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eHam Forums => Misc => Topic started by: VE3PLO on October 22, 2009, 08:55:05 PM



Title: Ebay, WTF, and shipping to CANADA.................
Post by: VE3PLO on October 22, 2009, 08:55:05 PM
This is really starting to tick me off. Recently i tried to purchase numerous items on ebay. My account is fully registered with eBay, paypal, address confirmed etc...
... and still people say that they will not to ship to Canada...

Why do sellers fear that they will be charged DUTY?
Why are people afraid to ship Canada? If you fear that you will be charged DUTY, go back to HS and read what duty is.

It's not like we live somewhere on the other side of the moon. We are on the same continent!!! and nobody else is here with us. I do understand if you have to ship an item to Turkmenistan where there is no FedEx nor UPS or whatever but c'mon, Canada? WTF is wrong with you?
I guess that people do not know what NAFTA is if it comes to items/merchandise that has been manufactured here in North America.


Title: Ebay, WTF, and shipping to CANADA.................
Post by: KL7 on October 23, 2009, 03:11:54 AM
I have wondered the same thing for years, about why some people won't ship to Alaska or to a P.O Box, or why they try to tack on extra fees for Alaska over and above actual costs.


Title: Ebay, WTF, and shipping to CANADA.................
Post by: N5LRZ on October 23, 2009, 05:25:59 AM
And all these years UPS has promoted itself as being able to deliver to just about anywhere on the face of this earth.  And all the time I thought...

But I know definately WHY people do not want to ship to AK...

They do not want to make that poor UPS guy or gal carry that little box over those snow covered mountains in the wilderness to get a delivery signature.


Title: Ebay, WTF, and shipping to CANADA.................
Post by: WB5JEO on October 23, 2009, 08:25:34 AM
I think it's mostly that they just haven't checked and imagine that there are more problems. You give them a selection of boxes to check, like "U.S. Only," "U.S & Canada," and "Worldwide," and they take the easy choice. It's not cost. It's not much more to use the government mail for packages to Canada or Alaska. UPS is kind of steep to Alaska, as they base charges on distance, often generating significant differences for two shipments to the same state, depending on how far each address is from a UPS center. And it's kind of chore to use the UPS web site to check on cost of an international shipment so that you can quote an approximate rate in the offering. Although cost shouldn't bother the seller, since the buyer is paying, they may have had people balk at paying high shipping when the seller insists they use UPS only. People who use UPS exclusively can't, of course, ship to a P.O. box. Most people who order from other places understand about what it costs to ship to them. I imagine a lot of sellers will agree to ship to both places if asked.

I suspect a lot of it is just that people are dumb. (Noting that just about half are below average intelligence. New Mexico state agencies are accustomed to getting questions from prospective tourists asking if they need a passport and visa to visit.)


Title: Ebay, WTF, and shipping to CANADA.................
Post by: K0OD on October 23, 2009, 09:57:17 AM
My company shipped to Canada but the teriffs were high and products had to spend time in a customs broker. There are currency differences which not all Canadians understand. Then there are complex issues on returns.

Our Canadian orders tended to be smaller than USA ones. In our field, buyers there are less wealthy than their American counterparts. It was a wonderful moment for our shipping people a few years ago when we hauled down the Canadian flag from our site!

---
We do ship with no surcharge to Alaska, Hawaii, PR, Guam etc. UPS is outrageous and only USPS is feasible. But on heavier packages even the Post Office is very costly.

--------

The rest of the world... we want no part of. Too complex for the rare order (and tons of fraud) worldwide shipping would bring. There is no good way to verify overseas credit cards.

---------

Did you know that many of the largest and presumably smartest U.S. general merchandise sites don't export. Walmart didn't used to ship to Canada. (I'm not sure about now) No, Walmart isn't dumb!


Title: Ebay, WTF, and shipping to CANADA.................
Post by: K0OD on October 23, 2009, 10:26:52 AM
"I guess that people do not know what NAFTA is"

Should add that NAFTA doesn't mean free trade for all products.
 

Internet commerce is mostly about low prices. We sell dirt cheap but the tradeoff for the customer is diminished service. Exporting, checking out foreign credit worthiness, dealing with language differences, etc gum up the whole process.

MANY web retailers START OFF by selling the whole world and soon learn that most of the world is a scary and not very profitable place. Still, we get a couple of foreign fraud attempts (all very sizable) a month.

Back to Alaska, what do you think UPS drivers there get paid?  Would you want to deliver packages to the homes of Nome in winter in darkness at 20 below zero? They probably lose money on EVERY delivery in some rural areas.


Title: Ebay, WTF, and shipping to CANADA.................
Post by: NO2A on October 23, 2009, 02:44:54 PM
Imagine having a tower delivered to Nome,AK! Chances are you`d have to pick it up yourself. I`ll bet even Anchorage doesn`t have any H.R.O. dealers (or equivalent). Hey,if the buyer is willing to pay for shipping who cares?


Title: Ebay, WTF, and shipping to CANADA.................
Post by: K5END on October 23, 2009, 07:59:43 PM
I think they use dog sleds up there.

Each of the dogs has a little hat with the UPS logo on it.

The dogs are Union, of course.


Title: Ebay, WTF, and shipping to CANADA.................
Post by: K4DPK on October 24, 2009, 10:33:38 AM
If that's the same young lady I see in e-mails from time to time, dressed in a skimpy little UPS uniform and short pants, I know why no-one wants to send her up there.

She's not dressed for cold weather!

Phil C. Sr.
k4dpk


Title: Ebay, WTF, and shipping to CANADA.................
Post by: N2VPC on October 27, 2009, 09:31:08 AM
I don't ship outside the US anymore largely due to PayPal's no-questions-asked refund policy.  I have experienced scammers both here and abroad who receive the item and either claim "item not as described" and send back something else (like a rock of similar weight) or immediately do a chargeback through their credit card. I am left without my money (plus heavy shipping expenses) and my item. There is NO "seller protection" and PayPal's customer service is lousy.  For me it is more a mitigation of risk than anything else. Ted


Title: Ebay, WTF, and shipping to CANADA.................
Post by: N4CQR on October 28, 2009, 09:36:52 AM
Due to this very reason, I DO NOT ship anywhere other than to the US and US possessions and Canada. Unless it's to a APO/FPO.

I have had nothing but positive experences with CA purchasers. All were hams however. It seems that packages go to CA arrive quicker than packages comming from CA.

807!

C r a i g

---------------------------
I don't ship outside the US anymore largely due to PayPal's no-questions-asked refund policy. I have experienced scammers both here and abroad who receive the item and either claim "item not as described" and send back something else (like a rock of similar weight) or immediately do a chargeback through their credit card. I am left without my money (plus heavy shipping expenses) and my item. There is NO "seller protection" and PayPal's customer service is lousy. For me it is more a mitigation of risk than anything else. Ted
-----------------------------


Title: Ebay, WTF, and shipping to CANADA.................
Post by: W4TLN on October 28, 2009, 04:28:11 PM
PayPal certainly DOES have seller protection.
https://www.paypal.com/cgi-bin/webscr?cmd=xpt/Marketing/securitycenter/sell/SellerProtection-outside


Title: Ebay, WTF, and shipping to CANADA.................
Post by: W5DQ on October 29, 2009, 10:39:13 AM
Never sold anything for delivery in Canada but I have bought a couple items from Canadians. Had to pay a sizeable tariff on incoming items. Bought a TS-440S a few years ago from a ham in Quebec and ended up paying for the radio, UPS shipping fees and another US$25 charged by UPS (seperate billing about a month later) for tariffs, duties, whatever you want to call it. And it took an additional 10 days to get the item here to California above the standard week of waiting for the UPS driver to find the West coast.

I don't buy or sell outside the US no more due to events like these. Not worth the hassle when selling things on eBAY when you already are being gouged out the ying-yang by eBAY and Paypal fees.

Now having said that, not sure if the same duties and such still apply if one ships via USPS, FedEx or others outside the US. I would imagine they do. I ship pkgs only USPS Priority Mail or FedEX now if at all possible. I avoid UPS like the plague.


Title: Ebay, WTF, and shipping to CANADA.................
Post by: AA4PB on October 29, 2009, 12:26:19 PM
Actually I believe there is still an exemption for a limited amount of Amateur Radio gear for personal use (not resale) in the U.S. I've purchased equipment several times from other countries and not had to pay import duties because it was maked as Amateur Radio equipment.

When I ship stuff overseas I always mark the documents as Amateur Radio because some other countries also have import duty exemptions and that can save the buyer money.

I've shipped a lot of small items to hams overseas via first class USPS, uninsured with no special handling and only once had a problem. It often takes a couple of weeks but it gets there and the cost is a whole lot less than going UPS. Insurance in some places is half the value of the item! I find the cost and effort shipping to Canada to be not much more than shipping to the U.S. via first class - but that's for a small 2"x3"x5" box. A 40 lb radio may be a different story.


Title: Ebay, WTF, and shipping to CANADA.................
Post by: VE9AAE on October 29, 2009, 07:47:26 PM
W5DQ, I think you are referring to the brokerage fee.  UPS, DHL (and no doubt all the private couriers)charge such a fee- supposedly to 'research' what duties/tarrifs may or may not apply.  


I experienced such an incident when receiving a map software package from Garmin (a gratuity to make up for the trouble caused by a repeatedly defective product; no prob. since then, very happy with them now by the way).  Unfortunately, approx. a month later I received a rather sizable bill from the courier for "brokerage fees".  When I contacted them about it, in spite of the fact that it was listed as a gift and classified as duty free (and no duty was levied by Canada Customs) they informed me it was their policy that the research had to be done, thus the brokerage fee.  Ultimately Garmin covered the fee, but it took some telephone tag to sort it out.


To be honest, it seems a bit exorbitant based on the research required (5 minutes on the internet revealed the appropriate Govt. websites and info).
That is why now, if ordering/purchasing from the U.S. I  only use USPS, as they (and Canada Post) are much more reasonable with regard to fees, and to be honest I have NEVER had any problems with how my parcels have been physically treated.    


On another note; if the seller states that they don't sell outside the U.S. sometimes they MAY bend their rule upon request. If they refuse? So be it, don't buy from them!  


It's the vendor's prerogative where they will ship, and if they want to eliminate a potential market, well that's their loss (and potentially lower final price as a result of less available bidders/buyers).
Yeah, it sucks, but that's life. Just bring your business elsewhere to someone who will appreciate it.


Title: Ebay, WTF, and shipping to CANADA.................
Post by: VE3TMT on October 29, 2009, 08:29:35 PM
Again I'm still curious about the posters call sign?

Anyway dealing with the subject..I too get annoyed by sellers who will not ship to Canada. Shipping to Canada is no different than shipping in the US except you have to fill out an export declaration form. Big deal! As the shipper, you are not responsible for any taxes, import duties, brokerage fees or any other charges except for the shipping fees. If the shipping company tells you anything different, tell them to take a hike.

As for NAFTA, again it is a declaration that only applies to products manufactured in Mexico, USA or Canada. It has nothing to do with the shipper, but it may allow the receiver to pay a lesser rate on the duty fees when the shipment comes through Customs. Amateur radio equipment is duty free anyway, so a NAFTA declaration is pointless.

Brokerage fees are the responsibility of the receiver, and different shipping companies charge different rates. I have found UPS to be a rip-off, often paying more in duties than the item was worth. The US Post Office has very good rates.

PST and GST, the Provincial Sales Tax and the Goods & Services Tax are payable on all items coming into Canada regardless of the country of origin. Presently in Canada the combined rates are 13%. So for you numerically challenged folks out there that means if we buy a radio worth $1000.00 we have to pay an extra $130 in tax alone. That is why you may get asked to make a false claim on the value of the item being shipped. 13% of $500 is cheaper than 13% of a grand. This is considered mail fraud and is illegal to do. Regardless of whether I bought the goods or traded, the government still wants their money and I (the receiver) am responsible for paying it.

So really there is no valid reason for not shipping to Canada. As long as you have received payment for the goods, and can fill out a Customs Export Declaration everything else is seamless. I personally prefer to buy from Canadian hams as all we would have to pay is the shipping. Domestic shipments do not require any of the collections associated with cross-border shipping.

I have purchased many items from US hams and never had a single problem, aside from being ripped by UPS on brokerage fees. But lesson learned and I almost always ask the shipper to send the package by USPS. It's traceable, gets here in a reasonable time, and in one piece! As for hams buying from Canada, you may have fees to pay when your package arrives, I'm not too informed on your side of things, but again if the fees are going to be too costly, you walk away, but I bet it isn't too often.

73 and happy selling!


Title: Ebay, WTF, and shipping to CANADA.................
Post by: VE3PLO on October 29, 2009, 09:07:34 PM
"Again I'm still curious about the posters call sign?"

-There is no call sign for next month, that's why it says VE3 NEAR..
I am currently attending classes at VE3MIS club to get my license "properly" instead buying someone a case of beer and getting the license early.

As for whetever you said i totally agree. UPS is a misteake to ship oversees, most of the time the Duty fee is same amount as the item you purchased on ebay.

Few months ago i purchased a 4BTV antenna ( brand new in box ) from a very nice ham somewhere in lower states. The item sold on ebay for 110$, UPS charged me FUC********************************!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 65$ brokerage. Can you believe it???? Can you *************believe it?
 
Shipping through a UPS is a misteake. I find that DHL has very reasonable rates and USPS is a pleasure to deal with.

As for people being affraid/refusing to ship to Canada, its a lack of knowlege, or just being lazy :P to go to the USPS office and mail the package themselves instead of having UPS come and pick it up :P


Title: Ebay, WTF, and shipping to CANADA.................
Post by: VE3TMT on October 30, 2009, 03:51:56 AM
Congrats and hope you pass the exam. It's a great hobby!

I once sent an SGC-239 tuner back for repair after a cap smoked. SGC called me up and told me even though I wasn't the original owner, the unit was still under warranty and they would replace it no charge. They shipped a new one back with a value of $50 and UPS charged me $29 in brokerage fees! I called UPS and told them it was a return under warranty, and with a new invoice from SGC, they refunded the charge. Couldn't believe it. Three weeks after getting a TS850 sent up from Texas, I get a bill in the mail for $190 in brokerage. Unbelievable. I've never used them for cross  border shipping since.

73,
Max
VE3TMT