The majority of "dual band" j-poles are really single band 2m j-poles which load well on 70cm- but radiate into the ground & sky rather than to the horizon where most needed on that 70cm. Google "Fong j-pole" and look at the plans for a more effective & genuinely dual band j-pole. The difference? A phasing section which improves the 70cm radiation so it is greatest at the horizon. Easy enough to build from TV twin lead, although he may still sell them upon request. If you are running higher power levels you may not care, but these do a much better job when using an HT and you are a ways from the repeater.

Stu AF6IT

The answer won't be RG58! You don't mention the bands you plan on using. For HF use without a big amplifier RG8X would be much more appropriate yet still slender & inexpensive. Its what I use. There ARE better, but for me it is good enough and much less lossy than 58. "Best" can mean different things to different folks and depends upon your budget and other needs. Hardline or Heliax are options for those needing very high end performance and can afford it. For long UHF runs it will matter most. HF is more forgiving. So the answer for now is.... "it depends..."

Stu AF6IT

Have you checked it CW mode to make sure it has no output? The mic element could've gone open like MANY others have found. This would be check #1 even before the caps.

Stu AF6IT

Wow, this thread is an old one!

There are many choices, and most are viable. That is- even older gear can get the job done and if you are happy with it why not?

I posted a couple years ago or more (as KD6NEM) that I was looking carefully at this same choice. I wound up with a Ten-Tec Argonaut 516. Splendid rig, though not for everyone. It is now "obsolete" in that it is out of production since some components are no longer available, although many of its features have only recently been copied by Yaesu. This "old" rig has IF DSP which means its filters work better than most and require no optional add-ons. Ever. Well, now Yaesu now has what I regard to be the best bang for the buck by far- the FT-450. I do not own one, have played with one, and just admire them. It simply puts the 857 & 897 to shame except for its lack of 2m & 70cm. Honestly, if you are into HF you ought not let that affect your decision any more than superiority of the 450's performance while remaining bargain basement priced. As cheap or cheaper than the 857/897. Yet it'll run circles around them in several ways.

So I remain puzzled at why the FT-857/897 (or for that matter the IC-706)remain so popular still. Now my out of production Argonaut has some of the best of both worlds with real knobs and basically no endless menus so it has a traditional radio feel in some ways, while its filters are excellent. Only 20W which does NOT leave me feeling handicapped, but as I said earlier it is not a rig for everyone. But some of these more popular radios today have comparably poor filters AND have way too many nuisance menus to hassle through. And these cost more than better newer designs! Just does not compute to me. YMMV.

ALL rigs offer certain strengths and certain compromises, so pick what seems best within your budget. One last tidbit- used radios can offer a lot if priced reasonably enough. (A buddy just picked up an old Kenwood TS-450 cheap- NICE radio!) Know that some parts may not be readily replaceable. But above all- understand that most rigs build after roughly 2004 (give or take) are assembled with lead free solder. Google NASA & RoHS & have a peek at NASA's website devoted to this issue. You'll see that the expected life span of any electronic device assembled with this stuff which also utilizes fine pitch surface mount technology has a resulting finite life span. It becomes absolute GARBAGE once the tin whiskers start growing long enough to start multiple short circuits. That means somewhere between 5 to 10 years after MANUFACTURE it WILL drop dead- unrepairably so. So beware a "great" deal on any very recent used rig which is 5 years old or greater. Unless you plan on using it for a rather expensive paperweight or door stop!

Stu AF6IT

What doesn't Mike have on that website?

http://www.repeater-builder.com/radio-shack/radio-shack-index.html

Excellent site! It is my first stop for info on my Motorola Maxtrac & my Astron power supply too! I failed to notice his Rad Shack section... That site is like an entire library for several sorts of radios from the past few decades.

de AF6IT

I have one of these on my bench to repair for a buddy. Not a bad rig for SSB, but I suspect (but haven't fully verified) that it may not be frequency stable enough for digital modes. Or at least this one doesn't seem to be based upon casual observation. There are a few tricks which can help, though- like enclosing & insulating the oscillator crystal & even putting a resistor fed by the power supply on it to keep it warmer than ambient so thermal swings cannot influence it much.

de AF6IT

Pity no one mentioned Ed Fong's dual band J-pole. It most certainly does work both bands far more efficiently than any rubber duck. At least as good as a quarter wave ground plane on both bands as I recall. There were a couple different articles in QST- for a fixed version and a roll up version. Google Fong J-pole to find the articles. Ed uses a phasing section to keep the radiation pattern pointed at the horizon unlike a 2m J-pole being used on 70cm. I adapted mine to use RG-58 for the stub rather than the RG-174 used in many of Ed's. I hit repeaters FB using only milliwatts. No need for two antennas using one of these.

Stu AF6IT

Thanks Alan, was very helpful. I chose to not even waste my time on the front pillar based upon your advice. In the process of getting to the back pillar of this 1990 four door I discovered that there is probably room in the middle pillar.

My new Ace Hardware hole saw was proven to be defective but not before drilling the pilot hole. A small square of duct tape seals the pilot hole as the mount awaits a better tool to finish the job. I'll need to exchange the junk blade for one that is not off center. Wish I'd have spent the extra money for the Antenex NMO saw!

I find the existing "1U plus pocket" WEDO brand stereo mount to be pure garbage. The only structural strength is from a couple obscene gobs of some tough black RTV and some clear "shoe goo" RTV on the pocket. The existing stereo mostly just lays there on top of the pocket. Shall I pay $20+ for another piece of plastic & glue garbage? I think not. Think I'll get the sheet metal shears out & cannibalize some of the thin sheet metal from an old junk PC tower. Might take time but at least it shouldn't cost me $20 for a dollar's worth of inferior materials waiting to fail.

So yet another 1-2 hour job is being spread out over several weekends...

My 1990 Acura Integra is 20 years old and still an excellent car- I understand essentially a spiffed up Honda Civic. So how in blazes do I get the coax from my NMO soon to be in the center of the roof to the radio up front? This era Acura had the motorized shoulder belts- an obvious obstacle. Anyone ever do it? What is the best route for the coax? Is there enough room in the A pillars? How does one even get into the edge of the roof liner with all that hardware in the way? Seems that the folks at the Honda/Acura forums have no clue.

Thanks,

Stu AF6IT

Which is more important, packaging or substance? The FT-450 is twice as much radio as any 857 or 897 yet costs a lot less. I'm wondering why Yaesu is even still selling those older ones. Must be people are still buying them despite their aged design. Is the 2m & 70cm coverage really that important? Once one experiences the IF DSP filters in the 450 it would be hard to go back to primitive as well as more expensive!

Stu AF6IT

Alan,

For significant major purchases I use 5 years as the guesstimate since it represents the worst case scenario. Agreed that cell phones are considered disposable and do not factor in here. If I get 7, 8, or 10 years from a major purchase these days- well that is icing on the cake! You've probably seen NASA's RoHS lead free solder pages. I know my five year figure is not the median number, and for a low end HT I wouldn't worry. Many hundreds of dollars though and I plan for worst case. Some have enough free cash to not have to worry about it, but this is not how I live.  

As to radios, my old TH-46 was the most user friendly HT I ever owned. Had I not killed it good it might still be working today, no doubt with a couple new encoders being installed along the way. I loved it because it had a lot of buttons which meant that most functions were only a couple keystrokes away at most. All the many new wonderful features available today don't impress me enough to make me voluntarily want to give up the user friendliness which used to be designed into the simpler rigs. Used to be we could expect a minimum of ten years use from a radio, and many gave twice that. And I only speak of synthesized transistor architecture. Obviously there is still plenty of even older stuff from when things were easy to repair in the pre-SMT days. Yes, technology has never been smaller, cheaper, and more capable than now. But long lived and user friendly it ain't!

Stu AF6IT

Thanks Alan. I'm really looking for something I could horse trade for at an upcoming ham swap meet. I have certainly noticed the Icom & Yaesu you mentioned, but a few more knobs and a few less menus would not be all bad. And I am doing my best to boycott anything I can which is made with lead free solder. A nominal five year life span is a ridiculous price to pay for silly politics with little genuine environmental benefit.

How are converted commercial rigs for 70cm looking these days? That would probably be quite acceptable even so long as it is reasonably easy to re-program freqs. I know there'd be no VFO, but I figure if I could throw in a couple simplex freqs along with my favorite repeaters I'd be happy.

What is the purpose of sizing a fuse at twice the typical load? Protecting the fuse? I thought the purpose was to protect the radio & car's wiring. I would use the same rating as what the manufacturer specified.

After so many years of surviving with just HT's for my mobile needs I am considering looking for a used mobile rig. Simple is great, don't care for multiple nested menus. A sturdy well designed & dependable rig- made BEFORE the stupid RoHS thing took lead out of solder. Have a leaning towards ICOM, dual band would be nice but 70cm is more important than 2m if I must choose. High power is NOT required. Desire just one single antenna connector.

What are the "classics" made before 2004 I should be looking for? Anyone?

Thanks,

Stu AF6IT

Not so much more expensive at all when you consider what adding the filters & TXCO add to the cost of the 706!