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Author Topic: Violating Paypal Agreement  (Read 9094 times)
DAVER
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Posts: 63




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« on: September 12, 2011, 08:00:45 PM »

Why do so many people openly put things about covering the fees for paypal when it's clearly stated in their user agreement that it is not allowed?

4.6 No Surcharges. You agree that you will not impose a surcharge or any other fee for accepting PayPal as a payment method. You may charge a handling fee in connection with the sale of goods or services, as long as the handling fee does not operate as a surcharge and is not higher than the handling fee you charge for non-PayPal transactions.

There's also those goofy semantic ridden credit-card acceptance laws regarding charging more in specific states. You normally don't charge more... but give a cash discount.

Either way just seems weird that so many would violate Paypal TOS and risk their account.

Dave,
KD2AKC
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K8SI
Member

Posts: 21




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« Reply #1 on: September 15, 2011, 01:41:24 PM »

I see this all the time.  I, too have a PP account, and I NEVER charge extra...and won't buy from anyone who does.

73,
Jim  K8SI
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W8JX
Member

Posts: 5659




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« Reply #2 on: September 16, 2011, 07:23:00 AM »

I see this all the time.  I, too have a PP account, and I NEVER charge extra...and won't buy from anyone who does.

73,
Jim  K8SI

You simply pad it into cost of item more or less and not price it too low that you need a surcharge.
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N4NYY
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Posts: 4747




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« Reply #3 on: September 21, 2011, 07:12:11 PM »

Quote
You simply pad it into cost of item more or less and not price it too low that you need a surcharge.

I pad it to, to the cost of shipping.

Remember, shipping should include the materials, labor, gas, time. My Fedex is 20 miles away. That is at least 1.5 gallons of gas.

But you cannot directly push the paypal cost off on the buyer.
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K1CJS
Member

Posts: 5998




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« Reply #4 on: September 22, 2011, 12:32:51 PM »

....Remember, shipping should include the materials, labor, gas, time. My Fedex is 20 miles away. That is at least 1.5 gallons of gas.

But you cannot directly push the paypal cost off on the buyer.

Simply do the math, and add the cost of using paypal and any other expenses to the cost of the item.  Although you can't jack up the price and say the higher price is because of paypal, you can increase the selling price to cover your expenses--ALL your expenses--and there isn't a thing e-bay and paypal can do about it.

The people who offer free shipping do just that, and nothing is ever said about their prices.
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N4NYY
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Posts: 4747




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« Reply #5 on: September 22, 2011, 04:50:57 PM »

Quote
ALL your expenses--and there isn't a thing e-bay and paypal can do about it.

Ebay now charges final value on shipping. In other words, if you sell an item for $300, and charge $20 shipping, they charge their percentage to $320. This just started this year. So, there is something that ebay can do about it. They profit off of your expenses now.

Paypal is a joke, because you are offered no other real alternative.
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K1CJS
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Posts: 5998




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« Reply #6 on: September 23, 2011, 01:23:26 AM »

Ebay now charges final value on shipping. In other words, if you sell an item for $300, and charge $20 shipping, they charge their percentage to $320. This just started this year. So, there is something that ebay can do about it. They profit off of your expenses now....

The issue here is violation of the paypal agreement by charging the buyer what it costs you for the services of listing and paying, not what e-bay and paypal charges you for.

And actually, there is a solution--stop using e-bay.
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N4NYY
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Posts: 4747




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« Reply #7 on: September 23, 2011, 09:56:56 AM »

Quote
The issue here is violation of the paypal agreement by charging the buyer what it costs you for the services of listing and paying, not what e-bay and paypal charges you for.

That is correct. You cannot charge an extra 3% to make up for paypal fees.

I agree with you about stop using ebay.
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K1CJS
Member

Posts: 5998




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« Reply #8 on: September 23, 2011, 07:25:35 PM »

Quote
The issue here is violation of the paypal agreement by charging the buyer what it costs you for the services of listing and paying, not what e-bay and paypal charges you for.

That is correct. You cannot charge an extra 3% to make up for paypal fees.

I agree with you about stop using ebay.

Oh, but you can.  Just increase the price of your item, and keep quiet about it. 

What you can't do is state that you increased the price to cover the paypal fees.
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AA4HA
Member

Posts: 1386




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« Reply #9 on: September 24, 2011, 07:22:33 AM »

If you are selling on eBay and are concerned about the costs of PayPal charges then consider it in the same way a business considers overhead. You add that percentage to your reserve price. (5-10%). (cost of doing business)

With shipping I always try to give the most realistic estimate on what it would cost me to send something to a customer. I always do UPS or USPS with tracking and signature and that costs a bit more but it helps me keep track of when a customer has signed for something.

If I charged $50 for shipping and it cost me $47 I am not going to reimburse for $3. I typically do not make a profit out of the time and drive down to the USPS or UPS offices to ship stuff. In theory I could have USPS or UPS come for a pickup but I live in a rural area and it is a hassle in shipping packages that way.
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Ms. Tisha Hayes, AA4HA
Lookout Mountain, Alabama
DAVER
Member

Posts: 63




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« Reply #10 on: September 25, 2011, 06:55:00 AM »

Quote
The issue here is violation of the paypal agreement by charging the buyer what it costs you for the services of listing and paying, not what e-bay and paypal charges you for.

That is correct. You cannot charge an extra 3% to make up for paypal fees.

I agree with you about stop using ebay.

Oh, but you can.  Just increase the price of your item, and keep quiet about it. 

What you can't do is state that you increased the price to cover the paypal fees.

Exactly. I wasn't as much bringing it up to say shame on you to anyone... like i said you can word things to protect yourself. But think it would be stupid to lose your credit card payment and receiving abilities over an extra $3 or in some cases much less.

73,
dave KD2AKC
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K8AC
Member

Posts: 1465




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« Reply #11 on: September 26, 2011, 11:31:28 AM »

When I brought up this issue a couple of years ago, I was surprised how many guys had never read the Paypal agreement and when faced with the facts, chose to brag about the fact that they didn't follow the agreement.  I look at it this way - if a guy so cavalierly violates a legal agreement that he signed, he probably wouldn't be very concerned about screwing me over either.  So, I never buy from anyone who clearly states the buyer must pay the fee.  With me, it isn't a matter of the money, but one of integrity.

Recently, I learned another thing about the fees from a Russian amateur who bought a transceiver from me through a third party in the USA.  He read the agreement in great detail and discovered that the fees applied to the sale of goods only, and somewhere in the Paypal send money process was an option to send the money as a personal transfer.  If that was selected, the  buyer paid NO FEES!  That applied only to transactions where both parties were in the USA.  So then the question becomes: If you are a hobbyist who does NOT routinely sell gear and use Paypal for the transaction, is such a transaction a sale of goods, or merely a personal transfer?  I tried it once, and it worked as advertised. 

73, K8AC
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