Call Search
     

New to Ham Radio?
My Profile

Community
Articles
Forums
News
Reviews
Friends Remembered
Strays
Survey Question

Operating
Contesting
DX Cluster Spots
Propagation

Resources
Calendar
Classifieds
Ham Exams
Ham Links
List Archives
News Articles
Product Reviews
QSL Managers

Site Info
eHam Help (FAQ)
Support the site
The eHam Team
Advertising Info
Vision Statement
About eHam.net

   Home   Help Search  
Pages: Prev 1 2 3 [4] 5 6 Next   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic: Icom IC-7000 or Kenwood TS-480HX (SAT) for a new HAM  (Read 27906 times)
K9IUQ
Member

Posts: 2078




Ignore
« Reply #45 on: July 27, 2011, 01:14:20 PM »

That's why I'm somewhat changing my mind (more like shaping opinion) on what I want. I think TS-590s would serve me for a looong time to come. It will probaby make a learning curve a little steeper with the front panel much more busier than IC-7000 or TS-480SAT, but I'll get through it.

For a new ham you seem to be pretty smart.  Cheesy

The TS-590s is much easier to use than the Icom 7000. I am a long time Icom owner, owned many Icoms and they all work similar but I still find my 7000 confusing at times.

Kenwood supplies free software to operate the TS-590s if you wish with a computer. The software is very good and makes operating the radio and menus extremely easy. I wish more companies would follow this example.

Even without the software the TS-590s is more intuitive than a Icom 7000.

Stan K9IUQ
Logged
N5MOA
Member

Posts: 1120




Ignore
« Reply #46 on: July 27, 2011, 01:40:04 PM »


There are a few things you didn't mention about the 480. The high stability oscillator is an optional cost item. It is included in the Yaesu, and Icom. If you're mobile, or you use most of the digital modes, you need one. While stable, it isn't as stable under varying DC voltage levels as the other two are.


My opinion differs on this. I use a SAT at home and a HX mobile. I have found zero need for the high stability oscillator in either.

I've operated (still do) ssb, cw and RTTY contests, and chased dx on all 3 modes, from the mobile, with the engine off for a hour or so at a time.

 I have not noticed any issues caused by not having the high stability oscillator installed, or by any voltage variance.

I've also found the AF DSP improves readability in tough conditions, not the other way around.

Having the mic connector on the control head would be nice for some installs, but it isn't an issue on mine.

I R&R my SAT every day for a year before I bought the HX. The antenna dongles aren't an issue, imo.




I have also used the 7000. Icom has sold a lot of them, and for some people, they serve well. A buddy of mine loves his.

For my needs, I prefer the 480.



YMMV.




For a new ham you seem to be pretty smart.  Cheesy

Stan K9IUQ



New or old, he seems to be fairly sharp.  Tongue




Kenwood supplies free software to operate the TS-590s if you wish with a computer. The software is very good and makes operating the radio and menus extremely easy. I wish more companies would follow this example.


Likewise for the 480. You don't even need the control head connected if you use the computer to control it.

Also, the last DSP setting in the menu is "U", for user defined. Adjust it to suit via the software and save.






Logged
W8JX
Member

Posts: 6685




Ignore
« Reply #47 on: July 27, 2011, 02:13:10 PM »


Not a issue as MB-480 fixes this

2. The microphone is not attachable to the head, it plugs into the body. This is a terrible design. I own a Kenwood TM-D700 that does the same thing. Extremely inconvenient. The Icom 7000 has 2 mic connectors, one on the head, one on the body of the radio. This is the way to do it.

Not a issue and it simplifies remote mounting head on dash as no mic cords need to dangle from it. Kenwood did this right.


Your constant defense of the TS-480s proves what I said earlier about owners trying to justify their radios and blunt all criticism of their radio.

The MB-480 is a kludgy $60 option.

How it is better to have the mic connector on the body is beyond me. If you put the body under the seat or trunk then you gotta run a long mic cord to the body. It is much better to give the owner the choice like  the Icom 7000 does, on the head OR on the body for the mic. And that is a NO BRAINER.   Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy

Stan K9IUQ

I paid 45 bucks for my MB-480 not sure where you are pricing yours and beat you never owned a 480 with a MB-480 either.   On mic off body verse head,  you must have strange standards because with needing to put cable on head because when you do not it opens a lot of possibilities remote mounting it vs have a mic cord tethered to it too. Having all other cables on main body makes for a clean install. It also means mic does not have to be side mounted on head or in front panel taking up space that could be used for display and buttons.
Logged

--------------------------------------
You can embrace new computer/tablet technology and change with it or cling to old fall far behind....
W8JX
Member

Posts: 6685




Ignore
« Reply #48 on: July 27, 2011, 02:21:34 PM »


There are a few things you didn't mention about the 480. The high stability oscillator is an optional cost item. It is included in the Yaesu, and Icom. If you're mobile, or you use most of the digital modes, you need one. While stable, it isn't as stable under varying DC voltage levels as the other two are.


My opinion differs on this. I use a SAT at home and a HX mobile. I have found zero need for the high stability oscillator in either.

I have found my 480 to be rock solid too and never a hint of drift that I have ever seen. Maybe Icom and Yaesu need it more because of design or because of UHF support too. BTW on kenwood the receiver runs below line voltage from a internal regulator so voltage changes have no real effect on it within acceptable ranges.
Logged

--------------------------------------
You can embrace new computer/tablet technology and change with it or cling to old fall far behind....
W2RI
Member

Posts: 57




Ignore
« Reply #49 on: July 27, 2011, 04:15:42 PM »

I paid 45 bucks for my MB-480 not sure where you are pricing yours and beat you never owned a 480 with a MB-480 either.   On mic off body verse head,  you must have strange standards because with needing to put cable on head because when you do not it opens a lot of possibilities remote mounting it vs have a mic cord tethered to it too. Having all other cables on main body makes for a clean install. It also means mic does not have to be side mounted on head or in front panel taking up space that could be used for display and buttons.
He was dead on - HRO is $59.95.

Your claim about mounting to the body is not really relevant; with the Icom 7000 you can mount to either the body or the head. Being able to mount to the head makes for a clean install!

I have three 7000's. I like them. They do get hot, and have some finicky issues - for example, two of my mikes have failed. I can't speak to the 480, but I will say that with the 7000 you're paying for the VHF bands as well as HF. I never use 220 or 440 now; if I was doing it again I might consider something like a K3. But I like the 7000's remote head...
 
At the end of the day it's horses for courses; what works for me probably won't suit you, and vice versa. As a previous poster said, and Alan has done, try them together and see what you like ! If you can't try the together, then check out the videos and user reports. Contrary to what someone posted above, there *is* value to Eham reviews - you can see what people like and don't like about rigs (and other equipment).
Logged
M6GOM
Member

Posts: 1014




Ignore
« Reply #50 on: July 27, 2011, 04:17:28 PM »

Site a 480 beside a 7000 in a typical mobile, and you can't tell the difference. After all, if the lowest strength signal you can decipher is -90 dB, who cares if the noise floor is another 30 dB down!

I've done this and I can. I can take a medium strength SSB signal on the TS480 - say a S5 or S7 and on the Icom 7000 it has a lower S meter reading, maybe S1 or S3, but more importantly, it has the sound of a weaker signal - more of a hiss to it. Pop on the pre-amp and it is as strong as the TS480 is without the pre-amp on.

So the noise. When I get out of town, thanks to the excellent installation information on your website (my long standing disagreement with powering from lighter sockets aside  Wink ) and partly down to the fact it is a very sparsely populated rural county, in the daytime I usually have S0 noise reading on every single band and even when engaging the pre-amp on 17-10m both static and whilst driving down the road. With an install like this, the difference between the TS480 and the Icom 7000 on weak signals (S1 to S3 on the 480) is quite notable. The Icom 7000 won't even hear them with the pre-amp off however will pull them in slightly better than the 480 when the 7000s pre-amp is engaged but then I've still got a pre-amp I've yet to use on the 480. It IS deaf compared to the TS480 and also my TS590 when I tried it side by side prior to /M installation but that is mitigated by just running with the pre-amp on however I'll add the caveat that if you've any noise on the S meter, you want to be dialling down the RX gain anyway to improve the S/N ratio.

But despite this and despite my intentions to take the 7000 out of the car and put the 480 back in for the last several weekends, the 7000 is still there and I am not rushing to do it which has surprised me.
Logged
M6GOM
Member

Posts: 1014




Ignore
« Reply #51 on: July 27, 2011, 04:30:47 PM »


If you add up the cost of either 480, include the optional 1.8 kHz filter, the mobile mounting kit, the mobile cable kit, mobile extended power cable, voice module, high stability x-tal oscillator, etc., you end up spending over $1,600. That's about $400 more than the 7000, and it comes with all of these.

In the UK, the 480 comes with the mobile bracket, the mobile cable, the extended power cable as standard. You have to pay £120 for the TXCO and £80 for the VGS module so it adds £200 to the TS480 making it around £950 for the SAT and £1050 for the HX.

However in the UK, the Icom 7000 does not come with a mobile mounting kit, face off cable or extended power cable and it will cost you approximately £110 for those taking the Icom 7000 up to just over £1300, over £350 more than the 100W TS480 which is enough money to buy a TM-V71 dedicated dual band FM transceiver.

It is a tough choice for us over here and if the prices you state for the US are correct, I can fully understand why you would push a 7000 over a 480 as whilst I personally feel and have observed the 480's HF performance to be better, it isn't $400 better.
Logged
W8JX
Member

Posts: 6685




Ignore
« Reply #52 on: July 27, 2011, 04:34:29 PM »

He was dead on - HRO is $59.95.

And this is only place???  44.95 at Universal Radio and 45.95 and R & L. Guess he does not have his ducks in a row on price too.
Logged

--------------------------------------
You can embrace new computer/tablet technology and change with it or cling to old fall far behind....
K9IUQ
Member

Posts: 2078




Ignore
« Reply #53 on: July 27, 2011, 06:29:46 PM »

And this is only place???  44.95 at Universal Radio and 45.95 and R & L. Guess he does not have his ducks in a row on price too.

Give it up, you are starting to sound really irrational like our USA politicians.  Wink

Your constant defense of the TS-480s proves what I said earlier about owners trying to justify their radios and blunt all criticism of their radio.

How many times do you have to prove it???

Stan K9IUQ
« Last Edit: July 27, 2011, 06:35:43 PM by K9IUQ » Logged
W8JX
Member

Posts: 6685




Ignore
« Reply #54 on: July 27, 2011, 06:36:17 PM »

And this is only place???  44.95 at Universal Radio and 45.95 and R & L. Guess he does not have his ducks in a row on price too.

Give it up, you are starting to sound really irrational like our USA politicians.  Wink


Oh no not me. Someone else has been doing it. I was not make false claims like politicians do.  I had my ducks in a row here.
Logged

--------------------------------------
You can embrace new computer/tablet technology and change with it or cling to old fall far behind....
K9IUQ
Member

Posts: 2078




Ignore
« Reply #55 on: July 27, 2011, 06:47:28 PM »


Oh no not me. Someone else has been doing it. I was not make false claims like politicians do.  .

I do not believe anyone in this thread has made false claims. Even your posts are not untrue, I believe you posted your opinions and you believe them to be true.

My opinions and other opinions here , altho differing from yours are also true. The key word in my previous post was irrational. You seem to be so attached to your 480 that you can tolerate NO criticism of the TS-480 whatsoever. You have the need to counterpoint every post that states an opinion that is different than yours even going so far as arguing about the price of a MB-480.

You believe your view is correct and everyone else is wrong - just like our USA politicians...

Stan K9IUQ
 
Logged
KJ6PVR
Member

Posts: 25




Ignore
« Reply #56 on: July 27, 2011, 08:58:34 PM »


You believe your view is correct and everyone else is wrong - just like our USA politicians...
 

Well THAAAAT's another ballpark on its own - USA politicians :-)), we'll need another forum just for that...oooor we can just use a few words to categorize them and be done with it...this country stands on its last legs..

Anyway, one more question, Gigaparts or Hamcity?  Which one of these two would you buy from if you were going to spend your hard earned money?  Those two seem to have the best prices. I really like our local HRO, but there is NO way I'll pay over $150 just in sales tax to these moronic California politicians...  Sorry HRO guys...
Logged
KJ6PVR
Member

Posts: 25




Ignore
« Reply #57 on: July 27, 2011, 09:03:51 PM »


For a new ham you seem to be pretty smart.  Cheesy

Stan K9IUQ

I might be a brand new HAM, but I'm not that brand new under the sun , thanks  Wink
Common sense is something that's dying in this country, needs resuscitating...
Logged
N2RRA
Member

Posts: 645


WWW

Ignore
« Reply #58 on: July 27, 2011, 10:15:25 PM »

Site a 480 beside a 7000 in a typical mobile, and you can't tell the difference. After all, if the lowest strength signal you can decipher is -90 dB, who cares if the noise floor is another 30 dB down!

I've done this and I can. I can take a medium strength SSB signal on the TS480 - say a S5 or S7 and on the Icom 7000 it has a lower S meter reading, maybe S1 or S3, but more importantly, it has the sound of a weaker signal - more of a hiss to it. Pop on the pre-amp and it is as strong as the TS480 is without the pre-amp on.

So the noise. When I get out of town, thanks to the excellent installation information on your website (my long standing disagreement with powering from lighter sockets aside  Wink ) and partly down to the fact it is a very sparsely populated rural county, in the daytime I usually have S0 noise reading on every single band and even when engaging the pre-amp on 17-10m both static and whilst driving down the road. With an install like this, the difference between the TS480 and the Icom 7000 on weak signals (S1 to S3 on the 480) is quite notable. The Icom 7000 won't even hear them with the pre-amp off however will pull them in slightly better than the 480 when the 7000s pre-amp is engaged but then I've still got a pre-amp I've yet to use on the 480. It IS deaf compared to the TS480 and also my TS590 when I tried it side by side prior to /M installation but that is mitigated by just running with the pre-amp on however I'll add the caveat that if you've any noise on the S meter, you want to be dialling down the RX gain anyway to improve the S/N ratio.

But despite this and despite my intentions to take the 7000 out of the car and put the 480 back in for the last several weekends, the 7000 is still there and I am not rushing to do it which has surprised me.

This is such B.S.!!!!!

I've own both radios and had them side by side and your claims are so not true. I've never seen such a tremendous difference like that. If anything switching between the two was maybe a matter of 3db = 1 s-unit that I would've had to say due to propagation. That which flip flopped between either of them.

As far as noise! You couldn't get worse than being in a Hybrid car. The High Voltages your driving in is a receiver killer. Which brings my next point! I could hear signals better through the noise on the ICOM and had less noise than on the Kenwood. So why do I still have the IC-7000? Cause the Kenwood couldn't beat it!

I can say that my TS-480 never needed the High Stability Crystal as well. Dead on frequency everytime!

73!
« Last Edit: July 27, 2011, 10:24:40 PM by N2RRA » Logged
M6GOM
Member

Posts: 1014




Ignore
« Reply #59 on: July 28, 2011, 06:50:50 AM »


As far as noise! You couldn't get worse than being in a Hybrid car. The High Voltages your driving in is a receiver killer. Which brings my next point! I could hear signals better through the noise on the ICOM and had less noise than on the Kenwood. So why do I still have the IC-7000? Cause the Kenwood couldn't beat it!


Ah but thats in one of those mickey mouse cars you Americans seem intent on driving in the vain hope of achieving the same fuel efficiency we've had for decades with our diesel cars, lol  Grin Grin Tongue
Logged
Pages: Prev 1 2 3 [4] 5 6 Next   Go Up
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.11 | SMF © 2006-2009, Simple Machines LLC Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!