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Author Topic: Spark plug info for Harbor Freight 800 watt generator  (Read 4470 times)
KC2UGV
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Posts: 419




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« Reply #15 on: August 22, 2014, 11:34:27 AM »

Let's ask the experts, in regards to octane ratings for engines:
http://theserviceadvisor.com/octane.htm
http://www.consumer.ftc.gov/articles/0210-paying-premium-high-octane-gasoline
http://blogs.cars.com/kickingtires/2012/10/regular-cars-that-take-premium-gasoline.html

So, really, it boils down to what the manufacturer states for the vehicle.  Higher octane levels may/may not show an appreciable difference in efficiency.

Again if this claim had any merit then EPA MPG rating would not be conducted by mandate with 93 octane as they have for many many years nor would have Detroit fought so hard to keep that requirement off sticker on window. This has cost Ford dearly in that they have had to re-rate and lower MPG of several Eco Boost models because their MPG is much worse real world with 87 octane.  Detroit has long known that most are fixated on cheapest possible fuel and make sure its reflected in manual because most buyers lack the understanding that it is actually cheaper to use better fuel as they cannot see past price of fill up.

Sorry, I'm going to have to go with the car experts on this one.

Anecdotal, I have not noted a mileage difference in the various times I've had to buy 93, vs what I normally buy (87).

Regardless, it's doubtful you would realize a large enough difference to justify the additional $0.20/gallon in 87 vs 93.
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W8JX
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Posts: 5640




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« Reply #16 on: August 22, 2014, 03:30:47 PM »

Let's ask the experts, in regards to octane ratings for engines:
http://theserviceadvisor.com/octane.htm
http://www.consumer.ftc.gov/articles/0210-paying-premium-high-octane-gasoline
http://blogs.cars.com/kickingtires/2012/10/regular-cars-that-take-premium-gasoline.html

So, really, it boils down to what the manufacturer states for the vehicle.  Higher octane levels may/may not show an appreciable difference in efficiency.

Again if this claim had any merit then EPA MPG rating would not be conducted by mandate with 93 octane as they have for many many years nor would have Detroit fought so hard to keep that requirement off sticker on window. This has cost Ford dearly in that they have had to re-rate and lower MPG of several Eco Boost models because their MPG is much worse real world with 87 octane.  Detroit has long known that most are fixated on cheapest possible fuel and make sure its reflected in manual because most buyers lack the understanding that it is actually cheaper to use better fuel as they cannot see past price of fill up.

Sorry, I'm going to have to go with the car experts on this one.

Anecdotal, I have not noted a mileage difference in the various times I've had to buy 93, vs what I normally buy (87).

Regardless, it's doubtful you would realize a large enough difference to justify the additional $0.20/gallon in 87 vs 93.

It is funny how the fact that they have long used 93 for EPA tests and lobbied hard to keep it off sticker and that fact escapes you. As far as manual duh, they are gonna say you can use cheapest possible gas because the magic of technology can detect knock before you hear it and retard timing and silently steal your performance and money thru reduced MPG. So sad.  BTW VW's hybrid with is also turbo charged state premium in manual for best power and economy because they know it makes a difference. My daughter has a Eco Cruze and has always run 93 in it and it runs much better than new turbo Cruzes on lot running 87. Difference is night and day especially in hot weather but then if you alway use 87 you will never know what you are missing.
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W9FIB
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Posts: 666




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« Reply #17 on: August 22, 2014, 09:03:35 PM »

Higher octane also makes better smelling fumes when idiots run their engines in the garage.

Nope not at all. If you want a better buzz you need a winter blend which has a higher volatility (ie higher vapor pressure) than summer blends which have lowered volatility to reduce vapor lock tendencies.

Sorry, I am not an idiot that runs my generator in my garage. Someone here in this thread is though. So burn that stuff and get the most out of the VOCs you can. Now I wonder who in this thread admits to doing that?
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KC2UGV
Member

Posts: 419




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« Reply #18 on: August 23, 2014, 02:32:36 PM »

Let's ask the experts, in regards to octane ratings for engines:
http://theserviceadvisor.com/octane.htm
http://www.consumer.ftc.gov/articles/0210-paying-premium-high-octane-gasoline
http://blogs.cars.com/kickingtires/2012/10/regular-cars-that-take-premium-gasoline.html

So, really, it boils down to what the manufacturer states for the vehicle.  Higher octane levels may/may not show an appreciable difference in efficiency.

Again if this claim had any merit then EPA MPG rating would not be conducted by mandate with 93 octane as they have for many many years nor would have Detroit fought so hard to keep that requirement off sticker on window. This has cost Ford dearly in that they have had to re-rate and lower MPG of several Eco Boost models because their MPG is much worse real world with 87 octane.  Detroit has long known that most are fixated on cheapest possible fuel and make sure its reflected in manual because most buyers lack the understanding that it is actually cheaper to use better fuel as they cannot see past price of fill up.

Sorry, I'm going to have to go with the car experts on this one.

Anecdotal, I have not noted a mileage difference in the various times I've had to buy 93, vs what I normally buy (87).

Regardless, it's doubtful you would realize a large enough difference to justify the additional $0.20/gallon in 87 vs 93.

It is funny how the fact that they have long used 93 for EPA tests and lobbied hard to keep it off sticker and that fact escapes you. As far as manual duh, they are gonna say you can use cheapest possible gas because the magic of technology can detect knock before you hear it and retard timing and silently steal your performance and money thru reduced MPG. So sad.  BTW VW's hybrid with is also turbo charged state premium in manual for best power and economy because they know it makes a difference. My daughter has a Eco Cruze and has always run 93 in it and it runs much better than new turbo Cruzes on lot running 87. Difference is night and day especially in hot weather but then if you alway use 87 you will never know what you are missing.

The government also measures broadband access penetration by the max amount of bandwidth customers can obtain, and not using real figures.

BTW, VW's manuals state they need the higher octane, so use it.

And, as stated, I've used premium gas from time to time, and have not noted a difference in gas mileage that cannot be due to some other variables (Outdoor temperatures, for example).

Again, I'll lean on car expert's opinion on this one.
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W8JX
Member

Posts: 5640




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« Reply #19 on: August 24, 2014, 05:02:29 AM »

Higher octane also makes better smelling fumes when idiots run their engines in the garage.

Nope not at all. If you want a better buzz you need a winter blend which has a higher volatility (ie higher vapor pressure) than summer blends which have lowered volatility to reduce vapor lock tendencies.

Sorry, I am not an idiot that runs my generator in my garage. Someone here in this thread is though. So burn that stuff and get the most out of the VOCs you can. Now I wonder who in this thread admits to doing that?

Volatility is adjusted to make gas engines start easier in cold weather.  I have experienced vapor lock in outdoor power equipment when stored winter gas is used in warm weather. Summer gas in them in winter leads to hard starting.

I do love you continued comments on garage as it shows your total lack of understanding of even basic physics. Better not start your car in garage because it makes more CO in a minute than a generator does in 30.

Also when you use better gas in car it takes a few tanks for cars computer to learn new fuel unless you pull ECM fuses for several minutes which will flush old run data and adjust quickly. This native slow learn is to prevent damage for those that love 87.
« Last Edit: August 24, 2014, 05:06:44 AM by W8JX » Logged

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W8JX
Member

Posts: 5640




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« Reply #20 on: August 24, 2014, 05:13:11 AM »


Anecdotal, I have not noted a mileage difference in the various times I've had to buy 93, vs what I normally buy (87).

Again, I'll lean on car expert's opinion on this one.


You would not unless you run a few tanks of it or reboot car ECM by pulling fuses.

As far as experts, would that be same ones that MANDATE 93 octane in EPA tests or someone else?
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KC2UGV
Member

Posts: 419




Ignore
« Reply #21 on: August 24, 2014, 06:00:36 AM »


Anecdotal, I have not noted a mileage difference in the various times I've had to buy 93, vs what I normally buy (87).

Again, I'll lean on car expert's opinion on this one.


You would not unless you run a few tanks of it or reboot car ECM by pulling fuses.

As far as experts, would that be same ones that MANDATE 93 octane in EPA tests or someone else?

You know the only thing pulling the fuse on your ECM does is pop a "Voltage Loss" fault, right?  There's only one way to "reset" a car computer, and that's a series of turns with set speeds?

Car computers adjust in real time, and don't need magick to be done on them.
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W9FIB
Member

Posts: 666




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« Reply #22 on: August 24, 2014, 07:43:16 AM »


I do love you continued comments on garage as it shows your total lack of understanding of even basic physics. Better not start your car in garage because it makes more CO in a minute than a generator does in 30.

I am glad you do. Cause it shows your guilt since I directed it at no particular person. Other then someone in this thread. So guess who is the idiot that does it? Only the guilty defend an indefensible position.
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W8JX
Member

Posts: 5640




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« Reply #23 on: August 25, 2014, 09:00:39 AM »


I do love you continued comments on garage as it shows your total lack of understanding of even basic physics. Better not start your car in garage because it makes more CO in a minute than a generator does in 30.

I am glad you do. Cause it shows your guilt since I directed it at no particular person. Other then someone in this thread. So guess who is the idiot that does it? Only the guilty defend an indefensible position.

Quite the opposite it shows your insecurity and how you try to lash out against things you do not understand. That is funny.
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W9FIB
Member

Posts: 666




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« Reply #24 on: Yesterday at 03:44:06 AM »


I do love you continued comments on garage as it shows your total lack of understanding of even basic physics. Better not start your car in garage because it makes more CO in a minute than a generator does in 30.

I am glad you do. Cause it shows your guilt since I directed it at no particular person. Other then someone in this thread. So guess who is the idiot that does it? Only the guilty defend an indefensible position.


Quite the opposite it shows your insecurity and how you try to lash out against things you do not understand. That is funny.

Yep you are funny! And it is good that you can laugh at yourself. Cause your stance is a joke!

If I were lashing out as you say, I would have directed it at a particular person. Again only the guilty defend an indefensible position that was not explicitly directed at them. You really need to try harder to convince the world you really do know what your talking about.

Still waiting for those safety rules from the government that say running a generator inside a residential garage is proper. So far you have not posted any to prove me wrong. The challenge is at your door, not mine. If your as smart as you think you are, you should have defeated me with the facts as printed months ago. You can quote physics all you want, chemistry too. But that is NOT the proof you need to be correct. That is not safety procedures as spelled out by government agencies and generator manufacturers. That is what you need to prove me wrong. But you don't.

I can show you how 5 x 14 = 25...but it does not make it right. Just makes it BS. (A classic scene from an old "Ma and Pa Kettle" movie.)

BTW how are those jets with engines running in front of your garage? LOL That was a classic!
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W8JX
Member

Posts: 5640




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« Reply #25 on: Yesterday at 07:42:46 AM »


I do love you continued comments on garage as it shows your total lack of understanding of even basic physics. Better not start your car in garage because it makes more CO in a minute than a generator does in 30.

I am glad you do. Cause it shows your guilt since I directed it at no particular person. Other then someone in this thread. So guess who is the idiot that does it? Only the guilty defend an indefensible position.


Quite the opposite it shows your insecurity and how you try to lash out against things you do not understand. That is funny.

Yep you are funny! And it is good that you can laugh at yourself. Cause your stance is a joke!

If I were lashing out as you say, I would have directed it at a particular person. Again only the guilty defend an indefensible position that was not explicitly directed at them. You really need to try harder to convince the world you really do know what your talking about.

Still waiting for those safety rules from the government that say running a generator inside a residential garage is proper. So far you have not posted any to prove me wrong. The challenge is at your door, not mine. If your as smart as you think you are, you should have defeated me with the facts as printed months ago. You can quote physics all you want, chemistry too. But that is NOT the proof you need to be correct. That is not safety procedures as spelled out by government agencies and generator manufacturers. That is what you need to prove me wrong. But you don't.

I can show you how 5 x 14 = 25...but it does not make it right. Just makes it BS. (A classic scene from an old "Ma and Pa Kettle" movie.)

BTW how are those jets with engines running in front of your garage? LOL That was a classic!

You must REALLY be VERY insecure. This started as a simple info post and you get ugly.  So sad but such people attack what they do not understand to feel better so I understand you plight. You need to learn that things are not what you think and with 87 it is all about marketing. GM was a pioneer in knock control/low octane fuel management and others followed suit with time. The average consumer such as yourself is happy using cheapest gas and engine not knocking and can not understand that better fuel can help because they do not know how modern engines work. Modern turbo charged car could not exist today with spark/knock management that senses vibrations in block for early signs of preignition before you hear it. Without active and very fast control you would destroy pistons/heads in a matter of seconds under full boost with 87 octane.  This concept escapes you so you attack it just like you believe in the magic wall in a open garage door that keeps fumes in. Most cars will do well on 89. Also ambient temperature plays a big roll in octane needs of a engine. A cool damp day lessens requirement and a hot dry day raises it. You want a minimum octane to cover this and it is not 87 for best efficiency. But hey as long as it runs you and others are happy and like the illusion of only really needing the cheapest gas you can find. We drove 781 miles last month on $22 of electricity and 1.41 gallons of 93 octane gas because I push envelope and use technology. The numbers are verifiable because they usage is uploaded via onstar to your account daily and you can generate monthly reports.

I suspect you will rant again. Knock yourself out.

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W9FIB
Member

Posts: 666




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« Reply #26 on: Yesterday at 11:19:27 AM »

Actually I don't have to. You proved my point....again. And again. And again. LOL Must be the fumes!
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