Call Search
     

New to Ham Radio?
My Profile

Community
Articles
Forums
News
Reviews
Friends Remembered
Strays
Survey Question

Operating
Contesting
DX Cluster Spots
Propagation

Resources
Calendar
Classifieds
Ham Exams
Ham Links
List Archives
News Articles
Product Reviews
QSL Managers

Site Info
eHam Help (FAQ)
Support the site
The eHam Team
Advertising Info
Vision Statement
About eHam.net

   Home   Help Search  
Pages: [1]   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic: receiving a zs6 station one day better on a vertical than a beam.  (Read 1232 times)
WK6F
Member

Posts: 7




Ignore
« on: June 10, 2014, 05:36:43 PM »

had a weird experience today.received a zs6 station at s 4 to s 5 on my ground mounted vertical with a lot of radials on the ground better than with my 3 element beam pointing long or short path.actually no signal received with the beam on a good ft950 yaesu.the vertical antenna with a yaesu ft1000mpmk5 received good.
  my opinion on this is propagation just received the zs6 station vertically at that time.this is on 20 meters and have worked many zs6 stations before very well with the beam.I used the receive preamps on both rigs. the ft950 with the beam wasn't able to perform receive wise at all.zero signal received at that time.looking for opinions from operators with  possible experience.tom  wk6f
Logged
KA5PIU
Member

Posts: 446




Ignore
« Reply #1 on: June 10, 2014, 06:51:40 PM »

Hello.

I have a "Loaded" tower and some really long long wires.
I ditched the beam years ago as this drew complaints.
Guess what? I get FAR better DX!
Yes, the beam did NOTHING for me.
I can chat into Saudi Arabia FAR better than with this beam ever did.
Smith Charts? Great Circle? Pointed Right Direction?
None of that matters with a vertical!
I  can load the tower with 27 MHz CB, and keep up with the guys running all sorts of power.
First off, it is a really clean 4 watts, and a gain vertical
I can load the tower to 5/8th wave on 11 meters, and do to its width it acts as a stovepipe.
on 160 meters, where a vertical is not affordable, a long wire is used, and ALWAYS gives better figures than any other antenna I have tried.
80 Meters, that is a tossup.
40 meters, 20 meters, 10 meters, the Tower seems to be better.
At 20 meters, the tower has an advantage.
On 10, the Tower rules!
This was done originally to keep the household happy.
And, yes, you can mount a VHF or UHF antenna on the tower, but it has to be isolated from the tower, otherwise you have the HF antenna connected to the shield of the VHF antenna.
Simply mount them away from the tower.
To be correct, what I have is called a "Mast Radiator" antenna.
Logged
G3RZP
Member

Posts: 4391




Ignore
« Reply #2 on: June 11, 2014, 01:06:47 AM »

What polarisation was the ZS using? Although on HF, especially if there are any reflections on the path that are under the Brewster angle, you can expect a polarisation change anyway. I have had the situation on 40m when working VK long path that my horizontal full wave dipole received a better signal than my semi-vertical sloper (aimed long path) by about 2 S points, but the VK was getting a signal about 2S points better from the sloper than when  when I transmitted on the dipole. Interestingly non-reciprocal, and definitely not meeting the Rayleigh-Carson theory.

Verticals  have been described as 'antennas which radiate equally badly in all directions', although my folded unipole top loaded tower goes very well on 80 and 160, and that with no radials (although thick, wet heavy clay soil from about 6 inches down). It is the first vertical I have ever had that was successful, though, despite having ones with lots of radials.
Logged
WK6F
Member

Posts: 7




Ignore
« Reply #3 on: June 11, 2014, 06:27:27 PM »

not sure what the zs6 was useing for a antenna. wk6f
Logged
W8JX
Member

Posts: 5482




Ignore
« Reply #4 on: June 12, 2014, 08:49:09 AM »

had a weird experience today.received a zs6 station at s 4 to s 5 on my ground mounted vertical with a lot of radials on the ground better than with my 3 element beam pointing long or short path.actually no signal received with the beam on a good ft950 yaesu.the vertical antenna with a yaesu ft1000mpmk5 received good.
  my opinion on this is propagation just received the zs6 station vertically at that time.this is on 20 meters and have worked many zs6 stations before very well with the beam.I used the receive preamps on both rigs. the ft950 with the beam wasn't able to perform receive wise at all.zero signal received at that time.looking for opinions from operators with  possible experience.tom  wk6f

What many do not realize is that a beam is not like a highly focused flashlight. It has several lobes in elevation and the range/size/center point of theses lobes is controlled by its height above ground. It is entirely possible for a signal to come in at a angle that is in the null between lobes. I vertical is less fussy about this is DX.  Polarization of signal is not really a factor once it skips.   
« Last Edit: June 12, 2014, 08:51:31 AM by W8JX » Logged

--------------------------------------
Entered using a  WiFi Win 8.1 RT tablet or a Android tablet using 4G/LTE or WiFi.
G3RZP
Member

Posts: 4391




Ignore
« Reply #5 on: June 12, 2014, 08:55:10 AM »

'JX

That is very, very, true. I find that my beam at 62 feet can be too high on 28MHz for the Caribbean: I've also been in a contest on 20 where a 5 element Yagi at 62 feet was gangbusters into W6, but the East Coast couldn't hear it, and to keep the frequency I had to switch back and forth between the beam and a G5RV at 30 feet.
Logged
ZENKI
Member

Posts: 906




Ignore
« Reply #6 on: June 12, 2014, 02:34:59 PM »

Then there is also the "crooked path" Sometime my 6 element monobander on 20 meters is terrible  because the path  is not  on the calculated bearing. Highly directional monobanders can be a nuisance especially in a contest. Many times a just use a 204ba rather the bigger monobander because I can point  it roughly in  the directions and work many stations even slightly off the sides without having to turn the beams constantly.
Logged
Pages: [1]   Go Up
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.11 | SMF © 2006-2009, Simple Machines LLC Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!