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Author Topic: "regualar" two way communication?  (Read 1314 times)
BADAIM1
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Posts: 7




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« on: June 14, 2005, 08:10:34 AM »

I was wondering if there are any radios on the market that can also work with the "regular" frequencies such as the "talk a bout" ones from Motorola . I was wondering because besides "hamming" I would also like a radio that can function as a two way radio and I need a radio that can function on the same level as the radios such as the talk a bout ones. I was wondering if there are any radios that can meet this requirement that costs under $160? I was looking at Yaesu's line of radios and was wondering if the FT60R would be suitable for this task? Thank!
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KB4QAA
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« Reply #1 on: June 14, 2005, 09:15:23 AM »

Are there ham radios capable of operating on other radio service frequencies such as GMRS, FMRS, and commercial frequencies?  Yes.  If you modify them for "out of band" operation.

Is is legal for you to operate on these other frequencies with a modified ham radio?  No.  

Why?  Two reasons:  1. Ham radios are not FCC type certificated for commercial use.  2. Ham radios allow the operator to change the frequency from the control point, which is prohibited under commercial operations.  

73,

Bill
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K1CJS
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Posts: 5875




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« Reply #2 on: June 14, 2005, 10:35:00 AM »

Radios certified for use in the ham radio bands cannot legally be used in any other bands.  On the other hand, commercial radios made for use in business or public service bands can be used in the ham bands.

The "talkabout" or talkaround radios you are I believe you are actually cell phones, and work on those frequencies.  There are attachments available that 'convert' these phones to what seem like two way radios, but there are no rigs or sets on the market that can do both.  

Remember, cell phone frequencies are blocked on conventional receivers.
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K1CJS
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« Reply #3 on: June 14, 2005, 10:37:18 AM »

Oh, boy.  The first setence in the second paragraph of my last post should have read:

"The "talkabout" or talkaround radios you are referring to, I believe, are actually cell phones, and work on those frequencies.
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N6AJR
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« Reply #4 on: June 14, 2005, 11:09:36 AM »

in other words its illegal for you to use a modified ham radio on any band other than a ham band that you have the corect license for.  you can not modify a 5 watt HT or a 50 watt mobile rig to get better coverage from a fmrs radio.

 they put out 500 mills for a reason. they are ment for short distance, non commerical family style communications.

If you want to use more power or more bands, get your self a ham license.

The FCC wil smack you big time if you run out of band.
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W0FM
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« Reply #5 on: June 14, 2005, 11:16:21 AM »

Hi,

The "Talkabout" radios from Motorola are not cell phones, nor do they operate on the same frequencies as cell phones.  Talkabout radios are FRS (Family Radio Service) radios that operate at very low power on channelized UHF (460 MHz)frequencies.  (Some models also include GMRS (General Mobile Radio Service) channels, which are also in the UHF band.  They are meant for short range casual, "keep in touch" type conversations once confined to the 11 meter CB band.

73,

Terry, WØFM
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K1CJS
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« Reply #6 on: June 14, 2005, 02:59:16 PM »

Terry,

Thanks for clearing that up for me--I was aware that Motorola had other radios but was not aware of those.  I did know they sometimes called their walkie talkie feature 'talkaround'.  Guess I got them confused.

Thanks and 73.
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KC8VWM
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« Reply #7 on: June 14, 2005, 07:19:15 PM »

1) Assuming your a ham you can for example use a typical FCC type accepted commercial Motorola "like" two way radio for operation on ham radio frequencies.

2) However a "ham radio" specifically manufactured and FCC type accepted for the sole intended purpose of operating on ham radio bands is not permitted for use as a "dual" purpose radio in another service like FRS.

An FRS radio can be legally used and modified for use on amateur radio bands however, similarly it is also not considered to be a dual service radio device and therefore it may not be modified beyond it's FCC certification for "dual" purpose (Ham /FRS) operation.
 
Another more common example is a CB radio that has been modified for 10 meter operation. This is permitted by FCC rules, However, once modified, the equipment may never be used on CB radio frequencies any longer.

In short, once the original FCC type accepted equipment has been converted from it's original intended use, it voids the FCC type acceptance for that particular equipment and it must never be operated on it's originally intended band again.

The only exception to this rule I am aware of is certain VHF/UHF commercial radio equipment. For example, a VHF Motorola repeater may be setup to operate on VHF amateur radio bands and then later it may be sold by the owner and returned back to normal VHF/UHF business band operation. This is provided that the equipment is returned back to it's original operating specifications and the emission standards are certified by an FCC licensed radio technician. (Not a ham operator)

However the repeater system may in no instance be permitted to function as both a business band and amateur radio repeater at the same time using the same equipment.
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BADAIM1
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« Reply #8 on: June 14, 2005, 08:06:31 PM »

Wow! Thanks for all the info, guys. Pretty much all I was asking is that is there a radio that can pick up the frequencies that those "Talkabout" type (those short range "family" radios) and still function as a regular "ham" radio (communicating long distances). I was not meant on modding anything (I'd probably electrocute myself in the process Sad ). Would the FT-60R from Yaesu be able to pick up those freqs? Thanks guys!
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OBSERVER11
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« Reply #9 on: June 14, 2005, 08:34:58 PM »

you will be able to receive on the FT-60, but if you do modify the FT-60 and if you do choose to operate illegally, just remember that most of the newer services use narrow band FM (2.5kHz deviation) and the FT-60 is 5kHz and will not hear the FT-60 because you will be transmitting outside the receivers bandwidth.
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BADAIM1
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« Reply #10 on: June 14, 2005, 09:28:52 PM »

So just to clarify things before I shell out $200, I could pick up all the freqs that the "family" radios uses, right? Thanks a millions, guys!
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KB1LKR
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Posts: 1899




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« Reply #11 on: June 14, 2005, 09:45:24 PM »

Yes indeed the FT-60 can be used to monitor FRS, GMRS, MURS, as well as AM aviation (108-136 MHz), VHF & UHF public safety bands (including those in the lower end of the UHF TV band), the 1.25m and 33cm ham bands, marine VHF, NOAA (& Canadian)weather broadcasts, etc.

It also may be set for either 5 kHz or 2.5 kHz deviation via one of its setting menu items.

BTW it's a nice H-T!
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WA9SVD
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« Reply #12 on: June 15, 2005, 12:56:05 AM »

To sum it up, NO, you won't find a radio that will do both FRS and/or GMRS) and Amateur Frequencies (legally.)  However, many of the Amateur Radio H-T's DO have extended receive, capability, and you would be able to at listen to the FRS or GMRS.
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KE4SKY
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Posts: 1045


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« Reply #13 on: June 15, 2005, 05:04:00 AM »

IF you have a GMRS license, AND if you are using a type-accepted radio which is allowed on the GMRS bands, it is legal for a GMRS station to communicate with an FRS station using one of the seven common interstitial simplex frequencies which are shared between the two services, as stated below:

Before the
FEDERAL COMMUNICATIONS COMMISSION
Washington, D. C. 20554

In the Matter of WT Docket No. 95-102) RM-8499
Amendment of Part 95 of the )
Commission's Rules to )
MEMORANDUM OPINION AND ORDER

Adopted: October 30, 1998 Released: November 9, 1998

By the Commission:

[...]

25. We agree it is very likely that GMRS stations and FRS units,
when they hear each other, will communicate with each other. We also
believe that allowing GMRS stations and FRS units to exchange
messages on the seven channels they share, particularly in emergency
situations, furthers our goals of maximizing efficient use of the
radio spectrum and promoting public safety. However, we find it
unnecessary to amend the rules as Trahos suggests. The rules to
which Trahos cites as prohibiting GMRS stations from communicating
with FRS units do not apply to the classes of GMRS land stations
that are authorized to transmit on channels that are shared with FRS
units. GMRS stations, which are authorized by rule to share the 462
MHz interstitial channels with FRS units, are mobile stations and
small base stations transmitting voice type emissions with
relatively low power. Typically, these stations are transmitting the
same type of communications as FRS units. The rules already permit
GMRS station operators to transmit the same messages as FRS units
and GMRS stations are not prohibited from communicating with FRS
units. Nevertheless, we clarify, that GMRS and FRS units operating
on the same frequencies may communicate with each other if the
individual operators so choose.

- - - - Here are the frequencies used for FRS:

Ch - -  Freq.MHz - - - GMRS Shared?
1  - - - 462.5625 - - -  Yes
2  - - - 462.5875 - - -  Yes
3  - - - 462.6125 - - -  Yes
4  - - - 462.6375 - - -  Yes
5  - - - 462.6625 - - -  Yes
6  - - - 462.6875 - - -  Yes
7  - - - 462.7125 - - -  Yes
8  - - - 467.5625 - - -  No
9  - - - 467.5875 - - -  No
10 - - - 467.6125 - - -  No
11 - - - 467.6375 - - -  No
12 - - - 467.6625 - - -  No
13 - - - 467.6875 - - -  No
14 - - - 467.7125 - - -  No

73 de KE4SKY / WQAX587
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KE4SKY
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« Reply #14 on: June 15, 2005, 05:10:33 AM »

The ICOM F4 series UHF commercial portables are available will enable programming GMRS, including the shared insterstials, and amateur 70 cm in the same unit, for those users having the appropriate licenses in both services.

http://www.icomamerica.com/brochures/ic-f3gt_ic-f3gs_ic-f4gt_ic-f4gs.pdf
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