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Author Topic: Is Icom 7610 in trouble?  (Read 35775 times)
N6YFM
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Posts: 502




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« on: July 29, 2017, 04:49:22 PM »

I find it strange that Icom would have a huge, public, HQ party last December, showing off the radio and letting people play with it, with lots of talk between then and Dayton.  Then Icom showed it Dayton, but so did Flex with their new products.

Next, there was some rumor of problems found at Dayton, and then, "radio silence" since then.

Fast forward;   Last week I asked the organizers of the HamCon coming up in September at Torrance, CA (Los Angeles area) if Icom was coming.   They said, Flex is coming, but Icom cancelled and said they had a schedule conflict.

Hmm....    Los Angeles is probably the largest Western US market for Ham Radio.
What other larger region radio show is going on September 15 this year?
Several people contacted Icom, and they will not budge.

I wonder what problems Icom found at Dayton?  And I wonder if the Flex 6400M price and features is making Icom "re-work" their feature set?   With the 7610 so close to launch, why such silence from Icom?

Neal
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KC9NRN
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« Reply #1 on: July 29, 2017, 08:37:15 PM »

I find it strange that Icom would have a huge, public, HQ party last December, showing off the radio and letting people play with it, with lots of talk between then and Dayton.  Then Icom showed it Dayton, but so did Flex with their new products.

Next, there was some rumor of problems found at Dayton, and then, "radio silence" since then.

Fast forward;   Last week I asked the organizers of the HamCon coming up in September at Torrance, CA (Los Angeles area) if Icom was coming.   They said, Flex is coming, but Icom cancelled and said they had a schedule conflict.

Hmm....    Los Angeles is probably the largest Western US market for Ham Radio.
What other larger region radio show is going on September 15 this year?
Several people contacted Icom, and they will not budge.

I wonder what problems Icom found at Dayton?  And I wonder if the Flex 6400M price and features is making Icom "re-work" their feature set?   With the 7610 so close to launch, why such silence from Icom?

Neal

Very valid points, if true it's nice that Flex was able to knock them off of their feet a bit. It will be interesting to see what transpires in the next few months.
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FlexRadio 6300 Maestro Combo
Yaesu MP1000 Mark V
Icom 746Pro
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KA4DPO
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Posts: 780




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« Reply #2 on: July 30, 2017, 06:39:04 AM »

I find it strange that Icom would have a huge, public, HQ party last December, showing off the radio and letting people play with it, with lots of talk between then and Dayton.  Then Icom showed it Dayton, but so did Flex with their new products.

Next, there was some rumor of problems found at Dayton, and then, "radio silence" since then.

Fast forward;   Last week I asked the organizers of the HamCon coming up in September at Torrance, CA (Los Angeles area) if Icom was coming.   They said, Flex is coming, but Icom cancelled and said they had a schedule conflict.

Hmm....    Los Angeles is probably the largest Western US market for Ham Radio.
What other larger region radio show is going on September 15 this year?
Several people contacted Icom, and they will not budge.

I wonder what problems Icom found at Dayton?  And I wonder if the Flex 6400M price and features is making Icom "re-work" their feature set?   With the 7610 so close to launch, why such silence from Icom?

Neal

Very valid points, if true it's nice that Flex was able to knock them off of their feet a bit. It will be interesting to see what transpires in the next few months.


I doubt that Flex had anything to do with it.  The IC-7610 design was probably firm two years ago so they are not going to go changing it at this stage of the game.  I think they may have found a software issue or even possibly a hardware design issue that has to be addressed.  Better they address it now than sell a gacked up radio and try to fix them on the fly with software patches and expensive hardware fixes like other have done.
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VE3WGO
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« Reply #3 on: July 30, 2017, 08:49:54 AM »

I agree, the IC-7610 must have had some major issue discovered for it to be taken off retailers' websites, although it is still shown on Icom's own website as "Coming Soon".  Japanese radios have tended to be very solid from day one and rarely have they actually required a software update.  My TS-2000X is still using its 2003 software load (that was maybe its 2nd or 3rd update) here 14 years later, and my IC-9100 has the 2014 software version (its second update) here 3 years later, and there have been no add-on or wait-for or pay-for features on an ongoing subscription basis at all.  I guess they are perfectionists to some degree, with the radio fully meeting specs and the full feature list right out of the box.  Yes, there are minor bug fixes, but all features work and the radios don't crash, ever.  And Yaesu perhaps learned that the hard way with the FT-991 to -A version update which seems to have fixed a number of critical annoyances that users were experiencing (other than of course, the obvious feature increment to the real-time scope).

So my guess is that the IC-7610 just wasn't perfect yet, and something major showed up.  I doubt if much to do with competition form Flex or anybody else.  The two companies design rather different types of gear and have vastly different product and feature roll-out philosophies.

Having said all that, it is worrisome when a major new radio project gets pulled out from the public eye.

73, Ed VE3WGO
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K7JQ
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« Reply #4 on: July 30, 2017, 09:05:20 AM »

Say what you want about Icom, but I think history shows that when they release a radio into the marketplace, they are generally what they are supposed to be...reliable, on spec, and bug-free. They don't use their paying customers as beta testers, and worry about perfecting their products later. In recent years, incidents of blown finals and ESD problems have been reported in a couple of their radios,  but you wonder how many of those were user caused by improper careless or reckless operation. And, there are "lemons" in every consumer offering, where a problem is inherent in a particular isolated product. Any product that is electrical, mechanical, and made by human beings is subject to failure for any reason at any time. That's why there are warranties, to protect the consumer from problems for a reasonable amount of time.

Whatever the reason for the seemingly delayed release of the IC-7610, I'm sure it's a valid one that only Icom knows. Every other "theory" is pure supposition and guesswork. Relax folks...you'll be able to spend your money in due time.  Wink
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W1BG
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« Reply #5 on: July 30, 2017, 09:20:11 AM »

I'm not a conspiracy theorist, but have to agree that the silence from ICOM, now a full year after the product's announcement (Aug 2016), has become deafening.  Yes, they were caught off-guard by Flex at Dayton, but I really doubt that had any affect.

Yes, a "problem" was discovered at Dayton and it was serious enough for them to pull the demo unit back to Japan, rather than apply a quick firmware patch in a hotel room. That to me suggests it was more than just a firmware glitch.  The 7610 was also notably missing from the Icom booth at Dallas' HamCom (2 weeks after Dayton).  Was the glitch (or its fix) significant enough to impact FCC type acceptance testing as well?  Is its design really that significant of a departure from the 7300?

I distinctly recall ICOM mentioning last August that the 7610 would likely NOT be ready (to ship) in time for this year's Dayton hamfest and seems they were right. However, they at least had a physical working unit there to show (compared to the original mock-up behind a plexiglass case shown last year at Tokyo).

One thing which I think is clear is ICOM may have egg on their face come the 2017 Tokyo show (3 weeks from now) if by that date they are still not shipping product (and still not saying why).  And why do we still not have a firm price?

Just my 2¢

Bill
« Last Edit: July 30, 2017, 09:35:16 AM by W1BG » Logged

The Pay-TV Industry may not hold the patent on poor customer service, but Comcast in particular has made an art form of it.
N0YXB
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Posts: 1122




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« Reply #6 on: July 30, 2017, 09:22:40 AM »

Say what you want about Icom, but I think history shows that when they release a radio into the marketplace, they are generally what they are supposed to be...reliable, on spec, and bug-free. They don't use their paying customers as beta testers, and worry about perfecting their products later. In recent years, incidents of blown finals and ESD problems have been reported in a couple of their radios,  but you wonder how many of those were user caused by improper careless or reckless operation. And, there are "lemons" in every consumer offering, where a problem is inherent in a particular isolated product. Any product that is electrical, mechanical, and made by human beings is subject to failure for any reason at any time. That's why there are warranties, to protect the consumer from problems for a reasonable amount of time.

Whatever the reason for the seemingly delayed release of the IC-7610, I'm sure it's a valid one that only Icom knows. Every other "theory" is pure supposition and guesswork. Relax folks...you'll be able to spend your money in due time.  Wink

I agree. The 7300 has been a big success for Icom and I'm sure that they want to replicate that success with the 7610. Better to deal with whatever issues have arisen pre-launch than to ship radios that end up disappointing customers who have high expectations.
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K7JQ
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« Reply #7 on: July 30, 2017, 10:23:50 AM »

One thing which I think is clear is ICOM may have egg on their face come the 2017 Tokyo show (3 weeks from now) if by that date they are still not shipping product (and still not saying why).  And why do we still not have a firm price?

Just my 2¢

Bill

It's Icom's prerogative to determine a shipping date and a "firm" price. Everything else is just hearsay and unqualified estimates. The problem here is that everyone's getting antsy in anticipation...starting to conjure things up in their imagination. Again folks...Relax. Smiley
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GM1FLQ
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« Reply #8 on: July 31, 2017, 07:33:00 AM »

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K8EZB
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« Reply #9 on: July 31, 2017, 07:47:41 AM »

Quote
The 7300 has been a big success for Icom

Actually, a yuuuge success! Check out the 20+ pages of reviews here.

RB
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W1BG
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« Reply #10 on: July 31, 2017, 07:48:42 AM »


It's Icom's prerogative to determine a shipping date and a "firm" price. Everything else is just hearsay and unqualified estimates. The problem here is that everyone's getting antsy in anticipation...starting to conjure things up in their imagination. Again folks...Relax. Smiley

Understood. However, it's a little hard to relax when Icom's very own press release (Mar. 16, 2017) and still on their site today, indicates a planned release for May 2017.  There's also a price there of 368,000 Yen, which at the present exchange rate puts the price in USD at $3,329.41 yet we hear talk (more speculation) of prices as high as $3800. Why the mystery?

Yes, nerves are on edge. Compounding this nervous anxiety is the knowledge (undisputed) that some negative, unexpected anomaly happened to (or was discovered in) the demo unit at Dayton. Now in 3 more weeks it will be a full year since ICOM's initial public announcement and we're well beyond the originally projected May 2017 date published in their March press release. The silence is deafening. Many waiting customers would agree that we've all reached the point in our patience where ICOM owes its customers an update, something official, which I'm optimistic we'll likely hear at the upcoming Tokyo show, the product spotlight event of the year.  


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The Pay-TV Industry may not hold the patent on poor customer service, but Comcast in particular has made an art form of it.
K8EZB
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« Reply #11 on: July 31, 2017, 07:52:28 AM »

Quote
Yes, nerves are on edge.

You're kidding, right? Its just a radio! Relax, it'll happen.  Shocked
« Last Edit: July 31, 2017, 07:57:49 AM by K8EZB » Logged
W1BG
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« Reply #12 on: July 31, 2017, 09:35:45 AM »

Quote
The 7300 has been a big success for Icom

Actually, a yuuuge success! Check out the 20+ pages of reviews here.

RB

Yes, much to the chagrin of many who stood by, helplessly watching their own legacy rigs plummet in value practically overnight.  Shucks, look what happened to new prices. The 7300 feeding frenzy is also far from over, as retailers still say the 7300 continues to be their top HF seller by a wide margin. Likely by now you either have one yourself or else know a half dozen people who do. Its receiver is comfortably in the top tier of the ubiquitous Sherwood list of the holy grail and the real time spectrum scope & waterfall bring $5000 and $10,000 rig features to a $1300 rig that many of life's walking wounded can even afford. Subjective, but in my opinion it's also one of the best sounding rigs on the air, with factory default  TX audio quality second only to the Kenwood 590... and the KWD has a 10-band parametric EQ.  (just don't take it out to Field Day)

« Last Edit: July 31, 2017, 09:41:59 AM by W1BG » Logged

The Pay-TV Industry may not hold the patent on poor customer service, but Comcast in particular has made an art form of it.
N6YFM
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« Reply #13 on: July 31, 2017, 09:59:35 AM »

Quote
Yes, nerves are on edge.

You're kidding, right? Its just a radio! Relax, it'll happen.  Shocked

:-)  If you really want nerves on edge, just listen to the news about "Washington" each day.
Wonder how long until Kim/Donald start world war III ?   Then again, if our interceptors actually
work and catch the ICBM while it is high enough, maybe THAT would finally help propagation in this
solar cycle?  Nah, bad, bad idea....
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GM1FLQ
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« Reply #14 on: July 31, 2017, 10:36:07 AM »

Quote
Yes, nerves are on edge.

You're kidding, right?

Errrrrrr..........nope.

No need to ask that question - read most any 7610 thread and you will see he is far from being alone.  

          Shocked  but  Grin at the same time.......
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