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Author Topic: "Distracted Driving": What Dave Sumner did NOT say  (Read 17964 times)
N2RRA
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« Reply #45 on: February 03, 2012, 06:35:30 AM »

What many of you fail to grasp (for whatever reason) is that no one is attacking mobile ham radio use.
Wrong.
Quote
Some have whined that ham radio should be distinguished from cell phone use. That sort of logic is what a teenager would use on his parents, trying to manipulate them to get what he wants.
You really support your argument when you claim that those that disagree with you are "whining". You have not provided any proof of your assertion that mobile radio use causes distracted driving - at least, any more so than a regular conversation with a passenger does.
Quote
There are some people who just don't like to be told what to do. They don't like to be told to wear a seat belt, they hate a background check when they purchase a gun, they whine about their "rights" whenever there is common sense legislation passed in the interest of public safety. These personalities have a bloated sense of entitlement, and selfishness.
So who made you King? How does wearing a seat belt make one a safer driver? Last time I checked the US was still a free (or relatively free) country. Since when is sticking up for one's rights a subject for ridicule?

I agree with W2RI on his last statement!

What you don't seem to grasp W0DV is that it's not a matter of not liking being told what to do but paying for imbeciles that know they have trouble doing it and wind up hurting someone. Did you expect everyone else to accept to give up their freedom because some can't use common sense and logic based on their own responsibilty to know better what their capable of doing and not doing?

Not logical and guess you weren't using your common sense!

You questioned and I quote "what difference does it make wether it is a microphone or a cell phone". Talk about a teen age no common sense comment!

There's a big difference. For one, you don't have to look down constantly like you would texting. May I had most of the reason for these laws being past is due to cell phone texting.

Second, As for speaking on a cell phone at times people are hard of hearing because the cell phone speaker output is not very good. Ham radio gear has a much larger amplified speaker so your attention isn't being drawn away and tunnel visioned into space going "hah hah, I can't hear you" for the most part. There maybe some variables involved but still not as many ham rigs in the cars as much as there are cell phones ringing in the ears of some clumsy fools driving.

We can compare over and over again the differences but let's mention the obvious. Many many things can distract one from driving. For many a simple eagle flying over head, a hottie with a boottie, and even another accident but the list can go on and on.

Bottom line it is much less complicated to operate a radio as any car sterio and not have to take total attention away from the road as a cell phone would. That's just the pure simple fact. Yet I'll say it again! There are many things to draw away someones attention from the road so disrupting or infringing on someones else's right is just absurd. 

Sorry to hear about your accident but maybe just maybe you weren't to observant to see it coming. Just maybe it wouldn't have mattered but a lot of people drive around with their head in a cloud tunnel vissioned driving like their the only person on the road. You have to keep your head on a swivel and next time you could take defensive driving tactics to see it coming and avoid.

I've avoided many accidents because I saw them coming or I anticipated their move before that person made it. It's just something that comes with experience and common sense road practice. How many people drive like that? Probably not many but if everyone had a class to teach them because of lack of common sense of their own maybe they'd be less accidents.

Defensive driving courses are what I think people require instead of walking into a DMV and getting a license. Think about it! Is reading a driving practice exam booklet really the way for a person to get a license. I think not!

You get these people from other countries where they lived all their lives driving like they do then come here and think they can get away with the same crap. Go to India and tell me what you think. Then you'll wonder why alot of Indian's from Queens, NY drive the way they do. No respect for others at all.

I think the solution is a defensive driving course explained by a trained driving instructor to point out the obvious while teaching driving ethics and tactics rather than "demanding" me to remove my rig from my vehicle. It keeps up this way "being told what to do" we'll wind up like China or Russia.

I won't let it!

73!




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W0DV
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« Reply #46 on: February 03, 2012, 06:40:54 PM »

N2RRA: haha, do you think you are a better driver? Immune from getting in an accident? It's really foolish on your part to think that you cannot be involved in an accident because of the negligence of another. Like you, I have avoided many accidents. I am no different than most, many of us have had close calls. Yes, defensive driving is very important, and everyone should practice it. I was rear-ended while I was at a red light by someone who was doing about 50 mph, not paying attention to the road. I was at the wrong place, at the wrong time.
Can you identify the "imbeciles" on the road? That would make driving a lot easier wouldn't it?  It would also make things a lot easier for our state governments.

Since when is an HR more simple to use than a cell phone or car stereo? There are menus, settings, etc. I'm not saying that a ham radio is hard to use, but less complicated than a car stereo? LOL.  That was just a silly statement, pure and simple Smiley

Who is "demanding" that you remove your rig from your auto? lol. As an example, Illinois isn't. They just don't want you to use it while driving! They also say that you may use your electronic device (cell phone, 2-way, etc) while you are in traffic as long as you are in park, in neutral, during an emergency, or pulled over on the shoulder of the road. If you are using a hands free device, you may use it at any time. Wether you agree with this or not is irrelevant. I think most people will see this as sensible, and I think eventually most states will adopt similar laws.

There are always going to be a few whiners that will have a resistant, defiant attitude. It's not that complicated, it's just a matter of public safety. Distracted driving is becoming a big problem and the state governments are responding.
You and others like you need to understand that current legislation is not in favor of banning a ham radio rig for mobile use, nor is it out to make your life more miserable than it already is. It is looking to protect the general public from harm, and at the same time making an attempt to respect the needs and interests of all who use the road.

Be a man and stop being selfish. You are not the only one on the road. There is no way to tell who is more able to multitask while driving.

I have a rig in my F150, and I enjoy using it. I have no problem pulling over and using my cell, or HR. Too bad laws have to be made to point out the obvious of what they should not be doing in the first place.


W0DV
« Last Edit: February 04, 2012, 08:50:45 AM by W0DV » Logged
N2RRA
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« Reply #47 on: February 04, 2012, 08:42:07 AM »

N2RRA: haha, do you think you are a better driver? Immune from getting in an accident? It's really foolish on your part to think that you cannot be involved in an accident because of the negligence of another. Like you, I have avoided many accidents. I am no different than most, many of us have had close calls. Yes, defensive driving is very important, and everyone should practice it. I was rear-ended while I was at a red light by someone who was doing about 50 mph, not paying attention to the road. I was at the wrong place, at the wrong time.
Can you identify the "imbeciles" on the road? That would make driving a lot easier wouldn't it?  It would also make things a lot easier for our state governments.

Since when is an HR more simple to use than a cell phone or car stereo? There are menus, settings, etc. I'm not saying that a ham radio is hard to use, but less complicated than a car stereo? LOL.  That was just a silly statement, pure and simple Smiley

Lastly, who is "demanding" that you remove your rig from your auto? lol. As an example, Illinois isn't. They just don't want you to use it while driving! They also say that you may use your electronic device (cell phone, 2-way, etc) while you are in traffic as long as you are in park, in neutral, during an emergency, or pulled over on the shoulder of the road. Wether you agree with this or nor is irrelevant. I think most people will see this as sensible, and I think eventually most states will adopt similar laws. There are always going to be a few whiners that will have a resistant, defiant attitude. It's not that complicated, it's just a matter of public safety. Distracted driving is becoming a big problem and the state governments are responding.

Be a man and stop being selfish. You are not the only one on the road. There is no way to tell who is more able to multitask while driving. I have a rig in my F150, and I enjoy using it. I have no problem pulling over and using my cell, or HR. Too bad laws have to be made to point out the obvious of what they should not be doing in the first place.

W0DV


 Cry  Cry me a river will ya!!

I am a better driver than you no doubt and there's no reason for me to not feel more confident and positive about that than you.

As for the ease of a HR (ham radio) gear being easier or as easy as a car sterio for me is quite true. Unfortunately you seemed to indicate it is apparently not the same for you which again proves my point of the capable and uncapable operators. Thank you!  Wink

I have a YAESU FT-817ND and an IC-7000 I use while driving. If I can run through the menus, or just utilize the microphone which controls frequency change with ease than no one should have a problem doing the same, right?

"Of course not" your saying. Exactly! Not everyone is capable. That's my point!

I've grown tired of this thread but it has been entertaining to say the least.
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W0DV
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« Reply #48 on: February 04, 2012, 09:00:54 AM »


 Cry  Cry me a river will ya!!

I am a better driver than you no doubt and there's no reason for me to not feel more confident and positive about that than you.

As for the ease of a HR (ham radio) gear being easier or as easy as a car sterio for me is quite true. Unfortunately you seemed to indicate it is apparently not the same for you which again proves my point of the capable and uncapable operators. Thank you!  Wink

I have a YAESU FT-817ND and an IC-7000 I use while driving. If I can run through the menus, or just utilize the microphone which controls frequency change with ease than no one should have a problem doing the same, right?

"Of course not" your saying. Exactly! Not everyone is capable. That's my point!

I've grown tired of this thread but it has been entertaining to say the least.



Your post speaks for itself Smiley  There is no need for me to comment further.

Goodbye, child Smiley

W0DV
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N2RRA
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« Reply #49 on: February 04, 2012, 09:21:31 PM »


 Cry  Cry me a river will ya!!

I am a better driver than you no doubt and there's no reason for me to not feel more confident and positive about that than you.

As for the ease of a HR (ham radio) gear being easier or as easy as a car sterio for me is quite true. Unfortunately you seemed to indicate it is apparently not the same for you which again proves my point of the capable and uncapable operators. Thank you!  Wink

I have a YAESU FT-817ND and an IC-7000 I use while driving. If I can run through the menus, or just utilize the microphone which controls frequency change with ease than no one should have a problem doing the same, right?

"Of course not" your saying. Exactly! Not everyone is capable. That's my point!

I've grown tired of this thread but it has been entertaining to say the least.



Your post speaks for itself Smiley  There is no need for me to comment further.

Goodbye, child Smiley

W0DV

LOL! I am a child in age compared to you but the fact that a child could bring out your immaturity makes me laugh at such a hypocritical statement. I think lowering yourself to name calling speaks for itself.

Enough said!  Wink
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KT0DD
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« Reply #50 on: February 12, 2012, 09:59:42 AM »

I find the ones who believe ham operation while mobile to be distracting and should be outlawed, to be out of their mind. Besides the socialist, big brother, civil liberty and freedom of choice violations of a ban, there is a point they are missing.

Have any one of them ever heard of road hypnosis and driver fatigue? I personally have found mobile operation a blessing by keeping me awake and more alert on long road trips. Driver fatigue / hypnosis is becoming recognized as about as dangerous as drunk driving, and if a slight distraction can keep someone from falling asleep behind the wheel and killing someone, It's a blessing, not a curse.   Todd - KT0DD 
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K1CJS
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« Reply #51 on: February 12, 2012, 07:39:40 PM »

Have any one of them ever heard of road hypnosis and driver fatigue? I personally have found mobile operation a blessing by keeping me awake and more alert on long road trips. Driver fatigue / hypnosis is becoming recognized as about as dangerous as drunk driving, and if a slight distraction can keep someone from falling asleep behind the wheel and killing someone, It's a blessing, not a curse.

Now that is a good observation.  Long haul truck drivers actually WANTED something in their cab that would serve to distract them and keep them awake.  That is one of the reasons that they were so quick to embrace CB radios when the craze was starting back in the sixties and seventies.  Just the fact that they had someone talking to them helped them keep awake, keep their attention sharp and focussed on their driving.
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AI8P
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« Reply #52 on: February 13, 2012, 10:02:19 AM »

Well, I guess you must think that people should be encouraged to talk on their cell phones while they are driving to

"keep awake, keep their attention sharp and focussed on their driving."

There are none so blind as those who will not see.

Dennis
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N2RRA
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« Reply #53 on: February 13, 2012, 05:50:44 PM »

I find the ones who believe ham operation while mobile to be distracting and should be outlawed, to be out of their mind. Besides the socialist, big brother, civil liberty and freedom of choice violations of a ban, there is a point they are missing.

Have any one of them ever heard of road hypnosis and driver fatigue? I personally have found mobile operation a blessing by keeping me awake and more alert on long road trips. Driver fatigue / hypnosis is becoming recognized as about as dangerous as drunk driving, and if a slight distraction can keep someone from falling asleep behind the wheel and killing someone, It's a blessing, not a curse.   Todd - KT0DD 

I agree and actually mentioned the driver fatigue issue in my experience and shared by many many others in this thread in another post. Good point made and shared by the majority.

What the very small percentage like AI8P "doesn't see" is that the professional analyst that more than likely assisted the lobbyist to prove that certain electronics such as transceivers do not share the same distraction level as cell phones was proved in Washington and other states such as recent case in Illinois. LOL!  Roll Eyes

Then again the minority is the small percentage and I quote you "are the ones that are out of their minds" is quite true. No matter how much you prove your case they'll only see it their way. Their so blind they'll try to tell a professional race car driver how to race their car ,or an astronaut how to operate their space shuttle. LOL!

Their just plane crazy ,or have NO COMMON SENSE!


73!



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KT0DD
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« Reply #54 on: February 23, 2012, 10:03:01 AM »

Well, I guess you must think that people should be encouraged to talk on their cell phones while they are driving to

"keep awake, keep their attention sharp and focussed on their driving."

There are none so blind as those who will not see.

Dennis

What you are too blind to see is what N2RRA just pointed out. There is a BIG DIFFERENCE in the amount of driver distraction caused by a cell phone and talking on an amateur radio as pointed out in the previous post.

Scientists / doctors or whichever professionals conducted the aforementioned tests are most likely to have more accurate and factual information than you do. That is, unless you conducted all these tests yourself and have factual information and documentation to substantiate your findings. You just cannot accept the concept that maybe you just don't "know it all".
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N2RRA
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« Reply #55 on: February 23, 2012, 05:03:09 PM »

Well, I guess you must think that people should be encouraged to talk on their cell phones while they are driving to

"keep awake, keep their attention sharp and focussed on their driving."

There are none so blind as those who will not see.

Dennis

What you are too blind to see is what N2RRA just pointed out. There is a BIG DIFFERENCE in the amount of driver distraction caused by a cell phone and talking on an amateur radio as pointed out in the previous post.

Scientists / doctors or whichever professionals conducted the aforementioned tests are most likely to have more accurate and factual information than you do. That is, unless you conducted all these tests yourself and have factual information and documentation to substantiate your findings. You just cannot accept the concept that maybe you just don't "know it all".

EXACTLY!

Can't forget the guy who started this tread and pushed this subject in three other threads.

WA4D!

Him and AI8P just don't get it!
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K1CJS
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« Reply #56 on: February 26, 2012, 08:15:21 AM »

Well, I guess you must think that people should be encouraged to talk on their cell phones while they are driving to

"keep awake, keep their attention sharp and focussed on their driving."

There are none so blind as those who will not see.

Dennis

Now Dennis, I didn't say cell phones.  I used to drive long haul, and the chicken banders used to talk to each other over the air to keep each other awake.  Plz don't put words in other people's mouths.
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AI8P
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« Reply #57 on: February 27, 2012, 09:33:52 AM »

Can you explain to me, in scientific terms, the difference in cognitive distraction between talking on a CB and talking on a cell phone?   Is it the mic cable?
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KT0DD
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« Reply #58 on: February 28, 2012, 07:54:22 AM »

 I cannot explain in scientific terms, but I'm sure I can find a Phd in psychology who will verify in scientific terms what I say.  It has to do with peoples ability to handle their cognitive functions, focus and priority managment. Using your logic about distracted driving, then police, fire, and govt. officials are a public safety menace using their radios (and MY GOD...their laptops!) while driving. We then must stop airline pilots from using their radios in case they crash a jetliner, and NASA had better figure out mental telepathy (oops...another distraction) instead of radio communication to prevent the astronauts from crashing their spacecraft and killing people!

You cannot ethically make a blanket rule on these kind of activities. Everyone is an individual, and life will always have risk. You can get killed jaywalking or by lightning. It does happen. Humans are not perfect nor immortal. We cannot control everything in life.

Each of us handle situations differently, and unfortunately, some better than others.

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W2RI
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« Reply #59 on: February 28, 2012, 08:37:02 AM »

You don't need to be a psychology researcher to recognize how someone on a cellphone can be cognitively distracted. Many of them will do the "cellphone shuffle", walking in circles or back and forth, oblivious to their surroundings. I imagine it is because when on the phone they focus their attention on the voice in their ear, to the extent of ignoring any other input.

Contrast this with someone in a typical conversation, who is quite aware of his or her surroundings, and can respond quickly to stimuli.
In my experience a typical mobile QSO is better compared to a conversation than to a cellphone call.   
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