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Author Topic: Rig Audio Reports should be done simplex?  (Read 8990 times)
W7AIT
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Posts: 488




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« on: March 06, 2011, 03:58:10 PM »

Testing Rig Audio/ audio reports through repeaters:

I don't know how many thousands of times guys come up on repeaters wanting over the air “audio quality report” of their rig’s audio.

Its my understanding that true over the air audio reports should be done **simplex**, to wit:

1.   The repeater PL decode / encode filters (whatever / whichever is turned on at that particular repeater) affects audio roll off / audio response.
2.   Even if there is no PL encode or decode turned on at the repeater, its own audio circuits response curves dictate the final audio curves.
3.   Going simplex eliminates PL decode / encode filter roll off, and, the audio response of the repeater audio circuits itself.  Going simplex, only the audio circuits of the TX and RX stations at each end are in play, and hence should be a much, much better measurement.
4.   All of the above assumes adequate signal strengths with no white noise in the way  to make valid measurements – no weak signals with lots of white noise.

True or false?
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AD4U
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« Reply #1 on: March 06, 2011, 04:12:48 PM »

Rig audio testing should be done on simplex.  Even then the audio "heard" on the "other end" is no better than the audio characteristics of the particular receiver that it is coming out of.

Audio coming out of a repeater is no better than the audio characteristics of the repeater.  In other words great audio going into a repeater does not mean great audio will come out of the repeater.  On the other hand poor audio going into a repeater will not be improved to good audio by passing through the repeater.

Dick  AD4U
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W8AAZ
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« Reply #2 on: March 17, 2011, 06:01:05 PM »

I agree. There are some rptrs that pass a good audio signal around here and there is one in particular that makes everyone sound tinny, crappy to my ear.  I just monitor on another radio I have, at least initially.  Too loud and you get feedback.  This is on simplex!  Headphones are really helpful here.  Works on HF too. 
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K6AER
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« Reply #3 on: March 18, 2011, 08:17:03 PM »

If the station can not establish a simplex path the audio will have to be done through the repeater.


On the other hand if you use a specific re pater all the time why not get your report through the repeater.


My question is when did FM radios start having EQ's built into them?
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KE3WD
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« Reply #4 on: April 04, 2011, 07:42:41 PM »

If the station can not establish a simplex path the audio will have to be done through the My question is when did FM radios start having EQ's built into them?

Always.  In the form of preemphasis and deemphasis.  But don't expect that to be an adjustable control or even on the outside of the rig, it is fixed but it is still EQ nonetheless.


73
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N2RRA
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« Reply #5 on: June 30, 2011, 02:49:32 PM »

If the station can not establish a simplex path the audio will have to be done through the My question is when did FM radios start having EQ's built into them?

Always.  In the form of preemphasis and deemphasis.  But don't expect that to be an adjustable control or even on the outside of the rig, it is fixed but it is still EQ nonetheless.


73

Understanding very well all what has been said it's still good to ask for an audio report. In these cases being:

1. Microphone gain might be to high from the operator stand point which "no" repeater can adjust and will also affect the audio coming out of the repeater.

2. In case of preemphasis/deemphasis if the operators transceiver is not transmiting a 4-5KHz bandwidth FM quality signal the repeater will also not be able to adjust this resulting in low audio and narrow bandwidth. I know this to be true in the case of owning an Icom 7000 unless a mod is made. Fact!

In these two cases alone asking for an audio report will allow an operator to adjust accordingly so the repeater can do the rest of its job. As well as know if there is anything negative going on that he/she should be aware of.

Another good reason for audio reports maybe if an operator is looking for R.F., alternator wind or too much background noise ,or loose connection etc....The repeater is not adjusting all these factors and good reason for an operator to check if the quality of audible signal is just as good going in on the "simplex" side of the repeater as well on the outgoing side.

Am I crazy or is that not clear enough or how it goes?

73!
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K1CJS
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« Reply #6 on: July 01, 2011, 04:45:19 AM »

Yes, audio reports are better done on simplex.  However, if a request is made, quite a bit of the time, it is just to see whether the audio is coming through clearly and if it is easily understandable.  Most repeaters won't modify audio so much as to bother the person asking for the report.

It comes down to if the person requesting wants to know particulars--whether or not too much base is present, if the midrange  is sufficient, or if there is too much tinnyness coming through.  THOSE reports should be done on simplex, but for the simple "Am I coming through clearly" report, it makes little difference.  That is, unless you KNOW that the repeater being used has been adjusted to an extreme.
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K8KAS
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Posts: 569




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« Reply #7 on: July 08, 2011, 12:58:29 PM »

What else is on the repeaters any more? I have never heard of 1000's of requests for an audio check and I see no big deal with someone asking for a comment about his/her audio. We have 4 repeaters in the area and nothing really happens anymore on them.  Repeater regs/rules, PL and a total lack of anything technical lost me long ago.   Denny K8KAS
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