Call Search
     

New to Ham Radio?
My Profile

Community
Articles
Forums
News
Reviews
Friends Remembered
Strays
Survey Question

Operating
Contesting
DX Cluster Spots
Propagation

Resources
Calendar
Classifieds
Ham Exams
Ham Links
List Archives
News Articles
Product Reviews
QSL Managers

Site Info
eHam Help (FAQ)
Support the site
The eHam Team
Advertising Info
Vision Statement
About eHam.net

   Home   Help Search  
Pages: Prev 1 [2]   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic: Extinction Level Event?  (Read 12213 times)
N3OX
Member

Posts: 8852


WWW

Ignore
« Reply #15 on: June 06, 2012, 06:06:12 AM »

I'd bet that the scientist who admit that they never even expected this event with the tuna even know what they are talking about now and I'd bet that the scientist stopped eating tuna along time ago.

As I understand it the tuna is 3% more radioactive than it was before.

It's just that the small increase in radioactivity is due to a large increase in the relatively uncommon radioactive cesium.  There's a big "cesium signal" in the fish that came from Fukushima, which is really cool for tracking the spread of the radioactive release, but there are other radioactive elements in the tuna that stick around longer (potassium I think) that make it so that the large increase in radioactive cesium is only a small increase in the total radioactivity of the fish, which is already quite small.

It's cool that we can detect this kind of stuff, and it's helpful to understand fish migration patterns and so on, but there's just no health risk from this fish.  Probably good for the tuna if everyone is scared of dying of cancer from them though... we're overfishing 'em.  Could be Fukushima and overblown news reports will let them bounce back a bit Grin

As far as a further Fukushima disaster depopulating the Northern Hemisphere?  Nonsense.  If you follow the links in that article you will find http://akiomatsumura.com/2012/04/682.html where there's a quote from Robert Alvarez saying:

"About 134 million curies is Cesium-137 — roughly 85 times the amount of Cs-137 released at the Chernobyl accident"

The author at akiomatsumura.com then writes:

"Many of our readers might find it difficult to appreciate the actual meaning of the figure, yet we can grasp what 85 times more Cesium-137 than the Chernobyl would mean. It would destroy the world environment and our civilization."

I doubt that's supportable.  The radioactivity released at Chernobyl barely destroyed the environment and civilization in TOWN, and had fairly small and unclear effects on surrounding countries (to the point where there's some question if thyroid cancers went up in neighboring countries simply because people started bothering getting CHECKED for thyroid cancer) and no dangerous effect to speak of around the world.  The average dose of radiation that humans on this planet got from Chernobyl was equivalent to less than a day of exposure to the average natural background radiation.  

85 times worse than that would be a lot worse but it wouldn't wipe us out.  Not even close. Probably still isn't worse for someone in the U.S. than having radon in your basement. I wouldn't be surprised if we found  some statistically significant increased cancer rates in the dense nearby plume if the plume hit land instead of going out to the Pacific first.  Maybe even further afield.  But we need to remember that to wipe out civilization from radiation would require significant modification of life expectancy. So many of us die of cancer anyway ...

Now, I'm not trying to say there's no danger.  That would be silly. I'm also not trying to say that everyone involved would be forthright and honest.  It's already clear that people were trying to cover up the problems in nuclear plants in Japan and they won't stop now. And it would be a real disaster for Japan if there was a further massive release.  We need to watch out for it.  But I suspect the real danger to the rest of the world is the massive fear and near-term economic impact of a "super-Chernobyl" coupled with the fact that Fukushima has already nearly completely destroyed the chance of new, safer nuclear fission plants as a clean plentiful domestic alternative to fossil fuels, and a further disaster would be the last nail in the coffin.

I am quite certain that the main consequences to the life, health and prosperity of most of our planet of further radioactive release from Fukushima have really nothing to do with radiation.  Japan is a different story.

And extinction from a further radioactive release at Fukushima is even sillier.  To make the Northern Hemisphere really uninhabitable (as opposed to just wreaking destruction on our modern way of life) there would have to be so much radiation that it killed people before breeding age and made it impossible to grow food and so forth.  Look at what is actually going on very close to Chernobyl these days!  Some people still live inside the highly irradiated zone.  It's not a desirable place to live  but if you just uniformly dumped that concentration of radiation on the whole Northern hemisphere such that no one had a choice but to live with the new radioactivity of their surroundings, we'd get used to it.

I read an article recently that was suggesting that  the biggest real consequence of Chernobyl was that it eliminated a huge expanse of incredibly fertile land from food production for Europe, and that this has deeply serious economic consequences.  If we weren't so spooked by radiation, this wouldn't be an issue, because the scare is significantly worse than the stuff.
« Last Edit: June 06, 2012, 06:35:22 AM by N3OX » Logged

73,
Dan
http://www.n3ox.net

Monkey/silicon cyborg, beeping at rocks since 1995.
KE5JDJ
Member

Posts: 21




Ignore
« Reply #16 on: June 17, 2012, 05:53:35 AM »

I would not get too worked up because of an article on a conspiracy theory website.  And hundreds of above ground nuclear tests occurred between 1945 and 1963, when the Partial Test Ban Treaty was signed. 

Exactly.  Go to Google Maps and input these coordinates: 37.116252,-116.044636

Count the nuclear bomb craters for yourself.

Logged

Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom.
It is the argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves.
-William Pitt, British prime-minister (1759-1806)
W8JX
Member

Posts: 5447




Ignore
« Reply #17 on: June 17, 2012, 01:15:52 PM »

Exactly.  Go to Google Maps and input these coordinates: 37.116252,-116.044636

Count the nuclear bomb craters for yourself.

Then count people living there too.....
Logged

--------------------------------------
Entered using a  WiFi Win 8.1 RT tablet or a Android tablet using 4G/LTE or WiFi.
KB1TXK
Member

Posts: 438


WWW

Ignore
« Reply #18 on: June 18, 2012, 11:18:12 AM »

2053 detonations between 1944 and 1998

All of them mapped:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I9lquok4Pdk
Logged

N5RWJ
Member

Posts: 461




Ignore
« Reply #19 on: June 19, 2012, 02:24:47 PM »

2053 detonations between 1944 and 1998

All of them mapped:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I9lquok4Pdk
I think they missed the second Nuk in Japan?
Logged
KB2FCV
Member

Posts: 1139


WWW

Ignore
« Reply #20 on: June 20, 2012, 07:39:44 AM »

No offense to anyone in particular...but why do so many hams have this doom and gloom mentality? Its so damned depressing to tune across the bands and listen to guys crying about how bad things are and we're all going to die due to some government conspiracy. Some of you boys need some prozac or something geeez!

I think the whole prepper/survivalist thing goes a little far. Yes, there are very slim possibilities of some of their scenarios occuring, but to spend 10's of 100's of thousands of dollars "prepping" with years of food stores, etc... I think is a little over the top. I just don't see it where families will be killing eachother to get at someone eles's food stores, etc. I do think, though, it is important to be prepared with some food/water stores, and other needs to keep you going for at least a good couple of weeks, and supplies in case you have to relocate and leave the home with a planned place to go (even it its just a relative/friends/hotel) We've seen examples such as Hurricane Katrina where a localized area was wiped out.
Logged
ONAIR
Member

Posts: 1735




Ignore
« Reply #21 on: June 20, 2012, 09:04:59 PM »

No offense to anyone in particular...but why do so many hams have this doom and gloom mentality? Its so damned depressing to tune across the bands and listen to guys crying about how bad things are and we're all going to die due to some government conspiracy. Some of you boys need some prozac or something geeez!

I think the whole prepper/survivalist thing goes a little far. Yes, there are very slim possibilities of some of their scenarios occuring, but to spend 10's of 100's of thousands of dollars "prepping" with years of food stores, etc... I think is a little over the top. I just don't see it where families will be killing eachother to get at someone eles's food stores, etc. I do think, though, it is important to be prepared with some food/water stores, and other needs to keep you going for at least a good couple of weeks, and supplies in case you have to relocate and leave the home with a planned place to go (even it its just a relative/friends/hotel) We've seen examples such as Hurricane Katrina where a localized area was wiped out.
   No matter how bad things get, the odds are that at least some of us will survive!  Let's pick a frequency to meet on, and always keep those batteries charged! Smiley
Logged
KD8DEY
Member

Posts: 352




Ignore
« Reply #22 on: June 21, 2012, 10:09:14 PM »

I have an extinction level event a few hours after I make Chilli
Logged
KD8DEY
Member

Posts: 352




Ignore
« Reply #23 on: June 21, 2012, 10:14:32 PM »


Reminds me of some of the humor during the cold war scares of the A-bomb being dropped on us--"The thing to do if the bomb IS dropped is sit down under a desk or table, put your head between your legs--and kiss your @$$ goodbye!"
I'd rather kiss that cute red head with the big.................After all We're all gonna die!!!
Logged
LA9XSA
Member

Posts: 376




Ignore
« Reply #24 on: June 22, 2012, 04:09:04 PM »

Survivalism and preparedness is a good thing, as long as you avoid becoming myopic about it, and stay realistic. For example, some store food but forget how to secure water. Some people store types of food that they don't want to eat. Some people only have a shelter-in-place plan, but no bug-out plan. Some people focus only on communications, or focus just on the end of the world without preparing for house fires or tornadoes.
Logged
Pages: Prev 1 [2]   Go Up
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.11 | SMF © 2006-2009, Simple Machines LLC Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!