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Author Topic: Procedure help needed  (Read 1789 times)
KENNETH
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Posts: 84




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« on: October 27, 2017, 09:09:12 AM »

 Can someone explain what this means below? This discussion is saying what is not appropriate. But when I monitor and hear a CQ, the replying party always sends their callsign back once to a CQ. Esp. In field day.  I'm a new OP. What is the correct procedure? Or maybe i'm not understanding the context right. Thanks in advance.

"Is it the newest trend lately to send one's call sign back just once when answering a CQ?
Seems to be... I don't know who is teaching them that."

"I think next time I'm faced with that, I'll just resume my CQ.
They are not calling me"

"I am not convinced that ignoring a call back, even those with zero repeats of their identifier, is good policy. No one learns anything. The other guy passes it off as poor propagation. Why not answer, and ask the other guy to verify his call sign--maybe after a slew of those, he'll understand.
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K8AXW
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« Reply #1 on: October 27, 2017, 10:36:54 AM »

KENNETH:  Perhaps I'm misunderstanding your question and if so, please excuse me.

As I understand it, you call CQ and "someone" replies with their call one time.  Is this correct?

If so, it sounds like there might be a trend to extend contest operating to normal everyday QSOs. 

If this is the case, then it certainly deviates from the long accepted procedure of calling you with your call sign and then sending their call sign more than once.  The reason for THIS procedure  is simple.  It gives you time to prepare/tune the signal and then the repeated senders call is a courtesy so you can be sure of getting his call correctly.  Especially if there is QRM/N.

This is especially prudent because the sender has no idea what YOUR operating conditions are or what kind of equipment you are using.

You can respond to the single call if you wish...or not.  To respond is to this might give you more contacts which at the same time will legitimize this unorthodox procedure.

I'm sure you will get comments to the effect, "things and times change."  This is true. There has been so many changes during the past few years that I expect to hear anything.  Rather you respond is up to you.

Personally, I would respond, even if I had to ask for a repeat.

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KENNETH
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Posts: 84




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« Reply #2 on: October 27, 2017, 11:02:39 AM »

Yes that's the way I understood it, but I'm too new of a OP to understand what ticked them off? A contest or rag chew. Either way, Don't you answer a CQ back once, Then you go silent and listen if they  hear you? This conversation say yes.... I heard you answer my CQ once, I'm Miffed, so i'm NOT going to answer you back now because you only sent your callsign once.  Huh I don't get it. My super patient CW elmer passed away so thought I would ask here.
« Last Edit: October 27, 2017, 11:14:06 AM by KENNETH » Logged
AE5GT
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Posts: 28




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« Reply #3 on: October 27, 2017, 12:12:59 PM »

In non contest / dx situation , it is common practice to reply with the CQing stations callsign  
CQ CQ DE W1AW
my reply
W1AW DE AE5GT


This lets the calling station know that u are replying to their CQ not the guy 400hz up calling CQ .. This has do with the gud old days of crystal controlled transmitters .
you might not have a crystal for his freq so you might reply 5 khz away !  

« Last Edit: October 27, 2017, 12:19:45 PM by AE5GT » Logged
KC4ZGP
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Posts: 1637




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« Reply #4 on: October 27, 2017, 01:08:00 PM »


Kenneth,

I too experience it. I'm not sure how to respond. Does the guy just like sending his call sign?

I answer only if I'm sure they are answering me.

The clarity of the message rests with the transmitter.

Kraus

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KENNETH
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Posts: 84




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« Reply #5 on: October 27, 2017, 01:39:37 PM »

I'm following you guys so far. But what would you guys do in this situation? You being the station calling cq de ae5gt? Would you answer this example back below or remain silent?

CQ CQ DE AE5GT,
 you are now listening for any weak stations
You hear my reply W1AW

What if I'm qrp, or the band is fading, you don't know my situation. You just hear me as" W1AW", not the preferred "ae5gt de w1aw". Would you ignore me as the example in the first post? Or would you callback? To a certain degree is it not presumptuous (sorry can't spell ) to assume that i decided to legitimize this unorthodox procedure?
« Last Edit: October 27, 2017, 02:02:13 PM by KENNETH » Logged
AA4PB
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Posts: 14327




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« Reply #6 on: October 27, 2017, 04:13:59 PM »

When calling in a pile up, giving just your call may give you a chance to squeeze it in before getting clobbered by the crowd. I hear it quite often on SSB. No big deal as far as I can tell. In a contest it minimizes the time it takes to complete the contact, letting you move on to the next one sooner.
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Bob  AA4PB
Garrisonville, VA
PLANKEYE
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Posts: 212




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« Reply #7 on: October 27, 2017, 04:49:10 PM »





http://http://k4icy.com/BegginersCWguide.htm


This link may help Ken, it's a starting point and try to have fun with CW.  What you described does happen and quite often you will encounter other strange things happen in the CW mode.  Check out the SKCC and FISTS websites.  If you want to be a good CW operator make sure you know the procedure.  Ragchew, contest, roundtable ETC....  It may take some work to figure it out but once you do, CW will become the MAGIC MODE.    But all of that is up to you to figure out and again I hope the info I provided helps you.  Good luck and have fun with CW.   
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VK5EEE
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Posts: 1033




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« Reply #8 on: October 28, 2017, 03:06:26 AM »

It is a sad and bad trend. When you call CQ, the answering station should give YOUR callsign, at least once, maybe even 3 times:

1) so you know you are being called and not yet another LID working in a(n unlimited unspecified) split pile-up
2) so you know the station has your callsign correct especially if you have a callsign like VK5EEE (not VK5EE)
3) it is polite and curteous to ADDRESS someone when first speaking to them, it's rude to give only their C/S
4) it does NOT constitute a QSO if I have not heard the other station send MY C/S at least once, can't QSL

I have taken to ignoring such calls, because I consider it rude of them, and, I have too many times replied, with RST, Name, QTH put it back and found out they were just working split for some "DX" several kc further down without listening on their TX frequency.

In fact, this one issue -- the other being "5NN TU" so piss me off that I have put it at the top of my QRZ page!

Unfortunately, there is no Q code to say "have you got my callsign correctly?" or "send MY callsign, I want to hear MY callsign too!"
If you send back "QRZ?" they simply keep repeating THEIR callsign. And if you simply put it over to them without giving RST etc, it's a waste of time and is not the CW etiquette, which is to allow the CQ caller to set the type of QSO they wish to have, i.e. how much information they wish to exchange. There is no way out other than to ignore them, unfortunately.

But if someone sends you "5NN" you can always send back "99" (Get Lost!) if you value a signal report as essential to a QSO.
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Long Live Real Human CW and wishing you many happy CW QSO - 77 - CW Forever

Support CW by joining CW clubs. QTT: FIST#1124, HSC#1437, UFT#728, RCWC#982, SKCC#15007, CWOPS#1714, 30CW#1,
W7ASA
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Posts: 454




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« Reply #9 on: October 28, 2017, 06:00:05 AM »

It's actually a good procedure to call the station you are answering by using their callsign then yours, for the reasons the Lou mentions.  You would not mail a letter with only your address on it - right? It would get lost (in the U.S. Mail it may get lost anyway, but I digress...)




You're addressing another human being, a fact often lost on those who collect '599' rather than communicating. Don't be one of them - talk with the ham on the other end of the link. To me, if I hear a contest style blurb of a single callsign, I just keep calling CQ.  If I hear just some random callsign but have another station calling ME, I go to the station who specifically returned my call - zero question. After all, I hear a lot of CW activity down in the noise, so a fellow ham calling me - I answer right away: random callsings are just part of the noise.

73 ES GL WID CW - it's a favorite mode of many, for good reasons.

Ray ..._ ._
« Last Edit: October 28, 2017, 06:11:12 AM by W7ASA » Logged
G4LNA
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Posts: 140




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« Reply #10 on: October 28, 2017, 06:21:42 AM »

I must admit I've heard this trend lately as well, which is just plain rude. I usually just carry on calling CQ, especially if the call me off frequency because I don't know if they are calling me or not.

Oh, another thing, IMI, QRZ or QRL are not a callsigns they gets ignored. If they send IMI, QRZ or QRL with their call, that's acceptable, no callsign, no contact.
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K8AXW
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« Reply #11 on: October 28, 2017, 09:22:55 AM »

KENNETH:  You've received some good responses to your post and there seems to be a consensus of opinion.

While this single call thing is indeed rude and poor operating practice, changes are being made in all facets of ham radio and it's either accept it or find another hobby. 

As I said I would answer and if he was calling some DX station 4KHz up, too bad.  On the other hand the guy who gave his call once might just wind up being a great QSO.  However, I would say it will be one of those 5NN TU. In THAT case I would simply call CQ again without comment.

We have a saying here, "You can't buck city hall but you can stand outside and piss on the steps!"



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VK5EEE
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« Reply #12 on: October 28, 2017, 08:19:05 PM »

changes are being made in all facets of ham radio and it's either accept it or find another hobby.
Like when Bush said you are either with us or against us? Why does it have to be black and white? Why can't we be against both? I always believe in the THIRD OPTION. And here the third option is:

1) Don't "find another hobby" (and in any case amateur radio isn't just a hobby)
2) Don't accept wrong things (not matter it's by minority or majority)
3) DO THE RIGHT THING -- do as you know is right, that's what matters
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Long Live Real Human CW and wishing you many happy CW QSO - 77 - CW Forever

Support CW by joining CW clubs. QTT: FIST#1124, HSC#1437, UFT#728, RCWC#982, SKCC#15007, CWOPS#1714, 30CW#1,
K8AXW
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« Reply #13 on: October 28, 2017, 09:13:45 PM »

THINKING you are right doesn't make it RIGHT!  And some things are simply "black and white."  Using your philosophy nothing would get done!
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K8PRG
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Posts: 305


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« Reply #14 on: October 29, 2017, 07:47:29 AM »

If I hear a call only response to my CQ, I will call back.....it's not gonna take up that much time in my life to see if they are indeed trying to contact me. I don't see it as rude...certainly not half as rude as some of the posts on this thread....
Proper procedure? No, but am I going to ignore someone because they don't use proper procedure? No again. That's just me...
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