Call Search
     

New to Ham Radio?
My Profile

Community
Articles
Forums
News
Reviews
Friends Remembered
Strays
Survey Question

Operating
Contesting
DX Cluster Spots
Propagation

Resources
Calendar
Classifieds
Ham Exams
Ham Links
List Archives
News Articles
Product Reviews
QSL Managers

Site Info
eHam Help (FAQ)
Support the site
The eHam Team
Advertising Info
Vision Statement
About eHam.net

   Home   Help Search  
Pages: [1]   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic: Smart Phone the next step in Disaster EMCOMM?  (Read 10653 times)
W1JKA
Member

Posts: 1661




Ignore
« on: December 14, 2013, 10:30:00 AM »

I have just recently read about and also have seen on You Tube the  Australian researchers who have been developing a new ap to take advantage of the Smart Phone's built in Wi-Fi capabilities for short range phone to phone coms without need of towers. They are also developing a small pocket size range extender to be held or attached at arms length height that is good for several miles not to mention range beyond several miles due to relays. When this becomes available it's not to difficult to imagine where current infrastructure/tower dependent ECOMM systems will end up.
Logged
W7ASA
Member

Posts: 228




Ignore
« Reply #1 on: December 14, 2013, 10:58:56 AM »

VERY true!  There is also a lot of work - some reaching a practical stage - for full MESH self-forming/self-healing networking software for laptops and smartphones. The advantage is that the Red Cross and other emergency volunteers would not require licensed operators to support their close area operations and might not even require any special equipment. The weak point in this area is the small number of ham volunteers.

Around the house, we've been using a WiFi based FREE app for 'walkie-talkie' from phone to phone around the property.  As long as the phones can connect with the WiFi router, we're able to communicate without towers. This particular app is only for 2 phones, but it's handy.  For multiple stations, the MESH or other solution looks like an excellent choice for shelter operations (for example) , because we're ALWAYS short of ham volunteers.  Frankly, for the 'tactical' close to shelter comms, I'd like to have volunteers using MURS or MESH or something which can get them up and running license free, without waiting to have enough ham volunteers to operate the shelter equipment they have already purchased.

I love ham radio for me personally and for disaster response, but it's only one 'tool' in the box for supporting emcomm.



de Ray
W7ASA ..._  ._



Logged
KG4RUL
Member

Posts: 2722


WWW

Ignore
« Reply #2 on: December 14, 2013, 12:58:01 PM »

I have just recently read about and also have seen on You Tube the  Australian researchers who have been developing a new ap to take advantage of the Smart Phone's built in Wi-Fi capabilities for short range phone to phone coms without need of towers. They are also developing a small pocket size range extender to be held or attached at arms length height that is good for several miles not to mention range beyond several miles due to relays. When this becomes available it's not to difficult to imagine where current infrastructure/tower dependent ECOMM systems will end up.

Do you have the URL for the YouTube video?
Logged
W1JKA
Member

Posts: 1661




Ignore
« Reply #3 on: December 14, 2013, 01:20:33 PM »

Re: KG4RUL

Latest You tube was on MSN homepage this morning (in there some where) Huh Until I can find it again you can Bing/Google (IT researchers a step closer to developing natural disaster app) and get similar info.
Logged
KG4RUL
Member

Posts: 2722


WWW

Ignore
« Reply #4 on: December 14, 2013, 05:47:18 PM »

After reading the sparse detail I could find, one problem immediately came to light.  If you have a few hundred smart phones running the app, you have a few hundred smart phones draining their batteries.  In a disaster, of any more than modest proportions, the means to recharge the batteries may not be available.
Logged
W1JKA
Member

Posts: 1661




Ignore
« Reply #5 on: December 15, 2013, 03:10:43 AM »

Re: KG4RUL

Yes, the battery situation has to be considered, but as I see it (sans charger) a few personal spares or several at a central location with only necessary use would be a fraction of the cost other power sources i.e. generator and fuel and as stated in one of the articles if this type of app had been available during the recent Philippine disaster rescue and relief efforts during the first two weeks would have been considerably easier and loss of life reduced significantly. At the least this type of developing technology is an eye opener to the future of all types of EMCOM levels.
Logged
KG4RUL
Member

Posts: 2722


WWW

Ignore
« Reply #6 on: December 15, 2013, 07:16:58 AM »

I agree 100%.  But, in the rush of excitement when trying out anything new, little things like "how do you power the system" are often overlooked.  i.e. you are at the campsite, a 20 mile hike from nowhere, and you discover you left the toilet paper and can opener at home.  The more components that you have in a system, the more likely it will fail.
Logged
KF7VXA
Member

Posts: 458




Ignore
« Reply #7 on: December 15, 2013, 11:14:24 AM »

I could see some benefit, but it sure could cause a jam up. Somebody has to be there to respond to the calls. If we just look at cell service now, when something major happens, you get everyone who has a cell phone calling in about the event and except for those who are first to report something, if they are not a part of a police or multi lettered agency, once the problem has come to light, further calls by the public are largely ignored. There is still only so much bandwidth available with the Wi-Fi and then one has to look at possible interfearence with other services.
It could be a good thing for use in a small area, but it almost sounds like GMRS in a phone. I could see some uses, but more so for people who are involved at a command post rather than the general public.
I have no problem seeing it developed and I'm sure it would be of help to some, but it's not really a major answer in a big emergency.
As others mentioned, battery life would be pretty short if the phone is asked to be the Wi-Fi and transmit and receive also. That would increase battery drain far more than regular use. It might work better if it was put into a tablet with a far larger battery. To me, it just looks like another way for the cell phone industry to make more money, everyone would need a new phone as the shortcomings of the current phones are very evident.

73's John
Logged
KB8VUL
Member

Posts: 110




Ignore
« Reply #8 on: January 03, 2014, 08:05:21 PM »

OK, I keep seeing the same topic / argument against the idea being the battery life of a cell phone.
Sorry, but don't HT's run on battery?  And talking on them or just having them on runs the battery down. 
Hams deal with that by carrying extra batteries, so if the Red Cross was to roll out smart phones to volunteers to use with a wifi app for communications wouldn't they think to get phones that had user accessable batteries and then get extras so low batteries could be swapped out to be charged?

I am yet to see one thing posted in here about something that could take the place of ham in EMCOMM that hasn't had something wrong with it, and oddly those weaknesses are always the same weaknesses that ham radio has, but it's a bad idea because it's not ham radio and therefore it's just a bad idea.
Logged
W1JKA
Member

Posts: 1661




Ignore
« Reply #9 on: January 04, 2014, 02:23:44 AM »

Re: KB8VUL

Looks like the only EMCOMM thing Hams will be happy with are 2 hi tech aluminum soup cans and several rolls of fire proof Kevlar based string.
Logged
LA9XSA
Member

Posts: 376




Ignore
« Reply #10 on: January 12, 2014, 04:21:55 PM »

Re: W1JKA Please don't generalize a couple of guys who feature on the ignore lists on eHam and QRZ.com with hams as a whole. Most of those who take no interest in emergency communications just don't participate in that niche of ham radio.

Re: KF7VXA
Quote
To me, it just looks like another way for the cell phone industry to make more money,
As far as I remember, there's been initiatives like this before, letting phones talk peer-to-peer, but the phone companies (carriers) have actively opposed this since mesh networks would compete with their metered network. I think it's likely that in the future you would need to "jailbreak" your phone to get this functionality working, unless the phone manufacturers' interests in providing services to their users outweighs pressure from carrier companies.
If it becomes widely available, it might be useful for refugees in camps, neighborhoods and emergency managers talking to each other taking some of the traffic load from government networks and radio amateurs, so that would be a plus.
« Last Edit: January 12, 2014, 04:54:20 PM by LA9XSA » Logged
W1JKA
Member

Posts: 1661




Ignore
« Reply #11 on: January 12, 2014, 05:25:21 PM »

Re: LA9XSA

Generalize?? I think the proper word is facetious and thought this topic had died and gone to Ham heaven.
Logged
ONAIR
Member

Posts: 1741




Ignore
« Reply #12 on: January 13, 2014, 02:54:10 PM »

OK so in theory, this app would allow cell phone users to communicate with other local users directly phone to phone?  Wouldn't this open the possibility of all kinds of characters chit chatting and causing havoc, basically using it just like the CB radios and walkie talkies were used back in the day?  There already is an app where any smart phone user can talk to other smart phone users for free, and the language and conversations on there are beyond description!  It's called  http://www.cbradiochat.net  if you want to see exactly what I am referring to.
Logged
AE5JU
Member

Posts: 229




Ignore
« Reply #13 on: January 20, 2014, 08:25:58 PM »

This is all I have to say for cell phones in emergencies:

Logged
ONAIR
Member

Posts: 1741




Ignore
« Reply #14 on: February 05, 2014, 04:15:29 PM »

This is all I have to say for cell phones in emergencies:


  Just amazing!  What ever happened to all of those hardwired public phones that we once had?  Seen many around lately?
Logged
Pages: [1]   Go Up
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.11 | SMF © 2006-2009, Simple Machines LLC Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!