Call Search
     

New to Ham Radio?
My Profile

Community
Articles
Forums
News
Reviews
Friends Remembered
Strays
Survey Question

Operating
Contesting
DX Cluster Spots
Propagation

Resources
Calendar
Classifieds
Ham Exams
Ham Links
List Archives
News Articles
Product Reviews
QSL Managers

Site Info
eHam Help (FAQ)
Support the site
The eHam Team
Advertising Info
Vision Statement
About eHam.net

donate to eham
   Home   Help Search  
Pages: [1] 2 Next   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic: 1 meter antenna restriction  (Read 8482 times)
KC5HHQ
Member

Posts: 10




Ignore
« on: June 24, 2007, 05:03:50 PM »

I recently moved into a subdivision with a pesky HOA. I read over the bi-laws and came across this concerning antennas:

"
Except with the written permission of the ACA or as provided herein, exterior antennae, aerials, satellite dishes, or other apparatus for the transmission or reception of television, radio, satellite or other signals of any kind may not be placed on the exterior of any Dwelling or on any portion of the Lot outside the Dwelling, except that: 1.  antennas, satellite dishes or other apparatuses that are on meter or less in diameter and that are designed to receive transmission other than television broadcast signals shall be permitted and  2. antennas or satellite dishes designed to receive television broadcast signals shall be permitted. Any of the foregoing permitted devices and any other device permitted by the ACA, must be located in an area where such Permitted Device is not visible from any portion of the street in front of the applicable lot with the apparatus.
"

If I am reading this correctly, I am permitted to put up any type of antenna as long as it is less than 1 meter in diameter. If was looking at a HF mobile whip from MFJ, but I am unsure if this would be permitted. I currently have a 20 meter dipole running down the eve of my house, but I receive horrible reception from it because I am surrounded by two-story homes. I was hoping someone would have an idea for a 1 meter in diameter antenna, or some other type of stealthy installation that I could place in my back yard. I passed my General test yesterday, so I am anxiously awaiting a contact.

Thanks,
KC5HHQ (Chris)
Logged
N3OX
Member

Posts: 8911


WWW

Ignore
« Reply #1 on: June 24, 2007, 07:01:05 PM »

Chris,

That's an interesting wording that may give you some leeway but if you're trying to get away with a technicality, it does say "designed to receive transmission" ...

Anyway, it might open up one avenue for stealth, but 1 meter is awfully limiting on HF... the best 1 meter diameter antenna that I could think of for HF would be a magnetic loop antenna... that would be small and a well constructed one would be a halfway decent radiator and fairly low profile.  

As far as a more general thought about antennas in the backyard, I don't see a house in your neighborhood that doesn't have trees... a wire vertical up the side of a tree is about as stealthy as it gets... could you do that, with some radials buried or just stapled to the ground?  Of course, I'm looking at a google maps aerial... maybe there aren't any useful trees on your property.

Your thought that you need to get your antenna out a bit from the house is right... but I think sticking with wire is OK.  You'd be surprised at how hard it would be to see a magnet wire dipole strung between a couple of trees and fed with homemade open-wire line, for example.

Automatic/remote antenna tuners can be disguised as all sorts of lawn furniture or decorations.  Very small gauge wire is invisible to the average person who doesn't know it's there.

It's a little harder to make commercial feedlines totally invisible, but what I did when I was in an apartment was to have a tuner on the balcony with coax into the shack and a pair of 30 gauge wires were the only thing that went off the balcony from the tuner (which was in a box with plants on top)  .

So, anyway, I think the 1m thing is too much of a restriction... but it might be an interesting ploy to get some VHF antennas.

Just remember that language in your HOA agreement that permits antennas for reception of satellite and television does not necessarily guarantee you the permission to put up whatever antenna you want for whatever reason... so maybe it's better to hide ;-)

73,
Dan
Logged

73,
Dan
http://www.n3ox.net

Monkey/silicon cyborg, beeping at rocks since 1995.
KC5HHQ
Member

Posts: 10




Ignore
« Reply #2 on: June 24, 2007, 08:16:33 PM »

Dan,
  Thanks for the ideas, but I forgot to mention that I have no viable trees on my property (I have a 10ft sapling we planted when we moved in). I believe the location you were looking at was my previous place of residence. I was thinking of draping the ends of the dipole over the roof of my house hoping that would help, but this is all just guess work as I don't really have any HF experience. My Kenwood TS-440S has an built in tuner so that's not so much a problem.
    I guess my options are to leave it where it is (on the eve of house fastened with plastic christmas light connectors... about 11ft in the air), drape it over the house, or move it to the back fence of my yard and use the fence as supports for it (6ft tall fence). The only problem with my fence is that it is not very high, and not very long... Maybe a loop is the best way. I see one on MFJ's website for 400$, but I would have to build my own...

Thanks,
KC5HHQ (Chris)
Logged
N4HRA
Member

Posts: 303




Ignore
« Reply #3 on: June 25, 2007, 05:03:22 AM »

You may want to look at your gutter and down spouts, If they are well bonded, place a SGC ATU at the base of the Down spout with a real good ground. keep your power below 100W

The reason for the SGC ATU is it will tune just about anything, you only need RF and 12Vdc,

just my 2 cents
Lew
N4HRA
Logged
AA4PB
Member

Posts: 14422




Ignore
« Reply #4 on: June 25, 2007, 05:43:24 AM »

How about a long support pole with a 1M dia (or less) dish on top of it? The "dish" could make a nice capacitance hat for the short vertical. The support pole may need some guy wires (dipole) or the "feed line" to the dish could be brought overhead back to the house (end fed wire).
Logged

Bob  AA4PB
Garrisonville, VA
KC5HHQ
Member

Posts: 10




Ignore
« Reply #5 on: June 25, 2007, 07:19:15 AM »

Lew- I have seen where those rain gutter antennas have worked quite well, but unfortunately I don't have any type of gutter system on my house.

Bob- That is a good idea. I already have a dish on the side of my house, but one could always use another...

I am thinking of just asking my HOA rep. about antenna restrictions in general. He may tell me that anything is OK so long as it is not visible from the street. We'll see I guess.

I believe I have figured out the problem with my current setup. It is not half of a wavelength in the air so the radiation pattern is pretty much vertical... Would that make sense?

Thanks for the suggestions guys, please keep 'em coming.

KC5HHQ (Chris)
Logged
WA9AFM
Member

Posts: 285




Ignore
« Reply #6 on: June 25, 2007, 08:13:44 AM »

Chris,

     I think you idea of approaching the HOA rep is a good one.  If you antenna is modest, well hidden, and doesn't cause any technical problems, you may well get a pass.  

Put heavy emphasis on the public service/emergency communications aspect.  Mention that in an emergency, you can serve as a link for the neighborhood to the outside world.  

Get the neighbors on either side of you in on this; if they don't have an objection, it's likely the HOA wouldn't have any heartburn.

As a 'preview' for the HOA, put the antenna up temporarily and show them what it would looks like.  

Be reasonable and prepared to negotiate!  No one wants a cat fight.  I'm on our HOA committee.  Luckily, we don't have any antenna restrictions, but when we do have to enforce a CC&R, we try to reach some sort of reasonable compromise.  

Don't use antenna brand names or model numbers; just say it's a 'modest, low-profile' antenna.

Tom, WA9AFM/5
Logged
W7IBI
Member

Posts: 0




Ignore
« Reply #7 on: June 25, 2007, 09:32:05 AM »

Does your house have an attic with at least a 40 foot clear space away from metal duct work and wiring? If so you might want to consider the the alpha-delta DXEE shortened dipole. All bands 40-10meters with tuner.  That is how I settled the HOA problem of NO antennas except satellite TV dish.
It's workable, even with our present poor band conditions, but it is not as good as the old tribander at 50'!
Logged
KC5HHQ
Member

Posts: 10




Ignore
« Reply #8 on: June 25, 2007, 10:23:07 AM »

Well, my attic's length is probably around 50ft, but there is duct work and studs sticking out everywhere. This was my first thought when I decided to put up a dipole, but unless I could shrink myself I doubt I could get between some of those studs. I'm going to have to check it again, but I'm fairly certain I won't be able to get back to the room I use for my shack from the attic entrance. If only they made invisible 60ft towers...

KC5HHQ (Chris)
Logged
N3OX
Member

Posts: 8911


WWW

Ignore
« Reply #9 on: June 25, 2007, 01:22:14 PM »

"If only they made invisible 60ft towers... "

They do make vertical antenna supports you can put up and down by yourself in minutes.

http://www.n3ox.net/projects/lowbandvert

Depending on your operating habits, you might have a good time with something like this.  

You might even be able to strike a deal with the HOA and your neighbors... if you buy an autotuner for the base, you can extend the pole to only 16-ish feet with one wire for daytime use... 20m and up.  At night, when you want to do 80/40/30, you can put it up to its full height.  

If you dig a modest hole and put concrete and an appropriate pipe in, you could have a guy-rope-less support for the Spiderbeam pole.  Put a garden around it to hide the concrete once you've installed the tuner and the radials (put a lot of 'em down... soon they'll be invisible)

I was able to put this pole up and take it down by myself in 1-2 minutes in the dark.

I never spent any time trying to stealth-ify my installation, because as I mention on the webpage, I asked my landlord if I could have an antenna if I did the yard work and she gave me an enthusiastic "yes", but I planned the installation with an eye toward being told "no".

73,
Dan

Logged

73,
Dan
http://www.n3ox.net

Monkey/silicon cyborg, beeping at rocks since 1995.
N3OX
Member

Posts: 8911


WWW

Ignore
« Reply #10 on: June 25, 2007, 01:25:15 PM »

Oh, another advantage of the telescoping fiberglass solution...

nothing like the peace of mind in bad weather to have taken your antenna down AND inside before it hits.

The new 60-footer is no good that way... takes too much time to take down and put up so unless I know there's going to be major severe weather, I just leave it up.

But the 40 footer was easy enough that I just left it DOWN except when I wanted to operate (which you'd do anyway)... and that's great if you are in a lightning prone area.

I don't recommend going out to take it down because you hear thunder though ;-)

Dan
Logged

73,
Dan
http://www.n3ox.net

Monkey/silicon cyborg, beeping at rocks since 1995.
W8DPC
Member

Posts: 542




Ignore
« Reply #11 on: June 25, 2007, 01:55:54 PM »

It would be nice if you could run a wire where the gutters WOULD be if you had them.  The average Joe isn't going to look at a piece of wire and think it's an antenna - when they think of an antenna, they think of Yagis, dishes, and sometimes verticals.  If you match the color of the house, or the color of the roof (if you run it along the roof edge), chances are that NOBODY will see it.  If someone does, tell them that your cable or satellite company installed it to cut down on bi-coupled RF hash feedback causing static in your television - you know, make something up.
Logged
ONAIR
Member

Posts: 3571




Ignore
« Reply #12 on: June 25, 2007, 02:23:34 PM »

    Any restrictions on "flagpoles"?  How about putting up an artificial tree with an antenna inside?
Logged
WT0A
Member

Posts: 922




Ignore
« Reply #13 on: June 28, 2007, 08:00:51 AM »

1 meter in diameter? That means it could be 300 feet long.
Logged
KC5HHQ
Member

Posts: 10




Ignore
« Reply #14 on: June 28, 2007, 08:55:02 AM »

Hah, yeah I guess it could be. That was my original thought when I read the guidelines. I have contacted my HOA rep. and he said that if it was not visible from the street or over the fence I would be O.K.
    I bought a 1:1 MFJ balun (i was getting shocked on transmit), and new black wire to run along the eave of the house. I haven't placed the new dipole up (it's flooding down in Texas), but I hope that by moving part of the 40meter dipole to the back side of the house and the other half to the side of the house will improve the signal strength. Does anyone know what the radiation pattern of a horizontal dipole running in an L-shape along a house might be?
  I found a 102" flagpole at Home Depot for around 100$, but I don't know if the wife would like that. We'll see. I like birds. Maybe a birdhouse is the answer...

Thanks,
KC5HHQ (Chris)
Logged
Pages: [1] 2 Next   Go Up
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.11 | SMF © 2006-2009, Simple Machines LLC Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!