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Author Topic: Stolen Valor & Ham Radio  (Read 11491 times)
W1MSG
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« Reply #15 on: January 01, 2013, 06:57:16 PM »

From a vietnam era vet..USAF 1966 to 1970

to me the real issue is the volunteer army which is an expansion of the military-industrial complex which President Eisenhower warned us

SO..bring back the draft and real citizen solders

The american people have forgotten the real horrors of war and contract it out to the 'volunteers'...they are just employees of the armed services...
just an employee with company benefits from DoD...
US funded Mercenaries  ... nothing more

gone are the real citizen solders

SO
get over it...
nothing was Stolen
you still have Your medals
and
remember


First and foremost, Thank you for your Service.

You weren't Drafted you joined the Air Force, and the Air Force didn't participate in the Draft Lottery.  Vietnam era Vet, what real horrors of war can you expound on that the American People have forgotten, I'm curious. I suppose the career Soldiers, Sailors, and Airmen back in the 60's and 70's weren't employee's of the DOD, and I believe everyone that served had benefits such as health care and leave. You sir need to get over it.

Thanks for playing, Next Troll please ...
« Last Edit: January 01, 2013, 07:24:41 PM by W1MSG » Logged
KD8IWZ
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« Reply #16 on: January 02, 2013, 07:36:52 AM »

Craig, W1MSG, I see you are retired Army, thank you for your many years of service to our country! In partial defense of Paul, K3SF, he didnt go north over the border, or get his family doctor to write him an 'excuse' as several of my friends did. I'm sure he served honorably also. Every day when I go to work, I see many young men and women, several that have been or are about to be deployed, having to leave their family because they were ordered to. Each of them still do their part to protect this country.

I only did 5 years active duty, and am very proud that I did a year in Viet Nam. And each day at 5 o'clock when they play Retreat amd the National Anthem, I have a lump im my throat. I would give you both a strong handshake and my thanks. And I extend my hand also to each and every vet or active duty man or woman. Thanks to all of you for serving!

73  Dale
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K3SF
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« Reply #17 on: January 02, 2013, 01:39:35 PM »

Craig, i too appreciate your service. 

However, in my opinion the issue of 'Stolen Valor' is more imaginary than real and stems from a more fundamental issue of ignorance of the US population. What you are doing is educating the general public about the truth and it is the truth that really matters and the valor, honor and glory are always with you no matter what. It is the public that looks for the next new thing, their next hero.

What i was trying to get at is the the overall US population has NO idea what military service and more importantly civic duty really means. That the sense of civic pride and duty has been lost. Without this real experience by the population at large, their experience of war is something the see on TV and the movies and video games and guys who like to bullshit. It is not a real experience. This experience only happens when you are actually there and engaged. Real life experience is the best teacher. The basis for the truth. I just think it is more important to instill civic duty in everyone adn have them engaged.

I did not serve in combat, i served as support to the B52 crews, the F-4, U2 and the SR-71 pilots that flew out of Okinawa.
my job was to provide down range weather and i was damn good at it. i was one of a few satellite operators in the paciifc that was engaged in the hunt for the USS Pueblo and her crew. i was a guinea pig (aka human subject) as part of a USAF CO2 metabolic study that help save the Apollo 13 crew. Many would say i tended to volunteer way too much but to me i was doing my civic duty.

After discharge i got  degrees in engineering and went to work for various contractors developing systems for the intelligence community. You pick any three letter agency and i have been there. I did this because i saw how important intelligence was in averting the greater conflict. Stop things before the escalate and result in combat. This is my way of saving lives.

Now i am doing research for the Army at Aberdeen Proving Grounds (APG) in Maryland.

So service to country does not necessarily end when discharged. Civic duty is a lifetime commitment.

When i talked about the draft, it was my way of saying some people need to be pushed a little to do their civic duty. As such, this become a universal experience across all of America. A common universal civic experience will keep the bullshitter at bay. To me this is what the volunteer army has thwarted. In addition, I am of the opinion it makes the politicians more adventurous and less thoughtful of the impact of going to war because there is almost no public outcry or concern. The public has no idea, no real experience.

When i used the term mercenary, it was intentional to make one look at how we use our armed service. It is intended to pull back the cover of patriotism that veils how the US really is using the armed services. Patriotism can be commonly mistaken for civic duty. They are not the same. Patriotism as i have seen today seems to be blind, where as civic duty is eyes wide open.

The basis of civic duty comes from the constitutional phrase, "We the people".  It is the constitution and all it stands for that the american public no longer understands. This is the basis for how i view our ( yep yours and mine) country.

Basically what i am getting at , is dont treat the symptoms (chasing down bullshitter),  fix the cause (civic education and pride in our young).

Paul K3SF

still helping the free world

















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W1MSG
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« Reply #18 on: January 02, 2013, 06:36:17 PM »

Thanks for the replies, and Paul thanks for explaining your post. It now makes much more sense and doesn't appear as though you were trolling. I do understand the points you are making, but here is a link to the December News of the Fake Warrior project. Now this is just December, you can go back and see the same kind of stuff for the last few years, and it continues to escalate in frequency.
I'm not sure Stolen Valor is a good title, but those that are stealing benefits and such from those that have earned it and deserve it is what chaps my butt the most.

http://www.fakewarriors.org/phonies/phonies748.htm

I only wish they hadn't taken the list of phonies down, there were hundreds of them and the claims and actual records were just amazing. I will direct you to http://www.thisainthell.us they have a growing list that will leave you shaking your head.
I get several e-mails a month asking me to look at this or that online. I just had an active duty friend of mine send me a link to a facebook page. This guy has a picture of himself in Dress Greens as a Command Sergeant Major with plenty of fruit salad for awards along with a Special Forces and Ranger TAB and 30 years worth of service stripes. However reading further into his profile he says he joined the Army in 1986 after completing college. He must not be a math major as 30 years would put him at 2016, that and missing Airborne wings, but having foreign jump wings just blows him out of the water. I sent him an e-mail asking him politely to explain his photo or he would most likely get lots of e-mails from military and vets about his obvious screwed up uniform.

So as you can see it runs the entire gamut, those that are just trying to impress their friends to those that are trying to steal benefits. I have decided to lump them all together and treat them the same.

Anyway, Thanks for the comments and Thanks for your Service !! 
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W1MSG
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« Reply #19 on: January 03, 2013, 06:21:27 AM »

Ok here is one of the better examples, now this clown was outted in 2007 and is back at it again on his Facebook page with his phoney CSM Uniform and such.
This is a copy of the news article ..

http://www.w1msg.net/fakes/collier.pdf

And here is his real record

http://www.w1msg.net/fakes/collier.jpg

This is the kind of stuff that pisses me off, especially when we have guys that actually gave their life fighting in Iraq.
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AA4PB
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« Reply #20 on: January 03, 2013, 07:03:45 AM »

I know nothing about this particular case nor do I know how the Army processing operates. However, I do know that when I reenlisted in the Navy years ago that I was given discharge papers from the Naval reserve and transferred to regular Navy. Years later when I transferred from the regular Navy back into the Naval reserve I was given discharge papers again. If you were to research my record you'd probably find three sets of discharge papers indicating different ranks and different dates.

Just saying - make sure you have ALL of the information.
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WN2C
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« Reply #21 on: January 03, 2013, 07:49:34 AM »

I agree that this pisses me off too, but I am trying to figure out how this thread has any thing to do with ham radio or even radio in general.  So what if some a**hole wants to say he is the CSM of the Army.  Who cares. When it comes right down to it, those closest to him know he is a BullSh!tter and you will know soon too when he starts talking.  As far as someone getting the bennies from the Gov or VA that shouldn't, then turn their asses in. Oh and let the IRS know too so they can tax them for the benefits received or make them pay it back. Defrauding the guvement is taken verrrry serious by them. Don't know why as they have been defrauding the American people for a long time.

Rick wn2c
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W1MSG
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« Reply #22 on: January 03, 2013, 08:59:04 AM »

I started this thread because of the BS stories I hear on the Radio, many of which I have debunked already when I received their records.

As for numerous discharge papers, you are correct, but they are all in the Archives. Notice how this guy has 3 different dates of service. That sheet is just the cover sheet that comes with the redacted DD 214's and other documentation.

It has as much to do with Ham radio as most of the other stuff posted in the MISC forum, but at least some of these violators are actually HAM Radio folks.
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K3SF
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« Reply #23 on: January 03, 2013, 10:27:13 AM »

Craig

i applaud your efforts to go after the guys who defraud the federal government.

in regards to hamradio:

I think one way to keep them off the air is to file a complaint with FCC regarding revoking their license on the basis of 'character' which is sufficient cause for revocation.
keep them busy filing paper work with the FCC and off the air. Federal Fraud charges are serious enough for the FCC enforcement to consider.

Just a thought

I am not sure how cross agency information can be easily passed but that does not prevent the every day concerned citizen like yourself from reporting it to the FCC enforcement department.

Paul K3SF
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KE3WD
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« Reply #24 on: January 03, 2013, 02:39:45 PM »

Good luck with that one, Paul...
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WA4D
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« Reply #25 on: January 03, 2013, 03:21:45 PM »

Master Sgt. Craig,

You've got these guys prostrate before you. Bowing and scrapping. Remember the vast majority of these guys either did not serve, were not in the Combat Arms or were REMFs.  It's amusing.  

K3SF reminds me of the kid in 4th grade who  called out  from the back of the room. "Craig twisted my private parts during recess, Teacher!"  Laughs.

I don't tell Vets "thank you for your service". It's too phony. And I reject the cliche from those that extend it to me.  It's like saying Happy New Year. A false platitude.  Most non Vets and Rear Echelon troops don't have much to talk about so they pump up their contribution or their "praise" for those who did.  But it's a farce on both levels.

As for these so called, "Stolen Valor" thieves that you are hunting down bounty hunter style.....Charge ahead. I think it's a waste of time and a bit silly. The Supreme's rendered their verdict on this last year.  To Lie about your service is "protected speech". Do I like it? No, but Life is unfair. As it should be.

United States Vs. Alvarez    Decided June 2012   (Vote: 6 to 3)
« Last Edit: January 03, 2013, 03:28:41 PM by WA4D » Logged
WN2C
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« Reply #26 on: January 03, 2013, 06:01:07 PM »

Master Sgt. Craig,

You've got these guys prostrate before you. Bowing and scrapping. Remember the vast majority of these guys either did not serve, were not in the Combat Arms or were REMFs.  It's amusing.  

K3SF reminds me of the kid in 4th grade who  called out  from the back of the room. "Craig twisted my private parts during recess, Teacher!"  Laughs.

I don't tell Vets "thank you for your service". It's too phony. And I reject the cliche from those that extend it to me.  It's like saying Happy New Year. A false platitude.  Most non Vets and Rear Echelon troops don't have much to talk about so they pump up their contribution or their "praise" for those who did.  But it's a farce on both levels.

As for these so called, "Stolen Valor" thieves that you are hunting down bounty hunter style.....Charge ahead. I think it's a waste of time and a bit silly. The Supreme's rendered their verdict on this last year.  To Lie about your service is "protected speech". Do I like it? No, but Life is unfair. As it should be.

United States Vs. Alvarez    Decided June 2012   (Vote: 6 to 3)

I do say thank you for your service and when I say it I mean it.  Some guys may have served in combat, most do not, but this does not take away from their service.  Some may have enlisted, some may have been drafted (albeit reluctantly especially during Viet Nam) this too does not take away from their service. 
It is those that have served and those serving today that protect our freedoms.
I even thanked my Father for his service during WWII.  Surprised the hell out of him when I said it.

So to all that have served, I say thank you!  Thank you for taking time out of your life to protect the freedoms of the greatest nation on Earth

Rick  wn2c
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W1MSG
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« Reply #27 on: January 03, 2013, 09:31:48 PM »

The original Stolen Valor act was in fact struck down as being against the 1st ammendment, however H.R. 1775 Stolen Valor Act of 2012 did pass a house vote of 412 to 3 and has been realigned to go after those that receive benefit from such claims.
Now having someone buy you a drink at the local bar because you said you were a decorated war hero might be pushing it a bit.
Personally I think public ridicule is the best punishment, the last HAM I exposed over the air was priceless. His Bronze Star, Combat Engineer Claims from Vietnam were debunked when his records were obtained showing he served 3 yrs active duty not the 6 he claimed, he was an E-4 not the SGT he claimed, he never received a BSM, and was a MARS Operator in Vietnam, never held a Engineer job specialty (MOS). The immediate silence when confronted with actual dates, times, and places was worth every minute I spent doing the requests to get his records.

Anyway, thanks for all the responses..

Craig
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K7KBN
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« Reply #28 on: January 04, 2013, 09:54:31 AM »

Friend of mine here locally was wounded in Vietnam.  He wears the purple heart for a piece of shrapnel that just nicked his hip and drew a bit of blood. 

Although he's met Washington State auto licensing requirements for permanent free vehicle registration and distinctive license plate with a picture of the Purple Heart and the license number beginning with PH (e.g. "PH0001"), he prefers his ham radio plates.
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73
Pat K7KBN
CWO4 USNR Ret.
K1CJS
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« Reply #29 on: January 04, 2013, 06:14:23 PM »

Someone who gets a nick like that and runs to the aid station has a report made and can get those things--even if he was only nicked.  However, I don't blame the guy for running to the aid station, not with the amount of infections and other medical problems that could happen from just such a 'nick' down there in Vietnam--or any third world country, for that matter.
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