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Author Topic: Big Nuclear booms Come?  (Read 43158 times)
N5RWJ
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Posts: 461




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« on: November 23, 2011, 12:42:23 PM »

Will our Government order Some freq closed, or all of them?
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LA9XSA
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Posts: 376




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« Reply #1 on: November 23, 2011, 03:28:52 PM »

In the CONELRAD days, US amateurs had to shut down their transmitters if regular radio stations stopped transmitting - that indicated that CONELRAD was active. Instead, two AM frequencies were used to inform the public, with transmitters that were shut on and off in a randomized sequence. The purpose of this system was to prevent enemy strategic bombers from using broadcasters and hams as radio direction finding beacons. However, this way of doing it became obsolete by the advent of ballistic missiles, leading to the EBS and EAS systems taking over from CONELRAD.

There could still, however, be a need to prevent enemy agents from hiding their traffic in the din of amateur transmitters, so even though the RDF reason is not as relevant now, the counter-intelligence reason might be relevant for shutting down amateur radio.

If the President shuts down the amateur radio service, RACES stations can - unless otherwise ordered - stay active.

To answer your question, I'd say it would depend on how the bombs come.
- Strategic ballistic attack?
- Terrorist attack by air, with advance warning?
- Other types of terrorist attacks?

If it's ballistic missiles from an enemy nation, maybe it's pointless to shut down amateur radio, as mentioned above.

If it's a terrorist group using hijacked planes or something like that to deliver the bombs, then maybe shutting down GPS, aircraft beacons (VORs and NDRs), the amateur service and terrestial broadcasters would deprive them of navigational aids - so it would be logical to consider the possibility, if there's advance warning, but I don't know if a shut-down is in any current plans.

If it's an unexpected, or land-based, terrorist attack, I think the government will be more concerned with re-establishing communications and inform the public after much equipment and infrastructure has been taken out with an EMP. In this case, amateurs would be needed to help set up alternative communications.

If you look at FEMA's unclassified guidance for managing a nuclear blast event, it talks about the problems of EMP, and it also talks about using the EAS, particularly weather radio for communicating with the public, and the use of two-way radio. It also mentions using volunteers and the National Response Framework - volunteer amateur radio operators could have a role to play here. On a cursory reading, it looks like that guideline is more concerned with terrorism (a single blast in a city) than a strategic ballistic scenario (booms everywhere).
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KE4YOG
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« Reply #2 on: November 23, 2011, 06:47:50 PM »

Considering that I live 5 miles from a major USAF base, 50 miles or so from Camp Lejeune USMC base and 50 or so miles from Ft. Bragg I have a feeling in case of a large exchange of nukes with another country my station will be shut down for ever. We are lucky they moved the bombers out but still. If I hear that we are under attack I will head closer to the base to speed up the process.
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W3LK
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« Reply #3 on: November 25, 2011, 05:14:52 PM »

In case of a nuke exchange, amateur radio will be at the bottom of my worries.
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A smoking section in a restaurant makes as much sense as a peeing section in a swimming pool.
AE6ZW
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« Reply #4 on: November 25, 2011, 07:46:08 PM »

dying from nuclear radiation poisoning is slow and painful process, because burn wound do not heel, like any burning wound is very painful.  I also agree with many others, that I would rather be closer to center of blast so death comes quickly and instantaneously.
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LA9XSA
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« Reply #5 on: November 26, 2011, 06:18:17 AM »

Nuclear attacks are more survivable than you think, if you're outside the immediate blast zone. Fallout is highly radioactive - the good news is that it decays pretty quickly.
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KB2FCV
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« Reply #6 on: November 29, 2011, 02:28:43 PM »

I'm pretty sure most of Northern NJ would be wiped off the face of the earth in a large exchange of nukes (would the 'Jersey Shore' house be one of the strategic targets?) so I don't have all that much to worry about. I don't really think we're anywhere near any sort of threat of a large exchange. If anything I could see a city being a target of some terrorist group if they got a hold of some sort of nuke in the US.
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K1CJS
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« Reply #7 on: December 01, 2011, 06:43:21 AM »

Nuclear attacks are more survivable than you think, if you're outside the immediate blast zone. Fallout is highly radioactive - the good news is that it decays pretty quickly.

It can--and yet again, with some types of N bombs it won't.  That is why some of those are called 'dirty' bombs, because the radioactivity doesn't decay rapidly.  Same sort of radioactivity that is around Cherynobyl and the crippled Japanese Nuclear Generation facility recently in the news.
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LA9XSA
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« Reply #8 on: December 01, 2011, 09:04:20 AM »

A "dirty bomb" is not actually a nuclear explosion, but a conventional explosion used to spread bits of radioactive material. It could indeed contain a variety of isotopes, including ones which take a long time to decay, leading to months of cleanup. If proper sheltering, evacuation and clean-up procedures are followed, it really shouldn't kill many more people than it killed in the initial explosion though.

As for actual nuclear bombs, how much fallout they produce depend both on the type of bomb and where they're detonated. An air burst would create less fallout than a ground burst, for example.
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KE4YOG
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« Reply #9 on: December 01, 2011, 09:49:05 AM »

If you have never watched "Trinity and Beyond" you have missed a great video. Scary but good video!
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KD4LLA
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« Reply #10 on: December 01, 2011, 07:45:47 PM »

What part of "bend over and kiss you butt goodbye" don't you understand about nuclear weapons?  I spent twenty-some years in the US Army, and in training we would hear "When you see the bright light take cover".  Well, if you "see" the bright light, the world you knew is over, and you may wish you were dead...

Amateur radio is the last thing I will be worried about.

Mike
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W8JX
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Posts: 6093




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« Reply #11 on: December 01, 2011, 08:01:30 PM »

What part of "bend over and kiss you butt goodbye" don't you understand about nuclear weapons?  I spent twenty-some years in the US Army, and in training we would hear "When you see the bright light take cover".  Well, if you "see" the bright light, the world you knew is over, and you may wish you were dead...

Amateur radio is the last thing I will be worried about.

Mike

I did time with SAC in 70's and been around some big nukes. There are no winners with them and if they start dropping them, I want to under one because life as you know it will end. And if it is "bad", if you survive blasts it will be slow death. Anyone that thinks it is survivable and is worried about ham radio after blast is not understanding what would really happen.
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All posted wireless using Win 8.1 RT, a Android tablet using 4G/LTE/WiFi or Sprint Note 3.
KA5N
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Posts: 4380




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« Reply #12 on: December 02, 2011, 03:19:15 AM »

This thread reminds me of old Science Fiction books where there is a small band of
people who survive the Holocaust and rebuild civilization.  Hogwash!  If you manage to
stay alive after the big one you are likely to be done in by some other stronger, nastier
survivor who will take what food and other goods you have collected and probably do
you in as well.
Remember the corner grocery won't be doing business as usual.
Allen
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ONAIR
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Posts: 1744




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« Reply #13 on: December 05, 2011, 08:48:06 AM »

Considering that I live 5 miles from a major USAF base, 50 miles or so from Camp Lejeune USMC base and 50 or so miles from Ft. Bragg I have a feeling in case of a large exchange of nukes with another country my station will be shut down for ever. We are lucky they moved the bombers out but still. If I hear that we are under attack I will head closer to the base to speed up the process.

   You need to move!  Get a place out in the middle of nowhere, far from any area that would warrant targeting.  I believe there is a map online which lists all of the probable mainland US targets for nuclear strikes.
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ONAIR
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Posts: 1744




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« Reply #14 on: December 05, 2011, 08:51:18 AM »

In case of a nuke exchange, amateur radio will be at the bottom of my worries.
   Maybe so, but what happens if you survive?  You will definitely need communications.
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