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Author Topic: Setting up SDR for Pan Adapter  (Read 10540 times)
K8DIL
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Posts: 15




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« on: June 12, 2013, 07:36:43 AM »

I'm planning on setting up a separate SDR receiver as a pan adapter to support my HF rig.  My current radio is an old IC-735 with the RX Out and RX In jacks on the rear of the radio.  I understand that the RX out is switched (isolated) when I transmit, so the anything connected there is protected.  My thinking is that I would run the RX out througha splitter, then one leg to the 735's RX in and the other to the SDR.

Then I got to thinking about upgrading my radio.  I had been looking at the TS-590 and the FT-950, but I don't believe either of these would support this split RX to the SDR.  Is this correct?  Is there any recent vintage HF rig, with IF DSP, that won't break the bank, that has this break-out in the RX path?  Or, is there something that has a convenient IF output that I could take to the SDR?

Thanks in advance,

de K8DIL, John
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KG6YV
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Posts: 515




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« Reply #1 on: June 12, 2013, 10:51:08 AM »

For an SDR to work as a panadapter it needs to tap into the receive stream at the first mixer.  The IC 735 and in fact most transceivers prior to the newest stuff like the TS590, FTDX5000/3000 and the K3 ALL used up-conversion which means the first IF is somewhere between 40-y70 mhz.  Not many SDRs and none of the cheaper ones will detect signals above 30 mhz.  This means that the transceiver's first IF would need to be down-converted to something under 30mhz for any SDR like LP-Pan, SoftRock or even the SDR-IQ.  That would require a homebrew project to build a down-converter. 

FYI

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KD2CJJ
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Posts: 369




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« Reply #2 on: June 12, 2013, 12:47:19 PM »

The newer >$2000 have IF outputs... Unfortunately unless your willing to home brew something (and mostly will work with vintage stuff; the current radios in my opinion are far too complex and some just are not possible to tap off the first mixer if they are DSP driven - I could be wrong though since I have never tried this)  the <$2000 radios mostly do not have IF outputs.  The only radio that I am aware of that has an off the shelf mod is the FT-950 (can be had now <$1k used) OR FT-2000 (but its >$2000 new).  You would need this:  http://rfspace.com/RFSPACE/IF-2000.html.  Essentially this card is an IF down converter... Once you have this you can pretty much hook up the radio to any Pan Adapter.  You will need either LP-Pan , SDR-IQ or even you can use Elecrafts standalone Pan Adapter (no PC needed) to work.  Keep in mind though the Yaesu's have the DMU units which provide the same capabilities (generally).

I'm planning on setting up a separate SDR receiver as a pan adapter to support my HF rig.  My current radio is an old IC-735 with the RX Out and RX In jacks on the rear of the radio.  I understand that the RX out is switched (isolated) when I transmit, so the anything connected there is protected.  My thinking is that I would run the RX out througha splitter, then one leg to the 735's RX in and the other to the SDR.

Then I got to thinking about upgrading my radio.  I had been looking at the TS-590 and the FT-950, but I don't believe either of these would support this split RX to the SDR.  Is this correct?  Is there any recent vintage HF rig, with IF DSP, that won't break the bank, that has this break-out in the RX path?  Or, is there something that has a convenient IF output that I could take to the SDR?

Thanks in advance,

de K8DIL, John
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73

Mike
KD2CJJ
N4OGW
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Posts: 314




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« Reply #3 on: June 12, 2013, 02:16:22 PM »

Another one: it is easy to add IF output to the Elecraft K2.

Tor
N4OGW
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K8DIL
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Posts: 15




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« Reply #4 on: June 12, 2013, 04:00:33 PM »

Thanks for the replies all.  What I was considering was not an IF input SDR, but a second parallel receiver that used a switched RX antenna input, as is provided on my 735.  There was an article in Jan 2013 QST about a "Cheap and Easy SDR" based on a DVB-T receiver in a USB dongle.  This thing has an input frequency range of about 67 to 1700MHz, so would require an upconverter to do HF reception.  There are a few out there that have an LO of 100 or 125 MHz, so they would work.  But again, I was looking for a radio that had such a switched connection available.

For those interested, here is a link that includes the QST article.  Or, search for "Cheap and Easy SDR" on the internet.

http://www.w3vpr.org/node/1252

Thank you again,

K8DIL, John
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AB4ZT
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Posts: 177




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« Reply #5 on: June 12, 2013, 07:04:26 PM »

I have a TS-590 and I am building a SoftRock RX Ensemble II to use as a pan adaptor rx.  Will use an MFJ RF-sensing TX/RX switch along with the the RX antenna input to the TS-590.  A tee connector will provide RX sigs to both the SoftRock and the Kenwood, and the MFJ switch will keep TX RF out of both.

73,

Richard, AB4ZT
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K5TED
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Posts: 780




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« Reply #6 on: June 12, 2013, 07:05:22 PM »

RTL dongle would work well in this application
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VE3TMT
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Posts: 449




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« Reply #7 on: June 21, 2013, 12:29:59 PM »

Using the R820T tuner dongle as an IF panadapter is quite easy. I use it with my Yaesu FT990 to get almost 2 MHz of display. It can be configured to be used as a separate same band receiver as well.

VE3TMT
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ZENKI
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Posts: 980




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« Reply #8 on: June 24, 2013, 02:20:31 AM »

You can get some ideas from this product web page

http://www.herostechnology.co.uk/pages/RF_Filters/filters.html#SPLTBYP

You can easily homebrew these products yourself if you dont want to  buy the kits.

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G4AON
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Posts: 543




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« Reply #9 on: June 24, 2013, 05:30:16 AM »

I'm planning on setting up a separate SDR receiver as a pan adapter to support my HF rig.  My current radio is an old IC-735 with the RX Out and RX In jacks on the rear of the radio.
<SNIP>
de K8DIL, John
I used to do exactly that, there are details on my K3 review (half way down the page). See:
http://www.astromag.co.uk/k3/

73 Dave
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K8AC
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Posts: 1477




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« Reply #10 on: July 24, 2013, 05:12:53 PM »

Some of the older Yaesu transceivers had a receive out/receive in path on the antenna that you could use. For example, the FT-1000MP Mk V had it - not sure about the other FT-1000s.  I used that approach with an SDR-IQ receiver for a short time with my Mk V.  There are a few problems with that approach of course.  Many of the SDRs are lacking in receive sensitivity on the higher bands (15, 12, 10) and so some weak signals that can easily be heard on the FT-1000 couldn't be seen on the SDR-IQ software.  Another problem is slaving the SDR frequency to that of the transceiver.  The SDR-IQ software supported a few current transceivers in that respect. 

73, Floyd K8AC
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WE1X
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Posts: 350




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« Reply #11 on: July 30, 2013, 01:31:08 PM »

John,

I use an RTL dongle (Terratec T Stick+) that goes from about 50Mhz to 2Ghz.

VE4NSA came up with a simple, reversible and non-invasive hardware mod for the Icom 7600 to tap the 64.455 IF to a splitter. Attached to the splitter is the Terratec dongle.  I then used HDSDR software to display the 7600's scope on an external display. The quality and resolution are far so far superior to the 7600's native display I don't use it anymore. Further, the HDSDR software can be configured to allow click and point tuning of the 7600.  I wrote a paper on how to install and configure the HDSDR software to do this (available on the IC-7600 Yahoo Group or Adam Farson's VA7OJ's website Icom page).

Others have done something similar with Yaesu rigs including the FT-897.

So it is possible to use an RTL dongle. The challenge will be to figure out where to tap the IF on the 735.

Harry WE1X
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KB9QHB
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Posts: 1




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« Reply #12 on: March 27, 2014, 11:01:20 AM »

Hi  KB9QHB here.


i did a pan adapter on my icom ic-735   easy as pie.  cut antenna off the cable of the rtl2832 820T dongle and tie  the end to the first IF of the 735, use a 100pf cap to decouple the IF from the dongle. use HDSDR software use 70451500hz as IF FRQ.  use omin rig to control the 735 with the proper cable.  setting up the software is not hard but you need to read how others have done it.
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VE3TMT
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Posts: 449




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« Reply #13 on: March 28, 2014, 12:20:16 PM »

Hi  KB9QHB here.


i did a pan adapter on my icom ic-735   easy as pie.  cut antenna off the cable of the rtl2832 820T dongle and tie  the end to the first IF of the 735, use a 100pf cap to decouple the IF from the dongle. use HDSDR software use 70451500hz as IF FRQ.  use omin rig to control the 735 with the proper cable.  setting up the software is not hard but you need to read how others have done it.

I did exactly that on my Yaesu FT990. Tapped the 47 MHz first IF.

As noted earlier, you have to tap the IF inside the radio. You WILL NOT get the required signal from the RX ANT in or out connections.

Configure the software (I use HDSDR) to match the IF of the radio, make a few tweaks and you're off and running. If your radio is capable of CAT control, you can set it up with OmniRig. You see an interesting signal on the display, you click...radio follows.

You can also configure it as it's own receiver using the radio IF as a source. Great for knowing where everyone is calling the DX!
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