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Author Topic: Icom IC-7000 or Kenwood TS-480HX (SAT) for a new HAM  (Read 26289 times)
N2RRA
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« Reply #60 on: July 28, 2011, 08:35:50 AM »


As far as noise! You couldn't get worse than being in a Hybrid car. The High Voltages your driving in is a receiver killer. Which brings my next point! I could hear signals better through the noise on the ICOM and had less noise than on the Kenwood. So why do I still have the IC-7000? Cause the Kenwood couldn't beat it!


Ah but thats in one of those mickey mouse cars you Americans seem intent on driving in the vain hope of achieving the same fuel efficiency we've had for decades with our diesel cars, lol  Grin Grin Tongue

Hah Hah! Well at least I'm considerate enough to humanity ,nature and world in general in trying to make the difference instead of being full of selfishness and full of self indulgence.  Wink  Roll Eyes  Cool

I know we talked about public reviews but look at this recent one between the Kenwood TS-480 and a ICOM 7000. VU2YK - third from top!

http://www.eham.net/reviews/detail/5338#102419

Being a CW Ham since I picked up my license I can tell you the ICOM 7K is a awesome CW performer. It's one thing we havent talked about here but it does beat and is another attribute advantage on performance over the TS-480.
« Last Edit: July 28, 2011, 08:39:48 AM by N2RRA » Logged
M6GOM
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« Reply #61 on: July 28, 2011, 10:30:51 AM »

Ah, CW. Sorry, I'm not up to speed with this new fangled communications mode so I can't comment on that aspect. I'm just a phone with a smattering of data from time to time.
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N2RRA
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« Reply #62 on: July 28, 2011, 10:40:07 AM »

Ah, CW. Sorry, I'm not up to speed with this new fangled communications mode so I can't comment on that aspect. I'm just a phone with a smattering of data from time to time.

LOL! Thats alright! One day you'll catch up to speed with the rest of us. Then maybe not.  Wink

If you want a good all around rig or gonna talk about it you have to know it through out fully. One other good reason why reviews have to be taken with a grain of salt. Now at days 65% of Hams don't qualify as Hams to an extent.  Roll Eyes
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N5MOA
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« Reply #63 on: July 28, 2011, 11:50:12 AM »


Being a CW Ham since I picked up my license I can tell you the ICOM 7K is a awesome CW performer. It's one thing we havent talked about here but it does beat and is another attribute advantage on performance over the TS-480.

In your opinion.

My opinion on the 480's cw performance differs from yours. It performs quite well. I did add the narrow cw filter.

Cranking the DSP filter down to 100hz (or 50hz on occasion) during a contest or pileup, I don't recall the 7000 doing any better, if that well.

As I said earlier, Icom has sold a lot of them, and a buddy loves his.

I used one for a bit, and while it is a nice enough rig, there wasn't a single thing about it I preferred over the 480.

YMMV, to each their own yada yada.

I'm just glad we have radio choices. Tongue

« Last Edit: July 28, 2011, 11:53:09 AM by N5MOA » Logged
N2RRA
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« Reply #64 on: July 28, 2011, 12:40:25 PM »


Being a CW Ham since I picked up my license I can tell you the ICOM 7K is a awesome CW performer. It's one thing we havent talked about here but it does beat and is another attribute advantage on performance over the TS-480.

In your opinion.

My opinion on the 480's cw performance differs from yours. It performs quite well. I did add the narrow cw filter.

Cranking the DSP filter down to 100hz (or 50hz on occasion) during a contest or pileup, I don't recall the 7000 doing any better, if that well.

As I said earlier, Icom has sold a lot of them, and a buddy loves his.

I used one for a bit, and while it is a nice enough rig, there wasn't a single thing about it I preferred over the 480.

YMMV, to each their own yada yada.

I'm just glad we have radio choices. Tongue



Agreed! Not trying to push one rig or the other but merely responding to some absurd statements. As you stated in your opinion there were not much difference in CW mode once you installed the CW filter in the TS-480. Before you did that I know there had to be tremendous difference.

Looking at cost effectiveness which was talked about previously after you buy the filter might bring the TS-480's cost closer to the IC-7000. Just another little thing to look at if your a person that just doesn't want to have to go out later and say I have to buy that now or later. All though the wide range of CW filtering from 50Hz on up on the IC-7K is great. Your not limited to optional 250hz, 300hz or 500hz filters like other brands.

Good thing we do have personal options out there. That's why I'll continue to say which ever choice you make initially always try to look into another and compare. If anything buy both and see for your self. Do not limit yourself and stop looking just because you purchased the rig you think is the best due to advice from others.

73!
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W8JX
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« Reply #65 on: July 28, 2011, 04:47:09 PM »


Looking at cost effectiveness which was talked about previously after you buy the filter might bring the TS-480's cost closer to the IC-7000. Just another little thing to look at if your a person that just doesn't want to have to go out later and say I have to buy that now or later. All though the wide range of CW filtering from 50Hz on up on the IC-7K is great. Your not limited to optional 250hz, 300hz or 500hz filters like other brands.


This is misleading because the 7000's skirts (the rate of attenuation outside of 6db rated bandpass) are pretty broad because it is fairly primitive IF DSP.  With 480 the CW rock is a brick wall outside band pass and has very steep skirts and a shape factor of better than 2 to 1. The throw in auto tune and mature audio DSP on top of that and you can slice down to less than 100 hz easily on 480. (Kenwood did auto tune/zerobeat with 570 too)The down side of only AF DSP with a wide front end is AGC swapping but with a tight rock in bandpass ahead of it this potential problem is largely overcome. In a nut shell a 480 without optional rock on CW is lacking but with optional rock it is a very competent radio.
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M6GOM
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« Reply #66 on: July 29, 2011, 05:13:27 AM »


This is misleading because the 7000's skirts (the rate of attenuation outside of 6db rated bandpass) are pretty broad because it is fairly primitive IF DSP. 

I think this is what disappointed me the most with the Icom 7000. I bought it after I'd bought my TS590 which has very sharp skirts with the IF DSP and was expecting something similar with the Icom 7000. I found that the nearby strong signal handling wasn't much better than the TS480 and in hindsight, I'd have been better off buying a 1.8kHz SSB filter than the Icom 7000.

The NB on the Icom 7000 though is a thing of wonder and I can't believe the way it deals with a QRM source I have locally. It certainly makes the 80m band usable for me which the TS590 doesn't.
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W8JX
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« Reply #67 on: July 29, 2011, 07:45:06 AM »


This is misleading because the 7000's skirts (the rate of attenuation outside of 6db rated bandpass) are pretty broad because it is fairly primitive IF DSP. 

I think this is what disappointed me the most with the Icom 7000. I bought it after I'd bought my TS590 which has very sharp skirts with the IF DSP and was expecting something similar with the Icom 7000. I found that the nearby strong signal handling wasn't much better than the TS480 and in hindsight, I'd have been better off buying a 1.8kHz SSB filter than the Icom 7000.

The NB on the Icom 7000 though is a thing of wonder and I can't believe the way it deals with a QRM source I have locally. It certainly makes the 80m band usable for me which the TS590 doesn't.

I have optional 1.8kc filter in my 480 and it is very selective and when used together with AF DSP it can be very tight.  Have you or did you try adjustable DNL on 480 on the static problem? 590 does not have DNL as far as I know.
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N5UD
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« Reply #68 on: July 29, 2011, 09:19:49 AM »

I laid off this debate for a while. I have the TS-480 in the pickup truck. It is hotter than Hades down here in Texas this year. The cab gets really hot out in the sun.
Yet the 480 keeps on ticking. I turn on the power, and the cooling fan starts right up. So the radio knows it is hot. I have kind of been expecting a problem. The LCD display keeps on ticking as well.

Not that it is a problem, but the large plain display on the 480 was one reason I got it. Might just be twisted thinking on my part.

I operate CW. The 480 needs the CW filter installed. I have installed the narrow filter. I also operate full break-in or at other times nearly so. No complaints.

The noise blanker usually works on this radio. Noise from multiple sources, then no it won't.

I have the control head mounted on my dash. I can do all the nifty DX chasing splits, changing freqs, etc pretty easy from that control head.

I like Icom radios in general. I have had many. Just not the 7000. So I can't offer a direct comparison. Just saying the TS-480 works well for me.

73 N5UD Tony
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N2RRA
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« Reply #69 on: July 30, 2011, 12:32:29 PM »

I laid off this debate for a while. I have the TS-480 in the pickup truck. It is hotter than Hades down here in Texas this year. The cab gets really hot out in the sun.
Yet the 480 keeps on ticking. I turn on the power, and the cooling fan starts right up. So the radio knows it is hot. I have kind of been expecting a problem. The LCD display keeps on ticking as well.

Not that it is a problem, but the large plain display on the 480 was one reason I got it. Might just be twisted thinking on my part.

I operate CW. The 480 needs the CW filter installed. I have installed the narrow filter. I also operate full break-in or at other times nearly so. No complaints.

The noise blanker usually works on this radio. Noise from multiple sources, then no it won't.

I have the control head mounted on my dash. I can do all the nifty DX chasing splits, changing freqs, etc pretty easy from that control head.

I like Icom radios in general. I have had many. Just not the 7000. So I can't offer a direct comparison. Just saying the TS-480 works well for me.

73 N5UD Tony

Great Tony!

Learn how to use the radio throughout out well and comment at a later date. Will take some time so you can adjust and experience all you normally would've with the TS-480 as far as QRM, QRN and QSB. Then you can debate all the pro's and con's.

The TS-480 can give the IC-7000 a run for it's money but everyones requirements is different but so is their hearing and common sense.

Hopefully you'll be able to learn how to use the dual mid ,narrow and wide NB adjustment in conjunction with DSP and Filtering. Adjust also receive audio bass and tremble so it appeals to your hearing effectively. These features effectively played a huge role for me mobile hearing those stations that I couldn't on any other radio. I've had quite a few in the mobile over the years.

Problem with most folks is they use one or the other and maybe not thinking to use them in combination. Mostly they just don't want to bother at all and think a radios NB should  work magically making it emmune to all noises.

I find ICOM rigs to generally hear best through the noise. Not all but some!

Anyway! Good luck and enjoy the IC-7K. Which ever winds up being best for you.

73!
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N5UD
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« Reply #70 on: July 30, 2011, 08:26:40 PM »

Oh I forgot to say I hear more stations than I can work. I have tweaked audio filter settings on both receive and transmit.

Since the first of the year, I have worked 209 DXCC countries from my mobile. No amplifier !

Working the 209 is a combination of band conditions, equipment, luck, and maybe some skill at operating.

Again the TS-480 works for me.

Enjoy using your new rig which ever you get.

73 Tony N5UD



 
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KJ6PVR
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« Reply #71 on: July 30, 2011, 09:01:27 PM »

I'm very very close on pulling the trigger on TS-590s. I started this thread with IC-7000 and TS-480, but I might just add a few more hundred bucks and get something that will stay with me for a long time. After reading reviews I changed my mind on learning curve as well. Seems like it will be easier to learn on a radio with "more buttons" on its face than going through deeper menu. I went to look at it to HRO store and it's not that big either. A very nice mid-size transceiver that can be taken out for a field day.
I'll bite a bullet of $600 more than TS-480 would cost, but I look at it as an investment. Seems to me these rigs keep value pretty good.
Thanks everyone who participated in this long thread. I'm sure I'll be back with more dumb questions on different topics  Grin ...

73,
Tom
KJ6PVR
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M6GOM
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« Reply #72 on: August 01, 2011, 10:43:13 AM »

I have optional 1.8kc filter in my 480 and it is very selective and when used together with AF DSP it can be very tight.  Have you or did you try adjustable DNL on 480 on the static problem? 590 does not have DNL as far as I know.

I'd got shut of the old one before the QRM started to come in and I've not tried it on the replacement yet.
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M6GOM
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« Reply #73 on: August 01, 2011, 10:57:21 AM »

Seems like it will be easier to learn on a radio with "more buttons" on its face than going through deeper menu.

Its not just the learning but operating. It is far easier to operate a radio with the settings you need and are likely to change accessible from a button or knob. I sold my FT950 because lots of stuff you use a lot was in menus. Want to change the NB level? Its in a menu. Want to change the DSP NR? Its in a menu. Want to change the power? Its in a menu. So to change the power on a FT950 you press the menu button, twist a knob to go through the menus until you get to the cryptic named one, which is always 50 items away from where the other stuff you use most of the time is, then use another knob to change the value and then press and hold the menu key to lock in the setting.  Then if you want to change the DSP NR setting, you repeat the aforementioned. To do that on the TS590 you press the PWR button on the front and twist a knob until its where you want it to be and thats it. If you then want to change the DSP NR you press and hold the NR button on the front and twist the knob until its where you want it to be.

Whilst it doesn't sound that bad as I write it, wait until you're doing it a few times in an hour.

 
« Last Edit: August 01, 2011, 11:01:19 AM by M6GOM » Logged
W8JX
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« Reply #74 on: August 01, 2011, 04:01:33 PM »

Seems like it will be easier to learn on a radio with "more buttons" on its face than going through deeper menu.

Its not just the learning but operating. It is far easier to operate a radio with the settings you need and are likely to change accessible from a button or knob. I sold my FT950 because lots of stuff you use a lot was in menus. Want to change the NB level? Its in a menu. Want to change the DSP NR? Its in a menu. Want to change the power? Its in a menu. So to change the power on a FT950 you press the menu button, twist a knob to go through the menus until you get to the cryptic named one, which is always 50 items away from where the other stuff you use most of the time is, then use another knob to change the value and then press and hold the menu key to lock in the setting.  Then if you want to change the DSP NR setting, you repeat the aforementioned. To do that on the TS590 you press the PWR button on the front and twist a knob until its where you want it to be and thats it. If you then want to change the DSP NR you press and hold the NR button on the front and twist the knob until its where you want it to be.

Whilst it doesn't sound that bad as I write it, wait until you're doing it a few times in an hour.

 

Kenwood has always been more user/menu friendly than Yaesu. 480 is pretty good too about not needing menu for for common things and some tweaks.
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