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Author Topic: question on working split  (Read 13657 times)
HS0ZFQ
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« on: February 24, 2015, 05:26:26 AM »

Greetings :
      Periodically I get confused when I hear a cw station say up 2,3 or 5.
If I am listening on 14.125 how far do I go up to transmit? If he says up 3 do I go to 14.128 and transmit from there? If I am listening on 14.200 do I transmit on 14.203 if he says " up three". Thanks for any advice
Richard
HS0ZFQ
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N3QE
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« Reply #1 on: February 24, 2015, 05:45:00 AM »

Slightly more appropriate group for this would be the "DX" section of this site. Especially as those examples you give sure look like phone frequencies :-). (Who knows, maybe they are CW frequencies in HS0-land!)

Yes, the DX will send their "listening frequency", often as an offset like "up 3", but other times they will send the last 2 or 3 digits of their listening frequency.

Often the split is only a suggested range and not an exact number.

On CW at least if they say "up 5" that usually means they are listening anywhere from 1 to 10 up.

On CW getting a little off the pileup (just a few hundred Hz will do for many garden-variety pileups) will help you be heard vs all the other signals zero-beat with each other.
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AC2EU
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« Reply #2 on: February 24, 2015, 06:29:37 AM »

Slightly more appropriate group for this would be the "DX" section of this site. Especially as those examples you give sure look like phone frequencies :-). (Who knows, maybe they are CW frequencies in HS0-land!)

Yes, the DX will send their "listening frequency", often as an offset like "up 3", but other times they will send the last 2 or 3 digits of their listening frequency.

Often the split is only a suggested range and not an exact number.

On CW at least if they say "up 5" that usually means they are listening anywhere from 1 to 10 up.

On CW getting a little off the pileup (just a few hundred Hz will do for many garden-variety pileups) will help you be heard vs all the other signals zero-beat with each other.

Splits don't make much sense to me either! As you say, he can be listening anywhere, and I can be sitting there pounding away to a void for all I know. If the OP says up 5, sometimes there are responders all the way from to calling frequency to 5K and beyond!! There even some who try below the caller.
It all seems like crazyness to me....
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N4KD
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Posts: 194




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« Reply #3 on: February 24, 2015, 07:10:24 AM »

Before I start calling at the split, I listen to the pileup a lot. It gives me an idea of where the dx is looking in the pileup and what sort of a pattern he's following. Then I try to call the dx just where he answered his last contact, or actually slightly off, since I'm not the only one that practices this.

I don't know any other strategy that will help with pileups that are 30 KHz wide.

vy 73,
Dave N4KD
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N8XI
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Posts: 278




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« Reply #4 on: February 24, 2015, 09:10:37 AM »

Here is some info.

http://www.idiompress.com/books-complete-dxer.html

No affiliation, it covers a lot of ground about DXing.
Several methods of trying to work DX.


http://www.k7ua.com/uploads/4/9/9/0/4990079/new_dxers_handbook_second_edition_01-29-2015_optimized.pdf

Check out Chapter 5 "Split Operation...
Especially "How do I make myself heard in a pileup?"

73, Rick - N8XI
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AC2EU
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« Reply #5 on: February 24, 2015, 04:04:09 PM »

Before I start calling at the split, I listen to the pileup a lot. It gives me an idea of where the dx is looking in the pileup and what sort of a pattern he's following. Then I try to call the dx just where he answered his last contact, or actually slightly off, since I'm not the only one that practices this.

I don't know any other strategy that will help with pileups that are 30 KHz wide.

vy 73,
Dave N4KD

There is a guy in our club who uses this method and claims that he can he can bag the DX with QRP ( high power is 12 watts for him).
None the less, it's a VERY tedious process at any power level...
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PA0WV
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« Reply #6 on: February 24, 2015, 04:08:54 PM »



I don't know any other strategy that will help with pileups that are 30 KHz wide.

vy 73,
Dave N4KD

When during your key down you switch your transmitter fast (400 Hz) on and off you get a lot of sideband components separated 400 Hz when the on time is not equal the off time. So you can make a lot of equivalent CW signals over the width of 30 kHz and you will be heard , I suppose so.
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M0LEP
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« Reply #7 on: February 25, 2015, 02:36:27 AM »

I don't know any other strategy that will help with pileups that are 30 KHz wide.

My strategy for pile-ups that wide is to leave the pack to fight among itself, and find something more interesting to do...

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W0WCA
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« Reply #8 on: February 25, 2015, 03:08:13 AM »

Richard the direct answer to your question is yes, you have the numbers right in as much as when he says listening up 3 it means 3 KC's.
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PA0WV
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« Reply #9 on: February 25, 2015, 10:25:36 AM »

listening up 3 it means 3 KC's.

3 Kilocoulomb's  ?
« Last Edit: February 25, 2015, 10:31:53 AM by PA0WV » Logged

AC2EU
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« Reply #10 on: February 25, 2015, 02:18:35 PM »

I don't know any other strategy that will help with pileups that are 30 KHz wide.

My strategy for pile-ups that wide is to leave the pack to fight among itself, and find something more interesting to do...



I have the same strategy!...even for split pileups that are 1khz wide  Grin
They would have to be giving me cash money prizes for the QSO before I will deal with that kind of tedium.  Roll Eyes
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WO7R
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« Reply #11 on: February 26, 2015, 12:06:02 AM »

Quote
Periodically I get confused when I hear a cw station say up 2,3 or 5.

You've been given a gift.  "up 2" always means 2 KHz above where he or she is transmitting.

Operators do this for a variety of reasons.  One is that the pileup is dying down and so they want to hear more "action" in their headphones.

Other times, they are hearing plenty, but have decided that, none the less, the pileup is getting too wide and want everyone to refocus.  Amazingly, not everyone does.

In any case, this is something you need to take advantage of because if they say it, then 95 per cent of the time, they mean it.  The last 5 percent simply means he or she has the "up 2" programmed into his or her macro, in which case, you still have to figure where the DX is really listening.

But, when an op gives a number, I always take it very seriously.  Even if the op has forgot that he or she isn't actually listening "up 2", they are often close by, but usually right on.  It's a strong percentage play to take it seriously.

Of course, you can't count on them staying exactly "up 2" for very long, which is why you have to get right on it.
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N4KD
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« Reply #12 on: February 26, 2015, 07:36:57 AM »

...
In any case, this is something you need to take advantage of because if they say it, then 95 per cent of the time, they mean it.  The last 5 percent simply means he or she has the "up 2" programmed into his or her macro, in which case, you still have to figure where the DX is really listening.

But, when an op gives a number, I always take it very seriously.  Even if the op has forgot that he or she isn't actually listening "up 2", they are often close by, but usually right on.  It's a strong percentage play to take it seriously.

Of course, you can't count on them staying exactly "up 2" for very long, which is why you have to get right on it.

Funny you say that... I was working a DX station that kept saying he was listening up. Everyone was answering on his frequency, he was working them, and no one was there representing the UP police. After competing in the huge K1N pileups, I was reluctant to just call on his frequency. Eventually, I called very slightly UP and he answered. That does happen, but the odd part is that the very next station I worked was sending UP, but again, listening simplex.

vy 73,
Dave N4KD
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