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Author Topic: Flex 6400M vs. Icom 7610 ?  (Read 34398 times)
KE2TR
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Posts: 616




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« Reply #120 on: September 30, 2017, 09:04:59 AM »

The only Elecraft rigs were the K2 and there early kits in which you had to do threw hole components and actually use a soldering to assemble, the K3/K3s/there amps KX3/KX2 plus all the accessories are just final mechanical assemblies, its not really like the heathkits or there K2 which are/were true kits. Having a board assembles by contract manufactures is what may US companies have done for years plus unless you have the inside track of these made in USA companies you would be surprise how many use off shore. Hell for all you know that K3S boards could be done in Mexico or China, boy that would be a laugh!   
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VE3WGO
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Posts: 151




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« Reply #121 on: October 01, 2017, 04:03:39 PM »

yup, the USA gave it all away at least 15 years ago.  All except for mil-spec and specialized RF laminates such as Rogers Duroid and Getek, the main FRP and FR4 PCB manufacturers are in Hong Kong and Taiwan, with their high run factories in mainland China.  So yea, every manufacturer who likes to claim "Made in The USA" is really saying "final assembly" in the USA, and maybe a little bit less than that.

The truth is that every consumer electronics companies that you think of as "American", is really doing the HW & SW design, while the manufacturing and testing is done elsewhere by You know who.

It has reached the point where if for some reason, shipping from China were to go offline, the USA would choke.
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KE2TR
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Posts: 616




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« Reply #122 on: October 02, 2017, 03:01:45 PM »

Its like Chinese food, they state they want best quality, lol. Back in the late 1990's I worked for an American manufacturer which at that time we did board layout here and the glass epoxy boards were made in Taiwan. The components were sourced either from Taiwan or here in the US, we also used filters by Collins BTW. The front panels were done here in the US as well as most of the metal work so except for some of the parts and boards it was built, tested and sold here in the good ole USA. Back then you could not get the Asian counterparts to build anything good but today is a way different story plus the companies that are doing that might make enough profit to stay in business.
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KA4DPO
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Posts: 780




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« Reply #123 on: October 04, 2017, 06:57:10 AM »

Its like Chinese food, they state they want best quality, lol. Back in the late 1990's I worked for an American manufacturer which at that time we did board layout here and the glass epoxy boards were made in Taiwan. The components were sourced either from Taiwan or here in the US, we also used filters by Collins BTW. The front panels were done here in the US as well as most of the metal work so except for some of the parts and boards it was built, tested and sold here in the good ole USA. Back then you could not get the Asian counterparts to build anything good but today is a way different story plus the companies that are doing that might make enough profit to stay in business.

You're spot on, there is almost no such thing as 100% made in America anymore.  The labor and material costs for tech products would eat you alive.  The only truly 100% made in America radios are for the military and they cost a fortune. 

From  your description it almost sounds like you worked for Ten Tec except they didn't use Collins filters.  I worked for Harris Corp. in the 70's and 80's, almost everything was made in the US except some semi-conductors that were made in Malaysia or Taiwan.  I was thinking Harris RF com but Long Island is a very long way from Rochester.
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K3TIM
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Posts: 123




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« Reply #124 on: October 04, 2017, 07:05:18 AM »

The 6k series and Maestro PWBs are made at a contract manufacturer in Austin, close to Flex.

Chinese food ?  I've had some damned good food in Hong Kong and Beijing. I mean really good.
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_..--
k3Tim - MSEE - PE - PPSEL / IFR USPTO:8063955:4462102:9,332,179:9,363,445
W1BG
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Posts: 69




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« Reply #125 on: October 14, 2017, 02:03:29 PM »

Flex radios are American made.  The new amp is made in EU

73. W9OY

The sub assemblies (circuit boards) that contain the thousands of tiny surface-mount devices are built by robots on a fully automated assembly line. It is a positively fascinating process to watch.
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The Pay-TV Industry may not hold the patent on poor customer service, but Comcast in particular has made an art form of it.
KE2TR
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Posts: 616




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« Reply #126 on: October 19, 2017, 06:34:18 AM »

It was a small company in St. James called Patcomm....
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KA4DPO
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Posts: 780




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« Reply #127 on: October 20, 2017, 09:13:03 AM »

It was a small company in St. James called Patcomm....
I

 remember Patcomm radios.  The 16000 was one of the first DSP rigs on the market but they had a few bugs.  I knew a guy who bought the 9000 and he liked it when he first got it but complained about birdies and tuning problems.  As I recall they didn't last too long in the ham radio market.  Did they do government radios also?
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KE2TR
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Posts: 616




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« Reply #128 on: October 20, 2017, 06:11:50 PM »

They tried to develop a man pack portable but after 9/11 everything went south, I got involved with the company 3 years  before they closed the doors, maybe if I was there earlier they would have gone into a different direction. The PC1600A was a re designed front panel which would have been different than the earlier versions, the 9000 would have been better as a qrp rig and the PC500 which if they had it out before the PC9000 would have been a better seller. They had the usual trouble with investors calling the shots instead of the designers but bottom line it was a small company.
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KA4DPO
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Posts: 780




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« Reply #129 on: October 23, 2017, 06:40:08 AM »

I have not seen anything out of Flex regarding the availability of the 6400 or the 6600 models.  They have them listed on their website under products but I have not heard of anyone buying either model yet. 

As for Icom, there is a rumor on Facebook that US dealers will get limited numbers of them in December but there is no way to substantiate that.  Also, there is nothing on the FCC web site that would indicate the IC-7610 has been submitted for Certification.  I don't think we will see either radio until sometime next year.  They are being sold in Japan and Australia but that seem to be it for now.
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N6YFM
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Posts: 502




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« Reply #130 on: October 24, 2017, 01:29:27 PM »

Well;   I guess Icom won the race :-)

Flex was so sure of themselves that they would ship first.
But;  Real people in Japan are reporting having picked up their units at dealers,
and real USA people visiting Japan have played with them.

Flex, at the last ham convention I attended, was still using
"marketing-speak-wiggle-wording" similar to "Our entire first production run is
sold out, so if you order now, the soonest you could see a rig would be Feb or
March 2018".     Um, yeah, right.   Where are all the public reviews from all those
people who purchased "the first production run" that sold out?  :-)

Kudo's Icom.    No propaganda, no spin, no promises and grand-standing, you simply
disclosed delays and shipped when it was ready and ignored all the noise...

Well done.
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KE2TR
Member

Posts: 616




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« Reply #131 on: October 24, 2017, 06:41:30 PM »

Flex has made hams mad with there Vapor ware tactics, They might perform a little better in the end but there extended roll out dates that keep getting pushed further away is pissing folks off, some of there orders are paid in full and I know two fellows now who want to cancel there orders. They need to step it up or Icom will beat them to the market.
If you really look at some of the current Flex owners they mostly come from either radio's like a Yaesu FT2000 which was dated by the time it hit the streets or Kenwood 570/590 series and ProII or III Icoms which were all very good radio's when they first came out but going to a Flex 6300 was a big improvement but [lace that 6300 up against a K3S, FTDX5000 or even 3000 and the Flex doesn't do anything better except a big monitor display but that can easily be added for not much more invested. Only time will tell but Flex should get cracking.
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N2DTS
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Posts: 732




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« Reply #132 on: October 24, 2017, 07:15:13 PM »

Lets hope Flex closes down and goes out of business!
Ten Tec is about gone and maybe Elecraft can fold as well, then we will get rigs on time.
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N0YXB
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Posts: 1120




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« Reply #133 on: October 24, 2017, 08:13:22 PM »

Yeah, to hell with the competitive marketplace.
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N2DTS
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Posts: 732




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« Reply #134 on: October 26, 2017, 12:46:44 PM »

Well, if these small companies cant perform like big ones they should close up shop and collect unemployment.

I am sure we would have SDR radios and kits without Flex and Elecraft, maybe 5 years from now but we would have them on time.
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