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Author Topic: letter confusion learning morse  (Read 3470 times)
AE5EK
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Posts: 53




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« on: August 25, 2010, 08:29:52 AM »

When learning morse, what lettersw/characters were hard to distiguish between?
For me it is/was c and y,  D an G, U and V

Dennis
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KE4ILG
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Posts: 150




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« Reply #1 on: August 25, 2010, 08:55:31 AM »

I am so far from that point in my life I can no longer remember.  Today I often times have difficultly copying some letters.  Mostly the reason is conditions followed by technique of the other operator.  The most often mis-copied character for me is the letters h, and s.  I find usually it happens when I am first copying the call sign for the first time.  After a while I get used to the other guys fist and it becomes easier to copy through out the qso.  Also during a qso there is normally a natural flow to the conversation so you will expect the next word to be what is being sent. 

As far a trouble copying the letter c it is used every time someone calls cq so this will soon become the easiest for you to recognize.  Keep up the practice and get on the air soon.  The fun is on the air not in the practice.  Do try to send the very best code you can.  Space the letters properly and add additional space between words.  I have said this many times, well sent code at any speed is always welcome.  Don't get wrapped up in your speed.  There are many slow codes guys and many more who will match your speed.  When you send qrs it means please slow down.  Normally the other op will try to match your speed if he doesn't tell him your xyl just got home. 

Here are a few cw abbreviations:
sn= soon
gm, ga, ge=good morning, good afternoon, good evening
gb= God bless you
cu= see you as in: cu sn
om= old man

Welcome to cw and hpe to cu sn, 73 Mike ke4ilg
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WB2WIK
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« Reply #2 on: August 25, 2010, 11:10:36 AM »

When learning morse, what lettersw/characters were hard to distiguish between?
For me it is/was c and y,  D an G, U and V

Dennis


Straining my memory from about 46 years ago when I learned the code, but I think "F" and "L" used to screw me up for some reason (I'd mistake one for the other).

That hasn't happened in 45 years, though. Cheesy
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N3QE
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« Reply #3 on: August 25, 2010, 01:31:03 PM »

When I was learning Morse (thinking back 30 year) some of the less common letters like Q and Z and X, I had to think about.

But that was only at the very beginning.

Today, when listening to high speed ops (50+ WPM), what I get confused about letters with long series of dots, e.g. distiniguishing S from H and H from 5.

Do you want to know, in the CW DX contests, what the most frequently busted call is? EE5E.
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AB2T
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Posts: 246




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« Reply #4 on: August 25, 2010, 03:26:30 PM »

For some reason, at high speeds (for me, around 30 -- 40 wpm) I get the numbers mixed up. 3 becomes 8 and 4 becomes 9 for some reason. 

E, I, S, H, and 5 are difficult to get down at high speeds.  I use morse training software + RufzXP to stop dit-counting and listen for the characters as wholes.

Any confusion will eventually iron itself out over time.  At least I hope so.

73, Jordan
« Last Edit: August 25, 2010, 03:28:16 PM by Jordan » Logged
W7ETA
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« Reply #5 on: August 25, 2010, 11:17:32 PM »

b and d

h and 5

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PA2EFR
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Posts: 11


WWW

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« Reply #6 on: August 26, 2010, 02:10:55 AM »

q and x
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KJ4FUU
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Posts: 162




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« Reply #7 on: August 26, 2010, 05:44:41 AM »

With me, it's "h" and "5", "b" and "6" (which with my lousy handwriting look similar), and "7" and "8". I get them most of the time when practicing, but occasionally slip up.

With practice, the confusion will go away, or at least occur less often (I hope).

-- Tom
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KE3WD
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Posts: 5689




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« Reply #8 on: August 26, 2010, 07:58:18 AM »

Never had that problem, although I can see how it could happen. 

Practice at copying is the answer here. 

Repetition to correct whatever the problem may be. 

Keep working (playing! - because if you keep it FUN then things will happen much sooner) and practice copying off the air.  The W1AW code broadcasts are a great way to do this. 

If you keep at it, soon you will hear whole words instead of single letters or characters anyway and that's a great place to be. 

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AB2T
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Posts: 246




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« Reply #9 on: August 26, 2010, 09:20:27 AM »

I agree with KE3WD -- W1AW is the best for practice and skills maintenance.

And now, transmissions back to 2005 are available for league members:

http://www.arrl.org/code-practice-files

All mp3.  Put it on your ipod, phone, go anywhere.

73, Jordan

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W0XI
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Posts: 67




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« Reply #10 on: August 26, 2010, 09:29:14 AM »

.... I use morse training software + RufzXP to stop dit-counting and listen for the characters as wholes.

Yes, agree; listen to characters as a whole AND listen to words as a whole, i.e. Koch Method. I just tried RufzXP with System 7 (got a new dell with MicroSoft 7) and it seems to be working.

I find studying the structure of letters, words, and the code interesting and that helps keep my interest. For example, I've been "looking for" Morse syllables as an analogy to sounds within words. There are 40 to 42 "phonemes" (sounds in the English language) compared to 26 letters. For Japanese, the "phones" and letter count is about the same, an advantage for them. Fun stuff! Google "The Art & Skill of Radio-Telegraphy" written years ago by William Pierpont, N0HFF; there you'll find a table that lists to total number of marks and spaces for each letter and the frequency of use for each letter in common text. ETNRO are the most frequently used letters; XQKJZ are the less used letters, implying extra study for them.

I find it interesting that (for me) the same word sounds somewhat different as the WPM speed is increased. RufzXP (see above) allows you to listen to the word PARIS at various rates. At 13 words per minute the word comes so slowly that the it is hard to hear THE WORD. At 40 to 70 WPM, PARIS sounds about the same but with a slight shift in pitch of the dahs due to the P and the dits at the end I & S sound like clicks. Neat. For me, words are easier to hear - and I tend not to follow the characters - as I transition above about 25 WPM. Guessing this will vary by person. AIN'T CW GREAT  Smiley 73s, W0XI.

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KQ6Q
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« Reply #11 on: August 26, 2010, 12:01:20 PM »

Listen to the W1AW code practice runs (both fast to slow (35 WPm down to 10 WPM) and slow to fast (10 wpm up to 35 WPM) and the bulletin runs at18 wpm. You'll get used to copying clear text (right out of QST sometimes) and you'll be amazed at how fast you can copy after a while. Listen for words, write them in longhand. When you try to print a letter at a time, it actually slows you down, and keeps you listening for letters rather than words!

Fred, KQ6Q
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KE3WD
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« Reply #12 on: August 26, 2010, 03:11:08 PM »

And don't neglect the part of the W1AW code broadcasts where they send the contest and other results that have lots of callsigns in them as well.  And the propagation reports.  It all goes together into good practice at hearing separate characters as well as whole words or even parts of words. 

"Parts of words?" 

For example, the rhythmic sound of "ing" at the end of a word. 

Or "ed" etc.

Suffixes and prefixes of words and being able to recognize them "all at once" like you would a single morse character are  the beginnings of being able to hear whole words all at once. 

"The"

"And"

"Radio"

"Per"

Well, you get the idea.


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