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Author Topic: wifi ham radio  (Read 4590 times)
KC8YYO
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Posts: 11




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« on: November 04, 2007, 09:32:10 PM »

ok so i found ham radio and wifi are mixable. my current license aplies to a serious wattage output potential. I have gotten together all the basic equipment for a 10-15w wifi station. read the rules and all that jaz. Then there is the predicament of identifying my station via stock hardware in my laptop. What would be the common proceedure for station id?

I was thinking along the lines of ping or ssid, but i am running windows xp, linux seems to be the norm out there.
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KC2RGW
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Posts: 287


WWW

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« Reply #1 on: November 05, 2007, 09:29:21 AM »

Just don't forget, no SSL or other means of encryption over that connection.  No WPA or WEP etc.
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KB1LKR
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Posts: 1898




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« Reply #2 on: November 05, 2007, 03:26:04 PM »

Also note only some (Ch 2-6??) of the US 2.4 MHz Wi-Fi channels lie in the 13 cm US amateur allocation, so choose accordingly.

Use your call sign as the SSID name of the wireless network, and turn on SSID broadcast and your virtually continuously ID'd.

Even 1-2W, vs. say 10-15W, should go quite a distance if you also use a moderately to highly directional antenna (e.g. Waveguide "tin can", Dish or even Yagi-Uda) under the Part 97 rules.

Have fun!
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KC8YYO
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Posts: 11




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« Reply #3 on: November 05, 2007, 05:11:51 PM »

ok so how do i make my pcmcia card continuiously broadcast my ssid. i have done this with a router but never with an laptop card slot type.
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W3LK
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« Reply #4 on: November 05, 2007, 05:40:20 PM »

And no commercial traffic - no Internet!

73,

Lon - W3LK
Naugatuck, Connecticut
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KC8YYO
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Posts: 11




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« Reply #5 on: November 06, 2007, 04:46:04 PM »

so how is the internet a commercial entinty? Last i checked it was more along the lines of a data base. more like an over sized BBS. therefore one has to watch what you talk about. Wheither it be data or voice you are still under the restriction of topic. (No porn, music, bisnuss, etc.) so if you get a random porn ad sent to your station in its transmission you have a problem. Hence you would most likely get a letter from the fcc. now on the other hand if you turn off pictures (so there not requested) and watch where you go on the internet (as you should) places that relate to ham radio would seem logical as a decent place to go. no there are other places that come to mind like NOAA for skywarn is one. (Gempak is web based) There is also things like free email that many hams use as a method of transmiting sensitive information in times of crisis much of that information is not a viable option in packet. Ie. many digital photos/video of a disaster scene. this could be an asset (so why overlook it?) as well depending on what is at hand. As with anyhting ham there are restrictions. but those restrictions disapear when you go back to stock wireless card. pst.... that 7db antenna on your router means that you need to id your station! THis is becasue you have changed the equipment  .per the part 97 rules. Any wifi radio that joe schmo pulls out of a box and plugs into a wall is aproved by the fcc as it is the box with no extra facy stuff! your local compusa belive it or not is a pretty neat ham radio store unlike radishack. go take a close look sometime. Cheesy This all really comes down to ERP at the antenna. Joe schmo has a very limited power base. (ERP)
  The ultimate goal is connectivity in a disaster situation or while on the road where a disaster is poised to occur in order to obtain or send digital information in a timely manner. A wise ares/races manager told me once "never rely on just one radio". wifi (2.4ghz)is very previlantly widespread and to some hams may be an nusance. Then there are those like myself that embraces it. to each his own.

But all that really doesn't say what i really need to know. i have windows xp which has zero configure "feature" (lol) the problem is.......

in windows xp where does one put an ssid to ensure that my call sign is broadcast via my pcmcia 2.4ghz wireless card?

OR

if that is not an option with windows xp is there a program out there that i can load so it "auto id's"


-jon
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W3LK
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Posts: 5639




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« Reply #6 on: November 06, 2007, 08:38:26 PM »

<< so how is the internet a commercial entinty? Last i checked it was more along the lines of a data base. more like an over sized BBS. therefore one has to watch what you talk about.>>

Then you obviously don't have a grasp of what the World Wide Web is. 99 percent of the sites are commercial and you can't transmit commercial business via amateur radio.

73,

Lon - W3LK
Naugatuck, Connecticut
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KC8YYO
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Posts: 11




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« Reply #7 on: November 08, 2007, 03:52:35 PM »

If you read the above paragraph I was talking about the 1% if that which makes up ham radio presence  on the internet. this has been all about ham radio and the crossover to the internet and how i/we can use radios to get there. THIS IS CALLED HSSM. there are many things that can be done wirelessly you don't HAVE TO BE connected computer to computer. Heck you don't even have to use your webrowser. for instance you could key up on the innternet radio program to a repeater somewhere. there are more implications that you may not relize at work here. What i am preposeing is all ham radio internet use. trying to be true to form with the ham radio community. I clearly understand what the web is i have been surfing it for 15 years. I know what is out there for the most part. i know the rules that what my ham test was for.

so....

 hey is there anybody out there that can help a guy brodcast an ssid in windows xp?

73's
yoyo
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KF4PJH
Member

Posts: 7




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« Reply #8 on: November 11, 2007, 09:32:31 PM »

ok, heres a catch for you..

go find a linksys wrt 54g wifi router..

v1 through 4...

download and read about ddwrt linux load for the router...

go buy a 24 db grid antenna,the pigtail for the coax connector to router reverse connector..

if you want, buy a 1 watt amp ..be sure it works bi directional.. rec and xmit gain..

setup somewhere within line of sight about 20 miles away with a laptop and wifi card pointed back at your setup..connect to 192.168.1.1    login is admin pw is admin...  set ssid to bcast every 1 min... your fine.. rules state every 10 min!!!..     if you cant connect go back to the antenna and connect there...

read.. its everywhere
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KC8YYO
Member

Posts: 11




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« Reply #9 on: December 08, 2007, 08:58:52 PM »

yes your right on the whole of the server side of the aspect. but.... what about the laptop??? that has to id as well. i am trying to keep this as portible as possible the home setup is a server and sizable sat dish. I just can't quite figure out how to keep the ssids the same as the server to communucate and still id as my station. so esentully you have to have 2 ids the server(kinda like a repeater) and the station connecting (mobile unit) but it seems that this not typically how it works in the world of computers.

ie. (in my area)

kc8yyo(mobile unit) -> wb8hcqm(repeater/server2.4ghz) <-wc8lan(eoc)

not

wc8lan(eoc) -> wb8hcqm(repeater/server2.4ghz)<- wc8lan(eoc)
I think this would be bad in the eyes of the fcc too... an eoc scyzofrentic conversation...lol

so still no strait answer...

73's
kc8yyo

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K3DC
Member

Posts: 88




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« Reply #10 on: December 19, 2007, 07:25:07 PM »

If the connection is not encrypted I guess you could place your call sign in the data packet of a UDP type transmission.

I think you could simply accomplish this by writing a program or script (In Perl) that would run under windows and send a UDP packet to the router every minute with your call sign in the data portion.  Now the router will simply ignore the packet data wise because there is no listener but the intent is simply to have some mehod of telling the world that you are XXXX and broadcasting.

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K3DC
Member

Posts: 88




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« Reply #11 on: December 19, 2007, 07:35:40 PM »

I guess I should so an example.  Here is something I just cranked out in Linux but with ActiveState will run under Winbloze XP.  Or you could use Cygwin.  

-- [ cut here ] ----
#!/usr/bin/perl
use Socket;
socket(SOCKET, PF_INET, SOCK_DGRAM, getprotobyname("udp"))
        or die "socket: $!\n";
my $ROUTER_ADDRESS='192.168.1.254';
my $MSG = "KI4YMD";
my $ip = inet_aton($ROUTER_ADDRESS);
# We do not care what port.  No one will
# grab this data anyway
my $port = int(rand(60000)) + 1024;
my $portaddr = sockaddr_in($port, $ip);
send(SOCKET, $MSG, 0, $portaddr) == length($MSG)
        or die "cannot set to $ROUTER_ADDRESS: $!";
close SOCKET;
-- [ cut here ] ----

I believe if the data is not encrypted then this solution will satisfy the requirement of ID.  

I admit I never even thought of mixing wireless with ham and am more interested in what you are trying to accomplish.  Maybe linking 2 stations up over a great distance?  What equipment have you purchased?

Chris
KI4YMD

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KC8YYO
Member

Posts: 11




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« Reply #12 on: December 20, 2007, 07:27:17 PM »

Thank you.
I am by no means a programer. I am more of a hard ware guy. hjere's an example of my high gain mobile station.

dell latitude->buffalo pcmica card wireles garden g54s ->Wireless garden WG-LA01 laptop adaptor -> "store Bought" super cantena -> Direct tv slimline dish


so here's how it works so i made a mounting bracket after taking off the old head unit of the dish. used the cantenna as a new head unit and marked dead center on the dish and eyed it. used netstumbler to fine tune to a known fixed location. so far in testing the head unit is good a four blocks very low signal(11mbps). When i added the dish it became a very useable strong signal. i have my neighbor 2 blocks away through the garage and his whole house at 54 mbps ful quieting. the quick rough math on this deal is the dish is 30-40 db gain and the cantenna is 12 db so at the min its like 42db So you can see the need for IDing. I figure ERP is somewhere in the 4200mw range worst case.

There is a problem with this setup. I have the hardest time figureing out whos who because i recive everyone and there brother. lol

The reason for the store bought cantenna is they have everything tested. SWR and such is a very big deal. I think all in all this cost about $100

I plan on adding an 500mw amp/preamp from hawking technologies (best buy $80) which should bring me up to 30,ooo mw erp

Poking around the internet i have found that some ppl have got 14 km off the top of there car. Problem... it was only line of sight. so i think if had had another station to connect to mobile i could probly get an effective signal of 1-5 miles. non line of sight with the similar setup as me. if i had a repeter to connnect to i most likely could connect tens of miles liek accross town. that would be sweet.


so i hope that answered you question. If you need a dish just ask a direct tv guy nicly and if your lucky you might get a used one. they usally have several junk ones in there van. "junk" for them is the head unit is bad and the dish is rusty.
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KC8YYO
Member

Posts: 11




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« Reply #13 on: December 20, 2007, 07:44:55 PM »

answer to second question.

What am i trying to acomplish?

well 2 meters is a pain to set up digital video for the person who doesn't know how to. there is very little support for shareing files. ie medical records in time of crisis from doctor to doctor. everything in this age is going to the way of the computer. so if oyu can't beat them join them. Cheesy The personal challenge for me is to see how cheap for how far with wireles. once that is done. iplan to move on to what to do with it and then who is the best usability for this set up. So i guess when i put it that way its all about dx send and recive. Cheesy


73's
yoyo
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K3DC
Member

Posts: 88




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« Reply #14 on: December 23, 2007, 08:29:03 PM »

A ham friend of mine told me today he was going to rig something up using a can and an old Dish Network dish.

http://www.hackaday.com/2004/12/23/use-a-primestar-dish-as-an-ieee-802-11-wireless-networking/

I found that info and maybe it would be beneficial for you for distance on 802.11b.
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