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Author Topic: Advance licence grandfather to Extra class  (Read 30464 times)
N2EY
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Posts: 3862




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« Reply #60 on: February 26, 2012, 05:51:01 PM »


btw, simply having an Advanced does NOT prove the licensee passed 13 wpm, nor took the exam in an FCC office. For almost 30 years, all new Advanceds passed their exams at VE sessions, not FCC offices. And for a decade, between 1990 and 2000, all license classes could be earned with just 5 wpm and a medical waiver - including the Advanced.


oh, I figured Advanced went away and the 13wpm requirement was dropped when the VE system was implemented.

Nope. It was available right up until April 15, 2000.

73 de Jim, N2EY



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K9AIM
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Posts: 962




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« Reply #61 on: February 26, 2012, 07:47:53 PM »

in that case, let me re-state my position -- Advanced should not be grandfathered to Extra (or maybe pre-VE Advanceds only should be LOL) and the bottom 25 KHz of 15, 20, 40, and 80 should be opened to all Tech Plus, Generals, and Advanceds. And -- Extras should get exclusive access to 18.110-18.135

K9AIM/waffle-house   Wink
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W5DQ
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« Reply #62 on: February 26, 2012, 10:23:25 PM »

Yes ,The Advance License should be combined with the Extra. The Tech with the General and a new BASIC License started for beginners!

and while you're at it, start putting licenses in bubble gum packs like sports figure trading cards. We can all collect them and who knows.....  in a couple of decades they might be worth some bucks too !! Grin

Gene W5DQ
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Gene W5DQ
Ridgecrest, CA - DM15dp
www.radioroom.org
N2EY
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Posts: 3862




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« Reply #63 on: February 27, 2012, 03:15:31 PM »

So you're essentially asking for an age-related waiver of the Extra written. I don't think FCC will go for it.

Actually I'd like to see the 25 KHz non-phone Extra-only segments opened up to all licensees.
  In other countries those segments are not limited to the highest class of licensee are they?

Why would you want that? It would only reduce the incentive to upgrade. A CW or data op would have no incentive to go past General at all.

btw, most other countries have no subbands-by-mode at all. Would you like to see that in the USA? There are folks who would...'phone right down to the bottom of every band.

So I ask:

Have you ever actually TRIED the current Extra exam? You can, you know. Completely free of charge.

but of course, several times.  i usually get anywhere from 40 to 60%.  If the questions were more theory I would enjoy studying and learn.  But most of it seems like drudgery and spending $15 to take a test I might not pass is nothing to sneeze at given my hourly wages. If anyone has an Extra class study guide they want to send my way out of pity feel free to do so LOL.

I use the hamtest online to study occasionally but a lot of the material does not seem much fun.  I have a good memory but there are an awful lot of questions in the Extra pool. 

So what? Just learn the stuff.

Heck, you're EIGHT YEARS younger than I am!

Did I hear right -- I no longer only get the Extra portion but have to take the Advanced exam as part of the Extra since there is no Advanced anymore? 

Before 2000, when the Advanced was still open to new issues, the Advanced written was 50 questions and the Extra written was 40 questions. You needed both to get the Extra, plus 20 wpm code or a waiver.

As part of the 2000 restructuring, the Advanced and Extra question pools were merged, and the Extra test made 50 questions. Not all the questions were included, because some were no longer needed (such as the Advanced band limits).

All the Q&A pools are available free-for-the-download. So is Part 97. Spend a little time each day studying and you'll be an Extra in no time.

73 de Jim, N2EY

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WA4ZVG
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« Reply #64 on: March 04, 2012, 12:13:56 AM »

Why in the world would any REAL ham,, and ADVANCE CLASS OPERATOR, who took REAL ham test, want to be classified with a bunch of NO-CODE EXTRA class CB'ers who just happen to have $60 in their pocket when they run across a VE?? Now I know the cost of the test is only $15, but those CB'ers are so stupid they go in there on a Saturday morning to take the test and fail it 3 times before they finally pass it the same day . Hence the $60 fee.

Yes I have seen them sit there and give the test as many times as a CB'er wants to take it in one sitting as long as they keep shelling out $15 per try.

One should really freak some VE out and go in and DEMAND to be given a 20 wpm code test. They couldn't do it,, They themselves were CB'ers last week!!!


Again,, who wants to be classified with a bunch of CB'ers who was on Ch 34 going by ROOSTER and wanting to know about your "PERSONAL" that Saturday morning and on HF that afternoon as an extra class.

They have dummied it down so much I hope it is NEVER grandfathered.

Oh and look ,, you can tell the new ones easily just by the call sign,, they use their initials as a vanity call. Don't matter what call area they are in,, fill out that form!!! These idiot so called extra class operators couldn't send an SOS on a sinking ship in Morse code to save their lives or wire simple flashlight circuit in a cave to get out they are so stupid. I wonder how many are " ON THE SIDE" as they come on and say.. GO BACK TO 11 METERS CB'er!!
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M0HCN
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Posts: 473




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« Reply #65 on: March 04, 2012, 07:34:15 AM »

Bitter, much?

The regional identifiers went out some years back, they mean little these days. How good an idea it was is debatable, but it is what it is, deal with it.

On the sub band thing, it is interesting to note that while region 1 does NOT (for the most part) have sub bands enforced as part of the license, the band plans are followed in the vast majority of cases, and you only very seldom hear wideband modes in the narrow band portions of the band plans. The US is one of the very few nations that does the incentive licensing by band thing, almost everyone else does it by transmitter power limits.

In fact the licenses in region 1 are normally silent about what mode is to be used where, except to specify that no wideband modes are to be used in some of the narrower bands. The manuals do however encourage the observation of the band plans.

Having the band plans written into the license conditions seems to be a US peculiarity that has caused a few issues, see the mess concerning UHF/Microwave spread spectrum working and the fact that it has taken until now to get a variation for an experimental station in the US.

End of the day, the biggest issue with US licensing IMHO is not code/no code but is the open question pool.

Regards, Dan.
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W0DV
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Posts: 200




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« Reply #66 on: March 04, 2012, 10:46:30 AM »

Looks like someone has some blatent personality issues, lol.

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/TS-520_820_530_830/message/23378


google is your friend
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W0DV
Member

Posts: 200




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« Reply #67 on: March 04, 2012, 03:23:50 PM »

Why in the world would any REAL ham,, and ADVANCE CLASS OPERATOR, who took REAL ham test, want to be classified with a bunch of NO-CODE EXTRA class CB'ers who just happen to have $60 in their pocket when they run across a VE?? Now I know the cost of the test is only $15, but those CB'ers are so stupid they go in there on a Saturday morning to take the test and fail it 3 times before they finally pass it the same day . Hence the $60 fee.

CB'rs are stupid? how can you back that up? I grew up with the CB radio, as did many other hams. Sure, I used the CB back in the day. When I became a Ham Radio Op, I left the CB vernacular behind, and I follow the rules and regulations of AR. As far as testing is concerned, I took my first exam in 94, passing the written novice and technician on the first try. If someone failed, they were not allowed to retake at that time, they had to come back to another testing session.

Shall we compare IQ scores? would that make you happy? I doubt it Smiley

One should really freak some VE out and go in and DEMAND to be given a 20 wpm code test. They couldn't do it,, They themselves were CB'ers last week!!!

The 3 VE's that administered the exams I took were all hams that had taken the code tests before the speed was lowered, and eventually not required at all. I'm very appreciative for their time, and efforts to allow me the opportunity to get a license, or a license upgrade. They are men of character, and Amateurs who do their best to set an example of how an Amateur radio operator should conduct themselves. Why not give it a try?


They have dummied it down so much I hope it is NEVER grandfathered.

Yes, the code requirement has been dropped. Honestly, I wish they would have kept the code requirement. Be that as it may, the code does not in any way dictate who is the better ham radio op. As far as the written exams are concerned, they have always been easy. There really isn't a need to point this out..but some just don't get it. It has never been a requirement to go to school to become a ham radio op.  The tests have always covered the basics, nothing more. I learned most of the material in the first week of electronics school, 10 years before I became a Licensed Amateur.


Oh and look ,, you can tell the new ones easily just by the call sign,, they use their initials as a vanity call. Don't matter what call area they are in,, fill out that form!!! These idiot so called extra class operators couldn't send an SOS on a sinking ship in Morse code to save their lives or wire simple flashlight circuit in a cave to get out they are so stupid. I wonder how many are " ON THE SIDE" as they come on and say.. GO BACK TO 11 METERS CB'er!!

LOL, yes, I am a 5 wpm extra. I passed the required material to obtain my license. Point out where I was wrong?
Yes, I have a vanity call with my initials..and this is wrong because? lol.
I'm not fast with the code, and I'm currently working on it, and improving. Isn't that what the hobby is about? to have a goal, to improve, and to mentor others? I can certainly send an S.O.S., and wire a flashlight. Gee, I can even draw a schematic!
My first power supply for my rig was a supply I built myself.

Lastly, the ONLY reason why you don't upgrade to Extra Class is because YOU can't pass the exam..PERIOD.

Good luck Smiley
« Last Edit: March 04, 2012, 06:19:13 PM by W0DV » Logged
K9AIM
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Posts: 962




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« Reply #68 on: March 04, 2012, 04:21:46 PM »

Yes, I have a vanity call with my initials..


at least you live in the 0 call district   Smiley
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N2EY
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Posts: 3862




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« Reply #69 on: March 05, 2012, 04:11:03 AM »

CB'rs are stupid?

In almost any group you can find some stupid folks. Doesn't mean they all are, just some.

I grew up with the CB radio, as did many other hams.

And many of us did not. Whatever.

Yes, the code requirement has been dropped. Honestly, I wish they would have kept the code requirement. Be that as it may, the code does not in any way dictate who is the better ham radio op.

Yes, it does. A ham who knows code has a useful skillset that others do not. Another tool in the toolbox, which is a Good Thing.

But there are lots of other skillsets. One skill alone is just one factor.

As far as the written exams are concerned, they have always been easy. There really isn't a need to point this out..but some just don't get it. It has never been a requirement to go to school to become a ham radio op.  The tests have always covered the basics, nothing more. I learned most of the material in the first week of electronics school, 10 years before I became a Licensed Amateur.

We could debate how "easy" they are, and were, but that's really not relevant. What's relevant is what happens AFTER the testing....


LOL, yes, I am a 5 wpm extra. I passed the required material to obtain my license. Point out where I was wrong?

Well, you didn't invent a time machine so you could go back in time and take tests at an FCC office....but I suppose that even if you had, there would be folks who would find fault with you for doing so.

One more point: The Advanced never required more than a 13 wpm code test. And after 1990, it could be had with just 5 wpm and a medical waiver.

73 de Jim, N2EY
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W0DV
Member

Posts: 200




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« Reply #70 on: March 05, 2012, 06:03:02 PM »

CB'rs are stupid?

In almost any group you can find some stupid folks. Doesn't mean they all are, just some.

I think perhaps you are replying to the wrong post. WA4ZVG feels that all no-code, or 5 wpm Extras are stupid. You should have replied to his post, not mine. I'm a level headed guy, I don't have a hard time understanding that in every group there are less than honerable people that want to sabotage the intentions and progress of others.

I grew up with the CB radio, as did many other hams.

And many of us did not. Whatever.

You missed the point entirely. Please read the original post made by WA4ZVG, and my response. Place it in context. The Fact that you and others did NOT grow up with the CB is irrelevant because it isn't being used against you! The point I was trying to make was that the CB radio was a natural stepping stone for many hams because they grew up with it. Hollywood all but glamorized it.
The same laws of physics apply to the CB radio transmitter as the HF transmitter. As a teen in the 70's, my first radio was a CB, i didn't even know what ham radio was at that time. Gee, if only I would have known back then that 25 - 40 years later, some goof(s) would use it against me and many other hams of my generation. The shallowness, and selfishness is beyond comprehension. But lucky for me, and others, most hams don't believe such nonsense, and I don't hear that sort of snobbery very often on HF. It's mainly in these forums where the reprobates come to light.

Yes, the code requirement has been dropped. Honestly, I wish they would have kept the code requirement. Be that as it may, the code does not in any way dictate who is the better ham radio op.

Yes, it does. A ham who knows code has a useful skillset that others do not. Another tool in the toolbox, which is a Good Thing.
 

Again you missed the point. I'm not the type of person who would push the "I'm a better ham than you" crap. Again, look at the post made by WA4ZVG.
There certainly isn't anything wrong with obtaining many skills in Ham Radio. I refuse to judge another in their walk within Ham Radio. Again, the code does not dictate who is a better op, nor does any other mode. There is much  much more to HR than the code, which is yet another point you failed to see in my responses to WA4ZVG.
The point here is that WA4ZVG was pushing a snob agenda, throwing insults at anyone who didn't have to pass the same code test that he did. I responded in kind. Again, context.  

I feel your efforts are better spent by replying to the sad, hateful post made by WA4ZVG. His hateful remarks will never promote the hobby of HR, and the skills acquired within it. Instead, serves only to discourage others from entering the hobby.

What is painfully obvious is that the remarks made by WA4ZVG probably are a vent of situations that are of a personal nature, rather than situations regarding HR.


W0DV
« Last Edit: March 05, 2012, 06:30:47 PM by W0DV » Logged
N2EY
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Posts: 3862




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« Reply #71 on: March 06, 2012, 02:13:39 PM »

To W0DV:

I think we agree on many more things than we disagree on. And that's what's important.

Suppose it could be proved that the "old" tests were much "harder" than the current ones. Or that the Advanced were the "hardest" test FCC ever gave for an amateur exam. Neither would make any difference to FCC! Nor would it "prove" much about any particular individual.

What tests someone passed years ago is only a single data point in their overall knowledge, skill, value, etc. as a ham. Harping on one data point while ignoring all others simply weakens the case of the person harping.

What really matters is what a ham does with the license and its privileges, and how the ham does it.

All the rest is fluff by comparison.  

Wouldn't you agree?

73 de Jim N2EY

« Last Edit: March 06, 2012, 02:44:38 PM by N2EY » Logged
W0DV
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Posts: 200




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« Reply #72 on: March 06, 2012, 03:09:04 PM »

To W0DV:

I think we agree on many more things than we disagree on. And that's what's important.

Suppose it could be proved that the "old" tests were much "harder" than the current ones. Or that the Advanced were the "hardest" test FCC ever gave for an amateur exam. Neither would make any difference to FCC! Nor would it "prove" much about any particular individual.

What tests someone passed years ago is only a single data point in their overall knowledge, skill, value, etc. as a ham. Harping on one data point while ignoring all others simply weakens the case of the person harping.

What really matters is what a ham does with the license and its privileges, and how the ham does it.

All the rest is fluff by comparison.  

Wouldn't you agree?

73 de Jim N2EY



Yes, I strongly agree with your statement.
« Last Edit: March 06, 2012, 03:11:24 PM by W0DV » Logged
K8MGA
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« Reply #73 on: Today at 03:29:26 PM »

The Advanced Class Licensed Holder, better known as the Red Headed Bastard Step Child of the ARRL.  Protest by not joining the ARRL that's what I did.  Also apply for the WAAS (Work All Advanced Amateur Stations) Certificate. getting it will be quite an accomplishment.  Particularly, when an Advanced is holding out verifying that he was worked by one of those Ham who could not see the unfairness of it all.
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