What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

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What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

MIKE BSEE,/BSCME- M.S.B.M.E (WA2JJH) on September 11, 2004
View comments about this article!

What do you think YOUR $10,000 rig should have in it?

Well, you can plunk down $7-10k and get Yeasu's or Icom’s so called top performer.

However, if you could have a rig custom built for $10,000, what would your design consist of?

1) Chassis like a Drake TR-7. All boards are on a ZIF motherboard.

2) The dual slope VBT of a TS-850 SAT.

3) Choice of 3 roofing filters. 2kHz (CW) 4KHZ (SSB) 15kHz (FM, AM and other modes).

There should be a no roofing filter mode; just to see how good your IF-DSP really is.

Software upgradeable IF DSP. Also in the 2nd IF, there should be a 16 pole filter.

There should also be a 500hz CW filter in the 2nd IF.

Have a choice of using IF DSP for everything from noise reduction. PBT, NOTCH, and speech proc. However, there should be a separate analog receiver.

What I am getting at is a dual personality rig. DSP with automatic and manual controls.

The second RX would be designed like a DRAKE R-7A.

Two transmitters as well. One full DSP. The other would be like a Kenwood TS-850.

Of course for 10K you can mix and match DSP with analog stages.

Operate the rig analog, DSP or a mix. A CPU would have over 20 presets of DSP and analog settings.

The Kicker Dual 48V MOSFET 325 Watt finals. Drive the finals combined for just under 400-450 PEP. Both amps are modified to bias Class A with the flip of a switch. Class A for either a super clean 100W or 40-125W to drive just about any LEGAL Limit amp to clean perfection. The ALC for an external amp can be adjusted exactly for your amplifiers tube age!

Both MOSFET PAs can be swapped out. One that has a external linear can get the rig with one full power 350W MOSFET AMP module. With the 2nd amp not purchased, one can elect to have the output of the driver go though a low power filter network for QRPp operations. About 2-3 W all modes.

To save on weight and size, a highly filtered isolated switching supply will be used to step down the 110 or 220 VAC. To 48VDC and 12VDC. All of the rig works on 12V.

The economy?($5000) version can have 12V bipolar finals for the defacto standard of 100W.

One can upgrade by installing the 48V supply and swapping in one or 2 48V Mosfet Finals.

Of course their will be a USB-2 or firewire PC interface. My fantasy rig would look like and be the same size as the Ten-Tec ORION.

All the fancy band scope displays and 9 band equalizers will be on the PC screen.

The real kicker. The PC display will show a virtual patch bay and test point graphic.

After all the rig have one analog TX on DSP TX proc, an analog RX and a DSP TX.

On the computer screen you can build many transceivers with DSP and real dual IF mechanical filtering. We also have the amplifier module choices!

On the screen you’re able to select exactly what you want.

Of course there is a panic button. Turn the rig off; it reverts to a DSP transmitter, DSP RX, analogue RX and TX.

What about 2M and 440……… Just add a 5W Dual band H-T inside the box! NO…VHF and UHF transceivers use a 3rd analog IF. The VHF/UHF is can use analog or DSP IFs. THAT MIGHT DRIVE THE COST UP!!! UHF and VHF should be restricted to the analog TCVR–my opinion anyway

What is left out.?!!! Antenna tuners! They take up too much space. The external ATUs are under $200! No CW keyer or digital voice recorder either.

This is only MY IDEA for a dream rig I could not spend $10,000 on.

When I look at what I want I get a combo TS-850, Orion, Drake R-7A, Icom 746-ProII, FT-1000 and an old Yaesu FT-560DX and a solid state DRAKE C line!

I am looking forward to what you want to see in a top of the line rig. A rig thats features inspired you. Perhaps your dream rig would not work. Who cares!

You may want to give a simple answer like…A hybrid of the Orion and DRAKE TR-7. How about the TS-850 with it's original external DSP built in? – Forget the 870!

How about a Yaesu FT-100D build like the new Harris mil spec rigs. You get the idea...

There really is no such thing as a stupid feature, if YOU want it!!!

Member Comments:

This article has expired. No more comments may be added.

What do you want for $10,000 in a radio

by OLDFART13 on August 29, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

I wouldn't spend $10,000 on a rig. I would and have spent that much on a tower and antenna system.

RE: What do you want for $10,000 in a radio

by AB5XZ on September 11, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

All that other stuff is nice, but I want *knobs* for tuning and volume control.

73Tom

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by KB9YUR on September 11, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

Forget about spending that much money! How about a simple HT that has 6, 2 & 70cm
and does SSB under $300 !?! I agree with the other posting that it's better to spend
more money on the antenna setup then the radio.

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by WIRELESS on September 11, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

I would like a $2000 price for a $10,000 radio.

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by KG9IO on September 11, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

It would have to come with an attorney because my wife would be divorcing my sorry ass if I spent $10,000 on a radio.

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by N2WEC on September 11, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

First off make it user friendly. Not another useless computer driven thing with 18 menus. Knobs for all functions. Price it to sell. Many Amateurs cannot go out and plunk down $10,000 on a radio. Send a reasonable/useable desk mic along with the hand mic. Have it be at least 100 watts out and be all mode. Have an HF + 6 model and a V/UHF model to include 6/2/222 and 432. Make it similar to the FT-736R with better recieve.

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by W3LOW on September 11, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

You would be crazy to spend $10000 on an HF ham radio, when essentially a rig under $500 will sound just as good on the band and have enough knobs to turn and buttons to poke at. Personally, have received more enjoyment form a lower priced radio than these high priced boat anchors. More fun for me to work a rare DX station with a modest set-up. The radio manufacturers' are laughing all the way to the bank. Of course, without propagation, the most expensive gear will be useless anyway. Guess you can drive a corvette or a truck, but the point is, it will get you there from point A to point B. Would rather invest into a high gain antenna system. But, if you have money to waste, it's a free country.

73,

W3LOW

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by NI0C on September 11, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

Mike,
Nice article speculating about a new dream rig. I share your respect for the features already included in the TS-850S. In fact it's hard to imagine $9000.00 worth of features and improvements to the 850.

If I had $10K to spend on new radios, I'd get a Ten-Tec Orion and a FT-1000D and fill both of them with all optional filters. After doing that, if I shopped wisely in the first place, I might even have some change left over for an amplifier!

73 de Chuck NI0C

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by NI0C on September 11, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

OldFart13:
Your point concerning spending money on antennas and towers is well taken. However, many of us would need to come up with a half million or more to purchase real estate where we would have room for $10K worth of antennas.

73 de Chuck NI0C

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by VE3WGO on September 11, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

I would also like to add high performance for the 50 MHz through 1300 MHz bands, with satellite duplex capability and transverter interfaces too.

As far as appearance goes, one of my favourite form factors is the modern Tek oscilloscope series. They are portable, have a nice control system design based on knobs as well as menus, and great asthetics. For instance, see http://www.tek.com/Measurement/cgi-bin/framed.pl?Document=/Measurement/scopes/comparison.html&FrameSet=oscilloscopes

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by KG4YJR on September 11, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

$10,000 for a rig?!?

Hams are cheap?!?

These pricey rigs from what I hear have been selling and selling well with people on waiting lists.
This should put the typical "hams are cheap" stereotype comments to rest.

BTW - Does anybody know how to calculate $10,000 in todays dollars vs. what a $10,000 rig will cost in 20 years if the trend of the newer rigs keep doing the opposite of computers and plasma high-def. TVs? Prices for ham equipment getting higher instead of like the other technologies that are getting lower.

Also,I can't wait to see if in the hamfest forums and threads like this 10 years from now if you'll see the same type of complaints like:

"I was at Shelby and all I saw was a bunch of dirty 10 year old 7800's stacked up for $9,995!"

73
Dave

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by K2WH on September 11, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

I have the 756pro and rarely use it. Over the years I have found that a good old Hallicrafters or Collins tube rig will perform almost as well as the current crop of Solid State rigs. DSP? My personal experiences indicate its not all it supposed to be. Claims like "Pulls out the weak ones" is pure fiction. DSP just quiets the internal noise generated by the radio.

Lets face it, when you buy a rig, you are buying a receiver. Transmitters are transmitters. Receivers; now thats where performance counts.

K2WH

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by KG4OOA on September 11, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

Hi Mike,

The few who would pay that kind of money would want all the whistles and bells you mentioned and a lot more.

You have to remember what HAM means, "Haven't Any Money". I like your thinking but if I had ten grand to blow, it would NOT be on a radio. Hell, I'd use it for something important like chasing women, fast mobile shacks (with or withpout a rig) or a trip to some of those exotic places. HiHi

73,
Bob

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by K3BU on September 11, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

There is real "Dream Radio One" in the works by Computeradio.us that promises to obsolete all of the above, in modular, user programmable station for a lot less money and lbs.
Check http://www.computeradio.us/ for progress. Soon there will be reflector available for discussions about features, after the detailed information about the system architecture, features and specs are revealed. Stand by for more.

Yuri, K3BU.us

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by N8EMR on September 11, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

WHat I want in a $10000 is a $9200 rebate coupon

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by N9DG on September 11, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

1. Ethernet connectivity (100Mb minimum).
2. Up to simultaneous 6 dual RX + sweep RF I/O boxes all driven from a single user interface (low power OK since I already have good transverters).
3. Support for 3-4 17inch plus monitors.
4. Point and click tuning and a graphic user interface with a waterfall centric design theme, provide one waterfall for each of the 6 RF I/O modules.
5. Tight "in the radio" computer logging integration.
6. An Ethernet based "traditional" knobs and buttons control panel with audio/mic/key I/O for when I feel nostalgic, or want to operate in the next room (CAT5), or by the pool (via WiFi), or 100's of miles away (via VPN WAN).
7. Some genuine imagination for a change, the current crop of $10K+ radios are sure lacking it.

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by AC0H on September 11, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

Anybody who spends $10K on one radio needs some serious counseling concerning inadequacy issues. Some people have more money than sense. There is absolutely no functional difference between an Icom 7800 and an TenTec Orion. The Orion is actually better in a lot of reciever performance catagories. If you get the same performance for 1/3 the price why pay the difference? The only reason I can think of is the proverbial pissing contest. Ridiculous!

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by W6EZ on September 11, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

$8,000.00 in change.

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by WA2JJH on September 11, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

LET ME CHANGE THE TITLE TO INCLUDE MORE HAMS.

Would would your DREAM radio for under $5000 should have.

Yes, I have to agree with many posters that 7-10K for a ham radio is too much!

My second choice would be a hybrid of the TEN-TEC ORIEN and a Yeasu FT-100D with all roofing and 2nd IF filters.

Cut the final power down to a clean class A 100W on the DSP side. The analogue TX would be 125W AB final.
One can save more money by opting to have the analogue
TX be under 25 watts output HF/VHF/UHF.

To keep cost low, the VHF and UHF would be just like the FT-100D or FT-857.

I still want the famous twin PBT the TS-850 has.
The low cost variant will have a built in ATU.

It will be much smaller and lighter than the ICOM-7800.

Cost $3000-4000 max!

Money is saved by having all the fancy scopes displayed via blue tooth or IR link to your laptop.

That is what I think would be an ideal all in one top of the line radio. What do you think?

Would it not be nice if the rig makers, made radio's with features we have wanted from the get-go!

73 WA2JJH MIKE

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by NY7Q on September 11, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

I'd rather have a nice TUBE rig....

RE: What do you want for $10,000 in a radio

by KC8VWM on September 11, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

Icom 7800 radio = $10599.90

Lightning Strike To Same Radio = Priceless

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by OBSERVER on September 11, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

Here’s another one for you, $18,010.00 station…..

Icom IC-7800 - $10,995.00
Alpha 87A - $7,000.00
Dipole - $15.00

I overheard a conversation on 17 meters between a gentleman in California and another gentleman in the mid-western United States. The Ham in California started describing his station, Rig - IC-7800, Amplifier - Alpha-87A, and then came to the most important component of all, the antenna. I was getting excited; I thought maybe a stack of mono band antennas, or maybe even a four element Stepper IR! When he said that his antenna was a dipole, I was very disappointed and tried to analyze the logic behind such an arrangement. The first and foremost important part of a station's performance is the antenna system, period. A high-end radio and amplifier is simply gravy on the potatoes, the meat and potatoes are in the antenna system.

My point is to purchase a radio that fits your budget and station configuration. The IC7800/Alpha 87A/dipole combination just does not make any sense money to burn or not. If you have a configuration like the gentleman mentioned above, when asked what you have don’t say anything about the antenna. Just mention the radio and amplifier, maybe that will change the subject and redirect the conversation. Another option would be to call the antenna a home brew, single element bi-directional dipolar radiator; it at least sounds impressive.

RE: What do you want for $10,000 in a radio

by K4JSR on September 11, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

I still love my little Alinco DX-70-TD that I bought
new from Radio Shack.com for about $400 Bux.
It talks, it hears, it works from 160-6 meters.
It works cw, ssb, am and fm. (No Caps 'cuz it is a small rig!) :-D.
So far I am about 10k Bux ahead and happy.
I will be going to Sevierville, Tn for the Ten Tec
hamfest. There I will ogle and fondle their new Orion
and other goodies. Should I ever feel the need for a
high Dollar rig, it would probably be an Orion.
After all, my other rig is a Ten Tec 544 Digital
that has also served me well for 26 years, and is
made in the good old hills of Tn, as is the Orion.
If I spend big Bux, I prefer to keep them in the USA.
Also, I don't think anybody makes a receiver as well
as Ten Tec does. All of the other stuff is just fluff
for those who have to have the biggest and the baddest
and generally under utilize it.
Paying 10k$ for a ham rig is like buying a ham sandwich and discovering that it is conspiring against you! (Mike knows what I mean!)
73, Cal K4JSR CET
Bethlehem, Ga.

PS. The Ten Tec "Open House and Tailgate Party"
is 24 thru 25 Sept. If you can find Sevierville,
you *CAN* find Ten Tec! You can get a factory tour
as well as enjoy some Southern Mountains
hospitality. No, I do not work for Ten Tec.
I am retired and too old and sorry to work!

RE: What do you want for $10,000 in a radio

by W6TH on September 11, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

What a puzzle.

$10,000 radio and will it bring as much fun as a National SW-3 and a 210 Hartley oscillator, half wave single wire fed antenna with a #47 lamp in series with the antenna?

You have the money, you have the right, go for it and enjoy. I lucked out as I spent my $10,000 sending my children to college.

.: W6TH

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by KY1V on September 11, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

Well I guess I am one of those people who has more money than sense, because I own an IC-7800. I also own a mint Drake C-Line. I like them both and for very different reasons. Heck, I even have an Alpha 87A which is probably overpriced too!

I think most of you that say you wouldn't buy these expensive toys even if you could afford them are only kidding yourselves. I know, I used to be on the other side of the fence and said the same things. Well, things change and so does a persons attitudes and opinions.

Let's put things into perspective. If you earn a million dollars a year, have your dream home, cars, boats, planes or whatever else you want...what's the big deal about buying a $10K radio? Sure I agree, your money is better spent on towers and antennas, but lets face it, not everyone has the real estate or permission to put up huge arrays. Does that mean this person shouldn't have a cool new radio? I am sure there are many hams that can afford a $10K rig but simply doesn't find value in it. To each his own.

For those that are fortunate enough to afford it all, radios, towers, antennas...most are willing to share the fun with ANY ham. Just look at hams like KC1XX, W3LPL, K1TTT, W4MYA and others. They have lots of top of the line radios, amplifiers, towers and antennas. So what if they spent tens of thousands to get them...they earned the money and can spend it any way they see fit. Quit complaining, make friends with them and enjoy the benefits of being a ham operator...what a great fraternity!

Heck, I bought my IC-7800 months ago and still don't have a yagi in the air...although I am close. It certainly isn't because I can't afford it or because I have no room for them. My house is for sale, I am moving back to New England (N.H.). I have a 140' rotating tower in the garage...just waiting to see daylight. In the mean time, I have been enjoying my 7800 with verticals, dipoles and long wires. Finally I have convinced my wife to let me put up a US Tower HDX-555 and a 4el SteppIR in the lot we own next door until we sell the house. The concrete has been poured and I am waiting for the tower. In the mean time, I am still enjoying my IC-7800 even with a dipole!

So, what I am saying is...who cares how much it costs! If you can afford one...great...buy it. If you can't, fine, buy something else, but don't put down those that can afford one regardless of their situation. Certainly don't put down the manufacturers for building them because most of the features will eventually trickle down to other less expensive radios eventually. Isn't that what you want?

Remember, not everyone can afford a million dollar home, a Ferrari or expensive diamonds, but that doesn't mean manufacturers should stop making them or people that buy them deserve less respect, nor are the stupid, foolish or dumb as some here seem to believe.

Now, for those of you thinking about buying a $10K radio, consider this...

1) If you can afford the radio and would be happy with all of the new bells and whistles...fantastic, buy one and enjoy your radio in peace! Ignore the jealous people!

2) For those that have to struggle to pay for one one (sell everything you own, borrow or mortgage your home), I would say that you may be sorely disappointed. It isn't really that much better of a receiver that your poor ear will suddenly convince your brain that you can work some station that you couldn't have worked on your FT-1000D, IC-781 or Orion, besides, if you have to struggle that bad to hear the station, it can't be that much fun anyway.

3) For those of you that can't afford one of these cool toys...quit complaining and go make friends with a ham that could afford one. You can come and play with mine any time!

73,

David ~ KY1V

"Putting on my flame retardant suit..."

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by K1ZF on September 11, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

Gee… and a tricked up R-390 still blows it away.! Hey: if ya got it, spend it. Remember the golden rule… ya can’t take it with you!

Gene K1ZF

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by KG5JJ on September 11, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

A built-in DC to light spectrum analyzer.

73 KG5JJ (Mike)

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by K2WH on September 11, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

Money isn't the issue here. If you have the money. 10k on a radio if you have 100 mill, is nothing. It's the same reason people by Chevys vs BMW's.

Some of us have it some of us don't.

K2WH

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by W3JJH on September 11, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

I want a fully loaded TenTec Orion (all the filters and the fan kit), a TenTec 963 Power Supply, a 238B Tuner, a Titan III Amp, and $1815.05 change.

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by W3JJH on September 11, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

Or maybe I'll get an Alpha 87A Amp instead and settle for only $230.05 change.

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by W3JJH on September 11, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

Opps, I mean an Alpha 99.

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by N2WEC on September 11, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

A real dream rig would have NO computer interfaces, terminals or connections. No way to use EchoLink or iLink. The radio would shut itself down if you try to connect it to the internet. Ideally it would blow its own fuses if it senses an internet connection.

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by NN6EE on September 11, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

Gentlemen,

The easiest and cheapest way to have a decently priced "Dream-Rig" is buy 2 ICOM 756PRO2s and EPOXY them together!!! Boy! That shouldah beeen a "NO-Brainer!!!"

Jim/ee :-)))

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by NN6EE on September 11, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

W3JJH,

Way ahead of you!

I bought a "ALPHA 91-B" for $3000 in change, and though a tad pricey at that time "Damn" it's a FB AMP!!!

Jim/ee

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by N2VJX on September 11, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

With 10,000 dollars I can put a nice down payment on a on a car or a house.

But the for the sake of conversation, I want a 10,000 dollar radio that can do it all. GPS, Satellite TV, Cellphone, Police Scanner, Internet browser, MP3 Player, DVD burner, and what else? oh HDTV with sorround sound speakers; this way I can hear my contacts in digital stereo.

pfft! grow up guys!!!

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by KR4WM on September 11, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

For my 10 grand, I want brick-wall filtering that can totally attenuate an interfering signal 200Hz away, yet still have full 3+KHz fidelity from the station I'm listening to. To me, that would be worth $10,000.00! (Also it's pysically impossible... unless we go digital.)

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by W4MGY on September 11, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

Frankly, there is no current manufacturer of 'ham' equipment that would get my $10,000. Given a choice, the money would go into professional grade gear like Harris or Collins. There is an issue not yet mentioned called 'pride in ownership' or 'snob appeal'. Yeh, it sounds elitist, what the hell, some guys can afford the best and won't own anything less.

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by K1CJS on September 11, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

Mike,

I don't think I'd want a $10,000 rig even if I could afford one--I'd probably be too afraid of hooking it to the co-ax--afraid of the one in a million shot of having it damaged.

I guess I'm like most hams out there, too cheap! But I think I'd rather have a lower cost rig that works well--without all the bells and whistles of the newer ones--for one important reason: Ham radio is my chosen hobby, but it isn't my life. 73, and thanks for an interesting read, nonetheless.

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by X-WB1AUW on September 11, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

That is EASY!
Inside it I want a rebate check for $9,000.
73
Bob

RE: What do you want for $10,000 in a radio

by K6USI on September 11, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

I can't believe it, GET REAL there is no such thing as a $10,000 radio..not on your best day, it's got to be some joke !!!. There is an old chinese proverb..."If you don't understand my silence you will never understand my words"..Answer: what do I want???...about a $9,000 credit.

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by PHINEAS on September 11, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

Expensive radio = bragging rights.

I will not ever put anyone down for spending money the way they want to spent it. I know people who are paying twice as much as their house is worth to live in a flood plain. I own a bunch of music gear. I will bet someone looking at me would make a remark about how I spend MY money.

10,000 dream radio for me would be a piece of land just about 1 hour out of town, where no one wants to live yet, with enough land to put up any kind of antennas I want. Or at least a down payment for one!!!!

Meanwhile, as long as I can talk for under $1000, that suites me fine.

Phineas
K0KMA

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by K6USI on September 11, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

There is no such thing as a $10,000 radio GET REAL, its got to be some kind of joke right???..There is an old chinese proverb..."If you don't understand my silence you will never understand my words"....What I would want is about a $9,000 credit

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by N8GNI on September 11, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

KB9YUR
I agree, a simple HT that has 6, 2 & 440 and
does SSB for under $300. The Icom IC-t90A comes close but no SSB. The FT-817 has all that plus HF ,and not much bigger then the ht's of yesterday. I once had a Santec (sp) that was 2 meter and SSB, I think it was FM also? I don't remember what I did with that radio?
Harry

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by NE0P on September 11, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

"BTW - Does anybody know how to calculate $10,000 in todays dollars vs. what a $10,000 rig will cost in 20 years if the trend of the newer rigs keep doing the opposite of computers and plasma high-def. TVs? Prices for ham equipment getting higher instead of like the other technologies that are getting lower."

Just the opposite. When I was first licensed in 1980, you could get an Icom 2AT 2 meter HT for $250. It had no PL, no memories, no scan, and did 1.5 watts out. Compare that to a $120 VX150 today. Also, today you can get an Icom 718 or Yaesu FT840 for $500 or so new. Radios of that caliber used to cost $700 or more just 10 years ago.

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by NE0P on September 11, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

AC0H wrote:
"There is absolutely no functional difference between an Icom 7800 and an TenTec Orion."

And the Orion puts out how many watts on 6 meter?

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by KC8VWM on September 11, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

"If you earn a million dollars a year, have your dream home, cars, boats, planes or whatever else you want...what's the big deal about buying a $10K radio?"

David, Do you think that people who make a million dollars a year are the type of people that waste money? Actually, you may be surprised to find out that most of them are quite the opposite.

After all, they didn't make a million a year by throwing money away at every whim, did they...

Some of the richest people I know are the most cheapest and most frugal SOB's I ever knew.

73

Charles - KC8VWM

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by NE0P on September 12, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

1. A manual notch filter. Recently picked up an Icom 740, and was really surprised to hear how much better the manual notch did than the autonotch on new radios, and you can use it on CW. Very good at eliminating the background noise and peaking CW signals. Probably as good as DSP.

2. Ham band only receive. How many of us really SWL anyway? You will be surprised how much crud gets into the receiver with the general coverage receive. The couple of ham bands only rigs I have had recently (Icom 740, Yaesu FT77) were very quiet on receive.

3. Optional modules for 222mhz, 902mhz, and 2.3g. 160 through 2 meters, 70cm, and 1296mhz would be standard. 200 watts on HF through 70cm, and 50 watts on 1296.

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by WA2JJH on September 12, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

NE0P cameup with a very important point. MOst RX's are general coverage, and ahe the spur snd birdie problems that come with a 1.8-30mhz front end.

Perhaps one of the RX's and TX's would have ham band only bandpass filters that can be switched in for TX and RX. Maybe that is why the Drake R4-c when modified beats the pants off thr ICOM 7800.

Perhaps the entire front end and 1st mixer can be programmed to kick in the right L/C network for your local.

Perhaps a notch with over 100 memories programed for mixer products and birdies that appear for your local only.!

I agree with several posters who say they should get a multi-thousand dollar rebate, after spending 10G's.

In other words.....we better be getting some very creative engineering in the 10G price range!

My perdiction will be very slow sales for the 7800.
ICOM will through in a slightly modifed 706-IIG with WLAN and as another poster hinted at, some type of special control and interfacing abilities between the two or perhaps 3 radio set!

The 3erd radio thown in foo $10,000 will be a special
multiband H_-T.

Sure for thst kind of money, throw in GPS and a video input on the H-T! It will double as a camcorder!

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by OBSERVER on September 12, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

KC8VWM - well said. The people who earn it the hard way understand its value, however the people who have it handed to them on a silver platter typically don't. As a self-made millionaire you remember what it was like when you had nothing. You got to be a millionaire by saving, planning, taking calculated risks and not purchasing unnecessary items like a $10K radio that isn't really any better than a $0.5K radio. Can the $10K radio filter out that deaf moron that insists on calling CQ right on top your QSO? Can that $10K radio and dipole :-) bust you through a pile up? It's a toy plain and simple. If you have the money buy it and enjoy. If you don't have the money finance it and don't expect to ever become a millionaire with that mindset.

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by K9KJM on September 12, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

This one is easy.
TWO Icom 756PRO's (Used @ 1500 each, And a nice Yaesu
FT8800 for VHF/UHF)
And spend the balance of over $6,500.00 on towers and antennas!

Or if you really like UHF, An Icom 910 instead of the FT8800, Leaving only about 6K for antennas.......

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by KY1V on September 12, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

------------------------------------
Charles (KC8VWM) wrote...

"David, Do you think that people who make a million dollars a year are the type of people that waste money? Actually, you may be surprised to find out that most of them are quite the opposite.

After all, they didn't make a million a year by throwing money away at every whim, did they...

Some of the richest people I know are the most cheapest and most frugal SOB's I ever knew."
------------------------------------

Charles...

First, your statement leads me to believe you presume everyone agrees with your assessment that the IC-7800 or any other $10,000 radio is a "waste of money". While there are several in this group that agree with you, of the few dozen IC-7800 owners I have personally spoken with, I have not yet encountered a single one that agrees with you. Furthermore, I have yet to have a ham sit down and play with my 7800 for a few hours and walk away thinking..."what a waste of money".

Second, the statement "you may be surprised to find out that most of them are quite the opposite" is just a bit pretentious, don't you think? There are more millionaires today than ever and I doubt you or I know more than a handful, let alone most of them.

Besides, what do you think these people drive, YUGO's, GEO's and CIVIC's? Isn't buying any other vehicle "a waste of money"? I know a few people that would say yes to this question.

Personally, I think paying $10,000 more for a Lexus LS470 versus a Toyota Land Cruiser is a waste of money, but there sure are a lot of others that disagree. I have two Land Cruisers and the money I "saved" could pay for two IC-7800's! (notice I take the term "saved" lightly for I know I will get flamed!)

Third, buying a single $10,000 radio doesn't in any way suggest the purchaser is "throwing money away at every whim". Perhaps it is their only whim or maybe not a whim at all. Maybe it was a well thought out decision.

Considering the "upper middle class" household income is near $100,000, (http://www.findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m1374/is_n6_v56/ai_18844576) for those people fortunate enough to earn a million dollars a year, spending $10,000 is equivalent to the average citizen spending about $1000. How many hams are willing to spend $1000 on a transceiver? Many, I think you can agree.

I don't know a single millionaire (I know a few) that does not have tens of thousands of dollars tied up in some hobby that another person wouldn't think is "a waste of money".

From what I have read in this thread, most of the comments supporting the "waste of money" idea are subjective rather than objective and I am quite confident you can figure out why this is the case <grin>!

Have a great weekend.

David ~ KY1V

"Keep it lighthearted for fear of flamers - Nobody likes a crispy ham"

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by AE6IP on September 12, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

I have not noticed that rich people are any wiser than poor people in their spending habits. I have noticed that rich people tend to have a lot more disposable income than poor people, and so tend to have a lot more expensive toys.

And no, it doesn't correlate well with how they earned their money. Some of the hardest working "rags to riches" people I know are also some of the biggest spenders, while my wife has a friend who was born rich and is probably the most careful spender I've ever met.

After all, if you don't spend it when you have it, someone else will when you're gone.

It's pretty easy to invest $10K in camera gear, for example. (A Nikon "prosumer" digital body and two good lenses...) So the question is simply whether you think the $10K is money well spent BY YOUR LIGHTS.

Me, I'd rather put the money into antennas. (My current $1500 station is split about 50/50 between antenna money and rig money, because I don't have the space for more antenna; although I'm lusting after the new step-ir with 40m)

If I were satisfied with my antennas, and felt like putting $10K into new station gear, it would probably include the best 40m receiver I could possibly buy, a decent spectrum analyser, better coax, and a 100w transmitter that was quieter and cleaner than my 706. No amps here. 100w is plenty for the solar minimum, and I'm looking forward to qrp at solar maximum.

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by N6AYJ on September 12, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

Rich people are just like you and me, except they have more money, to paraphrase Hemingway. I like rich people. It's just that earlier in their lives, they made different choices than I did, but I'll bet I had more fun. I believe in the adage, "If you think somebody else has too much money, go out and make some of your own". I also like the way guys with money will usually pay for lunch. I don't see why they should feel bad about talking about their $10,000 rigs on the bands. Everybody should be free to buy the toys that he likes and can afford, and to talk about them all he wants (within reason). I know I sure do, but a lot of times the toys I want to talk about aren't ham radios. So how can I fault a fellow ham with the bucks who wants to talk about his $10,000 rig? My KWM-2 and TS-820 are working just fine, though, so I don't plan to buy any new rigs.

Hiya Mike

by KA4KOE on September 12, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

Good article Mike. Glad to see the Trolls haven't derailed it.

RE: Hiya Mike

by KA4KOE on September 12, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

Diminishing Returns-

Well if I spend 10K on a 7800, will I get 5x the performance of an ICOM PRO2 for ~2K?

I'd love to see someone do an unbiased head-to-head comparison between the Orion and the 7800.

Lack of 6m on the Orion? Depends on if you want to operate 6m. Also, does the Orion bandscope operate real time, and have outputs for an outboard display?

PHILIP

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by AC7KZ on September 12, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

I'd buy a couple of nice $2000 rigs, and spend the rest on the antenna system. What good is a rig if your antenna system sucks.

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by VE3KKU on September 12, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

What would I like to see in a $10,000 radio? A $7,000 rebate coupon....

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by K0RFD on September 12, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

Well, since a $10,000 radio costs more than all of my cars put together, maybe the reply ought to be in that context.

A radio worth more than all of my cars should:

-Run forever without breaking or wearing out like the '90 Camry

-Take me anywhere in relative comfort, albeit not in style, like the '94 Crown Vic

-Give me half as many hours of fun and recreation as my '72 Jeepster has has given me over the years, with only the occasional squirt of ether needed to get her started.

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by WA2JJH on September 12, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

How about this idea. Pay the $10,000.
For the next 10 years you can send your radio back and get the latest one!

Not such a terrible idea? You will get 3 radio's over 10 years. The 2 older radio's you send back can be updated and sold by the manufacturer for under $2500 to new hams.

I do agree with many posters that one could pay $10,000, should get a multithousand dollar rebate.

Many new to ham rsdio, need a simple rig.
The icom 718 seems to be plenty of radio for under $500.

I had another thought. The new Ten-Tec ARGO-5 is IF DSP for $795. Build two of them in the same case.
Simply add roofing filters in the first IF.

When you add the roofing filters, you should get the whole thing for under $2000! True it is a 25W rad10.

Bottom line is that moat hams will spend 2000-3000 dollars for one top of the line radio. Better off getting a secoond radio for $1000.

Yet another direction to go. Many rigs have some type of computer interface.

Maybe some software guru could write the machine code
to interfa A company makes external DDS VFO and computer interface for old Drake ad Collins.
ce any 3 ham radio's together into one working radio system. You will get one rig with the reatures of you favorite 3 rigs you own.

Examples: Combo a TR-7,TS-850, and a yeasu FT-100D

COMBO a icom-775 WITH an Drake R4c.

Perhaps you can take your existing DREAM radio's, and interface/tandem them together. ou can use the TX and Rx sections of these radio's.

Perhaps ICOMSOWOOD IS WRONG! We do to want to buy another $3000 0r $10.000 radio.(unless it baby sits on XMAS night).

TNX FER READING AND 73 MIKE

Yes, we do have our ROLEX that will buy the 7800.

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by K4JRB on September 12, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

The question should be "radio station" not radio. With 60% of hams retired or near retirement $10,000 is a lot of money. For 10 grand I want a transceiver, amp, tower, say a SteppIR 4 el with extra 6 meter elements, and a 2 el 40 meter beam.

The FT 1000D and the Icom 781 were way out of the average ham's budget and the new radio's go far beyond that. I bought the top of the line Yaesu many years ago and for the first few years had to re-learn the transceiver if away for more than a week. I do not feel the average ham will never use all the features even in transceivers priced at 1/3 of the 10 grand rigs. Then we find out these rigs cause key clicks far worse than their cheaper cousins. You can find software for your PC that hives you a band scope
and with the trend toward many feaures being software driven one if left wondering if the investment is worth anywhere close to 10 grand.

Dave K4JRB

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by KB7LYM on September 12, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

What I want to see installed is a stainless steel container just under the top lid. There must be a slit so that I can put the few coins that I have left over can deposit.Also a smoke detector warning me that my $ 10,000 rig is on the way out and that I will be standing on the nearest corner at a highway exit with a cardboard sign saying " NEED $ 10,000 FOR RADIO
ANYTHING HELPS. GOD BLESS !

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by OLDFART13 on September 12, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

72ft US tower
Force 12 C4, 10-40 meters
Wire for 80/160
Yaesu FT-1000mp Mark V, 200 watts.
Bencher Paddle
Direct bury coax

That should be about $10,000

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by W6TH on September 12, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

David KY1V.

You want to threaten my freedom, and you expect me to be nice?

Good show David, you made a wise choice, your freedom to do what you want with your money. After all its only paper and we are not on the gold standard any longer, there is not enough gold to cover the paper dollar no matter how you look at it.

See you in the Free State.

73, W6TH

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by DUALGATEMOSFET on September 12, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

I want the radio to wake me up in the morning, brew my coffee, prepare and serve me a gourmet breakfast, drive me to work, do all my work for me, take me out to lunch at a gourmet restaurant, take me back to the office and complete my work, drive me home, then go into radio mode, make some rare DX contacts for me, log them and send out QSL cards to all my contacts. Then it can tuck me in, tell me 73 and sing me a lull-a-by.

73 from DUALGATEMOSFET
aka
"The Epitaxial One"

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by W6TH on September 12, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

DUALGATEMOSFET

If you live long enough you may get your wish.

Cost wise? A Congressmans yearly salary.

.:

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by HERTZ on September 12, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

DUALGATEMOSFET: "I want the radio to wake me up in the morning, brew my coffee, prepare and serve me a gourmet breakfast, drive me to work, do all my work for me, take me out to lunch at a gourmet restaurant, take me back to the office and complete my work, drive me home, then go into radio mode, make some rare DX contacts for me, log them and send out QSL cards to all my contacts. Then it can tuck me in, tell me 73 and sing me a lull-a-by."

Available technology allows such services only if user is willing to marry the service provider!!!

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by KD5OWO on September 12, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

You would think for a 10,000 dollar radio that it would cover 2 and 6 meters...

73'
+Steve/KD5OWO

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by K3UD on September 12, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

That $1000 you paid fo the Collins 75S1/32S1 combo in 1960 would be worth over $6,000 today.

Similarly, the $1,000 or so dollars that an bought a Drake C line in 1971 would be worth $4,700 today.

Unfortunately median incomes have not kept up with inflation and the $10,000 IC-7800 is as far away from me today as the C line was in 1971.

On the other hand, I have owned several very nice Drake lines when the
used prices on them dropped into my affordability range.

I recently had the pleasure of playing with a IC-7800 for an afternoon at the QTH of KY1V and It is a tremendous rig. I see he has offered to let anyone on this thread to come over and do the same. If you are in the neighborhood, take him up on it :)

If I had a spare $10,000 to burn, I would certainly consider it. However, I get along pretty well with my IC-746pro, the FT-100 and 40 ft tower with an almost full size tribander.

I certainly don't begrudge anyone who has one of these super rigs and hope lot more hams buy them as it might give me a chance to get one in a few years as those on the cutting edge purchase the the next super radio. Recycled radios don't bother me a bit. At some point, it all trickles down to the rest of us.

73
George
K3UD

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by NN6EE on September 12, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

Typically in the manufacturing world the first "proto-type" rig is rather expensive, but with a good volume of rig sales after that IT'S PURE PROFIT!!!

Jim/ee

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by NN6EE on September 12, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

Steve-KD5OWO,

Good point! But let's take it's offerings a step further, not ONLY including 6 & 2m. but also 222-225, 70cm., 1.2 ghz., AND 2.4ghz. AS WELL!!!

For the average "Joe-Ham" $10K+ is a helluva lot of bux!!!

Jim/ee

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by W6TH on September 12, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

IC 7800 is a bargain.

In my opinion I don't believe that $10,000.00 is too much for the IC 7800. I believe it is a promotional sale and as a introductory offer for the knowledgeable ham radio operators.

This IC 7800 is very far ahead of our times and is a step into the future. Time can and will prove what the electronic industry is capable of doing.

This is the most forward step Amateur radio has ever taken and seen since day one. It will continue to do so. Better get used to it because this is the change that American hams have always wanted.

There has to be leaders and followers and the leaders are now buying the $10,000 ham gear.

Eventually, yes, ham radio will be for the wealthy, which are many, so be concerned.

.: W6TH

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by K0IZ on September 12, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

Interesting post! Those that buy the top of the line rigs help the rest of us poor folks, as the technology trickles down.

I want diversity reception, able to hook two different antennas and have the receiver section(s) select the best signal. I now can switch (manually) between different legs of a V antenna and frequently see 10 to 20 db difference between pairs.

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by W6TH on September 12, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

K0IZ

I can make it easy for you to have diversity reception.

You will need two alike receivers, two different antennas as a vertical and horizontal. The audio will be joined and using one output of audio combined..

The second is the one I have used:

Two La Porte Rhombic antennas, three wire system, up at 90 feet, spaced five miles apart, one leading the other. Two receivers, the SP-600-JX. The audio combined into one output. The audio running through 21 miles of telephone line to my receiving station or shack.

Expensive, but sure does work and fun to hear one signal fade and the other take over. There is more to it but cut it short so you may have some idea of how to build your own. Not a weekend job.

You asked and it was given.

.: W6TH

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by WB2WIK on September 12, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

SDR is nice, but HDR is better, and a possibility for ~$10K.

Modern computers (non-mainframe variety) can be infinitely expanded upon with software, but that's not a feature of the computer. A feature of the computer is that it can be infinitely expanded upon with hardware upgrades that plug-in so simply that anyone can create his own upgrade path; and a feature of most low-end servers and even moderately priced PCs is that all critical components most likely to fail or require service are FRUs (field replaceable units) that simply swap out. In many cases, the FRUs are redundant and can be "hot swapped," thus eliminating the requirement for even shutting the system down for maintenance.

Ham gear could *easily* be built like this, with a $10K budget. Rigs having redundant (N+1) components wouldn't necessarily be small, but the recent trend is "big is back" (the IC7800s incredible success truly indicates this), and in the space of a 7800 or the pending FTDX9000 (which is even bigger!), rigs built of field replaceable building blocks, with redundancy of critical subsystems, are very possible indeed.

For $10K, I'd expect not only the 50V MOSFET PA, but I'd expect it to be a hot-swappable module that can be replaced by anybody owning a screwdriver in less than one minute. I'd expect RF and IF subsystems, including filters, that can all be instantly swapped: Pull the little handle, and the assembly drops into your lap. No reason they're not designed this way, other than the designers simply haven't done it.

Constant impedance, low-crosstalk, low-loss connectivity good into the microwave region dominates the computer and data storage industries. We have gold plated connectors that work perfectly for 4Gbps fibre channel (equivalent to ~4 GHz bus speed) that cost about a dollar. Let's start using them in ham gear.

WB2WIK/6

RE: What do you want for $10,000 in a radio

by W8JJI on September 12, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

An $8,000.00 discount.

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by N3NL on September 12, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

For that kind of price, I would want to have a nuclear
battery power source.
Frankly, I think that a conventional QRP station
or regular transceiver gives you more action per
dollar than 10,000 radio.
73, Nickolaus E. Leggett, N3NL

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by W6TH on September 12, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

Steve, what you say is all well and good, but I don't think the mfg's will buy that. A penny saved is a penny earned.

The only way to go in your direction is to go back to the kit form as we now have with the K1 and K2.

This is not the days where all hams are in the electronic fields. Computers, yes, upgrade yes, where you can buy all you need for upgrading on eBAY and such. Ham radio is a different ball game. but have my doubts there will be what you are asking.

As you can see and notice, the manufacturers are going one step at a time, competition is going to be heavy and time will tell of what our future outlook for your sort of demands will occur, if ever.
73,

.: W6TH

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by KC0RDG on September 12, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

"A real dream rig would have NO computer interfaces, terminals or connections. No way to use EchoLink or iLink. The radio would shut itself down if you try to connect it to the internet. Ideally it would blow its own fuses if it senses an internet connection."

LOL! to funny! I have to agree with the internet part, but computer interfaces, I disagree. Digital modes and CAT control are fun!

I say spend 10k if you got it and feel its worth it. Just don't spend the 10k and not feed your family, etc. I am like David. I have spent probably 90% of my time listening and 10% talking. I just find it more fun to listen to others talking. Maybe that will change. *shrug*

KC0RDG

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by KT0DD on September 12, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

KR4WM Wrote:>
For my 10 grand, I want brick-wall filtering that can totally attenuate an interfering signal 200Hz away, yet still have full 3+KHz fidelity from the station I'm listening to. To me, that would be worth $10,000.00! (Also it's pysically impossible... unless we go digital.)

You could probably contract with Harris Radio to custom build you one to those specs for $10-12K. And you might actually get 2-3 channels to choose from HI HI. 73.

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by NN2G on September 12, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

Lets see... 220Mhz multimode, 908 Mhz multimode, 1200 Mhz multimode, 2400 Mhz multi mode 50 watts or better on those bands. In addition to HF plus 6 meters, 144, 440. 250 watts on HF and 6 meters, 144 and 440. 150 watts on those bands. Thats just a start!

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by K5GLH on September 12, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

The very question sets the wrong premise. There is no radio on earth worth that much. It is not a matter of how much money a person has at their disposal but rather a moral issue.

If a person was a billionaire, it would still be too much money. Icom is robbing people and anyone who would pay it is an enabler of the robery.

If you cut the price in half it would still be too expensive. If you are one of those that bought it, I would not tell anyone. Although people may not say it to your face, they will think quietly... "SUCKER". When I saw that price I was ashamed to own an Icom radio.

I am sure there are those who disagree but that is what makes the world different.

Thanks for listening,
Paul

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by N9YB on September 12, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

"What do you want in a $10,000 radio?"

I would ask the question another way. What features and performace levels do you demand in a high-end rig?

What should this mystical rig cost on the open market factoring in a respectable (not over the top) profit for the manufacturer?

RE: What do you want for $10,000 in a radio

by KI9A on September 12, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

I'd like a box, along with the $10k rig, that contains about $8,000.

i got a chance to spin the knobs on a new ICOM 7800 yesterday, not impressed at all. Well, at least not inpressed by the $10.5k price tag. If this was a 5-6k rig, I'd think hard about it.

73-Chuck KI9A

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by KY1V on September 12, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

W6TH

I apologize, but I am at a loss to understand your comments. Please explain.

"You want to threaten my freedom, and you expect me to be nice?"

"Good show David, you made a wise choice, your freedom to do what you want with your money. After all its only paper and we are not on the gold standard any longer, there is not enough gold to cover the paper dollar no matter how you look at it."

How have I threatened your freedom?

David ~ KY1V

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by WA2JJH on September 12, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

Does anybody remember when TEN-TEC made rig modules?
You made your own rig out of the modules. his was bck in the 1970's.

Perhaps we can build on that.

You build only the rig you want to.

Perhaps a FRU appoach that Steve metioned is a good one.

I guess the ELKRAFT people do that on a small scale.
I have heard nothing but good things about the K1/K2.

I just wonder how good the RX can be without roofing filters. Does the K2 stand up well with the ORIEN?

I remember TEN-TEC would sell all sorts of modules to build your own rig. This was in the 1970's

Wonder what could be done today?

For $3000, I can buy a mil spec.Harris 1446U
1.8-30MHz All modes. l986 Vintage.
For $1500, I bought a Harris RF-3200. You should see how these rigs are bulit!

So ICOM....you can do better for $10,000

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by W4EF on September 13, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

Title deed to a 40 acre mesa sitting 1000 feet above saltwater in all directions with no local noise sources.

(uh....and a built in voice keyer)

73 de Mike, W4EF.................................

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by AB8TM on September 13, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

Features I would want in a $10,000 radio:

1. A coffee maker

2. A way to drive it to work.

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by W0NFU on September 13, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

Back in 1957 when I took my novice exam, the guy (W7BGH - now SK) who gave me the test had a 75A-4 & KWS-1 which were state-of-art for those days. I drooled when he let me play with the equipment after taking the test. I knew there was no way that I could afford such a rig.

According to my 1959 WRL catalog, the 75A-4 went for $795 & the KWS-1 was $2095. Together they added up to $2890. Adjusting for inflation, I suspect that would cost at least $43,000 in today's dollars. And the market existed for Collins equipment.

So what does this have to do with $10,000 rig today? Unless the new features have a market, we'd still be using SX-71s (had one & it was a good receiver) and maybe a DX-100.

It's the $10,000 radios which are the R&D platform for features which we now take for granted. For example, consider just one item the 75A-4 had. It had a passband feature which today we expect on all but the cheapest radios.

We need the $10,000 radios and their limited market.

73 - Larry WØNFU

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by KB1KIX on September 13, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

2 $2500. radios, a good amp, a few good beams, tuners, etc. I think I can outperform any $10,000. radio!

This hype of "bigger is better" is rediculous.

I see the same garbage with cigar afficionados that actually believe the reviews in Cigar Afficionado - some people will believe what they read in print from a magazine too dependant on advertisers to actually conduct an accurate review.

More money then brains - they'll buy the toys. But the real hammers will make the most out of a little, rather than the least with the most.

Jonathan

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by KY1V on September 13, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

I am sorry, I cannot pass this one by...

------------------------------
"This hype of "bigger is better" is rediculous."

"More money then brains - they'll buy the toys"
------------------------------

This is utter nonsense!

Last I recall, more brains equals more money...which provides the means to buy the toys. More accurately, it is probably ambition rather than brains, but then who's the wiser?

To prove my point, check the spelling in line one and the grammar in line two.

Now, for the grand finale...

------------------------------
"2 $2500. radios, a good amp, a few good beams, tuners, etc. I think I can outperform any $10,000 radio!"
------------------------------

Let's compare apples to apples, not oranges to orangutans. You are comparing 2 radios with an amplifier and antennas to one $10,000 radio. Hardly a comparison if you ask me. Besides, you left out the towers to support those antennas. Last I checked, a good yagi doesn't work well on the ground!

How about this...

1 IC-7800, 1 Alpha 87A, 1 140' rotating tower with stacked 6/6 on 20/15, one 190' rotating tower with stacked 4/4 on 40 and 7/7 on 10m. and a 2el 80m yagi.

Now, who's going to out perform who?

Oh, and what's the tuner for?

Boy this is the best thread ever, ;~)

David ~ KY1V

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by KY1V on September 13, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

Darn, I almost forgot...

----------------------
"But the real hammers will make the most out of a little, rather than the least with the most."
----------------------

Let's see...I got my license when I was in high school (that's about 29 years ago), I took my general and advanced class tests in front of a real live FCC examiner and I passed my Extra class when the code requirement was still 20WPM.

Shucks, why aren't I a real "hammer"? Must be that darn $10,000 rig I bought.

David ~ KY1V

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by KE4ZHN on September 13, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

Why spend 10k on a single radio? Im quite sure the 7800 is an outstanding radio, but you can build an entire station for 10k and have much more to show for your money.

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by N0TONE on September 13, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

What I want in a $10,000 radio is better performance than I could have, say, 15 years ago.

The lousy close-spaced IMD of the IC-7800 (worse than -80dBc) fails to match the performance of SEVERAL very old designs, including the IC-761 by the very same company!

AM

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by KE4MOB on September 13, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

What do I want in a $10000 radio??

I want it not to die with 3 months of unpacking it.

And if it does, I want a new radio, no questions asked.

I want to be able to ship it back for preventative maintenance and checkups every three years--free of charge.

I don't want the manufacturer to discontinue it a year after I bought it, and introduce a newer model that fixes all the "bugs" I find in my radio.

I want 24/7 customer support.

I want military-spec construction and performance unheard of before in a radio.

I want all components to be rated for at least 100 years MTBF.

I want a radio that will appreciate in value, rather than start out at $10000, then go to $10000 with a $2000 rebate, then show up on eBay 3 years later for $2500.

In short, if I'm spending $10000 on anything, I'm not making an purchase, I'm making an investment.

And very few things these days (short of real estate and stocks/bonds/commodities) are good investments. Electronics isn't one of them.

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by NJ0E on September 13, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

i'm not envious at all of the amateurs who can
afford the ic7800. i hope they enjoy all the
wonderful features designed into this transceiver.
i expect they are mostly ardent dx'ers and
contesters, and they'll be able to put those
features to good use.

i recently purchased a second hand ten-tec
omni 6/opt 3. i bought it direct from ten-tec,
so probably someone had traded it in on the
new orion.

there is no way i could have purchased this unit
new. but ~ ten years later, it came within my
reach on the second hand market.

if you want an ic-7800, you'll probably find them
relatively accessible in another 10 years. just
bide your time.

i also agree with the poster who said that many
of the prosperous amateurs who can afford these
are gracious hosts who open their shacks up for
others interested in contesting and dx'ing. if
you join a contest and dx club in your area,
you'll probably meet many such hams.

vy 73
scott nj0e

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by AD6WL on September 13, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

I want an ACOM 2000A to be included with it.

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by W6TH on September 13, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

David,
KY1V, what was meant of this statement was your freedom to do with your money as you so desire. Really none of any persons business to decide for you of what you should, can and not purchase. "Therefore you can be expected to not be so nice".

"You want to threaten my freedom, and you expect me to be nice?

No offense or displeasure of any kind as I was thinking in favor of your great purchase.

See you in the Free State.

73, W6TH

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by W6TH on September 13, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

After reading what is below, I am very interested in the IC 7800. Read on you Collins fans. Don't ever try to compare a tube receiver of any make or model to the IC 7800.

----------------This IC 7800 is the tops------------

Icom has developed the new flagship model IC-7800 which is a fusion of forty years analog RF circuit development expertise, with cutting edge digital technology.

The result is 110dB dynamic range, +40dB 3rd order intercept point in HF bands and other phenomenal performance features. The receivers combine various current and new technology, to obtain the +40dBm IP3, a specification never before achieved in Ham radio. Quite simply put, the IC-7800 is the ultimate Ham radio. Nothing else comes close!

The ultimate dual receiver performance is at your control; the receivers are completely independent all the way from the 4 antenna jacks, through the pre-selectors, DSP, signal detectors, front panel control, and right into the stereo headphone! The dual receiver allows you to receive two different bands simultaneously in different modes, with each receiver not causing any adverse affect to the other one. This true dual receiver takes your band hopping and contesting experience to the next level!

I am sold on just the receiver alone and you can read on for the other top notch specs.

I will be willing to give my wife and 17 kids up for this radio.
.:

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by KD5WIH on September 13, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

Man, did KY1V hit this on the head! It amazes me how some people can be so petty and jealous. He can afford an expensive radio; that's great! If he lived near me, I'd love to see his station.

Like most hams, I will probably never have a $10,000 rig. I am pretty happy with the TS-130S that I just purchased (used, of coarse) and will be real happy when I get it on the air! I am trying to get as good a signal on the air as I can do on a very limited budget. I am not foolish enough to go in debt for something I can't afford. If anyone is impressed by my station, it will be because I put it together will such a small investment.

I really liked the way KY1V talked about ham radio being a great fraternity- that is super cool. I have ham friends who are more knowledgeable about radio and can answer my questions. I have ham friends who are new to radio, who I can help. I have ham friends who have more money that I and have cool stations. I have ham friends who have less money (Ok- only a few!) who I can help by providing free labor to help on their projects.

You can bet that if I ever do come into a lot of money, I will have an expensive station. If I don't , I will continue to enjoy ham radio with inexpensive gear. Either way, it's a great hobby with many great people involved!

73,
Keaven
KD5WIH

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by YO9FYP on September 13, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

The best radio is the radio you have. I have a TS 450 SAT and I work only DX and contests. For what I spen $10,000 ? Is about same thing !
73 all, Alex

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by N0TONE on September 13, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

KD5WIH, I sure admire your way of looking at things.

I would make one comment stronger. Instead of "I won't go into debt for something I can't afford", I have always lived by "I won't go into debt unless the thing I'm going into debt for will increase in value faster than I have to pay interest on the debt". I've gone into debt for houses, specific speculative investments, and starting a business. I refuse to go into debt for a car, since it goes down in value immediately. Radios are just as bad.

AM

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by NE0P on September 13, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

KE4MOB said:
"In short, if I'm spending $10000 on anything, I'm not making an purchase, I'm making an investment."

And your car has appreciated how much in value?

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by KY1V on September 13, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

Just wanted to let everyone know...

I have had a good time with this thread. It has provided a great deal of entertainment while I sit here waiting watching concrete cure, waiting on my crank-up tilt-over tower and 4el SteppIR to arrive.

Thanks for the great times and PULLLEEEEEZZZZ...do not be offended...this is supposed to be F U N!

See you all on the air in October, CQWW SSB.

David ~ KY1V / VP5X

PS: Any ham (that has had a shower within the previous 24 hours) is welcome to come and operate my station!

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by W6TH on September 13, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

73 Dave, just taken my shower, but only one a day.

Gonna save my pennies for a IC 7800.

Will be listening for that big signal.

You sure have a good disposition, "ease of mind, no temper" and this thread proves it.

Good luck in the contests.

73, Vito W6TH.

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by WA2JJH on September 13, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

I did mean this post in be kind of togue in cheek, and also see if the rig makers are not leaving an important feature out.

I saw many good idea's from many posters.

1)A super no questions asked service contract!
2)Diversity 2 antenna, 2 RX operation sure would help with QSB. I forgot which poster thaught of that.

Diversity RX is very commen with UHF and VHF wireless systems.

Sure would be nice to work a 7800 on the air.

I did not write this post to create a have and have not bicker fest either.

I think a commen goal is a more reliable, robust, and field repairable radio. An upgradable radio. A radio that has everything, but it will not leave out the basics. Like key clicks and a less than decent spectral purity.

73

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by W3DCG on September 13, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

I thought I'd not say a word, but I can't help it.

The future of bells and whistles I believe lies in the marriage of Transceiver to Computer.
The PC has simply become too important in our lives, so common-place, and is simply, too much power to let lay idle.

See us all here? On the computer. My radio panel is just behind this composition- back to what I want in a radio for 10K:

Ideally, a real mouse- with a super nice perfectly sized mini-knob plus thumb and/or finger wheel, the means of manipulating the radio on a super high resolution virtual front panel. Move the palm sized mouse/knob/finger wheel combo pointer, over the virtual control area/field, whether it be RF GAIN, IF SHIFT, BPT, AF, 1st IF filter, 2nd IF filter, Freq, Band, whatever- then turn the knob, or left/right click, or click the knob- resolution/step-sizes controlled by thumbwheel and or click of knob. Only EVERY so called virtual "pot" has such a step size/vernier control option, via only ONE real such wonder mouse controller.

For 10 grand that is what I want. A radio that has even more point/click controls than on a real 7800, with the option of yet, MORE. FASTER. SMARTER. Just a box, with the specially designed Mouse/Dial/thumbwheel, and a super virtual front panel- no wear, no tear, any color you want, user configurable, fully customizable, real time band scopes on either RX, user sizable, bigger, smaller, minimizable to the task bar-
RF DSP, IF Crystal/Mechanical filtering, flawless QSK, Software Defined. Any digital mode you want, at your fingertips. USER DEFINED MODES (probably illegal but there just in case it was not). Include an optimized sound card, or have it as an OPTION.

For Ten Grande, that is what I want- a SUPER Orion- ORISUS (Or-Isis?), with a special custom designed whiz bang mouse thingie as described above, 20" Flat LCD monitor, OOOOOdles of the latest sort of RAM obviously, DVD, R-W CD, option to record anything and everything to CD-(you know, OOOOOOdles of Buffer Memory) as in, record a whole contest on a hand full of CDs, the latest super CPU fast enough to process everything as stated plus surf the web at the same time, ability to EQ and transfer to cassett tape, or other media, ability to edit the audio quality before release... Ability to custom tailor audio, in increments that would be cost prohibitive were a real studio style EQ to be employed.

And still point any beams I have in the direction I want with minimal ado, control the motors in a SteppIR if that's what is partially happening- plus work on whatever is "work" on the PC (Article, Story, Novel, programming Code, picture editing, banner making, card printing, System Monitoring/Administrating, reading/responding to email, whatever "work" is these days).

Well, guess I'm taking about a computer now, aren't I.

But I'm taking about a Radio designed to give the absolute most, designed to be interfaced to such a super PC, because the super PC of now, will be the typical PC for the masses in 5 years.

So I'm saying, keep the chinsy monochromatic LCD, keep your two big knobs, all that- in fact, bail on the whole front panel altogether, work on the GUI, develope and have manufactured the whiz-bang mouse thingie, put the energy into into the various inputs/outputs that will allow for all of the above- as well at the radio INSIDE THE BOX. Pay software developers even- put the money THERE.

Why? Because that is the future. And it's already arrived. PC and Display technology (high resolution color LCD no RFI) is already at a point to where ham radio manufacturers are a bit behind.

The true race, in high end radio- is actually, what manufacturer will implement the above dream radio in the most thoughtful manner, allowing more options and higher performance, for much less than it costs to make the radio to have to include all those fancy backlit knobs, switches, and high end TFT display.

GUI (Graphic User Interface) radio has always suffered in the performance category, but I believe, the time has come, to create a radio designed exclusively as a GUI ONLY radio, forget the hokey REMOTE ENCODER knob, make a real good knob/mouse/thumbwheel combo, develope the software-

Hey wait a minute- Orion will do almost all this won't it? It is completely controllable via GUI, no?

N4PY and others support it, yes?
It is a no compromise radio, isn't it? Fine-

Gimme Orion, in a box- keep the real front panel- reduce the price a thousand dollars so people can buy an LCD monitor instead, add a remote encoder whiz-bang mouse/finger knob/thumbwheel click thing as a 200 dollar option, encourage software developers to develope, thereby simplifying (ELLIMINATING) the fit/fINISH/POLISH aspect of manufacturing. Put it into the electrical design. Make or have made available a special sound card designed for Amateur radio application, as an option, the options become the interfaces that enable the PC/Radio.

Can't compete with fit and finish of the Big Three? Then flat out Do Not Compete.

Make the best radio to be had, by virtue of it's electrical design and quality of the circuitry- the catch is, if the world radio community wants the best radio, they're going to have to get past this fear of PC control.

If you tell the world, "Here is the best ham radio on the planet, and the front panel is awesome, never wears out- only catch is you must use a PC, and we recommend an LCD display in order to fully appreciate it's splendor," I'd bet that lots of hams would be willing to give it a whirl, especially if you could provide a whiz bang mouse thingie (have that part manufactured by contract or find where it already exists and market it as a means by which to sell your Orisus if you must, but keep it quality).

If people are willing to part with Ten Grande for the supposedly "best" radio to be had, I'd bet they'd be willing to part with 10 grande for the ACTUAL best radio, plus added benefit of a high end PC+ LCD display.

I cannot imagine a high end ham shack that does not also posses a fairly decent to state of the art PC as well. Take advantage of it, I say. It's the future.
Just make sure it also has the finest QSK on the planet. Never let die that tradition. It's your crown jewel. Make sure the rig is upgradable to be VoIP friendly as well. That too, is the future. Kenwood's already there. Could it be they are heading in this direction? They make this bizarre thing called the TS 480 front panel won't even attach to the base radio? For those who would be using purely GUI when at home or as a base station, they really need not care about the real front panel, except in a mobile or portable application. If this is the market they sought, mission accomplished. If they wanna sell more 480's they gotta sell the GUI aspect of the radio.

Shift the paradigm, you deal the cards.
Your deal says, here's the best radio on the planet.
If you refuse to use a GUI, then you just don't get to use the best radio on the planet. Period.

Compared to 10 grande? I'm no math genius, but 10k-3k= 7 grande. What kind of PC system can one get these days, for Seven Grande.

So now, for 10 grande, I not only get the finest radio on the planet from a performance and electrical design, operational efficiency perspective, but I also get a 7 thousand dollar PC, which will give me a very pretty, and very large, LCD "Monitor," worthy of viewing the latest videos on DVD, in Surround Sound! More personal empowerment. What sort of things will a 7 thousand dollar PC system do these days, in addition to merely controlling the finest production ham radio on Earth?

I do not know how well Wireless Internet PC works these days, or anything about bandwidth restrictions. But I wonder if someday, one could operate their base station while mobile, using VoIP via wireless connection through a cellular provider. How different would that be, hiking with Laptop, laptop headphones, a minipalm paddle, and some kind of tiny yagi+cellphone that enables your PC to connect to the Internet. Operate from a remote wilderness site, via Laptop, connecting to your base station, running high power and optimal base station antennas. If that fails, bust out the K-1, KX1, 817, DSWII, etc, a pocket full of wire, a vest full of patience, and do it the old fashioned other fun way.

What about contesting? Well, seems like high scorers are using the logging ware to control the rig anyway.

Just my fringe opinion of the future I see. 73, didn’t mean to hog-up all the bandwidth.

RE: What do you want for $10,000 in a radio

by LU1HQV on September 13, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

Add... Real diversity whit both rx.. or tree... quad convertion... powerfull DSP software... +110 db range...
500 W RF final... 16 + 10 filter pole.
good luck!
lu1hqv

RE: What do you want for $10,000 in a radio

by OLDFART13 on September 13, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

by YO9FYP on September 13, 2004
"The best radio is the radio you have."

The best radio is the one you use.

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by WB2WIK on September 13, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

"Sure would be nice to work a 7800 on the air?"

You've got to be kidding! The IC-7800 is so freakin' popular I can't go a day without working one on the air. Seems like all the "in" people already have one, no kidding.

The first in my neighborhood to have a 7800 was WA6DKN, and that was a few months ago. Since then, several have popped up, literally in the neighborhood.

Bunches of them on the air, possibly people don't always mention what they're using. I worked a guy on CW several weeks ago who'd been away from the hobby for several years and decided to get back on the bands in retirement...he bought an IC-7800 and it sounded great (on CW). What a nice way to get back into the hobby after a long absence!

The first production run had sold out before they shipped any, I understand...and now the second run has sold out as well. My local HRO doesn't have one, because they cannot keep one there. The rigs are sold before they come in.

So much for the theory that nobody would pay $10,599 for a rig. Obviously, that was wrong!

WB2WIK6

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by OLDFART13 on September 13, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

Check out the reviews of the radio on eham. Yeah, they are on the air.

http://www.eham.net/reviews/detail/3971

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by N9DG on September 13, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

W3DCG:
"Just my fringe opinion of the future I see."

Welcome to the so-called "fringe". And boy it's sure starting to get crowded out here; we will soon have to push the new frontier out a bit farther.

Nothing you propose is beyond today's *existing* technology and I'll bet *all* of it can be done for considerably less than $10K to boot. And it can have RF performance that meets or exceeds any of the existing high-end radios today or yesterday.

No doubt about it, ham radio is quickly becoming ready for another paradigm shift of a magnitude that we haven't seen since the vacuum tube came onto the scene so many years ago.

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by K3UD on September 13, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

"The best radio is the one you use."

Lots of truth to that. This is also the first thing you hear at amateur astronomy star parties when someone who is not yet involved asks the question about the best telescope to buy.

73
George
K3UD

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by AI3W on September 13, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

Seems to me..... that Ham Radio is a HOBBY. A hobby can be as expensive or cheap as you want to make it. Having said that, I would NOT send my kid off to football camp with the latest and greatest if he never touched a football before. Or I would not go out and buy a Steinway Grand for my daughter who wants to take piano lessons.

I grew up poor (and still am, monetarily). I'm not looking for sympathies, believe me. As a husband and father, I have moral responsibilities to take care of my family. If I would venture into getting one of these radios, I would be depriving my family of something, be it food, shelter or clothing.

I joined the hobby, just as that as a hobby that I can enjoy. I do not, not have I ever tried to 'keep up with the Jones'es'.

My time for the hobby has to take a back seat sometimes for other responsibilities. I like to impress the boy scouts with my little 706 that I can talk to someone over on another continent. Yes, you can do it also with a more expensive radio, but if we are to impress the younger generation into our hobby, then let show them with radios and equipment that they can afford.

I have heard true gentlemen working off their old tube radios that enjoy the hobby just as much as the one who 'has to have it all'. And I have heard total jerks (on 75M) who use their 3k radios like CB sets.

Take stock into your priorities and what time you have left on this earth and enjoy the journey.

Last thought for your mind...... I have never seen any luggage racks on hearses. Meaning you can't take it with you.

73 DE AI3W, Rick
FM19pw

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by NE0P on September 14, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

The 7800 is not built for most hams. Probably 75 to 80 percent of HF hams get on the air to rag chew, check into a WAS net, and maybe hand out a few QSOs during their state QSO party. For this type of activity an Icom 718 will do just fine. Better yet, get a used Icom 730 at 1/2 the price of the 718, and it will probably outperform a 718.

For these people the 7800 would be overkill, and some of them get on eham and other places complaining about $10,000 rigs. They must be the ones with the inferiority complex, though, because Icom's decision to market the 7800 has no impact on them. Icom did not discontinue their entry level rigs to produce this. Nor would the price of the 718 or 706 go down if they didn't market it. I can't see how the price of the 706MKIIG could go down much lower than it is today-probably the best buy in ham radio right now. Anyway, these whiners and complainers can't stand the fact that someone can afford something they can't.

Now there are hams who will truely use and appreciate the 7800, and they need that type of radio. Try to do serious contesting with an entry level radio. You can't. A few years ago I had an Alinco DX70TH and I was using it in the November SS, with a dipole for an antenna. The radio became unusable on 40 meter SSB because the front end completely overloaded. I had to turn it off and wait until sunday for 20 meters to open again. THis was hardly a serious contest setup or effort.

You hook up many radios to high gain (not Hy-Gain) antennas, and they just won't perform in a contest environment. THis is where the high end radios are needed.

Personally, I can't see why anyone would spend $20,000 on a car, but probably 30 to 40% of the US population has done that recently. I recently got an Icom 740, which has about a total of $500 currently invested in it (paid 300 for the rig, $150 for alignment and internal keyer board, and 50 for CW filter). THis is a 22 year old radio that still performs like a champ. I expect to get 22 more years out of it. How many cars from 1982 are still on the road? Of those, how many would you actually want to ride in?

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by W4ZV on September 14, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

I simply want the best close-in IMD, BDR and Phase Noise performance of any rig on the market today, as documented in independent evaluations by ARRL, RSGB, Sherwood Engineering and W8JI. And by the way, thank you very much Ten-Tec for the $7000 in pocket change!

73, Bill W4ZV

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by K0IZ on September 14, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

Re W6TH, Vito comment on diversity reception -

WOW - what a setup! Rhombics!!

I have tried hooking up my 75S3B and KWM2A to different antennas. The old (50 yrs ago) method was to couple the AVC (AGC) together so that the stronger signal would quiet the other receiver. For the moment I have my headphones set up for "stereo" with the 75S3B feeding one side and the KWM2A the other. Poor man's diversity!

Like your station on QRZ.

By the way, to see what else is coming in new technology, check out http://rfspace.com/sdr14.html. Software defined receiver. 150Khz bandwidth, able to store on computer and then "tune" around.

John

EXTREME HYPE ALERT!!!!

by W4ZV on September 14, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

Vito, please DO NOT fall for Icom's over-exuberant adverstising hype. Read on for some FACTS.

W6TH wrote:
"After reading what is below, I am very interested in the IC 7800. Read on you Collins fans. Don't ever try to compare a tube receiver of any make or model to the IC 7800."

----------------This IC 7800 is the tops------------

Icom has developed the new flagship model IC-7800 which is a fusion of forty years analog RF circuit development expertise, with cutting edge digital technology.

The result is 110dB dynamic range, +40dB 3rd order intercept point in HF bands and other phenomenal performance features. The receivers combine various current and new technology, to obtain the +40dBm IP3, a specification never before achieved in Ham radio. Quite simply put, the IC-7800 is the ultimate Ham radio. Nothing else comes close!

The ultimate dual receiver performance is at your control; the receivers are completely independent all the way from the 4 antenna jacks, through the pre-selectors, DSP, signal detectors, front panel control, and right into the stereo headphone! The dual receiver allows you to receive two different bands simultaneously in different modes, with each receiver not causing any adverse affect to the other one. This true dual receiver takes your band hopping and contesting experience to the next level!

-----------------------------------------------------

"I am sold on just the receiver alone and you can read on for the other top notch specs.

I will be willing to give my wife and 17 kids up for this radio."

Don't sell off your first-born for the "ultimate" package of undocumented and unadulterated marketing hype. Look at the following independent third party tests of the IC-7800 relative to other rigs:

ARRL: http://www.elecraft.com/K2_perf.htm#5%20kHz%20numbers

Sherwood Engineering: http://www.elecraft.com/K2_perf.htm#5%20kHz%20numbers

W8JI: http://www.w8ji.com/receiver%20IM3%20sorted.htm

RSGB: There is no link but RadCom magazine's August review of the IC-7800 showed that its Phase Noise was so bad that IMD and BDR measurements were "noise limited" at 2 kHz spacings and under. Incidentally, ARRL's Expanded Test Report documented the identical problem here: http://www2.arrl.org/members-only/prodrev/pdf/lab/ic7800.pdf (page 17 - asterisks by 1 and 2 kHz IMD and BDR measurements - "Noise-limited at the value indicated.")

Bottom line: The IC-7800's IMD, BDR and Phase Noise performance is not even as good as the $599 Elecraft K2 at 5 kHz spacings. At 2 kHz and under, Ten-Tec's $7000 less expensive Orion absolutely blows it away. It NOT the "ultimate" or "the tops" in performance unless you count overblown marketing hype. Shame on Icom for letting their marketing and advertising folk produce such clearly deceptive advertising claims.

Caveat Emptor and I suggest you hang on to the wife and kids!

73, Bill W4ZV

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by KJ7XJ on September 14, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

I don't have that kind of money for this hobby, and if I did spend that much for anything in HAM radio, I would probably would no longer have a wife! Seriously, I dont think I would want to invest that much in a radio. I am perfectly fine with my under $500 rigs. Eric

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by NL7W on September 14, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

Considering the IC-7800, there are obviously better performers out there (in terms of receiver specs). But, would they serve the wants of the various users in the target market? Probably not... hence, Icom’s introduction of the IC-7800 - a gee-whiz, high-spec, high-tech radio system.

WB2WIK mentioned, "A feature of the computer is that it can be infinitely expanded upon with hardware upgrades that plug-in so simply that anyone can create his own upgrade path; and a feature of most low-end servers and even moderately priced PCs is that all critical components most likely to fail or require service are FRUs (field replaceable units) that simply swap out. In many cases, the FRUs are redundant and can be "hot swapped," thus eliminating the requirement for even shutting the system down for maintenance." This almost sounds like a mil-spec (gov’t spec) radio -- something the IC-7800 is aspiring to become? A "radio system" with FRUs would be nice as technology improves upon the DSP/CPU processing aspect of the future transceiver. A well-built and configurable radio front-end, with a hardware (DSP/CPU) swappable boards or modules, as well as software upgradeable capabilities (software defined radio) would be ideal.

Heck, maybe a company could offer a configurable RF front-end... one that offers just HF, or HF through UHF and beyond.

73.

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by WA2JJH on September 14, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

I never said nobody would buy a $10,000.
I just feel that it should be atleast twice as good as an ORIEN.

It is what the operator does with rig that is part of the performance equation.

I would also expect TEN-TECS or ELKRAFTS support for $10,000. I am sure they are selling well for the niche market.

I guess I am just too busy with school to have worked a 7800 station.

If someone in the east coast with a 7800 would like to set up a sked, that would be OK by me.

I would be curious how my mil. spec HARRIS would compare with it.

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by N0TONE on September 14, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

NE0P, nice posting.

You're right, casual operators don't need super good receier performance. It's in the heat of a contest that you need a good receiver. In the heat of a contest, is where the IC-7800 falls flat on its face.

I have used the IC-740 myself. I would just bet that close-in dynamic range equals the IC-7800. For contesting work, you would not be upgrading from the '740 to the '7800.

AM

RE: EXTREME HYPE ALERT!!!!

by KG4PFO on September 14, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

How about a $9000.00 Rebate !!

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by WB8ROL on September 14, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

A $9,500.00 rebate coupon.

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by OBSERVER on September 14, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

Is an ORIEN a clone of Ten-Tec's ORION but is produced in another country? Does Walmart carry it?

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by WA2JJH on September 14, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

How about a V chip option for 75M!

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by K0RFD on September 14, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

KY1V wrote:
>1 IC-7800, 1 Alpha 87A, 1 140' rotating tower with
>stacked 6/6 on 20/15, one 190' rotating tower with
>stacked 4/4 on 40 and 7/7 on 10m. and a 2el 80m yagi.
>
>Now, who's going to out perform who?

Probably the better operator.

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by OBSERVER on September 14, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

KY1V wrote:
>1 IC-7800, 1 Alpha 87A, 1 140' rotating tower with
>stacked 6/6 on 20/15, one 190' rotating tower with
>stacked 4/4 on 40 and 7/7 on 10m. and a 2el 80m yagi.
>

>Now, who's going to out perform who?

Really depends on band conditions. However, I suspect that I'd beat the pants off of you using Echolink and a high speed internet connection.

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by K6BBC on September 15, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

What would I wany?

Three meals and a place to hide.

K6BBC

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by AB8TM on September 15, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

a built in assault rifle and a built in arby's roast beef factory

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by K4WOQ on September 15, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

Count me in if it includes a guide on how to justify such a buy to the significant other who does not understand the art or science of being a ham.

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by KF4VGX on September 15, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

I want to be able to drive it across country on less than ten gallons of GAS !

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by AD6WL on September 15, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

The base is completed and the 72' tower goes up in about a month. This will help my DX and contest operations a lot more than a $10K radio and a lot cheaper too. Heck, I can buy an ACOM 2000a amp along with the tower and it will still be cheaper and help more than a 10k radio.

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by W4ZV on September 15, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

OBSERVER wrote:
>Is an ORIEN a clone of Ten-Tec's ORION but is produced in another country?

Made in Ireland!

73, Bill W4ZV

RE: What do you want for $10,000 in a radio

by WR8D on September 15, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

Out of the question! A few years ago i did buy a new alpha and icom 775dsp and thought i needed my head examined shortly after. 10k just for a rig that a month later is just another "aging" radio, ain't no way!

73, John WR8D

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by KC2CBA on September 15, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

Who cares how individuals spend their money.Whats important is how our local,federal and national goverment spends our money.

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by WA2JJH on September 15, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

AURORA PROJECT

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by WA2JJH on September 15, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

I would also like a radio that is all FRU in design.
My Harris 1446U is a rig that self diagnoses which FRU is defective. This rig is 18 years old and works perfectly.

The 1446U was meant to be fixed by anybody with maybe an hour of training.

The FRU's can all be swapped out with a screwdriver.

The FRU concept is also used by high end IBM laptops.
I had a bad hard drive, becuase of a high-G drop.
IBM sent me a new 80GB hard drive,no questions asked!
The new preloaded hard drive was sent OVERNIGHT!!!!
NO CHARGE!

I have had nothing but troubles with getting DELL LAPTOPS repaired.

If it is status symbols you seek, check out the BREITLING B-1. It is one of the watches used on the space shuttle, ISS, and fighter pilots.

$3000 for a watch!!! $19,000 in 18K gold.
One of the things woman look at in men....Your shoes and your watch. I can wear my B1, not my rig.

I did not opt for the 18K gold. It simply will not scratch in stainless steel. I do use all the functions, except the night vision compatable illumination backlight.

Everybody knows most ROLEX's are worn are fake.
Funny as heck if the 7800 is bootlegged!

Imitation case. A crap rig inside. Sold by an estate broker!

Ultra nice screen saver and constant UTC time at
WWW.Breitling.com

With that...more dead dudes!

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by WA2JJH on September 16, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

The OM that came up with user custom front ends is on the money.

Some hams like W8JI have taken old Drake R-4C's and have got RX specs better than the 7800,R7A, other high end RX's.

I hae done many front end mods to TR-7's and my R7A.
Also AGC, ALC, 2nd if and audio stages.

Few rigs offer the ability to redesign your own to sort of speak.

If the DREAM rig(lets call it the Aurora hi-hi )
Had a FRU/PC like motherboard like structure, how about this.

Have your factory front end. However leave a slot dedicated to your own. It would be populated with factory companants, so you will have a redundant front end.

However the board will bigger, have no SMT's and perhaps leave a blank solder pads and traces.
For example you may want either a front end ultra opimised for ham bands only. You may want a broadband
front end for casual "scanner like use".

The mixer swap out on the TR-7 is great. I removed the 1980's vari-l DBM with a state of the art minicircuits mixer with lower loss.
Between the Mixer change, and the DRAKE ex- engineer transmit ALC mod, I have a radio that performs very well.

So I would also want a modification friendly rig.

The OM that wanted the machine gun and Arbys roast beef snadwitch option.

Hmmmmmmm......Thats cool. However I do not think you will get FCC type acceptance! You will also need an FFL lic. for out of state operation dept of health inspections, Michael Moore stalking you, ect!

I mean like SH--, it is enough to worry about meeting IMD and spurious requirements. You could get a pink ticket from the FCC, ATF and the U.S.D.A! It's the U.S.D.A that really is a hastle.
10G's in bribe money does not go far these days. Unless you have Michael Moore do a movie about it!

You could avoid the ATF by using directed energy weapons, like DPSS lasers. 10W @808nm/square mm will consume only a 3 volt @25 AMPS if you do not use a YAG XTAL to change the frequency/color of the beam.

If you layer youR dream rig with rye and baked ham slices, you truly have a HAM RADIO!!!!!!

Gee, I feel like Radio shack, you got questions, I got answers that suck!

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by WA2JJH on September 16, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

SRI FER MULTI-POST OMS.

I deliberaltly went a little histrionic, narsistic(yes spellin MIS-STEAKS fer u OCD-AR types) CAUSE some dude in another post claims he is in trouble with the FCC because of something he wrote on eham or QRZ.

He said it was for tongue in cheek humor that did it!
I admit I can be so T.I.C, I might need oral surgury.
What can be so tongue in cheek(TIC) to get your ticket yanked.

seqways into....How about a V chip for 75M...Really!
From what I hear it sounds pretty bad.

We want the young ones to get into this little hobby of ours.

We do have kids that have thier General that are under 15 years old. You may have a young one that is a Hamlet or avid SWLer. My friend KA4KOE has a 12 year old daughter that will be a ham soon.

It does not have to be on a $10,000 rig either.
Simple lock out the voice spectrum of 75M when your kid is just SWLing. I would not even use what I hear on 75M as part of my stand up act.

I do admire ICOMS price spread. They have a real bargain HF rig for under $500.

KENWOOD, you used to be the leader in HF. The TS-850, and the TS-50. That was over 10 years ago.

Kenwood always had the advanced features first and inexpensive. What happened to you?

The TS-480 too late!

Come up with a $2500 rig that will turn heads.
Hint: A TS-850 with IF DSP. A secondary RX with your famous cascaded filter design in the TX and RX path a with DSP enhancements that are software upgradable MANUAL as well as the crummy auto notch and please twin slope PBT

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by WA2JJH on September 16, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

The Orien is

a)A glitch in my speecg recog system. Fast but only 98% OK with many hours of training.

b)The Irish xport version painted in that blissfull green of a Colleens eyes. Simply fab with her red hair.
The red of the meters are that of her long hair.

The ORIEN is only sold in southern Ireland of course!

The ORIEN is TEN TECS FOLLY!!!!! The ORIEN is really the code name for the E version.

The E version makes the current run like like a POS.

CODE: ORIAN THE A VERSION 100% DUTY CYCLE ALL MODES!
THE ORIUN is the U version. It will be public
in 6 months or only after the a,e,i,o versions are all
sold. The U version will be just like a 7800 for $5000.
The U stand for universal. The U will emulate the 7800 on a PC! It will emulate all RF defects by simply downloading the downgraded software.

The U will emulate any rig on a PC. The EICO-753 emulation mode is back-ordered for months by nostalgia buffs!!!
Actually it is a usefull operator tool. The operator will have to build great antenna's and practice constant QSY skills.

The BPL emulation may be popular too!

TEN TEC MAKES AN ANTI-TRUST AGREEMENT WITH ICOM
THE 746,746PRO PRO-2,PRO-3EMULATION WILL NEVER BE AVAILABLE!
COME TO YOUR OWN CONCLUSIONS ON THAT ONE!

BY this time the ICOM PRO 7 will be out. If you bought the 6, you really have the SCHMOE 6!

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by HF2PWA on September 16, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

I would buy a 7800, if it shut up all you old farts that like old Drakes and the TS-850.

Thats all you and that old fart Steve from 6 land ever talk about!

What is really dumb is the doofiss that converts R4-C's to so called the number one RX.

Does eham pay you old farts to write this crap.

For under $1000, you get all the rig you ever need.
So what if these rigs have audio DSP! It is all digital
anyway. Who cares where the signal is converted.

It is all ones and zero's. Just write the right program.

That is the future.

Why does eham post crap like yours and Steves(MR WIZZARD WIK/2)

What makes the drama funny is that you and Steve bicker with each other!

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by WA2JJH on September 16, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

biff/HF2PWA, I think you just saw my last name and Steve's

I do not think anybody gets paid to write for EHAM.
I am not going to get into any psyco-babble.

I think your just anti-semetic. I happen to be Italian. I cannot speak for Steve. I only know Steve from his many EHAM technical postings.

Interesting name....BIFF. Is that from "Death of a salesman" The movie and Book?

EHAM will publish anybodys post.

Why do not you write an artical for EHAM.

The results run the full spectrum.
People will either thank you for an interesting thread idea. Some will make meanfull feedback and constructive critique, and we have the TROLLS.

The philosopher Marcus Aerellius had much to say about trolls. No he did not call them TROLLS.

He said we need TROLLS, criminals, and other lets say
negative people.

They have been here since the beginning of civilisation. We always need a reference point! Like 0 volts DC for example.
73 and when you work on a 3-500 amplifier, do not ask me for advice. I might forget something.

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by G3RZP on September 16, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

$9,999 in change!

My old and much modified FT102 has all the performance and bells and whistles I need - see QEX for May 2002 for why.

Nothing you can do to a rig will speed up the expeditions to the last two countries I need - KH7K and KP1!

73

Peter G3RZP

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by W9WHE-II on September 16, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

Get Real!
Buy a $10,000 HF radio, it WILL DEPRICIATE more in real dollars then any other electronic toy you have ever purchased. History tells us that today's $10,000 radio will be $9,200 in a year and $7,000 in three years. By the time Icom comes out with the next generation of super radio, your $10,000 HF radio will be worth $6,000 on the resale market.

Anyone that thinks a $10,000 HF radio is an investment is fooling themselves. If you like the radio, buy it. But don't kid yourself (or your spouse) into thinking its an investment.

W9WHE

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by OLDFART13 on September 16, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

For that kind of money I would like the following two accesories:

http://www.eham.net/libraries/download/360/Buy%20an%20US%20Tower%20and%20get%20this%20bonus.JPG

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by OLDFART13 on September 16, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

Cut and paste the above web address to your browser. It will be worth it, I promise.

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by WB8ZCC on September 16, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

I'd like $1000 in features and a $9000 rebate.

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by WA2JJH on September 16, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

DIFINITLY OLD FART! However they look a little young.
I would settle for Britney Sphears look a like B-girl.
For 10G's, yeah OK! for the night.
OK OLD-F, you made your point!
WoW are those boobs.....i mean batteries D size!

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by OLDFART13 on September 16, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

How this for an accesory?

http://www.eham.net/libraries/download/418/YL.jpg

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by VE7ALQ on September 17, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

I already have my dream radio in my ICOM IC-706 mark II G With the various (250 Hz, 350 Hz, 500 Hz) optional CW filters, IF shift, clarifier, and toggleable receiver preamplifier, plus general coverage transmit and receive from 60 kHz through 199 mHz, who could ask for more?

p.s. I bought mine new for CDN$1050 or about USD$750.

Accessories

by KA4KOE on September 17, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

OLDFART:

I guarantee the OM isn't going to be playing radio in the shack.

Just a reminder to all that there are lots of things more important than radio.

YEAH!!

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by NL7W on September 17, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

WA2JJH said:
"KENWOOD, you used to be the leader in HF. The TS-850, and the TS-50. That was over 10 years ago.

Kenwood always had the advanced features first and inexpensive. What happened to you?

The TS-480 too late!

Come up with a $2500 rig that will turn heads.
Hint: A TS-850 with IF DSP. A secondary RX with your famous cascaded filter design in the TX and RX path a with DSP enhancements that are software upgradeable MANUAL as well as the crummy auto notch and please twin slope PBT"

Right on! The TS-850Sat still has one of the best receivers ever designed for ham radio! If you install good International Radio filters in both IFs, you sure have a winner. The transmitter's IMD level is a little higher than I would like, but the transceiver's audio quality on TX and RX is phenomenal. A most excellent radio... and one I won't get sell.

The only radio I'd gravitate to today is the Ten-Tec Orion. Its properly designed front end, i.e. the switchable and selective roofing filters, and DSP capability, make it a winner today.

The IC-7800 can't claim the same close-n performance as the Ten-Tec...

73.

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by WD9CMD on September 17, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

Well, to start with thats way to much money for any, I mean any, ham radio.

However, of the ultimate radios out there, I'll put my money on Ten Tec with their Orion and subsequent revisions. After all, how many buyers would there be for a $10,000 custom radio? Ten Tec is US made folks! Its not been too long ago, people referred to the foriegn radios as "jap traps". But now we live in a world of Toyota's and Honda's. Call me old fashioned, but I believe in US goods and service whenever I can get them.

Lastly, if R.L. Drake or Collins were still in the ham radio business, I'll bet you would find their technology and service equal to or better than Ten Tec, if thats possible!
BUY AMERICAN!

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by WS8B on September 17, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

IR port for programming...

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by K8SWL on September 18, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

$10,000 for a radio? I don't have that kind of money invested in my entire shack! And I have a shack full of good equipment.

The aspects of Amateur radio that I find interesting are;

1. Finding equipment priced extremely cheap (or free). It usually requires repair, so I repair it.

2. Adapting equipment designed for other services for amateur use. Generally surplus and cheap!

3. Homebrewing.

4. Modifying existing equipment to get it to function as well as the newer stuff on the market.

You won't see my shack on the cover of QST or CQ, because it isn't new and pretty. Most of it is scratched, dented, etc. But the bottem line is it works, allows me to persue the hobby and prvides me with hours of activity.

There isn't a radio made worth that kind of money to me. If I had an extra 10 grand I'd add on to the house so my over crowded shack would be more usable.

But, to each his/her own.

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by WA2JJH on September 19, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

Yeah, when the rubber hits the road....I would rather have 4 rigs for the price of one.
Maybe have money left over for an AMP, and a $20 inverted V.

Funny how the mil. rigs in the same price range, do not have all the bells and whistles.

However these rigs, one can fix under fire!
Included in the price is a set of spare modules.

The only reason why a ham rig has PBT, notch, and DSP is the fact that we are crowded in spectrum.

If you think about it, the features are either for contesters or to escape QRM.

I just picked up a Ten Tec pegasus on ebay.
This will be my first IF-DSP rig.
I was not that thrilled in the audio DSP built into my FT-100D. The IF shift was useless,because the IF was not shifted. Some audio trick was done.
The 3 types of noise reduction were odd. The FT-100D is a noisy radio from the get go.

I did like the TX audio equilizer. I was able to get 3 very different audio types.

Antenna and operator skill is just as important as how fancy the rig is.

I could get excellent results using he FT-100D with an inverted V.

Nobody yet has been able to make that signal that is half QRM,QRN, and QSB become arm chair 5-9 copy.
Perhaps Digital Voice may help with diversity ANTS and RX's.

We have seen too many rigs with ultra complex IF DSP.
They did not put in a roofing fllter after the first mixer. The result DSP artifacts.

What is wrong with dual IF XTAL filters, enhanced by software programmable IF DSP upgrades.

Sure those technicolor displays are nice, but they add to the cost.

Very few have opted to use oversize finals and let the rig run Class A bias. OK only 33% efficiency.
You are not operating it on penlight cells!

Have we really progressed? Many Hams get great enjoyment out of an $800 rig.

Every ham hates it when he cannot fix the rig.He then has to ship it some place.

The ham radio industry could have learned a thing or 2 from the PC market.

Hey my radio's down. Run a diagnostic. The Rig maker will ship you out a computer alignable FRU.

I was hoping to see more progress in SDR and PC alignment of a radio. Motorola's high end H-T's can be aligned by a PC.

I guess I should have titled this thread......What do you want in a radio.

Those that baught the 7800, enjoy!
I would be really P.O.ed if I found similar circuits in the PRO-3!

Some radio's hae been around for years. In fact some Drakes and Collins, do appeciate in price!!!!!!

Some company makes rock stable DDS VFO's with PC control for rigs 30 years old or older!
Those radio's have been modified and are sometimes better then the new radio's!

I guess I want a rig that I can do some repairs. An RX that is noise free. A TX that has clean punchy audio. I do not want to hear filter bleed blow through.
I do not want such a level of DSP, that the audio is readable, but not comfortable to listen too.

I think built in ATU's are a waste. For under $150, one can purchase that tiny LDG.

I would hope 48V MOSFET technology shows up in more finals. I would like ultra light,no RFI switching supplies.

What use is a ICOM 706-IIG, if I have to lug a 25A power supply to power it. I have a 75A supply that weighs 7lbs. It powers my entire station.

Rigs tend to be too micro sized or too big.
A happy medium may allow The AC supply and 8 lithium D batteries for portable/QRP use.

73 DE MIKE

The second RX is something that can be of use.

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by AB5XZ on September 20, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

Oh I forgot:

I want my radio (with knobs for AF gain, RF gain, and tuning) to draw 100ma at 13.8vdc when receiving, unless it's Really Fancy receiving, in which case 250ma is acceptable.

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by N9WX on September 20, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

Well,

I don't know, I haven't seen the 7800 work and am not technically knowlegable enough to tell you if it's worth $10,000 or not, but from what I HAVE seen, the specs on it seem that much better than the ProII to justify the price.
For $10,000 I could buy two ProII's and a bucnh of nice gear for VHF/UHF operations and a NICE tower and antennas!
Personally, I don't care if it can decode RTTY or PSK31 for me,Whoooooopdee doooooo! Most of us have computers and can download MMTTY for FREEEEEEE!
(Thanks Mr. Mori)With the sunspot cycle bottoming out soon, I'd rather it do 1,000 watts out! How's that for barefoot ay? They brag about 200watts...but the proII does that for alot less!
Just my opinion.
73
Daniel N9WX

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by WA2JJH on September 20, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

AB5XZ makes a good point. RX consumption. The average base rig draws 2 amps on RX.

Perhaps make the radio dual personality.

1)REGULAR MODE ALL BELLS AND WHISTLES.

2)QRP MODE. JUST BASIC CIRCUITS USED FOR TX/RX.
100MA rx 500MA FOR 3 WATT MAX TX.

Did you know that the oldest VHF handhand holds the record for squelched RX minimal power consumption.

The OLD(1960'S INTRO) MOTOROLA HT-220 in VHF drew only 15ma in squelched RX!

That radio had NO IC's. Just over 30 transistors!

NO RIG COMES CLOSE!!! I HAVE SEEN 45MA SQUELCHED.

1000W HF Rig

by KA4KOE on September 20, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

Only 1 model was ever produced....the Hallicrafters SR-2000 Hurricane, 1 KW input. Said to have a fantastic receiver.

Philip

RE: 1000W HF Rig

by KI6LO on September 21, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

How about a $8500+ rebate check? For crying out loud, its a hobby not a life's calling.

These manufacturers must think that selling 100 $10K radios is as good as selling 1000+ <$1K radios. Only problem is most hams cannot afford that sort of rediculous price tag. I wouldn't spend $10K even if I could afford it. My car only cost $15K. I also second the idea of a lawyer to cover the divorce included with the purchase.

Gene KI6LO

RE: What do you want for $10,000 in a radio

by N9XCR on September 21, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

I think that when you spend that much money it becomes an investment and not a hobby. I'd rather take that $10,000 and invest in a company that does what Heathkit did. Bring back the kits that teach you something and are affordable. When radios are priced as they are these days on top of people wanting top dollar for used radios, amateur radio really appears to be an expensive hobby. There's other reasons people are turned away from amateur radio but I won't get into that. :) We all know how that ends up.

RE: What do you want for $10,000 in a radio

by VE7ALQ on September 21, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

I gave away *gratis* a number of Yaesu FT-101Es that I had accumulated over the years. Although not the latest technology, they are perfect radios for a new Amateur.

They were not up to the performance specs of the newer ICOM IC-706mkiig which I bought (IF shift, 3 selectable IF filters, solid state protected finals, red-hot receiver, DSP, Notch Filter, frequency readout to the nearest Hertz, 30 meters...)

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by NE0P on September 21, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

"When radios are priced as they are these days on top of people wanting top dollar for used radios"

Amateur radio has never been cheaper. For under $350 used, you could get:
1. Icom 730
2. Kenwood TS120/TS130
3. Yaesu FT77
4. Kenwood TS520/TS530
5. Probably a Kenwood TS830, definitely an TS820
6. Icom 740
The list goes on and on. All of these are very good radios, and will perform very well for all but the hard core contestor or DXer.

The same holds for new radios. For less than $600 you recently have been able to buy new:
1. Icom 718
2. Yaesu FT840
3. Yaesu FT8857
4. Kenwood TS50

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by KD5ALU on September 21, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

For $10,000 I want a seperate shack and antenna farm.

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by WA2JJH on September 28, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

VE7ALQ Yes you have an excellent radio. The fact that the 706II-G is certified for 30M. My FT-100D is not!
In fact if you check out some of the mil spec sites, the 706-IIG with all filters is recommended for MARS
use.

The TX ability of 200MHZ is illegal. Strange however
how well the 706-IIG receives the aircraft band.

Perhaps outside the US, in certain countries the 110-200MHZ capabilities are used.

I too wondered why the 706-IIG was modable to work s a commercial VHF radio.

I chose the ft-100D over the 706 because it had the ability to RX ok up to about 480mhz. NYPD is 470-512mhz. I wanted to be able to scan police and press frequencies.

If I had to do IT over....I would have bought the 706 with all the filters. When I baught the FT-100d, THE dsp FOR THE 706 WAS AN OPTION.

wHAT REALLY ANNOYS ME IS THAT THE FT-100D CAME WITH THE TCXO. HOWEVER IT WAS RATED AS TOO WIDE FOR 60m.

OH well....live and learn!

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by VE7ALQ on September 28, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

In Canada an Advanced Amateur is allowed to homebrew transmitters or modify type-approved transmitters. The onus of staying within the amateur bands is on the Advanced Amateur. Thus modifying my IC-706mkiig for continuous coverage transmit is NOT illegal here.

Yes, I have ordered the TCXO option for my IC-706. Not very popular, but I do like working close to band edges.

60 meters is not legal in Canada. Also 60 meters is SSB only, not Morse Code. I have zero interest in HF SSB.

Yes, the DSP works wonderfully. Both on CW and SSB.

As far as scanners go, you should see our Scanners in Canada. No cellphone block. Full receive 500 - 800 mHz.

What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by WA2JJH on October 1, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

I can buy A RACAL RA-3792 DUAL DSP RECEIVER for under $2000. YUP it has PBT/NOTCH/DSP. I would then use a Ten Tec ORION just for the TX for $3000.

I can then get OVER $10,000 bux of laughs over the chumps that are buying the YEASU FDX-9000 FOR $16,000!!!!!!

RE: What Do You Want in a $10,000 Radio?

by G3AXL on January 20, 2005 Mail this to a friend!

Money = quality of experience? I seriously doubt it. Where's the struggle? Where's the reward? It'd be more like relief that one's 10,000 rig managed to make contact with the next county.

If I had that sort of money to splash on a corporate rig, the least I'd expect is a 4 slot bread facility and some R.F. knobs to control the amount of browning of the toast. That's pretty much the extent of personal responsibility for what happens....
Now then - what would you expect in a £10,000 butter?

Just being argumentative, you understand.....

73s
G3AXL

RE: What do you want for $10,000 in a radio

by G1LGY on July 4, 2009 Mail this to a friend!

a radio is as good as the antenna it's conected to.
and hey the old boys know!

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