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Author Topic: Android: learn fast CW with Koch method  (Read 27834 times)
LB3KB
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« Reply #60 on: September 04, 2012, 05:02:45 PM »

Koch? Farnsworth?
try something else.
Like what ?

I'm not saying other methods don't work, in fact Just Learn Morse Code supports many other methods.  I'm just curious as to what methods actually work for somebody who failed with Koch's method.


73
LB3KB Sigurd
justlearnmorsecode.com
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PA0BLAH
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« Reply #61 on: September 04, 2012, 05:11:19 PM »

Bob, you're missing the obvious.

I think so, but there is a huge difference with your example. (Look at the royalties Agarwal received for the unbelievable number of books that is sold) No precedence for an undergraduate textbook.

-There are no starting requirements else then able to write.
- Even children of 6 years old perform it, when guided by parents.
- the only requirements are persistence and doing everyday 15 minutes exercising., no bright brains required.

The starters will learn Morse, but they want to get if for free,
and WHAT they get for free is experienced by them as worthless.

Other methods of learning Morse code: 2guys at the kitchen table, or that strange paid system with tales, just like you can find on internet, or the guy with the bunch of color coded resistors on his uniform, talking about EXACT he right length of signal elements.  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oGZrX5Dc_5o and that paid system, that some guys say it was their way after no success with Koch etc.

Bob

Bob
« Last Edit: September 04, 2012, 05:35:11 PM by PA0BLAH » Logged
LB3KB
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« Reply #62 on: September 04, 2012, 05:17:10 PM »

The starters will learn Morse, but they want to get if for free

The same would apply to any method for learning Morse code, and thus it has nothing to do with the quality of Koch's method.


73
LB3KB Sigurd
justlearnmorsecode.com
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AB9NZ
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« Reply #63 on: September 04, 2012, 05:41:57 PM »

Quote
Like what ?

I'm not saying other methods don't work, in fact Just Learn Morse Code supports many other methods.  I'm just curious as to what methods actually work for somebody who failed with Koch's method.
  Sigurd, when I failed with Koch I bought the Code Quick course and very easily learned the characters, then built speed with on air listening and operating, and your wonderful program. Bob calls the mnemonic system a "dog and pony show" and many others warn against it, but it sure worked great for me. No horrible plateaus, just a gradual climb to 30 wpm headcopy, I can't brag about my sending though Smiley
  73 de Tom, ab9nz   Mount Prospect, Illinois
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LB3KB
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« Reply #64 on: September 04, 2012, 06:01:24 PM »

when I failed with Koch I bought the Code Quick course and very easily learned the characters, then built speed with on air listening and operating, and your wonderful program.

That's very interesting, Tom.  There is merit to that system after all, then. ;o)

One interpretation would be that Koch as well as the traditional systems are not for everybody.  Maybe a small percentage of people actually do better with soundalikes etc.

I don't think it's fair to blame your initial failure on Koch, though.  It seems likely that you would have had an even harder time using the traditional visual methods.

Struggling with sending after learning to receive seems to be universal - it takes practice to get good at it and most people only practice sending on the air.  It goes without saying that it feels worse messing up sending if you're on the air.


I'm glad you found a system that worked for you.  Persistence pays off, and so does flexibility.  Congratulations!


73
LB3KB Sigurd
justlearnmorsecode.com
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M0LEP
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« Reply #65 on: September 05, 2012, 02:59:59 AM »

I'm just curious as to what methods actually work for somebody who failed with Koch's method.

For me, a mixture of things including, but not limited to:

  • * Listening to known sequences of characters on a CD in the car. Repetitive "A B C ... X Y Z" stuff, though most of the sequences I've been using involve character pairs. The key is in the sequences being known, not random, but long enough for me to get lost and then pick them up again.
  • * Listening to GB2CW when it's receivable (which is about once a week, if I'm lucky). This is useful because  it needs to be written down, and it usually includes a lot of punctuation, and few abbreviations.
  • * Listening on-air to CW traffic, picking stations working at under about 20wpm, and using fldigi in CW mode. The trick here is in catching the program out. When I get more of a conversation than it does then I figure I'm making progress.
  • * Listening to call-signs, words, or canned QSOs generated by computer, one way or another, if listening on-air isn't possible.
  • * Practicing sending to fldigi, cwget, or some other piece of morse-reading software.
  • * Occasional actual on-air QSOs.
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AB9NZ
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« Reply #66 on: September 05, 2012, 06:46:59 AM »

Quote
One interpretation would be that Koch as well as the traditional systems are not for everybody.  Maybe a small percentage of people actually do better with soundalikes etc.

I don't think it's fair to blame your initial failure on Koch, though.  It seems likely that you would have had an even harder time using the traditional visual methods.
   There are code charts out there, but I don't think anybody advocates a visual approach these days. What I was trying to express on this thread is that in my own very unscientific google searching and reading of Ray and Fabian's group and forums I've never seen where anyone other than LA3AKA and N1IRZ has achieved instant recognition via the Koch method. It appears to me that everybody falls back to the Farnsworth spacing which I read to be verboten in the Koch method. The words "German psychologist Ludwig Koch" carry a certain cachet, and my concern was that people were following an internet meme of a press release, and not the success of the method.
   Most likely scores of graduates of the Koch method will check into this forum and prove the fallacy of my worries which are only based only on a gut feeling and internet searching. Since he started with a clean slate, hopefully Davide will check back and share his experience with learning the characters via instant recognition. Of course in my questioning my intent was never to flame the hard work of the guys that create these wonderful Morse code programs. My deepest apologies if it was ever taken that way.
     73 de Tom, ab9nz    Mount Prospect, Illinois
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K7KBN
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« Reply #67 on: September 05, 2012, 07:07:06 AM »

I posted this back in 2005, right here on eHam. 
------------------------

The first time I ever heard of learning code that way was in the old book (later made into a couple of movies) "Cheaper by the Dozen".  In the book - the true story of a family back in the 1920s -  the father is an "efficiency expert" who teaches his twelve children Morse code at the dinner table.  The only phrase I remember was that the letter "C" was "CAREless CHILdren". 

This is a self-limiting way to learn code: you hear "DAH di DAH dit", you then think "CAREless CHILdren", and then write down "C".  The idea should be to hear "DAH di DAH dit" and immediately write the "C" without the extra step.
-------------------------------------

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73
Pat K7KBN
CWO4 USNR Ret.
AB9NZ
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Posts: 177




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« Reply #68 on: September 05, 2012, 07:48:25 AM »

MYTHBUSTER!
Pat, in my actual and recent experience I didn't find soundalikes to be limiting at all. After learning the characters with mnemonics, with casual operating and computer speed building I experienced a gradual climb to 30 wpm headcopy. So easy 12 kids could learn it at the kitchen table.
                   73, de Tom, ab9nz
 
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