MARS Hasn't Been Active
LEO GRIFFIN (KB7LOC)
on
August 23, 2004
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Since 1994, Army MARS has not handled a single emergency message to anyone but DOMS. They did nothing but radio checks when Oklahoma Fed building was bombed; when 9/11 needed emergency communications and MARS wasn't there except to trade radio checks. They have no emergency input from locals and no federal agency that needs MARS input. SHARES will handle most government emergency traffic along with ARES.
The EEI reports MARS idiots send to DOMS via the Western Area Gateway give EXACT GEORGRAPHICAL LOCATIONS of their local targets - including nuclear plants, gas mains, etc. Terrorists don't have radios and don't know English? Yeah, right.
If MARS wants a mission then let them review the history of Red Barger who helped the FBI catch numerous saboteurs and NAZI agents in the U.S. by monitoring and intercepting their communications. The Arab terrorists are using low-tech Amtor and Pactor to send communications since 2001. (See Klingenfuss report their website) Makes sense since if one is going to fight a hi-tech enemy, one should go low-tech! Get out the CW keys and Amtor and Pactor I software, gentlemen -- the war is on!
Leo
KB7LOC
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MARS Hasn't Been Active
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by KC7GNM on August 23, 2004
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And then you wonder why the military wants to shut down the gateway in Germany. That is exacltly the reasons I said mars is dying. Nothing but nets for hams that don't want to or cannot get on the hf bands. Nothing of real importance is ever going to be passed on MARS because of the exact reasons you said in your article.
73 de Greg
KC7GNM
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RE: MARS Hasn't Been Active
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by KG4RUL on August 23, 2004
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Hi Leo!
I assume that you neglected to include your MARS call in your post.
Unsecure communications are also present in any Amateur Radio operations, per the applicable CFRs. So I guess you would advocate the doing away with ARES/RACES and SATERN?
Dennis / KG4RUL
NNN0FAE SC
NNN0GBS FIFTEEN
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MARS Hasn't Been Active
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by N5NW on August 23, 2004
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And Terrorists don't have recon?
I'm sorry but in the logical argument this is known as a strawman. There is no security of position/location for potential targets. Especially in this day of handheld GPS.
The original message indicates a distinct ignorance of the role of radio (both amateur and MARS) in emergency communications. The first rule is stay out of the responder's way.
I suggest those critical of the responses of MARS, ARES, NTS, etc. take the EmComm course via the ARRL prior to offering criticism. Then they would know that ARES supports local disaster relief, while MARS supports DOD response to disasters, as coordinated by DOMS. Different missions entirely.
de N5NW / NNN0RBB
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MARS Hasn't Been Active
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by WTF52 on August 23, 2004
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One wonders why people seem to take such perverse pleasure attacking MARS and those volunteers who give their time in support of it. I sense some bitterness in this poorly-written "article", not to mention the ignorance it displays. I noticed that in this guy's profile, he indicated an interest in the Bible--maybe he should strive to live by its teachings and refrain from personal attacks (ie. "MARS idiots") on people who are actually out there participating in public service. Time to get a life, Leo.
Dwight NNN0TPR/NNN0ASI EIGHT
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by KB7LOC on August 23, 2004
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I bugged Robert Sutton and James Banks about MARS not having any mission and no accountability and was ignored by them. I then reported the EEI reports to the FBI and HS&D. Sutton took that as an insult and terminated my membership. I wear that insult with honor. My MARS call was AAR0NH.
During Desert Shield and Storm, I was the Gateway station for Oregon and passed over 3,000 pieces of traffic. The AP did a story on me and I got calls from England, South America and 39 of the 50 states from people who wanted to send/receive traffic from DS&S. I earned my callsign and the right to question the mission of present day MARS.
When they close the European Gateway they will have taken step one of ridding the world of an archaic system. Maybe this is the way they will break that outlandish contract with the AKIMA corp. and get rid of Sutton and Banks. Maybe, just maybe there will be a single MARS service that can do somehting. When the military dismantles something it usually does it in the manner we see today with Army MARS. It will spread.
ARES/RACES is the backbone of SHARES. HS&D has signed an MOU with ARRL, not with any of the MARS services. Go figure!
leo griffin
KB7LOC
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RE: MARS Hasn't Been Active
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by KG4RUL on August 23, 2004
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Leo, the question still remains unanswered:
Unsecure communications are also present in any Amateur Radio operations, per the applicable CFRs. So I guess you would advocate the doing away with ARES/RACES and SATERN?
Dennis / KG4RUL
NNN0FAE SC
NNN0GBS FIFTEEN
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Martians
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by KA4KOE on August 23, 2004
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Of course it isn't active...we've got two rovers still puttering around up there, and the red orb is yet again nearing opposition this month...prime spying time for us Earthlings.
Once the rovers finally die (they're already way outta warranty), the MARS folks will be at it again, slowly and surely drawing their plans against us.
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RE: Martians
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by K6AER on August 23, 2004
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I use to be involved with MARS in the seventies. At that time there was a need. With today’s need for high speed communications, encryption proof transmissions and seamless interagency coordination, ham radio is to military needs what the telegraph was when the telephone came along. Most soldiers in the field have access to satellite phones for health and welfare traffic. The ham bands are Amateur at best when it come to on-the-air behavior. Only in the complete collapse of communication will the professional and military community use ham radio. Mostly our work serves for film bites on the five o’clock news.
Don’t get me wrong about what we can provide, their have been times when ham radio was all that could be used. It’s just in the large picture we cannot provide the level of service that the military and emergency community needs on a constant basis.
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RE: Martians
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by N6AJR on August 23, 2004
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Folks.. Mars was there for me in Viet Nam, and I want to thank all the folks who let me say " Hello Ma , Over" and there was nothing better than to luck out and get into the Goldwater Net, and get the free call home in the states from our good friend Barry.. Thank you folks,, well done.. Tom N6AJR
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by N3ZKP on August 23, 2004
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<< ARES/RACES is the backbone of SHARES >>
Actually, NO!
SHARES is made up of Federal agencies, MARS and a couple of specific NGOs, most notable the American Red Cross.
There is no ARRL, AREA or RACES membership that I am aware of.
Lon NNN0OOR
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by N3ZKP on August 23, 2004
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Leo,
Based on your admitted conduct, if I had been the Chief, Army MARS, I probably would have booted you out, too.
Lon
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by G0GQK on August 23, 2004
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Ref."unsecure communications are also present in any amateur radio operation". Of course its unsecure, that is one of the rules of the hobby !
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MARS Hasn't Been Active
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by BANACEK on August 23, 2004
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In other words, Leo got "fired" for overstepping his bounds and wants to wage a campaign to destroy MARS.
I wish I was in MARS so I could offer my utter contempt to him with my callsign, but as an SWL I
still think he is beneath "Pond Scum".
Lan
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RE: MARS Hasn't Been Active
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by KG4VGH on August 23, 2004
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I want to also thank the MARS operators.
Nam 65-66 and 68-69
then 10 years with the Navy's Operation Deep Freeze
1988 - 2008
Finally got 2 way calling in Antarctica in 1995, but...still enjoyed the use of MARS for the "Remote" affect....
Salute Guys and Gals
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by K9EZL on August 23, 2004
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Ditto, KG4VGH! Thailand, '67- '68. I still remember the call home from Wake Island. Over.
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RE: MARS
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by GHOSTRIDERHF on August 23, 2004
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Didn't Kerry actually get his third purple heart from an injury he got putting up a Mars antenna in Vietnam???...
LOL
MARS and the Bi-Plane.... both great things in their days...
both however belong in military museums making way for fighter jets and high speed comms....
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by K7AAB on August 24, 2004
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MARS hasnt been active like morse code is not used by the military. Although I have been out of MARS for awhile I know for a fact it is still highly used and deployed throughout the globe where many units are deployed. There was an article out not more than a month ago on one such station in Iraq presently. Army MARS is much a part of SHARES as it ever was and is more the backbone than may other services as Mars runs dedicated paths 24 hrs. And for those that think morse code is dead as well, my Special Forces Comms unit is still communicating to many military units via morse today. I shake my head when I see people try to push so hard at getting rid of work horses like these to make way for "high speed comms and satellite" . When either of tecnological resources fail its the "archaic" methods that save our skins. I do beleive that knowing morse should be a prereq for MARS operators as many units still communicate or have the capability to today.
Sincerely,
Collin Dvorak
K7AAB ex: AAR0CI
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by W1GFD on August 24, 2004
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Leo as a current MARS member I couldn’t agree with you more, you are 150% correct regarding the use of digital over voice and believe it or not we are trying to make the switch but I will tell you what some of the problem is, unlike myself most MARS members are as old as dirt and do not think that digital has any place in EMCOMM and guess what those MARS members who feel like this are some of the ones in the upper management positions so trying to fight them is lesson in futility...... However there is a growing faction in MARS that is beginning to use digital more and more, one thing you must keep in mind is that MARS is a paramilitary organization and just like the Military things move as slow as death but the wind of change is blowing unfortunately it just a breeze and if the breeze doesn’t turn into a hurricane soon I think you will see MARS as a service blow away as a result of our own stubbornness in converting to more secure and efficient methods of communications, Also in response to the other part of your post about MARS not being active during 9/11 etc… well in order to understand why you first have to understand how MARS is structured and just how we get activated if the local SMD or local state official dose not put in a request for activation then all you will get is radio checks as we will only be on stand by and not in an activated mode, this is not to say that I agree with this it’s just the way it is, MARS like ARES needs to make it’s self more known to the local, state, and government agencies that are our customers, ARES teams have done a great job of this and MARS should take a page out of there playbook and try to do the same, I know it takes some time and effort but it is what needs to happen if we want to be included during any major disaster.
Thank You
Sean Binette
W1GFD
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by HAMDUDE on August 24, 2004
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Sounds like a big batch of sour grapes to me. If this fellow was so disgusted with MARS...then why didnt he simply resign and be done with it? Instead he chose to call the FBI and the Homeland Security people and make waves...so he got ousted. Sorry Leo, but you asked for it. Although I feel that MARS is a bit behind the times, it still serves as a good back up to existing newer technologies and should be retained. When someone joins an organization, and then insists on rocking the boat and making trouble...why do they wonder what happened when they get tossed out? After all, calling the FBI and the HS&D on them was a pretty cheap shot dont you think?
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by HERTZ on August 24, 2004
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MARS===Is this where men come from? Why so much talk about MARS---Venus is just as good and worthy of our attention.
;-) and 73s
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RE: Martians
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by KC8VWM on August 24, 2004
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"Once the rovers finally die (they're already way outta warranty), the MARS folks will be at it again,"
I think NASA took out the extended warranty plan for the MARS rover at Radio Shack.
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MARS Hasn't Been Active
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by W0FMS on August 24, 2004
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I decided to move to the country, got in a bit of an argument with a local MARS member at about the same time, and decided my station would be inactive during the move longer than I could request leave for (which was an understatement.. I still, 2 years later, don't have my shack fully set up again). Anyway, I resigned with the understanding that I'd be on good terms if I wanted to rejoin.
In the few years I was in Army MARS, I passed exactly two pieces of traffic to the same people who always screened their phone calls. Did about a million exercises and nothing else. I hate to say this, but I was going to rejoin-- but I don't miss it at all... So what is the point? It's even less active than a couple of years ago. It's just plain boring to be a Army MARS member if you are less than 70 years old (I'm 35).. If things pick up I'll rejoin. But I have to agree that MARS as an entity is literally a dead horse.
Still I commend the remaining MARS volunteers for sticking it out. But I didn't see my limited spare time going to good use so I didn't come back...
So strangly enough, I agree with both sides on this issue.
Fred Spinner, W0FMS (ex-AAR7DV)
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by KE2IV on August 24, 2004
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MARS?
Do hams still do that?
Nowadays - in the 21st Century?
When just about every serviceperson (or his/her buddy) has a GSM-capable cell phone and can call home faster than ET?
C'mon....you're kidding about all this, aren't you?
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RE: MARS Hasn't Been Active
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by GHOSTRIDERHF on August 24, 2004
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K7AAB...
Are you smoking crack????
"I know for a fact it is still highly used and deployed throughout the globe where many units are deployed."
You are just wrong on that ... they may be at 'some' places but why would I use a MARS station that I can only send a MARSGRAM from when AT&T has set up 1000's of FREE KIOSKS for us to call home on -- free 15 minutes phone calls plus internet in most places...
"There was an article out not more than a month ago on one such station in Iraq presently."
Yes -- and NO ONE was using it -- at all -- thats the news article --
"And for those that think morse code is dead as well, my Special Forces Comms unit is still communicating to many military units via morse today."
I sure hope that when your unit comms into my AO that you let me get the hell out of there before you start transmitting with an EASILY DF'd mode... you have to be National Guard becuase the regular Army and Reserve all have SAT and SPITFIRES ...
"I shake my head when I see people try to push so hard at getting rid of work horses like these to make way for "high speed comms and satellite".
Yeah and next we will be getting rid of bi-planes and going for those new fangled jets...
"When either of tecnological resources fail its the "archaic" methods that save our skins."
Really -- I will bet my life on a satellite shot before some guy sending a urgent message in the clear in morse code... give me a break!!!!
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RE: MARS Hasn't Been Active
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by DAILYREGULARITY on August 25, 2004
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Looks like everyone is coming down on Leo pretty hard. You must have stepped on some toes, Leo!Don't worry, though, sometimes the truth hurts and I think that is what the reaction you are getting comes from. First off, let me say that I do not wish to detract from the immeasurable good that MARS volunteers have done for our service men, women, and their families in years past. They performed a real and valuable service in so many ways for these people and ultimately, our nation as a whole. However, I too, have paused to wonder what purpose MARS serves in the modern world. The basis for this comes from a few years ago when I would tune around and I found a hf MARS net just a very few KHz above 75 meters. Listened to this thing a few times and came away with the reaction of "whatever?". The participants that I could hear (SSB and maybe USB at that) were mostly OF's (nothing wrong with that in and of itself) and sounded like they were in the last gasp motel. The net control was aptly placed as he sounded like he was in major "control freak" mode. Most of this was booring MARS stuff for the sake of MARS stuff and he was ranting about how the net participants needed to start making the nets "ON TIME" and they better not miss any without prior clearance and on and on. I'm sitting there listening to this and wondering at just how empty one's life must be to join and put up with this abuse and yet serve no clearly useful purpose for doing so. Guess some people need that "control" thing in their lives to give it meaning and if that is their bag, then by all means go for it, but if I have something come up on a particular day or evening and don't feel like the net (where nothing of importance happens anyway) is priority number one in my life, I don't really feel like getting permission to be excused each and every time. After listening to this a few times I recall thinking that if this has to be done, I'm glad somebody else is doing it and not me. 73, DR
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RE: MARS Hasn't Been Active
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by WTF52 on August 25, 2004
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Looks like Ghostriderhf, aka the former banned K4FAU is back.
For all concerned, this sicko steals other people's callsigns to post. He formerly used the callsign of the Florida Atlantic University Amateur Radio Club, until Eham blocked him at the club's request. The guy has alternately been a signal officer, a coastguardsman, an amateur extra, and about anything else you can name. He also once ripped off the callsign of a another ham named Sam and claimed he was an extra at Fort Hood. Only trouble was, the real Sam was a Tech that lived nowhere near Texas.
He really seems to hate MARS, and apparently is subject to frequent delusions.
Do a forums search on K4FAU and compare that writing style to Ghosty's.
Busted again!
Dwight NNN0TPR
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by WA1RNE on August 25, 2004
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Admitting that certain aspects of the amateur service are out of date seems to be a real tough thing for some of us to swallow.
MARS is an antiquity just like Civil Defense. It's not that our servicemen and women didn't appreciate you guys being there during the Korean and Vietnam wars, it's just that it's been out-moded by current technology and a different set of requirements.
At the federal level, Civil Defense and fallout shelters for nuke strikes has been replaced by Homeland Security to take up the war on terror. At the local level, CD is now Emergency Management.
What if hams refused to adopt SSB over AM during the 50's?? That would have been pig-headed and not in our best interests. The military will do what is in their best interests in order to get the job done - period.
..and if that means eventually retiring MARS, then that's that. Better to just "Roll with the Changes", don't chomp on the bit......
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RE: MARS Hasn't Been Active
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by WTF52 on August 25, 2004
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Another poster who is unaware of the MARS mission. MARS no longer has morale and welfare traffic as its primary mission, and hasn't in quite awhile. Visit www.navymars.org and catch up on current events. Better yet get off your duff, get a callsign, and get involved.
Dwight K3WVU/NNN0TPR
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by AC7NJ on August 25, 2004
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The lack of information here is incredible, flaming one organization or another never did any good. The mission of MARS has always been ECOM (emergency communications) In the past MARS has been active with health and welfare messages for the people of the military. Some phone patches and marsgrams still exist but very few most of the Navy ships have e-mail pay phones etc. There are a number of organizations helping the service people with phone cards and some have cell and sat. phones.
Another misinformation is the suggested license class of MARS members it is true Tech. licensed hams can participate in MARS HF nets, but MARS has more extra class operators per member than any other amateur radio organization.
The next point is things like the OK fed building, the world trade center and other disasters. MARS un like ARES cannot self activate this means we must be asked to help. The fact that MARS can assist in civil disasters is little known or understood, by many.
The NCS and ARES (ARRL) have a MOU to work together but many individuals have never thought it through how this will work. The NCS frequencies are not in the ham band, hams are not authorized to transmit on the NCS frequencies. All three MARS organizations are members of SHARES (part of NCS) all MARS members are also amateurs. I think you see the answer MARS will fill the gap.
INTEROPERABILITY in the past pre 9/11 ECOM organizations ARES, RACES, SATURN, NTS, each MARS organization all worked independently. Post 9/11 this is changing rapidly and I'm a part of that change. A MOU has been presented to the ARRL between all three MARS organizations here in the Pacific Northwest. The ARMY and the NAVY have worked on joint operations.
using obsolete modes yes we use AMTOR FEC & ARQ, PACTOR ARQ with automated store and forward stations. We also use ALE and soundcard modes.
Security: By regulation encryption is not to be used in MARS just like it is in the ham bands. Many state and local agentcies would like secure communications. IMHO encryption adds a un neccessary complexity and would be the cause of delayed communications during an emergency.
The way I see it you can be part of the problem or part of the solution.
Randy AC7NJ
NNN0KPO
FEMA region ten ECOM staff call NNN0AS0 TWO
503-550-1602
ac7nj@arrl.net
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Armed Forces Day 2004
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by KA4KOE on August 25, 2004
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I am not a member of MARS, but did participate in the 55th DOD Military to Amateur Cross Band test this year. Lots of fun. Hope MARS is still around to do this next year.
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RE: Armed Forces Day 2004
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by NA4IT on August 25, 2004
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Not going to comment on MARS. But I am going to address the gentleman a couple of posts ago that refered to the National Guard with a negative attitude...
GET OF THE GUARD AND GET OFF THEM NOW!
Our entire National Guard unit is called up to be deployed! And there are some of the finest men and women I know in there!
If you don't have anything better to do than run down service men and women, why don't you move to Iraq.
And Yes, I'm MAD!
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by K0SF on August 26, 2004
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As much as I'd like not to, I probably will have to concur with Leo.
MARS activity depends on the state. In Minnesota, it is fairly quiet. In Michigan: very active. Activity depends on the leadership within the state, and the amount of coordination with local and state authority.
I've always believed the phone-patch service was the most beneficial to the "customer." Even as late as the '91 Gulf War, we were quite active from MN as Operation "Desert Voices" made numerous patches (one morning, I had made 87 patches to the 82nd Airborne, who had just landed North of Baghdad early in the ground offensive !). At another time, I made a patch for the 3rd Armored Cavalry (Ft. Bliss) commander while in Iraq. He and his wife had not talked for months, and they were both ecstatic and very appreciative ! After that, we ran many patches for 3rd ACR troops.
But here is an example of the problem: My family was on vacation in Seattle 2 weeks ago. We met up with a West Point classmate of mine who now commands a Squadron in the 25th ID from Ft. Lewis which is soon deploying to Irag. He is a ham, and he laments the difficulty soldiers have calling home. The lines are long and the cost is prohibitive. Some are trying to set-up VOIP accounts via PCs, but access is very limited. He asked if I would help (via MARS) to establish a phone-patch net for his unit. I'd love to, but the problem: they have no equipment. He will need a transceiver, amplifier (and spares) as well as a beam and tower. They simply do not have HF equipment as part of their mission task organization & equipment (MTO & E). Therefore, not only do I need to organize the stateside effort (probably my station, I have a 130' tower), but I also need to hunt for equipment to send overseas. Lastly, I need to rely on his interest to set-up the station, train operators, and maintain the station. This is very difficult with no system in place. 13 years ago, the Army had roving comm vans for this purpose, but they don't have them any longer. Without the military formalizing this activity at the brigade level, it is extremely difficult for us civilian do-gooders to help them.
Yes, the mission is diminishing, and it is a shame that there are many MARS members that are quite competent technically and operationally. But, unless the "customer" is willing to spend some money and show interest, it will die. It is ridiculous to believe that volunteers marketing themselves without much customer interest will result in an active system.
73,
Steve, K0SF/AAT5AO
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by N2OBY on August 26, 2004
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<<...MARS like ARES needs to make it’s self more known to the local, state, and government agencies that are our customers...>>
I'll say right up front that I'm not a MARS member, although I've considered joing for quite some time.
My question is prompted by the qoute above. Isn't the DOD MARS' one customer? And if so, isn't the system activated by DOD when and if needed? Why is there an assumption made that MARS should/would be activated by/for other agencies?
-Ken N2OBY
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RE: MARS Hasn't Been Active
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by N3ZKP on August 26, 2004
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Ken,
<< Isn't the DOD MARS' one customer? And if so, isn't the system activated by DOD when and if needed? Why is there an assumption made that MARS should/would be activated by/for other agencies? >>
You are close. DOD is MARS primary "customer", however MARS is also available to state and local governments. Generally the latter two don't make use of us unless there in an MOU in effect. In some places there are, on most places, there aren't, for a variety of reasons.
I am at a loss to understand what difference it makes to non-MARS members whether the service exists or not.
The vast majority of nay-sayers in this thread never offer anything constructive, but instead attempt to denigrate and destroy ANYTHING they are not personally interested in. Some have call signs and some are cowards who don't have the cajones to put their true identities to their words. Others are disaffected members who have an axe to grind (such as the author of this so-called article) and see this as a way to stir up trouble. Every group has them and every group eventually gets tired of messing with them and boots them out.
Lon NNN0OOR
Maryland-District of Columbia-Deleware
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RE: MARS Hasn't Been Active
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by N2OBY on August 27, 2004
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Lon,
Thanks for the explanation. I also agree 100% with your other points about naysayers. I've found that if you ignore them long enough, they tend to fade away. They tend to stick around forums like this because with the large audience there's always someone who gives in and gets into it with them, providing the attention they crave.
On to more pleasant things... I'm very active with my county's ARES/RACES program, but having served four and a half years in the Air Force (81-86) I've always wanted to join AF MARS as a way to "keep my hand in" so to speak, and give back to the service that did so much for me. Until recently I was under the assumption that I had to have at least a general class license, which I'm halfway to obtaining (passed the theory portion, now working on the code...).
Would you mind describing your MARS experience to me? If you'd prefer to do it offline, you can email me at n2oby@arrl.net.
Thanks & 73,
Ken N2OBY
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RE: MARS Hasn't Been Active
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by N3ZKP on August 29, 2004
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Ken,
I've been out of town at the NorthEast Area Navy MARS conference. I'll email you.
Lon
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RE: MARS Hasn't Been Active
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by KI4GSF on August 30, 2004
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I am currently a newly licensed ham (tech) and do intend on joining AF MARS in my area (North Eastern Kentucky).
My father served in Viet Nam and Thailand. My mother still has several MARSGRAMS that were sent.
I served for 5 years in Germany, and I have to say that my main interest in the hobby and MARS was due to one person stationed there with me.
So as a vet, do I think MARS still serves a purpose? yes I do. Does it need to evolve , yes it does, but it needs to do so at the hands of the up and commers that bring the new technology with them.
thank you for this forum
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MARS Hasn't Been Active
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by KC5ZYO on August 31, 2004
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If MARS is inactive i guss that I have been talking to someone that is not there because two times a day 7 days a week I check in to the net. I have been a MARS member since 1997.
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MARS Hasn't Been Active
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by KF4WSN on September 14, 2004
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I think More Hams should be Active in MARS. As a ham and member of this Virginia Army National Guard find MARS to be a important Service. I have served in the active Army for the first 15 years of my service and inn the Guard for the last 5. Any service to your country and it's service members is Honorable. Wake up America the USA is at war. support the troops!
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MARS Hasn't Been Active
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by T32AI on November 12, 2004
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Just as a tradesman has several tools in his toolbox, it's wise to keep the old ones too (U just never know when it'll be the 1 u need).
MARS was and is still another tool in the comm-toolbox.
I've sent/rcvd msgs via MARS to/from my niece and nephew in Iraq.
In the past I was AFC0BNR during 'nam and handled fone patches @ the ripe old age of 14.
73's & "out"
Radio Rick
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RE: MARS Hasn't Been Active
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by K7AAB on March 29, 2006
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Sound like a toolshed from the rear Ghost... why dont you use your callsign? Or do you have one?
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RE: MARS Hasn't Been Active
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by KC5FOG on June 10, 2006
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I'm not involved in mars at all so this comment comes from a non-involved ham. I see the root of most attacks on MARS is because of old timers that are ticked about codeless ops being allowed to use HF. They claim all kinds of reasons the MARS service should be terminated but its all about the HF.
Eric Kc5Fog
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