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Author Topic: Repeaters not being used? You've been 'Punked'  (Read 6455 times)
WA4D
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« on: July 21, 2012, 07:17:53 PM »

Here in Los Angeles a random scan of assigned repeater frequencies reveals much dark spectrum.  Traffic is light by almost any definition. Dozens and Dozens and Dozens (many private) repeaters sit silent only to dutifully Auto ID every 10 minutes and then return to non use for days on end.

This condition is not limited to Los Angeles as Washington DC area hams have stated that the traffic levels are low on the VHF/UHF bands in their region. I'm betting this is the norm across the nation with a few exceptions.

The FCC should do unannounced Band Loading analysis in various geographic regions and immediately seize large swaths of these unused bands. Said spectrum should be given up for commerial use or turned into Non Licensed spectrum.

The ARRL is constantly squealing over one injustice or another done to Ham radio. The oracle of the ARRL K1ZZ writes in the current QST about the "threat" of  HOA rules.    --- It's time for the league to take a leadership position and demonstrate to the FCC that they are a responsible body. Use the spectrum or give it back.

One of the great myths of Ham radio is that it is a medium for reliable and meaningful  communication.  It may be reliable but hardly meaningful. (Tune ANY band and find literate, informed, substantive discourse....It's not there). Nor are the upper bands used more than occasionally. And then most often for the most insipid exchanges. "Traffic is light this morning Fred"...."I'm destinated now, Henry".

In the absence of authoritative metrics we are left to speculate. The reduction in entrance standards for ham licensing, allowed a flood of new ticket holders who bought into the illusion of ham radio as an exciting hobby. Moreover the vast majority of those who entered, came to use VHF/UHF spectrum. My own empirical observations note that few of these would be hams are techologists   They listened to the propagandists of the hobby and bought their cheap entry level VHF/UHF radios with easily mounted commercial antennas (it was plug n play heaven) ----- And after they finally broke into a local repeater with it's insular culture and  gave a few weather reports while driving to work, many realized, "Hey, I've been "punked!"   They saw ham radio for what it is!  The culture of the spectrum they are allowed to use was revealed to be shallow and populated by a mind numbingly bland group.

End the farce of allocating frequencies to those that don't use it.

mike/ wa4d.net  
« Last Edit: July 21, 2012, 07:25:06 PM by WA4D » Logged
K2OWK
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« Reply #1 on: July 21, 2012, 09:20:13 PM »

I think this is a troll. Please read up on Ham radio from its beginning. There is a reason why the FCC and most world radio organisations give more radio spectrum to Hams then any other entity. I am not going to give all the reasons, but realize without Ham radio you would not have SSB, Different antenna designs and arrays, The ability to use upper RF frequencies for for long range communication and on and on. Ham radio offers a vast information and experimentation system for communication and electronics. Emergency communications in time of disaster (cell phone towers fall down during tornadoes and hurricanes). Hams can be up and running emergency communications in minutes. Ham radio is a hobby that can be used for all aspects of communications and electronic technology. It is also used for rag chews for those that like to just discuss things, say with a fellow in China or Australia or just about any country in the world good understanding comes from this, and we realize that we have may thing in commen. If you are board with Amateur radio just leave it, don't distroy it for others that enjoy it. I am glad (if you notice) we are getting more frequencies for our use. I guess we must be doing something right. The FCC loves Ham operators even though there are not that many of us.

PROUD TO BE A HAM FOR MORE THEN 50 YEARS AND STILL ENJOING IT.

73s

K2OWK
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KG4NEL
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« Reply #2 on: July 21, 2012, 09:33:22 PM »

Quote
I think this is a troll.

The "real ham radio is only what I like to do" one. Fairly common.
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KA1MDA
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« Reply #3 on: July 22, 2012, 02:09:10 AM »

At least he's consistant in his trolling!

http://www.papays.com/dogqrz1.wav
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KG4RUL
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« Reply #4 on: July 22, 2012, 06:09:46 AM »

http://www.kg4rul.info/TrollAlert.jpg
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K9YLI
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« Reply #5 on: July 22, 2012, 08:23:55 AM »

Some of the problems is withthe co-ordinating  groups.

I believe that  repeater pairs  should be assigned, for a one year period.
I you don't have a working  repeater in one year, then you give up the assignment and start over.   no more of the  restriced pairs with  no repeater, just a status symbol.

I also would prefer  that all tone access be removed.
Backin the 70s  all were open and you could key up repeaters from all over with a band opening.  Now  you almost cannot tell there is a band opening.
I have had many  three way  conversatons using  two repeaters.  Almost like  HF.
now you have to  fumble with the  right tone, and  you cant do that while driving.
Since  repeater use is  ''way down' ,  who cares if there is interaction between repeaters.
Let everyone join in a conversation if  acceptable.

 If there is  'no usage'  on a repeater, so what if  some one keys up  two or more..

Don't complain, join the conversation.
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WA4D
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« Reply #6 on: July 22, 2012, 12:20:51 PM »

Interesting ideas you suggest Don.

And I'd welcome them among others. But change does not come easy to Amateur radio.

Cheers from LA
Mike/wa4d.net
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KCJ9091
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« Reply #7 on: July 22, 2012, 04:22:47 PM »

Some of the repeaters around here are linked to so many different linked systems they never shut up and keep the scanner from scanning to tell if there was any activity on any other repeater unless I lock the offending repeater out of the scan list.
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AA4PB
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« Reply #8 on: July 22, 2012, 05:15:19 PM »

"I also would prefer that all tone access be removed."

Sometimes there is a valid reason for tone access. We had a situation where another coordinated repeater on the same frequency pair had some users that were located in the "fringe" area of the local repeater. When those stations were using their repeater they were breaking the squelch on our local repeater and we all had to listen the the weak, noisy signals. Tone access solved the problem.
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K1ZJH
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« Reply #9 on: July 22, 2012, 05:57:51 PM »

This is the same troll who wanted ham mobile operations banned. LOL. It was all part of his plan to kill repeater activity so
he can steal the spectrum Smiley

Seriously, why bother giving him an audience and the benefit of a serious response?

BTW, many repeater controllers, such as the Computer Automation models, can be programmed to allow
a user to enter a STAR key on his TT pad to put the repeater in open access. That gives non-PL users access
to the machine when they need it. PL tones should be programmed in rig before you back out of the driveway.
 
Pete
« Last Edit: July 22, 2012, 06:01:50 PM by K1ZJH » Logged
K7RBW
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« Reply #10 on: July 23, 2012, 06:57:02 AM »

I would think that these days, you could have an SDR logging activity on the entire 2-m band (or any other band) and post histories of usage on the web. That almost seems like a no-brainer: collect the data and make it public. That would quickly and publicly Mythbust the "nobody's using the repeaters!" claims (one way or the other).

Of course, that begs the question of what to do with that information, which could get tricky...
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K8AXW
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« Reply #11 on: July 23, 2012, 09:02:43 AM »

Anyone read ZJH's comment??  Why are you people commenting on nonsense?  If you don't comment the troll has failed!
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WA4D
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« Reply #12 on: July 26, 2012, 06:39:59 AM »

K7BRW suggests a band loading data gathering plan that makes sense. And then poses the question, but "then what to do with that information?"

Easy. You publish it.  Transparently. Indeed, there is no reason your suggested concept couldn't be posted in real time on the net for anyone to  see, with aggregate history pages complete with time graphs and location and numbers of repeaters in use vs. those not in play at any given time.

But that's pretty ambitious and the propagandists of the hobby won't welcome such scrutiny.  I'm betting most areas would do fine with say a half dozen repeater pairs on 144/450 each. The rest of the spectrum should be reallocated and removed from ham radio.

What's the likelihood of that? Slim. Ham radio is fundamentally the same as it was a half century ago. WARC bands were introduced, a few AM stations dropped off 7.0mhz, the ham band allocations tweaked ever so slightly. But for the most part the spectrum assignments to ham radio are little changed.
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KA6MLE
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« Reply #13 on: July 26, 2012, 03:38:23 PM »

Poor old guy. He sounds very angry, hope he finds happiness before he dies. I have listened to repeaters down in LA when I am on vacation down that way (believe or not there are some places that I still really like in SoCal! lol). There seems to be PLENTY of repeater use down in that area, don't know what he is talking about. But some of the repeaters (2 of them that I know) should have the plug pulled on them by the FCC, 147.435 W6NUT, to name one. They are full of obscenity, jamming, bad acting children, etc... total waste of time and totally against the spirit of Amateur Radio. Oh well, I just change the channel to a QSO that has meaning, plenty to be found around the frequencies.  Grin
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K1CJS
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« Reply #14 on: July 27, 2012, 03:55:45 AM »

The 'Ignore' button is there for a reason.  Use it.
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