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Author Topic: Old Hustlers vs Ham Sticks and similar? Other cheap ones (except Screwdrivers)?  (Read 17374 times)
N6QWP
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Posts: 421




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« Reply #15 on: January 07, 2018, 08:35:55 AM »

Thanx for the various replies, so far.  The multisection whip was acquired at a swapmeet, so no repeatable source.

As I mentioned, hanging wire is usually not an alterative at these coastal camping areas....unless it is in one area of densely overgrown brush and small trees that create an overhead canopy.  These spots make it nearly impossible to avoid the interaction and losses of running the antenna wire all trough the branches and leaves (it is though, sometimes possible to maneuver a longer whip up through them).

Other spots do have an opening in the middle of the parking spaces that makes for a good opening for the whip....while others have no trees around....just spaces in the open.  

The spaces are short (no room for long wire antennas to run), surrounded by a loop roadway that prevents extending the antennas across the road to low trees on the other side (high RV's navigate and are higher than wire could run.

So, I am relegated to using a vertical whip....trying to better the results of a Hustler or Ham Stick.  I guess I will just have to experiment with a tuner, the next time i go there.  This creates the problem of having the tuner back at the radio....before the coax run of around 20' or so to the antenna.  (16' whip on 40 phone).

The idea of mounting a high frequency (10, 15 or 20?) Hustler whip on top and pruning it to 40 just popped into my head?

I don't want the bulk and hassle of erecting a commercial aluminum vertical each time.
I appreciate any ideas or experiences that can help in this type of situation.
« Last Edit: January 07, 2018, 08:58:03 AM by N6QWP » Logged
N6QWP
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Posts: 421




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« Reply #16 on: January 07, 2018, 09:50:40 AM »

G8YMW--Thanx for those informative links!  Just read them and much valuable info.
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NA4IT
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« Reply #17 on: January 08, 2018, 03:31:45 AM »

My first HF mobile was a Hustler setup. Homebrew 54" copper pipe stalk, with a 4 position adapter plate on top. In the center I had a 48" whip, with resonators for 17, 20, 40, and 75M. It looked like an upside down tree, but I could work any station I could hear. The rig was a Yaesu FT-900 mobile with the built in autotuner.

Worked Germany on 17M at 9AM in Fernandina Beach, FL, and Key West to Athens TN with S-9+10 signal on 20M at 12 noon. Also checked into the TN Phone net on 3.980MHz every morning, from Islamorada, FL.

The setup was on a Mercury Mountaineer, that had a class 3 hitch on it. A tube extended out past the body on the drivers side, and had a support stalk welded on it that the 3/8-24 mirror mount was attached on the bottom, and Delrin insulator on top for the Hustler stalk to be run through. This gave the antenna the needed support.

By the way, if you haven't figured it out, the antenna worked 10M also. 54" stalk + 48" whip = 102 inches... 1/4 wave on 10M (with the autotuner). The setup would work all of 10, 17, 20 and 40M, with a 50kcs past resonance or so of 75M.

I didn't use any fancy matching stuff at the bottom of the antenna, but behind the taillight, there was a wound coax choke.

I later switched to an Icom 706MKIIG and a K4POZ screwdriver.
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KB2WIG
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« Reply #18 on: January 08, 2018, 01:53:03 PM »



FWIW, when your parked, add a few radials to your antenna. Cant hurt and it might help a bit.


KLC
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EXTRALight  1/3 less WPM than a Real EXTRA
N6QWP
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Posts: 421




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« Reply #19 on: January 08, 2018, 04:28:57 PM »

Thanx, but.....Hard to do at the beach (sand) and only one parking space.....and the need for a clear all around walking area for at night, plus the fact that a van has a pretty good footprint and lots of metal for a counterpoise, makes it impractical....and probably not really necessary?
« Last Edit: January 08, 2018, 04:50:11 PM by N6QWP » Logged
AA4PB
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« Reply #20 on: January 08, 2018, 05:24:17 PM »

I think the Hustler has a bit less loss than a Hamstick. The extra loss in the Hamstick makes it have a lower SWR, in my experience. An antenna that length has an impedance around 25 Ohms. The resistance of the small wire plus the resistance in the ground system adds to this. If, for example, you have and SWR of 1:1 (50 Ohms) then you have about 25 Ohms of resistive loss. That means half the transmit power gets converted to heat instead of being radiated.

With a Hustler I found that a 2:1 UNUN at the base provided a nice match to 50 Ohms - and it worked well on all bands (with the proper loading coil installed). The parallel capacitor trick also works but you need a different capacitor value for different bands.

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Bob  AA4PB
Garrisonville, VA
W8JX
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« Reply #21 on: January 08, 2018, 07:01:04 PM »

That means half the transmit power gets converted to heat instead of being radiated.

Its all relative though because as much as half sounds like, it is only 3db which is barely discernible on S meter
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Ham since 1969....  Old School 20wpm REAL Extra Class..
AD4U
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Posts: 2483




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« Reply #22 on: January 10, 2018, 09:10:42 AM »

I often drive alone between lower SC to Va to visit my grandchildren. To pass the time on the 7 hour trip, I use 40M SSB. Now that the higher bands are not in great shape, I get GREAT performance from a Hustler 54" mast, a 30M coil, and a LONGER whip to resonate it in the 40M band. The ball mount is mounted in the center of the bed on my old Nissan pickup truck. The steel truck bed is not the best ground plane on 40M, but it is better than most other ground planes on a mobile. Yes this contraction is long and it is not pretty, but it works great.

Sometime you will see me on I-95 with a Honda 3000W generator in the truck bed. That powers a SB-200 amp in the passenger seat.

Most people do not think I am in a mobile. I can work most anything I can hear, including DX.

Dick AD4U
« Last Edit: January 10, 2018, 09:16:04 AM by AD4U » Logged
W8JX
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Posts: 12619




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« Reply #23 on: January 11, 2018, 04:51:29 AM »


Sometime you will see me on I-95 with a Honda 3000W generator in the truck bed. That powers a SB-200 amp in the passenger seat.


Ever consider a inverter with a few extra batteries to power amp? It  would be a lot more stealth so to speak.
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--------------------------------------
Ham since 1969....  Old School 20wpm REAL Extra Class..
N6QWP
Member

Posts: 421




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« Reply #24 on: January 11, 2018, 09:23:09 AM »

Anyone happen to remember the benefits of having the little ball tips on the ends of the adjustable wire elements on these antennas?  I seem to remember something about coronal discharge at high power.....or static buildup while moving???

How about the down side of not having one (under normal power of 50-100 watts)?  Or while at rest?

Thinking of maybe using longer wire elements for the Hustler coils as in the example cited above by AD4U....if I can find some stiff enough that will work.  (Longer is better?) 

AD4U--What length did you use?  Where did you find them?
« Last Edit: January 11, 2018, 09:43:17 AM by N6QWP » Logged
AD4U
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Posts: 2483




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« Reply #25 on: January 11, 2018, 04:05:28 PM »

I have a complete set Hustler resonators for bands 40-10M. The 40M antenna uses a 30M resonator with about a 5+ foot long whip coming out of the 30M coil.  It took that length to make the 30M Hustler resonator resonate on 40M. I could post a picture of the antenna but I do not know how to do that. It is TALL but it does not hit bridges on the interstate.

If anybody is interested in the exact lengths, I will post them. I used a MFJ antenna analyzer to get the lengths in the ball park. The 20M antenna uses a 15M resonator with a very long whip.

IMO both antennas work much better than the standard Hustler antennas. Every dB you can get on a HF mobile is a help.

Dick  AD4U.
 
PS: Several weeks ago, I was parked in front of the local post office with the engine off. I was listening on 20 waiting to the PO to open. I heard a VK calling CQ. I answered with only the 17 year old 100W Yaesu 100D rig in my truck. The VK came right back to me with S7. We spoke for 5+ minutes. IMO the band was not in great condition but I made the contact.
« Last Edit: January 11, 2018, 04:15:58 PM by AD4U » Logged
N6QWP
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Posts: 421




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« Reply #26 on: January 12, 2018, 06:47:08 AM »

My last question, again.....where did you get the longer whips?  What are they made from?
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AD4U
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Posts: 2483




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« Reply #27 on: January 12, 2018, 01:30:55 PM »

I got my whips at hamfests. At some of the larger ones there are several people selling just whips at different lengths. They are replacement whips. Buy the longest ones that will fit in the hole in the Hustler coil. You can always cut them off, but you cannot stretch them. I think the whip on my 30 coil that resonates it in the 40M band is 5+ long. Keep looking. Sooner or later you will find that you need.

Dick AD4U
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G8YMW
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« Reply #28 on: January 12, 2018, 06:14:35 PM »

The CB emporium 15 miles from me sells whips so I can see that happening over there.
I think most if not all will be stainless so no problem with corrosion
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73 de Tony
Windows 10:  Making me profane since March 2017
KA4NMA
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Posts: 537




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« Reply #29 on: January 19, 2018, 10:45:41 AM »

How to mount a hustler mast on a Toyota Yaris ?
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