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Author Topic: New Upgrade Kit for Zero Five 43' Verticals???  (Read 1258 times)
K0OD
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Posts: 2453




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« on: May 25, 2009, 05:59:34 AM »

I see that ZeroFive is now offering the "MKII Upgrade Kit" for around $100

From their site:

"increases performance on our multiband verticals. It gives you a low take off angle on 10 through 17 meters on our popular 33 and 43 foot multiband verticals. You will notice an instant performance increase on the higher bands with this kit. No more wasted power at high angles. We even have one for the 50 and 66 foot models that increases performance from 10 through 20 meters.

No details or photos are given. I presume this is a parallel shorter radiator. Anyone know?
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K3MOV
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Posts: 504




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« Reply #1 on: June 08, 2009, 12:57:44 PM »

I've written to Tom at Zero Five twice asking for details, but so far no response. Anyone else have any idea what the "Upgrade" consists of? Tnx es 73, Tom K3MOV
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K0OD
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Posts: 2453




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« Reply #2 on: June 08, 2009, 02:49:40 PM »

Tom, does ZeroFive know the antenna you want to upgrade was made by DX Engineering? LOL

I emailed DX Engineering about the ZeroFive upgrade. They were aware of it, but had no idea what it consisted of. I've tried to come up with my own upgrade to improve low angle performance above 20 meters and couldn't model anything simple that improves more than one band.

What these verticals really need is an 80/160 upgrade, much like AD5X's matching network. http://www.ad5x.com/images/Articles/Match160J.pdf
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K3MOV
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Posts: 504




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« Reply #3 on: June 08, 2009, 04:11:00 PM »

Jeff, I'm not sure where you got your info, but I bought my Zerofive 43 Foot Multibander in July 2006. It has been in continuous use since I erected it. I used and still use a DXE radial plate. At some point, I switched from a AS balun to a DXE balun with improved results. I'm now using a DXE unun, but the aluminum stick and foldover mount are the same ones I bought from Tom three years ago.
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KC9GXC
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Posts: 10




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« Reply #4 on: June 08, 2009, 06:27:25 PM »

Hi Tom;
Just curious why would you call DX Engineering about the Zero-Five add on kit. I’m sure if you called Tom, he would be glad to answer your questions.
I have the Add-on kit for my 33’ft Zero-Five and it works very well. I was able to work into Jordan today and got a 58 report on 20m SSB. Not bad for 100w and no radials just four ground rods down 6’.  Can’t wait to get the radials down later this month, can only get better.

Randy
W9RTB
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KC9GXC
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Posts: 10




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« Reply #5 on: June 08, 2009, 06:27:46 PM »

Hi Tom;
Just curious why would you call DX Engineering about the Zero-Five add on kit. I’m sure if you called Tom, he would be glad to answer your questions.
I have the Add-on kit for my 33’ft Zero-Five and it works very well. I was able to work into Jordan today and got a 58 report on 20m SSB. Not bad for 100w and no radials just four ground rods down 6’.  Can’t wait to get the radials down later this month, can only get better.

Randy
W9RTB
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K3MOV
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Posts: 504




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« Reply #6 on: June 08, 2009, 06:37:44 PM »

Gentlemen: Please get your information correct!!

First, Jeff tells me I have a DXE vertical when I have always had a Zerofive.

Now Randy asks me why I would call DXE about the Zerfive upgrade. Randy, it was Jeff who called DXE not me.  You should pose your question to him.

Again, I ask that you get your stories straight before posting.

Tnx es 73, Tom K3MOV
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K3MOV
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Posts: 504




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« Reply #7 on: June 08, 2009, 06:43:59 PM »

Randy, I find it easier for Tom and for me to pose my questions by email so he can answer them at his "liesure" rather than me taking him away from his work with a phone call in the middle of the day.

Since you apparently have a MkII Upgrade, would you mind sharing with the rest of us what it consists of?

Tnx es 73, Tom K3MOV
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A9KW
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Posts: 102


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« Reply #8 on: June 08, 2009, 06:51:02 PM »

Hi Tom
How are you today.
Why don't you give me a call tomorrow.
It has been real busy over here ,I received your emails sorry I did not get back with you.
Talk to your tomorrow.

TOM
N9ZV
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K0OD
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Posts: 2453




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« Reply #9 on: June 08, 2009, 07:12:12 PM »

KC9GXC/W9RTB says: "I have the Add-on kit for my 33’ft Zero-Five and it works very well"


Is that the new ZeroFive MKII upgrade kit? (was there ever a MKI?) What does it consist of?

The mixture of vertical components is confusing. My DX Engineering vertical uses an Array Solutions balun that I rewired as a unun.
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KC9GXC
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Posts: 10




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« Reply #10 on: June 08, 2009, 09:44:38 PM »

Tom K3MOV
I apologize for the mix-up on the names. Senior moment!

Jeff
I think Tom from Zero-Five could explain it better. It works for me.

Randy
W9RTB
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W6TGE
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Posts: 154




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« Reply #11 on: June 09, 2009, 12:40:57 PM »

Randy...

Just wonder about this quote...

>>>Not bad for 100w and no radials just four ground  rods down 6’.

Do 4 ground rods work at all? It seems they may, but I never heard of that.
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N3OX
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« Reply #12 on: June 09, 2009, 03:57:44 PM »

"Do 4 ground rods work at all?"

Nearly all antennas "work" by some definition.

If you don't have one of them, you can't make any contacts at all.  But the dynamic range of available possible contacts on the HF bands is so huge that you can waste a lot of transmitted power and still get excellent signal reports.

You could lose 6dB or 10dB or even more in your ground system or feed system and still have an antenna that "works" in terms of making you happy that you're making contacts and yes, even breaking pileups and getting good signal reports.

The difference between radials and ground rods on an antenna like this is probably not more than a handful of dB on the bands above 40m.  

Even on the lower bands there can be some surprising effects.  You could potentially add radials and reduce ground loss on say, 80m, while making the mismatch to your coax worse and pick up more line loss.  So you could trade ground loss for coax loss.  It's probably a fairly particular line type and length and UNUN type where it's zero-sum.

If all you care about regarding your antenna "working" is that you get 59 reports and break some DX pileups using 100W or a kW, then just about every antenna that isn't a super short super lossy tiny wonder-whip "works" very well.

If all you care about is that you can talk to someone at all, even the tiny antennas work great.

If you care about actual dB losses and how much better you can make an antenna, then some measurements, at least comparisons with a known efficiency antenna, are probably what you need to do.  

Ground losses, except possibly for very short verticals, will almost never be enough to totally ruin an antenna from a subjective standpoint with no comparisons.

73
Dan
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73,
Dan
http://www.n3ox.net

Monkey/silicon cyborg, beeping at rocks since 1995.
W6TGE
Member

Posts: 154




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« Reply #13 on: June 09, 2009, 05:28:53 PM »

Thanks, Dan:

I have been on since the days when Boatanchors were new rigs!  :-)

I have an R5 that I was going to put up about 6 feet off the ground. Of course this is a 1/2 wave antenna and does not need radials. I asked about the ground rods as I thought that perhaps I could put up a 1/4 wave that covered 40 and just use the ground rods as I do not have room for radials. I suspect, however, that the R5, with perhaps a PAR end fed 40M antenna would be a better choice.

I agree what you say about most antennas will work. In all my years I have worked a ton of DX...even getting 3Y0PI, with antennas that I just put up!

OH, without starting a flame war...my biggest letdown was as an OP of a station (EMARC)in the Bay Area. I was able to use a KW to a QUAD. I could not even tune up without being called for hours! When I got home, I would always have a bad headache. At that station, if I did hear some DX and called and it did not come back, I felt cheated!

I was proud to show some of the hams at work my 3Y0PI QSL when they knew that I was using an R5 on the roof of my house. One of them told me not to even bother when he heard I was going to try working them with my R5! As they say, a bumblebee can fly because it does not know that it is not supposed to be able to!
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KC9GXC
Member

Posts: 10




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« Reply #14 on: June 09, 2009, 07:43:49 PM »

Does my Zero-Five work with out radials at my QTH?   YES
Do I wish I had room for radials?            NO
Would it work better with radials?         YES

Can I find a better antenna for the space I have to work with? NO

If I’m making solid contacts what difference does it make how the antenna works as long as it does.
I live in a town home location of the antenna is at the front of my home. Easier accesses for my cable run to the shack. Later this year a new drive is going in, so I can have a large radial field  30’x 50’

The Zero-Five was my best choice and for me has worked beyond my expectations

Radio FT-950,  Tuner FC-40 at the antenna, Cable run  about 50’ of LMR low loss.
No RF issues .

Randy
W9RTB



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