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[Articles Home]  [Add Article]  

Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!

Kent Loren Carroll (KB9YZL) on October 9, 2004
View comments about this article!


Public Service should be part of your agenda!

Over the past few months, several Articles have appeared on eHam that dealt with the subject of ARS involvement in emergency situations. I was surprised by the magnitude of the negative response to these articles. A few selected quotes follow:

**************************************************

“Maybe its time for hams to admit they are not needed. This isn't 1925. Hams for the most part have been totally passed by with professional and permanent other resources.”

“Let me see ... The First Responders have been issued 1. cellphones 2. SAT cellphones 3. VoIP systems 4. Internet access and 5. UHF/VHF Tactical radios oh but wait -- you want them to find a use for HF ... LOL “

“What has started to get onto my nerves ……… is the fact that ham radio enthusiasts are simply forgetting that this is a hobby and not a needed civil program. “

“It's a hobby - where we loose our credibility is when we tell people that we are vital to the safeguard of the country!! … the cell phone is vital - the VHF/UHF govt comms are vital - the land line is vital ---- ham radios aren't - any longer…. Sorry “

“Who cares...I don't. Yawn.”

******************************************************

Personally, I find this sort of attitude embarrassing. The very first principle put forth in Part 97 reads as follows:

“Recognition and enhancement of the value of the amateur service to the public as a voluntary noncommercial communications service, particularly with respect to providing emergency communications.”

Now, I don't intend to get into a legalistic debate over whether or not Public Service is required of the ARS. I will only point out that it is, at the very least, one of the ARS's long-standing traditions. There are certainly plenty of you ready to argue that other aspects of the ARS should be maintained because they are “Traditional”; why should this admirable tradition go by the wayside, simply because some of the equipment and procedures are now obsolete?

More to the point, how do we justify the continuance of those privileges we enjoy as a group? In a “Frequency Hungry” world, how do we convince the FCC that it is in their best interests to let us keep those frequencies that we have come to regard as ours? The phrase; “Hey! It's just a fun hobby!” won't carry much weight when you have Industry ready to pay serious cash for bandwidth!

Finally, what happened to the moral side of the question? The simple desire to “Do the Right Thing”? Rather than saying “We're Obsolete!” and shrugging off the whole issue, shouldn't we be looking for other ways to serve? I begin to wonder if some in the ARS are using “perceived obsolescence” as an excuse for not making an effort. After all, going out of your way to help someone can be really inconvenient.

The “Nay-Sayers” are absolutely correct on one point: Our Professional Emergency Management People have superb communications gear at their disposal. It lets them communicate with each other, and with their support networks in ways that would have seemed like science fiction only twenty years ago.

But face reality! There's one thing all this high tech commo gear can't do: It can't locate the victims of a disaster as the event is unfolding. This critical bit of data still comes in the form of reports from the general public, and it still has to trickle in from the field in the good old-fashioned ways!

This is where “communication” is the essential commodity. This is where the plain, old, everyday “Joe Ham” can make a difference, even in the 21st century!

Please don't think that I'm suggesting huge programs in which “Super Hams” pull together previously un-imagined technological wonders “to save the World”; far from it. I'm talking about a few really simple things that every active ARS licensee can and should do, so that if a problem occurs, they are in a position to make a positive contribution.

My proposal is very simple: All it calls for is a little bit of preparedness!

You need to have four things in your vehicle:

  1. A transceiver (You're a Ham--you've got at least one of these, right?)

  2. A GPS (Don't whine; they're cheap, and you wanted one anyway!)

  3. A Cell Phone (Don't be a snob. If it works and it's faster, use it! Just don't trust it outside of urban areas!)

  4. A little notebook with all the local Emergency Management phone numbers and monitored radio frequencies. (Oops. I bet most of you didn't have this one!)

With these four items, and your knowledge and experience as a Ham, you are now an “asset”, instead of a mute spectator! You have the tools needed to call for help, and your GPS information lets you tell the Professionals where they are needed, with the precision they need.

I am IN NO WAY suggesting that Hams drive blindly into disaster areas, looking for opportunities to be heroes. The most likely outcome of that tactic would be the Ham becoming another victim in need of rescue. Our Professional Emergency Management People will already have their hands full--they don't need additional work!

All I am advocating is that you all be prepared, and willing to help. So that if, while pursuing your normal, everyday life, you find yourself somewhere where help is needed, you can actually do something! Please understand that the situation you find yourself responding to may have nothing to do with a Hurricane, Tornado, Earthquake or Flood. It might be something as mundane as coming upon an automobile accident on a lonely stretch of road. Your help will still be important to the people involved.

No one is asking you to do CPR, or give first aid. (Although it would be great if more learned these skills!) You aren't being asked to fight fires, dig through debris, or “core punch” severe storms. All you have to do is “call it in”.

So, how about it? Is this really too much to ask? Are you really too busy to take a few preparatory steps that might, someday, allow you to help save a life? Can you do a few simple things, and adopt a positive mental attitude that will make you a real asset to your community; or will you choose to join those who use words like “obsolete” and “irrelevant” as excuses for doing nothing at all?

Kent Carroll

KB9YZL

Member Comments:
This article has expired. No more comments may be added.
 
Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by ASTROHAM on October 9, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
As we've seen with recent disasters...

a) The almighty cell phone is unreliable. (At least one cell phone company uses "can you hear me now?" as a marketing play. I see the humor in that, don't you?)

b) Most municipal V/UHF communications systems have no backup power, or someone inside their organizations who knows enough about it to get it back on line if the systems crashes.

c) As much as the various ham radio emergency organizations practice for emergency, few will have enough volunteers to be able to activate at all hours of the night or day, or even have the ability to activate within minutes not hours. Often, it's the single ham on the spot who is the sole emergency communications link at the most critical or unexpected times during an unfolding emergency.

Good post. I agree completely.
 
Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by NC4CG on October 9, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
I like the post and the way it was presented. I'm a big believer in being prepared.
I view amateur radio as an adjunct to my public service roles, and not a reason for them in the first place.
Maybe if we were there quietly serving in time of need, instead of screaming about how cell phones are unreliable and municipal, state and federal communications are inadequate, maybe we could be taken a bit more seriously.
As I talk to those I work with in various agencies at the local state and federal level, I point out that it's relatively easy to get a ham license, and it's a "nice to have" item at your disposal if all other means of communications fail. That gives them the option of finding a ham or being a ham - and they know what we are when they spot us.

I kinda like the idea that most emergency servoces have planned ahead and we're not needed now as much as we once were, if that was ever the case. I think there are still niches that can be filled by amateur radio in time of crisis.
It's important to let the people who make the descisions know who you are and what you can do in a quiet professional manner and then be able to deliver if called upon. That takes organizational effort and teamwork and practice.

"They also serve who only stand and wait."
73 Bradley
 
Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by WIRELESS on October 9, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
If anybody thinks the content of this thread is some sort of example for emergency preparedness, there really is a need for psychological evaluations of people in this hobby.
 
RE: Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by N6AYJ on October 9, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
Whatever.
 
Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by KD5JFT on October 9, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
OK, First my $0.02 worth: There are people that value themselves way above what their apparent worth is to others. This goes for both some amateur radio operators and some of the "professionals". That said let's move on to the point in the article.

Just some backgroud;
I work for a small police department. Until several years ago, we had backup power at the department, but NOT at the repeater. Most of our officers were (and some still are) so radio illiterate, that they didn't know how to change to a simplex (also called talk-around) channel. Gee hard to do, change to channel two when you don't hear the repeater squelch tail. . .
Others just couldn't seem to grasp the concept of a repeater. I used to use the pictures from the Now Your Talking book to try to explain this concept. We still have dispatchers that will start talking into the mic before keying it, much less waiting for the repeater to kick in. Many police and fire/rescue agencies don't want help from outside sources that they haven't worked with or trained with before. This includes other government agencies. The "This is my turf, get out" or the "That's not my problem" syndrome. I saw this in a previous chief that refused to let our agency participate in a large rescue operation less than six miles away, stating "That is a city problem not ours". It didn't matter to him that agencies from other countries (not just local/state agencies) were involved in the rescue ops. When dealing with that mindset, you aren't going to get anywhere no matter what. (I still thank God for the day he was fired!). I had another supervisor that forbid any officers to carry personal radios on the job and ordered me to confiscate any personal radios immediately. I pointed out that he had just banned cell phones. My first (and last) confiscation was his cell phone. The above examples are just some of the mindsets you are going to encounter every now and then. (Hopefully rarely)

On the amateur side:
Do not show up in filthy condition (both personal hygiene and clothing). You must present a competent image if you are going to get anyone to take you seriously. I don't mean uniforms or anything like that (in fact I would avoid uniforms that could be confused with police/fire/emt personnel), but dressed neatly and appropriately for the occasion. Also remember you are there to assist the agency (whether it be the Red Cross, Salvation Army, local law enforcement, fire/rescue agency, local hospital, etc). Don't tell them how to do their jobs, they already know that. Instead concentrate on your specialty: Communications in difficult situations. If at all possible, train with the agencies you may be working with. It will be worth both your's and their time.

That being said. The value I see in Amateur Radio operations during emergency conditions is
1. The ability to communicate in any conditions. This is not something that many agencies can do!
2. The ability to relay information vital to the agency being served. Whether this is coordinating ice or water deliveries during a marathon, directing emergency supplies/services to where they are needed, severe weather spotting, or whatever. This need is decided by the agency being served, NOT the amateur helping out. Remember you are there to help them by providing communications abilities that they lack, not to provide the actual emergency services.

In the example given in the article, the author was concentrating on basic emergency preparedness, not disaster response. For the situations he was describing, he is entirely correct. I have met only two emergency call takers that had a clue as to what an autopatch was (and both were hams). The others couldn't grasp the concept of "simplex" (only one person can talk at a time) telephone communications. So plan for the lowest common demoninator. If your cell phone works, use it. If it fails (and the larger the emergency, or the more remote the area, the more likely it is to fail), then use the autopatch or relay to another amateur with a land line. Have the numbers of the local emergency agencies handy. Police/Fire/EMS. Not just 911. And know what the political boundaries are. And know your location (or the location of the problem/emergency) when reporting. GPS is nice, but if you call my agency, unless I am working, giving latitude and longitude will do absolutely no good. Learn how to use the gps to get direction and distance from a well known object. We are constantly dealing with cell calls from neighboring jurisdictions or from people that are asking for help, but have no idea where they are (now that is very frustrating). It is not unusual for a cell call to come in and be transferred from us to more than one other agency before jurisdiction is properly determined.

And last, but not least. . .be prepared to deal with a**holes on the other end of the line. A sad fact, but none the less, a fact of life. Don't lose your cool or professionalism. One argument (even if you are in the right) can do severe and lasting damage to any relationship between a served agency and the amateur community. Remember, you are representing all of us. Don't make a bad impression!!

I know I kinda rambled and ranted for a bit (it's late and I'm tired), but try to glean a bit of information out of this.

Amateur Radio can be very helpful in all sorts of situations, but IT IS UP TO THE INDIVIDUAL OPERATORS. Prepare and plan ahead, you never know when it will be needed.

ps All flames welcomed (sorry if I angered anyone though)
 
Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by KC8YVE on October 9, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
A very nice write up!
And most of the replies gleen valuable information as well.

One of my main motivations for getting into amature radio was the public service aspect. There is no better feeling in life that to provide a helping hand to fellow humans that are truly in need.

Best to All!
Tracy
 
RE: Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by VA7VEC on October 9, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
Having been the reception centre manager during an evacuation of 50,000 people, I can say two things:

1) The SAT phone took 1.5 hours for them to figure out how to use (no money for training/testing), the hundreds of donated cell phones all had the wrong chargers and nobody knew the phone numbers or where the chargers were, and many organizations and locations such as the instant warehouse were not part of the previously envisioned priority needs for communications. Modern communications failed miserably.

2) Despite the above, the ham radio operators sat in the gym not letting anyone know what they do, refusing to monitor the FRS radios used by all the reception centre managers, refusing to pass a priority message to the police ("why don't you phone 911 with that...") and not working with any other organizations. The 3 main reception centre managers had never dealt with amateur radio and didn't know how it worked, how to send a message or who the hams could talk to. With no diagram on the wall and no shadow assigned by the hams to the managers, I watched the reception centre managers send RUNNERS to get messages to the EOC.
Amateur radio did a great job of linking the EOC with the reception centre, but failed to do anything else to facilitate communications. They did get a nice letter from the city and the regional government saying they really helped which proves that they couldn't have done a better job.

Emergency communications was a huge need in this operation and amateur radio was there but did only the most minimal job. I was upset for nearly a year and still am!
 
RE: Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by W9RPE on October 9, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
...Reply
by WIRELESS on October 9, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
If anybody thinks the content of this thread is some sort of example for emergency preparedness, there really is a need for psychological evaluations of people in this hobby.""""....



This guys user ID "WIRELESS" tells the story...Do you work for Radio Shack??
 
THEV 4 ITEMS YOU NEED  
by KB7LYM on October 9, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
Here I read that one must have

1 TRANSCIEVER

2 GPS

3 CELLPHONE

4 NOTEBOOK

Those are the most important items to have in your car
it was stated.

However having been in the Emergency service one item seems to missing and yes it is overlooked many times by the Guru's and Leper Operators alike !

What is it you might want to ask ???

Well folks I tell you.... It is the nector of the
American Gods ! Without it you don't go anywhere.

Yes folks its GAS !!!!!

Only God knows how it feels being stranded on a logging road, deep in a valley, surrounded by mountains,cold,hungry and a Vulture looking at you.

You hope your handheld will get a repeater
You hope your cell phone is not in a dead zone
Your GPS is worthless without, maps or your cell phone
Your notebook might come in handy when nature calles. The Vulture knows when it is time

Got to go get some GAS !!
 
Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by KI0KY on October 9, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
I recently spoke with a local Red Cross Volunteer who served as a government liaison for the Red Cross in Florida. He stated that he had a cell phone, a satellite phone, and a regular phone to use. None of them worked. If he wanted to communicate with other nearby Red Cross facilitlies he spoke to the ham operator, who had come down from North Carolina. Ham radio may the the third or fourth level of communcation but it is still relavent.
 
Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by N8OMW on October 9, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
If you really want to help in an emergency or would like to know more about how ARS helps in an emergency, contact you local ARES/RACES group. There is a critical need for "TRAINED" operators in an emerency. TRAINED does not mean one has a FCC License. TRAINED means one knows ARS's role in an emergency and how ARS interacts with served agencies.

The first and foremost rule is you are volunteering your services to the agency. Without that agency you have no role in an emergency. Be flexible, you may and more than likely will be operating more than just an amatuer radio. The agency needs you because you are a trained communicator. You pass information they requesyt you to pass.

Our Emegency Communication Team in SW Ohio (Butler County) wrk hand in hand wth all local agencies. Assisting in passing information in the event of an emergency. We work with the agencies prior to an actual emergency to reduce the confusion and madness during an activation. WE are on their Work Groups and meet regualary looking for ways to improve.

Bottom line - if you want to participate in Emergency Comms as Part 97 encourages, please look up your local group to find out how ARS interacts with local "professional" emergency agencies.

Rob McPherson
N8OMW
Email: N8OMW at(@) Hotmail.com
Butler County Emergency Comms Team http://www.mindspring.com/~tssar/
 
Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by K5MAR on October 9, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
Kent, well said! While not everybody wishes to participate in emergency comms or ARES, they should at least be prepared to help themselves. As they say: Either you're part of the solution, or you're part of the problem!

Mark - K5MAR
AEC, Payne County, OK ARES
 
Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by N9GXW on October 9, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
These are some very good posts.

Two Points:

1: Some may consider me obsolete but the local High School would have a hard time pulling off their annual Cross Country Invitational Event without my obsolete ham buddies and me.

2: As part of another community program I had the occasion once to be riding “shotgun” on a Saturday Night with a local police officer. Another Officer had stopped a car about 8 blocks away from us. It turned out the guy had a warrant for his arrest and started resisting before anybody knew it and backup could be summoned. The officer squeezed his speaker mic and said “dispatch 438 subject resisting” but due to his being in a wrestling match at the time he was weak into the repeater, what everybody heard was “dishshshshsh8shshshshshctshshshshshing” but being a ham and practiced at pulling crap out of the noise, I heard every word. While the dispatch was asking for a 10-9 (repeat transmission), and not getting it, I was telling my officer what he said. We took off, while relaying to dispatch what I heard, and were there to help in about 60 seconds.

My point is that we loose track of the fact that there is more to us hams than the technology that we are carrying with us. We can contribute if we adopt a “how can I help you, can-do” attitude while politely keeping our place. We do not want to become a liability. It was not my place to jump into that fight once we got there, and I did not. It was my place to help get us there.

I do agree also we should show up looking like we know how to operate a washing machine, and have a regular relationship with a bar of soap!
 
RE: Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by K4RAF on October 9, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
This is a joke!

Nay-sayers are just ahead of their time, you all will understand sooner than you think!

Went to a APBA hydroplane race today on Kerr Dam. No hams involved, did just fine. Why? No net control, no hassle of what rotation or traffic list was in effect. No overhead, just communications straightforward...

They used 156.300 as Race Control (Marine Channel 6), FRS 1 as pits (unloading & loading 65 boats), FRS 14 as Race Safety. 157.050 was CG patrol. All worked fine, all license free.

Having worked in RaceComm for the Benny Hanna (NJ) Offshore Grand Prix for 9 years, there is little or no foothold that hams can seize upon now that FRS/GMRS has taken hold. Granted everyone raced safely but it was amazing to monitor how well UNLICENSED coordinators did running a race. They even had countdown simulcasting for every heat.

I see the sunset of "public service"... too much overhead & wasted breath...

No traffic... No function... No cycles...
 
RE: Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by KB9YZL on October 9, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
K4RAF;

Wow…….I feel safer now!...........And I’m sure that OEM managers all over the country are delighted to hear that the Hydroplaning Community is on the job!

KLC

 
Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by KI0KY on October 9, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
Regarding cell phones, satellite phones, etc, I know a local Red Cross Volunteer who went to Florida as a government liaison for two weeks in the area hit by Charlie. He was issued a cell phone, a satellite phone and had a regular phone at this desk. None of them worked. He had to talk to the ham, from North Carolina, across the hall if he wanted to communciate with the nearby Red Cross facilites. While ham radio is not as critical for emergency commuications as when the Titanic sank, being at the third or fouth level of importance makes ham radio still relevant.
 
RE: Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by K6BBC on October 9, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
Unless it’s a real emergency (like the Alaska earthquake of 64), amateurs should stay away. Generally, it’s a public relation nightmare for the hobby when the geeks in orange vest show up. STOP IT! Orange vested hand held carrying nerds Johnny on-the-spot types do not help us with out rapidly diminishing numbers.

K6BBC
 
RE: Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by AMATEURRADIODOTCA on October 9, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
Yes, and all those stupid volunteers from the Salvation Army and Red Cross too. And the volunteer firemen. And the church groups. And the hotels and restaurants who donate during emergencies. Let's keep them all out of there and leave it to the professionals. There are hundreds of idle police, fire and ambulance personnel at all times and with their modern communications, they never get overwhelmed. All volunteer groups are in the way.

Come on guys! Trained amateur radio operators provide a valuable service on a daily basis. Yes, there are some that are over-eager and there are many that are untrained, but the fact is that trained amateurs DO perform a valuable function.

In two of the areas I have been in, amateur radio presence has been increasing because the emergency officials have found them to be eager, trained, resourceful and participate on a regular basis ASSISTING with routine emergencies such as taking care of evacuees from apartment fires. Two of Canada's largest metropolitan regions are ADDING amateur radio, as we speak, to their facilities as they have realized that as a second or third level backup they will be needed.

By the way, when the problems with the Sat phones was pointed out to the hospitals, they ran a little test. It took over 1.5 hours to figure out how to use the phone and they realized they only had 1 phone for one of the largest hospitals in the country. Which one individual out of all the key hospital personnel gets to have the phone? Amateur radio stations were quickly added to their emergency plans and hams actively recruited or hospital personnel paid to take a basic license course to ensure they had enough operators.

Amateur radio is not the be-all end all. But in numerous special events where they have literally saved lives or assisted with emergency communcations, they have proven their worth. In emergencies, they are another component of the community responese where EVERYBODY pitches in.

 
RE: Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by KF4VGX on October 9, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
by KD5JFT on October 9, 2004 ,



On the amateur side:
Do not show up in filthy condition (both personal hygiene and clothing). You must present a competent image if you are going to get anyone to take you seriously.


I don't mean uniforms or anything like that (in fact I would avoid uniforms that could be confused with police/fire/emt personnel), but dressed neatly and appropriately for the occasion. Also remember you are there to assist the agency (whether it be the Red Cross, Salvation Army, local law enforcement, fire/rescue agency, local hospital, etc). Don't tell them how to do their jobs, they already know that. Instead concentrate on your specialty: Communications in difficult situations. If at all possible, train with the agencies you may be working with. It will be worth both your's and their time.

That being said. The value I see in Amateur Radio operations during emergency conditions is
1. The ability to communicate in any conditions. This is not something that many agencies can do!
2. The ability to relay information vital to the agency being served. Whether this is coordinating ice or water deliveries during a marathon, directing emergency supplies/services to where they are needed, severe weather spotting, or whatever. This need is decided by the agency being served, NOT the amateur helping out. Remember you are there to help them by providing communications abilities that they lack, not to provide the actual emergency services.

In the example given in the article, the author was concentrating on basic emergency preparedness, not disaster response. For the situations he was describing, he is entirely correct. I have met only two emergency call takers that had a clue as to what an autopatch was (and both were hams). The others couldn't grasp the concept of "simplex" (only one person can talk at a time) telephone communications. So plan for the lowest common demoninator. If your cell phone works, use it. If it fails (and the larger the emergency, or the more remote the area, the more likely it is to fail), then use the autopatch or relay to another amateur with a land line. Have the numbers of the local emergency agencies handy. Police/Fire/EMS. Not just 911. And know what the political boundaries are. And know your location (or the location of the problem/emergency) when reporting. GPS is nice, but if you call my agency, unless I am working, giving latitude and longitude will do absolutely no good. Learn how to use the gps to get direction and distance from a well known object. We are constantly dealing with cell calls from neighboring jurisdictions or from people that are asking for help, but have no idea where they are (now that is very frustrating). It is not unusual for a cell call to come in and be transferred from us to more than one other agency before jurisdiction is properly determined.

And last, but not least. . .be prepared to deal with a**holes on the other end of the line. A sad fact, but none the less, a fact of life. Don't lose your cool or professionalism. One argument (even if you are in the right) can do severe and lasting damage to any relationship between a served agency and the amateur community. Remember, you are representing all of us. Don't make a bad impression!!



Amateur Radio can be very helpful in all sorts of situations, but IT IS UP TO THE INDIVIDUAL OPERATORS. Prepare and plan ahead, you never know when it will be needed.



I have to agree with this post entirely !

If we look at the general age ,health and weight of amateur's, we would see a decline in who can actually help in a disaster. Sad but true. Other than using voice communications

As we all want to help ,the problem is in separating our Ego's from those than can actually be of service to the community.

As KD5JFT states ,be prepared to deal with a**holes on the other end of the line.

Problem is in amateur radio we have to many Chief's
( EGOS ) and not enough Indians. But then again thats what attracted hams into this hobby, sadly it also share in its decline .

Now how do we deal with it ??

KF4VGX

 
RE: Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by KC8VWM on October 9, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
Great subject Kent.

We need to focus more on the ARS service aspect and hopefully this subject will bring more emergency service awareness to light.

73

Charles - KC8VWM
 
RE: Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by W6TH on October 9, 2004 Mail this to a friend!



Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!

It was and now it ain't. Yes, it is now called a hobby, DX, rag chew, etc.

Ain't what it used to be. Really no need unless there is a interest in a subject; out of sight out of mind.

.: Viva La Liberte
 
RE: Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by AB8TM on October 9, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
The day we become a hobby is the day we CEASE TO EXIST.

Why would the federal government regulate and oversee a hobby? Do you think they care about you that much?

That or all hobbies will fall under federal regulation. The GRC (golfers regulation comission) will control the golfers. The PPTC (Photographers Picture Taking Commision) will oversee and make rules for hobby photographers.

When the federal government sees us as JUST A HOBBY, you WILL NOT HAVE A HOBBY.

I can just imagine all the Senators and Congressman in Washington wondering what all those poor poor hams are going to do for a hobby.
 
RE: Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by KC8VWM on October 9, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
Hams are still relied upon for certain events.

From skywarn to hurricanes. We are still the eyes and ears out there in numbers and from different vantage points.

That is all that they expect us to do as a service to the community. Always has been , always will be.

The fact that we try to futher "enhance" this activity in various ways, still boils down to the basic idea of providing a very simplified service.

Light bars on vehicles, CPR training, amateur radio paramilitary combat skills blah.. blah... blah.. is not the main objective here.

The term "emergency service" in Amateur radio does not translate into anything more than providing a means of communication during a time when communication is not readily present, or available using any other means.

Does this still happen? .. Yes.

Do they wan't us to provide anything else? .. No.

We are not paramedics, CPR, First Aid or ER technicians, fire rescue personnel, police dispatchers, or bomb squad specialists.

We are about radio communications, that's it... Nothing less, nothing more.

This is our only primary function and we should not be attempting to do provide anything more.

Simply put, when we are called upon in such instance, we are there to provide our services.

If they don't call us... That's ok too.


Charles - KC8VWM
 
RE: Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by KC8VWM on October 9, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

"If we look at the general age ,health and weight of amateur's, we would see a decline in who can actually help in a disaster."


Huh?... Since when did we engage in paramilitary training exercises?

Using radio equipment for communication related activities does not generally require a physical fitness requirement.

 
RE: Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by KC8VWM on October 9, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

"My point is that we loose track of the fact that there is more to us hams than the technology that we are carrying with us."

hmmmm...
 
RE: Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by AE6IP on October 9, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
I think Kent's suggestion is a fine one, for those who feel a need to provide public service, but not a desire to train. For such, however, I would suggest an alternative, which is to provide communications at public events.

While it is true that newer events don't rely on amateur radio, many older events, especially foot races, parades, and organized bike rides do. Effort put into this is fairly minimal, highly appreciated, and good public and community relations.

For those interested in spending more effort in emergency communications, I strongly endorse the recommendation to get training. The ARRL ARECC courses are a good investment in time for any ham interested in EMCOMM.

But if your interest is _community_ service, I'd like to make a recommendation: Take off your 'ham hat' and look at the bigger picture. 'trained communicator' is find, as far as it goes; but any served agency will always prefer volunteers with broader training.

If you want to be an asset, and you're interested in the red cross, take their first aid training, and make the effort to become one of their disaster workers.

If you want to be an aid in your local community, find out if they have a CERT (Citizen's Emergency Response Team) program or its equivalent, and take their training and participate.

As to concerns about losing HF spectrum if the government decides amateur radio is a hobby: The largest spectrum losses to the ARS happened long ago. Other hobbies have spectrum, and aren't having any trouble holding on to it. International treaties, which are infrequently renegotiated, limit what the FCC can do. The feds have thought of ham radio as a hobby at least since the mid '70s.

If we lose any HF spectrum, it'll be because of emi pollution, not because of an FCC take-away, and whether ham radio is a hobby or not won't matter at all.
 
RE: Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by X-WB1AUW on October 9, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
How could all of us hams who neither own cells phones, nor mobile rigs have been so ignorant of what we NEED for so many years? Ooooops! I forgot that I also need a GPS.

Wait a minute. Where is the research showing how many hams drive by that accident before anyone with a cell phone drives by it?

Could it be there are more people with cell phones than there are hams? Could it be faster to use a cell phone vrs using a mobile rig?

Is it really better to use longitude and latitude vrs a specific adr like 1442 S Mains Street?

How many years has the author had what he deems is needed by every ham? During those years, how many times was he first to contact emergency services via a mobile rig? How many times was GPS better than the street adr?

If a ham doesn’t own a motor vehicle, should they carry the same gear with them?

Bob
 
RE: Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by K4RAF on October 10, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
"The day we become a hobby is the day we CEASE TO EXIST."

Has anyone told the leaguers? They have defined us as a hobby with delusions of public service for at least 20 years now. They are marketing us as a hobby!

We were a service when we were totally unique. Mobile radio, phone patches, passing messages. Look around now, everything is wireless & has antennas!

Everyone who jumped on about the race comments missed the point & didn't participate in RaceComms for offshore powerboat races for 9 years. "Public Service" is not just hurricanes...

Things change, times change but hams?
 
RE: Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by KF4VGX on October 10, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
KC8VWM on October 9, 2004


"My point is that we loose track of the fact that there is more to us hams than the technology that we are carrying with us."

hmmmm...


Yea, its called FAT ! ;-)

and some dont cary it well.

 
RE: Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by K1CJS on October 10, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
Reply by "WIRELESS":

"If anybody thinks the content of this thread is some sort of example for emergency preparedness, there really is a need for psychological evaluations of people in this hobby."

Pal, your handle should by 'CLUELESS' not WIRELESS.
 
RE: Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by K1CJS on October 10, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
Reply by "WIRELESS":

"If anybody thinks the content of this thread is some sort of example for emergency preparedness, there really is a need for psychological evaluations of people in this hobby."

Pal, your handle should by 'CLUELESS' not WIRELESS.
 
Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by K1CJS on October 10, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
As well as being the local emergency coordinator for ARES, I also am considered to be his agency's 'radio officer' by my city Emergency Management Director. This is because I spoke up and informed him I would like to get more involved with the EMA.

One thing everyone should realize is the fact you have to speak up BEFORE the fact and volunteer your services. Only then can you get the proper and appropriate training and equipment you may need, including being checked out and cleared for any access to sensitive areas (such as the emergency operation center) you may need to enter.

Since I have been cleared and accepted as a member of the city EMA, I have been issued equipment and ID appropriate to the job the EMA director wants me to do, including installation of a city EMA radio in my vehicle and a handheld radio in addition to my ham gear.

It follows that if you don't speak up and volunteer, the officials won't realize what is available in their community. Also, when you do show up and volunteer during any emergency, those same officials won't have you included in their plans, won't know what you can do and therefore what to do with you, and may leave you sitting--or doing busywork. Afterwards, many of you make the usual comments about volunteering 'when the crap hit the fan' and then you complained that you weren't used or were used for anything but communications.

So, in addition to the items listed by the author of the article is another often overlooked item: Stepping up and volunteering your services, or at least making yourself and your capabilities known to the right people BEFORE ANY EMERGENCY HITS. Then if you aren't utilized as agreed on beforehand, you can complain.
 
RE: Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by NC4CG on October 10, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
For the most part I agree with the role of ARES as an organizational unit and a means of evangelizing public service capabilities in an area.
I do however wish there were more checks and balances in the system that prevented bad or disruptive behavior, and more importantly, people from being excluded from participating in ARES.
You can send letters to the ARRL volunteering for ARES, which are forwarded to the local EC. It's then up to them as to whether you get to go any farther. It occurs to me that whether politics or oversight this is a single point of failure within the organization.
 
RE: Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by K0RFD on October 10, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
K1CGS wrote (twice):
>Pal, your handle should by 'CLUELESS' not WIRELESS.

Name calling isn't becoming. It sort of causes people to stop listening immediately. You can probably get your point across without it.

Regarding public service (back to the original post), it's an important justification for the frequencies we're allowed to use.

While I might rather have a root canal than pretend to be important by carrying an HT at a bike race, I do have the necessary equipment to run my radio off of emergency power for at least 24 hours, I have a slingshot and a good-performing antenna I can hang from a tree just about anywhere, and I know what time and frequency the local net mobilizes on 2 meters for when REAL work needs to be done. Real public service, I'm there. Pretending to be important at non-emergencies, well, I'll pass.
 
RE: Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by AE6IP on October 10, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
> Real public service, I'm there. Pretending to be
> important at non-emergencies, well, I'll pass.

"Public service" is about more than emergencies, and providing comms at a parade, bike race, or other event, isn't "pretending to be important". It's a small but useful _public_ service.

Frankly, the hams who show up on race day, do their bit, and don't get in the way, do a far better job of PR for the hobby than the blue light and badge brigade ever does.

Also, it seems very difficult to get hams to understand this, but emergency services agencies have grown up. While they can, occassionally, take advantage of hams, the role of 'communicator' that hams fills is often replaced by the effort of other volunteers who can both run a radio *and* provide other useful service.

When I take a crew into a neighhorhood to do post-earthquake search and evaluation, I'll take someone who knows how to run an FRS radio and has s&e training over someone who knows how to pass NTS traffic but has no other training. Hands down. Ten times out of ten. And I'll have far less trouble finding people who can run the FRS and do S&E then I will finding hams, anyway.

 
RE: Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by GHOSTRIDERHF on October 10, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
Once again we take a very extreme minority of situations -- ie.. one out of 1000 SAT Phones does not work and that somehow justifies Amateur radio...

anyway my point is this -- the problem that I have seen first hand is that some hams (not all -- but allot) show up without a clue or INVITE in some agencies AO having never attended a training section and wants to go out in the thick of things and work comms... well bud -- we already have someone to do that -- we have been training with our fulltime comms people for months and months and for you to show up without being asked and comms equipment thats not on our freqs -- and you then get pissed off when we tell you that right now we dont need anymore comms people but if you would like to help we could really use a hand in handing out some blankets and coffee and you shout that "I'm a communicartor not a donut dolly"..

Anyway God bless those that do show up and try to help anyway they can -- at least they did show up....

 
RE: Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by N2LJD on October 10, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
Just some examples of ham radio's public usefulness. They speak for themselves:

http://www.qsl.net/n2zkx/

http://www.qsl.net/mbarc/service/calendar.htm

http://www.qsl.net/cars/newslet_files/newsflash2002dec.htm

...and of course the assistance provided by various amateurs during Hurricane Isabel in the Tidewater, VA area, when phones and cell phones and Internet access and so forth were down (for nine days in my area - central Norfolk) should show that even in 2003 our 'regular' communications infrastructure was, and remains, fragile. The city fathers in Tidewater thought enough of our efforts to sign a formal support agreement with CARS and I believe with PARC (Portsmouth) as well.

Joe
 
RE: Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by KB9YGD on October 11, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
I Am Involved With Amature Radio To Enjoy My Love Of Radio NOT As A Public Servant.As My Website & Qrz Profile Shows I Am Ready Where Emergencies Are Concerned but I Am NOT Here As A Public Servant.Should Hard Times Come Yes I Will Do Everything I Can With My Knowledge & Equipment To Help but Again I Do Not Just Exist For Public Service.Thank You,`` THE REAL HAM ``
 
RE: Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by KB9YZL on October 11, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
KB9YGD:

Your post is similar to many that I have seen over the past couple of years, and I feel that a response is appropriate to this discussion.

If you read the article carefully, you will note that I am only advocating a very basic level of preparedness. No action beyond that was specified…………All you have to do is make sure your “tools” are at hand, in case they (and you) are needed.

As simple as that proposal is, you were moved to respond in a somewhat negative fashion. Being willing to help “if hard times come” is what we should be able to expect from any real, contributing member of our society……….Yet the “Average Joe” doesn’t enjoy the Frequency and Operating privileges you do under your ARS license: Why do you merit these Privileges? What do you do that sets you apart from “The Average Joe”?

KLC

 
RE: Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by AE6IP on October 11, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
97.1 does not require, or even recommend, that all hams provide public service.

97.1 lists *5* fundamental purpose items; of which public service is only one.

The worst thing an amateur can do for the hobby is grudgingly provide public service. If public service isn't your thing, don't do it.

 
RE: Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by KT4XF on October 11, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
WIRELESS talks to us on the Wired Internet, so he must be SPAM
 
RE: Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by GHOSTRIDERHF on October 11, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
AE6IP

"The worst thing an amateur can do for the hobby is grudgingly provide public service."

I have to disagree with you (with tongue-n-cheek) ... the worst thing is for a Amateur to do is actually show up demanding that he should be part of the comms schema during a crisis simply becuase he has a radio and a license....

Unlike most of the madeup stories floating around none of our SATphones failed us where I was at, and none of our cell phones went out... and our GMRS walkie talkies worked fine, but we did loose allot of traffic signals and wound up most of the day playing traffic cop... and we used 2m and 70cm SIMPLEX for traffic control and things...

Yes -- we did have a group of hams that showed up and wanted to play "cop" and we said that we needed no help -- the reason being -- we had no idea who they were (we already had several reports of looting and for all we knew these guys could have been the eyes and ears of the looters).. but more so -- if they wanted to help in emergencies -- then why didn't they train with us during the rest of the year???

And oh by the way -- anyone -- if ARS is "truly" a SERVICE -- then who is the president of the service -- when do they have annual meetings, etc etc... i am sure you get my drift...40 years ago a service -- today -- a hobby with a proud tradition....

 
RE: Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by K1CJS on October 11, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
K0RFD;

Please note that what was done was not 'namecalling' as such--if I wanted to do so, I would use something much stronger than 'clueless'. The person who uses the handle 'wireless' really doesn't have a clue when it comes to public service during 'events' as such, therefore the substituted handle of clueless.

Also, please, the callsign is K1CJS, not CGS. If I am to be called down, please use my proper posting name. After all, everyone may gang up on the wrong person! ;-) 73!
 
RE: Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by N6PEH on October 11, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
I have asked on the "Emergency Communications" forum at this website, several times, what specifically have you done as a amateur radio operator during a disaster.

All of the responses have been very vague. Examples are; Provided emergency communications, or shadowed a Red Cross worker, or worked at a EOC. All of these things sound important, but are they really vital or just hams talking to other hams? I am often asked by non-ham radio people, "What do hams do?".

I do know there were hams that provided communications out of Mexico's devastating earthquake area in the 80's. U.S. and Mexico hams got word to family members regarding their status. Good Stuff!

I camp out in the California desert a lot. There is no cell phone coverage in many parts. While out there, a young boy had been seriously hurt riding an ATV without a helmet. Thanks to a 2 meter mobile radio, a GPS, and two amateur radio operators, the emergency was reported and help was dispatched there very quickly and airlifted the victim out.

I hunt in some parts of the California Sierra's, where again there is no cell coverage. But, I can hit amateur repeaters with my VX-150. This is very comforting to know, and just plain makes good sense.

Sooooo, there are little things that we as amateurs can do to help in an emergency situation. The problem is, when asked, I don't think we do a very good job of communicating what it is we do, or have done.
 
RE: Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by K1CJS on October 11, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
Just posted:

"And oh by the way -- anyone -- if ARS is "truly" a SERVICE -- then who is the president of the service -- when do they have annual meetings, etc etc..."

I believe you have the terms 'service' and 'club' mixed up. Such as the "Amateur radio service" and the "Family radio service" as opposed to the "Moon over the mountain Amateur radio club" et al......
Or maybe you thought about the other word for those clubs and just couldn't think of it--associations.

Understand, I'm not trying to provoke a word war, I'm just trying to understand your interpretation, because a radio service governed (yah, ha ha, right!) by the FCC doesn't have a president, etc..... 73!
 
RE: Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by AE6IP on October 11, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
> I have to disagree with you (with tongue-n-
> cheek) ... the worst thing is for a Amateur to do is
> actually show up demanding that he should be part of
> the comms schema during a crisis simply becuase he
> has a radio and a license....

You're right.
 
RE: Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by KA0ZLG on October 11, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
I see that a several people like to help out and a few don't. Living In NW Minnesota I had the opertunity to help out with an international exersizs this past summer. It was very informitive to see how it went together. All the serving agencies were given HTs all programed the same with about 5 channesl, and you know the ones that got the radios had trouble useing them, the cell coverage was pore, Ham radio was use as back up communications, and came through with flying colers. What was nice is that we hams were able to demistrate ATV and it worked quit well. We used the local repeater along with a Simplex frequency, The local club has a Small commo traler with all the radios needed along with some pupic service equipment in it. The trailer was placed next to the EOC and a phone was added with a direct line between itand the EOC.

Some things to remember When a major disastor happens all the media moves in and gets a cell phone freq and they don't shut it off all the time they are there because they know that if they do they may loose contact with there (studio). No we are not the best thing sence sliced bread but we are dam close when we are needed. Yes there are some glorry hounds but most of us do as told. As an EC I know who these people are and can place them in areas that they will not cause any trouble.

In the area that I live in is prone to Tornados and we are called out anytime of the day (Mostly late afternoon to 2-3 AM) to help spot. we will have anyware from 5 to maybe 20-30 or more depending on the sevarity of the storm. We have a linking sytem that covers along the ND/MN border from Canada to the SD border and then some along with other repeaters linked togeather though out MN and ND. and are used by bringing up the repeaters by DTFM as needed.

We have used the fact that we are not just a hobby but a community service to the local offials and this has help us out with getting less tower restrictions in some of the local commuities.
 
RE: Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by KC5SAS on October 11, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
KD5JFT wrote->"I don't mean uniforms or anything like that (in fact I would avoid uniforms that could be confused with police/fire/emt personnel), but dressed neatly and appropriately for the occasion.<----

Reply- While arriving clean and professional is important, so is wearing an easily identifiable uniform so that everyone knows who is a participant and who is a spectator. Police, Fire, EMS, chariatable agencies and others wear 'uniforms' which make them easy to find in the confusion present in some situations. It should be no different for the the ARES, RACES, REACT or SATERN members on scene. This is simply a way of preventing your people from blending in at a event. Sure you don't want to be confused with the public safety people there but you should also have a quick way for your people to be found by anyone on scene. A common shirt and hat color with appropriate group emblem is usually enough. So then you can point and say, "Find one of the guys in a grey polo shirt with the REACT symbol embroidered on the chest and give him this message."

VA7VEC wrote-> Despite the above, the ham radio operators sat in the gym not letting anyone know what they do, refusing to monitor the FRS radios used by all the reception centre managers, refusing to pass a priority message to the police ("why don't you phone 911 with that...") and not working with any other organizations. The 3 main reception centre managers had never dealt with amateur radio and didn't know how it worked, how to send a message or who the hams could talk to.<---

reply- This sounds like a lack of prior training and planning by the leaders of the ham groups involved. Until preplanning, training and drilling has taken place the hams should not have been involved. I have worked several shelter operations and my kit includes FRS radios so that I can monitor and communicate with shelter managers and staff. My job is to communicate no matter the means. Whether it is by fax, phone or radio the message will get through. Anyone who fails to provide that service has no business on scene.

K6BBC wrote-> Generally, it’s a public relation nightmare for the hobby when the geeks in orange vest show up. STOP IT! Orange vested hand held carrying nerds Johnny on-the-spot types do not help us with out rapidly diminishing numbers.

reply- The orange vests are part of standard saftey equiptment which are required in many places. Most police, fire and ems agencies require their people to wear simular vests to heighten the their visability to motorists when on scenes. When participating in traffic control at an event, ARES, RACES, REACT or others should wear the basic saftey gear provided so as to protect themselves and to let others know that they are participating in the event and anen't simply a bystander standing idly in the road.

KC8VWM wrote-> Light bars on vehicles, CPR training, amateur radio paramilitary combat skills blah.. blah... blah.. is not the main objective here.

reply- no but they are nice to have when you need them.

KC8VWM also wrote->We are not paramedics, CPR, First Aid or ER technicians, fire rescue personnel,....

reply- Maybe you aren't but I am and carry my fire department issue medical gear in my POV. It's there with me if I need it.

And KC8VWM wrote->
We are about radio communications, that's it... Nothing less, nothing more.
This is our only primary function and we should not be attempting to do provide anything more.

Reply- yes, radio communication is my primary duty but when providing that service and I witness a medical emergency I have a moral obligation to step up and offer my assistance. It is for that reason I am often placed on specific stations during an event. When the Red Cross needed shelter communications during a hurricane it was my EMT training which determined that I would work a 'special needs' shelter should my skills be needed to assist the nurse and EMS persons there.
For a 2 day bike-a-thon I was positioned to provide traffic control at a busy highway intersection because my fire department lightbar on my POV and orange vest would help motorists identify me easier and I would be able to assist with any medical problems until an ambulance riding the route, with a Ham on board to ensure timely notification, could arrive.

AE6IP wrote-> I think Kent's suggestion is a fine one, for those who feel a need to provide public service, but not a desire to train. For such, however, I would suggest an alternative, which is to provide communications at public events.

reply- I dissagree. Public events such as bike races and parades have many of the same elements found in 'emergency' events. Traffic handeling, net operations and use of various communications paths are skills which are often needed at public service events and should be trained on. Groups such as ARES, RACES and REACT should make the EMCOMM courses a requirement and groups providing public service event communications should strongly consider the same or conduct simular training at the club level for it's volunteers.

K0RFD wrote->While I might rather have a root canal than pretend to be important by carrying an HT at a bike race,

reply- That's your decision. I spent last weekend doing traffic control at a busy intersection for a Bike-a-thon with 1200 people pedaling to raise money for Multiple Sclerosis. While you worry about pretending to be important I was holding traffic as groups of bikers passed through a busy intersection. Yes, I did have a Ham radio and I used it to inform Net Control when certain vehicles such as the State Police escorts, ambulance, Sag Truck or other event vehicles were at my location so that event organisers could keep track of their whereabouts. This 2 day event covered 150 miles in 2 states and hams were stationed at rest stops and in event vehicles as well as intersections like the one I worked to provide event staff with trained eyes and ears. The riders were very sure to thank us for our help keeping them on the right route and make sure traffic was under control as they rode through. Event organisers were sure to state that we provided a important service by relaying messages regarding needed supplies at certain rest stops or calls for medical help when a rider crashed.
So put your HT away and don't worry about pretending to be important. There are plenty of us out here doing the important jobs on our weekends off from our regular jobs. We don't need your help.

To everyone else out there lending a helping hand, thanks and keep up the good work.

Steve, KC5SAS
SouthEast Louisiana REACT


 
RE: Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by GHOSTRIDERHF on October 11, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
N6PEH

I see your point and its well taken -- but here is the funny part -- if you are to judge a service by how many people it has helped in an emergency -- then the CB'ers have us beat hands down .. hell they have their own Channel 9 just to report such emergencies...

I would say daily that CB radio users far exceed hams on the use of their radios to provide emerncy communication to assist motorist in trouble and whatnot....
 
RE: Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by AE6IP on October 11, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
> Public events such as bike races and parades have
> many of the same elements found in 'emergency'
> events.

Agreed.

> Traffic handeling, net operations and use of various
> communications paths are skills which are often
> needed at public service events and should be
> trained on.

Can be trained on. It is possible, and common, to provide public service support with very little training. This is fine.

> Groups such as ARES, RACES and REACT should make the
> EMCOMM courses a requirement and groups providing
> public service event communications should strongly > consider the same or conduct simular training at the
> club level for it's volunteers.

absolutely
 
Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by KD4TOQ on October 12, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
Having been onsite for some emergencies in the not too distant past, I can tell you that unless you have been in a major disaster, you will not understand the dynamics of what happens. This is not about what I know or what I have done, it is about what I have seen. We Americans are at a loss when everything goes to pot. We don't understand how to function when there is ,

No Phone, cell or land line
No power
No food
No way to cook food
No way to keep food edible
No water

Hams play an important role in these situations because,

They have their own radios
They can make them work
They are motivated to help
They are volunteers

The authorities have their hands full with life or death emergencies and have little time or resources for the handling of less threatening problems. I have seen at least three occasions in the last 7 years where Ham radio and the public service radio, (fire, police, ambulance) were the only communications available, nothing else was working, except for satellite phones. By the way, can we guess how many police depts or communities have satellite phones? Anyone who believes amateurs do not play an important role in real disasters has never been in one in my opinion. Some areas of the country prepare for disaster as regularly as we fertilize our gardens in the spring, or do the spring house cleaning. All along the central and eastern seaboard, in tornado alley, witness Florida this year, Hams and other folk begin the meetings, the planning and the tweaking of the plan to be prepared for the next, hurricane, tornado, earthquake, or at the worst another 9-11. The cities and countys in eastern North Carolina almost always have a desk for Ham radio volunteers at the community emergency center, and the locals Hams have a representative at the meetings and when the center is activated. The collapse of the New York communications system which had just recently been modernized was a demonstration of what can happen in a disaster. The brave firemen, police and rescue workers were not able to save themselves in some cases because of a system wide failure. The Hams that were there and provided communications help could do so precisely because they were not part of the system and therefore escaped the damage that brought down the infrastructure. Sure we have some blowhards and some people who thrive on recognition and praise, but that is humanity,most Hams really want to help for it own sake. Anyway, that's my opinion, and I'm sticking to it.

Mark
 
RE: Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by KC8VWM on October 12, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
KC8VWM also wrote->We are not paramedics, CPR, First Aid or ER technicians, fire rescue personnel,....

reply- Maybe you aren't but I am and carry my fire department issue medical gear in my POV. It's there with me if I need it.


I have an EMS background. 15 years of official "trauma dog" experience in the ER to be exact.

However, as a radio amateur participating in AREAS events - I will be leaving my #7 Endotrachial tube, cervical collars, and MAST pants out of my ARES kit when participating in ARES events.

As far as "moral obligation" goes. I think that as an EMS facilitator you must be well aware of the risks involved of providing medical treatment beyond the scope of initial assessment protocols.

The key word here for victims is "stabilize."

Over the years I have read various JAMA documentation discussing such protocols and how they relate to several court cases that have regarded the lack of providing any "treatments" by off duty EMS personnel as clear negligence.

However, on the same token, if an EMS unit and personnel are already available at the scene, (as is the case during many ARES events) and you start providing a victim with emergency treatment and things start to go awry.

What is your position going to be when that family sues you for professional malpractice and you are accused of functioning beyond your intended role?

Beyond performing any immediate or needed life saving skills, It would be highly unlikely that I would provide any additional EMS treatment beyond the scope of ABC assesment criteria or beyond the level of "first responder."

There is already a fully equipped and trained EMS unit available to perform these additional functions at most of these events.

My role as a radio amateur during ARES events is "communicator."

Message ----> Sender -----> Reciever. (MSR)


73

Charles - KC8VWM
 
Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by KE4ZHN on October 12, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
It never hurts to be prepared for an emergency. It does hurt to jump into a situation without being asked, getting in the way of trained professionals, and just being a general nuisance. I see nothing wrong with hams being public servants providing they at least train in the basics of whatever they wish to do. Its vastly different being a traffic cop at a parade with an HT in hand and dealing with life and death scenarios in say a tornado or a flood. Even properly trained, I would advise any hams thinking of playing super hero to keep in mind the implications of doing the wrong thing and possibly endangering themselves or someone else. Providing emergency comms is well and good, but trying to be a paramedic or a cop without training or proper authority is just plain stupid.
 
RE: Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by WA4MJF on October 13, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
Very goods points, we are communicators.
In fact,on our ARES net the other night
we were talking about Shelter Operations
and our SEC made the point that we communicate
full stop. We don't mop, we don't do KP, we
don't set up cots, we don't gas generators, etc. Stuff like this needs to left to the trained professionals.

As far as badges, you can't get away from
them nowadays. Gone are the days of the
50s and 60s when we RACES folks wore a blue
arm band with yellow C D on it and carried
an ID in your wallet. Now everybody around
here has badges, school folks, private
businesses, hospitals, EOCs, etc. If you're
providing on site communications you gotta
wear a badge, even if it a visitor one.

I guess the folks that rant and rave about how
bad it is for hams to wear badges need a
reality check.

Another poster brought up a point about the
reflective vests, hey in a lotta cases, OHSA
says you gotta wear it. I hate them, but have
worn them when required, same-same for hard hats.

73 de Ronnie
 
RE: Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by KC8VWM on October 13, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
Common problems associated with volunteers during disasters:

Electrocution:

Many volunteers set out looking for victims on their own unaware that their environment poses a imminent danger to themselves.

Risk Of Fire & Explosion:

The "untrained" rescue attempt most often times does not consider a complete environmental assessment of the area. They often go in for the meat and potatoes rescue attempt completely unaware of any "potential" or added danger to themselves. Often times, they go it alone. Even trained processionals work in pairs and never alone.

They are not adequately trained to assess the environmental dangers nor do they have any certification or training in the use of devices for assesing the enviroment. They have no working knowledge of testing for gas emissions or oxygen levels prior to entering confined spaces.

Some "well to do" rescuers often become victims simply because they did not have an adequate oxygen supply in the rescue environment.

"Taking Charge" at a disaster scene.

While the intention of helping other people is all well and good, This is especially a problem that hinders professionals at all levels because the "volunteer in charge" does not have any previous triage experience or cannot adequately organize casualties. They cannot effectively deploy the assistance required for the event in any specific order of priority.

A task as simple as evacuating casualties out of an area has to be prioritized and organized according to specific logistical or medical criteria.

Unaware of the implications they are imposing, the "take charge" person often experiences the result of a what is known as "organized confusion." This leads to the complete collapse of organized structure at the disaster scene.

This is the point where people start getting "risky" and injuries start occurring. This eventually results in an added burden for rescue workers who are already strained to the limits as additional rescues and casualties are added to the list.

Each rescue at a disaster scene can take approx. 30 min on average. Now let's say you have 40 rescues at hand and 20 rescuers to perform this task. How long will it take? (Remember rescuers often work in pairs)

Now, have you done the math?

How can you better perform the rescues?

Who should get rescue priority?

A) The unconscious baby who is trapped under rubble?
B) The conscious man who is bleeding?

Answer: The man who is bleeding gets priority because the baby was assesed and was found to have stable vital signs, breathing. The man who is bleeding may have a more serious outcome in the short term if not treated immediately.

Many untrained volunteers are completely unprepared to deal with the actual life "experience" or consequences resulting from action taken or not taken.

As many as three quarters of the victims could die while waiting for rescue. After an hour and a half, untreated victims of shock would begin to die. After one day, trapped children would begin to die of thirst. After two days, trapped adults and shut-ins would begin to die of thirst.

... and the list goes on.

Most unexperienced civilians have difficulty handling this reality.

Many feel personally responsible and start questioning their abilities or actions or how they are handling the situation. "What If" I did it differently etc...

Disasters are a VERY traumatic experience for humans. Recognizing that fact even for volunteers is an important aspect of their training. Volunteers can have difficulty dealing with peoples families, or when making critical decision making processes. They have to endure these conditions often for many long hours at a time. This places a great deal of personal stress on any individual. Amateur Radio Communicators should have education in this area to help them cope and perform much better if faced with such a reality.

Remember, much training, skill and knowledge should be working behind that orange colored vest at a disaster scene.

It is not only about the equipment you carry with you that makes you effective at these events, but rather what you have acquired under your hat that makes you a highly desired and most valuable asset during any emergency that matters most.

Thanks For Listening.


Charles - KC8VWM
 
RE: Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by AMATEURRADIODOTCA on October 13, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
First of all, thanks to everyone who has participated! Obviously some strong feelings on both sides of the issue! This has been a very interesting thread, despite some of the hyperbole. Though I disagree with the naysayers, they make some very good points that shouldn’t be simply brushed off. Amateur radio does have problems and they need to be addressed.

Untrained volunteers and those who just show up are seen as being “in the way”. Yet the large number of police, fire, ambulance and emergency planning personnel who also have amateur licenses show there is a use and a need for amateur radio in both emergency response as well as general life. TRAINING TIP: More emphasis on not showing up unless you have training and have participated in exercises or you will be ruining all the good work of others.

Training has to be at a higher level. As a senior police officer in California said (as a ham) “If you haven’t been trained in Incident Command, don’t bother showing up.” How many of our trained hams still haven’t got ICS level 100? Vancouver, Canada has taken the steps to train numerous hams up to Level 400 at city expense. I loved the reaction of a Fire Department official at a public event who exclaimed “Our City hasn’t trained many of our officers to Level 300 and your volunteers are getting 400? TRAINING TIP: Get level 100 for all your personnel.

We talk the talk, but do we walk the walk? For all the talk of using ICS, helping in emergencies, attending once a year practices, how much do amateurs REALLY know about disaster communications? I am amazed about the misconceptions of many amateurs. For example, “we’ll have our guys out right away because ham radio can respond instantly.” Unless you have the authority to commit paid staff under your direct supervision, your emergency response rate for volunteers and officials off duty is 5%. Even the authorities fall down on this one. For example, when 95% of disasters and large-scale emergencies involve convergence of volunteers, why is it ICS hasn’t incorporated a volunteer coordinator and volunteer sign-in area? Both amateur radio and emergency officials are guilty of ignoring recurring themes of disasters. When convergent volunteers is a fact of life, why has it taken 30 years+ to set up a volunteer coordinator and 30+ years for amateurs to plan on staffing that location? TRAINING TIP: Read disaster reports from the newspapers, Internet and specifically seek them out. There is some VERY interesting reading. www.amateurradio.ca has as many as we can find up on the net.

On the topic of a 5% response rate of your members, that number is based on the last 30 years of debriefing reports and actual experience. Take 95% of your hams off your callout list and build your response over that. Oh, yes. Only 5% of your key personnel will be available so you will be relying on new hams and junior members of your group. You need to study disaster communications to be good at it. And make sure your newest members know what to do – they may literally be in charge. TRAINING TIP: Make sure your newest volunteers are immediately given the broad picture of what they are to do as they may be one of the few immediately available volunteers.

We don’t use our expertise. This is where these forums can be of great use to discuss issues. For example, ICS has a requirement for a staging area and there must always be spares. Amateur radio doesn’t need to have a physical staging area as we can stage on the air. This is a monumental advantage, but rarely used by amateur radio. A great discussion would be “how do we use this to best advantage?” When there is the big bang or the cloud of smoke streaming up to the sky, hams are immediately on the air. Immediate damage assessment is a huge asset of amateur radio. “This is net control. We have obviously had a major explosion. Are there any reports of block-wide damage? Are there any reports of single building damage? Are there any reports of minor damage?” Now you have a pretty good idea of whether it is a local incident or widespread and where the incident took place. Five minutes. Did you know that in Kobe, Japan it took TWELVE HOURS for the national government to find out that there were 48,000 buildings totally destroyed and 48,000 partially damaged? Amateur radio could be of huge help immediately after ANY incident by getting a visual grasp on the damage and passing that onto authorities. Even if it is just a confirmation that nothing has happened except in the one place the authorities are aware of. Also, knowing that an area is NOT damaged is just as important as knowing which areas are damaged. Some of the worst hit areas are the last to get response because nothing was heard from the area and the authorities focused on the first hit, noticeably hit areas that were still able to scream the loudest. TRAINING TIP: What are our greatest abililties. How do we put these to use within our program to take advantage of them.

Our procedures need to be reviewed as well. The old maxim of “If you don’t do it every time in your training, you won’t do it in an emergency” applies. While instant damage assessment is not a priority on your city’s truck-train crash exercise, if you don’t do it as part of your routine operations set-up, then you won’t remember to do it in a widespread disaster. TRAINING TIP: Review your standard operating procedures / operational guidelines. Make sure your members understand them and follow them. Read debriefing reports to see if you have missed anything or need to revise them.

Even emergency officials can get focused on an exercise and miss the column of smoke rising in another part of the city. Emergency officials watching hundreds of thousands of people at a fireworks festival were unaware that nearby a boat had flipped and 16 people were drowning until amateur radio pointed it out to them. Ambulance availability, coast guard/ambulance transfer, road closures and hospital capacity immediately became huge issues as the fireworks had just ended and hundreds of thousands of people were now heading home. In another case, a police incident occurred on the parade route. Emergency officials and event organizers are human beings, too. Amateur radio can and should play the role of giving the over-all picture of what’s going on. It sometimes gets missed at events and even at disasters. TRAINING TIP: The communications leader and, if assigned, the amateur radio planning officer should be taking a step back and looking at the broad picture of the event and surrounding areas.

“Disasters are complex, multi-jurisdictional, multi-organizational events. Most problems are not skills issues but management and planning issues. Throwing more firefighters or more police officers at the problem doesn’t work.” FEMA and emergency researchers have known for years that big disasters are problems because we don’t manage the response properly. We do all the skills training on putting out fires or how to handcuff a suspect safely or loading a patient onto a cot, but disasters require a whole new set of skills based on “We only have one fire truck available and eight fires – where do we send it?” or “We have nine roads in but only one police car to block traffic – what do we do now?”. Amateurs are good at some contingencies like “There is no power” or “The repeater goes down” but how often do we talk about “The ice storm effects lasted for six weeks – how do we cover six weeks of communications?” or “We are short of operators yet we haven’t told anyone outside the region how to assist or made any arrangements to accommodate outside assistance. What is our plan for long-term operations and communicating our needs outside the region?” TRAINING TIP: Look at the debriefing reports and have a group discussion on what were the skills issues (usually few) and what were the management and planning issues (huge).

Amateur radio does all the skills training, but not the management training for either public service or emergency response. We don’t use ICS for disasters so obviously we don’t need it for public events. Yet, when we do use it, the event works WAY better. Amazing that! Use logistics to deliver water or a spare battery or Finance/Admin is used to ensure everyone is signed in. ICS says you must plan on things getting worse or getting better. How often do we sit down with organizers and say “What if your phones fail?” or “The week before your marathon there was a three alarm fire on your race route. What are your plans if there is a major course disruption and how can we help communicate that and coordinate that with your officials?” TRAINING TIP: Apply ICS to your event structure and including make sure you look at planning for emergency communications. What if the parade needs to be stopped because a float ran over a kid? What if there is a natural gas leak in the crowd? Who is in charge if the event organizer becomes unavailable? What are the normal emergencies that happen with these events and what are the broad responses to unusual occurrences? Discussing it before the event can save a lot of problems during the event and make your public service even more welcomed.

Some of the discussion in the thread revolves around attitude. It’s funny, but attitude becomes less of an issue when you have met the individual ten or twenty times before. Knowing someone means you know their strengths and weaknesses and have already found your own way to deal with their personalities. This applies on both sides of the emergency officials and event organizers / amateur radio operator coin. “He’s a jerk but he sure gets our food quickly” or “his shirt is dirty today yet every time before his shirt has been clean and he sure knows how to run a net.” TRAINING TIP: The more you deal with organizers and officials, the less of an issue a first impression becomes. First impressions are still important, but they tend to fade with continual contact. Do you remember what your teacher wore the first day of school or what their personality was like through the year?

Untrained volunteers and those who just show up are seen as being “in the way”. Yet the large number of police, fire, ambulance and emergency planning personnel who also have amateur licenses show there is a use and a need for amateur radio in both emergency response as well as general life. Public service is a great way to meet the key people, learn the skills, develop your own emergency skills and see the strengths and weaknesses of the people you volunteer with.

Sorry for going on so long, but this thread has got a lot of bees buzzing in my bonnet. Thanks for reading!

VE7TOX
 
RE: Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by AE6IP on October 13, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
> Anyone who believes amateurs do not play an
> important role in real disasters has never been in
> one in my opinion.

I guess that means that Hebgen Lake quake, the Loma Prieta quake, Mt Saint Helens blowing up, the Montana blizzard of 1973, any number of Montana fire seasons, and the San Francisquito flood were not disasters.

Amateur radio plays a small but useful role in some disaster situations. As professional organizations take advantage of moodern communications systems, the opportunity continues to decline.

 
RE: Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by AE6IP on October 13, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
> Anyone who believes amateurs do not play an
> important role in real disasters has never been in
> one in my opinion.

I guess that means that Hebgen Lake quake, the Loma Prieta quake, Mt Saint Helens blowing up, the Montana blizzard of 1973, any number of Montana fire seasons, and the San Francisquito flood were not disasters.

Amateur radio plays a small but useful role in some disaster situations. As professional organizations take advantage of moodern communications systems, the opportunity continues to decline.

 
RE: Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by KC8VWM on October 13, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
"Amateur radio plays a small but useful role in some disaster situations."

Never downplay or underestimate the effectiveness volunteers can contribute to these events. They play a rather important and significant role in any disaster situation.

It's how these situations are handled that matters most.


73

Charles - KC8VWM
 
RE: Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by AE6IP on October 14, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
> Never downplay or underestimate the effectiveness
> volunteers can contribute to these events. They play
> a rather important and significant role in any
> disaster situation.

Volunteers can contribute during a disaster. And in some circumstances they are very useful. In none of the events I mentioned, nor in many other blizzards and fire seasons in my experience, did we rely on volunteers for communication; emergency, or otherwise.

This is not to say that amateur radio operators are never useful in a diasters. Only that there are many dissasters in which, for one reason or another, they were not.
 
Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by WA6JGM on October 14, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
Is Amateur Radio Hobby? Why yes indeed it is.

You can build your own equipment.

You can design and build your antennas.

You can work the Space Station with an HT.

You can chew the fat with your buddies via h.f. or the local gang via v.h.f./u.h.f. simplex or through a repeater.

You can have world wide communications via your home computer.

Or you can work the world using the above gear and antennas you designed and built.


Is Amateur Radio a service? Why yes indeed it is.

The Governing Agency that issued your license calls it the Amateur Radio Service, not the Amateur Radio Hobby.

You can give 42 minute advance warning to the community that is going to be hit directly by a "long track" F-4 tornado ie... the May 4 tornado outbreak in South West Missouri. I'm the Deputy Director for SKYWARN in South West Missouri....I was there.

You can provide Public Service communications from the Incident Command Post to the E.O.C. after the F-4 rolled through the County. All Public Service circuits were grid locked due to the extensive damage path that was laid down by the F-4 for 52 miles.
We were the only means of reliable communications for the first 4 hours. Thank God all the reliable hard wire and cell phone circuits crashed so we could get all the "glory" in being "rubber duckie rangers" who are in some weird "hobby". I'm the ARES E.C. and RACES Officer for the County.....I was there.


You can provide backup communications for local Governments and Public Safety when all communication circuits get overloaded and fail. ie....the Christmas Eve snow storm of 2002. Yes even that good old reliable cell service went down due to high demand,all of the providers went down.....I was there.

You can provide "sole" communications for a town that was hit by flooding. ie... June 2000 Cassville MO. All hard wire and yes even that good old reliable cell phone service went down for the count. Amateur Radio was the only means to get tacticle and logistic support for that Community.... I was there.

For a hobby, the Amateur Radio Service sure has come to the aid world wide when all other means of communications fail and has performed this hobby errrrrr service for decades.

Now comments on all those really reliable high tech goodies.

Sat Phones? They are very nice,really cool, and darn expensive. It's not in our budget here, we can't afford that "James Bond" stuff so on to the next venue.

Internet? A great tool! What do you do if the disaster takes out a major switch, trunk, or server. That's a joke...right?

Cell phones? Another Joke? I'm lauging now! I'd rather play with a gallon of gasoline and matches then place my faith in cell phones when disaster strikes. The only thing the cell service providers have proven around here is that you can sure count on them "not working" when there is even a hint of trouble.

I would love to live where the person who made the above statement.
It must be nice to live in an area that there is "noway" any disaster would strike.
My advice to that person is this. Should a disaster strike your community please do not show up at the local E.O.C. with an HT in each hand "duckies" ah blaz'n ready for action....you're not needed....or wanted. You become part of the problem and your ass could wind up in jail.

Just sit in the rubble of your community and say I'm glad this radio stuff is just a hobby and not a sevice. So I'm not obligated to help anyone or myself or my family.

So tuck your head into the sand and say night night since you have the "big yawn" going. Sleep tight... be safe....be ignorant.

Pat Conway
WA6JGM
Christian County RACES/ARES E.C.
Deputy Director for SKYWARN NWS SGF
Ozark MO, 65721


 
RE: Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by AE6IP on October 14, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
> Is Amateur Radio a service? Why yes indeed it is.

> The Governing Agency that issued your license calls
> it the Amateur Radio Service, not the Amateur Radio
> Hobby.

And they call the "citizen band service" a service.
And they call the "family radio service" a service.
and they call . . .

"service" is what the FCC is providing to the community.

"hobby" is what we do with services like the R/C service, the FRS, CB, and the ARS.

 
RE: Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by AE6IP on October 14, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
> Just sit in the rubble of your community and say I'm
> glad this radio stuff is just a hobby and not a
> sevice. So I'm not obligated to help anyone or
> myself or my family.

Right. The only alternatives are amateur radio or do nothing. Sure.

> So tuck your head into the sand and say night night
> since you have the "big yawn" going. Sleep tight...
> be safe....be ignorant.

The people with their head in the sand are the ones that thing that disaster relief stops at "communicating".

 
RE: Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by WA4MJF on October 15, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
Actually, no, AE6IP, as the saying goes
"a mans gotta know his limitations".
When we are assiting the EM/CD folks,
our job is communications. That is why
we are there, so as they say leave
the other stuff to those who are
there for other missions.

In my case, for example, many moons ago
I was a LT in our VFD, I don't presume
to tell other firefighters what to do.
Also, Many moons ago, I was in the local
volunteer rescue squad as an EMT/EMT
Examiner, I don't tell rescue folks
what to do. Many, many, many moons ago
I was a Red Cross volunteer, I don't tell the
Red Cross folks what to do.
I am recently retired as
a police officer, I don't tell LEOs
what to so. I am a retired Army officer,
I don't tell soldiers what to do. I spent
over a decade in the CAP, well, all y'all get
the idea......

Because you was, don't mean you are, to use
the venacular.

So I fully support our NC SEC when he ways we're
communicators only. Leave the other stuff
to those who are trained to do other chores.

73 de Ronnie

 
RE: Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by WA6JGM on October 15, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
You are so right, I appolgise for not going beyond the communications aspects.

You could become a part of a State Certified Disaster Assesment Team.

You could a First Responder.

You could be a firefighter.

You could be part of a Search and Rescue Team.

You could organize and implement a local C.E.R.T. team that works in concert with your local Emergency Service Agencies.

Don't expect the fire department to show up at your door when your community just got wiped out from a tornado or whatever. Your on your own if you don't believe that ask the Fire Chief or your EMA Director.

You point is well taken and thank you for clarifying my mistake.

73
Pat
 
RE: Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by OLDFART13 on October 15, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
I agree with the original author. He has made some valid points. But I would include the following items also:

Spare battaries and a way to charge batteries
Food and water for a day or two
A little first aid kit
Level 1 Amateur Radio Emergency Communications Course completion
 
RE: Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by AE6IP on October 15, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
Ronnie,

You're missing my point; which is my fault for being too brief: It's fine to be merely a "communicator" in a disaster, if that's all you can do; and there are people who legitimately can do no more. And if you don't have the training, don't try to do the job, be it communicating or disaster relief.

However, the condescending remark about "sitting in the rubble", as if a ham's only choices were to be a ham or be a loser, was way off base, and it was that I was objecting to.

Given the choice between taking a ham 'shadow' who is going to be nothing but a communicator, or taking someone who went the extra distance to be CERT trained, I'll take the CERT volunteer any day.

The 'shadow' is baggage; an out of place person whose lack of even limited training makes them too much of a danger to themselves and others to take into a disaster situation. The CERT volunteer has only limited use, but has some training, and I can teach them everything they need to know in 5 minutes about the FRS radio we'll issue them.

If you want to be merely a 'communicator' in a disaster setting, that's just fine; and there'll be plenty of low priority health and welfare traffic for you to pass; but if you want to be of real value in a serious disaster, take the extra step and learn skills that'll be useful.

After all, it takes less time to learn decent CERT skills, and to keep them in practice, than it does to learn enough CW and procedure to participate in the NTS.
 
RE: Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by N6AYJ on October 16, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
"All you have to do is make sure your “tools” are at hand, in case they (and you) are needed."

Yeah, those public service types sure do have their tools in hand! Having been licensed for 44 years, I have had ample opportunity to observe these "emergency communicators" in action. Never have I seen a bigger bunch of self-important, self-appointed B.S. artists. All they do is talk, talk, talk, talk, talk, talk, talk, just to hear themselves talk, and make themselves feel important because something is lacking in their lives. This is the same reason they get into ARES in the first place. Go home and spend time with your family! Quit attending ARES meetings where all you B.S. artists talk, talk, talk at each other all night long. You have nothing to say! We've heard it all before! Ten times!

"Radio service" does not mean the same thing as "public service". It's only a hobby. Anybody who thinks hams are really going to do any good in an emergency is rather deluded, in my opinion. Note: I said "opinion". Your opinions are self-serving, while mine are objective and based on plenty of observation.
I'm entitled to mine, and you're entitled to yours. Kindly do not attack my opinions just because they differ from yours.

 
RE: Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by KB9YZL on October 17, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
N6AYJ;

Please re-read the original article again carefully; since you seem to have completely missed my point.

Are you really saying that anyone who is willing (and able) to help a fellow human being in need is, as you put it, “rather deluded”?

The world you live in must be a very cold and hard place. I’m sorry.

KLC

 
Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by KD5JFT on October 17, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
Quote: (N6AYJ) Anybody who thinks hams are really going to do any good in an emergency is rather deluded, in my opinion.

Reply: My opinion is in direct conflict with yours. I have seen/participated in several incidents where ham radio was efficiently used. In several (most notably weather spotting) ham radio was the only reliable information available. After the last tornado, my chief was impressed enough that I almost got permission to install a ham radio in my police department's dispatch (something I have been trying to do for several years). The television and radio stations were exagerating the situation so badly (in apparent pursuit of ratings) that the information they were giving out was WORSE than useless. Ham radio provided accurate, clear, concise, and VITAL information that was not available from anyone else!

Quote: (AE6IP) The 'shadow' is baggage; an out of place person whose lack of even limited training makes them too much of a danger to themselves and others to take into a disaster situation. If you want to be merely a 'communicator' in a disaster setting, that's just fine; and there'll be plenty of low priority health and welfare traffic for you to pass; but if you want to be of real value in a serious disaster, take the extra step and learn skills that'll be useful.


Reply: I couldn't agree more. Well stated.

Quote: (WA6JGM) The only thing the cell service providers have proven around here is that you can sure count on them "not working" when there is even a hint of trouble.

Reply: Here too, and from what I understand, everywhere else also.

Quote: (VE7TOX) READ HIS ENTIRE POST!! (capitalization was used intentionally-yes I did mean to shout)

Quote: (KC8VWM) Read this one too.

Quote: (WA4MJF) As far as badges, you can't get away from them nowadays. Now everybody around here has badges, school folks, private businesses, hospitals, EOCs, etc. If you're providing on site communications you gotta wear a badge, even if it a visitor one.

Reply: I was refering to police style metal badges (where you could be mistaken for law enforcement), not the identification type you are refering to. I agree with you on needing these. I also agree with the reflective vests and hard hats. If you need them, use them. Don't wear them were they are obviously not needed though. That only makes you look hamsexy (see www.hamsexy.com for horrible examples of what not to do. Don't give people a reason to make fun of you or the hobby/service)

Quote: (KD4QOT) Some areas of the country prepare for disaster as regularly as we fertilize our gardens in the spring, or do the spring house cleaning.

Reply: If you saw my house, you would realize that the good regular preparedness training happens even more often. I can't emphsize enough, participate in the training. I have over twenty years of law enforcement/dispatch/security training. I would be nervous about running our weekly local ham information net, much less a disaster net. Of course, in a disaster, I will be much too busy doing my job to assist as a ham operator (maybe after I retire though). I don't even participate in the weather nets except to relay pertinent information to my PD or family.

Quote: (KC5SAS) While arriving clean and professional is important, so is wearing an easily identifiable uniform so that everyone knows who is a participant and who is a spectator.

Reply: Just don't go overboard with the uniforms or wear something that can be confused with Police/Fire/EMS. Especially police, that can get you in bad trouble very quickly. A polo shirt with an embroidered emblem or patch is very good and what I would reccomend.

Quote: K6BBC wrote-> Generally, it’s a public relation nightmare for the hobby when the geeks in orange vest show up. STOP IT! Orange vested hand held carrying nerds Johnny on-the-spot types do not help us with out rapidly diminishing numbers.

reply-(by KC5SAS) The orange vests are part of standard saftey equiptment which are required in many places. Most police, fire and ems agencies require their people to wear simular vests to heighten the their visability to motorists when on scenes. When participating in traffic control at an event, ARES, RACES, REACT or others should wear the basic saftey gear provided so as to protect themselves and to let others know that they are participating in the event and anen't simply a bystander standing idly in the road.

I would add, wear them were they are appropriate. If you are not participating in the exercise/drill or actual emergency or event, don't wear them. If you are in the EOC or other similiar place where they are not needed, don't wear them. Don't give people excuses to make fun of you or the service/hobby as they will and that will be the most remembered thing, not the actual services and all of the good work provided.

Quote: (KA0ZGL) No we are not the best thing sence sliced bread but we are dam close when we are needed. Yes there are some glorry hounds but most of us do as told. As an EC I know who these people are and can place them in areas that they will not cause any trouble.

Reply: Wish we all could hide our embarressments as easily as you do. I looked at most of the replies here as how to avoid them in the first place.

------------------------------------------------------
Ok, I've ranted long enough, it's time to go home and go to bed. . .

Craig Vowel
KD5JFT
 
Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by WA2JJH on October 19, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
Nicely written. Good points. After 9/11 I purchased a Yeasu FT-100D. It is to suppliment my motorolas.
A Laptop with a USB GPS RCVR is another good thing to have.

I also put in a tri-band wireless card in my laptop.
20AMP Gell Cell light weight batt boxes sell for 29.00 at auto shops

These batt boxe's are used to jump start cars. Some have built in air compressors.

CPR and first aid skills have to requalify every 2 years. Next time go for the difib qualification.
Auto-defibs are fool proof.
 
RE: Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by TECH2004 on October 22, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
we all know that ham radio is only a hobby and doesn't provide any service. there is no requirment to provide emergency communications and as stated by professionals on this site, they don't want us in the way. we need to leave this to the pros and stop pretending to be important. you guys who do this are only "wanna-bees" and your hurting the hobby.

we need to make sure that this country is more secure and that is why we should:

VOTE FOR KERRY!
 
RE: Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by KC2IXB on October 22, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
I hike in the Adirondack Mountains and I rely upon the Wilderness protocol to save my butt or some other hiker's I may find injuried along the trail. No cell coverage accept at the very peaks, but good repeater coverage all along the trails. As of yet, I have not had to use it, but I still don't hike without it. If your only public service is to monitor 146.52 MHz for the first five minutes of the hour, especially if your live in or on the fringes of the wilderness, you might just help in saving a life.
We can and do provide a service to the public and a service to one another.
Brothers and sisters, I'll be listening for you if you need my help.

73,
Bill
kc2ixb
 
RE: Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by KB9YZL on October 23, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
TECH2004;

LOL!!........I love sarcasm, when it’s really artfully done!

KLC


 
RE: Public Service Should Be Part of Your Agenda!  
by KC2OZU on January 7, 2006 Mail this to a friend!
I have a comment about the idea of activating within minutes not hours.

Most people in EMS or Fire are familiar with the Motorola Minitor line of 2-tone pagers. They're enough (at full volume) to wake up the whole house.

My thought, which I was thinking of bringing up to my local ARES group, is to have a dispatcher (whether it be at a local OEM/police office or an on-call volunteer) who could dispatch the volunteers. Older Minitor II's are relatively inexpensive, and if low band models are used (in 10- or 12-meters), at full power and with a decent antenna, they would have a rather wide coverage area.

-Jason
KC2OZU
 
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