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[Articles Home]  [Add Article]  

Does Your G5RV Give You Problems?

Vito Chiarappa (W6TH) on November 7, 2004
View comments about this article!

Does your G5RV give you problems?

If our G5RV is really 104, 108 or 112 feet long instead of 102 feet long, we won't detect much of a difference on 75 or 80 meters but we will definitely see a large difference on the 10 meter band.

The standard G5RV has trouble on 30, 17, and 10 meters. On other bands where this problem exists with the 30, 17 and 10 meter bands, arcing within the antenna tuner will happen, causing damage to the tuner.

Years ago in 1940 and years before there was the Center Fed Zepp the same identical antenna as the G5RV and could vary the antenna length and the open wire line length as well. However no problem to the 30, 17 or the 10 meter bands occured because the tuning system was different than what is being used today. The tuning unit of years gone by consisted of a link coupling system whereby the coupling could be varied and also a series or parallel tuning arrangements could be accomplished.

The input impedance to the G5RV antenna will vary from band to band, going from higher to lower and lower to higher impedances which the tuner cannot produce within a certain range of impedances or cannot take the high voltages developed. I will show written just what takes place with the G5RV antenna:

At a antenna length of 102 feet and a feeder length of 34 to 38 feet on 3.5 Mhz will require "parallel" tuning. 7 and 14 Mhz will require "series" tuning. 28 Mhz will require to experiment with both series and parallel tuning. This, because of the antenna height above ground and ground reflections.

In years gone by our Center Fed Zepp antennas, designed by John Kraus, W8JK were the best antennas of its time and still remains. The G5RV design by Louis Varney, G5RV has made it very easy to use with our modern day match boxes or antenna tuners, which really does simplify a great deal as to tuning methods. What noticeable problems have you noticed with your G5RV antenna? Our hats off to both, both now SK.

73, W6TH

Member Comments:
This article has expired. No more comments may be added.
 
Does Your G5RV Give You Problems?  
by AC5E on November 7, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
Well, for starters, I remember very well that back in 1940 we didn't have the 30, 17, 15, or 12 Meter bands. All those are post WWII developments. As is the G5RV itself.

The 105, or 102, foot dipole fed with open wire line is a fairly decent low band antenna, especially when it's fed with the classic link coupled ATU. In the G5RV configuration it leaves a great deal to be desired as an all band antenna.

And rather that engage in futile debate with those who swear Louis Varney's "20 Meter gain antenna that can be pressed into service on other bands" is the greatest thing since sliced bread - I will only suggest that anyone interested find either a pre-1940 college level textbook on transmission lines (I suggest Stephenson since he's a little less dense than most) or an equivalent college level textbook published since 1998.

It's interesting how everything that was old has become new again.

73 Pete Allen AC5E

 
Does Your G5RV Give You Problems?  
by AI4CB on November 7, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
This will probably spark a religious war but IMO the best way to press a G5RV into multiband service is to cut off the coax and balun and just run the twin lead or ladder line directly to the tuner!
 
RE: Does Your G5RV Give You Problems?  
by N4HRA on November 7, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
I fixed my G5RV problem by installing a ATU at the end of the Ladder Line.

Lew
 
RE: Does Your G5RV Give You Problems?  
by WB9TEV on November 7, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
This brings am interesting issue for the G5RV I use. This was bought off of Ebay from a group called Radiowaves. They sell the one I bought as a G5RV "lite" becuase it is claimed to be useable on 75 thru 10.Thing is it is only about 67 feet long. I use it and get what I might call sometimes good reports. Seems better for distance then even local guys as they hear me better on my veritcal. Anyway, I am looking for a better way. I have a limit space where the 67 feet is/was perfect.. I have noticed NOONE else sells a 67 footer unless it is called a jr and does not have 75 meters on it..
Any ideas? Is there something that can be done with this one to improve it?
 
RE: Does Your G5RV Give You Problems?  
by LNXAUTHOR on November 7, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
AI4CB wrote:

"This will probably spark a religious war but IMO the best way to press a G5RV into multiband service is to cut off the coax and balun and just run the twin lead or ladder line directly to the tuner!"

- that'd be my approach as well... for price vs performance, nothing beats a resonant/non-resonant wire dipole fed using ladder line... but i'd keep the unbalanced line out the shack?
 
RE: Does Your G5RV Give You Problems?  
by K5UJ on November 7, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
put up the center fed zepp; feed it with open wire line; run the line to a balanced matching network placed just inside the shack outside wall, and coax feed from it to the rig. it will work like a dream and no more g5rv problems.
 
Does Your G5RV Give You Problems?  
by K3YD on November 7, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
AI4CB wrote, "This will probably spark a religious war but IMO the best way to press a G5RV into multiband service is to cut off the coax and balun and just run the twin lead or ladder line directly to the tuner!"

I'll bet that you read the article by Lew Varney (G5RV) in ARRL Antenna Compendium, Vol. 1--or else you're as smart as he was. Ladder line feed (and a 20 meter omni-directional coverage pattern) are what Varney intended.
 
Does Your G5RV Give You Problems?  
by KP4HE on November 7, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
No mater what problem who may encounter. It's the most inexpensive, best performing, MULTI-BAND in market today (can beat a $27 for all bands). It come sutable for any lot size. (bigger is better)1/2 size, full size, doubble size. You pick.
Happy tuning.
David
KP4HE
 
Does Your G5RV Give You Problems?  
by SM4XUT on November 7, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
I have a 80m 1/2 wave dipole with 20m 450 Ohm ladder.This anttenna i similar to G5RV construction.
Using MFJ-949D tuner build in 4:1 balun and I can tune
10-80m without any problem. Now I want the MFJ-993 working automaticly. Is there any one who have experience of this.
SM4XUT
 
Does Your G5RV Give You Problems?  
by G0GQK on November 7, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
I never could understand why the G5RV became so popular, it is after all just a piece of wire, and a feeder, and its a called a dipole, so what's special about that.?

Since the original 102 ft long dipole, along came the half size model, completely useless, unless the radio conditions are right. Then someone in the States thought about selling double size G5RV at 204 ft.!
Double size G5RV, I ask ya !

Forget all about the G5RV, get yourself a piece of wire 33 feet long, solder it to the 102 ft. make yourself a 135 ft dipole, feed it with open wire feeder, 300, 450 or 600 ohm, a 4:1 balun and a good tuner and you will be able to transmit anywhere between 10 metres and 80 metres with an SWR as flat as ya momma's pancakes.
 
RE: Does Your G5RV Give You Problems?  
by K1OU on November 7, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
The best way to fix your G5RV is to take it down and put up a resonant antenna.
 
RE: Does Your G5RV Give You Problems?  
by WA1RNE on November 7, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

Over the years, the G5RV has been thrusted into the limelight as the "magic bullet" of multiband, single 50 ohm feed antennas.

In actuality, it is quite the opposite, probably because of shear convenience and desire.

As AI4CB stated, the best thing you can do to solve your G5RV blues is to a) cut off the balun - which is being mis-used because the impedance it is driving is unknown, maybe with the exception of 20 meters for the 102 ft version - and b) the coax.

What you are left with is a dipole (add 23 feet and it will be resonant on 75) fed with 450 ohm balanced line. Couple it to your rig with a good quality balanced tuner and you have a much more predictable system.

I would also stay away from tuners that use 4:1 baluns to couple to balanced line. Again, this is a misapplication of the balun as it is meant to operate at its designed port impedances: 50 ohms resistive in and 200 ohms out. Since the SWR can vary widely on balanced feeders (which they can typically handle without being lossy, the major reason for using them), that means the impedance will vary as well, which is highly unlikely to be 200 ohms resistive. The balun is therefore not running under the conditions it was designed which can result in it's failure as well as lost efficiency - or less radiated power.

Now if you say, "hey, it's easier to use the coax to get the feed into the shack", well, you're right, it is easier to route coax. But there are lots of ways to get 450 ohm line into the shack and it will be worth the extra effort.

In terms of cost, an 80 meter dipole fed with 300 or 450 ohm line and a good quality balanced tuner is definitely cheaper than buying a G5RV.

You get a better antenna without paying for the all the hype.....

73, Chris
 
RE: Does Your G5RV Give You Problems?  
by W8JI on November 7, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
The G5RV is a decent 80, 40 and 20 meter antenna.

When "full size", it has reaqsonable SWR and efficiency on the lower end of 80, the higher end of 40, and 20. That includes when you have 50-75 feet of coax on the antenna, and the tuner in the house.

Regardless of what popular opinion here seems to be, I can PROVE it isn't bad on those spots. Those who claim it is terrible can never really demonstrate why, they just know it is because it isn't "resonant". It really isn't necessary for the antenna itself to be resonant to have good efficiency.

As a matter of fact, a dipole (or doublet) goes through a gain peak when it is NOT resonant, when it becomes 1.3 WL long!

The problem with G5RV's comes in when people insist on using the half size, or insist on using them on bands where the feedpoint impedance is terrible. Another problem is people who use G5RV's often install them half-fast, often at low height and near objects that are radio wave obstructions or absorbers.

So here is the REAL bottom line. If you put a normal G5RV at the same height as a dipole and use a reasonable length of coax, no one will hardly know the difference on 80,40, or 20 to any other "dipole" antenna you use. If you try to use it on 30, 15, or 10 meters, you'll be lucky to not burn something up. That's becuase the impedance at the end of the ladder line is astronomical on those bands.

You can use it on 160, but only when fed like a T against a good ground.

I used a G5RV on 160, 80, 40 and 20 that way, and regularly kicked butt in pileups on the lower bands. BUT my G5RV was 80-90 ft high, in the clear, and fed against a good ground system as a T on 160.

I also A B blind tested a G5RV against a dipole at the same height, and NONE of the listeners could tell the difference between the antennas on 75 meters, 40 meters, or 20 meters.

If you model the system and include transmission line and tuner losses, you'll also see that agrees with what I say.

As for a 50ft G5RV working on 75 meters , bull. Unless you fed it as a vertical T against a good ground, a "G5RV JR" will suck. It will be just like using a regular 102ft G5RV as a dipole on 160.

Another interesting tidbit. Few people seem to like the G5RV, but a few people think by making it shorter still (88ft for 80) it makes a good antenna. That's because the "good antenna" is on the W4RNL site and is not called a G5RV.

73 Tom
 
Does Your G5RV Give You Problems?  
by W3DCG on November 7, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
Well...I've obsessed over this issue. I read what I could find about tuners, baluns, coax/windowlines,losses...losses in both, all that I could find. Got lost periodically but finally decided a normal G5RV would work good enough for a dipole that is, on 80/40/20...most of what matters to me given our place in the current solar cycle.
This solved my problem of having to spend another 50-80 bux on a "remote" balunced to unbalanced transformer to my auto-tuner. Turns out, this old design 102' wire works generally best on 20, worked great once on 17m, not so good since, and it works- but not well- on 30m. But- hey, I never run more than 100W, and so far my tuner has encountered no problems whatsoever- with anything, even 70' of coax with a direct short.
I am afraid to apply over 50W on ten though, I burned a different auto tuner that way, on a 40m OCF! I never get to do 10 now days anyway. Well on 80m, I have NO CHANCE of getting faintly close to 1/2 wave up, so for NVIS it's fine, works like any other near half wave wire I've ever run never higher than 45 feet up.

I have finally actually come to believe, darn-it, there is seldom magic to be found. I really wanted to believe! But finally, experience is convincing me that "windoms", vertical dipoles, other commercial variety OCFs work... by and large- though it does seem to my ear, that either lots of Old Timers using basic CFed Zepps, up near a halfwave flat or Inv Vee, are lying about their power, or they have the best barefoot signals 30-80m with these ancient balanced fed, especially link coupled, systems.

It's amazing why I don't have one yet... oh, wait, I do- butchered my 160m G5RV 5 ways from Sunday, End Fed, different lengths, OCF, and now Cfed with several visible splices, 100' long, and it seems to work much better than the G5RV on 30m, not at all on 17- but maybe an issue of lengths, both wire and windowline. I'll likely cut the 100' down closer to 30-40m size, figure out the best compromise length of windowline, so it'll work best on 30, and better than now on 17, maybe even fill in G5RV nulls on 20m- if I'm lucky.

If high power were in the equation- then everything changes. I just can't imagine how I could trust a high power auto tuner. In such a case, suddenly, something other, old and non magical, like the Alpha Delta multiband dipoles, painstakingly tuned for each band, starts to look real good!

NOW here in near Winter, my biggest riddle is 80m. Anyone have any experience, or even theoretical idea, how well one of those "shortened all band doublets" would work, hung vertically? These are the wires that feature loading coils, so the overall length is around 70'. What if one could hang 50-60' of it vertical, bending the top leg horizontal say, 20-10', and feeding it in the middle with window-line running parallel to the ground. Would this be a good (cheap), no radial 80m vertical?

PS, my tuner(150W CW IntelliTuner- tm) tunes my 102' G5RV fine all bands, but I'm afraid of 10m. The thing just doesn't work well on 30 or 17, like many have theorized and/or discovered in practice.
 
Does Your G5RV Give You Problems?  
by KC8VIF on November 7, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
I built mine for less than $10.00.
102'awg14, 31' 450 window line, no balun just a few turns
of rg58x then x feet of rg8 into a mfj949d driven by
a ic706mkiig. If the freq is touchy to tune I substitute a 5' jumper for the 1' jumper between the
rig and the tuner. WAS in 3 days using 6,10,12,17,20,40,75 SSB. Many dx on 10,17,20m ssb. 10'off the ground on one end and 35' on the other with some of the window line laying on the ground, go figure? Super antenna NO! ,Poor antenna Maybe. Lots of fun yes!!! A lousy antenna is better than no antenna!
I will garrantee it will whip the dog on a Isotron.
Enjoy the hobby
73
Greg
WG8Z
 
RE: Does Your G5RV Give You Problems?  
by W4CNG on November 7, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
No, I have resonant antennas all in the Attic. Just switch to them (3) and operate 75-10 meters, minus 30 meters, do not do alot of CW, some but not alot. Have used a couple of G5RV's at Field Day, such a pain to tune up to an antenna in the middle of a contest without interfering with others (using a Antenna bridge and A/B switch. No problems, do not use them.
Good Luck to those that choose a fair antenna, with a tuner to make a bad/fair antenna look good to your radio.
Steve W4CNG
 
RE: Does Your G5RV Give You Problems?  
by PE1NPG on November 8, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
The G5RV is not a wonder antenna. In my opinion its works just as wel as a dipole with open line. I use a 2x17 meters with an open line of about 8 meters, but direct into the tuner, it seems to work fairly well on all bands, except 10 meter band. I have a vertical dipole that I 15 m and up, so I did not ajust the length.

Simple credo : Maximum length of dipole you can get up, open line into the tuner, and have fun working the world!

73 de Jean-Pierre
 
RE: Does Your G5RV Give You Problems?  
by N4ZOU on November 8, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
The problem with a G5RV is that it was designed for use on 20 meters and ladder line feed all the way to the transmitter. Using the antenna on another band changes the impedance at the end of the feed line. The solution is to simply find a point on the feed line Where your tuner can properly match that impedance. You can build a feed line matcher using feed line and Switches. Simply take some feed line, ladder line or coax, and Make a loop of 2 feet where it can be placed in and out of the feed line at will with a switch. Then make the same setup with 4 feet. Double the feed line lengths with this setup until you have the final feed line length at 32 feet. One of these lengths of feed line added will provide an impedance that your tuner can properly match. This also works with a transceiver with an internal automatic antenna tuner with a limited range of 3:1 SWR or less. Adding the lengths of feed line will provide a SWR or 3:1 or less. Use caution with the selection of feed line as with any antenna and feed line system. Remember; you're not tuning the antenna! You're just finding a place on the feed line where the impedance is reasonable. On other parts of the feed line very high impedance and corresponding high voltage can exceed the rating of the feed line and burn out that or other sections of feed line. If using coax the line matcher may be put in a box and used in the shack. If using ladder line you will need to keep the line sections separated and only one loop for each section between switches. A 4:1 Balun can be used between the ladder line matcher and coax but the impedance should be close to 200 ohms at the end of the ladder line or 50 ohms at the transceiver side of the Balun. Use a noise bridge or SWR analyzer to figure out which section of line to use on which band or different parts of a band if using the internal 4:1 Balun in your antenna tuner.
 
RE: Does Your G5RV Give You Problems?  
by W9WHE-II on November 8, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

The G5RV was never intended to be an all band antenna.

When Mr. Varney (G5RV) came up with the design, it was intended to be three 1/2 wavelengths on 20 meters and to exibit some modest gain on 20 meters. Now, if you want to use it on other bands, that's fine, but just understand that it was never intended to be an "all bander" to begin with.



W9WHE
Proud to have cancelled my ARRL membership.
 
RE: Does Your G5RV Give You Problems?  
by WA3KYY on November 8, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
Don't know what it is about the G5RV that people say makes it difficult to use on other than 80,40 and 20. I use mine on all bands 160-6. It doesn't put out much of a signal on 160 but that is due more to the low height (25 feet) than anything else. I have over 100 countries on 10, 15, 20 and 40, 86 countries on 30 and 46 countries on 80. Don't recall the numbers on 12 or 17. But I have worked all continents on all but 12 and 80m with it (need one more on each)and 160. It has never given me a problem with my tuners (both unbalanced) and the balun. However, my tuners are not the typical autotuners built in to may rigs. Both are extended range autotuners and can match for 8-3000 ohms impeadance. On 10 and 160 I have to retune frequently, especially on 160, but for the other bands I only need to retune if moving from the upper to lower portions and not always then.

Given the constraints of both my QTH and equipment, it was a pretty easy antenna to fit into the space and match on the bands I was most interested in operating on. I was also easy to construct and cheap to buy the needed wire and insulators.

Mike
WA3KYY
 
Does Your G5RV Give You Problems?  
by W9DZ on November 8, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
L.B. Cebik, W4RNL has a lot of technical info regarding the G5RV on his website. He has written lots of antenna articles for various radio publications and is also a technical advisor to ARRL I believe. Here is a link to the G5RV article:

http://www.cebik.com/g5rv2.html

Allen, W9DZ
 
RE: Does Your G5RV Give You Problems?  
by W6TH on November 8, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

From calculations I find:

3.5 Mhz 102 feet too short. Should be 133 feet.

7.0 Mhz 102 feet too long and short. Should be 66 feet for half wave or 133 feet for two half waves fed in phase.

10,1 Mhz 102 feet close to two half waves fed in phase. 92 feet would be a full wave or two half waves fed in phase.

14.0 Mhz 102 feet is a long wire on 20 meters, should be for a extended double zepp 85.57 feet which will give a 3 db gain. at any height above ground.

28 MHz: On this band, the antenna acts as a 3-wave, center-fed long wire.

The pattern is similar to 21 or 24 MHZ, but with additional gain due to the colliner effect obtained by feeding two 3/2-wave antennas in phase. The load is high-Z, with low reactance.



14.150 MHz, and the dimension of 102 ft is derived from the formula for long-wire antennas which is:" LENGTH (ft) = 492(n-.05)/f(MHz).

Thanks to all for the posts as I have gained much knowledge in regards to the G5RV antenna.

.: 73 W6th.
 
RE: Does Your G5RV Give You Problems?  
by NB3O on November 8, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
Impedance data is from both EZNEC modeling and testing a G5RV at 35 feet above poor conductivity ground. Dimensions are 102 feet total length #14 hard drawn copper with 30 feet of 450 ohm slotted ladder line. Data was calculated and then measured at the ladder line end where the connection is normally made to the coax.
Real world measurements using the HP8753C were observed to be similar to the EZNEC data. A current bead balun (approx. 18uH common mode) using five Fair-Rite P/N 2643102002 was placed between the analyzer and the ladder line. Your milage may vary. 73
MHZ VSWR Rohms Xohms
3.5 3.9 12.8 2.4
3.6 5.0 15.4 35.3
3.7 8.2 18.7 70.2
3.8 12.7 23.0 107.8
3.9 17.8 28.5 148.8
4.0 23.1 35.8 194.2
5.3 48.2 1282.9 -1201.1
7.0 8.7 64.6 -148.1
7.1 7.1 61.7 -126.8
7.2 5.7 59.3 -106.5
7.3 4.4 57.2 -87.0
10.1 57.4 87.3 490.6
10.2 61.6 93.9 527.0
14.1 2.7 104.7 -53.0
14.2 2.2 108.6 -10.7
14.3 2.5 114.0 31.7
14.4 3.5 120.8 74.6
21 14.4 51.2 178.7
21.1 17.0 53.7 201.1
21.2 19.8 56.6 224.7
21.3 22.7 60.2 249.7
21.4 25.7 64.5 276.4
24.8 2.6 123.9 -19.9
24.9 2.5 121.1 13.0
25 2.8 119.4 44.8
28 61.5 3072.6 103.2
28.5 62.5 1234.3 -1527.6
29 58.8 427.4 -1034.9
29.5 50.7 209.0 -695.4
29.7 46.4 167.7 -599.1
 
RE: Does Your G5RV Give You Problems?  
by WA5ZNU on November 8, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
I think I get it. If I follow all the recommendations, I'm going to shorten my G5RV to 88ft (or 66ft or 44ft), and put a current balun on it (I guess to replace the current balun that's on it now), lengthen the coax to 70ft to give a nice resistive load on the way up, replace the balun with a 4:1 toroidal transformer to match the impedance on the bands where the reactance is low already and the ATU would be working fine anyway, and then cut the coax down to 0ft or less to eliminate its losses due to the >50 SWR on 60, 30, and 10M. Then I add more wire to the 88ft I cut it down to bring it up to 135ft to make it into an 80m doublet, which I should then raise up to a HAAT of 1/2 wavelength with ladder line brought in through a 2x2 foot metal-free hole in the wall all the way to my balanced-balanced tuner that I build myself by welding metal plates together to make high-voltage capacitors.

And to think how much better off I will be than with a 102ft doublet, a bead balun, and about 6 ft of coax through the wall to an autotuner!

Seriously, though, I have put up a low 30M dipole (10M doublet) with twinlead to a coax choke and it's noisier and less sensitive than the G5RV. More fiddling to do, or maybe I need to get out the slingshot and try to get it higher.
 
RE: Does Your G5RV Give You Problems?  
by W6TH on November 8, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

NB3O

Does not look like a all band antenna, does it?

Wrong antenna tuners are being used. For all band use it is to go back to the old way of coil across the 450 ohm line and a capacitor across the coil for parallel tuning. Then for series tuning, a coil across the 450 ohm ladder line and insert one capacitor in each leg of the 450 ohm line. This method will give a perfect balanced line, whereby the currents will be equal in both lines.

I tried this same system of matching and had no problem to work the WARC bands with of course a low VSWR.

.:
 
RE: Does Your G5RV Give You Problems?  
by W9WHE-II on November 8, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
Here is another solution:

"fan dipole, fed with ladder line, to the tuner"

Cut the legs for your favorite bands and tune the rest!


W9WHE
 
Does Your G5RV Give You Problems?  
by KG2CQ on November 8, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
I bought a G5RV now I don't know if I should put it up. This antenna sounds scary to me.lol Anyways I have heard good and bad reports on this antenna. I have the G5RV that goes from 3.5 thru 30MHz. It will not except 10MHz. I will try it and see what happens. If someone out there knows of anyone that knows a better antenna like the G5RV let me know thanks, Mark.
 
RE: Does Your G5RV Give You Problems?  
by W8JI on November 8, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
This is similar to what I measured.

If you look at the following:

MHZ VSWR Rohms Xohms
3.5 3.9 12.8 2.4
3.6 5.0 15.4 35.3
3.7 8.2 18.7 70.2

SWR is about 4:1 on the low end of 80. On the middle of 80 meters through 75 feet of RG8X system total feedline loss is only about 1 dB. Not much different than a dipole.

7.1 7.1 61.7 -126.8
7.2 5.7 59.3 -106.5
7.3 4.4 57.2 -87.0

Again on the high end of 40, SWR is reasonable. System loss is again only about a dB or so.

10.1 57.4 87.3 490.6
10.2 61.6 93.9 527.0

60:1 SWR and 20-30dB feedline loss. No good.


14.1 2.7 104.7 -53.0
14.2 2.2 108.6 -10.7
14.3 2.5 114.0 31.7
14.4 3.5 120.8 74.6

Again works fine on 20, that's three bands.

21 14.4 51.2 178.7
21.1 17.0 53.7 201.1
21.2 19.8 56.6 224.7
21.3 22.7 60.2 249.7
21.4 25.7 64.5 276.4

Junk on 15 meters! Better than 30M but still no good.

24.8 2.6 123.9 -19.9
24.9 2.5 121.1 13.0

Good on 24 MHz. That's four good bands.

28 61.5 3072.6 103.2
28.5 62.5 1234.3 -1527.6
29 58.8 427.4 -1034.9
29.5 50.7 209.0 -695.4
29.7 46.4 167.7 -599.1

Junk on ten meters.

Looks like the G5RV (with a tuner) works pretty well on 3.5, 7, 14, and 24 MHz. Forget the rest of the bands however. I never used mine on 24MHz, but in A B tests no one could tell if I was using the G5RV or a dipole on 80, 40 or 20.

73 Tom
 
RE: Does Your G5RV Give You Problems?  
by W6TH on November 8, 2004 Mail this to a friend!


W8JI

Thanks for the information.

To work 30 meters it can be done by using two antenna tuners one feeding the other. This will transform the impedance match two times.

On 80, 40 and 20 the G5RV does well and tunes easily, but on the other bands it's a beast. My normal antenna is a 133 foot center fed zepp for the 80 meter band. Works great as a marconi on the 160 meter band, but about one S unit down from a 160 meter zepp or dipole.

.:
 
RE: Does Your G5RV Give You Problems?  
by N6AJR on November 8, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
I still say a Fan Dipole ( multi band single coax feed ) antenna can be made for under $15 and work much better than a "g5rv" antenna.. and in a flat top, sloper, or inverted V don't make much difference

here is a good starter or do a search on fan dipole on google, or here on elmers search, and this one you can under stand how it works..

http://www.hamuniverse.com/multidipole.html





"""Does Your G5RV Give You Problems? Reply
by KP4HE on November 7, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
No mater what problem who may encounter. It's the most inexpensive, best performing, MULTI-BAND in market today (can beat a $27 for all bands). It come sutable for any lot size. (bigger is better)1/2 size, full size, doubble size. You pick.
Happy tuning.
David
KP4HE """
 
RE: Does Your G5RV Give You Problems?  
by N6AJR on November 8, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
I still say a Fan Dipole ( multi band single coax feed ) antenna can be made for under $15 and work much better than a "g5rv" antenna.. and in a flat top, sloper, or inverted V don't make much difference

here is a good starter or do a search on fan dipole on google, or here on elmers search, and this one you can under stand how it works..

http://www.hamuniverse.com/multidipole.html





"""Does Your G5RV Give You Problems? Reply
by KP4HE on November 7, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
No mater what problem who may encounter. It's the most inexpensive, best performing, MULTI-BAND in market today (can beat a $27 for all bands). It come sutable for any lot size. (bigger is better)1/2 size, full size, doubble size. You pick.
Happy tuning.
David
KP4HE """
 
RE: Does Your G5RV Give You Problems?  
by N6AJR on November 8, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
I still say a Fan Dipole ( multi band single coax feed ) antenna can be made for under $15 and work much better than a "g5rv" antenna.. and in a flat top, sloper, or inverted V don't make much difference

here is a good starter or do a search on fan dipole on google, or here on elmers search, and this one you can under stand how it works..

http://www.hamuniverse.com/multidipole.html





"""Does Your G5RV Give You Problems? Reply
by KP4HE on November 7, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
No mater what problem who may encounter. It's the most inexpensive, best performing, MULTI-BAND in market today (can beat a $27 for all bands). It come sutable for any lot size. (bigger is better)1/2 size, full size, doubble size. You pick.
Happy tuning.
David
KP4HE """
 
RE: Does Your G5RV Give You Problems?  
by NB3O on November 8, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
Similar to Tom's observations, most folks I queried could not tell the difference between the G5RV at 35 feet and the 80-40-20 meter fan dipole (same height) at the other end of the yard (150 yards apart, same East-West favor). Both of these were left-overs from Field Day and were occasionally used for comparisons through the summer months.
The difference is a matter of convenience. The G5RV went up a little easier. And since the internal antenna tuners in the modern rigs can match the mild VSWR on the popular bands, most folks like them. Either style will allow a coax entry into the shack (assuming a good current bead balun is used).
Tuning the G5RV on the high VSWR bands can be done as Vito mentioned by using the a link coupled tuner (like a Johnson) as long as the tuner is placed at the balanced ladder line end. Unfortunately the stock old Johnson does not cover 30 or 17 meters although the coil taps can be borrowed from other bandswitch positions. Doing all this makes the antenna look more like the traditional Center Fed Zepp. Funny how these things come full circle......73
 
Does Your G5RV Give You Problems?  
by K9MI on November 8, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
The solution for a high performance, simple multi-band dipole is to switch to the "Real McCoy".

Now, let's see who recalls that article in CQ Magazine written by antenna expert, now SK, Lew McCoy, W1ICP.


Mike - K9MI

 
RE: Does Your G5RV Give You Problems?  
by G7HEU on November 9, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
I've read all of this with interest. Many people here know much more about this than I do but here's my contribution:

I started with a 1/2 G5RV. I then read about coax losses and poor performance of the antenna on the WARC bands.

I built a balanced ATU from an old article. It's a series / parallel unit ( uses a knife switch ). The a.t.u was directly connected to balanced ribbon which went straight to the centre of what was now a doublet.

I can only fit in one antenna at a time so comparisions are very subjective but I'm convinced the new arrangement was much more effective.

Later I managed to add a bit more wire to each end and ( with droop ! ) have a total length of 66'. That works even better.

Yes it takes a little time to move aligator clips and tune the capacitors. Also my radio's auto a.t.u. is now redundant.I think that's a fair price to pay for maximum efficency.

There's a picture of my a.t.u. on my E-Ham profile. If anybody would like a scan of the article I built it from please e-mail me.

Steve
G7HEU / M0HEU.

 
RE: Does Your G5RV Give You Problems?  
by KI7YY on November 9, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
K9MI is correct! Put up a "real McCoy" and all will be well. A real McCoy is all the wire you can put up, fed in the center with balanced feeders to a good Transmatch. It was a great article, and Lew was a Great Ham!
 
RE: Does Your G5RV Give You Problems?  
by NG1I on November 9, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
Has anyone cut the balun and line to the shack and replaced the whole transmission line with ladder line to their G5RV? If so how is over performance on what bands? I have a full size 102' G5RV. So what's the scoop? Thanks 73 Frank
 
RE: Does Your G5RV Give You Problems?  
by K4JF on November 9, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
I have tried G5RV and found it to be the outdoor equivalent of a rubber ducky. Trap dipoles work far, far better. Double bazooka is several orders of magnitude better, and easy to use on several bands if you have a decent tuner.
 
Does Your G5RV Give You Problems?  
by K1SCQ on November 9, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
I have been using a G5RV junior with my TR4 and MFJ tuner for a month or so and have been fairly pleased. My SWR on 40, 20 and 10 is under 2:1 (closer to 1.5:1 on 40) and is around 3:1 on 15 (on the antenna side of the tuner). I have about 75' of coax from my shack to the feedline of the G5RV so I suppose I have some line loss, but my signal reports have been good on 10, 20 and 40. I only have around 75' of land to work with and am very happy with this antenna given my lot limitations. The price was right at ~$30.00.

K1SCQ
 
Does Your G5RV Give You Problems?  
by KA2QFX on November 9, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
For what it's worth, here's my take on the G5RV.
http://www.bridgeport.edu/~msedutto/g5rv.html

P.S. Hearing is believing, and I've never heard a G5RV off of 20 meters with a signal worth a damn, compared to a similar sized resonant or non-resonant dipole fed with open line a decent tuner.
 
Does Your G5RV Give You Problems?  
by KA2QFX on November 9, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
For what it's worth, here's my take on the G5RV.
http://www.bridgeport.edu/~msedutto/g5rv.html

P.S. Hearing is believing, and I've never heard a G5RV off of 20 meters with a signal worth a damn, compared to a similar sized resonant or non-resonant dipole fed with open line a decent tuner.
 
Does Your G5RV Give You Problems?  
by KA2QFX on November 9, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
For what it's worth, here's my take on the G5RV.
http://www.bridgeport.edu/~msedutto/g5rv.html

P.S. Hearing is believing, and I've never heard a G5RV off of 20 meters with a signal worth a damn, compared to a similar sized resonant or non-resonant dipole fed with open line a decent tuner.
 
Does Your G5RV Give You Problems?  
by KA2QFX on November 9, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
For what it's worth, here's my take on the G5RV.
http://www.bridgeport.edu/~msedutto/g5rv.html

P.S. Hearing is believing, and I've never heard a G5RV off of 20 meters with a signal worth a damn, compared to a similar sized resonant or non-resonant dipole fed with open line a decent tuner.
 
Does Your G5RV Give You Problems?  
by KA2QFX on November 9, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
For what it's worth, here's my take on the G5RV.
http://www.bridgeport.edu/~msedutto/g5rv.html

P.S. Hearing is believing, and I've never heard a G5RV off of 20 meters with a signal worth a damn, compared to a similar sized resonant or non-resonant dipole fed with open line a decent tuner.
 
Does Your G5RV Give You Problems?  
by KA2QFX on November 9, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
I apoligize for the multiple comments posting. After clicking post I recieved a myriad of different messages indicating some error (no topic selected, methods of posting article, etc) or another. None of which indicating the post had occurred.
 
Does Your G5RV Give You Problems?  
by N5YPJ on November 10, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
For a wire antenna, at 35 feet I can't complain about my antenna. Only place I have problems is tuning up on 75/80, it's hard to get a match and have to retune every little QSY of 30 Khz or so. Once tuned it works well.

Sure it can't beat a 2 or 3 el yagi, but then again, I can't afford one of those.
 
Does Your G5RV Give You Problems?  
by W2CSH on November 10, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
I finally gave up on the G5RV when I moved to my new QTH about 5 years ago. I had it down on the ground for installation of new rope and accidently ran over it with the riding mower. I purchased a Windom Half-Square cut for 80 meters and above from Antennas and More. The WHS will radiate with less than a 2:1 SWR with no tuner on all bands. I use a tuner for 60 meters and it works fine. I get great DX results and have even worked some JA's from the east coast. It is a very nice antenna for small lots and has been a great performer. The G5RV burned up two tuners and was not a good performer on any band but 40 meters. I suplement the WHS with a GAP Titan vertical which is also a very nice antenna but will not work on 60 meters.
 
Does Your G5RV Give You Problems?  
by W0OOW on November 10, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
My G5RV works fine. No, it can't compete with 5 el and 140' but... On 20 it is 3/2 wave with a nice pattern. The other bands... they vary. As I recall G5RV designed this antenna with 20 in mind to cover the areas of his interest. Mine is only at 30' but works fine. Personally, I'd rather use a standard 3/2 on 20 fed with coax. Tuning.... I used to use about 130', center fed with open wire. That got to be "interesting" on 40M. Anyway, it works super on 20.
Steve
 
RE: Does Your G5RV Give You Problems?  
by W6TH on November 10, 2004 Mail this to a friend!


Here is some information of value to all.

Should you have trouble with a G5RV or any other antenna that will not tune and get a low VSWR, I suggest using two ATU to solve the problem.

As an example:

I have several ATU that I play with and for the example I use the MFJ-941B and cascade it to a MFJ-962.
This system tunes all bands on the G5RV. You may give this a try if not able to work all bands on the G5RV.

.: 73 W6TH.
 
Does Your G5RV Give You Problems?  
by K6RMR on November 11, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
We did not abtain 30,12 and 12 meters as ham bands
untill the early 1980's
 
Does Your G5RV Give You Problems?  
by K6RMR on November 11, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
We did not abtain 30,17 and 12 meters as ham bands
untill the early 1980's
 
Does Your G5RV Give You Problems?  
by K6RMR on November 11, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
We did not abtain 30,17 and 12 meters as ham bands
untill the early 1980's
 
Does Your G5RV Give You Problems?  
by N7IBC on November 12, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
I have two of these antennas up, both with the same basic configuration and they work well for me.If I can hear them, I can usually work them. Get some pretty decent DX stuff from my mountain location.
Has anyone, and this may seem a crazy idea, but co-phased these together??
If so, how is the harness made??

N7IBC
 
RE: Does Your G5RV Give You Problems?  
by W6TH on November 12, 2004 Mail this to a friend!


N7IBC

Should both antennas be symetrical, then just parallel them, the feed lines. The distance between both antennas work best if spaced half wavelength away, side by side.

.:
 
RE: Does Your G5RV Give You Problems?  
by W6TH on November 12, 2004 Mail this to a friend!


K6RMR
We did not abtain 30,17 and 12 meters as ham bands
untill the early 1980's.
-------------------------------------------------

The 30, 17 and 12 meters were always there. Just were not given to be used by ham radio.

Back in and before 1940 the G5RV was called a center fed ZEPP with 100 feet flat top and thirtyfive feet of open wire line. All that Mr., Varney did was to add a long length of 50/75 coax to the antenna feed line and then it was called the G5RV all band antenna.

The correct tuning method should be able to tune this type of antenna both series and parallel.

Hope this gives you some idea of the changes made from old to new antennas.

.:
 
Does Your G5RV Give You Problems?  
by N0VA on November 12, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
I use a half-sized G5RV laying directly on my roof due to size restriction and the need for covert operation. I use an MFJ Diff-T Tuner and operate 1 watt QRP cw or no more than 10 watts when not QRP.

Now, I don't why it works but it works and I make contacts and get the usual RST reports one expects from QRP and low power output. So I don't care about all the theories about why a G5RV in full size, much less a half-size, shouldn't work.
 
Does Your G5RV Give You Problems?  
by WA8SDF on November 13, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
No it does not. NO PROBLEMS .
I run a G5RV JR up 70ft in an inverted Vee and for 40 -10 it works just fine. My lot size is very small... and I am very happy with the results.
 
The proof is in the eating  
by AD1C on November 14, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
Mine works just dandy.

I have the 102' version with the 35' or so of twinlead, a W2AU balun then RG-213 coax into the shack. The antenna is strung between two trees, the center only about 37' off the ground.

Judge these results for yourself:

325 countries all bands

229 80M
282 40M
263 30M (*)
316 20M
316 17M
293 15M (*)
301 12M
278 10M

(*) loading is poor on 30M and 15M, so I sometimes use a different antenna.

I've worked about 25 countries on 160M by tying the coax together and feeding it as an end-fed wire.

73 - Jim AD1C
 
RE: The proof is in the eating  
by W6TH on November 14, 2004 Mail this to a friend!


AD1C

Your G5RV Give You Problems?

Yes it does, on the 30 and 15 meter bands.

You answered the problems. Problems that many others have. Thanks.

.:
 
Does Your G5RV Give You Problems?  
by N6TZ on November 14, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

The G5RV is a very compromised antenna at the least. I shudder to think that people even buy "factory made" versions of it. What a waste of money.

Instead, first get out the ARRL Handbook or ARRL Antenna handbook and read...yes study and read. Then you will find that you can actually build your own better antenna.

Then, put your money where it will pay most. a good mast(s) for decent height(30 ft minimum), good home-made open twin lead line (or buy a good twin line), and a good antenna tuner.

You want all bands, put up about a 102 to 105 foot total dipole and center feed it with the ladder line to the tuner. You will do better than that G5 by far.

Hints:

Bring the last ten or so feet of feedline into the shack by using the "twin coax" method(it's in the books). That will keep some voltage and rf problems out of the reach of you and the pet cat.

Also, check out the nearest fence supply company for "top rail" pipe in the 21 foot version with telescoping end. It is real easy to get 40 feet with a set of guys and a swivel mount on a eight or ten foot 4by4 post in the ground. Your local hardware outlet has all kinds of fence hardware to handle post mounting and guying - use your imagination, but use safety first. If you are not mechanically inclined, get help!

It won't quite match on one band? - add a foot or two to each end, or take away that much.

This will be a horizontally polarized antenna, and thus will be much quieter on receive than one of those pathetic trap or other multiband verticals. You may have up to 20 db+ improvement in signal/to/noise ratio by using horizontal polarization.

Hal, N6TZ@arrl.net
 
RE: outdoor rubber duckie?  
by KI9A on November 14, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
"I have tried G5RV and found it to be the outdoor equivalent of a rubber ducky. "

SWEET! I have 5BDXCC with an outdoor rubber duckie at 40'!!

I have used this antenna for over 25 years, found basically what W8JI has said. 10-15, it sucks. Don't use WARC much, so can't really say. 20-40-80, comparded to resonant dipoles I had up, made many A/B on them & NOBODY detected a difference, ever, on any band.

I have 138 DXCC on 80, 211 on 40, 281 on 20 with this outdoor rubber duckie--can you imagine what can be done with "real" antennas??

73-Chuck KI9A

 
Does Your G5RV Give You Problems?  
by NJ6F on November 18, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
I use a 130' G5RV that was called a Dentron Doublet. I have it in an inverted V configuration with a 90 deg split / one leg to the east and one to the north here in San Diego / El Cajon. Feed is at 35' and ends droop to 10' off the ground.
This antenna works great on 10 meters thru 75 but does not load up on 30 meters and since it is at a 90 degree angle 75 loads up with low SWR from 3900 up.
All this is using a 4:1 balun out of a Dentron MT3000 tuner up on the eve of the roof at the feedpoint behind a 4 position thru the coax ant switch using a FC20 auto tuner. NOW when I use the big MT-3000 tuner with a larger range, no problem on any band.
For 160 I use a Butternut vertical 160-10.
Now for performance... on 17 against a straight tubular dipole cut for 17 but only at 15' above ground, the 130' G5RV wins most of the time by 2 or 3 S units. It is 3 to 5 S units worse than my 3 el A3 beam on 20/15/10. The G5RV is part vertical and mostly horizontal which aids in the local contacts via vertical polorization. I like it and it has proven to be a all around good antenna. Dont fall for this purest stuff about bringing the balanced line into the shack....you can forget that....big hassle and I don't need RF on my audio. Go for 130' length I say in a broad side 180 degree standard configuration. Ideally....if I had the room and did not have a flexible tuner I would suggest a high center fed pole 40-60 feet, with a 1:1 air core balun....not ferrite...they saturate and heat up, fed with RG8 or better with multiple dipoles seperatly cut for 75, 20, 40/15, 17, and 10 I believe in a curtin arrangement like the military does it. You need to mount the 20 next to the 75 etc to eliminate any interactions / space for odd wavelength non-interaction. Seperate dipoles also work well 40/15 on one and 17/12 on the other and 20 by itself.
If you want go for a 160/75/40 vertical like a Butternut 75/40 with a 160 coil... or the HF9V Butternut with 160 coil if you want all bands out to 6 meters with little space. The Butternut vertical works well on all bands and is not some ugly monster wind load wise and TAKE the FULL Max POWER unlike some of the others and it uses NO TRAPS so you use the full lenght of the vertical for each band. Stay away from Verticals with lossy traps where the 10 meter section for example is all of 4 feet long from the base, which to me is a dummy load. I get out great on 160 with the Butternut. A roof mount Butternut with the resonant radials might also be an ideal thing if you have no room.
I you live in an apartment....remember you can load up the metal under the eve of the roof or the gutter or........it's Xmas.....put fake XMAS lights on your green wire dipole..... who cares if they don't go on.
People complain about wire antennas but Christmas lights of course OK...go figure....I also use a Spider dipole for 10-75 / its all of 8 feet in length for a balcony or deck. Gets out great on 6-40 and is OK on 75. Decorate one with plastic flowers.
Have fun.
 
Does Your G5RV Give You Problems?  
by NJ6F on November 18, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
I use a 130' G5RV that was called a Dentron Doublet. I have it in an inverted V configuration with a 90 deg split / one leg to the east and one to the north here in San Diego / El Cajon. Feed is at 35' and ends droop to 10' off the ground.
This antenna works great on 10 meters thru 75 but does not load up on 30 meters and since it is at a 90 degree angle 75 loads up with low SWR from 3900 up.
All this is using a 4:1 balun out of a Dentron MT3000 tuner up on the eve of the roof at the feedpoint behind a 4 position thru the coax ant switch using a FC20 auto tuner. NOW when I use the big MT-3000 tuner with a larger range, no problem on any band.
For 160 I use a Butternut vertical 160-10.
Now for performance... on 17 against a straight tubular dipole cut for 17 but only at 15' above ground, the 130' G5RV wins most of the time by 2 or 3 S units. It is 3 to 5 S units worse than my 3 el A3 beam on 20/15/10. The G5RV is part vertical and mostly horizontal which aids in the local contacts via vertical polorization. I like it and it has proven to be a all around good antenna. Dont fall for this purest stuff about bringing the balanced line into the shack....you can forget that....big hassle and I don't need RF on my audio. Go for 130' length I say in a broad side 180 degree standard configuration. Ideally....if I had the room and did not have a flexible tuner I would suggest a high center fed pole 40-60 feet, with a 1:1 air core balun....not ferrite...they saturate and heat up, fed with RG8 or better with multiple dipoles seperatly cut for 75, 20, 40/15, 17, and 10 I believe in a curtin arrangement like the military does it. You need to mount the 20 next to the 75 etc to eliminate any interactions / space for odd wavelength non-interaction. Seperate dipoles also work well 40/15 on one and 17/12 on the other and 20 by itself.
If you want go for a 160/75/40 vertical like a Butternut 75/40 with a 160 coil... or the HF9V Butternut with 160 coil if you want all bands out to 6 meters with little space. The Butternut vertical works well on all bands and is not some ugly monster wind load wise and TAKE the FULL Max POWER unlike some of the others and it uses NO TRAPS so you use the full lenght of the vertical for each band. Stay away from Verticals with lossy traps where the 10 meter section for example is all of 4 feet long from the base, which to me is a dummy load. I get out great on 160 with the Butternut. A roof mount Butternut with the resonant radials might also be an ideal thing if you have no room.
I you live in an apartment....remember you can load up the metal under the eve of the roof or the gutter or........it's Xmas.....put fake XMAS lights on your green wire dipole..... who cares if they don't go on.
People complain about wire antennas but Christmas lights of course OK...go figure....I also use a Spider dipole for 10-75 / its all of 8 feet in length for a balcony or deck. Gets out great on 6-40 and is OK on 75. Decorate one with plastic flowers.
Have fun.
 
Does Your G5RV Give You Problems?  
by NJ6F on November 18, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
I use a 130' G5RV that was called a Dentron Doublet. I have it in an inverted V configuration with a 90 deg split / one leg to the east and one to the north here in San Diego / El Cajon. Feed is at 35' and ends droop to 10' off the ground.
This antenna works great on 10 meters thru 75 but does not load up on 30 meters and since it is at a 90 degree angle 75 loads up with low SWR from 3900 up.
All this is using a 4:1 balun out of a Dentron MT3000 tuner up on the eve of the roof at the feedpoint behind a 4 position thru the coax ant switch using a FC20 auto tuner with FT-100-D. NOW when I use the big MT-3000 tuner with a larger range, no problem on any band switching out the FC20 when using bigger tuner.
For 160 I use a Butternut vertical 160-10.
Now for performance... on 17 against a straight tubular dipole cut for 17 but only at 15' above ground, the 130' G5RV wins most of the time by 2 or 3 S units. It is 3 to 5 S units worse than my 3 el A3 beam on 20/15/10. The G5RV is part vertical and mostly horizontal polorization. I like it and it has proven to be an all around good antenna. Don't fall for this purest stuff about bringing the balanced line into the shack....you can forget that....big hassle and I don't need RF on my audio. Go for 130' length I say in a broad side 180 degree standard configuration. Ideally....if I had the room and did not have a flexible tuner I would suggest a high center fed pole 40-60 feet, with a 1:1 air core balun....not ferrite...they saturate and heat up, fed with RG8 or better with multiple dipoles seperately cut for 75, 20, 40/15, 17, and 10 I believe in a curtin arrangement like the military does it. You need to mount the 20 next to the 75 etc to eliminate any interactions / space for odd wavelength non-interaction. Seperate dipoles also work well 40/15 on one and 17/12 on the other and 20 by itself.
If you want go for a 160/75/40 vertical like a Butternut 75/40 with a 160 coil... or the HF9V Butternut with 160 coil if you want all bands out to 6 meters with little space. The Butternut vertical works well on all bands and is not some ugly monster wind load wise and TAKES the FULL Max POWER unlike some of the others and it uses NO TRAPS so you use the full lenght of the vertical for each band. Stay away from Verticals with lossy traps where the 10 meter section for example is all of 4 feet long from the base, which to me is a dummy load. I get out great on 160 with the Butternut. A roof mount Butternut with the resonant radials might also be an ideal thing if you have no room.
If you live in an apartment....remember you can load up the metal under the eve of the roof or the gutter or........it's Xmas.....put fake XMAS lights on your green wire dipole..... who cares if they don't go on.
People complain about wire antennas but Christmas lights of course OK...go figure....I also use a Spider dipole for 10-75 / its all of 8 feet in length for a balcony or deck. Gets out great on 6-40 and is OK on 75. Decorate one with plastic flowers.
Have fun.
 
Does Your G5RV Give You Problems?  
by K8CXM on November 25, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
I've tried fan dipoles, dipoles, trap dipoles, loops, W5GI Mystery Antenna, verticals and several other wire antennas and my trusty 102 ft. G5RV is STILL the best multi-band antenna I have. It keeps going back up when I become disatisfied with what replaced it. It does a fair job on 75/80, excellent on 40 (2 S-units over the DXEE), a good job on 20 and 17. It stinks everwhere else. But, if one antenna gives me good performance on 4 bands, I'm pretty happy. And the installation is a compromise: apex at 40 feet and the ends at 25. It is in the clear however. Maybe it's a compromise antenna, but a cheap one and has never given me any trouble.
 
Does Your G5RV Give You Problems?  
by K4GLM on December 9, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
I like Lou McCoy's Dipole.

Hang the longest wire you can between two tall supports, feed in the center with ladder line and a good tuner.

With antennas, SIZE DOES MATTER

Shannon Boal K4GLM
 
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