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Author Topic: R 2005D Motorola service monitor help  (Read 8477 times)
N3DT
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Posts: 667




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« on: November 11, 2012, 05:17:14 PM »

OK, left it on overnight and I'm sure the fan isn't cooling it off enough, sure enough in the morning, it's not working.  AC light comes on, but that's all.  Haven't tried running it off 12V yet.  Undoubtedly a power supply problem, but I don't have a service manual or anything on it.  All boards modular, so very hard to trouble shoot except just looking at parts by pulling boards out, can't see anything burned.  No AB smell.

Anyone have any ideas.  I see a Chinese gentleman on evilbay is selling a 2001/2002 service manual cd, but I don't know how similar they are but for $15?

Dave
N3DT
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N4NYY
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« Reply #1 on: November 11, 2012, 05:25:19 PM »

Try to run in on 12V. It it works, then you know it is the power supply. You can likely rebuild it without a schematic.
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WB6DGN
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« Reply #2 on: November 11, 2012, 07:37:21 PM »

Quote
I see a Chinese gentleman on evilbay is selling a 2001/2002 service manual cd...

Dave,
The 2005D is a 2001D with the options denoted by the last two numbers of the model number unlike other manufacturers who list their options separately.  The 2005, 2021, etc. are all the basic 2001 instrument.  What does matter, though, is the revision letter, in your case "D".  The "D" revision has some significant changes over the A, B, and C versions and the manual needs to match.  Hope this helps.
Tom
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N3DT
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« Reply #3 on: November 13, 2012, 11:26:05 AM »

I'm going to try over at batlabs.com, maybe one of the Motorola guru's will know something.  I know Motorola sold their service monitor division to General Dynamics when I was still working around 04 or so, so I may try to see if GD has any information.  Motorola tech is no help.

I've traced the AC to the power supply board and am trying to figure out the dc outputs, at least that may get me somewhere.

I still don't understand the dc input circuit with the fuse, one side of the dc fuse is connected to ground, unless they're fusing the low side?  I'm not putting any dc power to it until I know what I'm doing.

Dave
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KB5ZSM
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« Reply #4 on: November 15, 2012, 12:30:58 AM »

If in fact it is a thermal problem, try using freeze spray to isolate the problem area and maybe the faulty component.
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W9GB
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« Reply #5 on: November 15, 2012, 04:32:46 AM »

http://www.cardinalelec.com/index.htm
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N3DT
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Posts: 667




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« Reply #6 on: November 15, 2012, 08:17:48 AM »

If I had any clue where the problem could be, I'd use the freeze spray, but at the moment nothing is working and there are about 15 daughter boards, one large mother board.  Thanks for the Cardinal link, but I could take it to the Motorola depot in Upper Marlboro, MD instead of shipping a 70 lb container to Chicago.  I may end up doing that if I can't find a schematic or service manual on it.  It would probably be worth a couple hundred just to get it working, if they will even work on it, and they may not since Motorola has sold their service monitor division.  I'd probably have to find a General Dynamics service depot.  But I'm going to hold out until I find out anything from Batlabs.
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WB6DGN
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« Reply #7 on: November 16, 2012, 12:33:17 AM »

Quote
Thanks for the Cardinal link, but I could take it to the Motorola depot in Upper Marlboro, MD instead of shipping a 70 lb container to Chicago.  I may end up doing that if I can't find a schematic or service manual on it.

I doubt if GD would work on a monitor of that age; not sure about Mot. if they still have service facilities available or not.  The last company I worked for used Cardinal and their service was very good.  My own preference, however, is Amtronix in northern New York,  http://www.amtronix.com/ .  I believe he works on Motorola though his specialty is Agilent/Hewlett-Packard.  If GD or Mot. does work on it, hold on to your hat! as far as price goes.  Doubt you'll get out of either for less than a couple thousand, maybe more depending on what they find.  For example, a new CRT, last I heard, is around $1250 for the part alone!  The independent shops are going to be a lot easier on your wallet but still pricey.  Doubt you'll get anyone to even plug it in for a "couple hundred", though.  Good luck; when you're dealing with "high end" test equipment, you're in the big leagues and pay accordingly.
Tom
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NJ1K
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« Reply #8 on: November 16, 2012, 04:30:24 AM »

I have a full service manual for R-2001D.  It's not for sale but I might be able to help with specific information.

email me at mycall at sparkarc dot org
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N3DT
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« Reply #9 on: November 16, 2012, 06:57:42 PM »

wb6dgn,  yes, I was thinking that if I took it for repair it would be very expensive, and undoubtedly Mot will not work on it as they have sold the monitor rights to GD.  And they would be very expensive too.  I'm thinking my best option is buy the D model CD from a guy on evilbay for $75 and bite the bullet.  I understand there is a good section in the manual about trouble shooting no power up.  I'm pretty sure it's a power supply issue, but not sure, but I did discover A3 is the DC output module and I have no voltages on the TP's there.  That's a pretty good indication along with absolutely no function except the AC LED on the front panel when I plug it in.

I'm hoping I can find a fuse, but good luck on that one.  I've been through the power supply boards pretty thoroughly, but somethings not working.  Probably a transistor or two.

Dave
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WB6DGN
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« Reply #10 on: November 16, 2012, 11:58:56 PM »

I'm not 100% certain that Mot. has closed their test equip. depot.  Seems to me I read recently that someone sent something there.  Not having any Mot. test equipment, I didn't pay much attention, though.  Probably moot anyway as, you're right, the prices would be very high.
There is a retired Motorola test equipment tech. that frequents the Test Equipment thread on Bratlabs that might be able to offer some advice while you're looking for a manual.  He seems to be very helpful and knowledgeable and may well be able to steer you in the right direction.  If you could get this problem fixed without having to buy that CD, I think I'd think twice about buying it because of the very limited parts availability for that series.  Nothing more frustrating than knowing what's wrong and not being able to get the part.  'Course, another option might be to look for a "parts donor" monitor to keep things going for (maybe, quite) a while.  The killer is the CRT.  When it starts going dim, you know its days are numbered.
I like that series monitor, though.  That's the monitor that I used in the portable shop (mine was a 2021 with the trunking options) until the day I retired.  Good luck with it.
Tom
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N3DT
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« Reply #11 on: November 17, 2012, 05:51:47 AM »

By the time I quit working in 05, Motorola would not accept any service analyzers for repair or calibration.  We had to go to GD, apparently they sold all the rights.  Not to say an independent shop wouldn't take care of it.  It may be that working boards are rare as hens teeth, but I'm sure components could be sourced or substituted, except maybe the CRT.  It's certainly worth fixing if possible.  I've read that people at batlabs have been happy with the CD from the guy on ebay, so I may go that route in case something happens in the future.  The machine is certainly worth $75.

Thanks
Dave
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WB6DGN
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Posts: 619




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« Reply #12 on: November 17, 2012, 07:47:41 PM »

Quote
...so I may go that route in case something happens in the future.  The machine is certainly worth $75.

Its a darn shame that so much nice equipment is compromised by lack for replacement parts (really lack of mfg. support).  Wonder if someone could make a profitable business out of supplying replacements for such "no longer supported" equipment?  World, remember that old saying, "Waste not, Want not."  This world sure needs to be less wasteful.
Tom
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N3DT
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Posts: 667




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« Reply #13 on: November 23, 2012, 08:08:07 AM »

Well, I've found a diode that was a dead short in the low voltage power supply.  I'm going to replace all 4 diodes in the bridge and hopefully the thing will come back on.  I did discover that if any of the power supplies are shorted, or even high or low voltage, it's all monitored and the control board will shut everything down in that case.  We'll see.  Parts should be here Monday or Tuesday.  I got the service manual from 'southern cross' on the ebay, it was a bit pricy, but I guess worth keeping the analyzer going.  At least it's perfectly readable/printable.
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KE3WD
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« Reply #14 on: November 23, 2012, 08:26:56 AM »

Well, I've found a diode that was a dead short in the low voltage power supply.  I'm going to replace all 4 diodes in the bridge and hopefully the thing will come back on.  I did discover that if any of the power supplies are shorted, or even high or low voltage, it's all monitored and the control board will shut everything down in that case.  We'll see.  Parts should be here Monday or Tuesday.  I got the service manual from 'southern cross' on the ebay, it was a bit pricy, but I guess worth keeping the analyzer going.  At least it's perfectly readable/printable.

Very likely that will be all that is wrong with it. 

Good troubleshooting, sometimes just takes a wee bit more time, patience and the willingness to look for it, but as I told you above, suspect the power supply. 

"Follow the power, follow the power, follow the power!" 

Squidmatic not necessary for that. 


73
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