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Author Topic: New to HF and shocked by what I hear  (Read 18142 times)
K4HAT
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Posts: 2




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« on: October 19, 2010, 07:07:37 PM »

Can the group explain to me what happened over the years to HF ?
I have been a ham for a while now and recently upgraded....
OH BOY.    Never in my wildest dreams would I have expected the rude, nasty and downright filthy language and verbotten topics on almost every band.  Childrens band sounds meek and mild compared to some of the hams I hear and it seems worse on 80 then any where else. Man you would NEVER talk that way on any of the five repeaters I trustee and if you did I would come hunt you down.
What happened Huh??    Did 11 meters spill over to what used to be civil people's radio ?  I noticed it does not seem to "creep" into 20
much but it's still there, kinda like a really bad mold.  I was waiting tonite for a qso with an old buddy on 3910 and I could not beleive my ears.   Started writing down calls but soon realized it was every one I heard ! 
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K4RKY
Member

Posts: 59




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« Reply #1 on: October 19, 2010, 08:43:12 PM »

It's on 20m as well just not as much. At times around 14.272 +/-  two or three get in there thinking they are still in the Navy! (always the same ones) 80m is the poster child of bad manners and grown men that never grew up. But it seems to be in a certain small range of frequencies fortunately. I try to stay below 3.950 when I am there unless I am in CW mode with the exception of 3.880 early in the morning. I was taken back too when I first became a General (I actually blushed from embarrasement). Huh
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Rick ^i^
W1ITT
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Posts: 145




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« Reply #2 on: October 19, 2010, 09:03:51 PM »

Back in the "good old days", when the FCC monitored the bands and people actually received "pink slips" for infractions, manners were at least a bit better.  Even hearing that someone else got a pink slip seemed to provide just enough fear to keep most fellows on the straight and narrow.  Those who worked hard to study for their exams and sit through the code tests seemed to value their license more than many lads nowadays.
The FCC no longer has the funds to bother much with us, and some notable miscreants seem untouchable to their efforts to remove them from the air.  We used to take pride in being a self policing service, but ostracism seems to matter little to the current trouble makers.  I suspect that some of them even enjoy it.  The Commission gave up on 27 mhz enforcement, and they seem to have given up on the Amateur Service as well.  Given the state of the Federal budget, I don't see things getting any better in the future. 
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G3RZP
Member

Posts: 4442




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« Reply #3 on: October 20, 2010, 01:11:20 AM »

Is it a case that in many ways, it's so easy to get on the air these days that people do not realise what a privilege it is to have a ham radio licence??
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KX8N
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Posts: 543




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« Reply #4 on: October 20, 2010, 04:27:12 AM »

Is it a case that in many ways, it's so easy to get on the air these days that people do not realise what a privilege it is to have a ham radio licence??

No, it's a case that in 2010 more and more people don't care if what they do or say offends others. Operators are a sample of the general population. Unfortunately today it's considered exercising your free speech if you curse, are rude, and take an "I don't care what you think" attitude. You see it just as much walking down the street as you do on the air. Fifty years ago you didn't have that.
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N4UM
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Posts: 465




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« Reply #5 on: October 20, 2010, 09:07:00 AM »

You seldom see it on the digital modes or on CW.  It seems to be a combination of extemely poor taste conspiring with the first amendment.  Freedom of speech is accompanied by freedom not to listen.  Nobody forces you to listen to this garbage and it's readily avoidable.  If you don't like it, don't listen to it. 
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KE4DRN
Member

Posts: 3721




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« Reply #6 on: October 20, 2010, 07:17:29 PM »

hi,

too bad the FCC still lives in the dark ages with
tiny $10,000 fines.

The FCC needs to update the fines so those that
abuse their license are held accountable.

$100,000 fines would help to put a stop to the bad element.
Nothing can stop it 100% but FCC should start somewhere.

A 10% whistle blowers fee to those that report the bad guys
can't hurt either.


73 james
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KC0MMY
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Posts: 43


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« Reply #7 on: October 20, 2010, 07:41:09 PM »

It's not just on phone, either.  I left my rig parked on 14.230 about a week ago to see if I could capture some SSTV images.  Let's just say some of them were quite inappropriate, which was surprising.  I can deal with "weird" images, but inappropriate ones?  I don't need to see it.  I, too, was shocked to hear some of what is/was said on 80/75 meters when I was spinning the dial several months back.  I still visit that segment of the radio spectrum, but I wear the headphones when others are within earshot.

It's really too bad, because I've been trying to get my 11-year-old daughter and 10-year-old nephew into amateur radio.  It's kind of embarrassing to show them just how interesting this radio service is when you hear "grown" adults use coarse language.  How can young people respect adults when the older adults don't even respect each other?  

To the offenders:  Can/should you expect others to respect you when you use that language?  Think of the image that's being displayed to the globe.  I always thought that amateur radio was supposed to promote international goodwill.  I don't think using foul language and displaying inappropriate images on SSTV constitutes the promotion of international goodwill.  

Another experience I had with foul language on the amateur bands was when I was in Massachusetts in the summer of '09.  My family and I went on a camping trip with a bunch of friends.  Our friend's son took an interest in amateur radio.  I decided to fire up the 2M/70CM mobile radio and see if I could hit any of the local repeaters.  I found one which had a very interesting net.  Unfortunately, one bad egg ruined it because he apparently had diarrhea of the mouth.  I calmly explained to the boy that this isn't a part of amateur radio.  I'm not sure if the offender was licensed or not, but it was quite embarrassing, to say the least.

There's a way to attract youth, but using foul language isn't a good way to do it.  Anyone can be vulgar.  It doesn't take a lot of talent, or brain cells for that matter.  To find someone who can carry on an intelligent -- or at least an interesting -- conversation, regardless of how you communicate, seems to be lacking.

K4HAT:  Don't be discouraged. There are still a lot of good operators out there.  We just need to come out of the woodwork!

I hope to catch you on the air!

73 de Andre
KC0MMY
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KE5TGG
Member

Posts: 10




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« Reply #8 on: October 21, 2010, 06:08:07 PM »

I haven't even been on the airwaves yet, just started studying for my General Class License. But hearing about this doesn't surprise me at all. This problem (rude, obnoxious behavior) extends into countless other areas of day-to-day living, too. I think that "KX8N" hit the nail on the head, that there are so many people who simply don't care if their rudeness, profanity, or obnoxious attitude offends someone else.

I wish the FCC would crack down on these people, giving each violator JUST ONE warning. Then, if they do it again, PERMANENTLY revoke their license, and tell them that if they are found transmitting again they will face a very large fine and possible jail time to boot. If current laws are not that strict, then they should be changed to fit the times we're in now, be enforced without wavering, and done so as much as possible. Maybe if the FCC levied very significant penalities on these people, the word would start getting around that they (FCC) MEAN what they say about RULES that govern conduct/speech when on the air.

Chris
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G3RZP
Member

Posts: 4442




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« Reply #9 on: October 22, 2010, 01:40:30 AM »

I guess the problem is that people don't realise that exercising the right to free speech also means that it should be done responsibly, with regard to others.

Listen to the DX pile ups for other examples. CW is better, but still full of lids who call when the DX has come back to someone else...
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W7ETA
Member

Posts: 2528




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« Reply #10 on: October 22, 2010, 03:51:47 PM »

"Can the group explain to me what happened over the years to HF ?"

Nope.

People will have their opinions, but that is all they are, opinions.

75 meters had weirdos, and angry child like ops when I got my first ticket in the late 70s.

I find plenty of delightful ops to chat with.

73
Bob
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K3RMX
Member

Posts: 31




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« Reply #11 on: October 22, 2010, 04:01:37 PM »

Enough with the free speech argument.  It does not apply to what we say on the radio.

The First Amendment's free speech clause in the US Constitution only prevents the federal government from censoring political discussions that were not allowed in most other countries.  Think of former (and still probably current) USSR/Russia, China, N. Korea.  It does not give anyone the right to say anything at any time.  Commercials cannot say anything they want to, such as my product is 200% better than my competitor's product, unless the advertiser can show that it is true.  Tobacco companies have not been able to advertise on television since 1970, I think.

Pornography is not entitled to "free speech."  No one can yell "fire" in a crowded theater unless there really is a fire.  Standards of decency still apply; it's just that the FCC, along with most other government agencies, no longer has the resources to police what is said on the air.

Years ago, as a teenager just "stretching my wings" by being as obnoxious and crude as I could be to most adults lasted until I said the wrong thing to my father one time; when I recovered from the headache and awful taste remaining in my mouth, I realized that comments, verbal or written, have consequences, intended or not.  It is only because "the law" frowns upon one person wrongfully hitting another more than it frowns on crude language that a lot of people don't physically stop one person's offensive language directly.

Besides, if the only way of expressing yourself is to curse, you don't have a sufficient vocabulary to express whatever you want to say in a descriptive manner that does not need curse words to communicate.  Ignorant people can't express themselves any other way; smart people can.

I've said my piece.  If you disagree, feel free to do so by explaining why you disagree, not by looking me up and punching out my lights.

Steve
k3rmx
(and basic, everyday lawyer at the end of a long week)
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W3LK
Member

Posts: 5644




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« Reply #12 on: October 22, 2010, 05:31:21 PM »


Besides, if the only way of expressing yourself is to curse, you don't have a sufficient vocabulary to express whatever you want to say in a descriptive manner that does not need curse words to communicate.  Ignorant people can't express themselves any other way; smart people can.

Steve
k3rmx
(and basic, everyday lawyer at the end of a long week)

<clap> <clap> <clap> <clap> <clap> <clap>
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A smoking section in a restaurant makes as much sense as a peeing section in a swimming pool.
K4DPK
Member

Posts: 1077


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« Reply #13 on: October 22, 2010, 07:28:49 PM »

Several of you have given excellent reasons why the condition exists, but not one has admitted it is just as much our fault as anyone else’s.

If you hear foul language on the air and don’t speak out against it, you are allowing it to continue because of your silence.  

What would you do if someone who spouted filth with every breath joined you and your friends at a table in a restaurant?  How would you react if someone stood beside your family in line at a movie and used loud, foul language?

It is simply not good manners to use bad language when you are unsure of your audience.

I curse.  My wife says it is the greatest of my many failings.

But I am very careful on the air.  I have occasionally (too often) let something slip, but I have frequently let it be known that I don't think the ham bands are an appropriate forum for such behavior.

I get cussed out occasionally, but at least they know where I stand.

Phil C. Sr.
k4dpk
« Last Edit: October 22, 2010, 07:30:55 PM by Phil Chambley, Sr. » Logged
N0AZZ
Member

Posts: 241




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« Reply #14 on: October 25, 2010, 07:23:34 AM »

That is what they make the big knob on the radio for or just pull the plug that is the way it is. All I work is DX SSB and have had few problems in 4 yrs on HF many of those you speak of have been around for a long time back to the day of FCC exams.
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