Call Search
     

New to Ham Radio?
My Profile

Community
Articles
Forums
News
Reviews
Friends Remembered
Strays
Survey Question

Operating
Contesting
DX Cluster Spots
Propagation

Resources
Calendar
Classifieds
Ham Exams
Ham Links
List Archives
News Articles
Product Reviews
QSL Managers

Site Info
eHam Help (FAQ)
Support the site
The eHam Team
Advertising Info
Vision Statement
About eHam.net

   Home   Help Search  
Pages: [1] 2 3 Next   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic: eqsl confirmations/ ARRL question  (Read 10138 times)
KD8IWZ
Member

Posts: 52




Ignore
« on: November 13, 2012, 03:22:09 PM »

I'm sure there is a very simple answer to this, but for the life of me I can't figure it out by myself. Any ham can sit at his pc and easily make and print a homemade (and very professional) qsl, which the ARRL will accept.  Yet they will not accept an Eqsl confirmation. If I were to print a Eqsl card, cut it out with my papercutter, what is the difference between that 1 and a homemade pc generated qsl? Both would look identical. What am I missing here? Thanks much for pointing me to the simple answer. I'm not trying to 'beat the system' or break any rules, I'm just confused!

73 Dale
Logged
N4NYY
Member

Posts: 4820




Ignore
« Reply #1 on: November 13, 2012, 06:03:14 PM »

It's called the honor system. If you can live with yourself trying to fool them, then go ahead. I do it the legit way. I use LoTW and QSLs. If I do not earn it, then I do not want it.
Logged
K3VAT
Member

Posts: 763




Ignore
« Reply #2 on: November 13, 2012, 06:10:27 PM »

I'm sure there is a very simple answer to this, but for the life of me I can't figure it out by myself. Any ham can sit at his pc and easily make and print a homemade (and very professional) qsl, which the ARRL will accept.  ... 73 Dale

Sorry Dale that just isn't so, and especially for DXCC.  Try submitting a card from the recent HK0NA, 706T, T30PY, ZK2C or dozens more that doesn't have their SPECIFIC label or doesn't have their SPECIFIC stamp and see what happens.  DXPeditions safeguard the integrity of their data by using very personalized cards that are not easy to duplicate (don't forget the custom stamp and label that each uses).  QSL checkers (field level and especially at the ARRL) even are familiar with hundreds of active DX station QSL cards, what they look like, how the signature is made, etc.  Try printing out a full color card with specific photos or logos like 5T5JL or DP1POL card and submit it and see what happens.  Card [Field] checkers like N4MM (and many others) have been checking cards for multiple decades and know all the tricks.  Why would anyone want to circumvent the system by taking such a chance?

You may get by on forging (which is what this is) a card from USA for a 160M QSO or Spain for a 40M CW QSO or from Japan for a 20M SSB contact - but it is easier to just work them!  

Much of my satisfaction comes from receiving that QSL card knowing that I indeed worked it and it is confirmed.  After all, who are you competing with if not yourself?

73, Rich, K3VAT
« Last Edit: November 13, 2012, 06:12:31 PM by K3VAT » Logged
KD8IWZ
Member

Posts: 52




Ignore
« Reply #3 on: November 14, 2012, 01:22:36 AM »

Rich, thanks for your reply, please don't think I'm trying to get away with anything, my only experience with the card checkers has been WAS. My satisfaction is just casual operating, making a FB qso with another ham, confirmed or not, I'm not chasing any awards. I had just been reading a few topics here by others asking about making their own qsl cards, and saw many folks suggested using various programs on their computer. I was just looking at the logic behind 'homemade' cards, you pointed out what I hadn't thought thru completely.

73  Dale
Logged
K2CMH
Member

Posts: 278




Ignore
« Reply #4 on: November 14, 2012, 12:36:53 PM »

I just had to laugh at the responses, the last sentence of the original post says:

"I'm not trying to 'beat the system' or break any rules, I'm just confused!"

The very first response: "It's called the honor system. If you can live with yourself trying to fool them, then go ahead. I do it the legit way"

Then the second response: "You may get by on forging (which is what this is)...but it is easier to just work them!"

The OP made a point of saying that he was just inquiring and had no intention of trying to beat the system...yet, the assumptions seem to be that he is...

Does no one read the entire post anymore before hitting the Reply button?

Sorry, but I just had to comment, I'm sure I will get some flames for this..lol
Logged
AG6WT
Member

Posts: 477




Ignore
« Reply #5 on: November 14, 2012, 01:08:48 PM »

If you are using the same printer and same card stock for all, the card checker is going to know. If you are going to try to beat the system by using a variety of printing sources, card stocks, graphic designs, etc. to make them all unique and realistic.... well you just plunked down a huge chunk of your time and money that probably would be better spent on actual equipment and operating time.

That is, the barrier to successfully cheating with paper qsl's is pretty high.

Cheating eQSL, however, isn't hard if you know anything about computer scripting. In fact, even without trying to cheat the system I get QSL's (that I don't confirm) from DX stations I've never worked.
Logged
K3VAT
Member

Posts: 763




Ignore
« Reply #6 on: November 14, 2012, 05:11:57 PM »

I just had to laugh at the responses, ... the second response: "You may get by on forging (which is what this is)...but it is easier to just work them!"

The OP made a point of saying that he was just inquiring and had no intention of trying to beat the system...yet, the assumptions seem to be that he is...

Does no one read the entire post anymore before hitting the Reply button?  Sorry, but I just had to comment, I'm sure I will get some flames for this..lol

Guess you have heard of the plural pronoun 'you'.  See this link:
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/YOU?s=t definition 2. 

73, Rich, K3VAT
Logged
N4CR
Member

Posts: 1701




Ignore
« Reply #7 on: November 14, 2012, 10:15:24 PM »

I'm sure there is a very simple answer to this, but for the life of me I can't figure it out by myself. Any ham can sit at his pc and easily make and print a homemade (and very professional) qsl, which the ARRL will accept.  Yet they will not accept an Eqsl confirmation. If I were to print a Eqsl card, cut it out with my papercutter, what is the difference between that 1 and a homemade pc generated qsl? Both would look identical. What am I missing here? Thanks much for pointing me to the simple answer. I'm not trying to 'beat the system' or break any rules, I'm just confused!

73 Dale

Are you talking about printing your own card or printing one from a QSO?
Logged

73 de N4CR, Phil

Never believe an atom. They make up everything.
M6GOM
Member

Posts: 1012




Ignore
« Reply #8 on: November 15, 2012, 05:28:17 AM »



Are you talking about printing your own card or printing one from a QSO?

With eQSL you can either print the QSL card of the other station yourself or pay eQSL to print it for you and post it to you.

The point being made that although this is a valid QSO, because you can print the card yourself then apparently the ARRL LoTW programme don't accept it. Quite a strange state of affairs considering that eQSL has been on the go 5 years longer than LoTW and is used by four times more people.
Logged
KF5SVY
Member

Posts: 4




Ignore
« Reply #9 on: December 17, 2013, 09:23:53 PM »

So as a new to QSL ham, I've printed some of the initial QSL cards for requests on Canon dye sub 4x6 photo printer on postcard stock with the QSO info printed on the face (the program I'm using does that via export of file.)  It's anice pretty card that I'm thinking of having printed to reduce cost.

I'm writing a personal note on the print in sharpie and sending the QSL in an envelope as the photo Postcard isn't as thick a stock as I'd like and I hoped it would protect the card some.

Is this card going to be accepted by the ARRL if some guy uses it for an award?

Nothing to do with cheating the system, just hoping my effort on a few QSL cards (and for that matter, a SASE or two from the contact)  doesn't go to waste. 

Les

I do the majority of my QSL via eQSL 70%, LoTW 25%. 
Logged
W9FIB
Member

Posts: 955




Ignore
« Reply #10 on: December 18, 2013, 12:44:43 AM »

My question is if the reason eQSL confirmations are bad because information can be erroneous or faked, what is to prevent the same erroneous or faked information to be entered into LOTW? eQSL requires a response, and I believe LOTW does too. I use eQSL but not LOTW. The point being, if both systems require a 2 way confirmation, then why would both not be counted the same way? Or is it because ARRL runs LOTW and not eQSL?
Logged
N0IU
Member

Posts: 1374


WWW

Ignore
« Reply #11 on: December 18, 2013, 03:33:26 AM »

Quite a strange state of affairs considering that eQSL has been on the go 5 years longer than LoTW and is used by four times more people.

While it is true that as of this post, there are 222,034 eQSL users and only 61,829 LoTW users, you conveniently left out the other statistic. On eQSL, there are 328,351,965 so-called "confirmations", but LoTW has 543,512,284!

eQSL requires a response, and I believe LOTW does too.

LoTW does NOT require a response. Unlike eQSL, if you submit a bogus contact to LoTW (and there is nothing to prevent you from doing that), it is not confirmed until I upload my log and there is a match which means your bogus contact will sit out there forever. And unlike eQSL, I can not see who claims to have had a QSO with me so there is nothing for me to respond to. Either you are in my log or you're not!

Like others have said, I have received MANY bogus confirmation requests on eQSL. eQSL even has a warning that you should only confirm a contact that is not automatically confirmed by checking it against your log.
Logged
WA8UEG
Member

Posts: 399




Ignore
« Reply #12 on: December 18, 2013, 05:15:43 AM »

I receive 2 or 3 bogus request A WEEK from Eqsl. I upload my log to Eqsl for those that enjoy using it but other than that ignore it.
Logged
AJ4WC
Member

Posts: 47




Ignore
« Reply #13 on: December 18, 2013, 05:17:01 AM »

I think the standards for a match are higher with LoTW.  With eQSL, if I don't have the correct information: date, time, or even if I screw up the call, I can make adjustments when the other ham submits his data.  For me, I see it most often with SSB since I have hearing issues and sometimes hear wrong.  Several times I have gotten the call wrong and didn't realize it until I see the other ham submit to eQSL.  I then correct my log and resubmit.  And, here's the interesting part, I can then resubmit to LoTW with the corrected call.  In other words, I can use eQSL to "cheat" LoTW, so indirectly LoTW is accepting eQSLs whether they like it or not.   Shocked  I have no qualms doing this because I did actually work the stations.  eQSL must not either, otherwise they wouldn't let you view the other stations info prior to getting a match.  
Logged
N0IU
Member

Posts: 1374


WWW

Ignore
« Reply #14 on: December 18, 2013, 06:13:10 AM »

I think the standards for a match are higher with LoTW.  With eQSL, if I don't have the correct information: date, time, or even if I screw up the call, I can make adjustments when the other ham submits his data.

That doesn't make LoTW's standards higher, it makes them right! The only leeway you get with LoTW is that the time has to be within 30 minutes +/- of each other.
Logged
Pages: [1] 2 3 Next   Go Up
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.11 | SMF © 2006-2009, Simple Machines LLC Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!