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Author Topic: Why list "closed" repeaters?  (Read 1166 times)
AG5T
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« on: March 23, 2005, 06:11:02 AM »

I notice that artscipub.com lists closed repeaters. I have always wondered why they list them, the ARRL repeater directory lists them, etc. If these repeaters are closed and not available to anyone but a select groups, why list them at all? Wouldn't the information be considered private? Or are they listed to show that the repeater pairs are already in use for that area? Just curious. I've also heard of repeaters with exclusive, private, expensive memberships. A hobby for everyone?? What do you think? Thanks.
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WB2WIK
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« Reply #1 on: March 23, 2005, 07:52:27 AM »

They're listed because they're coordinated.  Whether available for general access or not, they're still coordinated (or at least the listed ones are) and the information is useful, if for no other reason than to advise interested parties that those frequency pairs have been allocated to someone; thus, someone else wishing to place a repeater on those same pairs within the coverage area of the first coordinated repeater would not stand much chance of also being coordinated.

WB2WIK/6
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WB6BYU
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Posts: 13576




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« Reply #2 on: March 23, 2005, 01:20:59 PM »

Some years back someone did a "band occupancy survey"
using the ARRL Repeater Directory, which didn't list
control links or some closed repeaters at the time.  This
led to the conclusion that those parts of our bands were
sparsely populated - think this was one of the arguments
used when we lost the 220 - 222 MHz segment.

So now the League lists all coordinated users.
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N3BIF
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Posts: 1190




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« Reply #3 on: March 23, 2005, 02:01:43 PM »

 AG5T,   Picture yourself the proud owner of a several thousand dollar station.   Approx 100,000 folks might want to visit any time they want ,unnannounced.

     How long before you put a lock on the shack door ?

BTW I dont care for private machines either but I understand the rationale.      
       
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K0BG
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« Reply #4 on: March 24, 2005, 11:27:09 AM »

I'm in the process of coordinating a repeater pair, and you have the option or list it or not irrespective of its open or closed status. In this case, it will be listed and it will be open. And no tones!

Alan, KØBG
www.k0bg.com
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KG4YJR
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Posts: 179




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« Reply #5 on: March 24, 2005, 06:12:18 PM »

I always wondered why to bother listing them myself and if they also have closed autopatch you wouldn't be able to make an emergency call if that was the only repeater in range and you just happen to be one of the last dozen or so folks left in America that doesn't have a cell phone yet.
Also, if you don't have or know the repeaters ctcss tone you aren't going to be of much help either. Frequent travelers probably run into this a lot when scanning the repeater output frequencies. They hear a lonely local putting a call wanting to chat with someone but right then and there the person that's passing through, hearing the call, trying to get back to them is saying: "what's the damn ctcss tone?".

73
Dave
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WA4PTZ
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Posts: 528




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« Reply #6 on: March 26, 2005, 04:23:48 AM »

I have always been opposed to the concept of
"Closed Repeaters" because it seems to be a
contradiction to our purpose. I am also familiar
with the costs of building and maintaining a repeater
and CHEAP and inconsiderate people who do not wish to
contribute but don't mind keeping the PA hot with use.
I think publishing them can help if you are looking
for a repeater that you can use by reducing the number
of frequencies you may need to check. It can also tell
you about the character of the people in the community
you are entering.
73 - Tim
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N2MG
Administrator

Posts: 0



« Reply #7 on: March 27, 2005, 05:11:38 PM »

I don't see the problem...you hear a repeater, you look it up, it's listed as "closed" or as using a CTCSS, now you know.  Why on earth would you NOT want to have the info, if it's available?

Also, CTCSS tones are not always to keep "people" out, but to prevent keying up of the repeater by undesirable (non-ham) sources.  There have been more than one repeater that would get "kerchunked" by sources like high-powered radar and other repeaters.

Mike N2MG
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N0IU
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Posts: 1375


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« Reply #8 on: March 28, 2005, 10:10:11 AM »

The whole subject of open vs. closed repeaters was beaten to death a few months ago as a Speak Out piece. If you see a closed repeater listed in your area, why not contact the club and see what it takes to join that club and help them defray the cost?

Remember, access to a repeater is a privilege, not a right!
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KG4YJR
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Posts: 179




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« Reply #9 on: March 29, 2005, 06:59:02 PM »

>>I am also familiar with the costs of building and maintaining a repeater and CHEAP and inconsiderate people who do not wish to contribute but don't mind keeping the PA hot with use.<<

You got that right. They are also the same type of people that call up our repeater's main trouble shooter at 2:30am in the morning just to tell him there's occasional static that's annoying them. Turning their rig off until say 7:00am or later, then calling never seems to be an option for them. It's a thankless job for him but one that he enjoys.
Besides mine and my wife's club membership dues, we also donate about $20 a couple of times a year to help with costs and upgrades. I also encourage those that have limited finances or lots of excuses to just volunteer for a club's repeater "work day". You'd be surprised how just giving your own time and a little sweat by helping out is equally as appreciated as donating finances or more. Plus, you learn a lot at the same time.

73
Dave
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W5GNB
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Posts: 419




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« Reply #10 on: April 03, 2005, 08:12:00 AM »

As other posts have emphasized, the listing of "Closed" repeaters is good info to know so that someone will not move in too close to an occupied frequency with a new repeater.  If there were no knowlege of the repeater, who would would know where to operate without hitting someone?

PL tones or DPL access may be desired or at least an option on the repeater simply to stop spurious interferrence from outside sources.  I don't know of any cases where the PL or DPL access is being used to deny access to anyone.  The purpose of "Closed" repeaters is to not have a bunch of idle chatter or whatever going on in the system.  This is very desireable in wide or multi-link systems or remote base setups.

With most of todays "Good" repeater locations, the intermod from other sources is a concern.

I have several repeater systems up and running with PL and DPL access that is normally turned off, the repeaters are OPEN and no tone for access but I can switch the tone access in if something wierd was hitting the receiver and keying things up.

Closed repeaters also are desireable if there are some fools around that cause havock on the system, fortunately there are none of those sort of characters in my area "YET" !!

73's
Gary - W5GNB

 
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