won't give the ARRL a dime until they change into an organization that I like, and I could care less if anyone tells me I "should" do something else. I really laugh at all the "should people". They really seem to think I am really going to do something because they tell met to. Idiots!

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by KB1IUB on July 13, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

:4) When was the last time you made contact with W1AW
:on the air? I commend W1AW for sending bulletins and
:code practice in the evenings, but that's it lately.
:During Field Day, I didn't hear W1AW except for the
:bulletins.

Well, I heard them! I had attempted to make
contact, but they did not hear us on our G5RV.
The G5RV on 75 Meters was OUR Fault! LOL

bill

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by K0PD on July 13, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

I am one of those ham's who dropped their ARRL membership after they raised their subcription.Not that i could not afford it but i felt i was not getting my money's worth to begin with and decided i was done contributing or as the old saying goes " why throw good money after bad".If they had only raised it $1.00 i might still be recieving it but now we'll never know.One ham said if you think qST is bad try Wayne Green's Mag 73' well guess what i now subcribe to it and for a third of the cost find the Magazine not only controversial but fun to read.As for Lambda and rainbo advertising i had no problem with that as all people and group's have a right to be heard but not forced upon us.AS for the Gay people who along with the conservative writer's in this forum i say TAKE IT SOME WHERE ELSE.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by K0XXX on July 13, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

WA8KJP - "I won't give the ARRL a dime until they change it to an organization that I like, and I could care less if anyone tells me I "should" do something else. I really laugh at all the "should people". They really seem to think I am really going to do something because they tell met to. Idiots!"

So it sounds like what you are saying is that the ARRL "should" change to be exactly what YOU want it to be...

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

Anonymous post on July 13, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

You got it k0xxx, its my money and I choose who and when to give it to.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

Anonymous post on July 13, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

k0xxx,

You are another example of a moron here on eHam. The ARRL doesn't have to do anything. It or anybody else are going to do what they want in the end. If the ARRL conducts itself in a way that I think merits financial support, I may support them. But I will never tell them or anybody else they "should" do something because they won't anyway. They will do what they want but I will also do what I want. And for now, they don't get a dime. Game over!

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by K0XXX on July 13, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Now, now, Richard, let's try to express oueselves without the name calling.

Yes, I support the ARRL and Amateur Radio. I am a Life Member of the League, a VE and an ARES EC. I believe in putting my time and my money into the things I believe in. Do these things make me a moron? No. Trying to engage you in an intelligent conversation? Maybe.

Mark, KØXXX
ARRL Life Member

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by KE6PKJ on July 13, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

K0XXX said,

"So it sounds like what you are saying is that the ARRL "should" change to be exactly what YOU want it to be... "

K0XXX, what I understood the sentiments posted by WA8KJP's and other like minded people here, was that they would like the ARRL to change to meet their needs. Until that happens they choose to vote with their pocket books. That seems pretty reasonable, rational and democratic. That's how change is effected. We do it all the time from political parties to shopping decisions. I personally have no beef with the ARRL but I can appreciate and entertain ideas from those who do.

Please though, no name calling Folks.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by K1CJS on July 13, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Everybody who thinks the people in Newington are getting rich sitting in their offices make me want to laugh. Everybody who thinks it costs nothing to have Washington offices, (although a small one, there IS one) look at your mortgage payment, or your rental expenses-whichever! Everybody who thinks the ARRL does nothing constructive and takes credit for everything good that happens to us and our bands, get a life!

If you took time to look at how the higher ups in Newington spend their time, you'd find they spend their time traveling and supporting ham radio, not sitting down in their offices. I don't know how much the Washington offices actually cost to maintain, but bet its more than the average man earns, and the people who work out of there are most always on the go, back and forth between the FCC and other federal offices and their offices.

And finally, if you think the ARRL takes credit for everything good that happens to Amateur radio whether or not they spearheaded or even supported it, just do research, look at public records and the ARRL records. True, there may be some backpedaling sometimes, but the successes AND THE FAILURES of the ARRL are in the public record for all to see.

The ARRL is a larger, more visible organization than most others ham organizations, and they strive to represent a broader portion of the hams in this country. It seems that they take way too much more bashing than the other organizations do--and some of that is because of the past leadership of the ARRL. In other words, the present leadership is damned if they do and they're damned if they don't.

The least we should do as hams is look at the present leadership of the ARRL and what THEY have tried to do, one way or another--don't hold them responcible for the actions of the past administrations. And if you won't support them financially, support ham radio by not bashing the ARRL in public.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by K0XXX on July 13, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

KE6PKJ - I have no problem at all with WA8KJP, or anyone else for that matter, wanting the ARRL to change to fit their needs. If we all thought that the ARRL didn't fit our needs, or wasn't responsive to them, it (the League) wouldn't exist. I was trying to point out, and not doing too good of a job of it, the double standard of his "no one should tell anyone else what to do" arguement. Thanks for the constructive comment.

WA8KJP - if you really feel that you must continue the flame, let's move it from this forum and just e-mail me direct. I'm sure it would be most entertaining.

Mark, KØXXX
k0xxx@arrl.net

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

Anonymous post on July 13, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

k0xxx,

if you don't want to be 'flamed' (your words), you need to stop directing your rants to a specific person. Because if you do, you will get it right back. And by the way, we are not on a first name basis.

The "@arrl" in your email address says it all. Also, tell your comrades at the league that they aren't going to get any support by default. They need to earn it.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by KE0SM on July 13, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

"Until that happens they choose to vote with their pocket books. That seems pretty reasonable, rational and democratic. That's how change is effected. We do it all the time from political parties to shopping decisions."

A Boycott is somewhat effective against commercial entities but used only because there is no alternative.

Refusing to participate is definately not the best way to effect change in a democracy, voting is.

Unfortunately, actually trying to change anything requires time/effort/resources, while anyone with an internet connection can whine here far too easily.

Yes yes, I know, you're protesting. It's just a coincidence that your position is also the one that is effortless and free. Uh huh, ok, whatever.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by KE6PKJ on July 13, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

KE0SM, I would tend to give the benefit of doubt to WA8KJP. I'm assuming he's been a ham and league member for a very long time. Perhaps he's spent a lifetime voting, lobbying and battling for change. Maybe his boycotting and venting here is just the prescription for him.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

Anonymous post on July 13, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

The logic of some people amazes me. Not wanting to send money to an organization considered to be ineffective is not boycotting. Its called not wasting your money. I suppose people in the former Soviet Union who did not want to support the only party, Communist, were unfairly boycotting their government according to eHam thinking.

People get paid in this world for results not effort. The ARRL will not get money from people like me until they produce, not just expend energy. An idiot can expend energy, smart people who work smart get results and then get the credit. That is how it works.

Finally, if someone happens to have a part 97 license, they didn't get an obligation to support anybody along with it. I don't owe the ARRL or anybody else anything. Neither does anybody else.

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by KB9OJS on July 13, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

All that I can say is that I hope the ARRL does more to fight the (possible?) removal of the International Morse Code Requirement. I am a VE and have been for the past two years and would really hate to see it go. I think the 4 teir system now is easy enough, they could only make it easier by charging a fee every year to have a license (no test, just a fee). Even though CW is not my favorite mode(SSB is),I feel that it is very important that those who want to be on HF learn it and that the ARRL does more to make sure the CW requiremnet stays.

As for the Gay/Lesbian Ad's in QST, who cares? They paid the money to the ARRL to put the Ad in the publication. I am a straight white male and if club catering to sexual orientation wants to put an Ad in there, more power to them. They have to advertise somehow.

Two cents from just one man of many,
John Bunyan, KB9OJS Amateur Extra Class

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by K1CJS on July 13, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

I'll just qualify my last post a bit more: If you won't support them (the ARRL) financially, support HAM RADIO by not bashing the ARRL (part of ham radio whether is liked or not) in public.

Put another way, Bashing the ARRL is bashing ham radio, because whether you like it or not, when you say ARRL, most people automatically think of ham radio.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by W5USB on July 13, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Alright, we are only to post publically with "positive" commentary about the ARRL, and limit all negative comments to a more private forum, such as email? This doesn't make much sense. If a prospective ham were to read such a forum, he/she would think that the organisation could do no wrong (from all the positive comments). I think each person should keep their views public, regardless of the nature of the post.

Art Granda W5USB

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by AE4TR on July 13, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

"Now that your qth is disinfected from all things touched by the ARRL (magazines, awards, qsl cards, license), you can start enjoying the hobby all over."

You forgot to mention, if you shred your license, You will have to get a new one, before you can start enjoying the hobby all over. Good Luck!!!

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by K1CJS on July 13, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

W5USB: Pardon, but I did say "support HAM RADIO by not bashing the ARRL in public". and "When you say ARRL, most people think of ham radio." As this is a discussion board for the most part by and for hams--a more private forum than not, I don't consider this discussion to be public--it is between ham radio operators.

I also said the successes AND THE FAILURES of the ARRL were in public record for all to see. However, I apologise for any unclearness on my part concerning the statements I made. I do sometimes have have a small problem expressing myself.

73, Chris J. Smith, K1CJS

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by N8ZUX on July 13, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Lotta response people I'll not get on a soapbox.

One ) If I was making more money I would join the ARRL .

Only I have my other priorities such as day to day expenses, etc.

Two ) I passed my Code and have a General License, I enjoy the challenge, after all this is what Amateur Radio is all about, going for the challenge and enjoy the rewards, sure I am Studying the Extra book.

Three ) I remember when the Commercial Radiotelephone Licenses were 1st., 2nd., 3rd. and the endorsements and the restricted permit.

I held a Thrid with element 9 Broadcast Endorsement, again challenge with a reward after that FCC reissued a restricted to me ( LIFETIME ) after the 1974 paperwork reduction act and congress made the FCC to be on the carpet every 2 to 3 years to see if they been naughty or nice or whatever congress had them report in.

as to the 11 Meter fear well we can be elmers and attempt to these newbies, be better radio operators, I actually watched or monitored what goes on, thats the other 1/2 of the hobby. By the way, on a Red Cross net I offered input critiques to improve operator proceedures which created a class on Net message handling, also there I fed back again. results were a sugguestion to take a position in my new Home county but I wish that I had the money to be able to get back in action, but I am under liberty not to post pubically that area. I took a resignaton for now and weather I will get back in, I will leave that as a Subject to clause. again sealed statement under liberty not to publically disclose my findings.

Good day !

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by KB0YOJ on July 13, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

As in a fairy tale once upon a time I was thinking about joining the ARRL, but decided not to because of the rate. Granted $39 dollar a year is not that much, but as a Tech with no HF privileges I have no use for the monthly issues of QST as I had found out by purchasing a few issues at the news stands. The magazine is mainly geared to the HF ham. Before anyone says anything about upgrading, I am working on that. I just think the ARRL should offer a membership for hams with attaching a magazine to it. I would like to support the ARRL and have access to the TIS member only section, but I am not going to pay a membership fee for something that I have no use for. If they ever offer a membership without a magazine attached or a magazine geared more towards the Techs (such as the old CQ VHF) then sign me up.
Carmen

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by AE6IP on July 13, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

>> If you won't support them (the ARRL) financially,
>> support HAM RADIO by not bashing the ARRL (part of
>> ham radio whether is liked or not) in public.

>> Put another way, Bashing the ARRL is bashing ham
>> radio, because whether you like it or not, when you
>> say ARRL, most people automatically think of ham
>> radio.

You've got your logic backwards, I think. Hearing ARRL and thinking 'ham radio' is just like hearing 'Ten-Tec' and thinking 'ham radio.'

On the other hand, hearing 'ham radio', I don't think of the ARRL or Ten-Tec, I think of sitting in front of a transciever, contacting other hams.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by K7VO on July 13, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

For those who believe W1AW only broadcasts, I worked W1AW from the top of Mt. Spokane yesterday while they were running the contest with my little Mizuho portable. If I can work them, anyone can.

The point, the real point, is that ham radio operators are a small minority of the population. If we want to be heard in Washington DC we need to band together behind a single lobbying organization, and the only credible organization right now is the ARRL.

United we stand, divided we fall. If this thread is any example, ham radio operators are hopelessly divided.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by W4EF on July 14, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

WA8KJP wrote >>>The ARRL is a joke. The FCC is a joke. The ARRL takes all the credit for everything good as if it made it all happen, and it blames someone else when things don't go well, just like all politicians. And it works.

There is no doubt in my mind that good things happen in spite of the ARRL not because of their useless and ineffective nonesense.

I won't give the ARRL a dime until they change into an organization that I like, and I could care less if anyone tells me I "should" do something else. I really laugh at all the "should people". They really seem to think I am really going to do something because they tell met to. Idiots! >>>>>>>

WA8KJP, I think the only reason that people are urging you to support the ARRL is that it might be in your self interest (and in the interest of ham radio in general). If there were no competition from commercial or government services for amateur frequencies or commercial interest which would seek to pollute amateur frequencies with interferenece (case in point - the BPL industry), then importance of the ARRL to the future of amateur radio would be greatly diminished. In that case I don't think anyone would care one way or another if you liked the League or not. Unfortunately, we live in a world where numerous entities (many of them commercial) are competing for the scarce resource of radio spectrum. In this environment it is hard to argue that we don't need a national organization versed in the ways of the beltway going to bat for us in the spectrum and regulatory battles which are inevitable. Trying my best not to "should" on you, I would argue that it is in your interest (I assume you care about the future of amateur radio) to want effective representation in these matters. That having been said, I would gather from your comments regarding the ARRL that you don't feel that they are providing effective representation for amateur radio. If that is the case, then it would seem reasonable that you wouldn't want to send them any money as this would be encouraging bad behavior. On the other hand, your negative comments seem to be very broad and general in nature. I frankly find it very difficult to discern anything from them other than the fact that you think the ARRL really stinks. One would be hard pressed to distill anything constructive from such comments - kind of like telling a child he is bad or no good, but not telling him why. I for one am curious what your vision of an effective League would be? Unless you have such an alternative vision, or unless you can at least articulate a list of the specific concrete shortcomings of the league, then it seems to me to be pointless for you to rail on and on about how bad the ARRL is. What good can come from it. Who knows, you may have some good ideas that others haven't considered. Why not put them out into the court of opinion for reasoned argument and debate.

73 de Mike, W4EF...........................

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by WB5HZE on July 14, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

KB0YOJ, now THAT'S a constructive comment! You know, I still look forward to my QST every month, in hopes that I'll see something that appeals to my own particular interests (a handy circuit, a new approach in antenna design, some interesting gadget). But two times out of three, there's little of real interest to me & I feel a bit let down. Now, I realize there are many facets of amateur radio and it is not possible for QST to focus on any one without shortchanging the others. Overall, the editors do a pretty good job of things. Still, QST simply doesn't appeal to everyone- for a variety of reasons I'm sure- so it is entirely fair to question whether the subscription should continue to be mandatory for all members.

I'm sure the ARRL could easily determine a reasonable (FULL) membership rate without the subscription- online access to archived QST articles could be controlled by flagging the callsign (so that's no excuse).

The ARRL should seriously consider your suggestion. Not that it is new, it's been brought up before and squashed- but in the past the magazine was the only way to assure that all members regularly received info about the operations of the ARRL. Today, this information can be (and some already is) easily distributed via e-mail and the website. So there's no longer a driving need for the paper magazine (strictly from the organizational perspective, you understand).

If the organization is truly concerned and wishes to increase membership, steps in this direction might make a difference.

Myself- I'll continue taking QST, even if a "no-subscription" plan is offered. They still publish some interesting material occasionally.

Ron WB5HZE

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by W3ULS on July 14, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

The numerous comments generated by my initial article exceeded anything I expected. I haven't read every posting, but it appears that the hams who agree with what I wrote already are members. The negative views of the non-member cohort, typically spiced with each non-member's particular grudge, indicate that this group is not one from which a significant number of new members can be found.

My article started from the proposition that the ARRL needs a significant number of new members. It appears the most productive way to go about enlarging the membership base is to greatly expand the number of new hams and solicit memberships from these newcomers, who will not be burdened with decades-old grudges of one sort or another. In other words, a program aimed at making ham radio appealing to a technically-oriented public.

[Coupled with a nationwide outreach program would have to be a review and revision of the current VEC set-up, which seems to be a semi-autonomous universe of its own operating within the ham radio fraternity. The current examination system is not marketing-friendly, to say the least. The induction into our hobby needs to be celebratory rather than conducted in an atmosphere reminiscent of SATs.]

The powers-that-be at the ARRL are launched on a strategic planning exercise, and I'm sure none of this is foreign to them. I wish them well.

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by KG6AMW on July 14, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

It’s the $39 that has you cheapskates worked up. I bet if was $5.99 on sale, you complainers would then say how great the ARRL is.

The ARRL Needs More Members!

Anonymous post on July 14, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

The last post by w3uls says it all.

According to him, the ARRL needs new members.(PERIOD)
He apparantly could care less why current non members don't want to join and he also could care less how to make the ARRL a better organization.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by N7UQA on July 14, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

I have been an ARRL member for some time now, I don't always agree with the ARRL but like it's been said before they are the only game in town. The ARRL has gone to bat for ALL hams, they DO make a difference. If the ARRL was gone do you think there would still BE an amateur service? My advice to others?... Put aside your differences and join the ARRL, weather you agree with them or not they are the ONLY ones fighting for your interests. Anything else is JUST a magazine subscription.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Money!

by W9WHE on July 14, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

W3ULS writes:

"It appears the most productive way to go about enlarging the membership base is to greatly expand the number of new hams and solicit memberships from these newcomers....."

Mabey. But it does illustrate my point. IF YOU DISAGREE WITH THE ARRL, YOU JUST DON'T MATTER.

If the ARRL would loose its "dismissive" attitude tword dissenting opinion, it might not create such HOSTILE detractors. NO BUSINESS can afford (in the long run) to anger such a large part of its potential customer base. Someday the ARRL will learn this.

NAAAAAAWWWWW! Who am I kidding!

RE: The ARRL Needs More Money!

by W5USB on July 14, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

OMG!!

I was "surfin'" around the net, and happened across this document. It appears to be confidential (I have no idea where it came from, I just followed a few links from another site) and involves using HF (13.56MHz or so) for an array of inexpensive merchandise tracking transmitters. If this document is legitimate, the FCC has already ruled on this matter and the hardware is being produced in earnest as we speak. Crap like this is becoming all to common in this supposedly "free" society.

http://quintessenz.org/rfid-docs/www.autoidcenter.org/media/hf_cheap_tags.pdf

And a whole ton of stuff to browse through, if you feel so inclined. Man, I'm getting a bad feeling about this.

http://www.cryptome.org/rfid-docs.htm?GXHC_gx_session_id_=271e74444abf041b&

Art

RE: The ARRL Needs More Money!

by W5USB on July 14, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

BTW, I just joined the ARRL moments ago. I would like to apologize to anyone I may have upset by my earlier posts.

I have taken the time to investigate further the comments given here, from both sides (hence my break from posting) and have changed my mind somewhat about the ARRL.

I still think it's an individual choice, and I would recommend that each individual investigate further the goings on in this country. More than just Amateur radio is at stake here.

Peace folks!
Art

RE: The ARRL Needs More Money!

by KB9YKY on July 14, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

It is interesting how the libs always pull the race card and call people "bigots" whenever anyone says anything that does not favor/promote the liberal agenda of homosexual queerness/child molestation queerness and the further expansion of the liberal socialist/communist state.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Money!

by MICHELEBAMA on July 14, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

KB9YKY, just to prove how out of touch you are, I'm 37, not a child.

You need to grow up and open your mind, God is NOT on your side or my side, he's on all sides.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Money!

by KB9YKY on July 14, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Girlie, this is an amateur radio website. Why are you looking here to post your silly liberal banter? If YOU are indeed really 37 (which is very doubtful)...and YOU talk and think such silly and childish filth as YOU origiinally posted...that would make YOU a slut. There are many websites better suited for your slutty "interests".

RE: The ARRL Needs More Money!

by KB9-YKY on July 14, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

What I meant to say was....There are many websites better suited for your slutty "interests". And I know this because I'm always visiting online with them for my "relief".

RE: The ARRL Needs More Money!

by KB9YKY on July 14, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Kid, YOU are not fooling anyone with your silliness. They know callsign suffixes are not separated from the prefix with a hyphen. YOU need your little bottom paddled for playing so foolishly on your mother's little 'puter.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Money!

by JOEMAMMA on July 14, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Joe, This is your mamma speakin'. Now son, I thought we done brought you up right. These nice folks here at eham don't wanna be listening to your hateful talk boy.
You ain't been right in the head since that preacher man done "had his way with you". Maybe thats whats got you so upset. Or maybe it's cuz yer sister stopped sleepin' with you after she married yer cousin Bobbysue. Whatever it is, put it behind you (no pun intended) and git on with life.

Luv Joemamma.

P.S. One of the sheeps been walking kinda funny. Have you been messing around with the animals agin'?

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by AE4TR on July 14, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

[Three ) I remember when the Commercial Radiotelephone Licenses were 1st., 2nd., 3rd. and the endorsements and the restricted permit.]

I also went through this trip and ended up with a First Class Radiotelephone License. The FCC re-issued me a General Class Lifetime Permit. I really felt let down after all that hard work and studdy. In those days there was no such thing as going to radio shack and buying the real test with answers. I am really disappointed with the FCC. I also have an Extra Class Ham License. I hope they never decide to cut it back to general.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Money!

by KB9YKY on July 14, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Kid, go somewhere else to play. Maybe, YOU could go somewhere and play with the amateur radio question pools. Then, after a few days, go get a tech license and a callsign. Then you could get a little walkie-talkie and do some CBing with your little shack inna pocket.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by N3TNQ on July 14, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

by MICHELEBAMA on July 11, 2003 Mail this to a friend!
KB9YKY , Joe:

I wonder if two women wanted to have a threesome with you, you'd have the same disgust you have for the 'gay' people. I would bet that if I offered myself and a female friend of mine, you wouldn't turn it down. Like that would ever happen!!

Typical hypocritical Republican you are.

Michele

Hmmm, cute post with a point until you blew it! You basically lambaste him for stereotyping and then you prove yourself just as bad. "Typical hypocritical Repulican"? So all people who register as republicans are hypocrites? Interesting. I have been accused of being many things in life, but hypocritr has never been one of them. Actually, I am a pretty liberal republican, but that is still what I am registered as. So I am automatically a hypocrite? Your point would be much more valid if you weren't making blanket judgements yourself : )

Howard

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by K4JRB on July 14, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

I laugh at the comments about all the high paid salaries at the ARRL. This last year they added some people to increase the membership, the base funding, and to make the Sales operations more efficient. The Executive Director makes far less than with most non profits of this size. Many of the new staffers are retiring from their first job and that is the only way
they can work there. The President and Board of Directors are not paid (except for expenses which are very limited).

ARRL membership is much more than QST. There is no other organization that can speak for USA amateur radio at WRC or the FCC, or Congress. The ARRL has a diverse membership so they try to support the new modes, old boatanchor history and lore, traffic handlers, Contesters, Award Chasers and more. Does anyone believe that 40 meters would have a chance of expanding if it were not for the ARRL and their sister IARU organizations.

Lets stop speaking of past problems and concentrate on new issues such as BPL which is the biggest threat to amateur radio HF ever! As to CW the ARRL has told the FCC they don't want them to drop the CW requiremnent even in the face of the DOD et al dropping CW in favor of the newer digitial modes. The ARRL is not the problem on the CW requirement.

I stand by my statement that every ham should be an ARRL member. I became a life member 20 years ago but when I look at the current dues its small change compared to what most spend on gear. The only way your voice is to be heard is by being a member and then voting your position. Otherwise you are not represented!

Dave K4JRB

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by N1VLQ on July 14, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

I am completely embarrased to be associated with this drivel. There is no winner in this mindless excuse for a debate. Actually, it doesn't even begin to qualify as a debate. This is playground stuff. By people who should know better. No matter which side of the original issue you are on (remember, there was a point to this at one time?), as is usual, the discourse disintegrates into name-calling, insults, and demonstrations of bad behavior. There are very few posters in this thread who have any right representing any group in public, let alone one with the proud history of amateur radio. Grow up, people. (That goes for the "Old-Timer's" as well as the "kids".) My grade school children behave better than you.
I do wish you well, all of you.
73
Bruce, N1VLQ

The ARRL Needs More Members!

Anonymous post on July 14, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

What makes this whole discussion a farce is that the ARRL weasels have to come to a free site in order to hustle new members for themselves because the ARRL can't hustle non members on their site since non members are not allowed to use the ARRL site.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by W4EF on July 14, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

WA8KJP wrote >>>>"What makes this whole discussion a farce is that the ARRL weasels have to come to a free site in order to hustle new members" >>>>>>>>>

Now there is a constructive comment!

BTW, is "weaselship" automatically conferred when you join the ARRL, or do you have to make special application for it (I am trying to figure out if I am just a regular member or a full weasel).

73 de Mike, W4EF.........................

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by N1GNV on July 14, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

WA8KJP:

Would you care to identify who on this thread is an "ARRL weasel"? Granted,
it's been over a year since I worked there, but I've yet to see a call or
name that I recognize as a League employee or officer.

Your assertion that "non members are not allowed to use the ARRL site" is
simply not true. Try typing www.arrl.org into your browser's navigation
bar. You'll no doubt be astounded to find that something like 90% of the
information is available for all. Free. No charge. No dues or other
costs. Just go and get it.

Yes, certain pages are for members only. These are primarily the product
reviews and other content from League publications. Guess what? I *paid*
for that content with my dues. In fact, I paid for the entire site with my
dues, and sometimes I wonder why they give away all that information to
non-members for free. My guess is that one reason they do it is so some
will see the value in belonging to the League. Of course, there will always
be freeloaders taking advantage of it one minute and bad mouthing the League
the next. But an honorable gentleman like yourself would never do that, I'm
sure. I look forward to your reporting back on your delight and gratitude
for all of that free information, and your pleasure in announcing your new
ARRL membership.

Thanks and 73,
John Bee, N1GNV
Quicksilver Radio Products
www.qsradio.com

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by N6YVY on July 14, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

If you want to know more about people. You might want to visit this site and put in their address....

http://www.reversephonedirectory.com/

It could prove quite interesting if you know what I mean!
Bob N6YVY

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by AD5OA on July 15, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Greetings! My first time to post, but having read these comments, I had to drag out my soapbox. I am not yet a member of ARRL, but I will be very soon (had to get it in the family budget). Why? Simple...ever hear of LPFM? Thousands of us "little guys" wanted to operate 10W or 100W broadcast stations in rural areas of the US. The plans were fair and simple -- pick a clear frequency that would be non-interfering to any full power FM station. What happened. Thousands of letters, from simple emails to full-blown, lawyer-submitted Letters of Comment. Result? The NAB (the "necessary evil" to broadcast TV and Radio) and other groups like it stepped up and said, "No" to the FCC. Now, LPFM is all but useless to common people, due to the strict regulations on it.

The ARRL, for it's good and bad points, provides a voice for amateur radio. Even if it is no more than just making our presence known. All of our good actions and community deeds will not mean squat if the FCC thinks that there is no longer a solid group of amateurs willing to stand up for what we have.

And, on the continued off-topic discussion of CW...

I'll make a deal with each of you. We keep the CW requirement. Along with it, you must be able to copy 5wpm in RTTY by ear, copy without electronic aid five minutes of packet (you can choose the flavor), draw a SSTV picture from listening to the transmission and for bonus points, whistle a test message in PSK31.

It is OK to enjoy a mode of communication. But, to force it in this day and age to be the "Great Gate" through which any ham must pass -- well, it makes me wonder if we are doing the "Star-Belly Sneeches" thing from Dr. Suess.

If we need a requirement that would be truly useful to amateur radio, how about there be a requirement to Elmer at least one person a year? Not just showing them the question pool, but showing them the fun and beauty of "making radio". Don't filter people out -- raise the level of the people as they enter (and continue in) ham radio.

*** I now put my soapbox away, and put on my asbestos undies in expectation of the flames to follow ***

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by RobertKoernerExAE7G on July 15, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Whew!

I heard what I thought was a farce, Jerry Springer running for Congress. Then I found out it was true.

Did his show go off the air? Are some of his scheduled guests starting to arrive here? ;-))

Bob

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by W9WHE on July 15, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

K4JRB says:

"There is no other organization that can speak for USA amateur radio at WRC or the FCC, or Congress".

The ARRL represents LESS THAN HALF of USA hams? Thus, the ARRL "speaks" for a MINORITY. The ARRL does not speak for me. I speak for me, thank you.

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by NR7Z on July 15, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

It is likely that the ARRL, during its lifetime has helped Ham radio more than hurt it. If you aren't happy with the ARRL over some issue, then do something to change it!! But don't cancel your membership!!! That's like taking taking the ball home when you're losing the game. Then no one plays!

How can we expect support from politicians and the general public if we don't support our main lobby?

RE: The ARRL Needs More MONEY!

by W9WHE on July 15, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Thank God that LPFM was defeated!

We DON'T NEED is another band where law-of-the-jungle freebanders run wild like 11 meters!

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by WAZZUP on July 15, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Yes, the ex-mayor of Cincinnati, the guy that wrote a check to a Newport KY hooker and she talked, the guy that redeemed himself as a newscaster on a liberal news channel (WLWT ch5), went on to sell himself into the TV for the Strange, wants to replace a congressman from Ohio.

Jerry has gone from being an embarassment to semi-respectibility, to Teen Sluts on Crack embarassment, and I can only imagine what he will do to Ohio.

Then again, Voinovich is only a republican in name, he is as liberal as any Toledo area democrat.

Jerry, Jerry, Jerry, New York is calling YOU HOME.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by K1CJS on July 15, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Those that say you speak for yourself, you're right. I also speak for myself. However, consider yourself (one ham radio operator) as holding a flashlight on a small boat (ham radio) in the harbor. A ship (the FCC) heading for that boat will be able to see many flashlights (a group of hams, the ARRL) much better than just one.

You may say the ship will avoid that boat and steer around it, but think what would happen if the ship never saw your flashlight.

The FCC at least hears and pays attention to the ARRL. If you think the FCC actually pays any attention to you--no matter how many comments you file about anything--you're delusional.

The ARRL has done a lot of things I don't agree with as well, but still works for the PRESERVATION OF HAM RADIO. And that, in the long run, is what we're all after, isn't it?

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by W4MGY on July 15, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

There is no excuse whatsoever for any active ham not to be a member of the League. Forget the politics, new office furnature or the meager saleries the ARRL pays their employees; if there was no ARRL, there would be no ham radio...period. It is galling to note that ham radio is full of a bunch of sorry cheapskete bums who make excuses and won't even pony up a lousy 39 bucks a year for membership dues in the ARRL. At the same time, these are the same people who would spend all afternoon dialing 1-800 numbers to verious dealers for the lowest price on a FT-1000 Mark V! If it wasn't for the ARRL, we wouldn't have recently been granted access to 60 meters or anywhere else. The League also supports the IARU who went to bat for us at the just concluded WARC and finally came up with a solution to the 40 meter boondoggle that has plagued us for 55 years or more.

That said, I am going to get off topic and direct a reply to couple of comments from AE4TR and AD5OA. Yes, it was a rotton deal what the FCC did to the commercial op ticket. Until I got out 8 years ago, I had made my living in broadcast radio since the late 60's. 35 years ago, the holder of a First Phone had a "meal ticket" that could get him/her into every commercial facet of communications..from broadcasting to commercial 2-way radio. The holder of a First Phone possessed the equivilant of a 2 year college degree. However, today with all the consolidation in broadcast ownership, and deregulation in general; a lot of former engineers where forced in 1996 to leave the business and find greener pastures in other fields. The FCC declared that it was no longer neccessary to even have licensed personnel on duty. Beleive it or not; under current FCC regulations, your local AM/FM broadcast station could even legally use the services of an unlicensed TV, or CB radio technician to act as Chief Engineer to keep track hundreds of thousands of dollars of expensive and complex broadcast facillities!

Concerning LPFM. This is a fine example of what lobbying the FCC can do. If the object of having a LPFM station was to provide a quality broadcast service to a community without the drivel that already exits on the air, fine. However, it turned out that the overwhelming majority of the applications submitted to the FCC for LPFM licenses came from fudimentalist religious groups who wanted to gain access to as much FM dial positions as possible. The LPFM rules allowed low powered stations to be licensed with only a 400 kHz seperation from larger high powered stations, too close under the current standard practice of 600 kHz. The NAB, CPB and NPR did their homework, and did the right thing with lobbying the FCC to recind this Clinton era idea. The LPFM issue became history. How many of you know there was and still is an orginized effort to flood the FM band with hundreds of low powered religious FM translators and satellite stations? The main object to this plan was to make it difficult for the listening public at large to hear NPR afilliated stations in the 88-92 mHz segment of the FM dail.

Amateur Radio does not continue to exist because of stary-eyed altruism in the eyes of FCC commussioners. It exists because of people with smart political savvy who have the ability to lobby the FCC and the halls of Congress on our behalf. Politics is a nasty business, but this is how things get done in today's world. The ARRL is the only one who has, or can effectivly represent amateur radio. Wayne Green is in it to make noise and make a buck. CQ is in business to sell books and magazines. Glen Baxter and his "IARN" sit on 14.275 and does nothing but make noise. Listen folks, like it or not, the ARRL is still the only game in town. In politics, as it is in everything else in life...money talks, bullshit walks. There is no free lunch in ham radio. This is how I see it - Support the ARRL, even if it is for no other reason than the League's ability to speak up on our behalf.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by KD7KOY on July 15, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

W9WHE.."Thank God that LPFM was defeated! "

I'm not so sure if that is good. The majority of broadcasting is now in the corner of big corporations or affiliates.
You say what they want you to say or your not on the air.
I don't see how a licensed broadcast station running 10-100 watts is bad.
I think it's not so much as a 'law of the jungle' that scared some politicians, more like 'law of money' and 'don't want competition'..communication is power..and they won't let it go easy.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by W9WHE on July 15, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

W4MGY demonstrates why the ARRL can't muster its membership numbers when he says:

"There is no excuse whatsoever for any active ham not to be a member of the League...... if there was no ARRL, there would be no ham radio...period"

Yup..its attitude. Attitude. Attitude. HOW DARE I not be a member. "There is no excuse" W4MGY declairs.

Well my friend, this IS STILL THE UNTIED STATES OF AMERICA (despite liberals)WHERE WE HAVE A CHOICE. AND I CHOOSE NOT TO BELONG TO A GROUP WITH SO MANY ARROGANT, SANTIMONIOUS, SELF-RICHOUS, NARROW MINDED PEOPLE WHO THINK THAT "THERE IS NO EXCUSE" FOR DISAGREEING WITH THEIR PERSPECTIVE.

Some insight. The ARRL, as a business, needs more money. But it has a problem. Too many perspective customers dislike it. They dislike it because of attitudes like the one you exhibited. Until the ARRL stops FOSTERING such narrow thinking, it will find it difficult to raise more money.

You can yell, scream, insult and demean people all you want. They still will NOT join till there is an attitude change.

ONCE AGAIN, is the ARRL all bad?. NO. Is it 100% arrogant? No. Does it do some good things? YES. But like any corporation, the ARRL has a corporate culture. Unfortunately, the ARRL's corporate culture is wayyyy to narrow minded.

RE: The ARRL Needs More MONEY!

by W9WHE on July 15, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

W4MGY demonstrates why the ARRL can't muster its membership numbers when he says:

"There is no excuse whatsoever for any active ham not to be a member of the League...... if there was no ARRL, there would be no ham radio...period"

Yup..its attitude. Attitude. Attitude. HOW DARE I not be a member. "There is no excuse" W4MGY declairs.

Well my friend, this IS STILL THE UNTIED STATES OF AMERICA (despite liberals)WHERE WE HAVE A CHOICE. AND I CHOOSE NOT TO BELONG TO A GROUP WITH SO MANY ARROGANT, SANTIMONIOUS, SELF-RICHOUS, NARROW MINDED PEOPLE WHO THINK THAT "THERE IS NO EXCUSE" FOR DISAGREEING WITH THEIR PERSPECTIVE.

Some insight. The ARRL, as a business, needs more money. But it has a problem. Too many perspective customers dislike it. They dislike it because of attitudes like the one you exhibited. Until the ARRL stops FOSTERING such narrow thinking, it will find it difficult to raise more money.

You can yell, scream, insult and demean people all you want. They still will NOT join till there is an attitude change.

ONCE AGAIN, is the ARRL all bad?. NO. Is it 100% arrogant? No. Does it do some good things? YES. But like any corporation, the ARRL has a corporate culture. Unfortunately, the ARRL's corporate culture is wayyyy to narrow minded.

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by KC0LZE on July 15, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

I feel as a new member to the Ham Radio Community that I have no choice other than to be a member. Not cause of pressure from anybody, but just to give support to the organization that will support me and fight for the hobby's best interest. Being a member also supports your local repeater clubs with benefits when enough are members. I think it is petty to not be a member and then complain that they did not represent you or your opinions. Just like voting, if you don't vote, then you do not have the right to complain about who won the election! Whether we like what the ARRL is doing or not. I feel that all HAMS that can afford the dues, which should be EVERYONE, they should be members. Remember that it isn't the loudest voice that gets heard, it is the voice with the most behind it, whether it is money or number of people. If we are so proud of our hobby then make it known.

To the gentleman that said "Please list all the accomplishments by the ARRL in the last 50 years to justify the tens if not hundreds of millions of $ this organization collected and spent. Don't list petty nonsense, list major issues won by the the league. Good luck thinking of any." You can make that statement of any organization. But the most important question is "What have you done for the organization? Are you a member of every repeater club for which repeaters you use? Are you a member of your local ARES/RACES? Do you donate your time to local non profit groups for events such as the MS150? If not, Why? Without the ARRL and everyone promoting Ham Radio to their best of their ability then yes we will become nothing more than "Yup, 10-4 good buddy. I will meet you at the coffee house."

And without the ARRL there will be nobody to defend or express our opinions.

73

Shawn KC0LZE

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by W9WHE on July 15, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

KD7KOY:

With LPFM, the FCC feared total CHAOS. With thousands of LPFM "freebanders", FM would have quickly and hoplessly gotten out of control - Just like 11 meters. Do you think thousands of K1MAN's would be a GOOD thing? I don't.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members

by WD8LQB on July 15, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

There are plenty of threats to amateur radio from commercial interests that would love to get some of the amateur spectrum. I know that the ARRL serves a purpose to help lobby and influence law makers.

If someone does not want to be a member of ARRL, that is always up to the individual. If a non-member files comments to the FCC, writes a senator or congressman, promots amateur radio to youth, etc., then they are helping the hobby.

There will always be a large group of people that don't participate in an organization. That is nothing new. There will be non-members who promote the hobby and non-members who don't. There will be hams that only care that the hobby is around for what is left of their own lifetime, with no regard for the future of the hobby.

For me, the future of amateur radio is important, and one of the best ways I know to protect it is to be a member of ARRL. There are certainly non-members out there that promote the hobby in some way.

People are going to support what is important to them personally. If the future of amateur radio is important, they will either join ARRL, or promote it in some other way as a non-member. If the future is not all that important to a ham, there isn't much reason for a discussion about joining ARRL. If the future of amateur radio is not important, they aren't going to care if anyone else enters the hobby or not as an ARRL member or non-member.

The ARRL Needs More Members!

Anonymous post on July 15, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

To all of the ARRL boosters.....you lost this one on this site. You tried to use the resources of the eHam management to hustle money for yourselves, but I think you lost this attempt and probably made even more enemies in the process. I am surprised eHam didn't kick you guys off. Its time the ARRL goes back to its pay site and try something else. This is getting boring.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by W4EF on July 15, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

WA8KJP wrote >>>>To all of the ARRL boosters.....you lost this one on this site. You tried to use the resources of the eHam management to hustle money for yourselves, but I think you lost this attempt and probably made even more enemies in the process. I am surprised eHam didn't kick you guys off.>>>>>>

Its funny you say that KJP. I know the guys who founded eham.net. They are all active contesters who I am sure are league members. One of them in fact has been heavily involved with writing the log checking software used by the league's contest department. He has also authored a number of the contest write-ups
published in QST.

>>>>Its time the ARRL goes back to its pay site and try something else. This is getting boring.>>>>>>>

Yes, your visceral "I hate the ARRL" arguments are getting really boring. At first I thought you were just lazy. Now I am beginning to believe that you
are constitutionally incapable of producing a substantive argument on what is wrong with the ARRL or articulating a vision of what an effective League would look like. You can't because you don't know. You probably haven't even thought about it. You just enjoy calling people "morons" and "idiots" like a playground bully whose only rise in life is calling other people names. I say to you put up a real argument or just shut up!

73 de Mike, W4EF...........................

RE: The ARRL Needs More MONEY!

by W9WHE on July 15, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

WD8LQB writes:

"There are plenty of threats to amateur radio from commercial interests that would love to get some of the amateur spectrum".

You know....I hear this doom and gloom all the time, especially from the ARRL. CERTAINLY...there are threats above 30 Mhz, but I doubt HF is reliable enough for new commercial interests. Especially as the cycle winds down. Satelite and LAN stuff prefer above 30 Mhz (yea I know about PLC). Moreover, with big spectrum hogs like the BBC and Deutscha Wella WITHDRAWING from many markets.... I think the HF threat is frequently exaggerated. Can you name a commercial enterprise seeking reasignment of the HF spectrum currently assinged to the Amateur service? I can't. Above 30 Mhz, yes, but below?

My point? Competitive threats to HF are overblown...all to pump up ARRL membership because...as the ARRL promoters are quick to point out...."only the ARRL can save us".

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

Anonymous post on July 15, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

To: Little man aka w4ef. Your anger is getting the better of you. The vast majority of part 97 licensee's don't think your league is worth a crap. That is a fact. If they did agree with you, 2-bit hustlers from the ARRL wouldn't be on this site begging for money. You lost little man, now go away. Like I said, you are boring everyone now.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by W4EF on July 15, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

>>>>To: Little man aka w4ef. Your anger is getting the better of you. The vast majority of part 97 licensee's don't think your league is worth a crap. That is a fact. If they did agree with you, 2-bit hustlers from the ARRL wouldn't be on this site begging for money. You lost little man, now go away. Like I said, you are boring everyone now.<<<<<<<

WA8KJP - your comments speak for themselves and suggest that you are incapable of anything but ad hominem personal attacks on people who don't agree with your vague and unarticulated position. This "little man" w4ef will now go away because it is in fact pointless to waste time arguing with someone who is constitutionally incapable of engaging in intelligent debate. If you consider that a "victory" then I say more power to you brother - whatever floats your boat.

Later, Mike - W4EF.........................

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by KD7KOY on July 15, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

"With LPFM, the FCC feared total CHAOS. With thousands of LPFM "freebanders", FM would have quickly and hoplessly gotten out of control - Just like 11 meters. Do you think thousands of K1MAN's would be a GOOD thing? I don't."

I think allowing private licensed stations running at low power is a good thing. Political correctness, corporations and money have taken over the majority of what we see and hear.
Promugating this 'sky is falling' attitude is exactly how these giants stay in business. And telling you what you want to hear. No competitiion is good for them. Bad for us.
I may not like what you have to say, but you have a right to say it.
And that is ALWAYS a good thing.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by KD7KOY on July 15, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

I may add also that there is nothing stopping "freebanders' who operate illegally anyway from broadcasting now. With FCC regulation they would have at least been in competition with bonafide licensed stations.
That argument is ludicous.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by N1RWC on July 15, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

For K3UD, A KB'er is A KB#xxx 2x3 Callsign. In the 1 Call District we ran out of 1x3 Calls so the CB Converts are issued KB1xxx. Not to say all KB1xxx Stations are former CB Users, but there are a few KB1 Callsigns that are giving the Hobby a bad name.

For W5USB, That's great that the ARRL loaned their callsign to a group in another part of the country, but when was the last time you heard them contesting from W1AW in Newington, CT?

73 All Matt N1RWC

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by N1RWC on July 15, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

For K1CJS, in reference to the repeater directory issue, I am involved with several repeater groups and every issue states " Updated on MM DD YYYY except for X and X areas." If that's the case then they would have listed the PL tones that were put in place at least 2 years prior to the printing of the book. Also they could list the repeaters which came into service within the last 2 years also. I agree that the ARRL gets their info from the Frequency Coordinators, but maybe they should check the info before printing it.

As for the Digital Listings, when the ARRL pulled the Digital out, they basically took the stance that the ARRL could care less about Digital, and let someone else take care of it. Funny part is that if you go to the TAPR Website, you can't get any up to date listing info from them either, but they want your money so they can keep an obsolete listing that the ARRL dropped.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by N7JI on July 15, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Imagine, for a moment, NO lobbying in DC.

W9WHE, we'll just leave it to you.

It's all on your shoulders, go ahead and fight for us.

If you can do better than the ARRL, I suspect there will be a mass exodus from their ranks to yours.

In fact...

by N7JI on July 15, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

I shouldn't have singled out W9WHE.

If ANYONE wants to start an organization that can MORE EFFECTIVELY lobby Congress for the benefit of amateur radio, PLEASE feel free to do so.

I suspect, then, you'd get some funding.

Until then, you can't complain about what you don't wish to support.

Fair enough?

RE: In fact...

by WAZZUP on July 16, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

alternative organizations have been formed, but all have been the probverbial "flash in the pan"...

Like I said in my first post, the ARRL is the only game in town. Love it, or hate it, and while many may question the motives, the ARRL has always had the best interest of all in mind. I know that I have question the ARRL's sanity in the past too.

RE: The ARRL Needs More MONEY!

by WD8LQB on July 16, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

W9WHE writes:

"... CERTAINLY...there are threats above 30 Mhz..."

Well we agree on this, which is why I did not single out HF. I won't bring up PLC since you already mentioned this. Since I like to operate above 30MHz (in addition to HF), I am concerened about some of the threats to the world above 30MHz.

I am not here to tell someone to join ARRL or not. I can see benefits to being a member. If you do not, then that is fine. The bigger issue to me is whether or not hams care about the future of amateur radio. Contrary to what some believe, it is possible to care about the future of the hobby and not be a member of ARRL.

I choose to be a member because I see a value in the lobbying efforts that the ARRL can provide. If a non-member does not like broadband over powerline technology, they have had the same access to the FCC website to file a complaint as an ARRL member. You don't have to be an ARRL member to send a letter to your state senator or representative to back bills that might benefit amateur radio. Non-members can still attract people to the hobby.

I would not have gotten started in the hobby without the guidance of an Elmer. If I can interest a few other people in the hobby and give them some guidance, then I am helping the hobby continue.

You get what you want out of this hobby. There are plenty of bands and modes of operation to enjoy. It is possible to interest others in amateur radio or not. If I want to pay $39 a year to belong to ARRL, I am certainly not destroying amateur radio by supporting ARRL.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by W9WHE on July 16, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

N7JI:

That's OK, we are having an intellectual discussion (or at least most of us are) so no harm - no foul!!

The notion that I must either support the ARRL or start my own .ORG is more ARRL narrow thinking. The issue is not black and white. WHY can't the majority of us do what we are already doing..... namely hold a carrot out in front of the ARRL...by saying...we will not join until the ARRL has an attitude change?

More importantly, WHY is it that the MAJORITY must change to suit the MINORITY at the ARRL? From my perspective, that's ass-backwards liberal thinking at its height of hippocricy!

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by KE0SM on July 16, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

"The logic of some people amazes me. Not wanting to send money to an organization considered to be ineffective is not boycotting. Its called not wasting your money. I suppose people in the former Soviet Union who did not want to support the only party, Communist, were unfairly boycotting their government according to eHam thinking. "
=================================================
When it comes to amazing logic, you are no slouch yourself. We were discussing effecting change in a democracy with elected officials. You draw a parallel with the Communist Party in the former Soviet Union.

The ARRL could be made a completely different organization in 1 election cycle. Those who care about what it does have the power to change it. That is a fact.

In light of this it seems hypocritical to me for some to criticize but not help. Simple as that. If everyone were to follow your lead, the ARRL would disappear completely. Do you honestly believe that the hobby would be better off without it? Maybe you do, but I sure don't.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by KB1IUB on July 16, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

It’s the $39 that has you cheapskates worked up. I bet if was $5.99 on sale, you complainers would then say how great the ARRL is.

The RGSB is having a 'sale.' Perhaps
you are right and the ARRL should!
I think that a $6 membership with out
printed QST would be BIG.

Bill

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by KB0YOJ on July 16, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Well here is my idea. The ARRL may or may not be all that great but I agree they do need the support. I challenge the ARRL to change their membership ways and offer three levels. Level one Full ARRL membership with QST, Level two Full ARRL membership with a magazine dedicated to 50Mhz and above Level three Full ARRL membership with access to the members only section of the TIS with no QST. ARRL give the current members and future members a choice then you might see a rise in membership.

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by KE4ZHN on July 16, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Only beef I have with the ARRL is those stinkin contests! If this is their idea of promoting amateur radio...count me out.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by N7JI on July 16, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

W9WHE said...

"The notion that I must either support the ARRL or start my own .ORG is more ARRL narrow thinking. The issue is not black and white. WHY can't the majority of us do what we are already doing..... namely hold a carrot out in front of the ARRL...by saying...we will not join until the ARRL has an attitude change?

More importantly, WHY is it that the MAJORITY must change to suit the MINORITY at the ARRL? From my perspective, that's ass-backwards liberal thinking at its height of hippocricy!"

I would say:

The ARRL supports the position of its MEMBERSHIP. That goal is to protect ham radio. The other stuff is petty because without protection of ham radio, it all becomes a moot point.

In addition, I would reply that it is far, far easier to change an organization from the INSIDE than from the OUTSIDE.

The best way to affect change (which can't be expected overnight anyway) is to join and run for office. Get all of ones like-minded friends to join, and then lay down the vote!

Scott N7JI

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by K1CJS on July 16, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

N1RWC, I do know about the updates by the area repeater coordinator, but the coordinators just plain can't check every bit of information sent in to them. It's just impossible! I was president of a certain club a few years back and had a go-around with the repeater trustee and the coordinators on this very issue. I had to cajole the trustee to get an update sent in, and that was after I had spoken to the coordinators on the phone. Their message to me was unless the trustee sent in the corrections and updates, they wouldn't be accepted and the current information would be run again.

You would be surprized at the laxity that the coordinators have to put up with from the clubs and the trustees--there are very few that will regularly send in the updates when their repeater system information changes.

As far as the digital listings, I wasn't aware of the ARRL stance, I was informed that TAPR requested this, not that the ARRL refused to list the digital stations anymore. I apologise for speaking when I didn't know the ARRL engineered that.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by N1RWC on July 16, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

K1CJS you have a somewhat valid point on the repeater trustee turning in the info, but that is only half the problem. The Frequency Coordinator has to take some action to get the right info where it needs to go. It took 5 years before the Frequency Coordinator passed along the PL tone on one of the local machines, and the trustees sent the required paperwork to him every year. So some blame goes to the Trustee and some to the coordinator. But, and this is a big one, How often does the Frequency coordinator list a repeater because someone submitted paperwork? And did they follow up on the status of the machine? I have seen several machines listed that are paper only, because the Coordinator didn't contact the Trustee to find out if the machine was in service. This is an area that the ARRL could even assist if they got off their you know what with their Field Organization. How many Section Managers, Assistants, and other League Officials could get on the air,(if that was possible), and try using some of these machines and "RELAY" the info to the proper people?

As for the ARRL TAPR deal, that's why Packet has almost gone non existant in the last 3 years.

Now let's go have some fun and get on the air instead of the Digital Twisted pair?? 73 matt N1RWC

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by K1CJS on July 16, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Touche, Matt! Sure, lets get on the bands instead of the thread! 73!

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by N4AX on July 18, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

LOOK WHERE THERE MAGAZINE IS GOING!!!! CUT BACKS ON TECHNICAL ISSUES , DELETION OF CONTEST RESULTS... A BIG MISTAKE!!!!!!! IF THE MAGAZINE IS ONLY GOING TO BE ABOUT ADVERTISEMENT , A SALES BROCHURE IF YOU WILL, THEN THEY WILL LOOSE MANY SUBSCRIPTIONS, SURE THATS ONLY PART OF THE MEMBERSHIP, BUT IT IS THE ONLY MATERIAL ITEM YOU GET FOR YOUR MONEY!!!! WHERES THE PRIDE IN OWNING A QST ANYMORE , ITS LIKE OWNING A NEW RADIO AND NOT BEING ABLE TO USE IT!!!!SO MANY HAMS SHOULD EVALUATE THE MAGAZINE/ MEMBERSHIP FROM THEIR OWN PERSPECTIVE, AND LET ARRL KNOW ABOUT IT, DON'T BE SILENT THAT HELPS NOTHING!! BYRON /N4AX

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by W5HTW on July 18, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

For K3UD, A KB'er is A KB#xxx 2x3 Callsign. In the 1 Call District we ran out of 1x3 Calls so the CB Converts are issued KB1xxx. Not to say all KB1xxx Stations are former CB Users, but there are a few KB1 Callsigns that are giving the Hobby a bad name.

For W5USB, That's great that the ARRL loaned their callsign to a group in another part of the country, but when was the last time you heard them contesting from W1AW in Newington, CT?

73 All Matt N1RWC

Darn. I thought "KBer" was 'Kiddie Bander." In other words, CB (it is called Children's Band anyway, so why not Kiddie Band?)

You can loan out your call sign? I do know of certain clubs using certain members' call signs on Field Day or other events, but the member had to be present, as it was his by gosh call that was going on the air, and he was the one responsible. But you mean the station call sign can be loaned out? Wonder if the station trustee has to go along with it?

I never gave this much thought before. It's a new concept, loaning out a station call sign, at least new to me. I would guess the club or person using it would have to be an ARRL member?

Interesting.

Ed

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by K7FD on July 18, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Since CW is going by the wayside, it may be important for the ARRL to come up w/ a new name for QST; soon no one will recognize Q signals...

73 John K7FD

...and one more thing...

by K7FD on July 18, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Lately, each issue of QST contains WAY too many League ad's begging for money; i.e., "write us in your will"..."become a member of the Golden Casket Club", etc...

Somehow developing funds by hounding those about ready to take a big dirt nap just doesn't cut it...

73 John K7FD

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by KC0IGY on July 19, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

I have been a ham for 3 years now, and an ARRL member for all of that time. I have contacted them on 3 occasions and have been very pleased with their reponse. The questions I asked were answered completely and promptly.

My view on the ARRL is this: Its OUR league and OUR input plays a role in how it will function. If we use it, it will almost certainly get better.

73,
Pierre KC0IGY

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by KC5SZU on July 19, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Hello Again, I will amend my opinion on the ARRL and give it serious thought and a second chance in the future. Thanks to all for a chance to vent on the matter. 73s

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by KC8VWM on July 20, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Agreed, the ARRL needs more members. (customers)

If you were a business and you wanted more customers, what would you do?

I think it's time that the ARRL takes it to the next level.
Campaign ads similar to the Red Cross would be VERY effective. They should run a few ads like the following on T.V.

"ARRL Logo opens up on the screen- "What have we done for homeland security lately?- Amateur radio operators assist everyday Americans like you in times of civil emergency and disaster.(Start video here). Show 911 building plane crash, wild forest fires burning in California, floods along the Mississippi showing floating houses, devastating earthquakes in San Francisco, and show pictures of the worst tornado in US history killing 330 people.) (Narriator breaks in:) We want to continue our work in the community so we can continue changing lives. What can you do to help? Become part of the team. Join us as an affiliate member of ARRL. Do your part to help your community and become an ARRL affililiate member today! "

Perhaps, someday and through ARRL "newsletters of encouragement", these affiliate members will someday become "part of the team."

73

KC8VWM
Proud Member ARRL

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by KB9YTQ on July 20, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

I have only been a ham since 2001, so am a fairly fresh face. In terms of the gay/lesbian activity, I see no problems with it. As much as I don't agree with it, they have just as much right to be hams as we do. That is one of the cornerstones of ham radio -tolerance.
I have to agree with N3NO in something we said awhile ago. The ARRL should look at the example of the Aircraft Owners and Pilots Association (AOPA) and the Experimental Aircraft Association (EAA). The EAA is giving the chance to any kid the opportunity to fly in a small plane for free. I don't know how many of you are familiar with the Young Eagles Program, but it has taken the aviation world by storm. Our Civil Air Patrol squadron has reaped the benefits of this already. This program opens a whole new world up to kids all over the country. The ARRL needs something along the lines of the Young Eagles. I'm having a very hard time finding other teens who are hams or much less even know what a ham radio is!! Without a larger youth program, the ham community will dwindle away to nothing. The loss would be a great loss to society, because hams are extremely unique people.
Another problem is the issue of licenses lower than Extra. I currently hold a Tech, but intend to work on the Extra. Many people look down on the tech as not even being a ham. These people need to get off their high horse. A ham is a ham, no matter what rank. This does not mean that all hams have this attitude - I've met many great people who are just proud of my accomplishment.
Another issue is promotion. I'd like to see ads in popular magazines and on TV for ham radio, paid for by the ARRL. Only when our numbers increase can our lobby power in Congress and with the FCC. We also need to see more activity within the community (emergency services, hamfests, booths at fairs, school demos, etc.)

I myself am a member of the ARRL. I don't agree with everything they do, but you have to remember that the ARRL would not exist without us. Those of you complaining about the league have very valid complaints. But nothing gets done by complaining. Call or email your state rep or even Jim Haynie. Express your radio views to members of congress. Remember that the ARRL used to be a grassroots group. Help it find those roots, not only for us young hams, but the ones of the future. Thanks for the opportunity to voice my opinion.
Best Wishes and 73s,
Mark, KB9YTQ

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by EXARRLMEMEBER on July 20, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

The ARRL's problem today is the same as it has always been. They think their job is to tell the members what to think rather than asking the members what their opinions really are. Their prominent support for promoting homosexuality via ham radio was probably the final straw for many.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by K8NY on July 20, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

KB9YKY .... Very well put, you hit the nail on the head!
Thats the reason I quit the ARRL 3 years ago "...showing that they want to turn amateur radio into CB radio with the belief that they will rake in more money for the purpose of increasing their already overpaid salaries"

Bob

RE: ...and one more thing...

by W0FG on July 21, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

"Somehow developing funds by hounding those about ready to take a big dirt nap just doesn't cut it... "

Spoken by someone who obviously has never been constructively involved with non-profit organizations.... Charitable bequests are the major source of funding for churches, private hospitals, colleges and universities, and most other serious non-profits. Charitable trusts and other bequests are a perfect way to see your interest and support for your church, your college, your hospital, the NRA or the League continue after your death and provide a continuing legacy and memorial.

When you are 20 years old and see yourself as immortal, you may scorn death as "a big dirt nap", but when maturity takes hold, making a statement of support for those things you hold dear as well as providing for your heirs is something other than a joking matter. The League is to be commended, not scolded, for encouraging legacy giving .

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by N8AUC on July 21, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

WOW! There certainly have been a lot of comments posted to this topic since I last looked! Some of them are intelligent comments, and then there are the rest of them. Determining which are which is left as an exercise to the reader. Your mileage may vary. Some of you may even end up walking.

Here's the bottom line folks. The ARRL is a membership organization. And if you have a ham license then you are eligible to join. Code vs No-Code, old vs new, tech vs extra, it just doesn't matter despite what you might think, or someone once upon a time told you.

But here's a little gem for you. If you think ARRL is broken, you can fix it. But remember that you can't fix a membership organization from the outside, you can only fix a membership organization from the inside. News flash - That is true of ALL membership organizations, not just ARRL. If you want ARRL to reflect your views, then join, and make sure you communicate with your section manager and division director on the issues that matter to you.

Going around with the idea that if they do what you want then I'll give them my $34 dues is putting the cart before the horse. It doesn't work that way now, never has worked that way, and never will work that way. You can't harvest a crop before you till the fields and plant the seeds. You always must sow before you reap.

I have had differences with the league in the past. And I take issue with some things that they do now. Like rubber stamp reviews for advertisers (at least that is what it seems like). But they are only people, they aren't perfect now, nor are they likely to be in the future. But then neither are you or I. Get over it.

I am a member of ARRL, I have been for several years now, and will continue to be a member. In fact I am seriously considering a life membership right now. I also recommend membership to all hams. Do you have to join? Certainly not! Should you join? I think so. The contests are fun, and QST is nice, but those are the icing on the cake, pretty fluff if you will. The real core of the matter (to me) is that when it comes to credible representation of amateur radio interests in Washington, the ARRL really is the only game in town.

I view ARRL membership as an investment in the future of ham radio. Or more like an investment in there being a future for ham radio. Does that make it a sure thing? Maybe - maybe not. But that's the nature of an investment. They always carry some risk with them. In my opinion, if you want to pitch in and help insure that there is a future for ham radio, then you should be a member, too.

As a disclaimer, I am not now, nor have I ever been an employee of ARRL, have never held any elected office or field appointment in ARRL, I'm just a member who has gotten older and hopefully a little wiser with age. Your opinions may differ, and you're entitled to them.

73 de N8AUC

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by KE4ZHN on July 21, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

How is giving the ARRL money going to save amateur radio? The ARRL is nothing but a lobby group who are only interested in making themselves more powerful. If the FCC tomorrow, decided to shut down amatuer radio, what can the ARRL do about it? (notta! zip! zero!) I dont see how sending some already overpaid politician hard earned money is going to save anything! Only thing that will be saved is his bank account! The only thing I have seen the ARRL lobby for thus far is making it easier to get a ticket. How is this going to improve amateur radio? Flooding the bands with technically inept operators is NOT improving anything, but it sure fills up the ARRL`s coffers! Are we that pathetic in this great country of ours that nobody wants to actually earn a ticket anymore? As long as the ARRL stands for dumbing down this hobby, I will not support them.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by WAZZUP on July 22, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

KE4ZHN said:
How is giving the ARRL money going to save amateur radio? The ARRL is nothing but a lobby group who are only interested in making themselves more powerful. If the FCC tomorrow, decided to shut down amatuer radio, what can the ARRL do about it? (notta! zip! zero!) I dont see how sending some already overpaid politician hard earned money is going to save anything! Only thing that will be saved is his bank account! The only thing I have seen the ARRL lobby for thus far is making it easier to get a ticket. How is this going to improve amateur radio? Flooding the bands with technically inept operators is NOT improving anything, but it sure fills up the ARRL`s coffers! Are we that pathetic in this great country of ours that nobody wants to actually earn a ticket anymore? As long as the ARRL stands for dumbing down this hobby, I will not support them.

WAIT, Are you sure you are thinking ARRL and not NCI, W5YI and WB6NOA?

If the ARRL is only a lobby group, when are YOU going to testify before the FCC?
The ARRL's political activities are minor, and perhaps TOO limited. There should be a full time staffer whos sole job is to keep after the FCC.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by N8AUC on July 22, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

KE4ZHN said:
As long as the ARRL stands for dumbing down this hobby, I will not support them.

WAZZUP said:
WAIT, Are you sure you are thinking ARRL and not NCI, W5YI and WB6NOA?

If the ARRL is only a lobby group, when are YOU going to testify before the FCC?
The ARRL's political activities are minor, and perhaps TOO limited. There should be a full time staffer whos sole job is to keep after the FCC.

=====
Gordon West (WB6NOA) and, to a slightly lesser extent, Fred Maia (W5YI) have, in my opinion and observation, done more to dumb down ham radio over the past 20 years than anyone. Memorize some answers to a few questions that you need not understand in the first place, and shazzam baby - you're a ham - lust like good ol' Gordo! As KE4ZHN points out, that's the wrong way to go about it.

The right way (which I think we agree on) is to actually learn the theory. That way when they change the question pools you don't need to panic and rush out to buy more of the memorization books. You see, the theory (and the FCC's syllabus from which the question pools are derived) doesn't change much. You'll be able to really understand and actually answer the questions that are asked instead of parroting back answers memorized courtesy of good ol' Gordo.

Who produces and publishes the real theory books? It ain't good ol' Gordo, or fast talkin' Fred Maia...it's the ARRL. That's right, the book considered by many colleges and universities to be the premier "manual of applied communications", IS the ARRL Radio Amateur's Handbook. If you learn what's in THAT book, you will really know what you are doing, and truly be able to pass any amateur exam produced by the FCC. Why don't Gordo and Fred publish real theory books? Because they don't generate the renewable revenue streams that the little memorization books do. It doesn't fit their business model. They're in it for the money, not the long haul. Everytime the question pools change, they get to produce a brand new stream of their little memorization books. And hordes of people rush out to buy them because they want the easy way out.

The reason that ARRL publishes Q&A books is primarily response to market demand. They never did it in the days before Fred and Gordo. In fact, doing that used to be illegal. Anytime you sat down before an FCC examiner to take an exam (which I did for Tech, General, and Advanced), you had to sign an affidavit before you could leave the session stating that you would not divulge the questions on the exam, because it was illegal to do so. And there were very real penalties if you did (and got caught).

It's not ARRL that is dumbing down ham radio.

As for their political activities, the ARRL needs to do more of that than they currently do, as WAZZUP indicated. But I don't see Fred or Gordo lobbying congress or the FCC on the behalf of ham radio. The only people I see doing that are from the ARRL. And the more of our voices that are behind them, the more effective they will be.

You can believe whatever you want, history shows otherwise.

73 de N8AUC

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by W9SZ on July 22, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

If you want to see changes in the ARRL, DO SOMETHING actively to change it. Complaining to the masses without talking to your ARRL reps is not going to accomplish anything. Dropping out isn't going to accomplish anything.

I feel no one has any right to complain about the ARRL unless they are members and are doing something - anything - about it. Write a letter to Newington, at least.

My ARRL reps are at all the local hamfests. I often spend some time talking to them about various things. This is at least a start, as I know my voice is being heard by somebody who can at least try to do something.

Zack W9SZ

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by N7KME on July 22, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

In today's world, it's still nice to know that opinions are like A**h*les. EVERYBODY HAS ONE, SOME SMELL WORSE THAT OTHERS. (that statement right there will flame somebody on because they can't stand the truth!) Keep in mind that because of the great country we live in, we can voice our opinions freely and not be imprisoned for them! We acheived this state of freedom by wars (unlikely resolution for amateur radio problems), and by the democratic system (politics). Now anyone who actually believes that the democratic system (politicians) will listen to the average Joe Citizen before they listen to a well paid lobbyist group should probably go take another large dose of Prozac and watch the flowers grow on the wall. Politicians are the most mercenary group of wolves that ever walked on two feet.
Whether or not you agree with some of the issues being supported by the ARRL does not mean that you should reject entirely their support on capitol hill. All too often today, we are caught up in the "what about ME" attitude, and since we have the right to voice our opinions, most of us (just like I am doing here and so are you), loudly voice our own opinions (see opening sentence of this post) but are wholly unwilling to do something about it ourselves.
If you don't agree with the ARRL, then vote in members whose opinions and platforms you do agree with. But since the ARRL is "the only game in town" when it comes to representing us hams as a whole, should we not stand up and let the government know that we are a force to be reckoned with? If you read all the posts here in this thread, all you see is a bunch of squabling rhetoric, not a cohesive voice as we should be in the case of BPL. Let's put down our differences, support the group that represents us, or shut up and quit crying about what will happen when we have HF shut down because no one was there to stop the push for BPL. This has nothing to do with code vs. no-code, nor studying vs. memorizing. It has everything to do with "STAND UP AND BE COUNTED NOW" I for one am seriously considering upgrading my ARRL membership to Life Member. The move to a socialist society here in the United States will be an easy one for the right politicians to achieve becuase so many people are so wrapped up in expressing their own opinions, and not supporting the groups that have the ability to protect them.
Craig Price
N7KME

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by N8CPA on July 22, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

N8AUC DE N8CPA:

Thanks for your latest post about who's dumbing down the Amateur Radio Service. I met his lordship at Dayton 10 years ago, or so. I had never really paid attention to his ads in QST and other mags, and never heard of NCI. Mr himself proceeded to try to recruit me into NCI, not by selling me on the agenda of his organization, or by a litany of benefits of joining, but by ranting against the League. He did not impress me with his intelligence or his salesmanship. If anything he helped to congeal my opinion against No-code HF. Prior to that meeting, I had maintained a somewhat neutral stance. Ever since that meeting I have referred to his "study guides"--which are nothing but memorization manuals--as Amateur Radio LiDerature.

Your post hit the nail on the head without so much as a spark. Way to drive the point home!

If

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by TECH2003 on July 22, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Yes, the ARRL needs more members. The CW crowd is killing ham radio. There is no need to keep CW. If we eliminate CW we can have more room for phone and get more hams on hf and more ARRL members. It's a win-win situation.

RE: More Members! And Less Hatred, Please.

by KN4LF on July 22, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Jason, KB1JPB Said:
I would also like to state for the record that I am going to make it my personal mission to help recruit more women hams; black, latino, native american and asian hams; younger hams, and, yes, gay and lesbian hams into ham radio.

Thomas KN4LF Says:
I think I will make it my personal mission to attract only technically knowledgeable people back into the ham radio service. If I’m successful the hobby should be dominated by intelligent and productive white males again. As our politically correct communist dominated society has succesfully marginalized white males during the last 30+ years, everything has gone to pot including the radio service and the ARRL.

RE: More Members! And Less Hatred, Please.

by K1CJS on July 22, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Tech2003,

I'm sorry, but you are wrong. The CW crowd is NOT killing ham radio, the thing killing ham radio is just the CW TESTING REQUIREMENT. CW was, is and will continue to be a valid and power friendly way to operate. At one time, I never thought I'd be saying this, but I have been enlightened to some point by a discussion on the article,-- K.I.S.S. with another poster, NN6EE.

CW will continue to be a valid operational mode for moonbounce, meteor scatter and other weak signal modes. At the same time the CW/digital band allocations should be left alone so CW will not be forced out of the bands. (At least I have been saying THAT right along.)

The main way CW testing is killing ham radio is by the simple fact when people ask about ham radio, most of the time their second question (right after "What is that?") is "Oh, but you need to know morse code, don't you?"

First Scenario:
Imagine if you say no and they later find out it IS required for higher class licenses? First, you are made out to be a liar, second, ham radio is made to look bad because you were a liar concerning code.

Second Scenario:
You say yes then try to explain about the no-code entry license, but the minute you said yes the person turned away with an attitude something like this: Geez, morse code?? I didn't think it was still in use in this day and age.

And if you try to be diplomatic and say it sometimes is, the second scenario still applies--and you aren't believed most of the time.

When new operators are exposed to the code, some of them WILL wonder about it and will learn it, even if those same operators were against it to begin with. That is just human nature. If people are required to learn or do something, most of the time they will rebel. If they are exposed to it gradually and tempted to try it, the end result will most of the time be different--those same people will be much more likely to embrace it and learn it.

The code testing requirement should be scrapped, but the code will continue to be accepted and used just as it should be. The other reason it shouldn't die is this: Morse code is an important part of the history and remains a legacy of radio--ALL radio.

RE: More Members! And Less Hatred, Please.

by TECH2003 on July 22, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

I agree. There are some people who will want to use CW for some reason but I don't see why. Once CW is eliminated we will have more room to use on the overcrowded phone bands. This will attrack more hams that we desperately need.

RE: More Members! And Less Hatred, Please.

by K1CJS on July 23, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

CW will still be needed because it is the ONLY mode that will allow you to work moonbounce and meteor scatter and other WEAK SIGNAL MODES. Voice modes just will not work intelligeably while operating "weak signal".

There is no reason to eliminate the CW allocations on the bands--CW IS after all a mode that some people want to use. The testing requirement is the only thing that should be eliminated.

If you insist on eliminating CW altogether, you are just as bad if not worse than those who insist on keeping it as a testing requirement. There is room in the hobby for all operating modes, CW INCLUDED!

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by WA2JJH on July 24, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

I have not been s member for 25 yeaers. I simplpy did not like QST(too many)ads.

Also they have not much for the service (IMHO).

Simple matter of saving money. I also found Waynn Greens(W2NSD) lambasting of the ARRL more amusing than what the ARRL said they were doing.

I have not found anything major That the ARRL has done for Ham radio. Simple as that.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by N8CPA on July 27, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

The League is the only group lobbying for Amateur Radio
in DC. They have siginficant credibility with the FCC and both houses of congress. All American amateurs benefit from their successes and suffer their failures, whether members or not. We pay no license fees, except vanity calls. So a league membership is a valuable way to contribute to the preservation of our allocations. Like any organization, they cannot please all members all the time, so don't throw out the baby because the bathwater's dirty. Think about joining--they are the only significant voice for amateur interests in Washington.

Ps. Tech2003--If you don't know the code, you're not qualified to have an opinion about why or why not people like it. Frequently learning it may preceed liking it by a delay of several years. In my case, there was a 12 year gap between my learning and my liking it. I call it the LILLI principle--Learning It Leads Liking It, or Liking It Lags Learning It.

And here's a bit of advice for when you get your call sign. Be careful, young friend. If you express opinions for which you're not qualified, you may quickly find yourself marginalized even on VHF/UHF. There's a social dynamic on the bands above 30MHz that's stricter than on the bands below, because the naturally limited propogation creates denser geographic radio communities. That has always been the case on VHF/UHF, well since before I got licensed 24 years ago. Your disadvantage will be that you have not really yet learned how to listen effectively to amateur communications, because you haven't learned Morse. And you need to be aware of that before you press the PTT for the first time. LISTEN before you transmit. Welcome to Amateur Radio--your real radio education is about to begin.

RE: The ARRL Needs More Members!

by W2AGN on July 31, 2003 Mail this to a friend!

Unless something has changed, the ARRL is still a "non-profit" organization. As such, they CANNOT lobby. That was one complaint over the years, that they cling to the "non-profit" tax status at the expense of representing Ham Radio.

The ARRL Needs More Members!

by W3ULS on January 22, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

I am very happy to report that the ARRL's Board of Directors over the last weekend (Jan. 16-17, 2004) adopted a very progressive, intelligent series of proposals that bode well both for the hobby and for the ARRL.

I won't go into detail here, since the ARRL's web site has the details. Suffice it to say that there will be a new, no-code license with substantial privileges on the HF bands as well as VHF and UHF. The availability of such a license will, in the not-so-long-run, make for a substantial increase in licensees, and my guess is those licensees will be active hams.

Also, of course, the influx of newbies will provide a pool of potential ARRL members, and will go a long way toward meeting my concerns about the need for ARRL to attract new members.

So I think things at long last are on course. Congratulations to Messrs. Haynie, Sumner & Co. for a job well done.

73,

John, W3ULS

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