Call Search
     

New to Ham Radio?
My Profile

Community
Articles
Forums
News
Reviews
Friends Remembered
Strays
Survey Question

Operating
Contesting
DX Cluster Spots
Propagation

Resources
Calendar
Classifieds
Ham Exams
Ham Links
List Archives
News Articles
Product Reviews
QSL Managers

Site Info
eHam Help (FAQ)
Support the site
The eHam Team
Advertising Info
Vision Statement
About eHam.net

   Home   Help Search  
Pages: Prev 1 [2] 3 4 Next   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic: The Secret to Learning CW  (Read 2400 times)
OLLIEOXEN27
Member

Posts: 0




Ignore
« Reply #15 on: April 22, 2009, 10:28:43 PM »

You play head games - not very mature.
Logged
OLLIEOXEN27
Member

Posts: 0




Ignore
« Reply #16 on: April 22, 2009, 10:30:55 PM »

Certainly not worth wasting time with.

oli
Logged
NY4D
Member

Posts: 2




Ignore
« Reply #17 on: April 23, 2009, 05:31:56 AM »

The secret to learning CW, and getting better at it, no matter what method, is one word: PRACTICE.
Logged
KB1OOO
Member

Posts: 214


WWW

Ignore
« Reply #18 on: April 23, 2009, 06:05:36 AM »

> You play head games - not very mature.

I'm not sure what you are referring to?
Logged
AA4PB
Member

Posts: 12897




Ignore
« Reply #19 on: April 23, 2009, 08:35:02 AM »

Morse code is NOT a language. It's a method of encoding individual letters just like Baudot is a method of encoding letters. If I send a page of English text to someone who knows Morse code but doesn't know English then they will not be able to understand what is being said, even though they might be able to copy all the letters and reproduce the page.

What helps hams communicate even when the language is not fully known is the use of common Q signals and abbreviations. Those give us a small common language but Morse code itself does not.


Logged
VE5AE
Member

Posts: 12




Ignore
« Reply #20 on: April 23, 2009, 09:22:02 AM »

I'm going to add my two cents here... I passed the 5WPM ticket years ago but never used it. Two months ago, I decided that I was going back to ham radio. Also, I decided that CW was the way to go. I committed myself to learning and my long-term goal was and still is 20 WPM. (I'm planning to operate on HF 99% in CW).

Since I had forgot all about CW, I had to start from square one. Reading advice online and also in this forum. I agreed that the Koch method was probably the best for me. So downloaded just learn Morse code. (A VERY good software). I started practicing two letters at 12 WPM with the characters sent at 20 WPM. It was good, but I realized at one point (half-way through the alphabet) that I was still counting. I tried to move to 15 wpm sent at 20 with mixed results.

At one point, I finally got a rig and decided to listen to live QSO. It was a shock. I was so used to large spacing that I could not copy nothing. I could not copy well even at 10 WPM. Don't get me wrong here, I still had Morse code knowledge. But I was handicapped because I was used to the large spacing.

At that point, I decided to listen to archive W1AW sound file that you can find online. I started with 13 WPM. It did not take me too long and I was doing good at that speed. Now, I trying to master 15 WPM. I'm not there; but I'm getting there. Soon, I will have the inverted V installed and I will be able to QSO. I believe that I should be able to have nice QSO at 13+ WPM on 40-meter.

Honestly, I don't think that there is a perfect way to master the code that fits everybody. Personally, my long-term goal is still to have a good solid copy at 20 WPM; but for a bit, I will try to focus on having fun with CW on the air.

Right now, I'm trying to move from 13 to 20 WPM. And I'm trying to move from paper copy to head copy. (Any advice?)

Before I conclude, I MUST thank people from this forum. N2EY, WB2WIK, KB1OOO and plenty of others. I might have quit at Day 4 if it was not of this forum and the advice I read. You guys don't know, but I was always reading the advice and telling myself, "If they did it; I can too".

73 de Ian, VE5AE
Logged
LB3KB
Member

Posts: 227


WWW

Ignore
« Reply #21 on: April 23, 2009, 03:43:10 PM »

VE5AE,

If you set the speed to 12/20 WPM, you're saying your desired speed is 20 WPM but that you need to slow it down to 12 WPM to be able to keep up with it.

If you find yourself counting at the speed you have selected, this is an indication that you have time to waste between characters and thus you should select a higher speed.

You indicate that you're copying on paper.  That means not only that you're wasting your time grading yourself, but also that your software is not allowed to throw you more of the characters you miss most frequently.  Thus it's going to take you much longer to get good at it - just like those who are using any other method that doesn't offer this feedback mechanism to generate more useful code for you.


If your desired speed is 20 WPM, you should learn at 20/20 if you can keep up with it.  Reduce the word speed if you can't, but not too much.

Then read the help file - it has a section on becoming proficient that you may find useful before venturing into standard timing without preparation (i.e. knowing all the characters, at standard timing)


And above all else, read between the lines before deciding whose advice is worth listening to.


73
LB3KB Sigurd
http://justlearnmorsecode.com
Logged
OLLIEOXEN27
Member

Posts: 0




Ignore
« Reply #22 on: April 23, 2009, 07:02:45 PM »

AA4PB,

You are misinterpreting the word 'language' incorrectly. Your example is irrelevant because I'm not talking about English and a foreign language but a third language.

A series of letter and number code sounds in themselves are non sensical from a language standpoint.

I'll give you a few examples: When I hear the letter c by itself or I hear the letter q by itself I recognize them but they have no meaning. However when I hear cq it has meaning and a bell goes off - not in my intellect but in my understanding. Same thing with my call sign. When I hear it I don't hear two letters, a number, and two letters. I hear a complex sound that has meaning to me. If I heard my call sign at 50 wpm I would still recognize it. If I hear a DX call sign at high speed I may be able to write it down first try but I might have to hear it twice. The reason: it is a new complex sound (word).

A QSO is basically a common set of complex sounds familiar to all users. If you notice your own habits
you'll notice when you ragchew you don't copy as fast and you either translate some letters in your mind or sequence the letters in your mind (if you use the Koch method). The sounds of letters can never be a language in themselves because instant copying of the letter plus sequencing of the letters (at high speed) is impossible to the brain after about 23 wpm. Also that's the fastest you can probably write.

The bottom line is if you listen to QSO's only
you'll hear the same words, protocol, and phrases over and over again with little deviation. Soon, they will become easily understandable at high speed - much faster than other methods. As you get faster and more experienced you'll soon understand new sounds (words) - for a list just Google the 50 most common words used in the English language. Soon those will be easily understood. If someone sends 'chrysanthemum' in code at 30 wpm you won't be able to copy it. There is no getting around it unless you've heard it several times and it becomes second nature to you.


I hope that helps. Those who disagree just to disagree
don't respond, please. This isn't for you.

oli





Logged
OLLIEOXEN27
Member

Posts: 0




Ignore
« Reply #23 on: April 24, 2009, 07:37:43 AM »

I think instead of using the term 'sequence the letters' I should say you line up the letters and form the words in your mind. That's probably easier to understand.
Logged
AB9NZ
Member

Posts: 177




Ignore
« Reply #24 on: April 24, 2009, 08:39:55 PM »

 I just worked a brand new ham (three months )in North Carolina sending beautiful code about 13 words per minute. I asked what technique he used to learn. He said Just Learn Morse Code. Another nice job Sigurd, please keep sending us those new operators.
                Take care guys de Tom, AB9NZ
Logged
OLLIEOXEN27
Member

Posts: 0




Ignore
« Reply #25 on: April 24, 2009, 11:55:49 PM »

To those concerned by my username,

I have an extra license, a GROL, and a radiotelegraph license. It shouldn't matter what credentials a person has. Expertise is overrated. It's experts who destroyed our economy or failed to act to prevent it. Most experts are only repeating what they learned but who was the first expert and where did he learn from?

I don't believe any experts. I listen to what they say, choose a direction that seems more reasonable, and adjust as I learn more.

Another thing is that bright people make people who aren't so bright uncomfortable. That fits some of you and if you have that insecurity you need to look at it.
Logged
N2EY
Member

Posts: 3895




Ignore
« Reply #26 on: April 25, 2009, 05:15:32 AM »

The secret is that there is no one way that works best. You have to try different things to find what works for you. Some folks get lucky and find a way that works for them on the first go, others need to hunt around more.

The secret is that Morse Code isn't just one skill, it's whole set of related but unique skills, and getting good at one (say, paper copy) won't necessarily make you good at another (say, head copy). Yet at the same time, learning the different skills can help you learn others (learning to send usually helps you learn to receive).  

The secret is that if you want to get good at Morse Code *operating*, you have to actually do it *on the air*. Have ragchew QSOs, get into a contest, copy W1AW bulletins, chase DX, but do it on the air. Sure the computer trainers and tapes have a place, but they're like running on a treadmill compared to running on the road or a track. They're a training aid, but not the thing itself.

The secret is that learning any skill takes time, practice and effort. Skills aren't like book learning. Nobody learns to ride a bike, drive a car nor type by reading about it.

73 de Jim, N2EY
Logged
OLLIEOXEN27
Member

Posts: 0




Ignore
« Reply #27 on: April 25, 2009, 11:07:29 AM »

I agree. Getting on the air is the fastest way (pretty much what I've been saying lol - listen to or work QSOs). Also not worrying about how fast you are going. That just frustrates you and makes you want to give up.

The worst thing about sites like this is one group wants to one up everyone by showing off how smart they are or by what license they hold. But all they do is recite what they learned like robots.

Learning isn't the same as understanding and reciting something isn't the same as knowing. Questioning what you've learned is more useful.

Logged
OLLIEOXEN27
Member

Posts: 0




Ignore
« Reply #28 on: April 25, 2009, 11:40:39 AM »

Back in the day the FCC used to require 21 wpm code copy without error on their Extra test. For commercial they required 25 wpm 1st class and 21 wpm 2nd class if I remember correctly.

In the mid eighties they changed requiring perfect copy to answering seven questions out of ten to pass the Extra. They realized the importance of understanding the message instead of copying letters and numbers perfectly.
Logged
OLLIEOXEN27
Member

Posts: 0




Ignore
« Reply #29 on: April 25, 2009, 01:05:31 PM »

A few more tips for high speed operation IMHO(lol):

When I qso at 30 wpm plus I just hear the important stuff. I can go faster but I can't key that fast so what's the use? I hear the prefix (I get the complete call sign on 2nd over), the state, the rig, the antenna, the wx and pretty much ignore everything else. I often know what's coming by what's already been sent because I've heard it 1000 times before. If it's a rag chew or a dissertation I pick out clues. I recognize the rig and antenna on the first or second letter. Just like a speed reader reads I can filter out 95% of what's sent. But at the end of the qso I can tell you most everything you want to know. If the guy sent me random letters, numbers, and punctuation I'd QRT and go watch TV. He's not communicating anything so why bother?

That's the difference between me and some of you. You're too by the book, learn fast, learn slow bla bla. I'm not trying to force my way on anybody. That wouldn't be right - why do anything just because somebody said so? You shouldn't do anything unless you see it's value for yourself. Learn the way you feel best.

oli
Logged
Pages: Prev 1 [2] 3 4 Next   Go Up
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.11 | SMF © 2006-2009, Simple Machines LLC Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!