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eHam Forums => Antennas and Towers and more => Topic started by: VE1BWG on April 19, 2010, 06:49:44 PM



Title: Workable Antenna
Post by: VE1BWG on April 19, 2010, 06:49:44 PM
looking for an antenna that requires minimal foot print  and cost that can handle from 80 meters down to 10.  I have tuners and and ICOM 735

Thanks.


Title: RE: Workable Antenna
Post by: N3OX on April 19, 2010, 07:39:59 PM
That's way too little information.

What qualifies as a minimal footprint?  How much space do you have?  Does it have to be invisible too, or just small? 

What's your budget?  $20?  $200? 

How much do you actually care about talking a *lot* on 80?  Is that your favorite band?

Honestly, the best very small space antennas are homebrew ones that are designed to fill up the available space, and the cheapest ones take advantage of assets you already have.

73
Dan



Title: RE: Workable Antenna
Post by: K0OD on April 19, 2010, 09:55:39 PM
Got trees?


Title: RE: Workable Antenna
Post by: K2MK on April 20, 2010, 05:20:10 AM
A vertical might be a good choice. If you have some ground that permits you to bury radials, the initial footprint might seem large but once the radials are buried (thus out of sight) the final footprint will be quite small.


Title: RE: Workable Antenna
Post by: KH6AQ on April 20, 2010, 07:06:56 AM
Check out the Husterl 6BTV vertical at DX Engineering.


Title: RE: Workable Antenna
Post by: VE3WMB on April 20, 2010, 07:25:28 AM
If you have the space, it is hard to beat an 88 foot doublet fed with ladderline or open wire line, up at least 30 feet, as your only HF
antenna. LB Cebik documented this in an article called "If I could only have one wire".  Even if you have to droop the ends down, so long as the
middle half of the antenna is horizontal the impact will not be too significant. The advantage of the 88 ft length is that all of the major lobes will be broadside to the antenna so you can predict what the pattern will be.

As far as verticals go, I can also vouch for the Hustler BTV series .. very good value for the money but you will have to devote some time and effort to putting down some radials.

Michael VE3WMB


Title: RE: Workable Antenna
Post by: N3OX on April 20, 2010, 07:45:50 AM
Hopefully the OP will come back soon and tell us if "limited space" means a 20 foot square back yard, an apartment balcony, or what. In another thread he was looking at the TakTenna... so "limited space" might mean extremely limited.

If invisibility is not a requirement and there's some patch of dirt somewhere to put in even a small radial system, a vertical probably ends up being a good bet for most situations.  Only a couple square inches of footprint :-)


Title: RE: Workable Antenna
Post by: WB5JEO on April 20, 2010, 08:14:27 AM
I suppose this one is out. Too much footprint.
http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1412/1162156219_af49980d20.jpg (http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1412/1162156219_af49980d20.jpg)


Title: RE: Workable Antenna
Post by: VE1BWG on April 20, 2010, 08:14:48 AM
Area is about 60 by 50 and I have trees.  visibility is a problem but I think I can make my way around that.  All the locals are on 80 meters up here in Dartmouth.  $250.00  is doable for budget.

Thanks for the advice so far.


Title: RE: Workable Antenna
Post by: K0OD on April 20, 2010, 10:16:37 AM
"Got trees?"

Good.

Now, how high?

Huge difference in what one can do with one 15' tree versus, say, several nicely spaced ones 70' tall.


Title: RE: Workable Antenna
Post by: VE1BWG on April 20, 2010, 11:23:04 AM
about 50 ' high  only one.


Title: RE: Workable Antenna
Post by: K0OD on April 20, 2010, 12:46:17 PM
Now we're getting somewhere. 2 good choices:

All band doublet at 50' run in inverted V configuration fed with open wire into shack tuner. Radials not required. Great out to about 2,000 miles on 80. Excellent all around antenna on 40 on up. Quiet on receive compared with verticals.  
 

Or inverted L vertical 50' up and about 15' off to anther tree or even sloping downward to the ground. Needs some radials. Killer on DX, especially from VE1. Who needs locals!

Slingshot will get you a support line up 50'


Title: RE: Workable Antenna
Post by: VE1BWG on April 20, 2010, 02:14:27 PM
Should I put a tuner on the  doublette?


Title: RE: Workable Antenna
Post by: VE1BWG on April 20, 2010, 02:15:30 PM
Thanks for the help.

VE1 BWG


Title: RE: Workable Antenna
Post by: K0OD on April 20, 2010, 03:48:59 PM
There's lots about "all band doublets" on the web.

For example
http://www.hamuniverse.com/hfdoublet.html

If you can get the apex up 40 feet or more this will be an excellent and very cheap all band antenna. Like any dipole it will have nulls on the ends where performance will be  a bit worse. (if possible mount it so your friends, or favored directions, for example Europe, are broadside). On the higher bands the directional qualities may be somewhat irregular. But overall, a very good performer.  

Main disadvantage of a doublet is the need for a tuner (which you already have) and the difficulty your installation may present in bringing the twin-lead into the radio room so it doesn't get too near metal (like gutters).

My experience with such antennas is that they usually work better than verticals, especially on receive. No radials are required for dipoles/doublets.


Title: RE: Workable Antenna
Post by: K5TEN on April 20, 2010, 05:28:17 PM
I'm lucky.  I live on a mountainside with plenty of 75' pines, a 65' oak, and some 50' hickory trees.  

I could put a wire vertical in the pines for 80/75m, but it's not one of my favorite bands anymore.

I did put up a 43' wire vertical with 4 33' elevated radials for an elevated wire ground plane.  Works absolutely beyond expectations.  Maybe $30 worth of wire and $25 invested in coax.  It's a monster on 40m, does very well on 60m, and I can do QRP on 40m and 30m with 3 watts and can't be more elated.  It's 5/8wave on 20m and I have squeezed into pile-ups on DX with the big dogs with the KW's and towers and yagis and got the well-timed contact.

Up until I put this up, I was one of those "anti-vertical" hams who was adamant about yagis and horizontal dipoles.  If your deal is to work the maritime provinces on 80m in the evenings, I'd go with a dipole as best as you could, but it you are looking for a great DX antenna on the cheap that the folks in the maritimes could easily hear you during the day on 40m and you could work into VK/ZL late at night with 100w SSB...the elevated ground plane vertical is a nice weapon in the arsenal.

Good Luck!