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Author Topic: What to buy Kenwood TS-2000 or Yaesu FT-950  (Read 14022 times)
N4NYY
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Posts: 4749




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« Reply #30 on: August 01, 2012, 06:09:46 AM »

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So there's $25 of the $200 difference. And if you want to use more than one program with the radio simultaneously which requires access to the COM port you can't without spending more money.

It is actually less now, since both prices have changed.

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Want to do digital modes? Get out the cheque book again for an interface. The TS590 does audio over USB installing it as a separate soundcard so you don't have to tie up the soundcard in your computer for digital modes.

I do not do digital modes. Have no interest. Still, if I did, I do not think it would matter. But that is just me.  

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Buy your FT950. Just don't complain when you find you can't see the top half of the display when you're stood up looking down at it nor that you can't see the display at all in bright light nor that to change power settings requires several key presses and diving into the 200 entry menu with its cryptic labelling. Oh and don't complain when you find that the inbuilt ATU won't match your G5RV because it is very narrow in what it'll tune.

I have bought 2 (first one took a lightning hit), and have not complained yet. The display one reason I like it. I can easily distinguish the colors into what they mean. For example, when I get full power out, I see red in the bar graph. I also see high SWR. Green is for the filtering. Quick Identification. Red for processor and EQ. Try that with the mono-chrome 590. All the great technological advances for the 590, and they still cannot get past the mono-chrome display.

Secondly, The RF power knob is overrated. It takes about "1 keystrokes" to enter it, and 1 to set it. You spin the VFO to the proper menu. But all that is moot, because I use HRD, which has an RF power slider and turns the power down instantaneously. In fact, Most everything can be done from the HRD. Got DXCC with the 950, all by turning down the RF power using HRD. In fact, so many people that bitch about the RF power not having a knob, makes me think they are just whiny, since it really is no big deal, even without HRD.

Regarding tuning the G5RV, most rigs, not just the 950, cannot tune a G5RV.

Last fact. All these post are pure opinion, since there is no 950 receiver data on Sherwood. NONE. The closest thing you have is W8JX, who had them side by side on the same antenna. And the 950 has internally changed over the years., and is on the 2nd EDSP.

Oh, BTW. I went to the TS-590 reviews, and found that while it in fact has a great receiver, it seems to lack SSB punch. That appears to be the biggest complaint.

Also, I found a review from an M6GOM, and he listed the 590 cons:

"Cons:
IF Shift is completely absent on phone and I miss that. It worked on all modes on both the FT-950 and TS480. You have to mess with hi and low cut to get the same effect.
Manual notch is too broad. The FT950 had it about right. This could be addressed with a firmware update so we'll see.
FT-950 Contour is something I miss. It was nice to set it to +5 and move about to help boost audio.
Still have to cycle through NR1-NR2-OFF and BC1-BC2-OFF.
FT950 has the advantage on the tuning dial due to being infinitely adjustable from no resistance to needing a stilson to turn it. The TS590 has only two settings and for me the light setting is a bit too light and the stiff too stiff."

Thanks for that info. Gotta love the reviews. No IF shift control, huh? What would you rather have? RF power knob of IF shift? LOL


BTW, to all you FT-950 owners. Not sure if you know this, but you can greatly improve the RX audio. Menu 069 is the "countour" control. Default out of the box is -15. Change this to +10, and watch your RX audio dramatically improve. You can toggle the Contour on and off to see the difference.

« Last Edit: August 01, 2012, 06:37:40 AM by N4NYY » Logged
W8JX
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« Reply #31 on: August 01, 2012, 07:04:26 AM »

I have bought 2 (first one took a lightning hit), and have not complained yet. The display one reason I like it. I can easily distinguish the colors into what they mean. For example, when I get full power out, I see red in the bar graph. I also see high SWR. Green is for the filtering. Quick Identification. Red for processor and EQ. Try that with the mono-chrome 590. All the great technological advances for the 590, and they still cannot get past the mono-chrome display.

Actually a discharge type color display on 950 is a step backwards not forward. It is simply eye candy that has it own limitations. The 590's LCD display is superior in ALL lighting conditions and capable of excellent detail too

Secondly, The RF power knob is overrated. It takes about "1 keystrokes" to enter it, and 1 to set it. You spin the VFO to the proper menu. But all that is moot, because I use HRD, which has an RF power slider and turns the power down instantaneously. In fact, Most everything can be done from the HRD. Got DXCC with the 950, all by turning down the RF power using HRD. In fact, so many people that bitch about the RF power not having a knob, makes me think they are just whiny, since it really is no big deal, even without HRD.

Not whiny at all. It is poor design planning on 950 to require using menu then VFO to set pwr out. On a 590 the VFO knob is only for VFO like it should be and very easy access to power settings without accessing main menu to do it.

Regarding tuning the G5RV, most rigs, not just the 950, cannot tune a G5RV.

My "old" 570 will will easily tune a G5RV type antenna and since the 590 uses same basic design tuner it should do so as well. Given that a G5RV is a popular antenna that has been around for many years it does not speak well for 950's inability to accommodate it.

Last fact. All these post are pure opinion, since there is no 950 receiver data on Sherwood. NONE. The closest thing you have is W8JX, who had them side by side on the same antenna. And the 950 has internally changed over the years., and is on the 2nd EDSP.

The 950 is still a dated design in DSP world and 590 is more advanced. Why do you think Yaesu is developing 3000? Because 950 is no match for 590.

Oh, BTW. I went to the TS-590 reviews, and found that while it in fact has a great receiver, it seems to lack SSB punch. That appears to be the biggest complaint.

This is easy to "fix". By default TX audio is flat and low level and it today world of plug and play hams few take time to learn the rig and properly set it up. Such hams are better off with simpler/older analog or simply DSP designs with few option on them. The 480 is same on audio out of the box but if you take to to learn to set it up properly the 590 like 480 can have superb audio with outstanding punch on demand. 
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N4NYY
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« Reply #32 on: August 01, 2012, 07:19:52 AM »

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The 950 is still a dated design in DSP world and 590 is more advanced. Why do you think Yaesu is developing 3000? Because 950 is no match for 590.

Likely to compete with the Icom 7600 series. Again, you have no idea why they are they are releasing the 3000. It is pure speculation and opinion.
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W8JX
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« Reply #33 on: August 01, 2012, 07:29:56 AM »

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The 950 is still a dated design in DSP world and 590 is more advanced. Why do you think Yaesu is developing 3000? Because 950 is no match for 590.

Likely to compete with the Icom 7600 series. Again, you have no idea why they are they are releasing the 3000. It is pure speculation and opinion.

Given that 7600 has been around for a while this is unlikely. The only receiver that can equal or slightly beat 590 anywhere near it price class in some areas is K3.  Beside Yaesu has bigger problems, the TS-990 which ships in about 3 months and uses the complete 590 receiver as it secondary receiver. 
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N4NYY
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« Reply #34 on: August 01, 2012, 07:39:37 AM »

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Given that 7600 has been around for a while this is unlikely. The only receiver that can equal or slightly beat 590 anywhere near it price class in some areas is K3.  Beside Yaesu has bigger problems, the TS-990 which ships in about 3 months and uses the complete 590 receiver as it secondary receiver.

Again, pure opinion and speculation. You sound like a Kenwood employee. If you actually have some factual knowledge of their releases and direct competition, then stop talk and walk the walk. Post it here. You sit here and boast about Kenwood and what they are coming out with. The TS-590 took forever to come out. And their flagship TS-2000 has been around for nearly a decade, without a replacement as of yet. Talk about dated technology.

Judging by Kenwood's slow release history, I am not holding my breath on the TS-990 anytime soon.
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W8JX
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« Reply #35 on: August 01, 2012, 07:47:53 AM »

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Given that 7600 has been around for a while this is unlikely. The only receiver that can equal or slightly beat 590 anywhere near it price class in some areas is K3.  Beside Yaesu has bigger problems, the TS-990 which ships in about 3 months and uses the complete 590 receiver as it secondary receiver.

Again, pure opinion and speculation. You sound like a Kenwood employee. If you actually have some factual knowledge of their releases and direct competition, then stop talk and walk the walk. Post it here. You sit here and boast about Kenwood and what they are coming out with. The TS-590 took forever to come out. And their flagship TS-2000 has been around for nearly a decade, without a replacement as of yet. Talk about dated technology.

Judging by Kenwood's slow release history, I am not holding my breath on the TS-990 anytime soon.


Unlike you I had the privilege and pleasure of meeting and talking with the person in charge of marketing for Kenwood in US over several days at Hamvention this year. Very pleasant person.  The 990 is real and is coming before end of year. The Tsunami disrupted their supply chain for 990 and those problems are now all resolved.
« Last Edit: August 01, 2012, 07:52:57 AM by W8JX » Logged

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N4NYY
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« Reply #36 on: August 01, 2012, 07:55:05 AM »

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Unlike you I had the privilege of meeting and talking with the person in charge of marketing for Kenwood in US over several days at Hamvention this year. Very pleasant person.  The 990 is real and is coming before end of year. The Tsunami disrupted their supply chain for 990 and those problems are now all resolved.


Ah, yes! You are not a Kenwood employee. But you spoke to one! I am sure he is not going to say great things about Yaesu, and all his rigs are the best! Thanks for making that clear. Do you know what the purpose of marketing is, and what they are supposed to tell you about their equipment? Very pleasant fellow, though!

Now I will ask you again, for the 3rd time. State or post your factual evidence. Do not sit there and tell me you spoke to a Kenwood employee. You make a claim that the 3000 is being released to compete with the 590. You made a claim that the TS-990 is going to make Yaesu worry. Now stop talking junk, and post any facts to back up your claims.

I think it is safe to say that you have a clearly biased opinion.

« Last Edit: August 01, 2012, 07:59:36 AM by N4NYY » Logged
W8JX
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« Reply #37 on: August 01, 2012, 09:29:06 AM »

Ah, yes! You are not a Kenwood employee. But you spoke to one! I am sure he is not going to say great things about Yaesu, and all his rigs are the best! Thanks for making that clear. Do you know what the purpose of marketing is, and what they are supposed to tell you about their equipment? Very pleasant fellow, though!

Actually I do not once recall him mentioning Yaesu or Icom rigs in comparison. I spoke with same person at 2011 Hamvention and he then confirmed the existence of a new rig but not by name when I pinned him down on some inside info I had found. Then he said that due to Tsunami that roll out would be delayed. The 990 is scheduled to be in FCC acceptance testing this month. The 990 they had at show was a actual early production model and not a prototype. Specs are supposed to be released shortly after FCC acceptance.

Now I will ask you again, for the 3rd time. State or post your factual evidence. Do not sit there and tell me you spoke to a Kenwood employee. You make a claim that the 3000 is being released to compete with the 590. You made a claim that the TS-990 is going to make Yaesu worry. Now stop talking junk, and post any facts to back up your claims.

Not talking junk. 590 is a better rig than 950 as it is a new and more advanced design just like a say new computer is more advanced than a 3 or 4 year old one. What many do not understand that the mere presence of IF DSP does not mean equal performance as that is determined by the quality, processing power and implementation of hardware used to build rig. Just like computer hardware changes rapidly so does DSP hardware.

I think it is safe to say that you have a clearly biased opinion.

Yes it is safe to say you do indeed.
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N4NYY
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« Reply #38 on: August 01, 2012, 09:51:06 AM »

Quote
Actually I do not once recall him mentioning Yaesu or Icom rigs in comparison. I spoke with same person at 2011 Hamvention and he then confirmed the existence of a new rig but not by name when I pinned him down on some inside info I had found. Then he said that due to Tsunami that roll out would be delayed. The 990 is scheduled to be in FCC acceptance testing this month. The 990 they had at show was a actual early production model and not a prototype. Specs are supposed to be released shortly after FCC acceptance.

Oh, so you spoke to him in 2011 and 2012, And it is still not out, and they are blaming the tsnumai? Good to see that some things never change with Kenwood.

Quote
Not talking junk. 590 is a better rig than 950 as it is a new and more advanced design just like a say new computer is more advanced than a 3 or 4 year old one. What many do not understand that the mere presence of IF DSP does not mean equal performance as that is determined by the quality, processing power and implementation of hardware used to build rig. Just like computer hardware changes rapidly so does DSP hardware.

It should be a better rig, as it is newer. But saying that, again, it is opinion, because there is no factual data. Sherwood does not have it. Still, that is not what I was talking about. You made claims that the FTDX-3000 was coming out because of the 590. Pure speculation. You made claims saying that the TS-990 (still waiting after 2 hamventions) will mean trouble for Yaesu. Again pure speculation. Still waiting for facts on those claims.
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I think it is safe to say that you have a clearly biased opinion.

Yes it is safe to say you do indeed.

Wrong. Stop trying to shift you claims. I only have tried the 950, and have no comparisons. I have not gotten my hands on the 590. Saying that, you have. And your tests was done on a "radial-less" 5BTV. There are no Sherwood stats for the 950.

Do I think the 590 would have a better receiver? Possibly. Most people say so as I do not have first hand knowledge. But I would not make any claims to that being a fact, like you did.
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W8JX
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« Reply #39 on: August 01, 2012, 10:16:05 AM »

Notice how Yaesu does not publish the shape factor of its IF DSP band passes? (6db and 60db down specs) Kenwood does. As far as 2011 delay given that a LOT in Japan was wiped out and massive flooding in Thailand and LOT of manufacturing was delayed in many industries for radio/computer hardware to car parts. But hey if it make you feel better you can continue to claim that kenwood was late for no reason. Remember the trouble Yaesu had with 817 parts. It was because of Tsunami too and complicated by trying to find a new source for old technology. 
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N4NYY
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« Reply #40 on: August 01, 2012, 10:38:31 AM »


Quote
Notice how Yaesu does not publish the shape factor of its IF DSP band passes? (6db and 60db down specs) Kenwood does.

I can't speak for Yaesu, like you seem to do with Kenwood. And I am really not disputing that the 590 has a better receiver. You just have shown nothing but opinion. No one has done any legitimate tests. Saying that, you still have not provided what I asked on the 3000 and 990. I won't ask anymore.

Quote
As far as 2011 delay given that a LOT in Japan was wiped out and massive flooding in Thailand and LOT of manufacturing was delayed in many industries for radio/computer hardware to car parts. But hey if it make you feel better you can continue to claim that kenwood was late for no reason. Remember the trouble Yaesu had with 817 parts. It was because of Tsunami too and complicated by trying to find a new source for old technology. 

Kenwood built its reputation of of slow releases, all by itself. I had nothing to do with it. Saying that, I have yet to see any significant delay of any type of consumer goods because of the Tsunami, including 2 other Ham Radio manufacturers. Not saying there are not any delays, but to blame a product release on it, is really putting it out there.

When I first purchased my first 950, the price was $1,245. The new one was $1,400. I had not known that they price had gone up that much. That is why I originally posted the price difference in this thread. Since that time, the difference has clearly gone down, making it more worthwhile to consider the 590. Still, nothing you have said has been backed by factual basis.
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PD2R
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« Reply #41 on: August 02, 2012, 11:13:12 AM »

Beer: check
Snacks: check

OK, I'm good to go.

Let's put some more oil on this fire: I have used both transceivers and I preferred the TS590. On a crowded 80 meter band during the fieldday contest, the receiver performed outstanding. Nice audio as well, both RX and TX.
The FT 950 was a good rig as well and the fact is doesn't have a dedicated RF power knob is an inconvenience. If I had to choose I would go for the TS 590 in a hart beat. That probably has a lot to do with the fact that I feel Yaesu has been going down hill since they came out with the FT 2000. The FT 1000 once was the number one rig used for contesting (and still is used at a lot of contest stations) but the FT 2000 could never live up to it's predecessor.
Fortunately the FT 5000 got them back on track again but come on, that additional bandscope is joke. Personally I don't like the looks of today's Yaesu line all together.
I have heard roomers that the FT 3000 is going to sell for around €3000,-(!) which in my opinion is way to much. The 3000 is ugly too but that's just my personal opinion. (Says the guy that owns an Persident Lincoln CB look a like that goes by the name "K3") Grin

But come on guys, N4NYY prefers his 950 and W8JX prefers the 590 and there's nothing wrong with that. Live and let live!
I wish N7BBC the best of luck with his disision.

 
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K4RVN
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« Reply #42 on: August 04, 2012, 03:32:44 PM »

N7BBC Have you made up your mind which transceiver to buy yet? After you started this thread, I became interested in a new rig and have chosen the 590 Kenwood. I like good receivers and simple menus. The sale is on and price I have found is 1529 with free shipping. Sale ends  Tuesday 8/7. I am still thinking on it until Monday. If interested I'll give you a link to the company which has it on sale. I have spoken on the air with three 590s this week and all gave good reports on the 590. I also looked at the 950, but would not consider the 2000 due to its age since introduction. I would suggest a used one if you go that route.
If you, or anyone has found a better price for the 590, please let me know by Monday and I would appreciate it. My email is on QRZ.com under K4rvn. Thanks for any info.

73
Frank
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KF7DS
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« Reply #43 on: August 09, 2012, 09:18:47 AM »

Go with the 590...the RX is EXCELLENT. Beat the pants off my IC7600 in every way. I sold the 7600 and bought a 590 and an Elecraft KX3 and I still have change left over.

Best,
Don KF7DS
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W2WAW
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« Reply #44 on: August 09, 2012, 12:03:50 PM »

In my humble opinion the icom 7200 beats them both by a large margin. The IF DSP in the Icom Is a joy to listen to. If you get a chance to demo one give it a try. Mike w2waw
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