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Author Topic: Before I accidentally blow something up! :)  (Read 10161 times)
N4CR
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Posts: 1694




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« Reply #15 on: February 07, 2012, 05:24:36 PM »

Please don't chew at me because I have a question related to CB  Smiley  I can't find any useful help in those boards.

Are you here to learn? If so, read and learn.

Quote
How high can a Uniden 520 be turned up modulation and/or carrier-wise without sizzling the radio?

According to the manufacturer, around 3.8 watts.

Quote
Someone had one turned up to.....I think it was like 6 or 7 watts (yes, I know. But who out there IS running a totally by the book, absolutely no adjustments made, pure stock CB anymore?) I tried turning the one I had up even more than my ....AHEM!...informant did, (I think I was getting like 8 or 10 watts) and suddenly after about 3 days seen the power output needle indicator on my SWR meter hooked to it drop like a stone!

That was no accident. That was murder.

And LOTS of hams operate at 5 watts or less. It's called QRP operation and it's quite popular. There's even a breed of hams that operate QRPP. Max output 1 watt.

Quote
I've been told that an increase in power by only 2 or 3 or 4 watts won't do anything practical as far as more gain and that you need an antenna with many elements to do that.

Listen to THAT person. They know what they are talking about.

Quote
For some reason though, before I had turned up the power, people couldn't hardly hear me even 10 miles away very well, but after I had it turned up even a few watts (this is before I turned it up more and sizzled it), people were hearing me about 15 or 20 miles away. Could it be the radio was only set at 2 or 3 watts originally? I thought all CB's were set at 4 watts stock...?

Day time? Night time? Were there DX conditions?

There's been lots of times when I couldn't QSO with a station 10 miles from me yet I could be heard half way around the planet. Atmospheric conditions are like that. Unless you can perform A/B tests under the controlled conditions of a test range or test equipment, you can't tell much. You can't depend on anecdotal evidence gathered miles away under various uncontrolled conditions to understand how your changes are making a difference.

And that's just the nature of the beast.

Quote
How high COULD I go on a 520 safely -just out of curiosity?

3.8 watts. It really depends on a lot of factors, some outside the control of the manufacturer of the radio. Such as...

12 volts or 13.8 volts or 14.6 volts was the supply voltage?
50 ohms or 60 ohms or 40 ohms was the apparent impedance at the antenna connector?
Which transistor was used in the final stage?
Did the manufacturer substitute different devices based on parts supply limitations?
What limiting designs were placed around the final stage?
How was the heat sink designed?
Was it properly implemented/secured?
If there was heat sink compound, was the heat sink compound new or years aged and dried out?

And that's just the really obvious ones. There's more.

But the answer to your question is that the company no doubt hired an MBA at some point to optimize profit and that meant he required the process to use the least expensive devices that would meet spec. And that means you can't squeeze much out of it and have any kind of engineering margin of error. Soon you cross that margin and let the smoke out.

And you found out where that was empirically.
« Last Edit: February 07, 2012, 05:38:48 PM by N4CR » Logged

73 de N4CR, Phil

Never believe an atom. They make up everything.
AH6RR
Member

Posts: 803




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« Reply #16 on: February 07, 2012, 06:25:56 PM »

If you want more power on the chicken band ebay sells lots of illeagal radios and amps. I would not risk my ticket for any chicken crap oh I mean band stuff. So dont ask about the mars mods either.
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AD6KA
Member

Posts: 2238




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« Reply #17 on: February 07, 2012, 09:29:51 PM »

Quote
K9ZHW:
You REALLY think they're going to waste time and taxpayer $ running around tracking down and giving citations to every Tom Dick and Harry who has 5+ watts coming out of their CB or running a small 50 or 100 watt amplifier, or run around saying to everyone "let me see your CB to make sure it hasn't been altered inside"? Trust me, they won't -unless they're called to investigate a major case (such as mentioned above) and JUST HAPPEN to spot something. People I know have written in about "pee wee" violations and have been told "Don't look for anything within the next 30 years" -in not so many words. (By the way, they even ignore complaints of people messing around on Ch. 9 -unless again, they've repeatedly interfered with emergency communications- and even then the worst I've seen happen is a "threat" to get the local police involved, and all they can legally do (unless they cost someone their life hampering emergency personnel) is issue a ticket for, at the worst, disorderly conduct, which probably wouldn't stand up in court alone anyway.)

I can't believe a licensed ham could write such drivel.
True, the FCC can't go after every CB'er operating
illegally.
But, they DO go after those they can. For operating
in and and interfering with ham bands,
running illegal power, "Freebanding"
interfering with neighbor's electronics....
(In other words, they're saying "we know you're
running illegal power") Don't take my word, the
FCC Enforcement actions and letters are public information
For just a SAMPLE
check out this short list of FCC Enforcement Actions.

http://transition.fcc.gov/eb/AmateurActions/files/Bruba10_06_01_5170.html

Scroll down to "Warning Letters" and click on several and
you will find quite a few regarding CB'ers and their
"WARNING FOR UNLICENSED RADIO OPERATIONS."


And if you think a warning letter from the FCC
is a "joke" the jokes on you. You MUST respond with
a full explanation of your radio antics (when, where, why)
within 10 days, or your file moves up the food chain towards a "Notification of Apparent Liability" in the ballpark of $10,000.

Hell, the case may move up the food chain towards a NAL anyway,
no matter how you respond, depending on what evidence
they have on you, and your attitude.
Ken,  AD6KA
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AJ4CU
Member

Posts: 78




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« Reply #18 on: February 07, 2012, 10:29:15 PM »

Hello All,
My own brother in law is a cb guy, dave made amp, rci modded rig, and all the annoying sounds etc that goes with it, now sadly he lives two doors down from me and has in the past interfered with my legal amateur operations,
 I had repeatedly spoken to him telling him that he is interfering with my station and have requested he refrain from using that splatterbox he calls an amp, his response "The FCC will do nothing"!
 I also monitered him and several others in my area (yes I own a legal CB, no mods, box stock, one can never have too many ways to communicate) talking about our feud and how much of an ass I am for confronting him.
Finally one weekend during a contest he was killing me on 10 and 15 M, I called him on the phone and politely asked to stop, what I got was a drunken tirade....Told him I was done with him and I was making a complaint to the FCC.
I had concise logs, field strength logs, recordings etc... submitted them and viola, within a few days he got a letter ( I got a copy also from Riley, we had spoken on the phone prior to the formal complaint) to my suprise who comes a knocking asking I call off the FCC, I told him to tell someone who cares and that he brought this upon himself....
Anyway after a few weeks I found out he sold the amp and stopped using power, no longer interfering with my operations I spoke to Riley and he sent another letter basically saying next time will be the demise of his cb days.

This is a condensed version of the events that took place, neighbors from adjoining streets were banging on my door simply due to my tower so I had to be the guy tearing into their stereos, baby monitors etc...what a friking nightmare...

So in closing YES the FCC will do something about it and it was in very poor taste to even ask the question on this site, rules are for a reason...

73 all DE AJ4CU
Hari
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KF5IIL
Member

Posts: 22




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« Reply #19 on: February 08, 2012, 03:30:54 AM »

We should follow the laws and regulations because it is the right thing to do, not because whether or not some agency enforces them. 

The radio community in general (not just amateurs) works in the overall because the community works together.  We are our own discipline (and always have been). It just works a lot easier that way.  The threat of enforcement and punishment is only relevant to those with a "wink, wink, say no more" attitude.
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K1CJS
Member

Posts: 6055




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« Reply #20 on: February 08, 2012, 04:44:11 AM »

Sorry, but my take on this is that you want help to increase the 'output' of your CB.  That isn't legal, and you come onto a ham radio site to get advice about how to do it?

Well, the advice is this:  Leave well enough alone.  Don't diddle with the radio and it will last you a good long time.

And that is the ONLY advice you should be getting from here.
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N4NYY
Member

Posts: 4818




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« Reply #21 on: February 08, 2012, 08:39:46 AM »

Unless you have an RF sampler and a scope, you need a peak-reading meter.

Please correct me if I am wrong (I cannot recall) for sure, but on AM, 100% modulation would be achieved if you peaks 4 times the carrier. In other words, if you peak 8 watts on a 2 watt deadkey, that should be 100%. Any more, is splatter. Slightly less is fine.

If it is clipped, forget about it. Adjusting modulation pot will do nothing. And the waveform will look like crap on a scope.

If people bring me clipped CB, I will refuse to work on them unless I can un-clip them. If they ask me to clip, I refuse.
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N9ZHW
Member

Posts: 80




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« Reply #22 on: February 08, 2012, 12:02:33 PM »

@ AJ4CU (sorry, tried to P.M. this but system keeps saying it can't find you)

I don't know how you managed to do that (refering to your response to my thread today). I just told another guy via P.M. that I've written countless letters, e-mails and phonecalls to the FCC about the tons of CB violations today (including the what has become common practice of idle chattering on Ch. 9 which is supposed to be for emergency or travelers assistance use only) and all I ever got was what looked like a run off copy of the previous letter saying to sum it up "sorry, we're too busy nowadays with tv, commercial stations, cable, satilite, and dozens of other higher priority issues. Don't look for anything within the next 30 years." You must either be near an office, know Riley Hollingsworth personally or something.  Smiley   (Actually I was told a few years ago Hollingsworth retired and they didn't bother to fill his spot due to budget issues in Washinton DC.)
I guess from my experiences, they apparently don't even CARE about CB anymore -short of using it to pass terrorist or unauthorized classified information -or darn near that severe.
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N4NYY
Member

Posts: 4818




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« Reply #23 on: February 08, 2012, 12:54:25 PM »

Quote
(Actually I was told a few years ago Hollingsworth retired and they didn't bother to fill his spot due to budget issues in Washinton DC.)
I guess from my experiences, they apparently don't even CARE about CB anymore -short of using it to pass terrorist or unauthorized classified information -or darn near that severe.

His replacement is Laura Smith, and you can find CB violations notices on their websites. Not sure about what you are complaining on Ch.9, but I would venture to guess that that is the lowest priority for enforcement, and rightfully so. I would highly doubt that police actually monitor that channel anymore, and you could get help faster from Ch.19 and a cell phone. There are more important uses for enforcement dollars than enforcing Ch.9.
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N9ZHW
Member

Posts: 80




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« Reply #24 on: February 08, 2012, 02:16:35 PM »


 Not sure about what you are complaining on Ch.9, but I would venture to guess that that is the lowest priority for enforcement, and rightfully so. I would highly doubt that police actually monitor that channel anymore, and you could get help faster from Ch.19 and a cell phone. There are more important uses for enforcement dollars than enforcing Ch.9.
[/quote]

My point exactly......They don't care about CB stuff anymore -not just the idle chat on Ch. 9 but ANYTHING. And they're not going to waste taxpayer $ and their time running after such pee-wee things. I have yet after 27 years of CB-ing, to see anyone get chewed out or fined or anything related to Part 95 Subpart D violations unless, again, it involves or is tied to major criminal activity. The guys I previously mentioned who were bleeding on local EMS transmitters and radio stations are such a case. Other than that, I wouldn't worry about my -or anyone else's- 5+ watt CB. Anywho, I think I just found the wisdom of "how to" I'm looking for on altavista.com  Smiley  Smiley  Smiley
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AJ4CU
Member

Posts: 78




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« Reply #25 on: February 08, 2012, 03:54:42 PM »

N9ZHW,

I feel you are not listening to your fellow amateurs, this is basically a moot point, noone here is going to assist you in rule breaking, Period!

I did/do not know Riley however if one simply submits a properly formatted and signed (this is important!) complaint with substantial evidence it will be followed through with, I do not know where you get your info from but alas it is dismally incorrect! If you are dead set on using a cb then buy one, use a good antenna get it up at proper height and go with it and relax, whether or not you can key over rubber duck or pig pen is kinda stupid...nuff said...

GL ES 73 DE AJ4CU
Hari

P.S. I prefer you air anything you want to say to me right here in the forums, a PM is useless as i would just post it here anyway in my response...
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AJ4CU
Member

Posts: 78




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« Reply #26 on: February 08, 2012, 04:02:40 PM »

Here is something for you to mentally ingest...

http://www.qsl.net/wb5rue/part95plainenglish.html


Read it, understand it, apply it, go tell it on the mountain!
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N9ZHW
Member

Posts: 80




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« Reply #27 on: February 08, 2012, 04:08:05 PM »

Well, never mind guys.....I found the wisdom I need on a search with altavista.com
I'm 10-7.....10-4?  Smiley
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N9ZHW
Member

Posts: 80




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« Reply #28 on: February 09, 2012, 02:03:44 PM »

Actually those of you who seem so rightous (I use the term loosely...no offense) about something as pee-wee as having a CB going at 5 watts, you should talk to KB8UCN  (Michael Hunter). He's actually 1 of the several who have played with/adjusted, or whatever you want to call it my CB. I recall him cutting this, turning on that, etc. so that it WOULD be louder. (This was a # of years ago, but still....). So, in retrospect guys, not all amateurs are the "Careful, I can't step on any cracks", if you will, kind. Now, if there are amateurs here and there that will do something like that here and there, I wouldn't make a mountain out of a mole hill.
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N4CR
Member

Posts: 1694




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« Reply #29 on: February 09, 2012, 03:01:13 PM »

Actually those of you who seem so rightous (I use the term loosely...no offense) about something as pee-wee as having a CB going at 5 watts, you should talk to KB8UCN  (Michael Hunter). He's actually 1 of the several who have played with/adjusted, or whatever you want to call it my CB. I recall him cutting this, turning on that, etc. so that it WOULD be louder. (This was a # of years ago, but still....). So, in retrospect guys, not all amateurs are the "Careful, I can't step on any cracks", if you will, kind. Now, if there are amateurs here and there that will do something like that here and there, I wouldn't make a mountain out of a mole hill.


Great, you found a ham who's willing to be a criminal. I'm really impressed. Especially the part where you think it's a good idea. And bonus points for documenting the deed in a public place.

Why are you here?
« Last Edit: February 09, 2012, 03:07:52 PM by N4CR » Logged

73 de N4CR, Phil

Never believe an atom. They make up everything.
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