Call Search
     

New to Ham Radio?
My Profile

Community
Articles
Forums
News
Reviews
Friends Remembered
Strays
Survey Question

Operating
Contesting
DX Cluster Spots
Propagation

Resources
Calendar
Classifieds
Ham Exams
Ham Links
List Archives
News Articles
Product Reviews
QSL Managers

Site Info
eHam Help (FAQ)
Support the site
The eHam Team
Advertising Info
Vision Statement
About eHam.net

   Home   Help Search  
Pages: Prev 1 [2] 3 Next   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic: Best AM Performer  (Read 3312 times)
VK1OD
Member

Posts: 1697




Ignore
« Reply #15 on: December 10, 2009, 11:07:46 AM »

W7AIT, you do not understand AM.

The TS2000 is specified for 25W carrier power output on (full DSB) AM, and with 100% modulation, peak envelope power reaches 100W which is within the capability of its PA.

Differently, many if not most Icom radios are setup for carrier at 40% of the PA's PEP capability which means that they are limited to about 60% modulation before 'controlled carrier' sets in due to ALC action. Some Icom radios are noted for ALC peculiarities on AM and there are mods to try to address them.

Note all the above applies to DSB AM. Some eariler 'SSB radios' produced AM with only on sideband, and the numbers are different.

Is 25W carrier enough for AM? Well in years past, many of us had high level modulated PAs with just 25W of DC input. Our limit (in VK) was in the past a max of 150W DC input, which could deliver about 100W of carrier.

I use my TS2000 with an amplifier which will comfortably deliver our limit (currently 120W pY), and it is a better signal that delivered by the traditional or boatanchor transmitters.

Owen
Logged
VK1OD
Member

Posts: 1697




Ignore
« Reply #16 on: December 10, 2009, 12:01:51 PM »

Just looking at the specs on the Ranger 2955...

It is rated for 150W PEP on SSB and '50W RMS' on AM.

The SSB rating implies a linear PA capable of 150 PEP.

The AM spec is an unusual one, not using ITU methods of power measurement.

Does it mean 50W average power on a 100% sine modulated transmitter (ie ITU pY)? If that was the case, it would imply carrier power of 33W, and PEP of 133W (within the capability of the linear PA).

Does it mean 50W carrier (ITU pZ)? If that was the case, a 100% modulated AM wave would require a PA to handle 200W PEP (which is greater than the SSB PEP rating).

Like many specs, it doesn't state the AM modulation depth.

Overall, one is left a bit in the dark from the specs as to whether this radio produces full DSB AM, maximum modulation depth and just what power it produces.

Owen
Logged
WB8UHZ
Member

Posts: 125




Ignore
« Reply #17 on: December 10, 2009, 01:54:28 PM »

w7ait

I can't think of a  reason a licensed ham would recommend a radio such as the Ranger you note for ham use when it is illegal to buy the thing commercially in the USA. Its JUNK. It does not even meet FCC specs for approval to be sold, imported, listed for sale or made in the USA. The thing is a junk CB radio masquerading as ham equipment. Stay away from such Junk.
Logged
WA2DTW
Member

Posts: 91




Ignore
« Reply #18 on: December 10, 2009, 03:17:11 PM »

WB8UHZ-  I think you're talking about a different "ranger".   I think there is a CB radio called "ranger".  But the Johnson Viking Ranger is a classic for AM.

But for modern rigs-  you can't beat the Flex for beautiful AM.   And the old SDR1000 is just fine.
Logged
WB8UHZ
Member

Posts: 125




Ignore
« Reply #19 on: December 10, 2009, 04:10:31 PM »

WA2DTW
  No it was W7AIT who recommended one of those junk Rangers made in China or Malaysia which should not be used on the ham bands. They are illegal to sell, list for sale, import and make in the USA by decision of the FCC. That should tell any good ham all he or she needs to know about a piece of equipment. I was not referring to the Ranger made by Johnson several years ago which is an excellent well made radio.

73 Tim WB8UHZ
Logged
W7AIT
Member

Posts: 488




Ignore
« Reply #20 on: December 10, 2009, 09:07:07 PM »

VK1OD:  Do that and 2SC1972 driver blows.  I and a few others have blown them.  Best turn it down and save yourself a $400 repair bill from Kenwood.

But you know more than me right? Go ahead and cranker up!
Logged
VK1OD
Member

Posts: 1697




Ignore
« Reply #21 on: December 10, 2009, 09:53:15 PM »

WA7AIT, not to put to fine a point on it, your statement "The radio is only rated 25 watts AM and when 100% modulated, that means a maximum of 12.5 watts of carrier power and 12.5 watts of modulation power." is plainly wrong. The numbers don't work like that at all, perhaps you need to consult a text book on amplitude modulation.

Nothing to do with the TS2000, if you symmetrically amplitude modulate to 100%, a 25W carrier, there is 25W of carrier, 12.5W in both sidebands, or 6.25W in each sideband, and the peak envelope power is 100W. This is basic AM theory.

Owen
Logged
W7AIT
Member

Posts: 488




Ignore
« Reply #22 on: December 10, 2009, 10:27:38 PM »

Somebody needs a nap.
Logged
VK1OD
Member

Posts: 1697




Ignore
« Reply #23 on: December 10, 2009, 10:56:40 PM »

For others reading this, the following is a little clearer:

Nothing to do with the TS2000, if you sinusoidally amplitude modulate to 100%, a 25W carrier, there is 25W of carrier, an additional 12.5W in both sidebands (6.25W in each sideband), average power is therefore 25+12.5=37.5W, and the peak envelope power is 100W. This is basic AM theory.

Owen
Logged
W8JI
Member

Posts: 9304


WWW

Ignore
« Reply #24 on: December 11, 2009, 06:40:10 AM »

Somebody needs a nap.

The people questioning your information are correct.

First, 100% non-distorted sinewave modulated AM has a 4:1 ratio between PEP power and carrier power. If we have a 25 watt carrier, the PEP on modulation peaks at 100% modulation would be 100 watts.

Second, the Ranger 2955  is really an illegal piece of "pirate" CB equipment. They either don't know how to rate the various power specs, or they are lying just to sell stuff. The class E stuff, even if true, is meaningless. The ratings are meaningless.

Tom


Logged
W7AIT
Member

Posts: 488




Ignore
« Reply #25 on: December 11, 2009, 08:51:13 AM »

You are terribly misinformed.

Its not illegal to sell Ranger 2995’s in the US.  The Ranger 2995 is legally offered by several US suppliers. Its offered to **hams** as a ten / twelve meter ham radio.  I know of several other hams who also own them.  In fact anyone can buy one, just you need a ham license to legally **use** it on the air.  Those unlicensed “freebander CBers” who chose to buy and **transmit** with the radio on CB, are breaking several laws, primarily no “type Acceptance” for CB by the FCC, along with several other rules in part 95.

As far as the quality / performance reliability of the radio and “The thing is a junk CB radio masquerading as ham equipment. Stay away from such Junk.”, it has its shortcomings as I previously addressed.  I will say mine has been running 24/7 for two years, no problems at all.  As far as performance, it does the job, and I have **fun** with the radio.  If you have a problem with that, I say “get a life”.

It’s a “Fun” radio, something to experiment with.  I enjoy making AM contacts with other hams on 10 meter AM band, and by the way, finding that many I contact, are using modified CB rigs.  There is nothing wrong or illegal for a ham to modify a CB radio for 10 meters and use it, as long as the ham operates it in accordance with his license privileges, and the radio itself it meets part 97 requirements.  Also think MARS/ CAP mods MARS hams make to your fancy expensive Ten Tec or Yaesu or Kenwood, same thing, not illegal as long as the operator uses the radio in his licensed bands.

I think some of you here need to “get a life”.  The original question was simply “which radio”, and I made a suggestion.  Pick it apart, Take it or Leave, it I don’t care.  Its only a hobby.

If you’re going to get “bent around the axle” with this, and “nit pick” it to death, again I say “get a life”, life’s too short to argue, especially when neither side has all the facts.

Time for my nap.
Logged
KI6LXT
Member

Posts: 13




Ignore
« Reply #26 on: December 11, 2009, 09:39:51 AM »

Folks, first of all I want to thank those Hams who took my question seriously and answered it honestly. It was in that spirit that I asked it. It was not my intention to set off a controversy or to create hard feelings.

I have made a study of modulation and specifically Amplitude Modulation and of audio processing associated with improving the quality of audio within the bandwidth constraints of current radios. It is an honest curiosity and one in which I would like to experiment. I have a SoftRock transceiver and I may participate with some local Hams in a redesign of the transmitter for improved audio fidelity in AM mode.

Meanwhile I was looking for a tramsceiver with excellent audio qualities and the headroom to allow amplitude modulation without distortion.
Logged
W8JI
Member

Posts: 9304


WWW

Ignore
« Reply #27 on: December 11, 2009, 09:43:18 AM »

You are terribly misinformed.

Its not illegal to sell Ranger 2995’s in the US.  The Ranger 2995 is legally offered by several US suppliers. Its offered to **hams** as a ten / twelve meter ham radio.  I know of several other hams who also own them.  In fact anyone can buy one, just you need a ham license to legally **use** it on the air.  Those unlicensed “freebander CBers” who chose to buy and **transmit** with the radio on CB, are breaking several laws, primarily no “type Acceptance” for CB by the FCC, along with several other rules in part 95.


http://www.eham.net/articles/8189


You are deluding yourself if you think the primary market for the RCI-2995DX is amateur radio.

These are the very types of radios that are widely used by CB ops. They are illegal so far as the FCC is concerned because they are very easily modified to operate 11 meters.


Search

2995dx fcc citation

Logged
W8JI
Member

Posts: 9304


WWW

Ignore
« Reply #28 on: December 11, 2009, 09:46:02 AM »

Folks, first of all I want to thank those Hams who took my question seriously and answered it honestly. It was in that spirit that I asked it. It was not my intention to set off a controversy or to create hard feelings.

I have made a study of modulation and specifically Amplitude Modulation and of audio processing associated with improving the quality of audio within the bandwidth constraints of current radios. It is an honest curiosity and one in which I would like to experiment. I have a SoftRock transceiver and I may participate with some local Hams in a redesign of the transmitter for improved audio fidelity in AM mode.

Meanwhile I was looking for a tramsceiver with excellent audio qualities and the headroom to allow amplitude modulation without distortion.

The FT1000D Yaesu is very good sounding on AM and has excellent clean AM. You would never tell one from a high-level modulated rig, except perhaps the modulation of the FT1000D is more linear and less distorted.

The Ten Tec Orion is another good radio at least the Orion I  was.

Tom





Logged
WB8UHZ
Member

Posts: 125




Ignore
« Reply #29 on: December 11, 2009, 12:12:23 PM »

W7AIT

Once again you are dead wrong. The Ranger 2995 in fact is on the list of illegal radios posted by the FCC! It is illegal to import that radio, sell that radio, list that radio for sale and manufacture that radio in the USA.Doing so is a violation of the Communications Act of 1934 as amended. As for those selling the radio commercially, they are violating the law, a federal law in fact. All you need to do is  just a little research before you open your mouth. Many commercial operations have been busted by the FCC for selling those so called 10 and 12 meter radios. If you would like the easy way to see the list just go to www.qth.com for the list provided by the FCC. You can also find many places cited by the FCC for selling that junk. As a ham you have limited knowledge of the topic you are trying to discuss. Also as a ham, putting that radio on the air is far less than good amateur practice. That radio is of poor design and does not meet FCC required specifications. To be frank, you do not have a clue about what you're talking about. How the heck did you pass your license?
Logged
Pages: Prev 1 [2] 3 Next   Go Up
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.11 | SMF © 2006-2009, Simple Machines LLC Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!