Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
Charles Patrick Adkins (K8CPA)
on
May 5, 2004
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I'm sitting here looking at the Spring/Summer 2004 AES Catalog
And I'm looking at this ICOM IC-7800 -- Lots of Bells and Whistles.
I was just wondering' what this new fangled radio cost. So I called AES. The salesman gave me the price. $10,599,99, I mean, who are these guys kidding?! TEN THOUSAND American Dollars for a Radio that is basically a RADIO?!
I know about the twin TX and RX, but come on now -- how much did it cost to build this radio? -- And the parts?
I think ICOM missed the bulls-eye on this one. Ten thousand bucks is just too much for a radio. At least for us working folks, maybe some doctor or lawyer, but us working folk can't afford that.
I'm shocked...
Chuck K8CPA
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by KU4UV on May 5, 2004
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My snore-o-meter just pegged out at 30 over S9.
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by UA3AB on May 5, 2004
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Guys, I'm also in High End stereo hobby. USD10,000 for a piece of eqipment is a bargain there. So, why complain so much?
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by SP5QIP on May 5, 2004
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Hmm that`s interesting in Ukraine with monthly salary at 10-15$ per month.....
Mike
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by W4TME on May 5, 2004
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Let's see, you could buy 4 IC-756 Pro IIs or 3 Ten-Tec Orions for the same capital outlay. Doesn't seem like the ROI is very good for this radio just yet.
Let wait for rev.2 and about a $5000 price drop before considering it. If no one initially buys it the price has to go down.
-Tim
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by KD4TOQ on May 5, 2004
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It won't be on the market long if it costs so much to design and produce that it warrants that price. They won't sell enough to recoup their costs for production and developement. I easily have $10,000 dollars worth of Ham gear, but, I didn't buy it all in one chunk. It took years. It can't be that good! There is no technology that can make the radio perform so well that it is worth that much money. Finally.. There will be some sales to " Bigger Better Bobs" they have to have everything bigger and better. Look for the $5000 dollar coupon next year.
73's
Mark
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They'll sell plenty........
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by WB9YCJ on May 5, 2004
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to Gov, military, embassies, commercial, agencies, etc. The tightwads said the same thing about the 781 when it came out and it was a success!
If you dont like it wait for the Yaesu FT-dx9000.
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by K0RS on May 5, 2004
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I think it's great that Icom takes the amateur market seriously enough to even bother producing a radio like this. They sure didn't do to make money. Judging from the hams I see at swapmeets, most are to damn tight to even invest in a bar of soap. The mystery is why the whiners take so much offence at the fact Icom has built a perfectly nice radio for the high end market.
Icom will never recoup their development costs for this radio, regardless of how successful it is. This product is a "loss-leader," intended to establish a corporate image for the company rather than sell like hot cakes. Hallicrafters did exactly the same thing in the '50's with their beautiful SX-88...in order to steal a little thunder from Collins. Every SX-88 sold at a loss to Hallicrafters, but the company's reputation soared. The development and production costs of the 7800 will be written off as advertising. Ironically, the purchaser will be getting a radio that should probably sell for much more, if it was intended to be profitable. It's a great deal...if you can afford it.
Do you understand the Japanese concept of "face?" Yaesu does. Rumor has it they are set to release their comparable unit soon, too. Kenwood lost face when they introduced the VCR-like TS-2000, and hasn't regained it since. Their corporate bean-counters obviously look at the amateur market much more dispassionately.
Icom will make far more money pumping out generic IC-718's by the hundreds for a few hundred bucks each. At least the 718 owner can take some satisfaction in the fact that his radio is built by the same company that makes the grand 7800...and hopefully his 718 is the beneficiary of a little trickle down technology. Auto companies employ the same psychology when they go car racing.
Although the price of the new Icom has created a stir recently, expensive amateur radio equipment is hardly unprecedented. Consider:
In 1955 the infamous Collins "Gold Dust Twins", (guess why they called them that)the 75A-4 receiver and KWS-1 transmitter, sold for a mere $2700, about the average yearly salary for an American worker at that time and about twice the price of a nicely appointed '55 Chevy. Adjusted for inflation that would work out today to approximately $18,500. About 1500 KWS-1's were sold and over 5000 75A-4's.
In 1950 one could get on a waiting list for a Collins KW-1 transmitter (just a transmitter, mind you) for the pittance of $3850. At 600 lbs that was about six and a half bucks a pound. Inflation adjusted, that works out to a breathtaking $28,000 in today's money. Yikes! Even at that price about 150 KW-1's found their way into amateur's hands.
Why would somebody pay $250,000 for a Ferrari when you can buy a perfectly nice but pathetically generic Kia for less than 10 grand? I say more power to Icom and the new 7800 owners. Those who are offended by the price can go snivel in the corner and suck their sour grapes. Icom makes cute little 706's for you guys.
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by WB5UAG on May 5, 2004
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No, they are not kidding. If you are thinking just because Icom makes cheap radios that they can't make a top end one? I agree with several of the above posters, a bunch of ham radio operators are tightwads. Sure you can watch your pennies and get into this hobby inexpensively. It costs a little more to go top shelf. I'm sure if you shelled out heavy coin for this rig you would be in the shack every night trying to listen a little harder and talk a little further and be saying "I paid big bucks for this rig and it ought to talk to anywhere I want it to." Expensive rigs have their limitations just like inexpensive ones do.
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by NA4IT on May 5, 2004
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Don't blame AES for the high price...Icom had originally said $13,000....
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by N4CQR on May 5, 2004
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A couple of Koetsu Rosewood Signature Platinum moving coil phono cartridges would run about run about $11000.00 - They will still need associated components (Turntable, preamp, Amp, speakers etc.) to work. From that angle, the 7800 might just be a bargin.
I enjoy music a bit more than ham radio. Some people are quiet the opposite.
Craig
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by KT0DD on May 5, 2004
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This rig was not intended to be only an amateur radio. It was aimed at commercial and military use, and I read somewhere they will sell plenty to entities like the U.N. and foreign governments, as well as possibly our own Govt. There is a law on the federal books, that a manufacturer cannot sell an Item to the Govt. and turn around and give the average joe a big price break, so Hams have to pay a commercial grade price.
Too expensive for me... especially with BPL issues not resolved. 73.
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by W8MW on May 5, 2004
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K0RS told it like it is. It would be a major loss to amateurs if manufacturers built everything to a price point dictated by tightwads. That would have the corporate bean counters calling all the shots all the time. Talk about a great disincentive for design and production people. When high end ham gear raises the bar, some of those innovations eventually find their way into modestly priced gear. Better to celebrate the fact that Icom is pushing the envelope rather than giving up on the limited and not so profitable amateur radio market.
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by N4LI on May 5, 2004
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A couple of quick thoughts...
First, I am not sure Icom made this radio as a money-maker. It's a showpiece; a concept car made for sale. The mere fact that people are having this discussion shows they are getting mileage out of the concept.
Second... guess what? They're selling. The Icom rep I was talking to a few weeks back told me that the entire first production run was spoken for. This was even BEFORE the unit had a firm price. Some folks just have to have the best.
Will there be a big market for the 7800? Nope. But some folks will shell out the bucks. And, it'll make some newbies proud to own a 718, made by the same folks who make the Rolls-Royce of radios.
OK, Yeasu. Let's see what you've got...
Peter, N4LI
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by WA8NNX on May 5, 2004
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Take the price of a new KWM-2 in 1964, adjust it for inflation and see what you get. Seem to work out to just over $10,000! I love the KWM-2 but it is nowhere near the radio that you can by today for a thousand bucks. Top of the line radios have always been expensive but so are top of the line cars or anything else. For most of us we get along fine with more reasonably priced radios and cars etc. and just enjoy what we have. Icom has taken a chance on the market and I wish them the best of luck. My IC-746 is calling, see you on the bands. 73 Mike
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by K2WH on May 5, 2004
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To the original poster, have you read the specs on this rig? Probably not. It is not just another pretty picture or radio, it is much more than that and is probably the best tranceiver on the market at this time. $ 10,000? In this day and age, that's not alot of money.
While I wouldn't spend that much on a single radio, my 756pro and 2kw linear together costs about the same. So you see, it's all relative.
K2WH
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by K4CMD on May 5, 2004
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How 'bout a decent product review from an owner? Some of us who do think Icom has lost their frikkin' minds over the price might be a little less critical if we were to read some detailed information about just WHY this radio is so much better and how it performs. Alas, the half-dozen product reviews written by eham members so far are about on par with HT antenna reviews -- not HF radios, much less 10-kilobuck ones. Hell, the latest review reads:
"Radio is very good.
DSP is very good.
TFT is very good.
All 73."
Well, it damned well better be!!!
Give us some info, owners!!!
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by WB1FPA on May 5, 2004
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Wow, $10,600. Can it listen right through BPL???????
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by KG8JF on May 5, 2004
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Personally, I don't think it's worth the price. It just does not fit anywhere on my map of utility curves. I think it remains to be seen how many units they actually sell. Can you imagine describing your rig during a qso and the guy on the other end rolling his eyes back around to his ear lobes? I think it's conspicuous consumption.
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by N9FIK on May 5, 2004
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There is a robust market for $1,000,000 homes.
There is a robust market for $100,000 cars.
There is a robust market for $10,000 HDTVs.
Why not a $10,000 rig?
Why spite ICOM for trying to serve a market segment that values prestige? So in making statements that the 7800 isn't 3x the operational quality of an Orion or isn't giving 5x the features of a ProII entirely misses the point. It is like saying that for 3x the price, I should expect your Cadilac to go 225mph b/c my Honda drives 75mph.
You pay a little more...you expect a little more...absolutely this is true, but it isn't the only thing being offered when you are dealing at luxury price points.
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by KF4VGX on May 5, 2004
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$10,599.99 Are they Kidding. For one radio . LOL Glad the Richey Rich's have that kind of access cash laying around. I would rather put that kind of money in family material needs over hobby anyday.
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by K8DXX on May 5, 2004
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I think we'll have to wait for the ARRL Labs to test it. If you are a member, you can obtain the more extensive Lab Report.
Personally, I'd like to see the '7800 be compared in both lab and real world terms to the TenTec Orion. Perhaps Ten Tec could take a pointer from Icom; If they (TT) feel that most owners would not pay the upcharge for a color TFT display, why not at least put the outputs for one so Orion owners could display their radio's paramaters on a large flat screen, if funding was not a limiting factor!
73 de Bill / K8DXX
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by K0RFD on May 5, 2004
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K8CPA Wrote:
> Ten thousand bucks is just too much for a radio.
So don't buy one.
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by G4DYO on May 5, 2004
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And I'll bet it won't work any more stations than my old FT-101!
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by RA3DEM on May 5, 2004
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I would also remind prices of other radios, like professional GE/Ericsson portable for 3000 USD (!) and mobile for 4000 USD, list price.
And that radio could perform not much better then other equivalent monobands.
I'm sure, market will define real price after certain time.
73!
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by KB9NUR on May 5, 2004
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Information on the radio, copy/pasted from the AES PDF file:
IC-7800 HF/50MHz Transceiver The new Icom
flagship is a fusion of 40 years of analog RF circuit
development expertise, with cutting-edge digital
technology. The result, astonishing 110dB dynamic
range, +40dB 3rd order intercept point in HF, and
other features like a double conversion superheterodyne
system, mechanical relay BPF switching and
two roofing filters. The ultimate in performance,
function, and quality without compromise. 1.8 to
29.7MHz amateur transmit, 0.03 to 60MHz general
receive USB, LSB, CW, RTTY, PSK-31, AM, FM, SSB
DATA modes SSB/CW synchronous tuning 101
memories (99 regular, 2 scan edges), 10-character
comment Ultra high stability oven control crystal
oscillator Main and SUB receiver, external speaker
connectors for each Dual watch RIT and ∆TX
50MHz preamp and mixer 5-200W (5-50 AM)
Built-in supply (85265VAC) and high-speed HF/
50MHz automatic antenna tuner Voice synthesizer
(frequency, mode and signal strength) Four 32-
bit, floating point, DSP units and 24-bit AD/DA
converters Digital RF speech compressor Microphone
equalizer (adjustable TX bandwidth) Triple
band stacking register Multiple scan functions
Digital twin passband tuning 16-step variable
DSP noise reduction Variable noise blanker 7"
color TFT LCD (spectrum scope S-meter, and RTTY/
PSK-31 decode messages) RTTY/PSK-31 without
PC connection Digital voice recorder (200 second
RX memory, 99 second TX) CF memory card for
setting storage Multi-function, fully adjustable,
electronic memory keyer (DSP waveform shaping)
Double key jack system Full break-in 50 CTCSS
tone enc/decode UTC/local clock and timer function
Optical digital in/output CI-V interface
capability BNC-type transverter connector External
CRT display connector Four antenna connectors
Supplied accessories include 64MB CF memory
card, spare fuses, key and pin plugs, rack mount
handles, AC cable, speaker plugs, ACC plugs, power
plug 16.6"w x 5.9"h x 17.1"d, 55 lbs
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by KD2E on May 5, 2004
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It all figures....There are a LOT of folks out there making outrageous salaries. That accounts for why middle America is in a death spiral.
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by KA4P on May 5, 2004
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Lotta guys around here spend 40 to 50 grand for a bass boat. And then they tell me they think ham radio is an expensive hobby. I could get 4 or 5 7800's for the price of one boat. It all depends on how much you are willing to pay for your toys. By the way, I got a basic bass boat 9 years ago for 11K and it is still going fine, I will probably keep my 756PRO at least that long too.
Tom
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by WB8NUT on May 5, 2004
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For that kind of money, I can buy three TenTec Orions. Maybe the Orion does not have all the "flash and trash" but it will perform just as well and buying one benefits our fellow American workers. So when I get my next wad of money, I'm going for an Orion.
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by KI4CRN on May 5, 2004
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From what I hear they are selling like hotcakes. Must be someone who thinks the price is fair.
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by K4CMD on May 5, 2004
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Every man must believe in something.
I believe I'll have another drink!
-- Benjamin Franklin
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by W3JJH on May 5, 2004
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It is quite possible that the engineering development and tooling charges for the new radio were on the order of several hundred thousand dollars. In order to stay in business, Icom has to price the radio so that they can recover those start up costs within a reasonable time--say, a year or two. Thus, the price is high, but roughly in line with the cost of a Collins KWM-2 when corrected for inflation. Collins sold thousands of KWM-2s and KWM-2As over the decade they were in production. Icom will be lucky to sell hundreds of 7800s.
Is the 7800 a good radio? Probably. Would I pay 10.6 kilobucks for one? No, I'd use the money to buy a TenTec Orion, an Alpha amplilfier, and a new Mac G5 computer. Actually, if I had an extra $10 k, I'd put it in my son's college fund.
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by NC2W on May 5, 2004
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It's not surprising that this rig is introduced, just after the ORION. It follows a 50 year history of reverse engineering.
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by W1XZ on May 5, 2004
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New Icom radio: $11,000.
New Alpha amp: $6,500.
New all band motorized yagi and coax: $2,300.
New tower, rotor, and hardware: $2,000.
Going to a hamfest and seeing all those guys with dirty tee shirts and hard hats with rubber duck antennas on the top pushing stolen shopping carts full of junk from the free pile and realizing that's who you just laid out 20 big to talk to: Priceless
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by KG6AMW on May 5, 2004
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The question "is it worth the additional $7,000 when compared to Orion". The answer is likely no given the nonimal difference in performance.
KG6AMW
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by KA5N on May 5, 2004
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Sounds like "The Emperor's New Clothes" to me. I shall continue to struggle along with my little home-built K2.
Allen KA5N
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It will sell
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by K7VO on May 5, 2004
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I remember similar comments about the Icom IC-781. I remember seeing the IC-X1 (a prototype IC-781) at the Tropical Hamboree (Miami, FL hamfest) and all of us joking about the oh-so-expensive radio with the TV screen in it. The joke was on us. Icom sold plenty of IC-781s to hams, and probably many more to government and commercial interests.
Yes, the IC-7800 will sell. Yes, it will make money for Icom. No, I won't buy one.
Oh, and it isn't always a matter of being a tightwad. Some of us have families, other interests, mortgage payments, car payments, etc...
73,
Caity
K7VO/4
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by K8AG on May 5, 2004
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I'm sure it is worth $9500 more than my ft-920.
For that kind of money it ought to operate contests for you, keep track of and file for operating awards and get a job during the week when you are at work.
73,
JP, K8AG
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by N3QT on May 5, 2004
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K8CPA:
Thanks for your research (requesting the price via phone) and the post.
N3QT
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by K7FD on May 5, 2004
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A fool and his money are soon parted. Thank god for credit cards so an average guy like me can be foolish too!!! I want one!!
73 John K7FD
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by K3UD on May 5, 2004
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As I am not really a rabid contestor or DXer and have a modest antenna farm I don't know what a 7800 could do for me that my FT-100 and IC-737 could not do, But I certainly would like the opportunity to see what it can do :)
73
George
K3UD
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by K8OT on May 5, 2004
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And to think Ten Tec started out making little boxes to put A little CW filter in
Thats America!
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by N7UQA on May 5, 2004
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Look at it this way guys, it's like buying a car. With that said quit complaining about the price. The last big HF rig I bought from Icom was the IC-775DSP, I paid $3,400 for the radio from HRO out of Portland Oregon. I'm sure if I wait long enough the price will come down to where the IC-781 was in 1991.
If you are going to complain, complain about the price of gas!
Craig - N7UQA
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by K8CPA on May 5, 2004
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KA4IT Said:
>Don't blame AES for the high price...Icom had >originally said $13,000...
Not blaming the dealer sir, Blaming the manufacture for marketing a radio that is beyond the reach of the majority of the hams in the USA.
73 de Chuck K8CPA
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by AD7DB on May 5, 2004
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I asked the sales rep at AES Las Vegas what he thought of the radio. He answered obliquely that a lot of people had already pre ordered them. (I guess I should expect that a salesperson will only be concerned with how well something sells, whether it's a good radio or not.)
I just can't see how it's worth $10K. I could buy two IC-756 Pro II's and still have a lot of money left over for a great antenna system, which is the lion's share of how good you'll do on the air with any radio.
Yes, yes, I know. Look at some ham mags from the 1950's and see the top end radios advertised back then, adjusted to inflation those prices actually compare to this radio by now. And they were the top of the line in their day.
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by N5MZL on May 5, 2004
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OK, boys and girls. Let's take a Valium, a shot of Jack Daniels, or whatever your preference, calm down and look at this dispassionately.
Yes, $11,000 (read that number in the title again, people) is a lot of money for a ham rig. Will Icom make any money on it? Probably not. My understanding is that the Icom CEO personally commissioned the development of this radio, and most likely for a combination of the reasons already proposed (Japanese concept of "face", especially among his peers, which is another way of saying "bragging rights", a loss leader to sell more of their other products, and so forth).
It's not like Icom has not done this before. I remember when the first iterations of the '756 came out about fifteen years ago, it was the "ultimate radio" then as well, and with it's matching amp, comparably priced.
And yes, they will sell quite a few of them (just as Collins did with their rigs back in the days of yore), although still not make enough money on it to cover it's development costs. And they will sell them for the same basic reasons that Icom built the thing in the first place; bragging rights among those with enough money to afford the thing.
Now, I don't begrudge anyone who has enough disposable dinero to buy one of these things the right to do so. Whatever floats your boat.
If you've got the cash (more about that in a moment) and really want this radio, go for it.
And truth to tell, I make enough money that if I pushed it, I could swing buying one myself in the short-term future. Of course, if I told my wife I was going to drop eleven grand on a radio, she'd kill me...:)
But the fact is, I don't need that much radio. Nor do I think most hams need it, strictly speaking. Who needs two transmitters as well as receivers, and whatever other bells and whistles this thing has? I sure don't. I'm not a contester, nor a big-time DX operator (I love making DX contacts, but I'm not looking for the DXCC or the like, although I can see where someone really into these sorts of activities might). I'm a rag-chewer; I'm in the hobby because I like talking on the radio and generally fiddling around with my gear.
Does this make me a "tightwad"? Hell, no. Over the years I've spent nearly this much money on the hobby, albeit on an assortment of different radios, antennas and related hardware, as opposed to just one device.
And you can't use the "bass boat" analogy here, either. The big difference between a boat or RV, to use the example cited, and the Icom is that you can get financing for boats and the like. So unless you've got a credit card with a VERY long line of credit on it, more than most people have (or should have, and don't forget the outrageous interest rates banks charge for credit card loans), this radio is strictly a "cash on the barrelhead" item, a nontrivial difference.
And most people simply don't have $11,000 in cash to drop on what amounts to a toy. This is reality; deal with it.
Bottom line here is this; the people complaining about the price of the radio are out of line in the sense that nearly all radio manufacturers, past and present, have always had their high-priced "ultimate" radio models, and there have always been those who could afford to buy them. It's just like the average ham who spends $1800 on a new Ten-Tec instead of $1000 on a mid-rang Yaesu or Kenwood. You will try to get the most bangs for your buck.
And the people complaining about the "unwashed tightwads" are out of line as well, because just like the $1,000,000 homes, $250,000 cars or $100,000 boats that there are markets for, if someone buys one of these '7800s, it is for the same reason one would drop that kind of money on a house, car or boat. It's called bragging rights, "he who dies with the most toys wins", "I'm a Big Gun and you are not, neener, neener, neener", etc.
So let's keep things in perspective here, shall we?
73 de N5MZL
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by W4OFG on May 5, 2004
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I don't know how many of you have friends who bass fish or fish offshore...or just do pleasure boating...but some of my buddies think nothing of having $50,000+ tied up in boat, trailer, motor, vehicle to pull the rig, and fishing tackle...not to mention boat launching fees, gasoline, maintenance...all for a hobby engaged in only a few days a year. IC-7800 looks like a bargain in that perspective...and you can enjoy it 24/7/365. Too each his own. But to be honest, my beer budget wouldn't handle it!!
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How do you spell E * N * V * Y ?
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by NJ0E on May 5, 2004
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so there is a law somewhere on the books that
says all ham radio transceivers must be popularly
priced? no one should be allowed to design and
manufacture a unit that *i* can't afford/wouldn't
pay for?
as others have correctly pointed out, that has never
been the case. in the 1930's, the hallicrafters ht-4
was $700. that would be about $10,000 today. and that
was just a transmitter. there have nearly always been
top end rigs that the don wallaces and barry
goldwaters use. and other stuff that the rest of
have used. but most of us have managed to enjoy
ourselves in the pursuit of amateur radio with
whatever we had access to. in an earlier era, many
hams homebrewed their gear because that was the
only way they could afford to participate! i think
we're fortunate that's not the case today; these
really are great times to be a ham.
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by N3ZKP on May 5, 2004
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Chuck,
<< Not blaming the dealer sir, Blaming the manufacture for marketing a radio that is beyond the reach of the majority of the hams in the USA. >>
Are you also blasting Mercedes, BMW, Rolls Royce and many others for marketing cars that are beyond the reach of the majority of car buyers in the USA?
If that were ICOM's only rig you might have a point.
Lon
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by KD5VHF on May 5, 2004
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I'm sure it's a fine rig but I would rather have 10K worth of antenna hooked to a IC-718.
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by WB2WIK on May 5, 2004
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Manufacturers don't set selling prices, the market does.
There was a very long waiting list for the 7800 months before the first one shipped to the U.S., and every dealer in America was basically "sold out" before they got any. I've already heard and worked several on the air, but they're all very new, mostly delivered within the last two weeks.
$11K for a rig? Why not? It might be 5.5 times better than a $2K rig...that's not a huge point spread.
WB2WIK/6
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by K5WAG on May 5, 2004
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I have mine so you whiners just keep on whining.
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by VE3WGO on May 5, 2004
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Saying the 7800 is just a radio with bells and whistles is like saying a Corvette or Viper is just a car. Go ahead and buy 3 or 4 of your favourite basic radios instead of a 7800, and while you're at it buy 5 or 6 Corollas instead of a Viper.
The 7800's LCD colour spectrum display is an engineering marvel, extremely useful for survellance, passband monitoring as a Satellite or VHF/Microwave IF rig, 10 and 6 meter openings, HF DX chasing, or other activity monitoring. The posted dual high performance receiver specs of the 7800 look like they will blow away just about everything else on the market, including WJ and TT, etc, and why not? They are using the very latest mixer, PLL, DDS, IF, DSP technologies and lots of those technologies come from many leading internationational technology companies.
Buy American, you say? I bet an Icom and a Ten Tec have just about the same exact percentage of foreign and domestic components, software, and subassemblies, except for the folks who screwed it together and put it in the shipping box..
The 7800 is reserved for those who admire technology and the best it can do.
If anybody who actually KNOWS what electronics components, RF PA transistors, mechanical components, aluminum castings, LCDs, DSP chips, PCBs, etc etc ACTUALLY cost, (I work in tech manufacturing and can appreciate how a top end radio could cost 10K, and our assemblies often cost much more than that) then you wouldn't say that a 10k radio isn't worth it.
I haven't seen one or heard one yet, but I trust the manufacturers to at least come close to the target on the first try. That's why they succeed in the first place.
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by KG4TDM on May 5, 2004
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It's what you do with what you've got that counts!
73,
Tommy
KG4TDM
Miami, FL
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by K4SX on May 5, 2004
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Recently I was invited to a friends QTH, locally, to take a look at his new IC-7800 he had just received that day, April 28th. Of course I accepted and rushed over after dinner to take a look at ICOMs newest technology for Amateur Radio. My impression of the radio is that it is fantastic. I operated the radio during the 1-hour visit and thought I would put together my comments.
Receiver:
1). Both receivers are very quite with equal functionality. (Two identical receivers).
2). The selectivity on SSB seems to be excellent (I did not have time to check CW).
3). Ease of operation and function of each receiver is very good.
4). We did not have time to do compare via an A/B test but will do so in the near future.
5). Receivers have adjustable audio treble, bass and bandwidth.
6). Features and functions of the receivers are very similar to the IC-756Pro2.
Transmitter: (SSB was tested and not CW. I used an SM-6)
1). The output is 200+ watts, key-down and is adjustable between 0 and 200.
2). The SSB talk-power is 200+ watts.
3). The transmit audio has adjustable treble, bass, and bandwidth to 2.9khz.
4). On-the-air reports on 40M SSB were excellent.
5). The transmitter has improved cooling technology and venting.
Front Operating Panel:
1). Excellent layout and easy to understand/use.
Software/Book:
1). Easy to understand and similar to the Pro2 series.
Screen:
1). Appearance for my eyes was very good with clear color and distinction.
2). All 3 meters available are selectable, clear and readable. They are digital in nature and not analog as on the Pro series. One of the meter selections does simulate an analog meter and it does it very well.
3). The different settings for the screen are easy to adjust and modify to each persons preference.
4). The screen is larger than the Pro2 and 781 to accommodate the additional features.
5). The screen is easy to read and understand functionally.
Overall Assessment:
I operated the radio on and off for an hour after reading many sections of the book and I am very impressed. The radio is a very nice looking radio with excellent feature, function, and layout. I did not use test lab equipment to completely test the radio nor did I do an A/B test. I plan on doing an A/B test in the very near future.
My experience with high-end radios has been with ICOM, Kenwood, Collins, and Yeasu equipment and I currently own the IC-781, IC-756Pro2, IC-751A, and IC-706MkII. The IC-7800 is definitely a superior radio to these and the TS-950SDX, TS-850SAT, FT-1000D, and KWM-380 that I have owned.
As for price-point, I will have to leave that to each individuals own opinion and discussion. That is not the intent of this article.
Thank you for taking the time to read my article and I hope you have found this short review interesting. I look forward to going back and doing more operating and testing and also look forward to owning one soon. Let me thank K5AND for his generosity in letting me visit his home and operate his new radio.
73 and take care.
K4SX
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by VE4HQ on May 5, 2004
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Thats only about 14,782.00 canadian $. I wonder if they would drop the .99?
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by DK9BDN on May 5, 2004
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Why not complaining about a Rolex?
Buy something else!
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by NI0C on May 5, 2004
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Last evening I attended a most worthwhile presentation by W0EWM at the Mississippi Valley DX & Contest club concerning the advancements in DSP being incorporated in the new "high-end" transceivers including the Icom-7800. Therefore, except as a discussion starter, this "article" was disappointing to me.
Somehow, I expect an article posted on eHam to convey some worthwhile technical information, or at least an informed opinion on some ham radio subject, not merely someone's impressions gleaned from a catalog.
73 de Chuck NI0C
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by AH6FC on May 5, 2004
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Yep, $10,000 is a lot of money. Giving up 2 packs a day and that six-pack would give you enough money to buy an IC-7800 in 2 years. This doesn't count the money saved on doctor's visits for treatment of emphysema, heart disease, and alcoholic liver disease.
We live in a capitalistic society...free market. It's too rich for my tastes now but who knows? If you don't like it don't buy it!
73's & Aloha.
(Dr.) Bill :-)
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by AF4KK on May 5, 2004
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There will < ALWAYS > be an "ultimate" rig to look up to. It's always been that way since the beginning of commercial HAM radio sales! Sure, $10,000 is too much for me but they don't plan to sell millions of units. Part of the whole situation is the publicity of it all. We're chatting about ICOM right now, aren't we? The ICOM units I own are the 706 mkIIG, two R-3's and an older R-100 rx'er. I am happy enough with those units to wish I could buy a 7800 if I had the $$$. Oh well..... Dream on......
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by KX2S on May 5, 2004
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HA HA HA This is a rig for elite LIDS. LOOK I have a 7800. Who cares, everyone knows most of your money should go into a good antenna system
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by WA0ZZG on May 5, 2004
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Until you have used a radio of this class, don't
complain. These radios are built differently. They
are not the same to operate or work on. I also can
not afford anything of this class, but located a
'fixer upper' FT-1000D I could stretch to buy. It's
been quite an experiance. I suggest you never use a
radio like this if you can't afford one. You will
be spoiled.
Dave...
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by AG4RQ on May 5, 2004
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Sounds more like an auto dealership offering a demo auto with an IC-7800 mounted in-dash. Is the car and the radio under warranty? How many miles on the car and how many hours on the radio? Do they offer financing?
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by NOLICENSEASOFYET on May 5, 2004
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Hey guys, here is the hooter to this post. I think technology is great.
When they change the code, and there is a 50% to 80% increase in licensed operators, alot that don't have 10,000.00 to plop down on a rig. The radio production will swing towards the masses, not the rich. There will be alot of quality rigs that are not "ALL" bells and whistles.
Then Icom, Yaseu, Ten Tec, Bla Bla and Bla Bla Manufacturers will start producing rigs that are usable. Holly crap if I had something in my home that was worth $10,000.00 that someone could carry out of my house after they broke a window, I would have to hire a guard and build a vault. I have alot of the same equipment that I had in 1970, still works still does what it was designed to do, didn't cost $10,000.00
Soon these manufacturers will start looking at their profit margin in the mass, not the massly rich and stupid. I would like to say excess, excess, excess. Just like the guy I work with at the college who drives a $80,000 BMW suv. He is an ecology professor. What an oxymoron that is. You would think that he would drive a hybrid vehicle, but no. Anyway, I am strapping my flame retardant suit on, so knock yourselves out, tell me how much better you are than me and how stupid my opinion is.........I'm not sweating it.
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by N2CKH on May 5, 2004
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Hello All,
The best review of the radio that has been written
by and owner that I have seen can be found at:
http://chobi.archi.is.tohoku.ac.jp/~ooba/ja7ude/ic7800diary.htm
/s/ Steve, N2CKH
www.n2ckh.com
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by AG4RQ on May 5, 2004
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I just did a search for the IC-7800 on HRO. Here's the results:
1) Manufacturer: ICOM
Item : IC-7800
Description : DELUXE HF/6M TRANSCEIVER 200W
YOUR HRO PRICE $10599.00
Additional information :
Coming soon!
Like I said in my previous post, do they offer financing? Are they serious? If I had one, I'd sell it and buy a car with the money. Damn!!
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by KJ7XJ on May 5, 2004
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I believe this technology is worth every penny.
I can't afford it either.
If ICOM would set up radio loans like car companies do, then perhaps I could pay it off in 3-5 years.
My TS-440 still talks aroud the world. Sure I wish it had dual recievers and it would do data modes with no interface, but you get what you pay for. Im happy...
Eric
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by KA2UUP on May 5, 2004
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$10000 for a radio? Maybe not! But as a previous poster said, there is a market for $1M homes, etc. However, this radio, apart from the impressive specs, also seems to incorporate a number of soundcard communication modes without the need for a computer. For the "uncluttered station-type of guy" this may make a lot of sense.
To those that criticize other people's use of their OWN money:
GET A FREAKING LIFE!!!!!! If you cannot afford it, don't criticize those of us that can. I don't criticize those that go around throwing quarters around like their were manhole covers. To each his own. Live and let live!!!!
Cheers from Bert @ KA2UUP
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by W6YB on May 5, 2004
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Well said K0RS. Very well said...
I would have typed a reply with my opinion but K0RS did the work for me. Good job Icom! And thank you K0RS.
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by WB9NJB on May 5, 2004
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There is an interesting thread here just under the surface. It is the classic democrat class warfare scenario. The have nots sniping at those who work hard and have more. An earlier post suggested that the "working man" can't afford the new radio, and that is porbably true. But just what is the working man? The doctors, lawyers and other professionals work far more hours per week (without overtime or union rules) than just anyone else in this economy. That work generates tax revenues, and puts other people to work. I read comments like that from KD2E and I alomost have to laugh. Middle America is alive and well, particularly with those people who have maintained skill sets that are in demand in a modern economy. True, $10,000.00 is a great deal of money for a radio, but don't rag at those who have worked hard, and are willing to pay the freight. This radio is not aimed at Niddle America. Poverty sucks, and so does whining about it.
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by VE7REF on May 5, 2004
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KA4P is exactly right. I paid $35,000 for my LUND boat and love it. People will pay $10,000 for a radio if 10K is the same as 1K to other folks. It's all relative people.
Cheers all..
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by KF4WXD on May 5, 2004
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I used to build high-end audio equipment. In fact, my then boss is in the H. E. A. Hall of Fame. I learned that business is full of charlatans, frauds and BS artists. Let's see some double-blind tests of some of the more outrageous claims.
Russ - kf4wxd
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At that price, I'll order three!
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by WB4M on May 5, 2004
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One for home, one for the cabin in the Smokies, and one for my beach cottage. Not sure if I'll pick up an Alpha for the mountain or beach QTHs or not. I just love new toys!
73 guys 'n gals!
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by K3GI on May 5, 2004
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K5WAG: Congratulations! How do you like it?
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by G0GQK on May 5, 2004
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Icom are looking for lotsa American "must have" high rollers to pay for the never ending problems that many hams have with the 746 PRO, PRO II and 7400. It should be re-numbered the IC 11000
Just a thought. I wonder how many heart attacks will be recorded among radio hams if the 7800 turns out to be another turkey ? Does it have a built in heart monitor ?
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by KF3EG on May 5, 2004
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599.99 is the price of the radio, the added 10,000 is for the service at Icom that sucks.
I know a Ham who bit the bullet and bought a 7800 and is now kicking himself, his words "its no damn better than the Orion and I shouldn't have bought it, I let my credit card do my thnking for me".
Its a nice looking rig and it sounds good on the air, but so does a few hundred thousand 1,000 dollar radio's.
What peole pay for their radio's is their business, 1,000 or 10,000, but I think Icom should have spent the money on better service than on the design of the 7800. If Icom as someone said was dedicated to ham radio you would think they would fix their service problems and not try to BS their way in the market with a pretty light show of a radio.
I had a 781, 6 trips to the sevice center and they never fixed it, I did, bad solder joints on the relay board, God forbid a 7800 break down, it would need a 5 year warranty on it to cover the repair time and trips in the brown truck.
Face it Icom has Piss poor service, they can make a 10,000 radio and can't fix what they have out there today, so as far as I see their dedication is to their wallet not yours. and before you get pissed Yaesu and Kenwood aren't much better.
73
Jim
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by AD5X on May 5, 2004
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Why not? Even many of us "working men" can justify extravagant items. Lots of folks buy $50K cars. Others buy new cars every 2-3 years. Some folks spend a fortune in competitive shooting, or golf, or boating. I just bought a big plasma display - can't really justify it other than I just had to have it. Same with an $11K radio. Not saying I'll buy one, because I'm extremely happy with my Mark V - and I'll probably keep it 10 years like I do my cars. But I'll certainly look at the IC-7800, and whatever Yaesu and Kenwood are cooking up.
When I worked for Collins Radio, we had a slogan - Go First Class and Save.
Phil - AD5X
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by N9FIK on May 5, 2004
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Again, let people spend their money as they see fit. The price point pf $106 K$ is not solely about incremental performance it has as much to do with bragging rights and creating "I wish I had one too" effect with some Amateurs.
Look at some of the effects of a $10,600 price point. At first blush, it makes the $2,400 price of a ProII look down right cheap. It creates a bit of desensitization to what was formerly the high end. It makes the entry level rig, the 718 look almost free in comparison as the 7800 is an order of magnitude and a factor of 2x greater in price.
It will give the effect to the untrained Amateur of endowing the other rigs in the ICOM line up with a greater sense of quality. "If they can make a rig as fine as the 7800, surely the 756ProII, 718 and 703 must be good rigs as well."
Also consider this. A $10,600 super rig sets the stage for $5,000 future "not as quite a super rig". It would be the "compromise" rig for the person who can't go the full 9-yards but wants to be in the club. That would be no different than what Mercedes did with the S-Class and the E and C-Class autos.
If they are making them for the gov't and other commercial users, why not get the incremental cash from the Amateur market. It makes perfect sense.
As noted by another poster from the high end stereo world, double blind tests would prove quite interesting, but remember serving the high end not only involves offering superior performance, but it involves allowing the owner to have something most others can not afford. Right or wrong, it is a factor.
As a great marketing sage once told me, marketing boils down to one simple phrase -- "Nobody has ugly grandchildren. If you have to think about what that means, you will never get it."
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by LU1YNE on May 5, 2004
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It΄s just a matter of STATUS, don΄t tell me you wouldn΄t prefer 3 FT-1000Ds...
That rig is made for the guys having it to say they have THE IC-7800!...
It΄s just to appear to be the greatest ham ever, even when you don΄t understand what that green, violet & pink icons there in the screen mean!
ED
LU1YNE
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by K7AZN on May 5, 2004
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Some spend that much on bad habits a year, rather have the radio. It is a bargin for state of the Art equipment. And it won't ruin your health.
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by W9RPE on May 5, 2004
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I know what to throw in Icom's face when consider discontinuing ham gear because there is not market. Maybe it was the $10g 7800?
Also I had to comment on this quote from a windy poster on this thread. "Kenwood lost face when they introduced the VCR-like TS-2000, and hasn't regained it since." Just goes to show that even hams are smokin' something. And automobiles ain't been the same since the sleek styling of the model-T went away???
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by KB1KIX on May 5, 2004
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W4TME said exactly what I was thinking.
I got to see it at W1AW. There are some neat features (I like hookin' up a pc monitor to it and such). But.... ten grand is rediculous.
I'm also an audiophile, but I equate quality with my money and I just don't think that applies here for that much cash.
I'll get 2 Icom 756's and have the color screens.
Build a tower
LMR the whole thing
grab a few neat antennas
and I still have a few grand left for shop goodies and fresh tires for the truck!
Jonathan
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by WB2WIK on May 5, 2004
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I think those who made comparisons to cars, boats and other luxuries are on the right track. Many of my neighbors have $70,000 Porsches and such...doesn't mean I'll run right out and buy one, but it's pretty common.
For those who think there's no market for high-ticket items when lower-ticket items will do the job, remember BMW is now outselling Chevrolet, and here in L.A., the margin is wide. And there are more drivers here than anywhere...
My next-door neighbor has a very large and expensive cabin cruiser, which I note is mostly parked in his side pull-through and rarely towed to the beach. Cost *per day* to let it sit there and bake in the sun is probably about $100. So what?
WB2WIK/6
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by WR8D on May 5, 2004
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Guys...all over the country folks have laid down the ten grand just on the "chance" that they would get a 7800. Looks to me the demand has way outdone the supply so far. Yaesu is also coming out with one to compete with icom. Me i'd just like to see kenwood get back into the amateur market. After the 950sdx that little TS-2000 or the 870 just doesn't do anything for me at all. Oh and nope they "ain't" Kidding!!!
73
WR8D
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by W5ONV on May 5, 2004
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When I win the Texas State Lotto, I'm going to buy at least two of them for sure. 73,Jim
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by W5ONV on May 5, 2004
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Do you think that Kenwood and Yaesu will offer a similar radio sometime soon ???
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by N7BUI on May 5, 2004
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I'll bet the new owners won't do the "60 meter mod" on this little jewel. Also I suspect that HRO and AES will be offering "on the spot" easy financing for those of the ham community who don't have a high enough limit on their credit cards.
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by KG6LFN on May 5, 2004
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Does it come with a service manual or is that extra?
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by AH6FC on May 5, 2004
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yep, you're right. This is actually a very interesting discussion series.
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by AF1S on May 5, 2004
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Perhaps I'm missing something?? I'm not aware that Icom is pointing a gun at our heads to buy this radio. If you can't afford it or think it's not worth the money...then don't buy it. My guess is that most that are moaning about the price wouldn't begin to understand the difference between this $11K rig and their IC-718's!! 11,000.00 USD is short money compared to military/commercial spec'ed radios that we buy with our tax dollars everyday. There's a whole world of radio beyond our plastic hammy rigs that cost a thousand dollars. Considering the performance figures that the IC-7800 boasts (and hopefully meets) and the flexibility in the user interface (you know, all those knobs and switches), Icom should be congratulated for exposing amatuer radio to a low priced, low-end, commercial/miltary rig.
It's all relative boys and girls.
73
Bill/AF1S
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by AH6FC on May 5, 2004
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sorry, my comment was directed in reference to WB9NJB's note.
tks
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by K4TBN on May 5, 2004
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For fun, price a Garmin GNS-530 radio. The AM xmtr board only has a max of 16 watts out. It does come with GPS, tho'.
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by K6BBC on May 5, 2004
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Will the receiver make QSOs sound more interesting?
K6BBC
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by AF0H on May 5, 2004
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That's a lot of money for a CW rig. Think i'll stick with my HW-16 ,J-38, and multi-band dipole....
If you can afford it and will use many/all of it's features, then go for it. I just can't see spending that much when 80% of my operations are on cw with a straight-key. (I also have a TS-520 and an IC-735, but like to keep it simple and run the Heathkit - we need to put the HAM back in Ham Radio!)
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by W3ULS on May 5, 2004
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I've got a 25' cuddy cabin with twin outboards that's ten years old. Probably cost close to $200,000 for the boat, slip rentals maintenance, etc., over that period in expenses and foregone income. The boat is terrific in tough going and great fun to run.
I could easily justify springing for the IC-7800--if I sold the boat. But I'll enjoy the boat and wait on the Icom :-)
73,
John, W3ULS
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by N4VOX on May 5, 2004
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This class radio is made for serious contestors. If you don't have five or ten thousand invested in a great antenna system then there is no need asking the price of the radio. I don't own one, probably never will, but wish the ones that buy them the very best. Gill N4VOX
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by K0RFD on May 5, 2004
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KB1KIX wrote:
>But.... ten grand is rediculous.
It's only ridiculous if you think 10 grand is too much but you still actually buy it.
I'm still having trouble understanding exactly why it's a problem for some manufacturer to introduce a radio that some of us can't afford. Hell, there are LOTS of radios *I* can't afford. So I bought one I *could* afford and I have fun with it every night. Am I supposed to get mad at the companies who make radios I can't afford? If I weren't having fun with the radio I actually own, I might have the time to get mad about the ones I don't. But probably not, because that would be a stupid waste of effort.
Not Icom's fault you can't afford a 7800. Get a better job, a less expensive hobby, divorce your wife, sell your house, put your kids up for adoption, or (maybe most important) get more realistic expectations.
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by KT5E on May 5, 2004
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Hey - try something else. Ask AES or the other distributors if they sold any yet. I asked Texas Towers and they had sold 4. I wonder how many units Icom is banking on???
Jay
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by K1CJS on May 5, 2004
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"I think we'll have to wait for the ARRL Labs to test it. If you are a member, you can obtain the more extensive Lab Report."
I think it may be a while before the ARRL labs test this one. Where are they going to get the money to buy it? From the members dues? Could be, but I think you'll find a lot of the members won't like that, with them asking for more contributions lately and saying the dues they collect are falling short of providing the funds needed for basic day to day business.
I would like to see them test and review it, but as I stated, it may take a while before we see it done.
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by AE6IP on May 5, 2004
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Random thoughts:
1) I talked to the local HRO manager yesterday, and asked him how long it would take to get one if I ordered it. Upshot is that they are selling well, but it looks like Icom predicted sales pretty accurately.
2) Buying 4 756 proIIs or 10 TenTecs won't get you a radio that's 4 times better than 756 or 10 times better than a TenTec.
3) all price/performance curves flatten out at the top. There's a reason why an F50 goes for $1M, but the NXS that performs within 90% of the F50 only goes for 90K, and the Honda S2000 that does 50% of the NXS goes for 30K.
4) Y'all should read the Icom "president's statement" about the 7800. It would make clear what ICOM was up to.
Frankly, I think they accomplished it.
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by OBSERVER11 on May 5, 2004
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IT IS A HOBBY RADIO GUYS!
Do not compare to the KWM2A, and FORGET embassy, gov't, use. The Collins gear was not built for hams. I would bet this, the old KMW2A would still be standing and the Icom, Kenwood, Yaesu, would not if they were subjected to the same service.
Lets see how the IC-7800 performs in 2040.
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by WB4QNG on May 5, 2004
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If you have the money go for it. Do I think it is $10,000 better than my IC-718 I doubt it but then again I don't think a new Lincoln is worth $50,000 more than my old Cougar. I will say this if someone wants to trade me even for the 718 I will take it in a minute.
Terry
WB4QNG
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by K8DXX on May 5, 2004
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WB9NJB... That is the best post I've seen on eHam, bar none. I also have wondered what a 'working family' is. It is obvious by our work ethic and attitude, we're not part of that set. A doctor friend told me that many of his patients complain about $15 co-pays.... and in the same breath whine about how much they lost the previous night at the casino! Its time that the the whiners start demonstrating the same tolerance and respect they expect out of thriving capitalists.
I don't imagine many '7800s will be sold in Cuba or North Korea... except maybe to the government elites.
73s and mega dittos to all.
Bill / K8DXX
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by K3NG on May 5, 2004
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Does this rig come with crack, or do you have to supply your own?
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by WA2JJH on May 5, 2004
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Not my cup of tea. However there are those that want to buy the best. Sometimes it is worth the money. Sometimes it is.....""The emporer and new threads routine""
If I were to buy the 7800, I would expect a lot.
Mil spec. contruction for one. Plug in, field replacable modules. It should have a self diagnostic mode like the Harris 1446-U has. I have the Harris 1446. They can be had for $1500. They cost the taxpayers over $12,000 a unit, when they were new(1980's)
I would expect every bug to be worked out. I talked to an OM on 20M. He is on the list. I am going to have a sked, so I can hear one on the air.
Some people spend $30,000 for a watch! That is their business.
I do not think this radio will be a collectable like Collins and some Drakes.
I loved what another poster said.....for that kind of money it should be immune to BPL!
73 MIKE
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by K3BU on May 6, 2004
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Very interesting subject.
If we buy it, they will produce it. Is it worth the money? To some, $10k is "worth" trying. To others, they would wait for true evaluation, tests, specs.
Based on what I have seen in the description and circuit design, I doubt that it will come very close to even Orion in overload performance. Having high first IF and 6 kHz roofing filter, it will have problems meeting the advertised 40 dB at close spacings. Rest of it seems very nice, ergonomics, packaging is nicely done.
Orion has good strong signal handling capabilities (gets little worse with increased spacing), but has ergonomics and packaging that are much to "homebrewy" (see review at www.K3BU.us). Bugs are still coming out of it and this "software modifiable" radio can be only modified by manufacturer.
Seems like manufacturers don't get it, it's one or another thing that is wrong or missing. I got for one tired of fixing and modifying existing radios for contesting grade performance and started design work on "Dream Radio One" that should address most of the problems, be modular, flexible and modifiable by the users. See the design goals at www.computeradio.us - this might be the answer to our dreams about high performance radio at a very reasonable cost.
73 Yuri, K3BU
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by X-WB1AUW on May 6, 2004
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"I think ICOM missed the bulls-eye on this one. Ten thousand bucks is just too much for a radio. At least for us working folks, maybe some doctor or lawyer, but us working folk can't afford that.
I'm shocked..."
Lets see...........
Whose judgement should we trust, yours on ICOMs?
You admit, that you won't buy one, but there might be other people willing to buy one.
So. Who do you think ICOM had in mind when they came out with this rig, you or people who could afford it?
If you can't afford it, or simply won't spend $11K on this rig, and other people do buy it, why should you concern yourself with it?
Why do you care what other people spend?
73
Bob
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by N6AJR on May 6, 2004
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I have enough radios and I don't need another car and This summer I am spending my $ on a 1st class trip to Disneyland , at the disney hotel and all, all paid for in advance.
I have a ts2000, a 746pro, a 756, a ft 840, and a ts570 in the shack, and a ft847 in the pickup, and a 2m/440 in the car. I have up about all the antennas that the city will allow, 3 wires, 2 beams and a rotatable dipole on hf and a set up for ao-40 and some 2 meter 440 stuff so I can't buy much more on antennas.
I will probably not buy the 7800 right away, but maybe later. I am retired and worked long and hard to get here. I had a 5 to 6 pack a day ciggerete habit which I kicked after 38 years, and the $500 to $600 a month I don't spend there funds my radio habit.
I take care of my self , my family and friends, help out other folks when appropriate, and handle what needs to be done. So if I want to play, I can.
Folks it is just money, so if it makes you happy to buy this rig, then have a ball, if not then go get a ft 101EE and enjoy the tubes. Its a hobby, and is there to enjoy.
You can get one if you want , just figure out how..
73 and good DX tom N6AJR
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by N6AJR on May 6, 2004
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I have enough radios and I don't need another car and This summer I am spending my $ on a 1st class trip to Disneyland , at the disney hotel and all, all paid for in advance.
I have a ts2000, a 746pro, a 756, a ft 840, and a ts570 in the shack, and a ft847 in the pickup, and a 2m/440 in the car. I have up about all the antennas that the city will allow, 3 wires, 2 beams and a rotatable dipole on hf and a set up for ao-40 and some 2 meter 440 stuff so I can't buy much more on antennas.
I will probably not buy the 7800 right away, but maybe later. I am retired and worked long and hard to get here. I had a 5 to 6 pack a day ciggerete habit which I kicked after 38 years, and the $500 to $600 a month I don't spend there funds my radio habit.
I take care of my self , my family and friends, help out other folks when appropriate, and handle what needs to be done. So if I want to play, I can.
Folks it is just money, so if it makes you happy to buy this rig, then have a ball, if not then go get a ft 101EE and enjoy the tubes. Its a hobby, and is there to enjoy.
You can get one if you want , just figure out how..
73 and good DX tom N6AJR
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by KE5BAN on May 6, 2004
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After you spend the 10k on the 7800, you still have to buy a radio for 2m and 440. What a deal..
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by KG4PFO on May 6, 2004
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10k for a rig is just plain insane....Period!!
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by N0TONE on May 6, 2004
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K8CPA wrote:
"Not blaming the dealer sir, Blaming the manufacture for marketing a radio that is beyond the reach of the majority of the hams in the USA."
Chuck, without realizing it, you have hit the nail squarely on the head. Icom's whole point was to build a radio that's so expensive, that the only ham who would buy it were the well-heeled hams. It's the exclusive element that buys it, and they don't even care about the specs.
Having no 2 meters on it also makes it exclusive. You don't find wealthy hams on two meters any more.
AM
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by AC7WX on May 6, 2004
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I'll wait for the IC-7800ProIV mark II, season VII, maybe by that time Icom would have fixed all Bugs, they usually have with a new rig!! and I'll only pay $4999.99 not a single penny more, take it or leave ICOM!
73's de Sommer AC7WX /JA6DMH
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by N0MLR on May 6, 2004
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I can't understand why everyone is so surprised at the price of this radio? Can anyone name one thing that is not over priced these days?
I won't but this radio for the same reason I won't buy a new car..... It is much cheaper to drive a used one thats a few years old and let someone else take the beating.
For all those who are buying this radio at the $10,600.00 price try this test. Wait about 6 months and offer the radio for sale used and see what it will bring. Then you will know what its really worth. My guess is the radio will bring maybe $7500 to $9000.00 depending on the buyer.
And please people lets not kid ourselves about the price we have to pay over what the Goverment will pay. Mr. President will pay MUCH less because of Volume discounts and more over buying clout.
I was once told buy a distributor Rep that the Radio I was selling to my customers a Midland vhf 25 watt 2 channel cost them about $35.00 to build and I was selling it for $325.00 and making a whopping $50.00 for my trouble. I suspect the Icom radio costs maybe $400 to $600 to build the rest is the cost of distribution and Blue Sky and a Healthy profit for the manufacturer. The people at HRO probably make a few hundred on the sale of this radio.
Buy used and let someone else take the tail kicking.
Am I a cheap Skate? Yeah but I keep a lot more of MY money that way.
Greg Dunn / N0MLR
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by NI0C on May 6, 2004
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K8DXX wrote: "WB9NJB... That is the best post I've seen on eHam, bar none."
You are easily impressed. And, spare us your "dittos," please. This is a ham radio forum.
KE5BAN wrote: "After you spend the 10k on the 7800, you still have to buy a radio for 2m and 440."
Most serious HF operators are not looking for VHF/UHF combined in their HF rig. Including such capability in the same package with HF is only a very recent gimmick by manufacturers, such as Kenwood with their TS-2000.
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by KT0DD on May 6, 2004
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I Still think Icom's marketing is deceptive. +40 T.O.I figure means nothing without having specs to go with it. I imagine it is measured at 20 KHZ signal spacing.
Real world conditions are more like 5 KHZ signal spacing. I anxiously await the ARRL review to see how bad this +40db T.O.I. crashes under close in conditions. 73.
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by N5IVZ on May 6, 2004
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you still have to connect an antenna to it.. i doubt if icom recommends dipoles and verticals!
too rich for this guy!
fred mann n5ivz, mcallen, texas
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by W3JJH on May 6, 2004
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If I were to buy one, I'd buy in a state without sales tax!
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by G0HIX on May 6, 2004
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I've bought one (managed to grab one even though rarer than rocking horse doo doo) because:
a. The specs looked good; none of the 'major' radio manufacturers have bought out a 'big' rig in the last few years - seems small is beautiful and they don't look worth what was paid
for it - let alone going through successive key pad pushes to obtain the menu you desired.
b. I only have a postage stamp sized garden and can not erect towers/aerials the size of Rugby MSF, so want the best advantage I can have otherwise.
c. Because I work away from home and family (and radio) for 6 months at a time, and want to enjoy the best whilst home - and I can :)
This radio has done EVERYTHING I have wanted so far without question - I have owned another so called 'top of the range' radio AND its more powerful successor - both radios
had inherent problems which were not sorted by the manufacturers leaving mods to be developed and carried out by the users.
Any future enhancements brought about by a firmware upgrade will be a bonus - the ethernet port for example could provide many new and exciting possibilities for
operation/software in the future.
Yes it is expensive and out of the reach of most amateurs, but in my mind worth every penny to me in my situation - I look forward to see what the other 'major' manufacturers
bring out in the future, and may change again. This is my first venture into a radio by ICOM, and so far have been most impressed and pleased.
As other posters have stated - commercial grade gear is NOT cheap, but does the job.
If you want one and can afford it, go for it - but please don't slag it off just because of its price - it is a superb radio, and performs better than a lot of 'commercial/military' I have seen.
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by PY1BR on May 6, 2004
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We (hams) should consider that a transceiver with 2 independents receivers, 3 DSP units and all Bells and Whistles cost 10 thousand bucks.
But we don΄t need to buy it!
Thanks to Icom! At least they still keep on developing new radios with top technology. I hope Yaesu also do it. And Ten-Tec, and so forth....
73
EG - PY1BR
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by KA8UWR on May 6, 2004
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I have a new IC-7800 on order!! does anybody have the MARS mod for this rig yet?? can the "AM" be turned UP?? I plan on using it as a CB,tell me what I sound like on CH-19!!
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by W8KQE on May 6, 2004
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I applaud ICOM for taking the initiative and pushing the 'state of the art' with the IC-7800. Obviously, with a stratospheric price tag as it has, it is not for everyone. Neither is a Porsche 911 Turbo. BUT, you can still get very decent 'high performance' with a much less expensive car... let's say a VW GTI. The 7800 is like the Porsche, and the 756 Pro II, is like the GTI. You're still getting a great, high quality, state of the art, performing HF + 6 rig at a much less cost that should prove more than adequate! Pardon the crude analogy.
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by KA4KOE on May 6, 2004
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Someone said that Kenwood really booted it when they packaged the TS-2000s like a VCR. That is one ugly radio.
Kenwood has yet to produce anything to compete with the 706MKiig, or the Ft-857. Their TS-50S is OLDE technology.
Charles, the 7800 is too big to fit on my desktop unit in my small shack, so its definitely out of the question.
I'm cold....time to throw some more cash in the fireplace.
LA-DI-DAH.
:0
PHILIP
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by KE1MB on May 6, 2004
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Well lets see. It is a new piece of gear so that means it will only lose value and it is still considered to be a consumer product. Is this radio really a $7000 improvement from your 950sdx or 756 pro? Are we sinmply falling the typical game played on american buyers who have to out play the Jones? If you have $10K to spend on a radio why not buy a comercial radio like a Harris? Sure people will buy it. People buy anything.
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by K4CMD on May 6, 2004
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W3JJH ... good point about sales tax! If I were to buy one from HRO Woodbridge, my state's 4.5-percent sales tax would add almost $500 to the price!
$11,000!
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by N0TONE on May 6, 2004
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KA4KOE, Kenwood's TS-480 is intended to compete with the FT-100 and IC-706. The reviews on the rig suggest the receiver performance isn't so good - but then, the RX performance on the TS-2000 is pretty poor and it sells. Also, the 706 and FT-100 have easily-overloaded receivers. But that's OK for their intended, focused-mobil use.
AM
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by KA4KOE on May 6, 2004
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NOTONE
As such, the 480 still lacks 2m and 70cm like its competition, the 706mkiig and 857, which are, as my friend JJH says, "swiss army knife radios".
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by W9YE on May 6, 2004
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The comments from K0RS are right on the money (pun intended). Adjusted for inflation, the 7800 is no more expensive than Collins or Signal One gear was when new, and these rigs managed to find a market somehow. We should all be grateful that the technology which often appears first in high-end radios seems to trickle down pretty quickly to the more modestly priced gear. Am I going to plunk down $11K for the radio? Not any time soon -- but such offerings make me realize how much I like my used Icom 775, found right here on eHam for $9,000 less than a new 7800. More power to Icom!
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by W8COP on May 6, 2004
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I'm sure the marketing team at Icom did their home work on this rig.It will sell well,but if not,I don't think Icom will go belly up.
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by KF6JZC on May 6, 2004
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What hapened to the idea for both stereo systems and radios about the fact that the weakest link in a stereo was the speakers and in radio was the antenna? A $10000 radio still won't perform well if it is connected to a lousy antenna but a $500 radio would perform extreamly well if connected to a great antenna. The same goes for stereos. Paying a high price is just status. Most people can't tell the difference in the sound between a tube stereo amlifier and a solid state amplifier. Also, I doubt if most hams have the expertise to even use the ICOM radio to its fullest anyway.
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by VE3QAC on May 6, 2004
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God Bless all those poor YUPPIES out there, who work 84 hours a week to buy all those IC-7800's, BMW's and pay those high income taxes so I can stay home and enjoy there used toys at half price when they go and buy the next latest model.
THANK YOU YUPPIES!!
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by KD6NXI on May 6, 2004
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Obviously targeted at insanely rich fat cats who have nothing better to do with their not so hard earned dough.
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by KE4KVW on May 6, 2004
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Well lets see! It after all is NOT JUST an ICOM after all but it is really TWO ICOMS in one BIG PRETTY box with lots of PRETTY lights and BELLS and WHISTLES! I wanted TWO ICOMS in the same box ever since I bought my FIRST ICOM 10 years ago.It is NOT for everyone(IC-7800) but just for some so if you are blessed with getting one "ENJOY"it and if not just sit back and "DROOL" because a couple of years from now you can buy one USED and it will still be a "NEW" radio for you! I like it even better having THREE ICOMS in ONE box with my ICOM 746 (HF,6 meters & 2 meters all at 100 watts) what a DEAL! Grown up TOYS cost grown up prices! It is just making the other companies get off the pot and build someting better than what they are offering now so it is a GOOD thing for US!It can ONLY get BETTER!73's & God bless,ClaytonKE4KVW
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by KZ0ZZ on May 6, 2004
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I am considering one as a back-up radio to my Drake TR-3.
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by K0EJF on May 6, 2004
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Icom has no intention of marketing this radio to "The majority of AVERAGE hams". Just like General Motors, the maker of Chevys has no intention of marketing the Hummer to the average car driver. I just wish I could afford one!
73 de Jerry, KΨEJF
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by KT0DD on May 6, 2004
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NOTONE Wrote:
>Kenwood's TS-480 is intended to compete with the FT-100 and IC-706. The reviews on the rig suggest the receiver performance isn't so good
Don't know which review you read, The QST review shows much better Third order intercept at 20 khz for the TS480 than the 706. They didn't test the 706 at 5khz, so I cannot compare those numbers. Also the TS480 seems to be getting mostly great reviews on here.
73.
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by KT0DD on May 6, 2004
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NOTONE Wrote:
>Kenwood's TS-480 is intended to compete with the FT-100 and IC-706. The reviews on the rig suggest the receiver performance isn't so good
Don't know which review you read, The QST review shows much better Third order intercept at 20 khz for the TS480 than the 706. They didn't test the 706 at 5khz, so I cannot compare those numbers. Also the TS480 seems to be getting mostly great reviews on here.
73.
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by KE2IV on May 6, 2004
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It's like this:
You can drive a Hyundai.
Or you can drive a Lexus.
Or you can drive a Porsche.
Or you can drive a Ferrari.
Each will transport you from point A to point B.
Just like ham rigs will enable you to "communicate".
How much do you want to pay - and how good a ride do you want?
Oh, or you could stick a CA kilowatt in the attic and blast through everything - - isn't that what 2-ton SUV/Pickups are for?
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by VE3QAC on May 6, 2004
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God Bless all the poor YUPPIES who will buy this IC-7800 and I will buy it from them for the fraction of what they paid for it when Icom puts out the next model.
Thanks to all the YUPPIES who work 84 hours a week to buy this stuff and the new BMW's etc, just to pay higher income taxes so people like myself can sit at home and enjoy this great stuff! Keep working hard YUPPIES and race to work every day!!!
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by AB5XZ on May 6, 2004
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I want to know who the ham is who gets the first IC-7800 in my neighborhood. Then I will become his/her Best Friend and Elmer.
73Tom
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by WP3HW on May 6, 2004
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Kidding?, probably not. This will never become a volume selling item like typical consumer electronics products. Development, tooling, setting up production facilities, product launching, marketing, are all costs which must be amortized with the net income generated by the units sold.
By the way this transceiver is the best there is today and as well stated by others in this forum probably a bargain when compared to 1950's amateur equipment when adjusted for inflation; and did the units then have the specs and features of this Icom IC-7800?
Man has always strived to push the envelope, built pyramids, crossed unfanthomed oceans to "discover" "new" lands, build higher, climb higher, fly faster, reach the moon, we get the idea.
This looks to me as such an achievement, obviously in a specialized field and in a smaller scale. Going where no one has gone before involves risk and is always costly. If Icom can make money with this effort, hats off to them, though I would tend to doubt that they will, but the ham community will benefit from it.
I can't purchase one now, but sure wish I could...
73 to all
Pepe WP3HW
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by KC2MIB on May 6, 2004
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I echo the comments made by K0RS. Obviously these guys dont realize the concept of cooperate business. Companies must have a benchmark product to represent their organization and the IC-9800 is the way ICOM intends to go. ICOM beat YAESU to the punch with this bold marketing scheme. Coming off the canvas, YAESU has to compromise their efforts by lowering their introductory price, which might eventually work out better for the regular Janes and Joes. If you really are taken aback by the price tag on any product you see then it was not priced for you (Gomen nesai).
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by W5EEX on May 6, 2004
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It is ridiculous.....besides...when BPL gets a foothold, it will be worth about $25 dollars like
all the rest of our nice gear....I'd like to see the looks on the faces those that paid $10K for a radio then. I can buy some stocks or bonds for $10K and not have them lose that much value.
73
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by AB5Q on May 6, 2004
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I really enjoyed reading the variety of comments that discuss price, performance and make historical comparisons. Many think that $10,000 is a lot of money for a frivolous item. All I can say is take a look at your auto loan, mortgage and credit card interest. How do you feel about handing over hard-earned cash to some stranger for the privilege of borrowing money? Which do you think is more frivolous, $10,000 for something substantive (IC-7800) or taking $10,000 in cash and lighting it on fire (loan interest)?
Thanks Icom for taking the time to offer this technological marvel to Amateurs. Interesting radio but it is definitely not my style. I really cant get excited about it whether it costs $1,000 or $10,000. Please someone give me a reason to get excited about this radio! Theres several very impressive choices in the sub $5,000.00 class that I have yet to try.
On a final note, I hope that those who purchase the radio have enough common sense to purchase a really good lightning arrestor. Can you picture those ultra-sensitive, high performance electronic circuits getting vaporized in a few microseconds by a stroke of bad luck? Ouch!
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by N0VUB on May 7, 2004
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Wonder if they will let you make "interest-free payments until May of 2005...." "That's right folks 0% interest financing on an Icom 7800 with all the standard options...." Ought to fit well with that new Hummer.
That does seem like alot of $$ for a radio that hasn't really been tested by a number of users. My 718 works just fine, don't need all the bells and whistles. I even fire up the old Heath Kit SB104A and it works just fine too!
73
Mark N0VUB
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by N7MYW on May 7, 2004
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I'm suprised at the marketing team for Icom.Is this radio really going to "hear" better at the low end of the sunspot cycle??You'd think that they might have waited a few more years.
Or maybe looked at the US economy and waited until a little bit more of a recovery.
Economically it seems to have been a foolish time to bring out such an expesive model.
In 2010 they would most likely sell better.
Propagation will be better,hopefully the economy the same and more people MIGHT be able to afford such a purchase.
Even though all things are relative,reality brings more people back down to Earth.
N7MYW
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by AE6IP on May 7, 2004
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> All I can say is take a look at your auto loan,
Don't have one. Always pay cash for cars.
> mortgage
Don't have one. Paid the house off in 5 years.
> and credit card interest.
Don't pay any. Credit cards always get paid off at the end of the month.
> How do you feel about handing over hard-earned cash
> to some stranger for the privilege of borrowing
> money?
Don't do it. Only loan I've had (my mortgage) was through my credit union, and I know the folks there.
Now if I only had a job.
73
Marty
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by K4CMD on May 7, 2004
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Okay, okay. I understand the Ferrari vs. Hyundai thing. Variety is the spice of life, and the IC-7800 is the Ferrari of HF rigs.
One thing really does make me wonder though ...
The number of hams who already have put deposits down on this radio or actually have bought one.
The caliber of ham who buys a radio like this has probably been in the hobby long enough to know the general "mid-beta-testing" condition many, if not most, high-end radios are in when they hit the market, and usually for at least a year or two after that.
Continuing in the ever-popular automotive vein, have you ever heard the adage about waiting a year or so after a brand-new car model comes out, to let the manufacturer get through all the initial recalls, TSBs, and general bug-solving?
I do wonder why so many hams have outlayed this amount of money -- which, let's face it -- isn't a "drop in the bucket" for anyone really -- for a radio that (knowing Icom's track record of late, c'mon, be honest) will probably be spending a few weeks of its first year in its box on a UPS truck going back to Bellevue at least once.
It does seem a little impulsive to be ordering a radio, sight unseen and not reviewed by anyone, just because it's glitzy and has a high price tag. "First on the block" syndrome seems to be doing just fine. High price or not, it seems emotions -- not careful research -- are driving this car.
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by K4CMD on May 7, 2004
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Marty, I wish we could all be just like you.
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by N0MLR on May 7, 2004
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Everyone can be just like Marty and I. Go to www.daveramsey.com and follow his advice. Most of it is free on his site by way of his archived radio programs. All you have to do is click and listen. If you like what you hear too can be debt free. It worked for me and several of my friends.
And No I don't work for him and have nothing to gain from posting his web site.
Take a listen it will change your life.
Credit Wreaks!
Greg Dunn / N0MLR
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by WA4BWO on May 7, 2004
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OK... When Kenwood releases an $11,000 radio, then I'll buy one! I'm still suprised when I hear comments that my Kwd sounds like an Icom. I'm sure when Kwd releases a Collins equiv. (a Ferrarri of radios so to speak) I'll have the same opinion... It operates and sounds just like a 7800. D
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by KB2FCV on May 7, 2004
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I am glad to see that Icom has brought out a new "super" radio. I don't see any reason for people to have a problem with icom bringing out a radio they can't afford. Sure, I can't afford a 7800, nor can I afford a Ferrari. I do like them both! I would love to get behind the wheel of a Ferrari just as much as I would love to sit down and operate a 7800. I'll probably have to go to ARRL headquarters to try it out, that's where I had my one and only operating experience with the IC-781 years back. I loved working the 781 and I'm sure I would love operating the IC-7800.
There are some of us who can afford the 7800, and there are some of us who can't. That's just the way it is. I think people should quit their whining. $11,000 is on the low end for a military or commercial radio. Kudos to Icom for bringing this radio out!
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by K7VO on May 7, 2004
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KE2IV: I drive a 2001 Hyundai Elantra with 85,000 miles on it so far. It still rides super smooth, as in like new. The car is reliable, economical to run, and just plain nice.
Yes, some people can buy a Ferrari. I can't and I honestly don't see what it would do for me that my Hyundai won't do. I am not interested in status symbols or handling at 100+ MPH. I'm very happy with my Hyundai, thankyouverymuch.
I'm also very happy with my TS-430V (QRP version of the TS-430S) which cost me all of $250 on the used market. I also am still happy with my TS-660.
I suspect most hams who buy the IC-7800 are buying a status symbol and bragging rights. More power to them, but don't expect me to be impressed. I'm not impressed by Ferraris either.
73,
Caity
K7VO/4
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by K7VO on May 7, 2004
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W5EEX: BPL won't kill ham radio. Even if the FCC decides to ignore interference complaints there is no guarantee BPL will succeed in the marketplace. Even if it does not all BPL installations wipe out all the ham bands. The test site south of Raleigh does a number on 10, 12, and 40 meters. The other HF bands seem mostly clear.
Finally, let's say that in some areas 2-80MHz really are wiped out. Ever hear of 160m? 2m SSB/CW? 70cm SSB/CW? All would still be alive and well. Yes, we'd probably lose 50% of the ham community who are too set in their ways to try new bands and/or modes. The hobby will survive, and I suspect my equipment will be worth more than $25.
73,
Caity
K7VO/4
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by K4CMD on May 7, 2004
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Caity ... you won't find me giving up my HF bands that easily! This is war! Gimme a 7800, a kilowatt and a nice zepp antenna 10 feet from and parallel to any BPL-induced power line that shows up in my neighborhood -- I'll give new meaning to the term "transmission line"!!!
Oh, but seriously Riley, I was just trying to work some 160-meter DX ...
Meade
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by W5PVR on May 7, 2004
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10.6k for a Transceiver, seems a little pricey. Can I afford one?. Yes, will I buy one?. No, why no?. That much money would buy a good Municipal Bond and 600 bucks worth of beer.
73.
Bob
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by NN6EE on May 7, 2004
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To the Guy in the Ukraine: A lot of goods in your country are EXPENSIVE, except maybe Vodka!!! Items that are IMPORTED are extremely expensive as well, so what's your problem???
To Everybody else: I'd say a fair price for the IC-7800
would be TWICE the price of a IC-756PRO 2 ($4600)or there about. I agree that their asking price is an utter JOKE!!!
Jim/ee
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by KF9QA on May 7, 2004
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Boy there are alot of BITTER bastards in ham radio. Get a Fricken life and go to work.
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by N6KD on May 7, 2004
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When I was growing up, a new Collins S Line cost about $10,000 - this was when that amount of money would buy a nice new house - at least where I lived in Iowa. Ham Radio equipment has been available at bargain prices for the last 20 years or so. I don't believe it is an unreasonable price.
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by AB0SF on May 7, 2004
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This coming from a group of people who generally has a tough time pulling $5 from his/her wallets to get through the door at a hamfest, and is shocked when a $250 HT doesn't offer commercial/military performance, this is no surprise.
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by K5TH on May 7, 2004
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If you have to ask how much it costs, you can't afford it.
K5TH
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by AI3W on May 7, 2004
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A couple of things:
/sarcasm
1. I bet you'll NEVER hear "My rig is an IC7800, my antenna is a slinky dipole..."
2. Ooooh, that's rare DX station, so he speaks into the mic "This is K5SOB, using an IC7800, IC7800" K And then the pileup goes silent in reverent awe of the 'almighty rig' and allows the honor of making a contact with a 7800.
3. I highly doubt that the IC7800 operator will have transcended the airwaves and get 100% returns on all QSL's with all 5/9 reports.
4. It will probably take the new owner 5 years to read the manual from cover to cover.
5. Wondering if Icom will automatically include the WAS, WAZ, DXCC, 5BWAS, 5BDXCC, VUCC and other pretegious awards to the recipient?
/sacasm off
73 DE AI3W, Rick
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by AD7DB on May 7, 2004
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It's a nice looking radio, but it's too expensive for me, and I just don't see how it's worth that kind of money.
You can plow a field with an Indy race car. You can enter a farm tractor in the Indy 500. (I'd like to see someone fake up a picture of them doing this!) Although both vehicles can probably do those respective jobs, they won't do a GOOD job. They are specialized for what they ARE good at doing.
This radio is for status seekers with money to burn.
I'm frugal.
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by K4AXX on May 7, 2004
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Hmmmm. Let me think.
1970s. Hallicrafter Hurricane 2000. $3000.00. Decent brand new car, $3000.00
2004. Icom-7800, 10,600.00. Brand new decent car, $16,000.
Sounds like a bargain to me. Think I'll get me 2 of em'.
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by K1CJS on May 7, 2004
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There is not a new radio around now thats worth even $5,000., let alone $10,000. Dual this, dual that, sure, you've got two ears, but only one brain. This radio is nothing but a glorified status symbol. I do like Icom gear, but this offering is rediculous.
If they want to do something for hams, let em put out a version without the dual everything under the sun.
I want to know how many get returned to the factory for some sort of failure--I'll bet its no better (the failure rate) than the other high end sets Icom has produced.
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by N0FP on May 7, 2004
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$50 says ICOM will price it the same as Yaesu's new rice burner--within a year. (OK within 1/2 day's pay)
Another $50 says ICOM will show their stuff with the new $10K rig and then strip some goodies, use the same enclosure, and sell a bazzillion of them at $4K.
Time will tell who is the bigger fool in all of this high end stuff. Do I want one? Of course. Would I buy a lottery ticket at a hamfest to win one? Probably so. Will I write a $10.6K check to see the UPS driver real soon? Nope!
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by NA1A on May 8, 2004
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FYI: There is only about 400 units available for the whole USA and a little over 1,000 units available for the rest of the world. All the ones for available for the US are SOLD OUT!
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by AE6IP on May 8, 2004
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> Yes, some people can buy a Ferrari. I can't and I
> honestly don't see what it would do for me that my
> Hyundai won't do.
Probably nothing. You gotta be a driver to deal with a Ferrari.
> I am not interested in status symbols or handling at
> 100+ MPH. I'm very happy with my Hyundai,
> thankyouverymuch.
Actually, Ferraris are a lot more fun when you're handling them at 50 on roads most cars would only do 30 on.
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by AE6IP on May 8, 2004
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> Marty, I wish we could all be just like you.
Nothing hard about it. Be born into a poor family. Pay attention to economics. Never spend more than you earn.
Oh. and do what you love. the money will follow.
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by N9FIK on May 8, 2004
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"This radio is for status seekers with money to burn."
Give it a few moments thought. Recall the some of the other threads around internet that generate volumes of commentary in our community and I bet there is a link between them.
For example, as the hobby becomes populated by less technically inclined persons, there will be less of an emphasis by manufacturers on incremental performance for the next gen rig and more on eye candy and status.
As noted by many in this and other similar threads, the 7800 isn't going to give you 3x the performance of an Orion, especially for CW ops and it will not be "worth" 5 ProIIs.
Another issues is the demographics of the population as a whole. The baby boomers are in their mid 50's and have lots of disposable income as a group. Why not offer them the "Collins" (or some attempt at it) of their generation at a point in their lives when they can part with that type of coin?
You can bet they are working on the IC-3900 (half the number -- half the price) or some such rig that will be based on the same platform to capture the "me too" market.
--
Anyhow for a $10,600 rig, they sure created $1,000,000 in publicity...
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by KA4KOE on May 8, 2004
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Yep, notice the latest Dayton ad in QST...they're even using SEX to try and sell these things!!
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7800 vs Orion
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by KA4KOE on May 8, 2004
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Forgot....can't wait to read the real world tests between these two. If its only marginally better there's going to be a lot of upset people.
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by KA8UWR on May 8, 2004
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Received my IC-7800 yesterday,stayed up all night!! wwhat a machine,now forr all you "Wanabees" and price hawks,how do those Sour Grapes taste!!
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by N4CC on May 8, 2004
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I don't think money will REALLY be the factor that determines who will end up owning a IC-7800. There are many levels of interest in ham radio. You can enjoy ragchewing with a IC-718 and a dipole. You can work DX with an IC-718 and a dipole...but after you do that for awhile, you start to think..."gee if I only had a beam and tower..." so pretty soon you have a IC-718 and a tribander at 50 feet. For some the interest in going farther ends. For others, it becomes "gee, if I had an amplifier..." For some the interest ends there...For others it becomes "gee if I put monobanders up and had a 100 foot tower..." Every step of the way you improve your station capability by a little bit more but the amount of improvement that you get starts to become less and less in return for the investment that you put into it.
When you have multiple towers with multiple antennas and feed all your antennas with 7/8" hardline and have a room full of radios and contesting/dxing is a prime interest or if you're trying to figure out ways to be able to hear weak signals on 160 meters that "average stations" can't copy or etc., then doing whatever it takes to get "the best" may become a goal -- regardless of personal wealth. I say that because anyone reading this has spent $10K for a car or whatever so $10K is not really beyond the reach of anyone who "wants it bad enough". It is only a bad thing to spend it on a radio -- in my opinion -- if you ignore the obligations and priorities that should come before a hobby. It may take some longer than others. And, for some spending that much on a radio will never be a priority because the marginal gain to them is not there...but that doesn't make it "ridiculous" for others.
I bought a Signal/One CX-11A back when they were considered the "ultimate radio". Frankly I was disappointed, and it taught me a lesson. The jury is still out for me on the 7800. Just because it costs the most money doesn't necessarily make it the best radio. I want to wait to see what serious users think of them -- not just "whoever can afford one" but people who have reputations as the top operators. If the verdict is good, then I'll consider if/when I can afford to spend the money for the radio. One thing I'll say, though...I'm glad the manufacturers are trying to raise the bar and give us something to dream about -- whether or not we ever decide to own one.
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by N9FIK on May 8, 2004
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"Received my IC-7800 yesterday,stayed up all night!! wwhat a machine,now forr all you "Wanabees" and price hawks,how do those Sour Grapes taste!! "
It would be great if you post a review after you put it through its paces for a while.
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by M0HDX on May 8, 2004
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If you can afford a icom 7800 or fancy buying one on the never never then why not go out and buy one...you only pass through here once and your gone a long long time.. oh i nearly forgot! you cannot take all that money in the bank or tucked up under the matress with you either, go spend it before the xyl does and treat yourself to a new ic 7800.
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by KD8K on May 8, 2004
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"Kenwood lost face when they introduced the VCR-like TS-2000, and hasn't regained it since."
To me, thats an interesting comment, because I have always thought that the newer ICOMS look like old portable TV Sets. I personally prefer the VCR look!...
Actually I think Kenwoods's lack of an entry into the superradio wars now going on between ICOM and Yaesu may not be so much a lack of understanding of what "face" is but may well be a sound marketing strategy on their part. While Yaesu and ICOM are spending a lot of money producing these super radios, Kenwood is selling a lot TS-2000's to the mainstream amateur radio operator who don't have a lot of interest in seeing how close they can operate to a strong signal, but would rather enjoy the extra features. All radios have there advantages and disadvantages, including price, and its nice to have a variety to choose from.
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by MM0XAU on May 8, 2004
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1996 bought a TEN-TEC OMNI VI for....? (- forgot it) and in 8 years made 80000 QSOs....about 2 or 3 cents for a contact. So guys, buy a IC7800 AND USE IT !!
100000 contacts in 10 years is 10 cents per contact -- so what ?
C U on the bands !
Hans MM0XAU (SHETLAND)
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by W4VR on May 8, 2004
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I haven't heard a 7800 that sounded good. The transmit audio has no oomph or brilliance; in fact I've heard better-sounding IC-718's. I think I'll keep my trusty PRO2, and perhaps take a look at the new Yaesu when they get the bugs out of it next year.
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by K0RFD on May 8, 2004
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AI3W Wrote:
>1. I bet you'll NEVER hear "My rig is an IC7800, my
>antenna is a slinky dipole..."
Hahahaha, I had been thinking about the same thing, only I was thinking "Wonder how many guys are gonna plug one into a G5RV?"
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by K9HCK on May 8, 2004
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After reading all the posts on this thread I am really ticked off. How dare Icom build a radio I cant afford. Also Sony makes a LCD tv I cant afford either, so I guess I will be outraged at them too. Some hams should get a life. Its only HAM Radio.
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by VE3GFW on May 8, 2004
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I saw the first one in action at HRO San Diego the first day it came in. It was substantially quieter than the IC-756ProII beside it, had much longer ears and and according to people on the air sounded much better as well. They sold 3 during the half hour I was there and frankly I am considering swapping my ProII for a 7800. It really is that much better!!
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by K1CJS on May 8, 2004
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"While Yaesu and ICOM are spending a lot of money producing these super radios, Kenwood is selling a lot TS-2000's....."
I've heard the TS-2000 is sold out and the production run has ended. Maybe Kenwood is coming out with an improved version TS-2000, or maybe they're also gearing up to get in on the high price war.
Also, all you who say things about the outrage of some on this thread are way off base. Its not the idea of producing a radio that is priced so high only some people can afford it, its the idea of the big three thinking all of us hams are so naive that we actually think the radio is worth that much. Oh, wait, someone said all the units destined for the US are sold already. Maybe some of us are that naive.......
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by KE6I on May 9, 2004
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>After reading all the posts on this thread I am really
>ticked off. How dare Icom build a radio I cant afford.
>Also Sony makes a LCD tv I cant afford either, so I
>guess I will be outraged at them too. Some hams should
>get a life. Its only HAM Radio.
Yeah, me I'm still angry at Ocean Alexander for making yachts I can't afford -- how dare they! Those basards.
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by WA6FFV on May 9, 2004
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The same damm fool who would pay 10 graqnd ++ for a home entertainment system.I hope it does'nt go obsoletr before the check clears or the credit card is payed off.I'd like to see what this rig woukd be worth in the flea markets or swap meets 5or6 years from now.
I was taken to task in a e-ham forum when I wrote"Ham radio is a pit into which one pours money".I guess I was right.
WA6FFV AL
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by KD5NOI on May 9, 2004
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And you Think that the whole code Issue is keeping new blood out of the hobby
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by KO9R on May 9, 2004
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One Queston,
How many of you WANT this radio, even though it price dictates otherwise?
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by W5ONV on May 9, 2004
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I would love to have a 7800 if I could afford it.
If I won a lotto or acquired a large sum of money
I would buy one for sure. I like big toys like that.
But, am I going to buy one ? No ! 73,Jim
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by W1RG on May 9, 2004
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Remember the IC-781?? Still sought after. They came on the market in the ealy '80s for $6000... The price of a cheap automobile at that time. And they sold. They were still selling only a year ago..
The IC7800 is to todays rigs what the IC781 was to rigs in the early '80s. For the price of a cheap automobile...
Since I wish to leave an estate more useful to my progeny, I'll probably not opt for the 7800. But it sure would go well in my shack..
All the best
Gil, W1RG
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by K3SRO on May 9, 2004
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The developement of the expensive ICOM 7800 is a good thing for amateur radio and commercial/government application. It will eventually lead to a less expensive version of the IC-7800 with similar features and technology. It shows ICOM's strong committment to amateur radio unlike the folks at Kenwood Communications. We are all fortunate that Yaesu and Ten Tec also share ICOM's committment to the hobby.
If history repeats itself as with the IC-781 leading the way to the developement of the ICOM 756 series of radios, we should see the introduction of an ICOM 756 PROIII or ICOM 7801 sometime soon.
It still amazes me that a $10,599+ transceiver still does not include the 2 meter band as did the 746 series of radios. The failure to include 2 meters in the design of the 756 series of radios was also a big oversight by ICOM.
Let's keep our fingers crossed for a $3,500 to $4,500 version of the 7800. I love my ICOM 746 and 756 PROII. I also enjoy the Yaesu FT-1000MP MKV Field, Elecraft K2, Drake C-Line and Ten Tec OMNI VI+. In my opinion, these radios are the best in our wonderful hobby.
In closing, I think we all need to concentrate on how each one of us can help promote amateur radio to our younger generation. If our numbers continue to dwindle, if the government continues to take away our bands, if we don't hold ourselves to the highest standards of operating techniques and practices while on the air, our hobby will eventually disappear.
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by WA6FFV on May 9, 2004
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Guess what ham gear is usuall not type accepted for military or commercial use.You can get Ten-Tec to build you one to your specs for the same price.
wa6ffv
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by OLDTIMER80 on May 9, 2004
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I love my Icom 7800! It is much lower in price compared to the buying power of a dollar than my Hallicrafters SX-101A and HT-32B were many years ago. There were whiners then too. You do what you can afford to do and enjoy it. Whether you have a used $50.00 radio or a brand new $10,000.00 radio you can operate with class and have fun!! Some of the best operators out there have old Kenwood 520's and know how to use them. Remember, this is a hobby and it is supposed to be fun!
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by WA6FFV on May 9, 2004
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I'd like to see what this rig brings at the flea markets and swap meets in a a few years.
The key word here is COMPETITION.In the "old days" we had companies like Hallicrafters,Collins,Drake to name a few off the top of my head.The CB community prizes the Swans because it had 11 meters on the band switch
I suppose one could get a high from knowing you could afford a 10 grand++ rig but a fool and his money are soon parted.
<ONLY IN AMERICA>
WA6FFV
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by N5BEW on May 9, 2004
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If you don't like the price don't buy it. No one is putting a gun to your head telling you to buy it or else.
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by KH7M on May 9, 2004
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Well, there are several homes in California in which
are installed electronic theatre organs, that are
selling for well over $100,000! These produce "high
end" theatre pipe organ music via actual digital tone
samples of ALL the pipes, that were installed in
George Wright's home in North Hollywood before his
death in the Spring of 1998. Built by the Allen Organ
Co., their model GW-IV; you can see it at:
http://www.allenorgan.com/www/products/gwiv/gwiv.asp .
And, you really don't even have to know how to play
it, though I am sure most owners can. It will play
back actual performances by professional TPO players,
different technology, but similar to player pianos.
And, this Memorial Weekend, Allen is introducing
in Atlanta a new 5-manual instrument which will
probably be priced over $200K, and they have
orders already!!
So how is that for hobby/special interest spending?
And, you cannot drive it anywhere, but sure can
communicate emotion!
BTW, still enjoying my expensive Ten Tec Orion, hi.
73, Jim Reid, KH7M
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by N2JF on May 9, 2004
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W1XZ-----YOUR COMMENTS ARE PRICELESS!!!!! YOU WIN, HANDS DOWN.
CONGRATS.
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by KC0LTV on May 9, 2004
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I really don't understand the outcry over this rig. It's been a while since one of the "big four" has had a truly όberclass radio. While I'm sure some will buy it for status, there are other better motives out there for buying a high-performance, feature-packed radio. This radio includes a lot of features formerly not found on the ham radio market - a S/PDIF output for digital modes, Compact Flash slot, built-in PSK31 operation, etc. While you may decry the large display as being "eye-candy", it can also be useful - your status, info, etc. right on the screen, or a nice full-sized spectrum display. I'd be willing to be that this radio has excellent professional applications as well. There is a wide selection of good, reasonably priced equipment out there as well. Again, I don't quite see why everybody's complaining. The radio will probably fall by $3,000 or $4,000 in two or three years anyway.
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by PY1BR on May 10, 2004
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We have to think about radio concept innovations instead of how much it costs and the color of the screen...
First: Preselector - with this feature the receiver front end is limited to the tuned band and not wide open as most of the modern radios. A 60's radio will never work so well without a Preselector. Now we re-use Preselector together with today's technology (better mixers etc ) is even better.
Second: Double conversion - it's great because the signal path is shortened and very close to the original detected one. The todays mixers and other components allow two conversions instead of 3 or 4 where the signal travels with the risk of more distortion etc.
That's what I am interested in this new radio. New concepts and architecture. Of course sometime Icom will launch a cheaper rig with all these new concepts without so many knobs, double receiver, interfaces, big screens, wireless microphone, cold water and so forth...
73
EG
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ABC brings back "The Millionaire"!
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by AD7DB on May 10, 2004
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This fall on ABC, the return of a classic!
An anonymous rich eccentric millionaire buys brand new hams their own IC-7800, just to see what they'll do with it!
Check your local listings! 9:00 Pacific, 8:00 Central!
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by KI6YN on May 10, 2004
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They can charge whatever they want. Compare the specifications, and more importantly, how the specifications were measured. The Orion is a better radio and certainly much easier to operate. No one needs all that fancy crapola. Icom is only catering to those that want bragging rights; seems there are those that can't get satisfaction from making things, designing, or being creative, but they get satisfaction from having a big checkbook. That is fine with me; I'll keep on trucking with my Orion, Omni 6+, Argo V for travel, and soon an old TR7! This hobby is great because there is something for everyone, now there is a radio worth of Midas as well.
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by WA3KYY on May 10, 2004
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K3SRO wrote:
"It still amazes me that a $10,599+ transceiver still does not include the 2 meter band as did the 746 series of radios. The failure to include 2 meters in the design of the 756 series of radios was also a big oversight by ICOM."
Not including 2M and above is one of the major reasons the receive specs are so good compared to the 746 and other radios which do include VHF. The broadband RF amps used in the receiver front end to provide this coverage simply can't compare to the HF only front ends. Look at the receive specs on almost any upper end radio that stops at 30 or 50 MHz compared to those that go up to 2M or beyond. While they could have done it with a low noise converter, they would need two and a seperate transmitter chain to maintain the specs they were aiming for. That would have made the radio both bigger and more expensive than it already is.
The wide coverage radios come at a cost in performance. Even the HF only rigs with 100kHz-30MHz receive coverage do not perform as well as the ham band only rigs sich as the Elecraft K2.
Mike WA3KYY
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RE: 7800 vs Orion
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by WA6BPE on May 10, 2004
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>>Forgot....can't wait to read the real world tests between these two. If its only marginally better there's going to be a lot of upset people.<<<
It would probably be a surprise if it is better than the Orion. Without roofing filters down to small bandwidths there is nothing to protect RX performance from loud signals, no matter how good it is at wide spacing tests like 20 kHz. Plus they are using the Rohde & Schwarz auto-attenuation AGC circuit as featured in QEX magazine last year, which automatically throws attenuation in to maintain third order intercept numbers in the presence of loud signals, at the expense of rx sensitivity. Net effect is that you won't hear weak ones if there is a loud signal underneath the roofing filter. I am sure the ARRL Lab will figure out a way to test sensitivity under strong signal conditions to show what this does.
Is "at least as good as Orion" good enough for a radio that costs 3x as much? I don't know.
Hey, performance is not everything. An $11,000 HF rig is a "bragging rights" radio just like a Ferrari is for cars. And everyone knows a '72 Chevelle with a supercharged 350 engine is going to out race the Ferrari every time at 1/10th the price. It all depends on what's important to you.
No, I don't own an Orion and I'm not buying an IC7800 either.
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by K8CPA on May 10, 2004
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Wow... I am amazed at all the comments.
Just so you'll know folks. I wasn't intending to start a war or anything... I just was expressing my shock on the price of the rig. that's all.
I'm sure the rig is great. But not for my shack. I'll stick to my years old, TS-950SDX Kenwood, it works for the kind of Operating I do. I will admit it, I happened to be in the right place at the right time, when I got the rig. and I only paid $1500.00 for the rig... got it used. Second Owner of the radio. I'm a bit of a DX Hound and rag chewer, and every now and again, I get the CW bug and I'll make a few QSO's with the ol' Bencher BY-1. Do I have an antenna farm? Nope, Just a ol' Van Gordon Shorty all bander Dipole at 40ft... Stood off a 40ft steel TV Tower, that I've owned for years... works for what I do.
As for the important things in life??? Well, seeing I just filed for Chapter 7 Backruptcy, Things have changed for me, I've gotten back to the basic things in the life, the important things, like your health, peace of mind, Having a Relationship with Jesus Christ, Finding a job, doing the PROPER THING in reguards to Tithing to the Church, I admit it, I made mistakes in my Past, I cannot change that, I can only fix the mistakes and make a better future for myself, I also feel being a responsible person is also important, and this is why, I hope to get married, start a family and raise Children and teach them the things of the Lord and raise them as Loving Christian people.
One thing I've learned, "stuff" can never make one happy.. Only Jesus can do this.
God Bless Everyone...
-Chuck Adkins K8CPA
Lincoln Park, Michigan
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by K7FD on May 10, 2004
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I feel the power! Amen Brother...now is the time to give to the Church of Icom...
K7FD
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by K8CPA on May 11, 2004
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>by K7FD on May 10, 2004
>I feel the power! Amen Brother...now is the time to >give to the Church of Icom...
OM, your smart comments reguarding my personal convictions are not only not needed, nor are they liked. if you don't like what you read, kindly "Spin the knob" if you will...
>K7FD
73 es CUL
-Chuck K8CPA
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by K6BBC on May 11, 2004
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WOW - that all came out of left field.
Well, just to throw in my 2 cents. I never paid more than $650 for any radio. Apple computers, now that's another story.
K6BBC
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RE: 7800 vs Orion
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by AE6IP on May 11, 2004
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> And everyone knows a '72 Chevelle with a
> supercharged 350 engine is going to out race the
> Ferrari every time at 1/10th the price.
Thanks, OM. That's the funniest thing I've read on eHam.
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RE: 7800 vs Orion
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by M3FVM on May 11, 2004
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Here in the UK, the rig sells for a cool £6400. Now thats a lot of money to the average man, no doubts about it. I am the average working man but, Ive seen this master peice in the flesh at the Kempton Park radio fair. I can't believe theres a Ham out there that wouldn't buy this after seeing it in the flesh, if they had some spare money knocking about, or could sell some existing gear to raise the funds.
Its a dream come true and its a target worth aiming for, lets face it you have to have a target. It keeps the interest in the hobby going. No one's ever really happy with what they have got.
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by K8DXX on May 11, 2004
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Chuck,
Don't let those "smart comments" get you down. To the non-believer, its foolishness.
Personally, I'm sure I'd enjoy having a '7800, although I do agree that there are more important things in all of eternity. Don't think I'll buy one. However, an Orion is not out of the question, for this ham!
73
Bill / K8DXX
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by KC1XU on May 11, 2004
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They are selling every unit they can turn out. Last I checked, there was a waiting list. That would indicate that it is NOT overpriced.
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by K4CMD on May 11, 2004
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"They are selling every unit they can turn out."
Yeah ... but can they REPAIR every one that comes back in ...
:D
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by NE1RI on May 11, 2004
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There are no stupid prices, only stupid people. It's relative. If you've got $10K to spend on a radio and like that kind of gear, then the price is worth it to you.
Personally, I am still having a heckuva time with Icom's rig on the opposite end of the spectrum, the IC-718 which cost me @$600 2 years ago. Even if I won the lottery tomorrow, I don't think the 7800 would appeal to me. (I'd probably make a move on the 756PRO, tho'!)
To each their own.
73 de NE1RI
"Radio Free Quahog"
James
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by G0WTZ on May 11, 2004
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You would need to buy 3 Orions to keep a working one in the shack!
The IC-7800 is the best radio I have ever seen !
I will probably never own one because I can not afford one
If you can afford one buy it we wont see you on here much you will be too busy enjoying your rig.
The best is always expensive and so it should be!
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by VK4QC on May 12, 2004
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BUT - can you tell the difference at the other end?
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by AA4LU on May 12, 2004
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You would think that a radio this sophisticated would at least have a complete RS232 interface for controlling the radio via software. Why on earth would ICOM continue to leave out the capability to query whether or not the radio is set to split operation? For years, they have been told of this deficiency, but they continue to ignore the shortcoming.
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by NN6EE on May 12, 2004
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Until ICOM brings out a FAR SUPERIOR rig to my "PRO" which they have not, even now in the guise of the IC-7800, then we'll bide our time!!!
Besides with the threat of "BPL" why in the Hell would anyone spend that kind of money for a rig that is essentially a DUAL version of the PRO orPRO2 @. I saw and used a IC-7800 at the Intl,DX-Convention @ Visalia last month and believe me it's NOTHING special. The NOISE BLANKER is nothing new either as it's just like what we've got now, slight amount of audio-distortion when switched on. Now if they had NEW NB technology to RESHAPE the resulting audio output DIGITALLY and make it sound NORMAL then YAH it would be would it!!!
BUT IT AIN'T!!!
Jim/ee
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by NN6EE on May 12, 2004
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OOPS!!! :and make it sound NORMAL then YAH it would be would it!!!
I meant: would be "WORTH" it!!!
:-)))
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by K6LCS on May 12, 2004
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>>I guess I should expect that a salesperson will only be concerned with how well something sells, whether it's a good radio or not...
Since Icom didn't ship the units until the past few days, you really cannot fault a "mere salesperson" not to know the '7800 intimately.
Clint Bradford, K6LCS
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by WD8WV on May 12, 2004
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As one poster put it, the equipment he had accumulated over the years would come to about $10,000 is why I have said the following:
The only way I would spend that kind of moneyif I had it to spend is if:
1. The rig covered all bands from 160 Meters all the way to the giga hertz bands.
2. All modes, digital, cw, usb, lsb, am, fm, packet, pactor, amtor, sstv, atv and whatever else there is out there.
3. It was full legal limit power with maybe just a little extra.
4. Built in power supply
5. All the possible filters (crystal and DSP).
6. Built in touch screen monitor (so no computer is needed).
7. Built in legal limit tuner.
8. Built in transmit audio system.
9. Built in monitoring scope.
10. Built in CW keyer, memory keyer, cw reader and had built in paddles.
11. Built in low pass filter, high pass filter, 1:1 Balun, 4:1 Balun, etc.
12. 1,000 memories to store any possible frequency, split frequency, tones, offsets, etc.
13. Built in UTC clock and regular clock.
For the price they are asking for this rig it should have everything to where all you need to do is hook up a wire and talk or whatever. No additional equipment has to be purchased, no additional accessories, etc.
I read some of the posts and I am glad that some have the money to buy this type of rig, but I am a working man with a family to support, a home to take care and bills to pay. I am not a tightwad, but I am sensible when it comes to my purchases, especially in a hobby and especially one that is on shacky ground right now.
$10,000 would be a good start on one of my son's college education, or a start on a retirement plan, a home improvement project, etc. Now if I was an electrical engineer, computer engineer, or any type of engineer, or a doctor, a lawyer or President then I would probably have the money to just through away, but I am not. I am just your average working guy making about $32,000 a year and supporting a family.
So as far as I am concerned ICOM can keep their high dollar over priced rig. I am having fun with my Yaesu FT-840, Ameritron AL-811H and Drake tuner. I have been operating with this setup for over 7 years now with no complaints and good reports. I have worked all over the world with this setup, maybe not all countries, but according to my log about 115 of them so far and all 50 states.
Now I know this will offend some, but I am just putting in my 2 cents worth and not aiming this at any particular person or group of people.
Thanks eHam for letting me express my opinion.
Juddie
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by K8CPA on May 12, 2004
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Well Put Juddie, VERY WELL PUT!
From another Working class Joe, the real hams of america!
-Chuck K8CPA
Detroit, Mi.
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by VE3GNU on May 12, 2004
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I applaud ICOM for producing such an 'upscale' transceiver---one which I cannot afford or wish to own; nor do I begrudge anyone from buying one. What I do feel good about is that I have owned one of ICOM's early 'bullet-proof' radios since 1982---a fully-featured IC 740---ham band only---still going strong---has never let me down! It cost me $1546.98 (Canadian)including PS 20 Power Supply---! Just consider---I saved up for it 9 years! From what I gather there are not a lot of them out there---as it had a very short production run. I appreciate what I have and what it can do---and furthermore---"different strokes for different folks" is still very much in style!
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by VE3GNU on May 12, 2004
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I applaud ICOM for producing such an 'upscale' transceiver---one which I cannot afford or wish to own; nor do I begrudge anyone from buying one. What I do feel good about is that I have owned one of ICOM's early 'bullet-proof' radios since 1982---a fully-featured IC 740---ham band only---still going strong---has never let me down! It cost me $1546.98 (Canadian)including PS 20 Power Supply---! Just consider---I saved up for it 9 years! From what I gather there are not a lot of them out there---as it had a very short production run. I appreciate what I have and what it can do---and furthermore---"different strokes for different folks" is still very much in style!
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by VE3GNU on May 12, 2004
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I applaud ICOM for producing such an 'upscale' transceiver---one which I cannot afford or wish to own; nor do I begrudge anyone from buying one. What I do feel good about is that I have owned one of ICOM's early 'bullet-proof' radios since 1982---a fully-featured IC 740---ham band only---still going strong---has never let me down! It cost me $1546.98 (Canadian)including PS 20 Power Supply---! Just consider---I saved up for it 9 years! From what I gather there are not a lot of them out there---as it had a very short production run. I appreciate what I have and what it can do---and furthermore---"different strokes for different folks" is still very much in style!
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by SQ2HFJ on May 12, 2004
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if i had this many i would buy this electronic gem !
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by NA4IT on May 12, 2004
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There was an HRO rep emailed me earlier and inquired as to where I got my info that the 7800 was going to have a price of $13k. Well, if you are reading sir, go to http://dayton.akorn.net/pipermail/orion/2004-March/000319.html.
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by N7XM on May 13, 2004
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Maybe the MERCEDES 600 should be priced
the same as YUGO ???
Us " working guys" don't get to play with
expensive " toys " - that is the way it
is ! Accept it ! stop complaining!
Buy an good radio and spend the EXTRA money
on antennas !
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by W4ABX on May 13, 2004
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>Why not... people are buying Hummers.
Nuff said!!
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by W4MCQ on May 13, 2004
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In my opinion; anyone who pays more than $2,000 for an HF radio either has way too much money or too few brain cells.
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by W3DCG on May 13, 2004
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Yeah...I'd rather have a couple Orions with full decks of filters, and a tower and beam!
I like the car analogies.
I just can't imagine a more fun to drive car, (not on the race track, but to and from work, stores, etc) than an Acura Integra.
Sure, a person could spend .Mega bucks on other cars, amphibious cars, monster trucks, custom Aston Martins, Porsche's, what- ever.
But they are not any more fun to drive. They might have so many bells and whistles coupled with eXtreme speed, that it could kill ya.
Meanwhile, the guy in the Integra is zipping along with the shidditin grin on his face, having a total blast, town or country, especially winding roads (country). Pumping plain octane, flexing those sidewalls at every turn- DRIVING - the car, not worrying about breaking it, or what it'll cost to replace the tires, break pads, all while enjoying comfortable insurance premiums!
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by KC5RK on May 14, 2004
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I'll be willing to bet that Wes Hayward W7ZOI could build a better performing receiver with $25 dollars worth of parts from his junbox. Most if not all japanese rigs actually leave a lot to be desired in the way of performance. However, they sure look good! Think I,ll check into Ten-tec for my next rig.
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by K7ERQ on May 14, 2004
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WELL GUYS, I would suggest you operate a IC-7800. After hamming for 50 years, I wanted to try it, I am glad I did. Lifes to short to be little! I love my IC-7800! ABSOLUTELY FANTASTIC! I also love my Ten-Tec Orion. Icom stepped out in front, and pulled the entire hobby up a notch! 73 K7ERQ 1 801 372 2528
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by N3WES on May 14, 2004
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I think it's great that even a rig of this price can generate so much excitement. I myself look forward to when I get one!
*Anyone* who works is part of working America, and it's nobody's business what someone else makes or what they can afford.
To each his own, this is a free country.
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RE: They'll sell plenty........
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by W8JSA on May 14, 2004
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I know. I brought it and a 970 a few years ago. I wouldn't part with either. The 7800 is truly a work of techological art! Yes, it is worth the price.
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by N8QGC on May 14, 2004
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This is some of the funniest stuff I've ever read through in my life.
Rick AI3W, I was in tears thanks for your most sarcastic retort on this subject.
Here's my take, it's simple. As with most people in my general age group (35) and class (blue collar), I don't own Fancy overpriced cars. I own calendars with pretty woman stretched provocatively over thier hoods. So when Icom comes out with the calendar I'll buy it cheerfully and hang it in a place of reverance over my Kenwood TS-440S and Ameritron AL-811.
If you can afford it buy it I guess, as for me I'm just fine.
73 de John N8QGC
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by VE3UZI on May 14, 2004
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Maybe I could trade in my Buick for one of these...
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by MW0KIK on May 14, 2004
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forget icom......
check out the new yaesu pic from cq mag...
http://hometown.aol.co.uk/mw0kik/myhomepage/newsletter.html
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by MW0KIK on May 14, 2004
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or look on rigpix
http://www.rigpix.com/yaesu/ftdx9000.htm
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by K6RB on May 14, 2004
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So long as no one is telling you you have to buy something, there's no reason why a company cannot make a product and price it however they wish. If the price is too high, demand will be low. That's how a free market works. If you think it's too expensive, don't buy it. My SO2R station consists of two, used, FT-1000s, SO2R switching, bandpass filters, band decoders, and amplifiers - including a used Alpha 87-A. Believe me, I didn't spend $11K on the whole shebang. To me, $11K for the 7800 is not compelling. But I would never tell Icom they shouldn't make it and market it. That's my two cents.
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by KA4KOE on May 15, 2004
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I bought a second hand 756PRO and its grand. Its hard to imagine much improvement for the average Joe/Josephine HAM.
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by CT2ILQ on May 16, 2004
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Would the average ham buy it? We all know the answer
and the answer is no.
Many hams in the world wont earn that in a year.
The real question is this one:
What are the things on the IC-7800 that may be
added to a "normal rig" for about $50-$100 more
to give a better performance?
Check the reviews of the 7800 and you see that SPDIF is highly praised.
Optical digital audio in and out.
"High fidelity" isolated computer audio interfacing,
for digital modes, and to use a computer as a DSP
without additional noise, interference or distortion.
A normal computer as a DSP is cheaper, is more upgradeable and is more flexible.
BTW, the announced Yaesu FT-9000 has NOT SPDIF....
With tons of SPDIF interfaces in DVDs, and home cinema sets it should be cheap to add that to a rig.
73
Paulo Ferreira CT2ILQ
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by W8QWL on May 17, 2004
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Thia is the way you get the insurance company to pay for your new goddies, then you tell your friends that you bought the newest ICOM for 11 grand
send your old radios to me first.
dennis
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by KB0VVK on May 19, 2004
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Any body see the price compared to Collins when it came out Its not Over priced.the icom 7800
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by KB0VVK on May 19, 2004
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Any body see the price compared to Collins when it came out Its not Over priced.the icom 7800
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by KB0VVK on May 19, 2004
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I herd on my radio from somebody that Icom has sold all of the 7800s production for 2004
they may go to dealers but there sold
ps I KNOW I CAN.T SPELL so there.
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by WA6FFV on May 20, 2004
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What you could do with 10,600 bucks.
1 Make a payment or two on the mortgage
2 Pay down your maxed out credit card.
3 Buy your ol or yl or maybe the yf a diamond
to show her you love her.
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by N4UE on May 27, 2004
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This was a great thread.......
My $.02 worth. Back before I retired, I bought both a 756PRO and a 706g on seperate trips to Japan. I didn't do this without examining the exchange rates, the cost here in the USA and the posibility of no warranty.
Still, the price was SO good (caught them both on 'special', otherwise prices pretty much a wash).
I was a little disappointed when the PROII came along 2 years later. However, the PRO has given me so much enjoyment, I do NOT regret it's purchase in 2000. Besides, the PROII does not appear to be worth the cost to upgrade, at least not for me.....
IF (big IF!) I were still working and making my previous salary, and IF I were in JA Land and IF I found another 'special', I still probably wouldn't buy a 7800. Too much $ to be a beta tester. For all those out there who have the resources to buy one...
GO FOR IT! I have had some health issues in the past and have lost many of my old Engineer friends. You ain't gonna take it with you, if you have it, enjoy it!
My ex-mother in law was so, er, frugal, she would cut paper towels into 1/4 pieces. She died with much $ in the bank which her husband (my ex-father in law) promptly had a ball with! New home on the 7th fairway, hot and cold running bimbos, he went another 10 yrs and I bet still has the smile on his face, down 6 feet under!
I have more radios than you could imagine and a couple of $50,000 hot rods and LOVE it all!
Retiring early was the best thing I ever did.
Enjoy life: if it means bitching about the cost of the new generation of radios, using whatever you have, etc., just do it!
Just remember, you don't really OWN anything! Someday, someone else is gonna have everything you have, except for your memories. Make them good ones!!!!!
ron
N4UE
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by W8QIZ on June 10, 2004
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Personally, I'm very glad to see any manufacturer put the time and engineering into HF equipment. We all learn and get something out of each new piece of gear that comes along. As new rigs make a splash, other manufacturers can borrow from it and add those items on their new rigs that have shown to work well for hams. In today's dollars, you are still getting a bargan, believe it or not. I'm also glad to see that ICOM, their management, and engineering teams have the guts to complete such a project...its a lot of design work, lab testing, and software to design and build a transceiver like the IC-7800. The software writing and debugging alone is an enormous task! Whew!
Personally, I do not have the bux for such a rig, but many governments do; they're also the ones who really gobbled up most of the Collins S-line and KWM-2s years ago, and by so doing, made them available and affordable today. I will wait to buy an IC-7800 a few years from now as the price declines as a used piece of gear. This is how I got a perfect IC-781 for under two grand...was worth the wait.
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by WA2JJH on July 8, 2004
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Some people will pay $30,000 for a ROLEX or BREITLING watch. Money does not come with spending instructions.
I would rather have an ORIEN, a Drake TR-7/R-7A, and a Harris 3200. I would still have over $4000 dollars left over for a good antenna system.
The result would be a DSP state of the art rig, An analog ultra high performance rig, and a mil spec rig for back up.
Got the Harris, and the Drake 7 line. I am saving my money for the TEN TEC ORIEN.
This is just my idea of a dream shack.
If somebody wants to spend $10,000 for one rig, that is their business!
However one big factor is missing. What happens when the 7800 breaks. Can you do your own repairs on it?
Is ICOM tooled up for rapid turn around?
Bottom line. I would hope ICOM will give you the kind of repair/service/support that is worth $10,000!
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Icom IC-7800 IS VERY CHEAP
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by TG9AKH on July 26, 2004
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Friends,
I absolutely agree with comments to the effect that ICOM is producing the IC-7800 to meet two different but related goals (a) to serve the ultra high-end market, and (b) to have a solid flagship product that establishes the company as *the* tech leader in HF rigs.
Other people have already established valid comparisons with hobbies such as hi-fi audio and related electronics. Moreover, I have friends who own light (and not so light) aeroplanes, basically because they wish to fly. Some people splash out buying super expensive vehicles while others collect wristwatches.
BTW, have you guys seen how much membership in your local country club costs, so you can hit a little ball with a club and hope you put it in a little faraway hole in the grass? Low tech stuff, pure unadulterated human skill, little progress in the last century. Now, from my perspective, *that* membership is expensive.
Even if the IC-7800 happened to be the only transceiver available for amateur use, it still would not make Ham Radio a super-expensive hobby. I'd say it's cheap, a poor man's hobby.
Further, some hams in previous posting have presented very articulate and persuasive arguments to the effect that in *real* terms the IC-7800 is about as expensive as "top of the line" gear in the 50s and 60s. In fact, I suspect that no records are being broken by the IC-7800, at least not price-wise. If we could somehow adjust our price indexes for quality (in the narrow sense of availability of features and performance) the IC-7800 is actually SUPER CHEAP relative to the rigs built in the 50s and 60s.
Yes, I said it. In real terms, the IC-7800 is actually very, very CHEAP.
Do I own one? Not really. I think the IC-7800 has its place in club stations, contest stations owned by several people, and of course, in the shack of a few individuals who can afford it.
Relative to other hobbies, amateur radio remains very meritocratic. For example, we all admire QRPers, even creating special categories in contests and diplomas, to recognize their accomplishments. "Tuna Tin" QRPers have great merit as radio operators. It takes great operational skill and lots of character to succeed.
And then there's the people who build their own radios. In my view that has a lot of merit. The IC-7800 does not take away anything from these guys.
"Big Gun" stations (likely add the IC-7800 to their collection of rigs) do not have success guaranteed simply because they have super-duper amplifiers and all kinds of antenna arrays. I find that talent and experience matter so much in ham radio, that the introduction of IC-7800 and similar rigs is not going to change the character of the avocation, just as having big amplifiers did not change it.
Merit is still merit. Ask an owner of the IC-7800 if he understands how it works. Assess the quality and detail of the answer. If somebody gets to understand in depth how an IC-7800 works, then you have coupled $10k gear with a priceless mind. Somebody who knows nothing about how the IC-7800 works, is equivalent to coupling $10k gear with a worthless mind.
Hopefully, everybody will try to learn a bit how the tech in the IC-7800 works. I've been reading about it... and it is the kind of stuff that makes interesting conversations. Forget about the price nad focus on the technology. You don't need to buy and IC-7800 to get to understand how it works. Push the tech envelope and press the limits of your understanding. Go for it! Owning the IC-7800 is actually *cheap* in the grander scheme of things... but more importantly still... understanding how the IC-7800 requires some intellectual effort but it is otherwise FREE.
The IC-7800 is a gift from ICOM to us all. Yaesu, Kenwood... we're waiting... where's your gift to us all???
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by VK2BEN on July 28, 2004
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I know, the care factor up there in the Untied States is probably less than S1 on the 'give-a-toss-O-meter', but I finally found an Aussie supplier of the controversial IC7800. [one who happily quotes the price anyway].
At a mere AUD$15,995 on special ($1500 off!) it's sure to find a home with those who think a pair of IC756's (or FT1000's, etc) just aren't doing the best job of weighing the shack's bench down to the floor. That's not a description of me at all, but I think a 7800 will still look fantastic in the middle of the desk. I'm gonna get me one :)
Why will I? Because I LIKE IT. Is it overpriced? Probably. But so are Porsche 911 GT3's; but that's not stopped the market in its tracks. Their owners LIKE them, and that's ALL that matters.
That's the difference between Luxury Items and Consumer Goods.
There's a market for everything, as has been adequately pointed out.
Indeed, audiophiles are a great example of so-called 'overspending': ever looked at Bang & Olufsen gear? GG! The 6000-series CD player comes in at $7k, with another $5,200 required for a pair of amplified speakers! Yet, given the right financial circumstances a lot of people buy their stuff because they beleive in 'highest price = best quality'
Case in point: I love mountain biking (my heart and lungs complain often, but I try not to ask for their opinion), and you'd be forgiven for thinking that cycling couldn't possibly compare with hi-fi or ham radio. Wrong! My older model bike would cost $4,000 to replace. And the Team race models run over $10k. You can actually purchase a large motorbike for less that that.
'Average' Australian wage: $32,000 - $36,000 per annum. I hate using averages coz they don't give you the real picture about anything really, but that's the Government for you. Second hand Subaru Liberty in the Tradingpost: $17,000. One Icom radio: $15,995 on special. The look on my wife's face when I tell her what the sale of the car got me/us: $I'll let you know after court next week$.
Obviously not for your average ham. Because it aint no average wireless set! But like buyers of Porsche cars; you 'know' you have the best because you paid top dollar. It's one of those things. We humans are strange beings. Perception IS Reality!
OK; my last line of babble. Icom aren't trying to CREATE a market ---- they are CATERING to a market that _is_ already there....beleive it or not! Elite for the elitists.
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by HAMINEGGS on August 26, 2004
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No they are not kidding-mucho yen went into market research and consumer demand questionaires-and the market said "i want bigger-not smaller-radios of yore, like the FT-1000D and the 781 with all those nice knobs that did something, please applaud both ICOM an YAESU for developing and producing radios that up the technology benchmark to very high levels. it shows that (for ICOM and YAESU at least) Japan believes there is a market for these radios. They didn't intend to make 3 a year of these rigs and be glad to have 'face' bragging rights. As they push the technology advancement forward, the lesser radios in the line will incorporate some of the goodies (look at Caddillac..now Chevy's have antilock brakes (not so only a few years ago). The real issue every HAM and Egg out there should be concerned about is Ham band erosion and the real threat of BPL. We need to get the FCC to remember that THEY work for US, the citizens of the USA, not as the strong arm of the PAC electric companies trying to foist this smokscreen of BPL as a revenue source to fix thier decrepid power distribution system. Hooray for ICOM and Yaesu, TenTec-please look at the competition and add color TFT screens to your TOL Orion for 3K$, please...
Bottom line - Economics 101 - If no one buys at 10 kilo bucks, then they try sale/add ons/free stuff to sweeten the shock. If that desn't work, soon the rig will 'die on the vine' and be available as 'special order only' Go into a RadioShack, without gaffawing too loudly, and ask about thier Amateur gear...no buy-e, no sell-e, it's all economics---simple (some will spend the KiloBucks to have the NEXT BEST THING, others will drool over the store displays, still others will wait till the spring/christmas/father's day/whatever/ sale comes around and then buy..with out the wife attending, of course..
73
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by K3ROJ on September 27, 2004
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At first I thought $10,600 was too much for a radio but went ahead and bought one anyway. It is out of this world especially with the two receivers and the 10 MHz reference input capability using my HP Z3801A GPS unit. It works well with my Elecraft transverters since it has -20db output for that purpose and am able to see stations pop up on the VHF/UHF bands with the second receiver.
The one and only thing I found that is troublesome is the PSK31 tuning because there is no "snap to" feature such as in Digipan and tuning has to be carefully done even with 10 hz tuning steps.
It out performs my older Icom 756 PRO especially on 6 meters and will be selling it on E-BAY soon, AL
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by WA2JJH on October 1, 2004
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racal ra-3792 dual RX with DSP for under $2000.
Then use an ORION just for the TX for $3000.
It is the emporers new cloths story
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by N6ZAR on November 5, 2004
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Thank you ICOM for coming out with the IC-7800! It will be a while before I can afford it, but I will be getting one. I have been waiting for ICOM to bring out the successor to the 781, and it looks like the IC-7800 won't disappoint. Considering the cost of my original 781, the price doesn't surprise me, and the price won't dissuade me either. For those of you that can't accept the price, don't worry about it, you wouldn't understand :)
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by N6ZAR on November 5, 2004
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Thank you ICOM for coming out with the IC-7800! It will be a while before I can afford it, but I will be getting one. I have been waiting for ICOM to bring out the successor to the 781, and it looks like the IC-7800 won't disappoint. Considering the cost of my original 781, the price doesn't surprise me, and the price won't dissuade me either. For those of you that can't accept the price, don't worry about it, you wouldn't understand :)
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by VE4MM on January 23, 2005
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I bought mine last week from HRO. $10,550.00
I believe in supporting the Ham Radio manufacturers and dealers.
How can they develop new technologies without the purchase of new gear.
It is cool and I can afford it.
Now go out and support your favorite Amateur Radio dealer and spend some CA$H!!!!!!!!!
73
Michael Mark,P.Eng, BSc EE, VE4MM, Life Member ARRL
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RE: Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by K3ROJ on January 25, 2005
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I bought an ICOM 7800 last fall (2004) from HRO and before the purchase I was assured I could return it if not pleased within 30 days and to maintain the packing box, rig etc in perfect condition.
Help was needed to load it in my pickup truck and also after returning home (it weighs 70 pounds) I needed help from a neighbor. I must admit that the 7800 is the ultimate rig especially with dual receivers and just like my 756 PRO being able to create filters for my needs.
The only reason I returned the rig was because of very poor PSK31 reception since the receiver had to be exactly in the right spot to receive PSK unlike my Digipan which will lock onto a signal once getting close. Many contacts were lost because of that and I now use my 756PRO with Digipan (the PRO also has terrible RTTY tuning).
As I mentioned in an earlier post, the ICOM makes an excellent IF rig for transverters (only requires -20 Db input) and being able to monitor activity with the spectrum scope is like having a $10,000 piece of test gear.
Am waiting for the Yaesu rig that is supposed to outdo the ICOM, AL
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by W0LC on May 31, 2005
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Well, I can't even fathom spending that kind of cash on any part of this hobby, let alone just for the transceiver. It offers me nothing that my current equipment cannot do and probably do just as well. A tad of sensitivity or selectivity still won't justify that ridiculous price.
If you have the money, go for it. I won't. I suspect an upgrade is already in the works and that $11K radio will end up selling shortly for 1/2 of it's current price.
In either situation, I won't be buying one (whether money is an issue or not).
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by K6JPA on September 19, 2005
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Well, they may come out with a new upgraded model that will drop the price in half, but for those of us that have purchased one and can afford it, the money factor isn't the issue. It simply is the best that is currently available, and if it makes me happy to use, so be it.
As mentioned earlier, Icom didn't make this rig for the casual user. It's no more needed than a Lincoln, Cadillac, or whatever high end car one might purchase. They exist because there is a demand, by people that have the ability and desire to make manufacturers push the limits of technology.
If and when the "new one" comes out, I'll be one of the first in line to purchase one. If the threshold of technology is improved, it'll be worth the premium cost. After all, I can't think of a better backup rig sitting in the shack than my IC-7800.
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by JDOBBS on November 5, 2005
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I never seen so many grown men act like school children.
Why dont you guys tally up the cost of this hobby over a 10-15 year period. See how much you spent on masts,antennas,trancievers,transverters,antenna matchers,power supplies,linear amplifiers etc.. etc..
10K for Tranciever that gets very close to R&S and WJ SIGINT receiver performance is very impressive indeed. Take a look at GSA pricing for a EB200 for example.
the 7800's are making their way in select offices right along side the R&S gear (Although these 7800s have a different firmware) That says alot about the 7800.
I could not justify spending that much money out of my budget for such a radio right now but in the future when my home is paid off (10 years) I will revisit this radio.
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Icom IC-7800 $10,599.99 Are they Kidding?
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by K3ROJ on April 10, 2006
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I have had my IC7800 for over a year now and must admit it is the ultimate rig. Yes, $10,000 is a lot of money for an amateur radio transceiver but compared with the price of a new home or a good automobile it is just another toy to be enjoyed.
It took a while to get used to using the PSK-31 feature but now it is my favorite mode when not operating CW on 40 and 20 meters. It is outstanding when used as a contest rig and most clubs consider using the 7800 when contesting in remote DX areas.
So, go ahead and take the plunge and enjoy hamming with this great rig.
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